Re: [9fans] Running plan9 within Hyper-V

2014-03-12 Thread Patrick Kelly
>Hi, > >Was planning to have a stab at running / using plan9 and am struggling to find >compatible hardware (I want to use a laptop). Anyway, I have a win8.1 pro >laptop and though about using Hyper-V as the VM for running plan9. I was just >wondering if I was being an idiot >for even attempting

Re: [9fans] How to access CD drive?

2014-03-11 Thread Patrick Kelly
>From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of Steve Foster >Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 12:02 PM >To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs >Subject: Re: [9fans] How to access CD drive? > > >> Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2014 08:50:45 -0600 >> From: mirtchov...@gmail.com >> To

Re: [9fans] three sets of windows

2010-04-28 Thread Patrick Kelly
> > if you're feeling ambitions and want something more like your laptops > > track pad. > > Surely you jest? Something that repositions the cursor to an uninteresting > location in the middle of a document by simply hovering > one's thumb in the vicinity of the space bar? Or am I just parti

Re: [9fans] three sets of windows

2010-04-28 Thread Patrick Kelly
I use a Bamboo Fun http://www.wacom.com/bamboo/bamboo_fun.php on my Windows machine, and I love it. There are Linux drivers for the entire Bamboo line, so I'm assuming there's an available specification, if you're feeling ambitions and want something more like your laptops track pad. > > How

Re: [9fans] three sets of windows

2010-04-27 Thread Patrick Kelly
> > My netbook's trackpad is unacceptable for Plan 9 use, and since it > > doesn't have a PS/2 port I can't plug in one of my old Logitechs. > > I've been using http://www.thehumansolution.com/evoluent.html > recently, and I do love it. How the hell is a shape patentable?

Re: [9fans] [PlanX] Re: Mars Needs Women

2010-04-25 Thread Patrick Kelly
> > Then experiment! > > > > I _am_ experimenting! (c8= > > Silently on my own I'm engaged in the sort of ruggedly independent, lone > cowboy style research and development which defines > 9fans' > standard operating procedure. (in this instance, it involves reducing the > Blender 2.5 codebase

Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women

2010-04-25 Thread Patrick Kelly
> -Original Message- > From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of > Karljurgen Feuerherm > Sent: Sunday, April 25, 2010 6:33 PM > To: 'Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs' > Subject: Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women > > From the Oxford Encyclopedic Dictionary

Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women

2010-04-25 Thread Patrick Kelly
> -Original Message- > From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of > Corey > Sent: Sunday, April 25, 2010 2:14 AM > To: 9fans@9fans.net > Subject: Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women > > On Saturday 24 April 2010 21:20:35 Rahul Murmuria wrote: > > > I would like

Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women

2010-04-18 Thread Patrick Kelly
Then let's see it happen; I'm not sure what you're waiting for. > -Original Message- > From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of > Corey > Sent: Sunday, April 18, 2010 8:51 PM > To: 9fans@9fans.net > Subject: Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women > > On Sunday 18

Re: [9fans] Recommended emulators/VMs for P9 install

2010-04-18 Thread Patrick Kelly
Hyper-V is negative for 2008r2.

Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women (was Re: TeX: hurrah!)

2010-04-17 Thread Patrick Kelly
> -Original Message- > From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of > lu...@proxima.alt.za > Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2010 2:02 PM > To: 9fans@9fans.net > Subject: Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women (was Re: TeX: hurrah!) > > > You have repetitively ignored the h

Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women (was Re: TeX: hurrah!)

2010-04-17 Thread Patrick Kelly
> > > You can be right about the manpower issue. In no way could on man build a > > > bridge, but one man can build efficient software. > > > > Even here there is room for disagreement. Do you think a > > community-designed bridge would be preferable to one designed by a > > single architect? Th

Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women (was Re: TeX: hurrah!)

2010-04-17 Thread Patrick Kelly
> -Original Message- > From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of > lu...@proxima.alt.za > Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2010 12:10 PM > To: 9fans@9fans.net > Subject: Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women (was Re: TeX: hurrah!) > > > Yes there is, but the disagreement

Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women (was Re: TeX: hurrah!)

2010-04-17 Thread Patrick Kelly
> -Original Message- > From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of > lu...@proxima.alt.za > Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2010 10:26 AM > To: 9fans@9fans.net > Subject: Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women (was Re: TeX: hurrah!) > > > You can be right about the manpowe

Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women (was Re: TeX: hurrah!)

2010-04-17 Thread Patrick Kelly
> On the other hand: doesn't individual development suffers from at least two > problems? > > (1) lack of a common vision leading to potentially widely divergent and > incompatible solutions > (2) lack of sufficient energy (manpower etc.) behind any given project > development to make any real

Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women (was Re: TeX: hurrah!)

2010-04-17 Thread Patrick Kelly
> -Original Message- > From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of > Corey > Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2010 5:39 AM > To: 9fans@9fans.net > Subject: Re: [9fans] Mars Needs Women (was Re: TeX: hurrah!) > > > I appreciate your time and consideration in your

Re: [9fans] TeX: hurrah!

2010-04-16 Thread Patrick Kelly
>From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of >Karljurgen Feuerherm >Sent: Friday, April 16, 2010 2:15 PM >To: 'Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs' >Subject: Re: [9fans] TeX: hurrah! >Ok--so it's agreed that it's not OO that's the problem, it's the users, then, >

Re: [9fans] TeX: hurrah!

2010-04-16 Thread Patrick Kelly
sive. I'm beginning to get the impression people love to troll Plan 9, more than they love to better computing, more than they love to learn from what Plan 9 has done, more than they love to solve problems, the whole reason behind computer science. >K > >>>> "Patric

Re: [9fans] TeX: hurrah!

2010-04-16 Thread Patrick Kelly
Of > Jack Johnson > Sent: Friday, April 16, 2010 1:05 PM > To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs > Subject: Re: [9fans] TeX: hurrah! > > On Fri, Apr 16, 2010 at 8:47 AM, Patrick Kelly wrote: > > Object-Orientation reduces static provability. > > True (or true en

Re: [9fans] Recommended emulators/VMs for P9 install

2010-04-16 Thread Patrick Kelly
> > > > The only emulator you're spending time on is Qemu, the rest are > > virtualizers or simulators, and there is a significant difference. > > Emulators are much slower, because of what they have to do. > > Qemu is capable of full emulation, but when host & guest architecture match > (or are

Re: [9fans] TeX: hurrah!

2010-04-16 Thread Patrick Kelly
>From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of >Karljurgen Feuerherm >Sent: Friday, April 16, 2010 12:20 PM >To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs >Subject: Re: [9fans] TeX: hurrah! >1. "IFAIK"? Can't find that anywhere... >2. Is C++ a problem? Not supported by

Re: [9fans] Recommended emulators/VMs for P9 install

2010-04-16 Thread Patrick Kelly
> -Original Message- > From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of > Joel C. Salomon > Sent: Friday, April 16, 2010 10:51 AM > To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs > Subject: Re: [9fans] Recommended emulators/VMs for P9 install > > On Thu, Apr 15, 2010

Re: [9fans] Recommended emulators/VMs for P9 install

2010-04-16 Thread Patrick Kelly
>From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of >Rodolfo (kix) >Sent: Friday, April 16, 2010 2:20 AM >To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs >Subject: Re: [9fans] Recommended emulators/VMs for P9 install > >I am agreed with Federico, >vmware. Do not spend time with o

Re: [9fans] 9vx patch to read environment var PLAN9

2010-04-14 Thread Patrick Kelly
> I'm not so sure about /usr/lib or /usr/share. I'd tolerate both (I've stopped > caring about the unix filesystem hierarchy), but speaking as > a long-time Linux user they don't feel right, especially not /usr/share. > If you do put them in they probably won't draw any trouble as just hard-coded

Re: [9fans] P9P for Windows?

2010-04-07 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Wednesday 07 April 2010 17:05:42 Georg Lehner wrote: > Patrick Kelly wrote: > > On Tuesday 06 April 2010 17:07:51 Georg Lehner wrote: > >> ... > >> > >> I will be able to throw some time at work on creating either a posix > >> layer or > >>

Re: [9fans] P9P for Windows?

2010-04-07 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Tuesday 06 April 2010 17:07:51 Georg Lehner wrote: > Hello! > > has porting Plan9 from User Space to MS-Windows (and Windows CE) with > the help > of pthreads-win32 [1] already be considered? > > Would the drawing routines of drawterm for Windows complement for the > GUI-side of things? > > O

Re: [9fans] ken-cc, 64 bits machine, and 32 bits integers

2010-03-30 Thread Patrick Kelly
"long" is guaranteed to be at least 32 bits by C89. So this could do, but could be a little overkill: 1) If a compiler set on a 32 bits machine, "long" to be 64 bits? (I haven't looked at the sources, but I guess it is not the case for ken-cc suite). 2) On a 64 bits (since Charles Forsyth

Re: [9fans] Plan ? (was: native install)

2010-03-30 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Mar 30, 2010, at 14:23, Jack Johnson wrote: On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 6:17 PM, Patrick Kelly wrote: Read up on why Plan 9 was written. We've been succeeding for 20 years so far. I think this is an interesting comment in light of the evolution thread. Most people (incorrectly) e

Re: [9fans] Plan ? (was: native install)

2010-03-30 Thread Patrick Kelly
On one side, you have code (result) and consistency; on the other side, you have _inhumanity_ since you have increasing of the entropy that is disorder: order is unnatural, and is the mark of human activity. "Open source" seems very natural in this sense: the bazaar... Until you factor in one

Re: [9fans] Plan ? (was: native install)

2010-03-30 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Mar 30, 2010, at 6:33 AM, Gabriel Diaz Lopez de la Llave wrote: hello This way (dot-it-your-self-way) we will "only" have one-man projects. . . Do it yourself refers to the community doing anything they need. Most things are so trivial that one or two people can do it. That doesn't

Re: [9fans] Plan ? (was: native install)

2010-03-29 Thread Patrick Kelly
"Where's the beef?" is certainly a fair and reasonable thing to ask. I got hungry and ate it. What I'm wondering, however, is "_what's_ the beef?" Beef comes from the cow. As you said, these arguments have indeed been going on for some time - so, why only talk and no action? It's weird

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-29 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Mar 29, 2010, at 3:29 PM, Georg Lehner wrote: Patrick Kelly wrote: [..] In my opinion, package managers are only a solution for systems that are already a mess. I've said it before, I downright hate Windows, but it gets by just fine without a package manager; Just install and unin

Re: [9fans] native install

2010-03-29 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Mar 29, 2010, at 4:16 PM, erik quanstrom wrote: I would also be happy to hear about how non-coding activities are typically handled by using a Plan9 system. what non-coding activities? ☺ Surely you have played mahjongg at least once! - erik

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-29 Thread Patrick Kelly
>-Original Message- >From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of >Connor Lane Smith >Sent: Monday, March 29, 2010 8:42 >To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs >Subject: Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons > >Hey, > >On 29 M

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-29 Thread Patrick Kelly
>On my part I guess I'm assuming complexity will come, whether we like >it or not. I don't find it easy to believe that we can avoid >complexity forever, and I get the feeling some relatively rapid growth >is coming. Yes, but should that complexity be needless? I understand that as features

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-29 Thread Patrick Kelly
>since we are trying so hard to create new problems for Plan 9, should >i assume the old ones have all been solved? Sadly I think this is just people adding complexity because, 'that’s how Linux does it', and must be correct. Either that or they desire complexity for familiarity; an even more ch

Re: [9fans] quote o' the day

2010-03-25 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Thu, 25 Mar 2010 18:58:30 -0300, Tim Newsham wrote: As a example for our students we use http://git.savannah.gnu.org/gitweb/?p=coreutils.git;a=blob;f=src/cat.c;hb=HEAD versus http://plan9.bell-labs.com/sources/plan9/sys/src/cmd/cat.c In fact, we have both printed on paper hanging from th

Re: [9fans] quote o' the day

2010-03-25 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Thu, 25 Mar 2010 18:17:30 -0300, Francisco J Ballesteros wrote: As a example for our students we use http://git.savannah.gnu.org/gitweb/?p=coreutils.git;a=blob;f=src/cat.c;hb=HEAD I'm going to have nightmares tonight... versus http://plan9.bell-labs.com/sources/plan9/sys/src/cmd/cat.

Re: [9fans] quote o' the day

2010-03-25 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Thu, 25 Mar 2010 14:31:20 -0300, wrote: It's this kind of intellectual ugliness that makes the teacher in me hang my head in shame. How could we be managing to produce a whole generation of programmers who actually buy into that stuff? And it's not as if it's a fad that's getting better.

Re: [9fans] more little hardware

2010-03-18 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Thu, 2010-03-18 at 08:46 -0400, erik quanstrom wrote: > > > > my big question is "How do I get my employer to need plan9?" > > > > by careful choise of employer? ☺ Or become the employer Seriously though, ask around, see if theres a use for any old machines at your workplace. Too old to be

Re: [9fans] more little hardware

2010-03-16 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Tue, 2010-03-16 at 15:38 -0800, ron minnich wrote: > On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 1:02 PM, Patrick Kelly wrote: > > > Any thought as to using the OpenMoko as a phone platform? > > vapor. That thing was pure vapor from start to end. Figures sickening how many potentially n

Re: [9fans] more little hardware

2010-03-16 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Tue, 2010-03-16 at 11:44 -0500, John Floren wrote: > On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 9:54 AM, wrote: > >> http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/15/qi-hardwares-tiny-hackable-ben-nanonote-now-shipping/ > > > > Okay, Maht. You just cost me $125 :) I just couldn't resist. > > Of course, it remains to be see

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

2010-03-09 Thread Patrick Kelly
POSIX is a standard in which hardly anyone actually adheres too. AIX POSIX is not Solaris POSIX is not Linux POSIX etc. What good is a standard that isn't truthfully standardised. Alas I will say that POSIX does add quite a bit more cross platfom conformity than some other... things... but there a

Re: [9fans] (no subject)

2010-03-08 Thread Patrick Kelly
> -Original Message- > From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of > lu...@proxima.alt.za > Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2010 11:58 PM > To: 9fans@9fans.net > Subject: Re: [9fans] (no subject) > > >> Agreed wholeheartedly. Thing is, It's autoconf that needs c

Re: [9fans] gsoc2010 + plan9

2010-03-04 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Mar 4, 2010, at 4:13 PM, ron minnich wrote: The big thing I'd like to see as a GSOC project, and which I think is doable, is a first-class set of drivers for the beagle and/or IGEP. The beagle is cheap and would be a very nice terminal. It's close on some fronts. We really need video. USB

Re: [9fans] Check out my photos on Facebook

2010-03-03 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Mar 3, 2010, at 1:18 PM, lu...@proxima.alt.za wrote: I set up a Facebook profile where I can post my pictures, videos and events and I want to add you as a friend so you can see it. First, you need to join Facebook! Once you join, you can also create your own profile. Is it just me, or d

Re: [9fans] Vector graphics device

2010-02-19 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Feb 19, 2010, at 4:36 PM, Enrico Weigelt wrote: * James Tomaschke wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Enrico Weigelt wrote: I'm looking for some (9p-based ;-p) vector graphics device which allows one to define/manipulate the image as a graph (instead of having an raste

Re: [9fans] pineview atom

2010-02-18 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Feb 18, 2010, at 1:31 PM, ron minnich wrote: On Thu, Feb 18, 2010 at 10:26 AM, matt wrote: it supports 4gb of memory. of non-ECC memory, so nice terminal, bad server "the probability of having at least one bit error in 4 gigabyes of memory at sea level on planet Earth in 72 h

Re: [9fans] Binary format

2010-02-18 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Feb 17, 2010, at 1:21 PM, Enrico Weigelt wrote: * David Leimbach wrote: A lot of "plug in" functionality you'll find on other platforms that requires a shared library approach can be implemented via a file system service technique. Of course, and I would really like to see that approa

Re: [9fans] Binary format

2010-02-18 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Feb 17, 2010, at 10:04 AM, Enrico Weigelt wrote: * Steve Simon wrote: We recompile the relevant executables. The speed of kencc makes this much less painful than you might expect. It also happens very rarely on plan9 - I cannot remember the last time we had a "big" pull. Okay, but the

Re: [9fans] Plan 9 on Microsoft Virtual PC

2010-01-29 Thread Patrick Kelly
erything with the default settings, which made me wonder. I tried it out on a couple other machines, with varying success. Certain machines worked fine, others had issues. I'm not sure why it varies. Thanks a lot! Giacomo On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 4:46 PM, Patrick Kelly wrote:

Re: [9fans] Plan 9 on Microsoft Virtual PC

2010-01-29 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 29, 2010, at 6:44 AM, Giacomo Tesio wrote: Hello 9fans! I've tried to install Plan 9 on a 64 bit Windows 7 using Virtual PC, since I've read that a related bug was fixed and noone tried it. I just announced it worked like 2 weeks ago. Actually, after the fourth tentative (after cre

Re: [9fans] vms

2010-01-25 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 25, 2010, at 12:28 PM, Ethan Grammatikidis wrote: On 8 Jan 2010, at 7:12 am, Jeff Sickel wrote: there's not a single searchable site that provides a quick reference release that would give us inroads to all the /other/ operating systems available these days. Not sure if I un

Re: [9fans] Shall we fix the use of Up/Dn arrows?

2010-01-23 Thread Patrick Kelly
> -Original Message- > From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On > Behalf Of John Stalker > Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2010 5:22 AM > To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs > Subject: Re: [9fans] Shall we fix the use of Up/Dn arrows? > > > 2. We already have Pa

Re: [9fans] dataflow programming from shell interpreter

2010-01-20 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 20, 2010, at 4:13 PM, Eris Discordia wrote: Aren't DirectShow filter graphs and programs like GraphStudio/ GraphEdit one possible answer to the video processing question? Filter graphs can be generated by any program, GUI or CLI, and fed to DirectShow provided one learns the in

Re: [9fans] Are we ready for DNSSEC ?

2010-01-20 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 20, 2010, at 12:47 PM, Russ Cox wrote: starting over would seem (and probably is) best. http://www.jwz.org/doc/cadt.html Given the small amount of information I had... I havent even looked at the source yet...

Re: [9fans] Are we ready for DNSSEC ?

2010-01-20 Thread Patrick Kelly
That makes their use of the word extension wrong, but in that case starting over would seem (and probably is) best. i think it fits the definition of extension. the protocol is compatable with dnssec-unaware implementations. Since part of the base was modified, but it's still backwards co

Re: [9fans] Are we ready for DNSSEC ?

2010-01-20 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 20, 2010, at 10:33 AM, erik quanstrom wrote: one would likely need to start with a different structure than ndb/dns currently has to get dnssec. but i think that the most of the query logic could be reused. As I understand it; It is an extension, the base DNS stuff should not chan

Re: [9fans] Are we ready for DNSSEC ?

2010-01-20 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 20, 2010, at 8:42 AM, erik quanstrom wrote: On Wed Jan 20 08:27:58 EST 2010, maht-9f...@maht0x0r.net wrote: By the end of May, all the root servers should be running DNSSEC http://royal.pingdom.com/2010/01/19/the-internet-is-about-to-get-a-lot-safer/ Is Plan9 ready for such a mov

Re: [9fans] Independent study topic

2010-01-20 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 19, 2010, at 11:44 PM, Justin Jackson wrote: Hi everyone, I've been lurking for the past few months and I've really enjoyed reading the messages from this list. I'm looking for some ideas or advice---here's the story: I'm pursuing a Master's degree in computer science at a small sc

Re: [9fans] parallels

2010-01-19 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 15, 2010, at 4:51 PM, William Cowan wrote: erik quanstrom wrote: it's unfortunate that computer history isn't a bigger component of a computer science degree. in the case of vm, it's not even history; still alive and doing quite well as z/(vm|os) on slightly modified power arch har

Re: [9fans] parallels

2010-01-08 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 8, 2010, at 2:46 PM, erik quanstrom wrote: it's unfortunate that computer history isn't a bigger component of a computer science degree. History and Philosophy of Science was slow in becoming a legitimate academic pursuit of great practical value. It will probably not be quite as lo

Re: [9fans] Plan 9 on L4

2010-01-08 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 8, 2010, at 2:43 PM, Tim Newsham wrote: I might be having a hard time with the Japanese, but my impression is that the plan 9 processes are now also L4 userspace servers. This makes me think they're not running a paravirtualized Plan 9 on L4, but put L4 INTO Plan 9. The paper I

Re: [9fans] parallels

2010-01-08 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 8, 2010, at 2:18 PM, ron minnich wrote: On Fri, Jan 8, 2010 at 11:12 AM, wrote: I don't have enough experience with VirtualBox to make a sensible comparison. I had a horrible time with virtual box and Plan 9. Did not work at all well. I would avoid it. The thing that none of t

Re: [9fans] parallels

2010-01-08 Thread Patrick Kelly
As far as I know you would need an emulator not a virtualizer. On Jan 8, 2010, at 2:12 PM, ge...@plan9.bell-labs.com wrote: I don't have enough experience with VirtualBox to make a sensible comparison. The thing that none of the VM monitors seem to offer (though I'd love to be proven wrong) is

Re: [9fans] parallels

2010-01-08 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 8, 2010, at 2:00 PM, David Leimbach wrote: Do you think you'd recommend Parallels over VirtualBox? I've not tried plan 9 on VirtualBox as I usually opt to run it on real hardware where I can, and 9vx or drawterm to connect. It might just be me, but I cant get plan 9 to run well on

Re: [9fans] Plan 9 on L4

2010-01-08 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 8, 2010, at 12:59 PM, Tim Newsham wrote: Any reason why they prefer to rewrite large portions of code to use gcc rather than making use of different toolchains for the L4 kernel and the plan9 subsystems? It seems like the latter would be a lot less effort and result in a system that wa

Re: [9fans] 9p resource sharing [was: Scanners]

2010-01-08 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 8, 2010, at 11:08 AM, Jorden Mauro wrote: On Fri, Jan 8, 2010 at 9:44 AM, Patrick Kelly wrote: On Jan 5, 2010, at 6:52 AM, Enrico Weigelt wrote: * Jorden Mauro wrote: The coffee pot runs windows and there is a virus that causes Coffee Denial of Service on it. That, of

Re: [9fans] 9p resource sharing [was: Scanners]

2010-01-08 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 8, 2010, at 10:29 AM, hiro <23h...@googlemail.com> wrote: They are running apache on a toaster? My goodness. Way too powerfull of a toaster. Overkill ftw!

Re: [9fans] faces

2010-01-07 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 7, 2010, at 8:33 AM, matt wrote: You can't prove harmlessness in people, hence the joyful collective outcry of "all men are potential rapists". It's the halting problem of human interaction All women are potential rapists too, further complicating the problem. Brian! Your comput

Re: [9fans] 9p resource sharing [was: Scanners]

2010-01-07 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Jan 5, 2010, at 6:52 AM, Enrico Weigelt wrote: * Jorden Mauro wrote: The coffee pot runs windows and there is a virus that causes Coffee Denial of Service on it. That, of course, would be the very most worstcase that can ever happen ;-) I doubt anyone would be foolish enough to put

Re: [9fans] quote of the day

2009-12-25 Thread Patrick Kelly
>-Original Message- >From: 9fans-boun...@9fans.net [mailto:9fans-boun...@9fans.net] On Behalf Of erik quanstrom >Sent: Friday, December 25, 2009 4:43 AM >To: 9fans@9fans.net >Subject: [9fans] quote of the day >"Do not spend too much time trying to figure out why this math works. >The basis

Re: [9fans] What do you use plan 9 for?

2009-12-14 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Monday 14 December 2009 16:32:45 m g wrote: > On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 3:30 AM, Patrick Kelly wrote: > > On Monday 14 December 2009 09:49:31 chutsu wrote: > >> So.. been looking at plan 9, am confused what plan 9 is > > > > used for? I > >I use

Re: [9fans] What do you use plan 9 for?

2009-12-14 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Monday 14 December 2009 09:49:31 chutsu wrote: > So.. been looking at plan 9, am confused what plan 9 is used for? I I use Plan 9 as a web server, compute and compile server, and a file server for source code. It's far easier to manage than Unix or Windows, I've had BSD systems fail m

Re: [9fans] remote access to audio devices

2009-12-01 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Dec 1, 2009, at 17:28, Ethan Grammatikidis wrote: On 1 Dec 2009, at 8:44 pm, Steve Simon wrote: VNC can (has been) be a butt-saver' - but pales in comparison to remote desktop / remote X for relative responsiveness and seamlessness. My experience of serving a Windows desktop to

Re: [9fans] linux stats in last year from linuxcon

2009-09-27 Thread Patrick Kelly
, Patrick Kelly wrote: > > > On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 9:55 PM, David Arnold wrote: >> >> On 22/09/2009, at 4:47 PM, Jack Norton wrote: >> >>> In the end I don't care what the linux devs do, but they need to >>> come up with a game plan and either f

Re: [9fans] linux stats in last year from linuxcon

2009-09-24 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 9:55 PM, David Arnold wrote: > On 22/09/2009, at 4:47 PM, Jack Norton wrote: > > In the end I don't care what the linux devs do, but they need to come up >> with a game plan and either fork (server, desktop linux) or include it all >> and try and make everyone happy (the l

Re: [9fans] bluetooth

2009-09-22 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Sep 22, 2009, at 3:34 PM, Skip Tavakkolian wrote: anyone looked at this or given it any thought? I was going to check into it after I did some tests in the audio system. Although I probably won't finish my tests till early-mid october.

Re: [9fans] linux stats in last year from linuxcon

2009-09-22 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Sep 22, 2009, at 4:47 PM, Jack Norton wrote: Richard Uhtenwoldt wrote: J.R. Mauro writes: Another thing they won't consider is having separate versions for high-end servers and PCs. I don't understand why Torvalds thinks Linux has to be all things to all people. the Linux running on

Re: [9fans] linux stats in last year from linuxcon

2009-09-21 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Sep 21, 2009, at 10:33 PM, erik quanstrom wrote: "We're getting bloated and huge. Yes, it's a problem," said Torvalds." So may be Tanenbaum was right, after all, there's a reason we make things modular. rob, presotto, ken and phil did not agree with tanenbaum's ideas about modular kerne

Re: [9fans] linux stats in last year from linuxcon

2009-09-21 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Sep 21, 2009, at 9:12 PM, andrey mirtchovski wrote: it's on slashdot, it must be true: "During a roundtable discussion at LinuxCon in Portland, Oregon this afternoon, moderator and Novell distinguished engineer James Bottomley asked Tovalds whether Linux kernel features were being released

Re: [9fans] linux stats in last year from linuxcon

2009-09-21 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Sep 21, 2009, at 3:32 PM, David Leimbach wrote: On Mon, Sep 21, 2009 at 10:53 AM, Patrick Kelly wrote: On Sep 21, 2009, at 1:41 PM, Jack Norton wrote: ron minnich wrote: 2.7M lines last year 10K lines added a day. 5K lines deleted per day. I keep thinking this can't be sust

Re: [9fans] wireless stack code

2009-09-21 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Sep 21, 2009, at 3:23 PM, ron minnich wrote: On Mon, Sep 21, 2009 at 10:18 AM, Patrick Kelly wrote: I was under the impression Plan 9 had a few wireless drivers... am I wrong? nothing modern. That's the problem. I see, I guess that would make sense then. http://www.etherboo

Re: [9fans] linux stats in last year from linuxcon

2009-09-21 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Sep 21, 2009, at 1:41 PM, Jack Norton wrote: ron minnich wrote: 2.7M lines last year 10K lines added a day. 5K lines deleted per day. I keep thinking this can't be sustained. What happens next? At the same time, well, as pointed out, we all use it all the time. I'm sending this from gmail

Re: [9fans] linux stats in last year from linuxcon

2009-09-21 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Sep 21, 2009, at 1:04 PM, erik quanstrom wrote: At least by what i've seen, a good number of these submits have been fixing the same area, over and over again. How much of this is actually good development anyways (i.e. The "does this really belong here?" comments). [...] Yup, and it works

Re: [9fans] linux stats in last year from linuxcon

2009-09-21 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Sep 21, 2009, at 1:02 PM, tlaro...@polynum.com wrote: On Mon, Sep 21, 2009 at 09:22:56AM -0700, ron minnich wrote: 2.7M lines last year 10K lines added a day. 5K lines deleted per day. I keep thinking this can't be sustained. What happens next? Are there stats indicating where the lines

Re: [9fans] wireless stack code

2009-09-21 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Sep 21, 2009, at 1:11 PM, ron minnich wrote: There was a GSOC project to add 802.11 support. I mention this because the code might be simple enough to be useful as a template for Plan 9 wireless drivers. I was under the impression Plan 9 had a few wireless drivers... am I wrong? ron

Re: [9fans] linux stats in last year from linuxcon

2009-09-21 Thread Patrick Kelly
On Sep 21, 2009, at 12:22 PM, ron minnich wrote: 2.7M lines last year 10K lines added a day. 5K lines deleted per day. At least by what i've seen, a good number of these submits have been fixing the same area, over and over again. How much of this is actually good development anyways (i.e