It’s funny. I was reading some commentary on this last week (can’t even
remember where now; that was _last week_!), and I remember thinking that the
description reminded me of Williams Syndrome in people. They have a
grammatical sense that is at the stronger end of the human range, but their
So probably this has all been analyzed to death already, by people who, unlike
me, know what they are talking about.
But in re-reading it, I feel like the structure of the problem is
characterizable.
It is as if “facts” that are constraints on the sentences to be composed are
ordered in a wa
h that makes them so
different is still hard for me to see.
Eric
> -Original Message-
> From: Friam On Behalf Of Santafe
> Sent: Friday, February 10, 2023 3:11 AM
> To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] ChatGPT is not very smart...
Sorry for the last post.
I hadn’t read the link below in this one yet.
I will now get back to the work I was supposed to have been doing.
Eric
> On Feb 10, 2023, at 2:22 PM, glen wrote:
>
> This was laugh out loud funny for me. YMMV.
>
> Arguing with AI: My first dispute with Microsoft’s br
That makes me feel so good, that I am not the only one who makes that kind of
mistake publicly.
> On Feb 15, 2023, at 12:27 PM, Frank Wimberly wrote:
>
> Today is Wednesday, isn't it?
>
> ---
> Frank C. Wimberly
> 140 Calle Ojo Feliz,
> Santa Fe, NM 87505
>
> 505 670-9918
> Santa Fe, NM
>
>
It’s the tiniest and most idiosyncratic take on this question, but FWIW, here:
https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.1520752113
I actually think that all of what Nick says below is a perfectly good draft of
a POV.
As to whether animals “have” categories: Spend time with a dog. Doesn’t take
ver
textbooks and professional journal articles?
>>>>>
>>>>> I think one of the questions that remains present within this group's
>>>> continued 'gurgitations is whether the organizations we have conjured are
>>>> particularly special, or just
enter Nirvana.
>
> Modern philosophers, like Whitehead, take positions closer to Vedic (sans
> Nirvana and Karma), than animism—at least to the extent I understand them.
>
> davew
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 20, 2023, at 5:10 AM, Santafe wrote:
>> So there are things in DaveW
mputation is similar enough to the EricS computation",
> whereas "the Scooter computation (my cat's thinking) is similar to the Dorian
> computation (my other cat's thinking)".
>
> Of course, this all hinges on some particular, maybe perverse, understandi
> On Feb 20, 2023, at 10:46 AM, glen wrote:
>
> By even using the phrases "mental stuff" or "mental life", *you* are
> implicitly asserting there are 2 things: mental and non-mental. There is no
> such difference, in my opinion. Now, while I am often a moron, I don't deny
> that people *thin
I think the keyword was young.
You can do that if the old men are all married to young women.
> On Feb 22, 2023, at 12:02 PM, Nicholas Thompson
> wrote:
>
> Last time I checked, the average number of attached males has to equal the
> average number of attached females, unless, of course, fema
o with babies. I assume
> > they have younger siblings. I hope that as they enter their 30s their
> > attitudes will change because of the realization that they are running out
> > of time.
> >
> > ---
> > Frank C. Wimberly
> > 140 Calle Ojo Feliz,
&g
no open-ended life-extension unless I expect to leave
>> the
>>planet (hear my pain Elon?) I don't think the World3 has been updated to
>>be a Sol model and even considering it really challenges the very
>> structure
>>/concept of the World3 SD model!
This is fun. Will have to watch it when I have time.
Is there a large active genre just now combining ChatGPT wiht deepfakes, to
generate video of whomeever-saying-whatever?
I was thinking a couple of years ago about what direction in big-AI would be
the most distructive, in requiring extra co
It’s helpful to have a conversation being maintained by somebod(ies) else, to
which one can be a bystander without the distraction of coming up with
contributions to it. Things can suggest themselves that get pushed out of
awareness when one is carrying the discourse and figuring out what to do
mergent" from the elementary
> > particles from which it might be composed.
> > > >
> > > > I think we all believe in free-electrons,
> > protons, neutrons but also recognize that *most* of our observed universe
>
I read a little way in.
He should go on Joe Rogan.
Also, the graphic at the front is perfectly paired with the writing.
Eric
(apologies for the Lashon hara; I know one should not do that)
> On May 31, 2024, at 11:58 PM, Nicholas Thompson
> wrote:
>
> This (see below) got served up to me out
Is there a Greek root to build a word for Government by the Extremes?
> On Jun 4, 2024, at 6:42 AM, Frank Wimberly wrote:
>
> This is the article I had in mind
>
> https://www.huffpost.com/entry/why-gen-z-wont-show-their-feet_l_64cd1b52e4b01796c06c0cc4
>
>
> ---
> Frank C. Wimberly
> 140 Call
4L0mBUBL_Fs2dQ3fl-BWQ,,&typo=1
> which I learned in the context of missiles. But "government by canard" seems
> close to "wag the dog". So that's where I'd start my search.
>
> On 6/3/24 15:59, Santafe wrote:
>> Is there a Greek root to build a wor
Russell Brand, right?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell_Brand
I am put in mind of Joaquin Phoenix’s style of preening as Joker in whichever
batman movie it was.
> On Jun 15, 2024, at 7:16 AM, glen wrote:
>
> Sorry for not being clear. Yes, Fridman is part of the alt-right pipeline,
> sim
A few km or even tens of km does not seem long to me on geological scales.
If we have slowly formed crustal rock, it could be fairly uniform. Then if
there is a bending stress on large scales from upwelling, the least-disruption
fracture would be a long straightish crack along the the line perp
I have an impression that the pattern of this and many other decisions is an
acknowledgment — front brain or mid-brain; don’t know — that a
second-government that isn’t the institutional one is now fully up and running.
Many years ago, when I was working with Shubik, he gave me a paper by one of
hose
>> elephants than there will be solidarity. Say what you want about capitalism,
>> it encourages intra-tribal rifts and inter-tribal exchange. And that allows
>> bursts of altruism or "universalist" beliefs. If the successive oligarchies
>> are disrupted often en
Ah! A smart contract! I’ll bet there is some blockchain maven coding it up
right now.
Very nice. Offload the incentive onto them.
> On Jul 4, 2024, at 1:56 AM, thompnicks...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> My Phellow Phriammers,
> I am frantic about the last week’s events. In a fit of absurd geriatric
I have wondered, Dave, why you say no words:
I think of cave art as being ~40kA ago. Similarly for preserved footprints
that have been interpreted as dance.
Mitochondrial modernity probably ~250kA, and Y-chromosome ~100kA, with
considerable errors. European cave art presumably followed out-
You think you are taking baby steps from a clean (un-prejudicial) start.
I think you are massively prejudicing the frame in a way that may not go
anywhere. (Or maybe it does; I can’t say. It just seems like the one
everybody has been adopting forever, re-asserted one more time.)
You treat the
Yeah; wish it were possible to say something interesting.
The aspect of, or within, the field of experience, that “consciousness” and
other related words are somehow “about", should be general among all of us who
are made of about the same stuff. (So, the vertebrates, the mammals, the
social m
I have always assumed that is an exercise in asserting dominance. Who is boss?
Might it be me?
Many years ago, when I was curious about blue Weimaraners, having bumped into a
pair in Santa Fe, I went to read “The Weim Page” (not the AKC breed page, but
in that direction). I remember a nicely
I think your earlier, bad-faith account, was in the right direction, though
each of your last three notes has had a structure I like and take seriously.
(Hard to decide what I think of, or whether I agree with, anything at this
point.)
But if I look at the 3-way dialogue among Thomas, the Fede
But this seems to me like the challenge of all qualia-talk. How to try to say
this…:
By the time you say anything to me, about anything, what you are handing me is
some construct within the bounds of some formal system. If it is within math,
maybe it is a formal system whose origin and constr
Quick comment from me, not to the direct point in this post, which I like too,
but on something about Snyder which I learned (just off-hand) from a colleague
within the past 2 weeks.
These ideas about the language of inevitability as one of the devices of
tyrants was, I think, argued in much th
Suddenly I have an idea.
Somebody should launch a bot named Svejk.
Eric
> I don't need the sinister "What are you doing Dave?" of HAL but I do get very
> tired of it's obsequiousness, it takes work to balance that I could put maybe
> more productively in seeking a more genuine "coherence"?
>
Cool. Nepal even has mystical hillsides.
My colleage The Mystic has informed me that only we (in “the west” in “the
modern era") are degraded and malformed people; all other cultures have Wisdom
Traditions. So any child in one of those Other Cultures already has an
understanding of Reality th
ixing (chemical-electrical transduction) but ganglia do
> fusion gives us a spectrum of integration? Of course, ideally, we'd like to
> be able to extend a functional description down to dictyostelium signaling. I
> can't do that even in COVID-induced fever dreams. [sigh]
>
Back to Nick,
This business of, out of the variety of frames and points of view that could be
taken on anything, gradually making it clear that a certain PoV is the center
of a concept, and then requiring that we “get used to” seeing the concept
through that point of view, is indeed what the s
btw, rather than always complaining, I should have noted that I think Nick’s
analysis below is very much on-point:
> On Aug 7, 2024, at 8:12, Nicholas Thompson wrote:
>
> Yes. Because the verb require is intenSional and takes a proposition as its
> object. Thus, if you graph the sentence, it
Jon, hi and thank you for this.
I guess two inadequate replies from me, one to you and one to Glen, because I
don’t think I have the content that would be needed for any substantive
contribution.
I have seen these maps from particular computational systems to categories, and
I work with somebo
Second inadequate reply, to Glen, unhappily similar to the first to Jon:
> On Aug 19, 2024, at 23:37, glen wrote:
> There's so much I'd like to say in response to 3 things: 1) to formalize and
> fail is human, 2) necessary (□) vs possible (◇) languages, and 3) principle
> vs generic/privied
Hi Jon,
I must have missed the thread where you linked to the Collier video, but I
think I found the one you are referring to. Also didn’t know who Griffiths
was/is (textbook writer; I turned out not to have used any of his books), but
now realize what those mentions refer to. (I had imagined
Reply is to both Jon and Glen, though I seem to have deleted Glen’s post in
scurrying around trying to shovel the lahar of whichever day it was (are there
even different days, or is it just one long day run together?)….
Again, I feel like I am not tracking the language here, so I don’t know if
slow to get to this. Trying to shovel the lahar.
A thing I find interesting is that Musk uses a lot of labiodental stops or
fricatives (I didn’t have any sound on while the NYT videos played). The AI
replaces them with bilabial stops. The visual effect is much faster lip
movement (more stacc
You know, I don’t mind the phrase “above the law”. It may not be tailored to
lower-level mechanistic arguing about one or another case, but it acknowledges
a system context in which a society will operate under some kind of hierarchy
of prerogatives.
I don’t normally think about law in such hi
h thing as *Truth*, only
>>>> *Somebody's Truth*.
>>>> This is painfully evident at the moment in the fallacy of "fact checking,"
>>>> all the assertions of "misinformation," and "follow the science."
>>>> I do not
consistency from estimation to truth seems like a
> metaphysical, almost mystical, commitment.
>
> On 10/16/24 09:27, Santafe wrote:
>> Too many glosses on the word “truth”. Any of them is game, but with so many
>> in play, and registers constantly being shifted, tracking a
Hmm. This one I think I can attach to.
> On Oct 16, 2024, at 12:00, Prof David West wrote:
>
> I do not believe there is anything in postmodernism that argues for an
> infinity of truths or denial of a definition for truth.
Rorty seems to me to be essentially the latter. Or one who asserts t
probably by me. Could have been Bill Reese or one of those.
Jim Rutt had a podcast with a couple who identify as “pro-natalist”. They are
concerned to keep population high so that pyramid payments like social safety
nets don’t get too strained. They refer to it as “crazy” that anyone could be
U.S. interests even at
> the expense of their own economic sovereignty. The lack of a strong
> theoretical critique of this system perpetuates the asymmetry.
>
> In essence, the U.S. has inverted the classical rules of international
> finance, using its debtor position as an i
elieve, however, that unless both sides reject or severely moderate
> their respective radical fringe, all those who simply want to work to solve
> hard problems, are spinning their wheels.
>
> davew
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 8, 2024, at 12:12 PM, Santafe wrote:
>> This feels a
I don’t think that’s right.
I don’t think trump is dead set on anything, except self-aggrandizement and
acting out his resentments. He really is that small. There may be people
behind him who have “policy commitments” or something like that, which have
some definiteness; Michael Bolton was
The newspapers, and any number of writers, do a good job spelling all this out.
I have this frustrated feeling that doing this misses the point that is driving
the dynamic.
One of the good things that Paxton emphasizes about what drives fascist
movements from the ground up is the determined r
I have to say, that qualifies as art.
> On Oct 30, 2024, at 8:21 PM, Stephen Guerin
> wrote:
>
> On Wed, Oct 30, 2024 at 12:32 PM glen wrote:
> The idealists will never stop idealizing and then reifying their ideal. To
> Engineer is Human. But those of us who know (or merely confidently belie
I do want to second a variant of one of Pieter’s comments here, and to ask a
question:
> On Nov 10, 2024, at 12:01 AM, Pieter Steenekamp
> wrote:
>
> It will be fascinating to observe the outcome of the new Trump
> administration, and I genuinely hope it won’t bring us the kind of
> “interes
This feels a bit to the side of the operative point, to me.
The Atlantic article Marcus forwarded was good, and useful. People complaining
(very intelligently and groundedly, it seemed to me) about trying to solve
problems that they understood well, and getting brushed off or used. That’s
not
Yes. There is this impulse to set the record straight, when it is put upside
down.
Take the case of the repeal of the affordable care act. There were 70 attempts
in trump’s first congress to repeal it, after which for some reason they let go
of that effort (I guess there was pressure on them
; provide. The judiciary might be the last bastion of the Deep State, capable
> of resisting demagogues like Trump.
>
> What say ye? Is my optimism showing? 8^D
>
> On 7/17/24 17:17, Santafe wrote:
>> Back to the Roberts court, the things I have seen written that seem most
I think Pieter’s “brace yourself” is the right expression.
It’s like the hurricane forecast is now fairly clear, and the thing that was
your house is on the beach at landfall. So what plans are you making? People
are mostly institutional, and not so scrappy in finding ways to get things done
Exactly; each point Jochen makes here is accurate I think.
Pieter also mentioned U.S. spending. From the data, if I understand it
correctly, there isn’t any reduction in spending when the republicans take
power. There are cuts to social services, but the deficits remain large
because the tax
I join both my antifa friends and my MAGA friends in
> scoffing at the liberal tears. If you actually want change, then buck up and
> make it happen. Politics is not a day job you leave at the office at 6pm.
> Granted, I'm a tourist in both of those groups - all groups, actually, and
>
to blast through institutions.
> > That's what makes the tiny antifa efforts like blocking ports (for a tiny
> > few hours) or breaking windows on main street seem so stupid and indulgent,
> > like the temper tantrums of an undisciplined child.
> >
> > And in t
AM, Santafe wrote:
>
> I don’t think that’s right.
>
> I don’t think trump is dead set on anything, except self-aggrandizement and
> acting out his resentments. He really is that small. There may be people
> behind him who have “policy commitments” or something like tha
This article (apologies for paywall; I don’t know how to send an open version)
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/11/13/opinion/matt-gaetz-attorney-general-trump.html
is another example of missing the point, I think.
It’s all about messaging, and the campaign of demoralization. The puzzle that
the tru
This is good. Yes, please, do post.
Eric
> On Nov 22, 2024, at 11:23 AM, Jacqueline Kazil wrote:
>
> 👋 Long time lurker, second(third?) time poster.
>
> Not sure if you all know about - http://openelections.net/,
> https://github.com/openelections
> Some of the creators are former NYTimes
Would be interesting to see a list of various categories of science funding per
capita or per GDP for countries around the world. Situate the prospective US
in this list. Will our society be like that of Kazakhstan? Or maybe like
Uganda? Probably well below Uruguay or Argentina or Chile.
More drama in that part of that account than seems warranted to me.
Great that they got the data back, and it is in good shape, and that they can
do a detailed analysis of content.
When I get time, I’ll find the article and see what their “nearly equal” left
and right actually means. How m
Again thank you.
The result is over-interpreted, but I’m glad to have it, and it is related to
the way I want to frame some of these questions.
Donna is defnly one of the silverbacks. She is the one who did the
solution-separation experiments I referred to in the last post. It is good to
kno
> On Jan 30, 2025, at 12:32, glen wrote:
>
> Is it virtue signalling or an occult handshake to wear a T-shirt with
> Maxwell's equations on it? I just don't know anymore.
Ha! Wonderful.
I think there is an early age (say, beginning undergrad, or for those from
civilized places, maybe later
I think this last point:
> On Dec 11, 2024, at 13:35, glen wrote:
>
> The important cut point, here, isn't whether the impact is registered by any
> one person's mind or in their daily behavior. The cut points are systemic.
> Another eg: As a citizen of WA, I need not care about abortion righ
So the key distillation is that:
1. The public-sector layoffs are real and completed (so, cemented in the past).
2. The offsetting private-sector new jobs are aspirational, something the
“administration aims to” accomplish as a consequence of “stimulat[ing] economic
growth”. The quotes from Mi
I see:
> On Jan 12, 2025, at 8:13, steve smith wrote:
>
> I have imaginated that the value of reversibility in energy consumption is
> that to "clear a computation" (dispose o the slag) the obvious answer is to
> simply "uncompute" the computation... thereby (only?) *doubling* the
> computat
It seems like there are two separate questions here.
Steve talked about reversible gates, and suggested them as solutions to heat
wastage. But I think that doesn’t go through. I too thought of Marcus’s point
about unitary quatum gates as the obvious case of reversibility (needed for
them to f
It’s not an empty connection. I forget where I first read this, but in going
to look for something just now, I find this Financial Times article that
summarizes the names:
https://www.ft.com/content/cfbfa1e8-d8f8-42b9-b74c-dae6cc6185a0
(In case that link somehow spoofed incorrectly, the articl
Maybe this turns out to be kind of a nice ethics question.
You might make it part of the governance. Burr could do his sales, then
_immediately_ contact a broadcast network and make a statement, saying “I just
dumped a bunch of stock because I know how bad the COVID epidemic is going to
be.
he interconnected challenges of climate crisis, refugee crisis, energy
>> scarcity, population growth, resource depletion, poverty and economic
>> inequality, pollution and environmental degradation, and finally the problem
>> of war and nuclear weapons. Solving all these interc
So, a question about this:
The pro-natalists take it as an axiom (when of course it is highly arguable)
that populations must be at least maintained, in order for there to be enough
young people to care for all the old people.
But the whole knowledge-increases-production ideology would flatly
Yes, Glen’s final para (and the one before) were the only interpretation I
meant.
I wasn’t trying to be imaginative at all in the short thing I wrote about costs
in relation to reversibility. Just the plain-vanilla stuff, for the sake of
maybe articulating a theorem within the usual assumption
It’s interesting. The words are simple but the concepts are not simple.
In more mechanistic terms, I might write “accepting a pardon is an
acknowledgment that an accusatory verdict is what one will have to deal with”.
The complex notion of admission of guilt all turns on the question of
legiti
How Odd.
I read (part of) the first one, and thought That doesnt sound like Frank.
Then the Cormac one: yucky like a supermarket tabloid (not that bad, but).
It’s all unbelievably impressive, of course. But we have people saying they
can’t stand the mass-produced quality of essentially all
It’s funny;
Not to fail to be grateful for F’s several very nice observations below, and
some vivacious prose, but it is good that he started his tirade with quantum
mechanics and general relativity.
Reading them brought to mind a passage late in Kawabata’s Master of Go. I went
looking for
> On Jan 27, 2025, at 10:35, Marcus Daniels wrote:
>
> Eric writes:
>
> "He is arguing against the computation framing of consciousness. Searle’s
> device is to say that my brain is like my stomach, and that the computation
> framing doesn’t do its complexity justice."
>
> Can say the same
nism.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Friam On Behalf Of Santafe
> Sent: Monday, January 27, 2025 11:40 AM
> To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] "I hope I'm wrong. But that text reads like it was
> generated b
Yes, sorry...
> On Jan 27, 2025, at 7:14 PM, Stephen Guerin
> wrote:
>
> On Mon, Jan 27, 2025 at 1:08 PM Santafe wrote:
> But to suppose they _already_ contain everything there is to be understood is
> not a position I would take w.r.t. anything else we have anywhere in
first paywalled PDF (attached)
>
> On Wed, Jan 29, 2025 at 11:51 PM Santafe wrote:
> btw, thank you for this.
>
> Like the cosmic horizon, both the top link and the journal article are behind
> paywalls. But the university could get me the second one. A 3-page paper.
> Ama
> I can grasp from their perspective some of the columns in this chart. The
> one I don’t really get is how did people get so crazy about gender ideology?
> How is that a basic fissure in our society? I don’t get it.
I am not much persuaded that they really care. As before, it’s about
btw, thank you for this.
Like the cosmic horizon, both the top link and the journal article are behind
paywalls. But the university could get me the second one. A 3-page paper.
Amazing. I read the construction, and think I follow the claims. I haven’t
spent time looking at the manifolds he
Glen, your timing on these articles was perfect. Just yesterday I was having a
conversation with a computational chemist (but more general polymath) about the
degradation of content from recursively-generated data, and asking him for
review material on quantifying that.
But to Steve’s point be
... Narrative and its hypnotic
> power. The better you are at it, the more you're at risk.
>
> I feel like a dog chasing cars, running analog, nipping at the tires. The End
> isn't really to *catch* the car (and prolly die thereby). It's the joy of
> running alongs
024 - This Congressional
> Research Service report provides detailed information on federal R&D funding
> in the United States, including breakdowns by health, fundamental research,
> and defense-related research.
> Federal R&D Funding, by Budget Function 2023-2025 - This National Scienc
This thread merges many of the topics that have been articulated separately
over the past couple of weeks under the head.
Is Musk a “genius”? At what? This is a question about how to understand
cause, I think. How much Musk, and how much the way current social systems
work.
Several years ag
hen do the next thing, and such
>> questions [about a philosophy of free will] don’t come up". I have the
>> impression that most people are just like that - except FRIAM folks of
>> course.
>> -J.
>> Original message
>> From: Santafe
&
I think I know, rather than repeating things I have said before, what I would
like to ask specifically to break away from simply repeating this question in a
circle that grants common-language usage more self-contained “meaning” than I
believe it has.
Probably the answer to whatever I say next
> On Feb 25, 2025, at 14:50, Nicholas Thompson wrote:
>
> If you think that you are better able to predict your own behavior than your
> partner — or your dog, for that matter — then the evidence is against you.
> First-person accounts of behavioral causality are notoriously shoddy. I feel
>
I think I know, rather than repeating things I have said before, what I would
like to ask specifically to break away from simply repeating this question in a
circle that grants common-language usage more self-contained “meaning” than I
believe it has.
Probably the answer to whatever I say next
Hi Jochen,
Yes, he came by SFI at least once, maybe more than that. I know about the time
I was there. He stood and talked in the kitchen along with the others at tea,
interested in what was going on, and not himself the center of any special
cluster. Just him and the couple of people he wa
It’s such an encapsulation of that part of the society (including t and v) to
think that they could “humiliate” Zelenskyy. By insisting, in a conversation
with toxic scum, on the relevance of reality, he was about the only clean thing
in the room that could be heard.
There are people like Fare
Yeah; not likely a coverup. An odd way to die though.
Deer mice are everywhere in Santa Fe. If you burn firewood, you clear nests of
them out of your woodpile year-round. Often very big ones. And they invade
houses, inexorably. I think they have transporters.
A thing I read that is very in
This (Ruiu’s Hinterland) was a nice read. Perhaps under-treats the things that
aren’t his topic — like the deep professionalization of concentrating and
retaining wealth, which has not yet been reduced to a children’s online food
fight — while somewhat universalizing the things that are his top
much like how the U.S. dealt with Stalin, to bring the war to
> an end.
>
> Continuing to support Ukraine half-heartedly, without full military
> commitment, has serious downsides. The war could drag on indefinitely, and if
> Ukraine eventually wins, Russia would be humiliated. A
If there were institutional backing for this, I would take it very seriously.
Thing is, the European institutions already have their own stresses trying to
employ a number of people comparable to those that they have trained. I’m not
sure how many Americans they can take on, realistically. Al
Useful.
I find myself annoyed at the way the gaggle of reporters at any of these public
appearances go along with the circus, though I don’t suppose they have any
other options and I couldn’t do any better were I in their place.
There was one such thing regarding one of the abductions and depor
gt; <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.science.org%2fcontent%2farticle%2fdo-you-want-direct-research-institute-germany-s-max-planck-society-has-hundreds-top&c=E,1,28-CkVRzVdmahBvLzIk9tBoLAKX55-8VHju9ZGTNIOT1BiooB3j5JAPLY2r9WJUDlEInOplyC3aCos2d41AB9JnLJyoU0bC-_qNIgP-pILR2
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