[RE-wrenches] 100kW BOS cost per Watt

[Luke Christy]

Esteemed Wrenches,
We are working on preliminary pricing (not a bid) for several 100kW  
ground mount commercial  systems (crystalline fixed mount). This sort  
of system is somewhat outside of our niche, and I'm wondering what  
folks who do it all the time are seeing for typical BOS costs (Civil  
work, engineering, wire and combiners, etc) at this size level. There  
are a few threads on the list addressing these costs, but they are out  
of date at this point


If appropriate, I'd also love to hear any comments on what sort of  
retail price per watt you're seeing on systems this size.


Thanks in advance


Luke Christy

 NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25 (Luke  
Christy)

 CoSEIA Certified PV Installer (Luke Christy)

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Monte Vista, CO




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Re: [RE-wrenches] Mounting L feet on corrugated metal roof.

[Luke Christy]

John,
If the roofing you are talking about is similar to traditional  
corrugated, but with flat valleys and ribs instead of a sinusoidal/ 
curved profile, we just completed an install like that using the  
Corrubracket from S-5. (it also works for the sinusoidal profile) No L- 
feet required. The bracket is extruded aluminum with a two-pad profile  
designed to span over a roofing rib. There are two tapped M8 holes on  
top for attachment. It worked great, and it came with a sticky sealant  
already attached to the mounting area. The issue we ran into was that  
since there are 4 mounting holes in a ~3-3.5" square layout, you can't  
really attach to rafters/truss chords alone, as one pair of holes will  
miss the structural member. We had to use some additional blocking  
underneath the roof decking.  That was a pain, but I was pleased with  
how it worked otherwise. Worth checking out.


Luke Christy

 NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25 (Luke  
Christy)

 CoSEIA Certified PV Installer (Luke Christy)

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Monte Vista, CO.
 sgsrenewab...@gmail.com



Wrenches,
Do you have any tips, stories, methods for mounting L feet on  
the corrugated metal roof that has short flat spans and ribs.
After all these years, I am facing my first install on this kind of  
roof.  We originally were going to install 6 top of pole mounts but  
he decided the neighbors would not like the appearance so now we are  
looking at a 20 x 40' metal roof on the garage.  The customer asked  
about flashing the L feet.  I'm at a loss to figure out how to do  
that.


John Blittersdorf
Central Vermont Solar & Wind
Rutland, VT 05701
cvso...@aol.com








Luke Christy

 NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25 (Luke  
Christy)

 CoSEIA Certified PV Installer (Luke Christy)

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
 sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
 719.588.3044





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Re: [RE-wrenches] Laing Solar Eco Pumps vs. El Sid

[Luke Christy]

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2010 15:59:13 -0500 (US/)
From: "Howie Michaelson" 
To: "RE-wrenches" 
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Laing Solar Eco Pumps vs. El Sid
Message-ID:
<50860.71.169.178.212.1291064353.squir...@mail7.atypica.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1

Hi All,

I'm looking for feedback on the Laing EcoCirc Pumps for use in closed
glycol PV driven SHW loops as well as closed loop off-grid hydronic
heating loops (24 vDC battery systems or 12 vDC stepped down).   
Probably

the D5 is the pump I'd use, but I'm open to any and all feedback.

In particular, I'm looking for comparisons to El Sids.  The Laings  
appear
to have a stronger pump curve than the El Sids.  I've used El Sids a  
fair
amount for these applications and have had less than stellar  
results, as

the El Sids often seem to have very short life spans.  Dan F at El Sid
suggests that they blow up due to high voltages, although he claims  
the 24

volt battery based pumps are good to 31 vDC and I've had them break at
much lower voltages.  I've also run the B12 pumps on a converter  
from BZ

Products which was voltage limited (to 15 volts) - supposedly a safe
voltage for the 12 volt battery based El Sid pumps (although Dan  
inferred

at one point that voltage limited converters can have a higher voltage
spike at start-up.  I haven't ordered any over the last couple of  
years so
I don't know if anything has changed, as I got tired of replacing  
them.


Anyone have experience with the Laings in these circumstances? Or any
similar or perhaps hopefully experience with the El Sids?  At $2-300  
a pop

for the El Sids, I'm feeling gun-shy about spec'ing them any more.

Thanks,
Howie
--
Howie Michaelson
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer?

Sun Catcher, LLC
Renewable Energy Systems Sales and Service
VT Solar & Wind Incentive Program Partner
http://www.SunCatcherVT.com
(cell) 802-272-0004
(home) 802-439-6096



Howie,
I have used half a dozen of the Laing D5 solar pumps over the last  
several years, all in various PV-direct glycol loop configurations.  
Several have been running continuously for 2 1/2 years with no  
problems. I've also used the El-Sid pumps, and I have had good results  
with them though I have basically stopped using them in favor of the  
D5. I've been very pleased with the D5s, and they are quieter than the  
El-Sids, which is an issue in some cases. The ability to sweat  
directly to the pump body is also nice, as you don't have to worry  
about thread sealing like on the El-Sid.  I did have an issue with a  
pump failure several years ago (Not the pump's fault-my customer  
destroyed a pump by meddling with the system), and I wasn't too happy  
with the Laing customer support people I talked with as I was trying  
to get a replacement rotor. However, I might have just gotten the  
wrong person at the wrong time.
That being said, I'd definitely recommend the Laing D5 over the El-Sid  
for most situations.


Luke Christy

 NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25 (Luke  
Christy)

 CoSEIA Certified PV Installer (Luke Christy)

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Monte Vista, CO.
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com




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Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery based hydrogen incidents

[Luke Christy]

These descriptions of battery explosions certainly drive home the  
point that one should always always wear protective gear when working  
on batteries.


I have  a story that may take the prize for the most foolish behavior  
yet described (thankfully I wasn't involved until the cleanup stage).
In 2008 a neighbor of mine was filling a bank of 12 L-16s installed in  
a remote home here in So. Colorado. Apparently it didn't occur to him  
that it probably wasn't a good idea to smoke while adding water to  
gassing batteries. Two or three batteries into the job, sure enough, a  
spark fell off his lit cigarette, probably landed in or near the open  
cap of the cell he was filling, and the resulting explosion blew the  
top off of the L-16, also spraying electrolyte everywhere in the  
battery room. My neighbor (who shall remain nameless) was not wearing  
protective gear of any kind, and of course he had acid in his eyes and  
all over his face. He was alone at this house, 40+ miles from the  
nearest town, and close to ten miles from the closest neighbor. He  
managed to wash his eyes and face in a creek, and was somehow able to  
drive the ten miles to the neighbor's house, who then took him to a  
hospital. Amazingly, he came out of it without permanent eye damage or  
scarring, but that must be due to having had more than his share of  
luck that day.


I had the job of cleaning up the mess and replacing the blown-up  
battery. One thing that stood out was the fact that the top of the  
battery disintegrated into dozens of very sharp shards of plastic.  
These were obviously thrown out with the explosion and could have  
easily caused serious injury themselves. The entire wall of the  
battery room was covered with tiny bits of plastic, plate particles,  
and electrolyte, almost making a cartoon-like outline of my neighbor,  
as he had been standing in front of the wall when the battery blew.


Always wear your eye protection. (and it seems that smoking plus  
hydrogen equals bad things).



Luke Christy

 NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25 (Luke  
Christy)

 CoSEIA Certified PV Installer (Luke Christy)

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Monte Vista, CO.
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com




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Re: [RE-wrenches] XW config tool

[Luke Christy]

I have an inverter to update as well, and just got the tool in the  
mail. I fear I already know the answer to this, but will it work with  
Mac OS?


Luke Christy

 NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25 (Luke  
Christy)

 CoSEIA Certified PV Installer (Luke Christy)

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Monte Vista, CO.
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com




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[RE-wrenches] Re : XW config tool

[Luke Christy]

Jay,
Thanks.
I knew it was a silly question.
What kind of trouble are you having with parallels? That was going to  
be my next option.


-Luke

On Jan 16, 2011, at 11:45 AM, re-wrenches-requ...@lists.re- 
wrenches.org wrote:



Message: 8
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2011 08:48:23 -0800
From: jay peltz 
To: RE-wrenches 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] XW config tool
Message-ID: <37fa3ffd-6a95-4d0c-acc3-a133fa94b...@asis.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"

Hi Luke,

No way.

I'm not sure its working with my Mac on the parallels part.

jay

peltz power
On Jan 15, 2011, at 11:17 AM, Luke Christy wrote:

I have an inverter to update as well, and just got the tool in the  
mail. I fear I already know the answer to this, but will it work  
with Mac OS?


Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installer?: Certification #031409-25 (Luke  
Christy)

CoSEIA Certified PV Installer (Luke Christy)

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Monte Vista, CO.
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com









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[RE-wrenches] PV in NYC

[Luke Christy]

Hi Wrenches:

I am doing some consulting on feasibility for a potential rooftop PV  
project on a commercial apartment building in NYC .  I'm trying to put  
together some preliminary numbers, and I'm not sure how to estimate  
all the additional costs related to working in a NYC  mid-rise  
environment. Also, it looks like the NYSERDA commercial RPS incentive  
is really complicated and to navigate.


If anyone has experience experience working in NYC, I'd love to hear  
your thoughts. I can pay you for your time.  Or if anyone has  
resources they can direct me to, I'd appreciate it!

Please reply off-list.
Thank you in advance.


Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25 (Luke Christy)
NABCEP Certified Solar Thermal Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03
 CoSEIA Certified PV Installer (Luke Christy)

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Monte Vista, CO.
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com






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[RE-wrenches] 3-phase wire run considerations

[Luke Christy]

Hi Folks,
In several months we will be installing a 100kW ground mounted PV  
system for one of our commercial customers. I'm in the planning stage  
and am looking at the wire runs. The site requires a 700' underground  
wire run between the 480V service and the single central inverter  
located at the array (a PVP100kW unit). I have two related questions:
1: Given the significant cost of the AC cabling for this situation,  
what is the most appropriate number to use for current in running  
voltage drop calcs? The wiring is going to be significantly oversized  
to achieve a ~1% VD at this length. I could use the max rated output  
current of the inverter (120A), but that seems like it might be overly  
conservative. Opinions?


2: It looks like the most cost effective and manageable solution for  
this run will involve several paralleled sets of cables. How important  
are the considerations of careful cable bundling? ie: putting several  
conductors per phase willy nilly in a trench vs having separate  
triplexed bundles.


Thanks in advance for your thoughts.



Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25 (Luke Christy)
NABCEP Certified Solar Thermal Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03
 CoSEIA Certified PV Installer (Luke Christy)

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Monte Vista, CO.
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com






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Re: [RE-wrenches] SMA Sunny Design temperature/voltage calculations

[Luke Christy]

I also echo the frustration with the removal of the online SMA design  
tool. Setting aside the issues of how much quicker it was to check  
different sizing options with the old web version, I'm also annoyed  
that the new version is not available for Mac OS, which means I have  
to start up my janky old PC laptop if I want to use the tool.


Bring back the old version!

Luke Christy





Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25 (Luke Christy)
NABCEP Certified Solar Thermal Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03
 CoSEIA Certified PV Installer (Luke Christy)

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Monte Vista, CO.
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com






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Re: [RE-wrenches] Cell Cracks

[Luke Christy]

Ray,
I just saw the same sort of thing on 2-year-old Peimar modules. In my case, 
there were visible hot spots that had burned through the backsheet in several 
places on several modules. In some places it was just small blisters, in others 
there was a clearly melted area of the backsheet. The hot spots seemed clearly 
associated with the cells that had cracks, but they were always at the edges 
and corners of cells. Unfortunately I did not have access to an IR camera to 
view them under load in the sun. 

The manufacturer replaced them under warranty, but I’m not pleased with these 
modules at all.


-Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 



Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com <mailto:sgsrenewab...@gmail.com>
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com <http://www.sgsrenewables.com/>
> 
> Hi All;
> 
> I've had a colleague ask that I post a couple pictures of what appears to be 
> cracks in cells under the glass.  The glass is not damaged.  These are Sun 
> Edison modules, so apparently no warranty.  Has anyone seen this, and are 
> these possibly dangerous (hot spots) or is this nothing to worry about?  An 
> Infrared camera did not show any issues.
> 
> As always your invaluable input is always appreciated.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> -- 
> Ray Walters
> Remote Solar
> 303 505-8760
> 
> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Reliable 48 to 24 V DC to DC reducer

[Luke Christy]

Drake,
I’ve run into this problem numerous times in the last year, as I’ve had a 
number of off-grid customers that I have upgraded from legacy 12V or 24V 
systems to 48V. Left behind are often things like expensive DC fridges and DC 
heating pumps. I’ve searched for converters a number of places and have found 
that eBay (and Amazon) have a ton of DC-DC converters available. Yes they are 
Chinese, and the many different brands seem to be clones of one another, so 
It’s hard to pick one with confidence. I was suspicious of them at first, but 
have several out in the field that have worked well for some time now. Most are 
in the 10-20A output current range, but there are bunch of different voltage 
configurations available. Just do a search on eBay with your desired voltages 
and you’ll pull something up. For the 48-12V conversion range, the solution 
I’ve settled on is golf cart DC-DC converters, which tend to be high quality 
and are designed to run 12V lights and accessories from 48V golf cart battery 
banks. I find these on eBay as well and have had great luck with them.

-Luke


Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com <mailto:sgsrenewab...@gmail.com>
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com <http://www.sgsrenewables.com/>
> On Sep 15, 2018, at 8:58 AM, Drake  
> wrote:
> 
> Since Solar Converters seems to have evaporated, I'm not sure where to look 
> for a 48 to 24 V DC to DC converter. Samplex has 24 to 12. It seems like 
> someone mentioned a Canadian company that makes these. 
> 
> I need to step down power from a 48 V battery bank to power El Sid pumps for 
> an offgrid hydronic  heating system. 
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Drake 
> 
>  <>Drake Chamberlin
> Athens Electric LLC
> OH License 44810
> CO License 3773
> NABCEP Certified Solar PV 
> 740-448-7328
> http://athens-electric.com/ <http://athens-electric.com/> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Conext Gateway Control

[Luke Christy]

Hi Mac,
I have a very similar issue to yours with a customer’s remote cabin and the 
need to be able to monitor and change settings remotely. I installed my first 
Gateway with a brand new Conext 4048 and an MPPT-150 controller and I’m having 
the exact same trouble and am getting the same error message. Before 
installation, I actually thought I had verified that I could make settings 
changes through the internet on a bench test using the admin password, etc, 
however, once the system was installed I haven’t been able to get it to work 
despite verifying my passwords and making a long trip for a return visit to the 
site.

Perhaps someone else has some insight?
I’m glad to know that this may be a larger issue.

-Luke


Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

> On Jan 31, 2020, at 07:10, Mac Lewis  wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi Wrenches,
> 
> I am working with Schneider on this but I haven't heard back in a few days so 
> I thought I'd put it out to the list to see if anyone else has worked through 
> this.
> 
> We recently installed our first Conext Gateway in hopes of getting better 
> monitoring and control through Insight 2 portal.  We installed it on an XW 
> 5548, AGS, Batt Mon, HV-MPPT charge controller ~ 4 years old.
> 
> For some reason, we cannot make changes to the system via the portal.  The 
> monitoring is much better but the control isn't functional.  When I make a 
> parameter change, it asks for the username and password but then gives this 
> error every time:
> 
> 
> 
> I verified that I am entering the Gateway admin username and the new password 
> that I assigned.  I can log into it locally, directly through the Access Pt 
> functionality.
> 
> Any suggestions?  Schneider isn't responding and its a snow cat ride to get 
> into the site.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> 
> 
> Mac Lewis
> 
> "Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates
> 
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[RE-wrenches] PV Estimate for Vaporware Building

[Luke Christy]

Wrenches,
We have been asked for a cost  estimate for a grid-tied PV system sized 
to offset the electrical consumption of a building that is still in the 
design phase. The building in question will be a elementary/high school 
for a small community in southern Colorado. The only information 
available is that it will be ~20,000 square ft, and will be going for 
LEED Gold certification. Heating will be either via a ground-source 
heat pump or gas-fired boiler+solar thermal feeding radiant floors. 
Obviously the final choice of those two options greatly affects 
electrical consumption of the building, but that aside, how are people 
dealing with this sort of estimate process?...ie: when the building 
itself is still vaporware. Is there a reasonable way to come up with a 
ballpark W/ft² value when one is dealing with a host of unknowns? Any 
techniques you've used to deal with these extremely amorphous requests 
for costs?




Thanks in advance for your input.
-Luke Christy

Luke Christy
NABCEP™ Certified PV Installer

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Center, CO
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Re: [RE-wrenches] PV Estimate for Vaporware Building

[Luke Christy]

Jeff and Peter,
Thanks for your input. It's helpful.
Cheers,
-Luke


Luke Christy

NABCEP™ Certified PV Installer
Solar Gain Services, LLC
45943 County Rd E
Center, CO. 81125
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044

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[RE-wrenches] Mounting to SIPs, revisited

[Luke Christy]

Esteemed Wrenches,

We have a PV job in the works that will require mounting racking to  
several roofs that consist of asphalt shingles laid over SIP panels.  
The panels are standard 10" nominal thickness, with 9-1/4" of foam  
sandwiched by 1/2 OSB on each side. The rub is that the underside of  
the panels will be the finished ceiling (with 5/8" of wood over the  
OSB).


I found a couple of threads in the archives discussing mounting to  
SIPs, but most comments suggest  through-bolting, and that is not an  
attractive option in this case due to the finished ceiling directly  
beneath.


The roofs in question are triangular in plan, and are fairly small (~  
15' x 15' x 21')


Does anyone have experience with mounting directly to the outer skin  
of a SIP panel?
Suggestions on the best way to approach this problem would be  
appreciated.


Thanks in advance.


Luke Christy

 NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25 (Luke  
Christy)

 CoSEIA Certified PV Installer (Luke Christy)

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Monte Vista, CO
 sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
 719.588.3044





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[RE-wrenches] Hidden freight damage

[Luke Christy]

Wrenches,

We have been in business for about 8 years, and up until now, the shipping gods 
have smiled upon me, but apparently my luck has run out, as I've had 2 costly 
shipping nightmares within a month,  and I'm just wondering what other Wrenches 
have done to protect themselves from the liability involved in trusting 
expensive shipments to the freight carriers.  Here's my situation:

I recently had a pallet of modules shipped, and it arrived with multiple broken 
modules, due apparently to careless handling,and having had something heavy set 
on top of the pallet.  I have my freight shipments sent to a neighboring 
business which is kind enough to receive them for me, since they have many full 
time staff who are always available during business hours to fork shipments off 
a truck.  In this case the forklift driver did not notice the damage (it was 
not immediately evident), and the delivery was signed for.  However, upon 
picking up the pallet an hour later, I  realized that the shipment was damaged, 
called the freight company immediately to notify them of the damage, and 
subsequently filed a detailed written claim. 

I just got notice that my claim was denied by the carrier, evidently without 
considering any of the photos or the written explanation I submitted with the 
claim. They simply cited that the shipment had been signed for without noting 
damage.  
It is clear to me that the carrier was responsible for the damage, yet 
apparently because the damage was hidden and the BOL was signed, they can leave 
me holding the bag for a significant amount of money. 

This particular incident could have been worse, but it is the first time I've 
had it happen and it certainly makes me worried about future deliveries. It 
suddenly seems like an unacceptable liability to have others sign for my 
deliveries without a thorough inspection. 

I asked my distributor whether the shipments have any insurance on them, and 
the person I spoke with didn't know the answer. So my $50 Ebay shipment is 
insured, but my $50,000 worth of equipment isn't? My insurance agent says that 
I can make a claim on my commercial insurance, but advised against it in this 
case, since the loss was only around $1K, and is guaranteed to raise my future 
premiums.

I know that things get damaged or lost all the time in shipment, and I'm 
wondering how other businesses handle it.  Businesses that do larger volume 
must have damaged freight all the time.  Is it just impossible to get freight 
companies to take responsibility for damage that is not immediately evident, 
since they are acting as judge on their own behalf?  Do you just refuse to sign 
the bill of lading until you've examined all the contents of the packages (this 
is a logistical nightmare in most cases)?  Do you just chalk it up to the cost 
of doing business and/or make claims to your commercial insurance? 

Would appreciate your thoughts / experiences with this issue.  
Thanks. - Luke

Luke Christy
  
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] Hidden Freight Damage

[Luke Christy]

Wrenches, 
Thanks to everyone who responded to my Freight Damage post. 

I wouldn't wish freight nightmares on anyone, but it is somewhat comforting to 
hear that most folks have run into this problem over the years. 
The major takeaway seems to be that there is no substitute for a thorough 
inspection of every delivery, even though that's often logistically difficult. 
Also pushing back on the denied claim to see if the carrier will come around to 
some kind of settlement. Given that the carrier in question is Con-way and they 
are generally surly even at the local office, I don't have a lot of hope for 
that, but it seems worth a try. 
I'm thinking in the future it may be worth it to pay extra for lift gate 
service with a call-ahead so that I can receive the deliveries personally at my 
shop. It has been convenient to have my friends with a loading dock take 
delivery of my shipments, but there is only so much I can ask them to do in 
terms of looking for damage. In the past I have tried the tactic of having the 
person signing for the freight put something like "Subject to Inspection for 
Damage" on the BOL, but it's hard for that to work well when you never know who 
will actually sign for the item. Of course, with this latest broken shipment, 
the disclaimer didn't get on the BOL. 

Thanks again.  May all your pallets arrive intact. 

-Luke


Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] controllers

[Luke Christy]

Ron,

The Midnite Kids are in Beta testing right now The production versions are 
supposed to start shipping in the next month or two. 

We have a Beta Kid and I think it is going to be a game changer for small 
systems. It doesn't have quite as many features as the Classic, but it's pretty 
amazing for a competitively priced 30A MPPT controller. Plus more features get 
added with every firmware update just like with the Classics. I would highly 
recommend getting one when they start shipping from the distributors.

-Luke

> 
> The Midnite Kid looks like the ticket but didn't realize it was shipping yet. 
> I like the Classics so if the Kid is a chip off the old block then I'll go 
> with it for sure.
> 
> Ron
> 
> On 2014-02-21, at 1:41 PM, Jason Andrade  
> wrote:
> 
>> I recieved a Kid controller and the Whizbang Jr a couple off weeks ago and
>> so far it is a nice little unit, I haven't put it under any big charging yet
>> 
>> but I am a Midnite user and it is what you would expect from Midnite. I am
>> going to try the Whizbanger on the classic as it is what charges the
>> batteries for my house this weekend.
>> 
>> Jason 
>> 
>> West Coast Sustainables
>> Jason Andrade
>> C-46# 974647
>> (530) 410-4745 Cell
>> (530) 241-7498 Office
>> (530) 348-5301 Fax
>> ja...@westcoastsustainables.com
>> 

Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] Solar DHW

[Luke Christy]

Bill, 
I'm based in Southern Colorado, so unfortunately don't have personal experience 
with NE CA distributors, but having said that,  I would recommend giving 
SunEarth a call. They make top-notch harp-style collectors in So Cal, and they 
private label a host of other Solar Thermal components, including Steca 
controllers. The folks I have talked to from their sales team are friendly and 
helpful and I'm sure they can tell you who in your area distributes their 
stuff. They might even sell to you directly. 
I prefer Resol controllers for our thermal projects and have found that Alpha 
Thermal Systems in Massachusetts is the place to get those controls. They also 
distribute PAW pumpstations and will ship for a reasonable price. 

Best,
-Luke

> 
> Wrenches,
> 
>Occasionally I get wrangled into doing hot water.  I used to source 
> stuff from Solar 
> Depot, but they are gone.  For those wrenches in the NE California area, I 
> would appreciate leads on suppliers for thermal panels, tanks (with heat 
> exchangers), circ pumps, etc.  Is UMA a candidate?
> 
> Thanks for any tips. leads.
> 
> Bill
> Feather River Solar Electric
> 4291 Nelson St.
> Taylorsville, CA  95983
> 530.284.7849 / 6544 fax
> www.frenergy.net


Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] Corrugated Roof Brackets

[Luke Christy]

Adam,
I'm a big fan of the Corrubracket. We've installed hundreds of them on a whole 
range of different types of corrugated roofing, with zero problems so far. 
The peel-and stick sealant that comes attached to the bracket works really 
well, but it can get pulled aside as the fastener goes through and grabs the 
sealant. I always try to check  the bracket after attachment to make sure that 
the sealant is fully between the bracket and the roofing, and often I will daub 
polyurethane caulking on top of the fasteners.

The only thing I don't like is the price point and the fact that the span of 
the four mounting holes often necessitates some form of blocking.

-Luke


Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com


> From: RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On
> Behalf Of AE Solar
> Sent: Thursday, March 05, 2015 8:01 AM
> To: RE-wrenches
> Subject: [RE-wrenches] Corrugated Roof Brackets
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Wrenchers,
> 
> Anyone have feedback or preferences on mounting systems for corrugated
> roofs? I'm looking at the S-5! CorruBracket
> <http://www.s-5.com/clamps/index_2624.cfm> . Its for a very small system on
> a hunting cabin. The pitch is probably about 20 degrees and and I'm
> concerned about leaks over time. Any recommendations are appreciated. Thanks
> 
> Adam
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Adam Katzman
> Autonomous Energies
> 4872 State Route 9G 
> Germantown NY, 12526
> www.autonomousenergies.com
> (518) 567-1468
> 
> **


   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] Load testing Lithium battery bank

[Luke Christy]

Larry,

I've been checking out the [current] viability of Li+ technologies for RE 
systems, and I'm encouraged to hear of the success you've apparently had. 
What is the typical kWh size of the battery packs you've been putting together? 
Are you sourcing the GBS batteries directly from the manufacturer?

I appreciate both your and Jarmo's comments about the safety concerns with this 
rapidly evolving technology.  
Feeling good about the long term safety of a large RE-scale Li-ion battery pack 
for my customers has been a major stumbling block for me thus far. 

Thanks,
-Luke


Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] Question on Back up generators

[Luke Christy]

Dana,
I find this emissions-related issue pretty interesting. It hasn't been totally 
clear to me why these generator manufacturers keep taking various models off 
their "off-grid rated" lists, but this seems to shed a little more light on the 
issue.

However, I've been under the impression that the really restrictive tier 4 
regulations were mainly targeted at high horsepower diesel gensets. Does a tiny 
(relatively speaking)  propane genset have to meet the same runtime 
restrictions, etc?

In this penalty scenario where someone is getting fined $39k/day for running a 
standby power only generator in a non-standby situation, who is at risk of 
getting fined? Surely not the property owner… And how could that possibly be 
enforced? 

Best,
-Luke


Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com


Message: 3
Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2015 15:23:59 -0600
From: "Dana" 
To: "'RE-wrenches'" 
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Question on Back up generators
Message-ID: <01a001d07242$54a175e0$fde461a0$@com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hey All - 



I just got off of a phone call with my Onan generator supplier. Last
conversation with Kohler was the same story basically.



I was informed that their smallest water cooled generator, the RS22 (22 KW)
is now no longer "rated "for off grid. They actually called me to confirm
that this generator was for backup power to a utility inter connected house.
Tier 4 generators in the EPA CFR 40 is the Federal code what covers this, &
you are allowed 100 hours of run time for standby power and maintenance per
year. 

Q - Why am I using ridiculous sized generators for something that an 82-8300
watt generator does just fine?

A - The EPA current requirements, a shrinking economy, & manufacturers that
have to meet very expensive air quality compliance. 

The Penalty - If you get caught running a "standby power only" generator the
fine is now $39,000 per day! 

Now I am far from a polluting kind of individual and all for air quality but
this is getting the best of us. The 13KW air cooled generators are only good
for 2000 hours, & the water cooled go 20 years of moderate usage but cost a
boat load. I hate having the "Generator" talk with a new client they look at
me like I am crazy. So the air cooled units are basically throwaways and the
22KW units are way more than we need and what a client needs to spend money
on, unless you are at 10,000 ft el.



If you figure 30 amps/120 VAC input per inverter +/- x 2 = 7.2KW plus say
10-15% fudge or elevation factors would require an 8200-8300 watt generator.
Air cooled at 3600 RPM = 80 MPH & 1800 RPM = 40 MPH.  Even if the generator
were a bit smaller, ran slow (1200-1800 rpm) and ran a bit longer that would
be acceptable. 

So, why are we installing even 13KW air cooled or 22 KW water generators?

There is a business opportunity here folks.



What are you all installing?

Why?

Is it reliable?

Would you use it on your house?



Thanks for sharing all the wisdom and knowledge.





Dana Orzel 

Great Solar Works, Inc -  NABCEP # 051112-136

E - d...@solarwork.com  - Web - solarwork.com 

O - 970.626.5253  C - 208.721.7003 - No FAX Line

"Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988"  

P Please consider the environment before printing this email.


   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] Apprentice interview

[Luke Christy]

Since we're pretty far down the road of throwing out traits that define the 
mythic ideal employee/apprentice, I'm going to add what I think is one of the 
most important (and probably most difficult to find) traits, which is the 
ability to THINK (preferably quickly) on one's feet to solve a problem, as well 
as willingness/desire to learn new skills and improve the skills one already 
has. 
It doesn't seem like it's asking too much to find someone with those abilities, 
but it sure is rare to come across. 

-Lukw

Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] FLA battery setpoints with larger arrays

[Luke Christy]

Jay's point about adding PV to offset daytime AC for the battery bank brings up 
the issue of active cooling. 

How many folks out there are installing some form of cooling for LA battery 
banks, and how are you implementing it? 

The issue of excess heat being an enemy of battery life has had me concerned 
for several years now, and I have started installing multiple fans in battery 
boxes to increase the cooling from air circulation, but I'm not sure I have the 
effectiveness dialed yet. 

Interested to hear what others are doing here.

As always, I appreciate the great resource that is this list. 

-Luke



Message: 2
Date: Fri, 22 May 2015 17:07:05 -0700
From: jay peltz 
To: RE-wrenches 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] FLA battery setpoints with larger arrays
Message-ID:

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Hi Ray,

Cold isn't a problem.  It reduces capacity and yes they could freeze, but
it doesn't shorten life ( I mean besides the freezing part) in fact cooler
batteries last longer.
But hot is a problem. Those max temps are not the same thing as reduced
life from running at a hotter temperature.


As to internal temps, its really hard to do this.  IR cameras are pretty
good.  Temp sensors which stick to the outside of the case's are not as
good as ones that bolt to the post.  The post is a good thermal conductor
vs the plastic case.  The glue/stick on ones come loose as we all know and
that means less accurate metering.

My premise for bring up the temp concern is that with a larger array and
smaller battery which equals higher C rates you will have higher internal
temps, no way around it.  How high, how much/will it shorten the life
unclear but probably, how much, ?

Let me rephrase it, do you think hotter temperatures are increasing the
lifespan of the battery?

While on this subject, I've done some quick calcs and with hot areas, its
cheaper to add PV for installing daytime AC vs battery life lost due to the
heat.  We can thank the cheap world of PV for that.

And while I've thought about what Allan started this conversion with in
regards to sizing batteries.
I continue to size my batteries around best life for the battery  ( best
daily average % DOD).
There are many ways to consider the size/cost etc of batteries:  For a
larger battery (less DOD)  you could view it as buying lead futures, longer
time between problems, etc.  For smaller bank ( higher DOD)  my only reason
for doing it at this point is a bridge battery to when Li-Ion/other
technologies will overtake LA for cost/ease/MX/capabilities.

I'd be curious to hear what others think about that last part,

jay




Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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[RE-wrenches] Voltage Degradation with Uni-Solar laminate

[Luke Christy]

Hello Off-Grid Wrenches,

I recently made a periodic maintenance visit to a residential off-grid system I 
take care of here in Southern CO, and discovered an interesting problem. 

This system has an array of 48x Uni-Solar PVL-68 laminate modules applied 
directly to standing-seam metal roofing. 

The data logging on the controller (Outback MX-60) indicated that the system 
was having trouble completing a charge cycle and going to float. Initially I 
assumed was due to heavy electrical use by the occupants (renters). After a 
little checking, I noticed that the module string voltage was only about 0.5V 
above the battery voltage! 
This was a cool late morning, with full sun, and the array was charging almost 
2kW at 54.5V. The module strings were running at 55V. I've noticed the module 
voltage being lower than I'd like before, but it has never been this low. I 
suspect this is the real reason the system hasn't been able to complete a 
charge cycle.

By removing the loads I was able to get an open-circuit voltage of 71V, but 
that still seems pretty low. 

Has anyone else experienced a voltage degradation issue with the Uni-Solar 
laminate? What was the expected annual voltage degradation for this technology? 

These modules do have some age on them. The system was installed about 15 years 
ago (by a competent installer who is now retired). The system was installed 
before MPPT controllers were common, so I assume the modules are wired in 
strings of 4 for 48V nominal. 

Any experiences or opinions are appreciated.
Thanks in advance. 

-Luke


Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] Voltage Degradation with Uni-Solar laminate

[Luke Christy]

Jay,
the 71V I measured was the array VOC. 
Accessing the wiring for individual strings is fairly difficult as the 
combiners are high up in a hot attic. I didn't have a lot of time on site the 
day I observed this problem, so didn't gather as much information as I could 
have otherwise. 

A re-wire for more voltage looks like the solution.  With 8 modules in series, 
allowing for a wintertime extreme minimum temp of -30C is really going to drive 
the VOC up there. That looks like Classic 250 territory for a long-term solution
 
-Luke


As   
On May 31, 2015, at 1:23 PM, jay peltz  wrote:

HI Luke,

To add here.  I'm unclear if you have measured each string or the whole array 
at 71v.  
I would check each string for voc/isc.  

And then if they are consistent, I agree that putting 2 strings in series with 
a new controller might help out.  
You can try it with the MX-60 as you are at only 142v. If it works better then 
a new higher voltage CC would be required for winter higher voc.

Let us know what you find out.

jay
Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] Voltage Degradation with Uni-Solar laminate

[Luke Christy]

Allen, 
With 8 modules in series I think I'll be looking at a Classic 250 for sure to 
be comfortable with winter morning VOC. 
I don't really know what kind of combiner situation I'll find up in the attic. 
It may be easy enough to re-wire into strings of 6 instead of strings of 8, 
though that is still probably going to push me just over the 150 VOC hard limit 
of the MX-60. I may not be able to get around replacing the controller. 

-Luke



On May 31, 2015, at 10:59 PM, Allan Sindelar  wrote:

> Jay,
> Whoa, I'd be careful there. Unless there's been a change while I was away on 
> my bicycle, Outbacks are still 140V rated maximum voltage and 150V hard 
> maximum. 142Voc in May suggests that doubling strings in series will easily 
> exceed max Voc in winter. That's why I previously suggested Classic 200 or 
> 250. Am I missing something?
> Allan
> 
> Allan Sindelar
> al...@sindelarsolar.com
> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
> NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
> New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
> Founder (Retired), Positive Energy, Inc.
> 505 780-2738 cell
> 
>  
> On 5/31/2015 2:23 PM, jay peltz wrote:
>> HI Luke,
>> 
>> To add here.  I'm unclear if you have measured each string or the whole 
>> array at 71v.  
>> I would check each string for voc/isc.  
>> 
>> And then if they are consistent, I agree that putting 2 strings in series 
>> with a new controller might help out.  
>> You can try it with the MX-60 as you are at only 142v. If it works better 
>> then a new higher voltage CC would be required for winter higher voc.
>> 
>> Let us know what you find out.
>> 
>> jay
>> 
>> 

Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] Voltage Degradation with Uni-Solar laminate

[Luke Christy]

Thanks to everyone for your responses, both on and off-list. You guys rock.

Allan,
The system was originally installed in 2000 with an Ananda 
controller/disconnect box. The giant one with the mercury relays. It failed 
about 6 years ago and an MX-60 was installed to replace it. I agree that a 
modern controller is a no-brainer. I'd like to avoid having to replace the 
MX-60, but i don't see any way around it if I do a re-wire. 

To Ray's point, doing the string sizing exercise shows that a Classic 250 with 
8 mods in series is probably the easiest solution, although there might be 
clipping in some circumstances.
The existing MX-60 is in trouble for anything over 5 in series. 
-Luke



On May 31, 2015, at 11:30 PM, Allan Sindelar  wrote:

> Luke,
> I deleted your first message, but I thought you wrote that the system was 
> pre-MPPT, with strings wired as 4 12 Vnom in series. IT seems to me that 
> given insufficient Vmp, a modern controller is a no-brainer anyway, and it's 
> only a matter to which one to use.
> 
> A Classic 250 is the easy route that lets you solve a major problem with a 
> simple and sensible component upgrade. It'll cost the customer nearly as much 
> for a winter return trip to estimate Voc.
> But I agree with Jay and Randy: first check the existing array for failures.
> Allan
> 
> Allan Sindelar
> al...@sindelarsolar.com
> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
> NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
> New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
> Founder (Retired), Positive Energy, Inc.
> 505 780-2738 cell
> 
>  
> On 5/31/2015 11:22 PM, Luke Christy wrote:
>> Allen, 
>> With 8 modules in series I think I'll be looking at a Classic 250 for sure 
>> to be comfortable with winter morning VOC. 
>> I don't really know what kind of combiner situation I'll find up in the 
>> attic. It may be easy enough to re-wire into strings of 6 instead of strings 
>> of 8, though that is still probably going to push me just over the 150 VOC 
>> hard limit of the MX-60. I may not be able to get around replacing the 
>> controller. 
>> 
>> -Luke
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On May 31, 2015, at 10:59 PM, Allan Sindelar 
>> 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> Jay,
>>> Whoa, I'd be careful there. Unless there's been a change while I was away 
>>> on my bicycle, Outbacks are still 140V rated maximum voltage and 150V hard 
>>> maximum. 142Voc in May suggests that doubling strings in series will easily 
>>> exceed max Voc in winter. That's why I previously suggested Classic 200 or 
>>> 250. Am I missing something?
>>> Allan
>>> 
>>> Allan Sindelar
>>> 
>>> al...@sindelarsolar.com
>>> 
>>> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
>>> NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
>>> New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
>>> Founder (Retired), Positive Energy, Inc.
>>> 505 780-2738 cell
>>> 
>>>  
>>> On 5/31/2015 2:23 PM, jay peltz wrote:
>>> 
>>>> HI Luke,
>>>> 
>>>> To add here.  I'm unclear if you have measured each string or the whole 
>>>> array at 71v.  
>>>> I would check each string for voc/isc.  
>>>> 
>>>> And then if they are consistent, I agree that putting 2 strings in series 
>>>> with a new controller might help out.  
>>>> You can try it with the MX-60 as you are at only 142v. If it works better 
>>>> then a new higher voltage CC would be required for winter higher voc.
>>>> 
>>>> Let us know what you find out.
>>>> 
>>>> jay
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>> Luke Christy
>> 
>> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
>> NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
>> CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 
>> 
>> Solar Gain Services, LLC
>> PO Box 531
>> Monte Vista, CO. 81144
>> 
>> sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
>> 
>> 719.588.3044
>> 
>> www.sgsrenewables.com
>> 
>> 
>>
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Voltage Degradation with Uni-Solar laminate

[Luke Christy]

Unfortunately I don't have easy access to a Curve Tracer. That would be nice 
for this situation though. 
-Luke



On Jun 1, 2015, at 12:13 PM, Jerry Shafer  wrote:

> Do you or anyone you know have a IR Curve tester
> Jerry
> 

Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] Voltage Degradation with Uni-Solar laminate

[Luke Christy]

Larry,
Thanks. This is helpful. I think it's pretty clear that this system should have 
been designed with at least 5 or 6 modules in series to keep the VOC higher, 
but that wasn't very feasible with the original controller when the system was 
installed 15 years ago. Still, it has worked pretty well for a decade and a 
half, and I've never noticed the array voltage that low before.  I fear I'm in 
for a hot attic crawl to do some more testing and checking for faults. 

-Luke


On Jun 1, 2015, at 12:30 PM, Starlight Solar Power Systems 
 wrote:

> Sorry...I meant to type 17.75V (71V).
> 
> 
> 
> On Jun 1, 2015, at 11:21 AM, Starlight Solar Power Systems 
>  wrote:
> 
> Luke,
> 
> For reference, we sold/installed many hundreds of Uni-Solar products since 
> 2002. I have never seen anywhere near that much Voc loss. 
> 
> Since the PVL-68 has an open circuit of 23.1V (92.4V) but you only see 14.2V 
> (71V), a loss of 25%, I do not believe degradation is the culprit even at 15 
> years. The rated degradation is 0.73% per year. That should put you at 82.3 
> Voc. But, Uni-Solar consistantly outputs  at least 10% more than rated power, 
> even with age it should be higher than 82 volts.
> 
> Proper Uni-Solar installation required 2 screws into the roof up near the 
> top. A misplaced screw and time or an open seam may be causing a ground 
> fault, pulling down the voltage of the array. Start by using a Megger at the 
> combiner to check for leakage. No one likes crawling in a hot attic but I 
> think you may need to. 
> 
> 
> Larry Crutcher
> 
> 

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] #2 -#8 AWG Crimpers

[Luke Christy]

Hi Khirpa,
We use a high quality mini hex crimper with rotatable dies for #8-1/0 AWG. It 
is basically a miniature version of the Hex-Crimp battery lug crimper sold by 
Quick Cable. The one I have is older and no longer has the manufacturer label, 
but I believe it was marketed as a Cub Crimper. A quick web search shows that 
there is still a similar crimper sold under that name. At any rate, I have been 
very pleased with this crimper, and I'd recommend it.

Best,
-Luke

On Jun 4, 2015, at 12:11 PM, Kirpal Khalsa  wrote:

> Greetings wrenches. we would like to vet a good quality crimper for 
> crimping copper ring terminals to our mid range wire sizesAny of you have 
> a good quality crimping tool you can recommend. ...wire sizes I am looking to 
> crimp are #2-#8 AWG.
> Thanks in advance!
> Kirpal Khalsa
> Oregon Solarworks
> 
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Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] #2 -#8 AWG Crimpers

[Luke Christy]

Jay,
I haven't checked there in a while but I just took a look. The crimper I'm 
talking about is identical to the Junior Crimper sold by Del City.

-Luke
On Jun 4, 2015, at 1:13 PM, Jay  wrote:

> Have you checked Del City?  
> 
> Jay
> Peltz power
> 
> 
> 

Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] #2 -#8 AWG Crimpers

[Luke Christy]

Kirpal,
Glad to help.
By the way, I just realized that I completely butchered your name in my earlier 
post…My apologies for that. Typing on a smartphone didn't help.
-Luke

On Jun 4, 2015, at 5:42 PM, Kirpal Khalsa  wrote:

> Luke, Mick Jay.Thank you for the feedback..I just ordered a set of the 
> cub crimpers...I think it is going to be a useful addition to our tool chest.
> What  prompted this is that we often solder our ring terminals on but it 
> tends to stiffen the copper wire.We use alot of the Midnite panel mount 
> breakers and the 300VDC breakers still have the really chincy terminal posts 
> which break off with just the slightest twisting of the wireOver the 
> years Outback Power also used those breakers and we have piles of those brand 
> new crappy breakers which have a broken terminal postI noted some of the 
> single pole panel mount breakers have a sturdier terminal post and this 
> problem is going awayI am hoping this can happen for all the panel mount 
> breakers these manufacturers sell.  
> Made me realize a high quality crimp without the stiffening of the wire will 
> help reduce this problem.  Those breakers are expensive!  
> Thanks for the advice!!
> 
> Sunny Regards,
> Kirpal Khalsa
> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
> Oregon Solarworks LLC
> www.oregonsolarworks.com
> 541-218-0201 m
> 541-299-0402 o
> 

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] off-grid propane tankless water heater advice

[Luke Christy]

Hi Rebekah,
Here in the mountains of Southern
CO we work with tankless heaters a lot on off-grid systems. I know that you're 
trying to eliminate the phantom load of the electronically controlled heaters, 
but unless the application is for a seasonal cabin with a tiny PV system, I 
would get one of the modern electronic direct vent heaters. They work so much 
better than the non-electric ones, and they seem more reliable also. I've 
installed dozens of Rinnai and Wai-Wela (made in Japan by Paloma) tankless 
heaters, and as long as they are cleaned every year or two they are highly 
dependable. The consistency of water temperature and the quick response time is 
just in a different league from the old non-electric units. Many of the heaters 
I've installed have been in off-grid situations, and I've measured the standby 
consumption of Wai-Wela units at around 5W. It's not zero but it usually isn't 
a significant extra load and I think the advantages of the 
electronically-controlled units far outweigh the penalty of the standby 
consumption. The flexibility of the powered direct vent system is also a major 
advantage for ease of installation. 
Just my $.02

-Luke


NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03 
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 
 
Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

> On Sep 3, 2015, at 10:06, Rebekah Hren  wrote:
> 
> Hi Wrenches, 
> 
> Any suggestions for trustworthy:
> 
> -propane tankless water heater
> - draft-vented 
> -battery (or hydro) ignition with no electrical hookups
> 
> It seems to be a lot harder to find tankless water heaters which do not have 
> a 120VAC power supply these days. It's not a big power draw, but it is a 
> phantom load for off-grid and I'm not sure it's a great idea to manually 
> switch the tank power supply on/off several times day? 
> 
> Thanks!
> Rebekah Hren
> 
> 
> -- 
> Tel: 336.266.8800
> NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installation Professional™ 091209-85
> NC Licensed Electrical Contractor
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Re: [RE-wrenches] DPW Rack Problems

[Luke Christy]

These paint and fit issues have our experience as well.
The last DP&W rack I took delivery of had every single piece of paper and foam 
packing material stuck in the paint. Even after careful cleaning it was still a 
mess. That kind of stuff and the ridiculous lead times are really making me 
want to look elsewhere, despite the fact that I think they still make a good 
product.
-Luke

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03 
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 
 
Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

> 
> 
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[RE-wrenches] Generac EcoGen Failure.

[Luke Christy]

Hello Wrenches,

I've installed quite a few of the small 6 kW Generac EcoGen units for my 
off-grid customers and have been pretty pleased with them…up to now. The 15kW 
EcoGen unit recently became available and I commissioned one last week for a 
nearby off-grid site. The generator ran fine the first day, then the very next 
day I got a call from the customer saying that the genny auto started, ran for 
less than an hour, then started sounding funny and shut off with an error 
alarm. I made a site visit to check out the problem, and found that it would 
not start. Some further investigation suggests that there is some electronic 
control issue keeping it from running. The error code suggests a component 
failure. 

This is a brand new generator with less than 3 hrs of run time. 

The real issue I'm facing is that despite the fact that I am a Generac 
"Dealer", Generac refuses to give me access to Tech support or to help me with 
any troubleshooting over the phone. I can't get access to any service manuals 
or, really, anything unless I pay them ~$2k to become a Service dealer by 
attending some Tech training classes and buying a  bunch of spare parts I will 
likely never need. In general I'm not opposed to doing this as I work on 
generators all the time and it would be a good niche for my area, however it 
wouldn't help in this case, and I'm not exactly eager to pay Generac for 
training after the brushoff I got when I talked to Customer Support about this 
issue. 

Generac says my only option to get any kind of help or service on this 
generator is to contact a Service dealer. As I am based in rural Southern CO, 
the closest Service dealer is 3-1/2 hrs away. Of course this leaves me in a 
lousy position and makes it nearly impossible for me to help my customer in a 
timely manner, as it might take a week to get someone out here and then I'll 
likely have to pay for the drive time because the warranty won't cover anything 
over 100 miles round trip. 

I have to say I'm pretty much appalled at this lack of support for an obvious 
warranty issue with a  brand new product.

I know we've had some Generac discussions on here before. Seems like we may 
even have a couple of Generac Service folks on this list. Any advice on how I 
could get some troubleshooting help without bringing someone in from halfway 
across the state? Or does anyone know of a good Generac forum where I might be 
able to get some help?

Thanks as always. I appreciate this list.
 
-Luke

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   

Solar Gain Services, LLC
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Generac EcoGen Failure.

[Luke Christy]

Thanks Chris.
I do get the value of proper training, I just feel a little hung out to dry in 
this particular instance. However, as you pointed out, being in this situation 
where I'm pretty far removed from an urban area with a service dealer is 
probably fairly unusual. 

In any case, I really appreciate your offer to help. I'll get in touch off list 
with some more details. 

-Luke

On Nov 2, 2015, at 12:31 PM, Chris Mason  wrote:

> You do need a service tech on staff to be a service dealer. Otherwise you are 
> just selling the product.
> In order to be a service tech you need to attend training every two years. I 
> have to travel from the Caribbean to Wisconsin to take the training at my own 
> expense, they don't provide hotel anymore.
> The aim is to ensure properly trained technicians. Generac pays us to do the 
> services, something most solar manufacturers won't do.
> You are in a pretty unique position, not having any service dealers close by. 
> However, Generac may agree to pay the cost to bring a service tech to your 
> site. It is their responsibility to do the service.
> In one case they flew a tech to the Caribbean to service a commercial unit. 
> Now they just send them to me.
> If I can assist you remotely I will. Send me an email off list with a full 
> description of the problem and I will see what I can do.
> 
> 
> 

Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Icynene spray foam insulation patching

[Luke Christy]

Hi Jason,
We carry a can of Great Stuff expanding foam for that sort of thing. I'm always 
mindful of maintaining an air seal when we have to make conduit penetrations on 
newer buildings, so I try to get the expanding foam into the wall or roof 
cavity around the conduit and then seal the outside with a quality sealant. 

-Luke

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03 
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 
 
Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

> On Nov 19, 2015, at 05:22, Jason Szumlanski 
>  wrote:
> 
> ​What are you doing to patch up conduit penetrations through icynene 
> insulation?​ 
> 
> 
> 
> ​Jason Szumlanski​
> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Icynene spray foam insulation patching

[Luke Christy]

It would be interesting to know what this contractor was referring to 
specifically. I've used Great Stuff extensively in buildings insulated with 1/2 
lb polyurethane foam and haven't noticed any obvious adherence or other 
compatibility issues. I believe Icynene is usually a more dense 2 lb product. I 
wonder if there is some kind of chemical incompatibility. Anyone else know 
about this?


-Luke

On Nov 19, 2015, at 8:25 AM, Jason Szumlanski 
 wrote:

> A​n insulation contractor mentioned to me that Great Stuff is "not 
> compatible" with Icynene. I took that to mean it doesn't adhere. Perhaps he 
> meant that it isn't as effective.
> 
> Jason
> 
> ​

Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   


Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Frozen T-105s

[Luke Christy]

I would echo Mark's comment. 
Some years ago I worked on a bank of 2V Telco batteries that had gotten frozen. 
Granted, they were not frozen solid, but after thawing and putting them back on 
charge they recovered. Hard  to say how much capacity was lost, but the last 
time I checked in on them (last month), they were still operating. Those big 
C&D telco batteries are something else. This is a full-time use remote house 
situation with an old-school 12V system. The batteries were made in 1974 and 
they are still working today even with the freeze issue, which was probably 20 
years ago at least!

-Luke


On Dec 3, 2015, at 9:47 AM,  wrote:

> >>> Completely thaw them before attempting to charge them. <<<
> 
> If there is ice only on top of the cells, it is unlikely that the batteries 
> are damaged.
> 
>  Original Message 
> Subject: [RE-wrenches] Frozen T-105s
> From: Feather River Solar Electric 
> Date: Thu, December 03, 2015 9:00 am
> To: RE-wrenches 
> 
> Hey Folks,
> 
> I came across an off-gridder yesterday whom was getting zero support 
> from the dealer he had purchased his small system from, self installed, 
> batteries in a lightly insulated box outside.  When I inspected the 
> electrolyte levels I discovered it was frozen in some cells, the voltage of 
> the 48 volt pack was ~8 volts, I didn't check individual batteries due to 
> these facts...I'd seen "enough".  Recently temps have been in the high teens, 
> though we are back up to low 30's.
> 
> He does not have a genny or battery charger! I have a DC genny which 
> I could use to charge these batteries but should I waste my time and his 
> money trying to save them?  Others' experience with this situation?
> 
> TIA,
> 
> Bill
> 
> -- 
> Feather River Solar Electric
> Bill Battagin, Owner
> 4291 Nelson St.
> Taylorsville, CA 95983
> 530.284.7849
> CA Lic 874049
> 
> 
> 

Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   


Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
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www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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[RE-wrenches] HuP Conundrum

[Luke Christy]

Hi Friends, 

With all of the battery threads going on right now I figured it would be a good 
time to start another one. 

I have a customer with a large off-grid system who has just started having 
trouble with a bank of HuP batteries. This system is 48V with 8x 12V 6-85F-27S 
batteries in two series strings. Charging is supplied by around 10 kW of PV.  

I didn't install the system and the customer has always taken care of the 
maintenance and watering himself. He has seemingly been pretty diligent about 
taking care of things, including  equalizing on a regular basis. However, 
recently he started having voltage problems and when I made a site visit to 
check on the batteries, I found that 3 of the 8x 12V batteries each had a cell 
with SG so low it wouldn't register on my hydrometer. 

Obviously this is a problem, and owing to some complicating factors I'm not 
really sure how best to address the issue. 

Replacing the entire battery bank will be unbelievably expensive, especially 
given that the house is in a remote location and there is difficult access to 
the battery room. To add a another factor, the house is currently unoccupied 
while the owner tries to sell the property, so he is not exactly eager to 
invest a lot of money into battery replacement. 

The batteries are only 11 years old, so they should theoretically have quite a 
bit of life left in them. Perhaps those of you with more experience with larger 
batteries can advise. Can the cells be resurrected with careful charging and 
equalizing? 

What would you do?

Thanks as always for opinions and advice.

Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   


Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] SIPS panel roofs

[Luke Christy]

Hi Dana,
We had to do this very thing for a project some years ago. I searched 
extensively for a product that could allow us to attach directly to the top 
skin of a SIP panel without having to use blocking or through fasteners. We 
ended up using an attachment made by EcoFasten Solar. It uses a steel plate 
with a number of screws (8, I think) that collectively  create the required 
pullout resistance. They had engineering to support using the product on SIPs, 
which was awesome. 

A quick look at their website shows that they still make a SIP-specific 
attachment. Their flashing isn't ideal for Pro-panel, but I would think that 
you could make it work.

-Luke


> On Dec 16, 2015, at 16:45, Dana  wrote:
> 
> SIP ROOF INSTALLATION
>  
> I was asked to install on a SIP panel roof today. 5/8” OSB over 6” of foam on 
> a 9:12 roof pitch at 9800’ elevation with a Pro panel metal roof skin.  There 
> is a finished ceiling underneath the lower side of the SIP roof panel.
> I explained that it was not ideal due to the lack of good attachment etc. 
> They were not concerned and said “you’ll make it work!”
>  
> I have done SIP panels in new construction and we could install backing from 
> underneath and refoam.
> My first thought was to do 2-2.5 times the normal L feet.
> One thought was to use expanding moly-bolts.
>  
> Has anyone have experience attaching to SIP roof that was not prepared for an 
> array?
>  
> 
> Dana Orzel
> Great Solar Works, Inc -  NABCEP # 051112-136
> E - d...@solarwork.com  - Web - solarwork.com
> O - 970.626.5253  C - 208.721.7003
> "Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988" 
> P Please consider the environment before printing this email.
>  
>  
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Re: [RE-wrenches] HuP Conundrum

[Luke Christy]

Thanks Guys, for the feedback. 

I reduced the system to one string when I was on site, and it is maintaining, 
though the remaining "good" batteries had a lot of variance in the SG between 
cells.

I don't think the cells in these particular batteries are removable (at least 
not by me), as the interconnections are welded and it does not look like it 
would be easy to pull them out of the case anyway. As Jay pointed out, even if 
that were possible, replacing the cells with new ones seems like throwing away 
money.

The charge parameters were set kind of low ~58V Bulk and 61V EQ.

 I know the homeowner has not been using SG to equalize, as he doesn't even 
have a way to check the SG period.

Tommy Penson was kind enough to contact me off-list, and his recommendation was 
to increase the charge parameters and spend some time trying to bring the bad 
cells back up with careful charging and longer EQ cycles.  Seems like that is 
worth doing even if it's not successful, considering the expensive alternative.

-Luke





On Dec 16, 2015, at 1:44 PM, Dana  wrote:

> Try Tommy Penson at North West Energy Storage at 800.718.8816
> 
> 
> Dana Orzel 
> Great Solar Works, Inc -  NABCEP # 051112-136
> E - d...@solarwork.com  - Web - solarwork.com 
> O - 970.626.5253  C - 208.721.7003
> "Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988"  
>  Please consider the environment before printing this email.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On 
> Behalf Of Dave
> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 10:23 AM
> To: 'RE-wrenches'
> Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] HuP Conundrum
> 
> Luke,
> 
> Contac HUP for specific advice. You've probably already done that?
> 
> What comes to mind:
> Since you have two series strings, run the house on one string of all good 
> cells.
> 
> Pull out the weak cells and charge them as per HUP's advice.
> 
> I'm guessing that this problem has happened because the homeowner did not 
> properly charge the batteries.
> Homeowner most likely did not use a hydrometer upon EQ'ng the cells.
> Homeowner thought the cells were fully charged and equal but obviously they 
> were not.
> Record keeping, log books etc.. for people caring for expensive batteries are 
> well worth the effort.
> 
> David Palumbo
> Independent Power LLC
> 462 Solar Way Drive
> Hyde Park, VT 05655
> 802-371-8678 cell
> 802-888-4917 home
> 
> 

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery corrosion issue

[Luke Christy]

I would go with the puller idea. Grab a small gear puller at Napa or Autozone 
and use a large socket or something similar as a spacer on the back side so 
that the puller jaws don't dig into the soft lead.
The challenge may be finding a puller with a small enough bolt to push through 
the terminal hole.

I have also had luck driving out broken bolts with a pin punch. It can get a 
bit dicey though as you have to back up the terminal with something massive to 
absorb the force and keep it from bending and it really requires three hands to 
achieve.

-Luke

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03 
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 
 
Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

> On Jan 20, 2016, at 14:53, Kristopher Schmid  wrote:
> 
> Greetings,
> 
> Do any of you battery gurus have a suggestion for a method of removing a bolt 
> remnant that is corroded into a flag terminal.  Both sides snapped off flush 
> with the flag.  I was thinking try to drill it out or maybe a small gear 
> pulling tool?  I will never again use the non stainless hardware supplied by 
> the manufacturer...
> 
> Picture attached for reference.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> <_20160120_155125.JPG>
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Re: [RE-wrenches] fire extinguishers

[Luke Christy]

Dan,
What products are you using for electrolyte neutralizers?


-Luke


> On Jan 14, 2016, at 13:13, Dan Fink  wrote:
> 
> In my PV/battery training sessions for fire departments, we recommend CO2 
> extinguishers. Fire departments almost always have at least one; they don't 
> usually carry halon. I leave acid/alkaline electrolyte neutralizer with each 
> battery installation and then just recommend to the homeowner a fire 
> extinguisher and eye wash station.
> 
>> 
> 
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03 
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 
 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] SWRC50

[Luke Christy]

Jeremy,
 I might. Are you talking about the one that is basically an old-school 
parallel printer cable?
If so, contact me off list. I'm pretty sure I have a used one.
-Luke

On Jan 22, 2016, at 10:50 AM, Jeremy Rodriguez  wrote:

> 
> Hello wrenches,
> Does anyone have a new or used SW Series remote control cable ?
> 
> Jeremy Rodriguez 
> All Solar
> Penrose CO
> allso...@live.com
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NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Battery Box Construction

[Luke Christy]

Hi Shasta,
I have to second Ray and say that I'm impressed with the description of the 
battery boxes you've been making. I've always been dismayed by wooden battery 
boxes as well, but I have installed a lot of them, both because of the ease of 
getting materials and because they do seem to hold up fairly well over time. 

I'd like to make a move away from them though, and I'm intrigued by your take 
on construction. 
Are you using Stainless angle and u-channel for holding plastic panels 
together? How do you make the box rigid enough with only 1/4 thickness plastic 
sheets? I guess maybe the rigidity is coming from the angle and u-channels?  
What is the non-corrosive/conductive  coating that you are using for metal pans 
(made of mild steel, I assume). Just curious.

-Luke



Luke Christy 

NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25 (Luke Christy)
NABCEP Certified Solar Thermal Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03
 CoSEIA Certified PV Installer (Luke Christy)

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Monte Vista, CO.
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com

On Jan 29, 2016, at 10:08 AM, Shasta Daiku  wrote:

> I have always been dismayed with wooden battery boxes used in professionally 
> installed power systems. It seems vey DIYer/HomePoweresque. Where else is 
> wood used in electrical installations? I have on occasion built some BB 
> plywood core boxes, sheetmetal outer skin/ FRP inner skin/ raw edges and 
> corners banded with SS angle/ rubber gaskets with lots of latches.
> 
> I build boxes that are made of either plastic or metal depending on the 
> environment and usage they’ll see. Plastic, that is HDPE or acrylics, I order 
> online cut to size, or from a glass shop. 1/4” thickness. Metal, heavy gauge 
> sheetmetal, I have cut by fabricators, and then coated with 
> non-corrosive/conductive coatings by a cabinet shop.
> 
> Here are some general guidelines
> 
> -With either material, I keep the panels sized small. Less than 2’ x 2’ is 
> nice, both for shipping and handling. 
> 
> -Panels can be attached to each other using H and U channel, and angle stock 
> (which also gives rigidity). Lids are usually sectional rather than a heavy 
>  single lid. Sometimes, on plastic lids I rout rabbets on the connecting 
> seams so that the there is a half lap joint.
> 
> -Plastic can be drilled and tapped. I generally avoid using adhesives because 
> they are toxic as Hell and pieces want to slide out of alignment.
> 
> -When batteries sit on metal racks, I enclose the racks with acrylic sheets 
> using rare earth magnets. Magnets are attached to the acrylic with epoxy or 
> the 
>  magnet will have a counter sunk hole and machine screws can be used.
> 
> -I seldom build a box with a back wall. Instead, I apply a sheet of FRP 
> (fiberglass reinforced plastic) to the wall that the box sits against, smooth 
> side out.
>  Side panels butt against, and are attached to the wall using U channel or 
> angle stock. This accommodates a wall that may not be flat or a 
>  wall/floor intersection that isn’t square. Corners, That is sides to front 
> pieces are made with angle stock. They knock apart by using wing nuts or 
>  magnets. That way the front of the box can be removed for 
> placement/replacement.
> 
> -I stopped using hinges for lids along time ago, when I started making lids 
> that were sectional. Lately I run a length of U channel against the back 
> wall, the 
>  length of the box. The width of the channel is wider than the thickness of 
> the sheet, so that the sheet will slide in easily. The lid section is removed 
> rather 
>  hinged up. You know the saying “Don’t let the lid hit you in the head!"
>  
>  -Over the years I have tried a lot of coatings in my metal boxes. All have 
> held up well, but I have found that engine compartment type undercoatings to 
> be
>   my favorite.
> 
> -If I have a say in the power room/shed design, I will specify a concrete 
> slab with a shallow basin for the batteries to sit in. The basin has a floor 
> drain and is epoxy coated. Otherwise I have a sheetmetal tray fabricated and 
> have it coated. The tray is separate from the enclosure.
> 
> 
> -In very hard use applications I have the box made by a company that outfits 
> utility and work trucks with beds and boxes. These are just large custom
>  “truck boxes” 
> 
> -With smaller banks, I have successfully retrofitted both gang boxes and 
> truck/utility boxes. The simplest setup being adding some cross members to a  
>  $300.00 gang box so that the batteries sat elevated within. That makes a 
> very nice servicing height! Again interiors are coated.
> 
> Growing up, I had a lot of exposure to both industrial off-grid power systems 
> (mining, oil/gas, research, telecomm) and Mariti

Re: [RE-wrenches] Enphase M190 current limiting

[Luke Christy]

Hi Rebecca,
After you posted this I looked at the power production history for several of 
our Enphase sites with M190s, and the same thing is happening. Inverter output 
is being clipped at 140W across the board.
This seems like a pretty big deal in terms of potential lost production for a 
lot of users.

Have you brought this up with Enphase? 

-Luke 



NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03 
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 
 
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> On Jan 31, 2016, at 21:08, Rebecca Lundberg 
>  wrote:
> 
> I just noticed that several of our sites with Enphase M190s are current 
> limiting at 140 watts. These units used to clip at 199 watts so I feel like 
> our customers just lost a potential 30% of their power output. It appears to 
> be related to a firmware update 520-8-r01-v01.08.00. We've got one site 
> with just 8 units, 1 of them got this firmware update back in September and 
> has been limiting to 140w since then, 5 of them got this update in late 
> January and have been limiting to 140w since then, the other two are at a 
> previous firmware version and are performing as we would expect up to 199w. 
> Have any of you noticed this same thing? Do you know what this is about? It 
> doesn't feel very fair on the user end of things.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Rebecca Lundberg
> Powerfully Gree​n​
> Minnesota
> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Inverter/AC pump compatibility question

[Luke Christy]

Hi Allan,
 just to add to the testimony of others, I have several customers out there 
with 1990s era Trace DR inverters running SQ pumps and they seem to work fine. 

-Luke

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03 
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 
 
Solar Gain Services, LLC
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> On Apr 25, 2016, at 21:15, Allan Sindelar  wrote:
> 
> Wrenches,
> Has anyone powered a Grundfos SQ or SQE series soft-start AC submersible pump 
> from a modified square wave inverter?
> I need to run a 1/2 hp 115V AC sub on a 1990-era Heart EMS 2800-12. The 
> customer likes his equipment so I'm not encouraging an inverter upgrade.
> Thank you,
> Allan
> -- 
> Allan Sindelar
> al...@sindelarsolar.com
> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
> NABCEP Certified Technical Sales Professional
> New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
> Founder (Retired), Positive Energy, Inc.
> 505 780-2738 cell
> 
>  
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Generac EcoGen problem

[Luke Christy]

Hi Dave, 
I have quite a few of the 6kW EcoGens out in the field and I haven't seen this 
issue come up (thankfully).

I suspect the issue lies in the the scavenging  probe or plumbing for the pump 
system. The probe is supposed to set the fill level for the crankcase, but 
since it is basically just a tube projecting down to the oil level, I'd first 
take a hard look at the associated tubing and check valves. There could be a 
failed diaphragm or a stuck check valve that's stopping the scavenging action 
of the pump system. It could also be a chunk of goo or something in the 
scavenger probe.
You have oil going into the crankcase from the reservoir, but no oil being 
removed. 

As I understand it, the system is supposed to enable a longer service time 
between oil changes by effectively using the entire volume of oil in the 
reservoir and the crankcase. The oil is slowly pumped into the crankcase sump 
from the reservoir, and simultaneously pumped back out into the reservoir, 
while maintaining the correct fill level in the sump --as long as everything 
works properly. 

Have you checked out the plumbing diagram in the back of the installation 
manual just to confirm that the hoses are routed correctly? If the unit has 
operated ok for 1,000 hrs, that can't really be the issue unless a hose has 
cracked or has a vacuum leak at a fitting. 

I personally don't see an issue with draining the reservoir and sump and 
filling the crankcase back to the correct level so that you can run it on a 
temporary basis, but you will definitely want to get it fixed for the long 
term. 


-Luke

Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   


Solar Gain Services, LLC
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sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com

On Apr 29, 2016, at 9:59 AM, "Dave"  wrote:

> Wrenches,
>  
> I service an off grid home that has an EcoGen 6kW Model 58181 LP gen with a 
> Serial Number of 8301854. It has 1,175 hrs on it during 2-1/2 years of 
> service.
>  
> · It appears that the crankcase is filling with excessive amounts of 
> oil.
> · There was a Generac Service Bulletin in July of 2013 which predates 
> this generators Serial Number. This bulletin alerted the possibility of 
> excessive oil in the crankcase due to "incorrect routing of the pulse pump 
> hoses".
> · From the pictures on the service bulletin (and with the SN being 
> higher) it looks like the generator in question has properly routed hoses. 
> See photo attached if you are familiar with this problem.
> · There is an extra oil reservoir on these units. The engine takes 
> 1.7 quarts and the reservoir takes 4.2 Quarts.
> · I last changed the oil (and properly filled both engine and 
> reservoir) at 1,124 hours
> · Now at 1,175 hrs the generator runs very roughly and blows lots of 
> oily smelling blue/grey smoke. Most of the oil is gone from the reservoir so 
> it's pretty obvious that the oil has flooded into the crankcase.
> · If the Pulse Pump hoses are routed correctly and I'd say they are 
> since the SN is later than the recognized problem AND the fact this generator 
> ran great for over 1,100 hours then maybe is the pulse pump itself is bad?
> · I wanted to run this by this list before talking to Generac because 
> I know there are a number of wrenches whom have experience with the EcoGen.
> · Can I simply just drain the oil and only refill the 1.7 Qts in the 
> engine and run the unit?
>  
> Thanks for your time,
>  
> David Palumbo
> Independent Power LLC
> 462 Solar Way Drive
> Hyde Park, VT 05655
> 802-371-8678 cell
> 802-888-4917 home
>  
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Off-grid generator update?

[Luke Christy]

Hi Wrenches,
I have been following this thread with interest ever since Lena started it a 
few days ago.
I don't have a whole lot to add but I thought I would chime in. 

I struggle with the same issues I've heard from others on the list of needing  
good quality, smaller (8-15kW) generator options for off-grid. My 
interpretation of the consensus is that there is a lot of stuff available in 
the higher dollar, commercial category, but for smaller gensets the options 
still seem limited and somewhat unsatisfactory. I have been using Generac 
EcoGen units for the last 5 years, and they have been generally ok, though in 
my opinion the quality is not there. In addition, when I finally had a major 
failure on a unit that required warranty service, the process of getting help 
from Generac with that was a nightmare. If not for the generous help of several 
folks on this list, it would have been even worse. As Allan pointed out 
upthread, Generac is simply not set up to deal with the needs of Wrenches who 
support off-grid installations. This is especially true for remote locations. 

For those of you who have been using the 14RES from Kohler, do they reduce the 
warranty period for Off-Grid installations? 

-Luke

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   


Solar Gain Services, LLC
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Amphenol and MC4 crimper

[Luke Christy]

HI Carl,
I used that tool for a couple of years, and found it fine. I did eventually 
switch to a Rennsteig crimper for H4 connectors but only because I found a 
great deal on eBay. I wouldn’t have any qualms about using the Amphenol-branded 
tool. It definitely doesn’t have the quality of the Rennsteig tool but it 
crimped fine and seemed like it would have decent life for the money. 


-Luke


Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™ 


Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com <mailto:sgsrenewab...@gmail.com>
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com <http://www.sgsrenewables.com/>


> On Sep 21, 2016, at 1:57 PM, Carl Adams  wrote:
> 
> Hello Wrenches,
> 
> I wanted to ask you about Helios and MC4 crimpers.  I bought a set of 
> theAmpenol H4 crimp teeth and loactor for my Reinstag crimper some time back, 
> to handle the Amphenol H4 connectors They work well but require changing the 
> locator for femal and male crimps and they are expensive.  I see this tool is 
> out there.
> 
> It seems a less expensive solution and simpler than the Reinstag set.  Any 
> experience with this?  What are your thoughts.
> 
> With Regards
> Carl Adams, President
> SunRock Solar, LLC
> 513.290.9072  (cell)
> 513.766.6025  (office)
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Booster pump

[Luke Christy]

Hi Nathan,
I am of the opinion that the booster pump should be on the output side  
of the main circulator, since when the booster pump is disabled it  
will represent a resistance to flow and you want that restriction and  
any resulting pressure losses to be on the output side of the main  
pump rather than the suction side.

Just my .02.

Luke Christy



NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
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sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
www.sgsrenewables.com


Message: 3
Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2012 15:22:10 -0800
From: Nathan Stumpff 
To: "re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org"
   
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Booster pump
Message-ID:
   >

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Thermal wrenches,

When plumbing a booster pump in series for a solar drainback system,  
should the booster pump go ahead of or behind the main circulator?


Cheers,
-Nathan

--
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NABCEP Certified PV Installer #091209-175
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer #032412-14
nat...@arcticsun-llc.com<mailto:nat...@arcticsun-llc.com>
Office: 907/457-1297
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[RE-wrenches] Hyper Engineering Soft Start Device

[Luke Christy]

Hello Friends,
I'm wondering if anyone has experience with Hyper Engineering's soft  
start devices for motor starting on off-grid systems.
I have a customer with a mountain cabin who has a huge Franklin  
Electric 3hp 240v well pump and since he isn't there much and his  
other AC loads are minimal I want to minimize the inverter sizing if  
possible. Locked rotor current on this thing is 83A, which is tough to  
deal with.
These guys claim their product can reduce locked rotor starting  
current by up to 70%. Anyone tried the device? Thoughts?

Thanks for any wisdom you can offer.



Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
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[RE-wrenches] Looking for TM500 shunt board

[Luke Christy]

Hi Folks,
I have an old Xantrex TM500 energy meter that I'm repurposing for a personal PV 
project. The unit was originally set up with the TM48 48v adapter/shunt board 
(This thing has an RJ-11 connector for the comm cable to the TM500 and screws 
directly to the kelvin terminals on a 500A shunt). The 48V shunt board went 
bad, which is why I ended up with the TM500 unit, but that's ok because I need 
it to work with a 24V system now. The low-voltage shunt  board for 12 and 24V 
systems was smaller and simpler (as far as I can tell), but I haven't been able 
to find one anywhere.
Anyone out there have an old low-voltage shunt board that you want to sell? If 
so please contact me off-list. 
Thanks.

Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installer™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
Monte Vista, CO
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
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Re: [RE-wrenches] BZ Products Charge Controllers

[Luke Christy]

Nathan and Dan,

I have used the BZ Products controllers for several years with excellent 
results. They are my go-to solution for small 12 and 24V systems. I mostly use 
the MPPT500 and 500HV units because they come with a conduit-ready enclosure. 
The HV version works well with 2-60 cell modules in series. They are definitely 
a bare bones unit, and the enclosure could do with some better graphics so that 
it doesn't look so homemade, but they work well, and I like supporting a small 
US-based business. 
Drawbacks are the lack of an EQ function and non-adjustable charge setpoints. 
(And the homemade look)
So far I have only had one unit fail, which seemed to be due to a bad component 
as it basically failed immediately after hooking it up. BZ replaced it under 
warranty.
I'd recommend them. It's a great way to use 60 cell modules for small systems 
and you can't beat the price for a MPPT unit.

-Luke Christy



Hello wrenches,

Anyone have any experience with BZ Products charge controllers? Kind of thin 
website (http://bzproducts.net/) but it seems like a pretty slick way to be 
able to use the ubiquitous 60 cell panels in small systems, if the controllers 
are quality.

Any thoughts appreciated.

Thanks,
-Nathan

Nathan J. Stumpff
NABCEP Certified PV Installer #091209-175
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer #032412-14
Project Manager | Arctic Sun, LLC


Nathan;
I was just about to ask exactly the same question here on the Wrenches
list. The BZ controllers seem to fill an amperage niche vs price point that
we need here for small  MPPT 12v - suresine systems deployable by
helicopter, canoe etc. We don't need UL listing for these systems.
I'd love to hear reports on these controllers from other Wrenches before I
buy any of them and haul them out into the bush.

Dan Fink,
Executive Director;
Otherpower
Buckville Energy Consulting
Buckville Publications LLC
NABCEP / IREC accredited Continuing Education Providers
970.672.4342


Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
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www.sgsrenewables.com

   







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[RE-wrenches] PV-direct electric water heating

[Luke Christy]

Hi Wrenches,
Now that the cost of modules has come down so much, has anyone out there 
experimented with solar electric water heating? As in: direct connecting a 
short series string of PV modules to a tank -style electric water heater with 
an element of an appropriate voltage and wattage rating…?
 
A off-grid customer of mine who is also an electrical engineer has a situation 
that seems ideal for trying this idea out: he has a gas-fired tankless water 
heater and a water source that is very cold year-round. The idea is to take a 
30 or 40 gal electric tank heater, switch out one of the the 240V elements to 
something like a 96VDC, 1000W element (difficult to find, but available), and 
direct connect 3 or 4 60-cell modules in series (with a disconnect and 
high-limit control of course). The tank would then serve to preheat the cold 
feed to the tankless heater. We think we can get a decent daily temperature 
rise with this setup. Probably not enough to heat the tank to a normal DHW 
temperature, but certainly enough to offset a good deal of propane consumption, 
and all for what I predict will be considerably less cost than a small solar 
thermal system.

Has anyone tried this? I'd appreciate any insights or opinions.


Thanks
-Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044
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Re: [RE-wrenches] PV-direct electric water heating

[Luke Christy]

Hi Wrenches,
Thanks for your input. I agree that the PV water heating setup as I presented 
it has some obvious issues. However, as PV folks I think we all have a 
gut-level aversion to using PV energy for heating of any kind. As modules 
continue to get get cheaper I think some heating applications will emerge that 
make sense despite the collective instinct to gasp in horror. 


The Legionnaire's Disease point is an issue as the water in the tank will 
probably not be heated above 140 F very often with PV alone, (unless the 
homeowners are away for a few days). It seems like that could be dealt with by 
setting the tankless heater's delivery temp fairly high for disinfection 
purposes, say 140-145 F, then feeding the output to a thermostatic mixing valve 
to reduce it to a safer delivery temperature. There would be an efficiency 
penalty there, but it probably wouldn't be that significant. As Steven pointed 
out, tankless heaters do have a dead band where they won't add heat to 
preheated water, but in my experience with the right heater that band is only 
10-15º F wide (below the delivery set point). 

On the other hand some of the PV-direct issues are hard to avoid, such as the 
array operating out of the MPPT range a lot of the time and the need for a 
150VDC rated relay as David pointed out . If the idea turns into a project I 
may end up revisiting a diversion load arrangement with the existing 
battery-based system. Though I still think the PV-direct idea has potential.

Thanks again.


Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Oil Heating/ Solar Thermal

[Luke Christy]

Jeremy,
We did a Solar Thermal project several years ago to heat feedstock oil for a 
local biodiesel plant (profiled in the Apr/May 2012 issue of Home Power). The 
system has worked really well  We used a pressurized glycol system with a 
coiled tube heat exchanger in an atmospheric tank for heat transfer.  I would 
echo Mac's comments about using glycol in the collectors instead of oil. A 
water/glycol mix is a much better heat transfer fluid than oil, doesn't have 
unknown corrosion potential, and in addition you can use off-the shelf solar 
thermal components for the collector loop. We used standard harp-style 
collectors for the array, and were able to use fairly inexpensive mild steel 
for the fabricated atmospheric oil heating tank. A key design consideration for 
collector array sizing is that oils have much lower specific heat capacity than 
water. Thus it takes less energy to heat a specific volume of oil to a given 
temperature vs. heating the same volume of water. How much oil needs to be 
heated on a daily basis? Seems like it could be a lot if the application is for 
an asphalt plant.

-Luke Christy

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Certification #031409-25 
NABCEP Certified Solar Heating Installer™: Certification #ST032611-03   
CoSEIA Certified PV Installer 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
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> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2013 13:16:37 -0600
> From: "All Solar, Inc." 
> To: "'RE-wrenches'" 
> Subject: [RE-wrenches] Oil Heating / Solar Thermal
> Message-ID: <7B236FEB7531473E9F6E26805F771854@SrvcTagGV13VB1>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> 
> Thermal Wrenches,
> Has anyone ever heated an oil tank with thermal collectors?  
> Specifically, I wonder if the oil itself can be pumped through the collectors 
> ( drainback or otherwise ) 
> This is for an asphalt batch plant.
> 
> Thanks in advance!
> 
> 
> All Solar, Inc.
> Jeremy and Amy Rodriguez
> 1463 M St
> Penrose, CO 81240
> www.asolarelectric.com
> Phone 719-372-3808
> Fax 719-372-3804
> Email allso...@scswifi.net
> Email allso...@live.com


   







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Re: [RE-wrenches] Another pump quesiton

[Luke Christy]

Hi Howie,
I’ve had this same quandary when working with some specialty Pv-powered solar 
thermal projects. I really like the Laing pumps but they are very expensive and 
the D5 Solar version can be hard to get. 

Recently I’ve tried the Chinese-made Topsflo DC pumps and despite some initial 
skepticism, have been pleasantly surprised at how well they have worked. A 
major plus for retrofit/replacement is that the Topsflo TD5 uses a volute that 
is essentially a clone of the El-Sid pump body-albeit in stainless rather than 
bronze. I have to say that I haven’t actually tried a retrofit using the 
Topsflo motor with an El-Sid pump body and impeller, but I suspect that it will 
work. At the very least the pump body is a perfect replacement for pipework set 
up for El-SIDS. 
I have a Topsflo TD5 working in a PV-powered hot-tub heater setup that has been 
working daily for almost 4 years now with no issues, so the quality seems 
pretty decent.



Luke Christy
Renewable energy consultant

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044


> On Sep 14, 2020, at 21:49, Howie Michaelson  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi All,
> I need to replace 3-5 El Sid pumps I'm using in a low volume hydronic heating 
> system.  Other than laing pumps, are there any recommendations for 12, 24, or 
> 48 vDC pumps?  Having magnetic drives that mate with the impeller body of the 
> El Sids, would be a bonus.
> Thanks,
> Howie
> Howie Michaelson
> Sun Catcher
> NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer™
> 
> Solar Electric Systems Sales & Service
> 802-272-0004
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Ferrules crimps

[Luke Christy]

William, 
I have used various brands of both ferrules and crimp tools. Most of the 
ferrules I have used are German-made by the Weidmuller brand, these seem to be 
private labeled by Greenlee and others. Highly recommended. I’ve also had good 
luck with less expensive ferrules sold through various silly nonsense-brands on 
Amazon. 
I recently upgraded to a Rennsteig automatic crimping tool and it’s very smooth 
and nicely made. It adjusts automatically up to #6AWG, though one has to fiddle 
with the tension lever a little bit to keep from crimping too deeply on smaller 
ferrules.

Luke Christy
Renewable energy consultant

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com
719.588.3044


> On May 18, 2021, at 15:41, William Miller  wrote:
> 
> 
> Friends:
>  
> Do any of you have a preferred make, model and supplier of ferrule crimps and 
> crimp tool you would recommend?
>  
> Thanks in advance,
>  
> William Miller
>  
> Miller Solar
> 17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422
> 805-438-5600
> www.millersolar.com
> CA Lic. 773985
>  
>  
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Sol-Ark 12k w/ Generac Transfer Switch

[Luke Christy]

Rick, 
On most of their home standby models, Generac defeats the two wire start 
capability in programming and ships them set up to auto-start on a loss of 
utility power only. On most of these models with the Evolution or Nexus 
controller there is a way to re-program them for two-wire start capability. 
This involves entering a password on the generator controller and selecting the 
two-wire start option. One also has to install the start trigger wires into the 
controller plug, so Generac sells a kit with the wires and programming 
instructions for two-wire start. It’s hard to find but out there. 
Note that Generac standby generators are set up so that the generator 
controller senses the utility loss and a trigger signal is then sent to the 
transfer switch, whereas most other brands have the controls and utility loss 
sensing hardware in the transfer switch and the generator is triggered by a 
simple two-wire start signal from the transfer switch board. 

Luke Christy

Renewable energy consultant.

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com <mailto:sgsrenewab...@gmail.com>
719.588.3044


> On Jun 17, 2021, at 7:41 AM, r...@solshineenergy.com wrote:
> 
> Wrenches,
> 
> I’m looking to tie in a Generac Powerpact 7.5kW generator with transfer 
> switch to a Sol-Ark 12kW. The Sol-Ark has a two wire start (NO or NC) 
> capability, however, the Generac transfer switch operates on loss of 240V. Is 
> my only option to use a relay driven by the two wire start to drop 240V to 
> the transfer switch? 
> 
> Thank you,
>  
> rick brown
> SolShine Energy Alternatives, LLC
> Electrical & Solar Contracting Services
> www.SolShineEnergy.com <http://www.solshineenergy.com/>
> Check, Virginia 24072
> Office: 540.235.3095
> Mobile: 540.808.9502
> 
> VA Class A Contractor Lic# 2705147660
> VA Master Electrician Lic# 2710062762
> VA Alternative Energy Systems Installer  
> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional 110112-21
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Generator recommendation request

[Luke Christy]

Allan,
I would not hesitate to use either the Kohler 12RES or the 14RES. 
I have many of the 14RES units out in the field and to this date they have been 
the most consistently reliable generators out of the various brands I’ve used 
over the years (Generac, Cummins-Onan and others). Several customers with 14RES 
units  have over 2000 hrs, and one 14RES in a very particular situation that 
demand high runtime has just clocked 5,000 hours with no major repairs. For a 
genset powered by a 3600 rpm engine I find that amazing. Anyway, just my two 
cents. I don’t think you’ll go too far wrong with Kohler. 



Luke Christy

Renewable energy consultant.

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com <mailto:sgsrenewab...@gmail.com>
719.588.3044


> On Oct 15, 2021, at 4:37 PM, Sindelar Solar  wrote:
> 
> Wrenches,
> Generators have become a moving target, especially for off grid applications. 
> Most are set up for grid backup, and I'm assuming that many may simply be 
> unavailable, given that half of most everything else is on back-order with no 
> expected delivery date... I'm seldom asked to recommend a generator these 
> days, but I am today, so I'm requesting recommendations from other off 
> grid-savvy Wrenches, please.
> 
> I'm working with an older (2014?) existing dual Outback VFX3524 system which 
> will be upgraded to dual VFXR-3648s to work with a 16kW Blue Ion LiFP battery 
> bank; 4kW array with upgrade infrastructure in place to later add 2kW more if 
> needed. Once the upgrade is done I expect relatively little generator 
> runtime. The customer would prefer LP fuel and 2-wire start (for remote 
> control). Pretty much any well-regarded model in the 8-14 kW @240 VAC rating 
> range could work.
> 
> Thank you for your suggestions!
> Allan
> -- 
> Allan Sindelar
> al...@sindelarsolar.com <mailto:al...@sindelarsolar.com>
> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
> New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
> Founder (Retired), Positive Energy, Inc.
> 505 780-2738 cell
> 
>  
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Small diesel generator

[Luke Christy]

It’s certainly not for every situation, but I have had some experience with 
using [used] 6kw diesel light tower generators as backup power. These things 
are ubiquitous in the construction industry and are almost all powered by super 
durable Kubota or Mitsubishi 3cyl liquid-cooled diesels. They are definitely on 
the small end at 6kW, but even at 10,000 ft I have had no problem providing a 
full 4kW+ of battery charging power. One of my customers is an Iron Planet 
auction junkie and sourced one of these things for his PV system here in 
Colorado. It’s a summer-only solution, as the unit currently lives outdoors, 
but I was impressed with the performance. I have another one at a different  
site and it has proved to be reliable, quiet and easy to start. Downsides are 
obviously that they are most affordably sourced used from an auction house, the 
controls are pretty basic, and there is the whole issue of it coming mounted on 
a small trailer with lights. But some customers like that sort of thing, and 
it’s pretty straightforward to set up a generator controller for 2-wire start 
capability.


Luke Christy

Renewable energy consultant.

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com <mailto:sgsrenewab...@gmail.com>
719.588.3044


> On Oct 20, 2021, at 10:56 PM, frenergy  wrote:
> 
> We 're looking into pairing a smaller 6-8KW diesel generator back -up to an 
> off-grid Outback system to take advantage of the surplus of bio-diesel here. 
> We're aware of the need to keep it a warmish winter location Suggestions? 
> Experiences? No China knock-offs thank you.
> 
> Bill
> 
> Feather River Solar Electric
> Bill Battagin, Owner
> 4291 Nelson St.
> Taylorsville, CA 95983
> 530.284.7849
> CA Lic 874049
> Solar powered since 1982
> 
> 
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[RE-wrenches] Whisper 200 replacement options?

[Luke Christy]

Wrenches,

I’m looking for some advice on current small wind turbine options. I have a 
long time off-grid PV customer who also has a 20-year-old Whisper 200 turbine 
on a 75' tower. The turbine has been out of commission for some years due to 
failed bearings and now my customer wants to replace it. I’m struggling to find 
an appropriately sized replacement for him that isn’t some no-name piece of 
import junk— but I’m also not a wind expert and I haven’t kept up with the 
changes in the field over the last few years. Some web searching seems to 
reveal that several former big name manufacturers are now out of business and 
the options are few. 

Any advice on where to look and what might be good replacement options for this 
fellow?

Thanks in advance!

Luke Christy

Renewable energy consultant.

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com <mailto:sgsrenewab...@gmail.com>
719.588.3044


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Re: [RE-wrenches] LiFePo4 and FNDC

[Luke Christy]

Hi Jeremy,
I have a lot of LiFePo4 battery systems out there on the Outback platform and 
we ran into that issue also. The main issue with the Low SOC alarm is the 
blinking red light that tends to unsettle clients. The trigger for the Low SOC 
alert is adjustable though, and it’s pretty easy to change the setting so that 
the Low SOC trigger is [more] appropriate for the LiFePo4 battery. 

Look for" Flexnet Advanced Control" in the “MATE3S” Settings menu. You can 
change both the Low SOC trigger and the Critically Low SOC trigger values. Note 
that for some reason you cannot access these particular settings remotely 
through OpticsRE.

I really like having the FNDC data available through Optics RE so that I can 
check up on things remotely, and I’ve found that the energy tracking seems 
reasonably accurate given that it was designed for lead acid technologies. 

Feel free to reach out off list if I can be of more assistance. 

-Luke Christy

Renewable energy consultant.

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com <mailto:sgsrenewab...@gmail.com>
719.588.3044


> On Dec 15, 2021, at 7:06 AM, Jeremy Rodriguez  wrote:
> 
> Wrenches,
> Does anyone have some recommend settings for the OB Battery monitor when 
> using Lithiums   
> We installed a 600 hr pack at 48v  
> the MATE has been lately throwing a LOW SOC event.  
> I have reached out to the battery manufacturer, and used their recommended 
> settings but they suggest to basically ignore the issue since the battery 
> monitor was designed for lead acid batteries.  
> The site will have optics RE, so I don’t really want to just do away with the 
> FNDC.  
> I can’t imagine I’m the only one seeing this issue.  Please contact me off 
> list if you have some insight that needs a phone call. Happy holidays
> 
> Jeremy Rodriguez 
> Solar Installation / Design Expert 
> All Solar, Inc.
> 1453 M St
> Penrose Colorado 81240
> 
> Sent by Jeremy's iPhone. Sorry for typos and shorthand. 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Monitoring on Remote Sites

[Luke Christy]

Adam,
I would second Dave’s suggestion to use wireless bridges for this application 
-if hardwired internet access is available elsewhere on the property and if 
there is decent line of sight access between that point and where your 
equipment lives. 

I have used a lot of Ubiquiti Litebeam point-to-point links for this sort of 
thing and they are awesome. They have given me rock solid dependability once 
they are set up and configured, they function just like a virtual ethernet 
cable over the radio link, and you can even have a single access point transmit 
to multiple stations. Range for the entry-level Litebeam M5 unit is up to 10km 
and you can get a pre-configured pair of antenna dishes on Amazon for less than 
$200. Two devices can be had for around $100 if you are willing to configure 
them yourself with a laptop or the UISP app from Ubiquiti.   Worth checking 
out. Other versions are available with longer range and more features but I 
have found the Litebeam M5 is very affordable and works well for most 
shorter-range applications. 


Luke Christy

Renewable energy consultant.

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO. 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com <mailto:sgsrenewab...@gmail.com>
719.588.3044


> On Mar 14, 2022, at 11:48 AM, AE Solar  wrote:
> 
> Wrenchers,
> We have a project on a large property, where the install site has no internet 
> (there is internet much further away on the property, and on a different 
> service) and cell reception is pretty bad. We attempted to use SMA Cell Modem 
> Kits (sunny boy inverters), but couldn't get a good enough signal for them to 
> work. The client was fine with having just a production meter with no 
> internet based monitoring. Now there is the possibility of expanding the 
> system quite a bit (also with Sunny Boy's), and I'd prefer to figure out a 
> way to monitor everything from offsite. Has anyone had any success using a 
> third party antenna with the SMA Cell Modem Kits? Or have thoughts on other 
> methods for setting up monitoring where we could, at a minimum, see the 
> combined output of all the inverters? Thanks for any thoughts.
> Adam
> 
> Adam Katzman (he/him)
> Autonomous Energies | Owner/Operator
> www.AutonomousEnergies.com <http://www.autonomousenergies.com/>
> (518) 567-1468
> 
> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Monitoring on Remote Sites

[Luke Christy]

Dave-
As Dan pointed out, the Litebeam products are not wifi extenders. They must be 
used in pairs or other multi-device arrangements. Put simply, they allow you to 
transfer a hard ethernet connection wirelessly through  a 5ghz radio link. One 
nice thing about them is that they function exactly like an ethernet cable when 
it comes to connections, so you can simply plug in a device at the far end of 
the link to use as a 2.4gHz access point for your SMA inverters. Your 
Nanostation M2 would be idea to connect to the far end of the Litebeam link to 
provide a 2.4gHz wireless access point there. 
I have used all sorts of solutions for wireless access at the far end of my 
radio links. Standard household wireless routers reconfigured to not use DHCP 
work fine as a wireless access point in most cases. I have also used lots of 
Ubiquiti Unifi AP devices as access points and those are better because you can 
set them up with a laptop and they are much more reliable than a low-end 
residential wireless router. They are pricier though and a little fussy to set 
up. 


> On Mar 14, 2022, at 12:38 PM, Dave Tedeyan  wrote:
> 
> Luke, 
> I wanted to try out Ubiquiti products, and bought a NanoStation M2, but 
> haven't installed it yet. With the Lighbeam, can any device connect to it? If 
> so, I know at least the SMA SB wifi can only connect to 2Ghz, and not 5Ghz. 
> I'll have to see if there is a 2Ghz option. This is why I cannot use the 
> Engenius equipment anymore, since their 202 replacement is 5Ghz only.
> Cheers,
> Dave
> 
> On Mon, Mar 14, 2022 at 2:28 PM Luke Christy  <mailto:sgsrenewab...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> Adam,
> I would second Dave’s suggestion to use wireless bridges for this application 
> -if hardwired internet access is available elsewhere on the property and if 
> there is decent line of sight access between that point and where your 
> equipment lives. 
> 
> I have used a lot of Ubiquiti Litebeam point-to-point links for this sort of 
> thing and they are awesome. They have given me rock solid dependability once 
> they are set up and configured, they function just like a virtual ethernet 
> cable over the radio link, and you can even have a single access point 
> transmit to multiple stations. Range for the entry-level Litebeam M5 unit is 
> up to 10km and you can get a pre-configured pair of antenna dishes on Amazon 
> for less than $200. Two devices can be had for around $100 if you are willing 
> to configure them yourself with a laptop or the UISP app from Ubiquiti.   
> Worth checking out. Other versions are available with longer range and more 
> features but I have found the Litebeam M5 is very affordable and works well 
> for most shorter-range applications. 
> 
> 
> Luke Christy
> 
> Renewable energy consultant.
> 
> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 
> 
> Solar Gain Services, LLC
> PO Box 531
> Monte Vista, CO. 81144
> sgsrenewab...@gmail.com <mailto:sgsrenewab...@gmail.com>
> 719.588.3044
> 
> 
>> On Mar 14, 2022, at 11:48 AM, AE Solar > <mailto:autonomousenerg...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Wrenchers,
>> We have a project on a large property, where the install site has no 
>> internet (there is internet much further away on the property, and on a 
>> different service) and cell reception is pretty bad. We attempted to use SMA 
>> Cell Modem Kits (sunny boy inverters), but couldn't get a good enough signal 
>> for them to work. The client was fine with having just a production meter 
>> with no internet based monitoring. Now there is the possibility of expanding 
>> the system quite a bit (also with Sunny Boy's), and I'd prefer to figure out 
>> a way to monitor everything from offsite. Has anyone had any success using a 
>> third party antenna with the SMA Cell Modem Kits? Or have thoughts on other 
>> methods for setting up monitoring where we could, at a minimum, see the 
>> combined output of all the inverters? Thanks for any thoughts.
>> Adam
>> 
>> Adam Katzman (he/him)
>> Autonomous Energies | Owner/Operator
>> www.AutonomousEnergies.com <http://www.autonomousenergies.com/>
>> (518) 567-1468
>> 
>> 
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[RE-wrenches] Insurance for consulting.

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

Hi Wrenches,
Like many of you, I have been in PV industry a long time. I have focused on 
design-build operations in the off-grid realm. In recent years I have started 
shifting toward doing more consulting work, and having picked up a few high 
value clients, I am feeling the need to revisit my insurance and add 
professional liability insurance in addition to my GL policy. This has proved a 
little more difficult than expected, as my current underwriter does not offer a 
professional liability policy for our class of business and, and our local 
insurance agent is kind of out of their depth with respect to this anyway. I am 
a solo practitioner and don’t really represent a large account for my insurance 
company, so there’s little incentive for them to work hard to find me a good 
solution. 

I suspect that many Wrenches are or have been in a similar situation, so I’m 
wondering if anyone has advice/or comments on their experience with these 
issues.  If you’ve had positive experience with a particular underwriter or 
insurance company for solar consulting work, that would be information I’d love 
to hear. 

This is probably a reply-off-list topic.

Thanks in advance. 



Luke Christy

Renewable energy consultant.

NABCEP Certified Solar Professional™: 
Solar Gain Services, LLC
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com <mailto:sgsrenewab...@gmail.com>
719.588.3044


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Insurance for consulting.

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

Thanks Chris.
Appreciate the info. 


> On Jun 27, 2022, at 6:15 AM, Christopher Warfel via RE-wrenches 
>  wrote:
> 
> Try Brown and Brown. They are who we use.  Chris
> On 6/24/2022 11:48 AM, Luke Christy via RE-wrenches wrote:
>> Hi Wrenches,
>> Like many of you, I have been in PV industry a long time. I have focused on 
>> design-build operations in the off-grid realm. In recent years I have 
>> started shifting toward doing more consulting work, and having picked up a 
>> few high value clients, I am feeling the need to revisit my insurance and 
>> add professional liability insurance in addition to my GL policy. This has 
>> proved a little more difficult than expected, as my current underwriter does 
>> not offer a professional liability policy for our class of business and, and 
>> our local insurance agent is kind of out of their depth with respect to this 
>> anyway. I am a solo practitioner and don’t really represent a large account 
>> for my insurance company, so there’s little incentive for them to work hard 
>> to find me a good solution. 
>> 
>> I suspect that many Wrenches are or have been in a similar situation, so I’m 
>> wondering if anyone has advice/or comments on their experience with these 
>> issues.  If you’ve had positive experience with a particular underwriter or 
>> insurance company for solar consulting work, that would be information I’d 
>> love to hear. 
>> 
>> This is probably a reply-off-list topic.
>> 
>> Thanks in advance. 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Luke Christy
>> 
>> Renewable energy consultant.
>> 
>> NABCEP Certified Solar Professional™: 
>> Solar Gain Services, LLC
>> sgsrenewab...@gmail.com <mailto:sgsrenewab...@gmail.com>
>> 719.588.3044
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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> -- 
>  Christopher Warfel
>  ENTECH Engineering, Inc.
> PO Box 871, Block Island, RI 02807
> 401-466-8978
>  <http://entech-engineering.com/>
> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] WATER COOLED - 1800 RPM - 13KW GENERATORS INQUIRY

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

Hi Dana,
Following up on this, I would certainly be interested. 
We are a  small shop but I typically sell and install 5-8 generators per year. 
These are almost always Kohler 3600rpm 14kW units, so a 13 kW low speed unit 
would be welcome as an option. 

Thanks!


> On Jun 30, 2022, at 12:01 PM, Dana Orzel via RE-wrenches 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hey now all you off grid designer/installers,
>  
> I just had a conversation with generator manufacturer (name withheld for the 
> moment), about 8-13KW water cooled gensets with UL & LP gas powered. I 
> explained that there is a long time hole in the market since Onan & Kohler 
> dropped their gensets for prime power in this size range.
>  
> If they made the investment to produce & UL certify a 13KW - 1800 RPM - water 
> cooled – 2 wire start, prime power rated - 120/240vac genset, how many off 
> grid systems are being installed with oversized gensets?
>  
> If this was available how many units would each of you be interested in per 
> year? I am not asking for a commitment just a market survey for this sized 
> unit.
>  
> If there was 20-30 companies selling 4-5+ each per year this might be a 
> possibility.
>  
> Let me know either off list or on list (if this is OK ? Michael let us know) 
> & I hope there is a possibility here for more appropriately sized & available 
> gensets for our off grid client systems.
> I will be passing along this research to the OE manufacturer. If you do not 
> want your name passed along let me know for now.
>  
>  
>  
> Dana Orzel  Great Solar Works, Inc. 
> C - 208.721.7003   d...@solarwork.com 
> 
> Idaho Contractor - # 028765 Idaho PV # 028374
> NABCEP # 051112-136   www.greatsolarworks.com 
> 
> "Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988"  
>  
> P Please consider the environment before printing this email.
>  
>  
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Magnum Inverters

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

Hi Jeremy,
Check with Zonna Energy in PA. I use them for almost all of my off-grid 
equipment now and have been very happy with the service and pricing. They 
normally stock Magnum equipment but I have not checked on inverters in a while. 


Luke Christy
719-588-3044
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com


> On Jul 20, 2022, at 5:29 AM, Jeremy Rodriguez via RE-wrenches 
>  wrote:
> 
> Does anyone have a source these days for Magnum Energy Inverters? 
> Contact me off list if needed. 
> 
> 
> 
> Jeremy Rodriguez 
> Solar Installation / Design Expert 
> All Solar, Inc.
> 1453 M St
> Penrose Colorado 81240
> 
> Sent by Jeremy's iPhone. Sorry for typos and shorthand. 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Hawaii projects

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

I would recommend Doug Phillips of Solar Plus Kauai as well. I have  interfaced with him extensively as a client rep on a large ESS project in Kauai and he has been both extremely professional and an all around good person to work with.Luke ChristyRenewable energy consultantNABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Solar Gain Services, LLCPO Box 531Monte Vista, CO 81144sgsrenewab...@gmail.com719.588.3044On Nov 6, 2023, at 09:24, James Rudolph via RE-wrenches  wrote:Aloha Max,I operate out of Oahu as well. I do hear good things about this company on Kauai.Nathan Wood General Contractor, LLC1595 Haleukana St.Kapaa , Hawaii 96766808.821.9564https://www.nathanwoodgc.comGood luck with your projects and let us know if you happen to need any other help.Mahalo,James
B. Rudolph



Independent Energy  C-39784 ES #10816NABCEP Certified PV Installer since 2009  #091209-155C. 808.313.9701  On Fri, Nov 3, 2023 at 3:24 PM Max Balchowsky via RE-wrenches  wrote:Hi wrenches, i spoke with someone in Hawaii awhile back and i can’t find my notes or the email. I have a couple of projects on kauai coming up and need to speak with an installer over there.Thanks,Max BalchowskySEE Systems 760-403-6810
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___List sponsored by Redwood AlliancePay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.orgList Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.orgChange listserver email address & settings:http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.orgThere are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the other:https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.orgList rules & etiquette:http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htmCheck out or update participant bios:http://www.members.re-wrenches.org___
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Re: [RE-wrenches] discover lithium warranty issues.

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

I also have had a poor experience with Discover’s warranty. 
I installed 3x 7.4kWh AES batteries for an off-grid customer in 2020. I 
registered  the warranty for all three within a few weeks of installation. Fast 
forward to 2023, the original customer sold the property and the new owner 
asked me out to troubleshoot a storage issue. One battery had failed to due a 
faulty BMS. Discover refused to honor the warranty because the property had 
changed hands (they tie the warranty to the original registered owner), and the 
new owner was stuck buying a new battery. 

Discover did offer the replacement at a slightly discounted price but I thought 
it was lousy to find out that a 10-year warranty product suddenly has no 
warranty if the property is ever sold. It really turned me off, and I was left 
with the  feeling that I might have had better luck getting a warranty 
replacement if I had never registered the batteries at all. 


Luke Christy
Renewable energy consultant

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
sgsrenewables@gmail

> On Aug 15, 2024, at 9:49 AM, jay via RE-wrenches 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> I have an installer  buddy where i used to live who’s having to try and get a 
> discover lithium warrantied.  
> 
> Its 3 yrs old, 2 years installed.
> 
> The dealer is closed, and the customer doesn’t have the POP. 
> 
> Discover is being very difficult.  
> 
> The battery appears to have a dead cell block which makes trying to get info 
> out of the battery all but impossible as it won’t stay on long enough to 
> download the info. 
> 
> Does anyone have a contact who could help my  installer/friend  with this 
> issue?
> 
> thanks
> 
> Jay
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Re: [RE-wrenches] discover lithium warranty issues.

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

Dave- following up on this-

Point taken-  but I still reserve the right to be annoyed when a high-priced, 
properly-set-up, top tier product with a 10-year warranty fails in under three 
years and the case ends up in a warranty exception loophole with no joy. 
I’ll get over it though. 


Luke Christy
719-588-3044



> On Aug 15, 2024, at 12:08 PM, Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches 
>  wrote:
> 
> Being from Manufacturing I just disagree that warranty should pass on to a 
> different owner. (Unless in writing)
> Too much chance for failure with a new owner. 
> 
> We do want these folks to stay in business right?  Batteries are hard enough 
> in residential when doing everything correct.
> Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
> "we go where powerlines don't"
><http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/>https://offgridsolar1.com/  
> <http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/>
> e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net <mailto:offgridso...@sti.net>
> text 209 813 0060
> 
> 
> On 2024-08-15 10:57 am, Luke Christy via RE-wrenches wrote:
> 
>> I also have had a poor experience with Discover's warranty. 
>> I installed 3x 7.4kWh AES batteries for an off-grid customer in 2020. I 
>> registered  the warranty for all three within a few weeks of installation. 
>> Fast forward to 2023, the original customer sold the property and the new 
>> owner asked me out to troubleshoot a storage issue. One battery had failed 
>> to due a faulty BMS. Discover refused to honor the warranty because the 
>> property had changed hands (they tie the warranty to the original registered 
>> owner), and the new owner was stuck buying a new battery. 
>>  
>> Discover did offer the replacement at a slightly discounted price but I 
>> thought it was lousy to find out that a 10-year warranty product suddenly 
>> has no warranty if the property is ever sold. It really turned me off, and I 
>> was left with the  feeling that I might have had better luck getting a 
>> warranty replacement if I had never registered the batteries at all. 
>>  
>> 
>> Luke Christy
>> Renewable energy consultant
>> 
>> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 
>> 
>> Solar Gain Services, LLC
>> PO Box 531
>> Monte Vista, CO 81144
>> sgsrenewables@gmail
>> 
>>> On Aug 15, 2024, at 9:49 AM, jay via RE-wrenches 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi All,
>>> 
>>> I have an installer  buddy where i used to live who's having to try and get 
>>> a discover lithium warrantied.  
>>> 
>>> Its 3 yrs old, 2 years installed.
>>> 
>>> The dealer is closed, and the customer doesn't have the POP. 
>>> 
>>> Discover is being very difficult.  
>>> 
>>> The battery appears to have a dead cell block which makes trying to get 
>>> info out of the battery all but impossible as it won't stay on long enough 
>>> to download the info. 
>>> 
>>> Does anyone have a contact who could help my  installer/friend  with this 
>>> issue?
>>> 
>>> thanks
>>> 
>>> Jay
>>> ___
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Re: [RE-wrenches] discover lithium warranty issues.

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

We actually did download the log files for the two batteries that were 
functional. That data was sent in to Discover. The third battery that 
completely failed was totally unresponsive and could not be awakened to be able 
to extract the log files. The two that didn’t fail are still working and seem 
to be performing normally.


Luke Christy
719-588-3044



> On Aug 19, 2024, at 4:11 PM, Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches 
>  wrote:
> 
> Fair enough! Without knowing all the facts I would also say not that hard to 
> download the battery data to a thumb drive and ask why the battery failed? 
> Sometimes making the effort will help get a better price break. I have had 
> them be very fair with me on my clients dumb mistakes.
>  
> Have a good evening!
>  
> Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
> "we go where powerlines don't"
><http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/>https://offgridsolar1.com/  
> <http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/>
> e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net <mailto:offgridso...@sti.net>
> text 209 813 0060
> 
> 
> On 2024-08-19 2:47 pm, Luke Christy via RE-wrenches wrote:
> 
>> Dave- following up on this-
>>  
>> Point taken-  but I still reserve the right to be annoyed when a 
>> high-priced, properly-set-up, top tier product with a 10-year warranty fails 
>> in under three years and the case ends up in a warranty exception loophole 
>> with no joy. 
>> I'll get over it though. 
>>  
>>  
>> Luke Christy
>> 719-588-3044
>>  
>> 
>>> On Aug 15, 2024, at 12:08 PM, Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Being from Manufacturing I just disagree that warranty should pass on to a 
>>> different owner. (Unless in writing)
>>> Too much chance for failure with a new owner. 
>>> 
>>> We do want these folks to stay in business right?  Batteries are hard 
>>> enough in residential when doing everything correct.
>>> Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
>>> "we go where powerlines don't"
>>><http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/>https://offgridsolar1.com/  
>>> <http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/>
>>> e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net <mailto:offgridso...@sti.net>
>>> text 209 813 0060
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 2024-08-15 10:57 am, Luke Christy via RE-wrenches wrote:
>>> 
>>> I also have had a poor experience with Discover's warranty. 
>>> I installed 3x 7.4kWh AES batteries for an off-grid customer in 2020. I 
>>> registered  the warranty for all three within a few weeks of installation. 
>>> Fast forward to 2023, the original customer sold the property and the new 
>>> owner asked me out to troubleshoot a storage issue. One battery had failed 
>>> to due a faulty BMS. Discover refused to honor the warranty because the 
>>> property had changed hands (they tie the warranty to the original 
>>> registered owner), and the new owner was stuck buying a new battery. 
>>>  
>>> Discover did offer the replacement at a slightly discounted price but I 
>>> thought it was lousy to find out that a 10-year warranty product suddenly 
>>> has no warranty if the property is ever sold. It really turned me off, and 
>>> I was left with the  feeling that I might have had better luck getting a 
>>> warranty replacement if I had never registered the batteries at all. 
>>>  
>>> 
>>> Luke Christy
>>> Renewable energy consultant
>>> 
>>> NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 
>>> 
>>> Solar Gain Services, LLC
>>> PO Box 531
>>> Monte Vista, CO 81144
>>> sgsrenewables@gmail
>>> 
>>> On Aug 15, 2024, at 9:49 AM, jay via RE-wrenches 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi All,
>>> 
>>> I have an installer  buddy where i used to live who's having to try and get 
>>> a discover lithium warrantied.  
>>> 
>>> Its 3 yrs old, 2 years installed.
>>> 
>>> The dealer is closed, and the customer doesn't have the POP. 
>>> 
>>> Discover is being very difficult.  
>>> 
>>> The battery appears to have a dead cell block which makes trying to get 
>>> info out of the battery all but impossible as it won't stay on long enough 
>>> to download the info. 
>>> 
>>> Does anyone have a contact who could help my  installer/friend  with this 
>>> issue?
>>> 
>>> thanks
>>> 
>>> Jay
>>> __

Re: [RE-wrenches] Help on something strange

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

Hi Peter,
These DC gensets are typically set up for backup use in telecom applications. I 
have not worked with the Kohler DC line, but I have worked with Polar 
equipment. Polar makes a line of DC generators that are considerably more 
sophisticated and those units are typically connected directly to the DC 
battery bank, with the genset controller managing battery charging. Charge 
parameters-  absorb, float and start and stop voltages and timers all being 
user adjustable through a PC-based interface.. 

The Kohler 6VSG controller does not seem to be as sophisticated or have as much 
flexibility, but the intent is to have the genset direct- connected to the 
storage bank and have the genset controller manage battery charging with a 
programmable start voltage for autostart and a  %load current value or stop 
voltage to stop the generator. Changing these settings seems to require getting 
Kohler’s SiteTech software, which may be difficult if you’re not a Kohler 
Service dealer. 

I think if you were to comfortably use this generator for a modern RE system 
you would need to find a way to have a third party device monitor battery 
voltage (and hopefully also charge current) and manage gen start and stop 
commands through the 2-wire start interface. Perhaps a Midnite Classic 
controller using their gen start function? Maybe a legacy Magnum AGS device? 

Others on the forum  will probably have good suggestions.  


Luke Christy
Renewable energy consultant

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
719.588.3044
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com

> On Oct 9, 2024, at 3:18 PM, Peter Giroux via RE-wrenches 
>  wrote:
> 
> Afternoon wrenchers.
>  
>   Have something I have never seen. Visited a prospect last week who has a 
> larger system that was installed wrong. We are looking at fixing it. One of 
> the issues, the customer was told to buy and install a Kohler 6VSG 48 Volt DC 
> generator. The original installer ran the DC outputs into the AC inputs of 
> the inverters. Needless to say, application does not work. It was mentioned 
> to me that these DC Gensets need a “Buffer “ between the gen and the battery 
> bank.
>  
>   Have reached out to Kohler, no clue, Kohlers top resellers, no clue. Off 
> grid resellers in our industry, no clue.  Anybody here have a clue and the 
> proper way to run / use this generator to safely charge the large battery 
> bank.
>  
> Any and all help greatly appreciated.
>  
> Thx
> Peter Giroux
> American Solar & Alternative Energy Solutions inc
> Beautiful Norcross Ga
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Re: [RE-wrenches] I sent in my Wrench List dues, have you?

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

The quality of the information (and the general level of discourse) on this 
list is priceless, in my opinion.
I may not post myself very often, but I read new posts every day, and I 
appreciate this resource greatly. 

My dues are paid!

Luke Christy
Renewable energy consultant

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com

> On Sep 27, 2024, at 8:00 PM, Chris Sparadeo via RE-wrenches 
>  wrote:
> 
> I can’t count how many times you wrenchers have saved me. Pay honor and dues! 
> 
> On Fri, Sep 27, 2024 at 9:34 PM Jesse Dahl via RE-wrenches 
>  <mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote:
>> Paid. Great idea! Patreon for PV. 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 27, 2024, at 3:56 PM, Dana Orzel via RE-wrenches 
>>> >> <mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> If you’re not contributing knowledge &  $ you are stalking!. Participate & 
>>> Pony up All!
>>> 
>>>  
>>> 
>>> _
>>> 
>>> Dana OrzelGREAT SOLAR WORKS!  
>>> 
>>> C – 208.721.7003  E – d...@solarwork.com <mailto:d...@solarwork.com>
>>> W - www. greatsolarworks.com <http://greatsolarworks.com/> 
>>> www.solarwork.com <http://www.solarwork.com/>
>>> “Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988!”
>>> 
>>>  
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] PG&E NEM3.0

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

William,
I’d like to keep the discussion here also. I’m in Colorado so sort of thought 
that NEM3.0 was in already effect and being billed at the new rates. I 
understood it was going to represent a dramatic (negative) change for 
traditional grid-tied customers and your teaser confirms that. 

Luke Christy
Renewable energy consultant

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
719.588.3044
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com

> On Jan 13, 2025, at 6:59 PM, david quattro via RE-wrenches 
>  wrote:
> 
> Yes count me in
> 
> 
> 
> On Mon, Jan 13, 2025 at 5:32 PM MDElectricSolar via RE-wrenches 
>  <mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote:
>> I say yes please. This is a major change happening and I would like to be as 
>> informed as possible. I understood that the billing change had been delayed 
>> but it sounds like it is now in effect?
>> 
>> Michael D Nelson
>> MD Electric & Solar, Inc.
>> 707-684-0064 mobile
>> 707-884-1862 office
>> www.mdelectricsolar.com <http://www.mdelectricsolar.com/>
>> www.facebook.com/mdelectricandsolar 
>> <http://www.facebook.com/mdelectricandsolar>
>> 
>>> On Jan 13, 2025, at 5:05 PM, William Miller via RE-wrenches 
>>> >> <mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>>> Friends:
>>> 
>>>  
>>> I am evaluating my first few bills from PG&E now that I am on the new 
>>> billing program called NEM3.0.  I am finding out some disturbing 
>>> information.  Does anyone on this list desire to start a discussion on the 
>>> PG&E NEM3.0?  Does anyone think we should keep that discussion on this 
>>> list-serve?
>>> 
>>>  
>>> William Miller
>>> 
>>>  
>>> Miller Solar
>>> 
>>> 17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422
>>> 
>>> 805-438-5600
>>> 
>>> www.millersolar.com <http://www.millersolar.com/>
>>> CA Lic. 773985
>>> 
>>>  
>>>  
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Re: [RE-wrenches] PG&E NEM3.0

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

All- Apologies for the out-of-context message on this topic that came from me earlier today .Somehow I accidentally re-sent a message that went out to the Wrench list some time ago. -Luke Luke ChristyRenewable energy consultantNABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Solar Gain Services, LLCPO Box 531Monte Vista, CO 81144sgsrenewab...@gmail.com719.588.3044On Feb 6, 2025, at 12:30, Jay via RE-wrenches  wrote:Speaking of pG&EDoes anyone know if you install a zero sell inverter. Do you have to tell PG&E?I’ve got a friend out in California who asked me. ThxJayOn Feb 6, 2025, at 11:39 AM, Luke Christy via RE-wrenches  wrote:William,I’d like to keep the discussion here also. I’m in Colorado so sort of thought that NEM3.0 was in already effect and being billed at the new rates. I understood it was going to represent a dramatic (negative) change for traditional grid-tied customers and your teaser confirms that. 
Luke ChristyRenewable energy consultantNABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: Solar Gain Services, LLCPO Box 531Monte Vista, CO 81144719.588.3044sgsrenewab...@gmail.com

On Jan 13, 2025, at 6:59 PM, david quattro via RE-wrenches  wrote:Yes count me inOn Mon, Jan 13, 2025 at 5:32 PM MDElectricSolar via RE-wrenches <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:I say yes please. This is a major change happening and I would like to be as informed as possible. I understood that the billing change had been delayed but it sounds like it is now in effect?Michael D NelsonMD Electric & Solar, Inc.707-684-0064 mobile707-884-1862 officewww.mdelectricsolar.comwww.facebook.com/mdelectricandsolarOn Jan 13, 2025, at 5:05 PM, William Miller via RE-wrenches <re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:Friends: I am evaluating my first few bills from PG&E now that I am on the new billing program called NEM3.0.  I am finding out some disturbing information.  Does anyone on this list desire to start a discussion on the PG&E NEM3.0?  Does anyone think we should keep that discussion on this list-serve? William Miller Miller Solar17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422805-438-5600www.millersolar.comCA Lic. 773985  
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Re: [RE-wrenches] FM100 Stuck in Silent Mode.

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

This is a timely thread. Thanks to all for your input.

I also have a site with a problematic FM100. The system has 2x FM100s and every 
morning one of them has required a manual power cycle by the client to get it 
to start producing. I can get no data remotely through Optics that indicates 
what’s going on other than that the device just stays in silent mode after it 
shuts down at the end of the production day. I went down some rabbit holes 
related to installing a fixed resistor on the BTS sensor circuit to set the 
measured battery temp at 25º C vs leaving the sensor unconnected with the 
lithium battery bank. There were some threads on the NAWS forum that indicated 
ghost temp values from unconnected BTS sensors might a source of the problem. 
I’m not sure why I didn’t think of the AFCI card as possible cause also. 
Thankfully I have some spare new FM100s on hand. Looks like a trip out there to 
swap the device and pull some AFCI cards. 

I continue to be dismayed at the situation with Outback. I can’t really see 
them coming back to the market in an incarnation that we will recognize. - 
despite the various reports to the contrary. I hope I’m wrong. 
At least (for now) they are still supporting the Optics platform.

Luke Christy
Renewable energy consultant

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
719.588.3044
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com

> On Dec 10, 2024, at 8:50 PM, John Blittersdorf via RE-wrenches 
>  wrote:
> 
> HI Wrenches,
>I  have an off grid site on an Island on auto pilot for the winter with no 
> access.  The FM 100
> has remained in Silent mode even when the Array Voltage is around  150 Volts 
> and battery at 46V
> I did get a response from Outback Tech support but they couldn't figure out 
> what happened.
> I suspect that there is a ground or arc fault error which locks it up til 
> manually recycled.  The problem is that there is no indication found on 
> Optics that there is a ground fault. 
> We would be totally in the dark except the original small solar array with an 
> Apollo CC with
> about a kilowatt of solar has been dribbling in enough power to keep above 
> low battery cutoff
> for a few hours each day.  The system was up when I was on the tech support 
> call but has since quit for the day. Has anyone seen this before? 
> 
> John Blittersdorf
> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Better Internet Connected Charge Controller

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

Mark,
If you pair a Victron charge controller with a Victron Cerbo and your Starlink 
internet connection you will be able to use the Victron VRM monitoring platform 
which has iPhone and Android apps and will allow you remote settings changes as 
well as detailed monitoring. 

You can also connect a whole host of sensors (temperature, CTs, pulse meters, 
tank level sensors, etc) as well as other Victron devices like the Smart Shunt 
or BMV battery monitors to the Cerbo. You can monitor them all through the VRM 
app. My $.02 is that the Victron option is more flexible and will offer you 
much better remote monitoring options vs Morningstar. 


Luke Christy
Renewable energy consultant

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
719.588.3044
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com

> On Dec 17, 2024, at 7:19 PM, jay via RE-wrenches 
>  wrote:
> 
> i haven’t used the morningstar online equipment.
> 
> I do like the victron, its pretty easy to set up and versatile  
> Lots of size/voltage options. 
> 
> Jay
> 
>> On Dec 17, 2024, at 6:24 PM, Mark Frye via RE-wrenches 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Folks,
>>  
>> I am going to be charging some AGMS with PV for a remote equipment power 
>> supply.
>>  
>> I will have internet via Starlink and want to monitor the charge controller 
>> remotely for battery voltage etc.
>>  
>> I am trying to choose between Victron and Morningstar.
>>  
>> Is one better than the other in this application?
>>  
>> Mark Frye
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Midnite Inverter products, monitoring

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

Mac,

I have installed several Rosie and Hawkes Bay systems, all with Powerflo16 
batteries. The Powerflo16 batteries are great, and it’s easy to extract BMS 
data to other platforms such as Schneider and Victron. I wish they had some 
sort of standalone user interface other than a SOC bargraph, but that’s just 
because I like screens on my individual devices. 

The Hawkes Bay and Rosie products seem robust and well designed, but I’m 
underwhelmed by the user interface, which seems both somewhat confusing and 
also lacking in the abundance of features and incredibly detailed settings that 
we’ve come to expect from Midnite. 

All settings have to be changed from the MNGP2 interface, and there is only one 
battery setting page for all linked devices, which makes sense but takes some 
getting used to. Firmware updates are fairly easy through Bluetooth and a 
smartphone app, but you have to have wifi on site for it to work. 

Battery coms were easy, but you have to use a special cable that comes with the 
batteries and you have to plug it in the right way, and there are no 
instructions about any of these things, other than some labels on the cables. 
Once it was properly connected, the BMS data just appeared in the MNGP2 SOC 
field, but there is no information to reassure you that the BMS is actually 
controlling the charge and discharge settings of the inverter and charge 
controller. I had to call Midnite tech support multiple times to get 
confirmation on various things that seemed critical. With other brands of 
batteries you would likely need to make up special connection cables depending 
on whether the coms are CAN or RS485.

My biggest gripe, though, is the fact that there is not a native monitoring 
platform solution. Midnite stopped development on their own Combox device and 
you have to use the third party Solar Assistant platform with an Orange or 
Raspberry Pi device as the web gateway. It’s not overly hard to set up, but 
gathering all the various parts and paying for a Solar Assistant license is 
annoying and time consuming. Then all you get is read-only monitoring that is 
tailored for monitoring grid-tied AIO devices, so there are blank data fields 
here and there on the Solar Assistant Dashboard. There is no way to change 
settings remotely and the Solar Assistant dashboard feels very bare-bones. 

The lack of a full featured monitoring and control solution for these products 
in this era feels like a major fail. 

The other shortcoming of the Rosie system is that there is no provision for 
communications with the Classic line of charge controllers. If you don’t feel 
you need a 600V charge controller like the Hawkes Bay or Barcelona you can’t 
use a Classic and link it to the other devices. It has to run standalone, which 
means you can’t use BMS data to control charging, etc. Maybe not a big issue in 
the scheme of things, but annoying to not have compatible coms across a product 
line.

I have always been a Midnite Solar enthusiast, and I had high expectations for 
the Rosie/Hawkes Bay/Barcelona line, but I was a bit let down by the actual 
products. 

I have not used the AIO yet, but I understand that it has a completely 
different monitoring solution that actually works well. 


Luke Christy
Renewable energy consultant

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
719.588.3044
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com

> On Mar 27, 2025, at 7:21 AM, Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hello Wrenches,
> 
> I would appreciate opinions about the Midnite product line up, strengths and 
> weaknesses in regard to off-grid deployment.  
> 1.   Midnite AIO
> 2.   Midnite Rosie, Barcelona, Hawkes Bay system 
> 3.   How is the online monitoring/control platform for these systems?  Last I 
> checked it was in development, but its been a while.  Can you adjust system 
> parameters remotely?  Receive warning/error emails?
> 4.  Any issues with battery communications?
> 
> Generally, Im a big fan of Midnite, I really like how you can call them and 
> talk with someone smart.
> 
> Thanks in advance!
> 
> --
> 
> 
> 
> Mac Lewis
> 
> "Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates
> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Solar thermal covering

[Luke Christy via RE-wrenches]

Hi Jay,
I agree with Brad that Evacuated tubes are not a good (or even a reasonably 
possible) candidate for a drainback retrofit. If they are pass-through tubes, 
then they cannot fully drain as piping connections typically come through 
header connections at the tops of the tubes. If they are sealed heat-pipe 
tubes, then not only is the header unlikely to drain properly, but the tubes 
themselves will stagnate at a very high temperature without heat transfer fluid 
flow. 

I recommend a diversion heat- dump arrangement such as Todd suggests.Use 
paralleled runs of conventional hot water baseboard fin tube for the heat 
dissipator. This stuff is readily available at almost every plumbing supply 
house and it works well.  

Diversion can be activated by either an electric 3-way valve and a set point 
controller, or the passive wax-thermostat 3-way valve that you mention. I have 
used both methods extensively with good results. The wax thermostat will 
probably be significantly harder to find. Some years ago I ordered them through 
Low Energy Systems in Denver. Reach out to me off list and and I can supply 
some contact information. 

-Luke
 
Luke Christy
Renewable energy consultant

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional™: 

Solar Gain Services, LLC
PO Box 531
Monte Vista, CO 81144
719.588.3044
sgsrenewab...@gmail.com



> On Jun 17, 2025, at 3:46 PM, jay via RE-wrenches 
>  wrote:
> 
> In doing research today I found the following, not sure where I can buy them 
> at this point.
> 
> 1. solar dissipation tubes.  that will do about 12,000 btu or at least this 
> one does. 
> 
> 2. 3 way thermostatic valve which uses a type of wax that opens and closes it 
> at a specific temp and routes the heat through the dissipation tube vs the 
> heat exchanger down below.
> 

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