PS I use Nuendo for sound design - but I understand your price concerns - reaper would cover all these bases - I am unfamiliar with the bus system in Logic. Amplitude panning is just your basic surround panner - in fact the balance on your stereo is a form of amplitude panning. If you want a really irregular speaker setup youll need max and know how to program it (theres possibly other software available - thats just what I use)
On 27 March 2018 at 13:22, Augustine Leudar <augustineleu...@gmail.com> wrote: > 16 speakers etc ? I would use Reaper if you dont want to spend lots of > cash - its also very flexible. I use max for this stuff as its totally > bespoke. Pure data is a free version but a steep learning curve and I dont > know waht the spatialisation tools are like. > > On 27 March 2018 at 13:17, søren Bendixen <soerenbendi...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Thanks >> And impressive work! >> Now I just need to now where to get vbap or another form of amplitude >> panning - plug-ins and a hint re. DAW (reaper I guess..) >> BR >> Søren Bendixen >> >> Sendt fra min iPad >> >> > Den 27. mar. 2018 kl. 11.32 skrev jack reynolds < >> jackreynolds...@gmail.com>: >> > >> > This is the first one i found, but it will give you an idea. >> > >> > J >> > >> > http://www2.spsc.tugraz.at/people/georgios/publications/pape >> rs/marentakis_2014c.pdf >> > >> > >> > On 27 March 2018 at 10:27, Augustine Leudar <augustineleu...@gmail.com> >> > wrote: >> > >> >> Sorry Im a bit busy so didnt read all. I did quite a similar project >> with >> >> two concentric rings of speakers one inside the other. My advice would >> be >> >> to not use ambisonics but Vbap or some form of amplitude panning - >> sweet >> >> spot is less of an issue. I do a lot of walk around installations and >> >> occasionally for museums, >> >> best, >> >> Gus >> >> >> >> On 27 March 2018 at 08:01, Jack Reynolds <jackreynolds...@gmail.com> >> >> wrote: >> >> >> >>> As far as I know, higher order ambisonics over loudspeakers has a >> quite >> >>> confined sweet spot. Higher order spherical harmonics produce an in >> phase >> >>> and out of phase signal in opposite speaker pairs. So if you pan a >> signal >> >>> towards a particular speaker, the opposite speaker will produce a >> lower >> >>> level antiphase signal, which will work when you are positioned >> >> equidistant >> >>> from both speakers, causing a certain amount of nulling of the air >> >> pressure >> >>> at that spot, but positive particle velocity, like a figure 8 mic >> >> pattern. >> >>> So as you move around the room, the sonic image will change because of >> >> the >> >>> opposite pairs of speakers. >> >>> It’s also very difficult to isolate a sound in a single speaker, >> unless >> >>> you are working at seventh order ambisonics, with a 64 channel signal. >> >>> So I am wondering why you are considering ambisonics over vbap? >> >>> >> >>> I use the Blue Ripple Sound third order ambisonic plug-ins in Reaper >> and >> >>> have also been experimenting with the IEM seventh order plugins which >> >> could >> >>> be worth experimenting with. Reaper and Nuendo are the only DAWs which >> >> will >> >>> give you 64 channel busses for 7th order, and IEM have just launched a >> >>> customisable speaker array decoding plugin. You can also try MATHIAS >> >>> Kronlachers 7th order ambiX suite for binaural decoding at the same >> time. >> >>> They also free, so you could experiment for nothing! >> >>> PTHD has just updated to 16 channel busses but logic can only do 8, so >> >>> first order only, which won’t give you much positional accuracy. >> >>> >> >>> Hope this helps! >> >>> >> >>> Cheers >> >>> >> >>> Jack >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> >> >>>> On 27 Mar 2018, at 00:17, Søren Bendixen <soerenbendi...@gmail.com> >> >>> wrote: >> >>>> >> >>>> Hello >> >>>> I need some advice! >> >>>> >> >>>> I’ve been doing music/sounddesign for museums for a while now (read: >> >>> https://www.asoundeffect.com/museum-sound-design/ < >> >>> https://www.asoundeffect.com/museum-sound-design/>). My next project >> >>> could be the one using ambisonics!… >> >>>> I have never really used ambisonics but have been reading a lot >> lately, >> >>> and demoing plug ins - up til now only in headphones converting stuff >> to >> >>> binaural. >> >>>> And in the next few days I´ll test some ambisonics over my speakers. >> I >> >>> did that a while back and it sounded very cool. >> >>>> I have a studio with 8 ch out, 8 speakers (and a sub) - but hope I >> can >> >>> get my hands on 8 more channels and 8 more speakers. >> >>>> >> >>>> I have logic Pro x, ableton live 9 (upgrading soon..) and Reaper. I >> do >> >>> most of my work in Logic Pro X, and would like to stay in Logic - the >> >>> exhibition opens in less than three months…so digging deep into >> another >> >> DAW >> >>> is difficult. >> >>>> >> >>>> I’m a composer and I compose music and sounddesign.I tend to use >> >>> standard technical configurations in odd ways (parallel stereo, some >> >>> sourround configs), Mostly it is ways of composing and arranging every >> >>> sound as a part of a symphony. It do that in different ways - and I >> >> started >> >>> out working this way because I was asked to do 3 >> compositions/sounddesign >> >>> playing in the same room - (please read the article from >> asoundeffect). >> >>>> >> >>>> Exhibition rooms are also often odd designs - and so is speaker >> >>> placement. >> >>>> But this time I have the possibility to work in 3 circles and this is >> >>> what want to do: >> >>>> >> >>>> - Inner circle: Speak in headphones + two sounddesigns: one related >> to >> >>> the speak, the other layers from the sounddesign from the two other >> >>> circles. I want this sounddesign to be 3D/Binaural. >> >>>> >> >>>> - Middle circle: 8 speakers hanging from a rig about 4 - 5 meters up >> >>> pointing down into the circle.(45 degrees i guess..). This sounddesign >> >> will >> >>> consist of music, local sound related to object/themes in this part of >> >> the >> >>> exhibition. This should be in ambisonics. some of this sounddesign >> will >> >>> appear in headphones as binaural sounds. I can be two different >> >> audiofiles >> >>> (managed by Qlab). >> >>>> >> >>>> - Outer circle: 8 speakers placed on the walls - the room is square >> but >> >>> we will try to create an illusion that it is circular by projecting >> >> movies >> >>> on the walls. Here I want another sounddesign consisting of mainly >> season >> >>> related sound (spring, summer, winter - storm, rain, wind, and just >> the >> >>> sound of a cold cold morning..). >> >>>> his sounddesign should be ambisonics too. >> >>>> If possible I would like sounds from ex. horses (or people walking or >> >>> wind blowing) wander from the outer circle into the middle circle and >> >> into >> >>> headphones. and back. >> >>>> >> >>>> The sounddesign/music from the middle circle and the outer circle >> will >> >>> blend (and should blend) and when you put on headphones you will hear >> >>> layers of the middle and outer circle designs - so you never leave >> what I >> >>> call the overall sounddesign. >> >>>> >> >>>> So how do I do that..? >> >>>> >> >>>> First I need to know: Is it true that Ambisonics does not “aim for” a >> >>> sweet spot - Paul Virostek says it does (https://www. >> >>> creativefieldrecording.com/2017/03/01/explorers-of- >> >>> ambisonics-introduction/#more-16883 <https://www. >> >>> creativefieldrecording.com/2017/03/01/explorers-of- >> >>> ambisonics-introduction/#more-16883>) a lot says it doesn’t..? >> >>>> It is very importing to find out about, because an exhibition crowd >> >>> walks around so a narrow sweet spot is no go. >> >>>> And my main reason for using ambisonics is that is believe it is the >> >>> best format to create space/soundroom where you are ex. in the middle >> of >> >> a >> >>> storm. or you walk around inside a composition/orchestra.I also like >> the >> >>> idea that ambisonics is not depending on a fixed speaker >> >>> configuration..right? >> >>>> >> >>>> So I want to create big spaces BUT the same sounddesign needs both >> >>> overall sound and local sound (sounds that stays in a specific >> position)- >> >>> and wandering sounds - it seems to be possible too to blend an >> overall >> >>> ambisonic full circle of sound with local placed sounds in the same >> >> design…? >> >>>> >> >>>> And what software do I need? >> >>>> I guess I need software that can deal with ambisonics files and make >> >>> ambisonics files out of mono, stereo, surround files >> >>>> and software that can convert ambisonics sound into binaural sound >> for >> >>> headphones. >> >>>> >> >>>> I´m testing >> >>>> Noisemakers ambihead, and Ambipan (good stuff and working in logic >> too) >> >>>> DearVR music (and tomorrow testing DearVR pro for ambisonics output) >> - >> >>> (sounds great and the panner is very good) >> >>>> And Logics own binarual output. (seems ok for binaural but misses >> some >> >>> automation) >> >>>> Wigware (seems ok but cannot work in logic) >> >>>> >> >>>> I’m about to test >> >>>> Waves ambisonics B360 + NX >> >>>> Rondo360 >> >>>> >> >>>> Everthing will run in sync controlled by Qlab - I guess Qlab can >> handle >> >>> ambisonics, right? >> >>>> I found this about Qlab and ambisonics but it involves Reaper >> >>> https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=161556 < >> >>> https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=161556> >> >>>> >> >>>> I’m used to do the different layers of sound design in different >> >>> sessions and combining them afterwards but this time I will try and >> make >> >>> all three in the same session…in logic. >> >>>> >> >>>> I also have sound particles but it is stand alone and I might use for >> >>> some odd stuff. >> >>>> >> >>>> So - what do you recommend? >> >>>> And what do see as problems/issues? >> >>>> >> >>>> I’m sorry for taking your (holliday) time but I need someone to says: >> >>> Buy or get this software and do this - and you´re good :-) >> >>>> And I know I’m addressing my questions to a forum of people how does >> >> far >> >>> more weird stuff than this :-) >> >>>> >> >>>> I hope I’ve made myself clear. If not: tell me. >> >>>> >> >>>> Med venlig hilsen/Best regards >> >>>> >> >>>> Søren Bendixen >> >>>> Composer/Sound Designer/Producer >> >>>> >> >>>> Winner of Monitor Industry Award 2016 for the exhibition “Gladiator”, >> >> At >> >>> Moesgaard Museum >> >>>> >> >>>> New album Music for exhibitions out 15 January 2017 >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> Company: Søren Bendixen & Anette Krag >> >>>> soerenbendi...@gmail.com >> >>>> +45 60624394 >> >>>> www.soerenbendixen.com >> >>>> Facebook >> >>>> Soundcloud >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> -------------- next part -------------- >> >>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> >>>> URL: <https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/ >> >>> attachments/20180327/e3c21b73/attachment.html> >> >>>> -------------- next part -------------- >> >>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> >>>> Name: Musicforexhibitions_2x32cm.jpg >> >>>> Type: image/jpeg >> >>>> Size: 61248 bytes >> >>>> Desc: not available >> >>>> URL: <https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/ >> >>> attachments/20180327/e3c21b73/attachment.jpg> >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>> Sursound mailing list >> >>>> Sursound@music.vt.edu >> >>>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe >> >> here, >> >>> edit account or options, view archives and so on. >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> Sursound mailing list >> >>> Sursound@music.vt.edu >> >>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe >> here, >> >>> edit account or options, view archives and so on. >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Dr. Augustine Leudar >> >> Artistic Director Magik Door LTD >> >> Company Number : NI635217 >> >> Registered 63 Ballycoan rd, >> >> Belfast BT88LL >> >> www.magikdoor.net >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> >> URL: <https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/ >> >> attachments/20180327/8d98ceee/attachment.html> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Sursound mailing list >> >> Sursound@music.vt.edu >> >> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe >> here, >> >> edit account or options, view archives and so on. >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > >> > 07889727365 >> > >> > 02036861372 >> > >> > 3 Swimmers Lane >> > Haggerston >> > London >> > E2 8FR >> > >> > >> > www.facebook.com/reynoldsmicrophones >> > >> > www.sohovr.co.uk >> > -------------- next part -------------- >> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> > URL: <https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/attachme >> nts/20180327/6dd24adf/attachment.html> >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Sursound mailing list >> > Sursound@music.vt.edu >> > https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe >> here, edit account or options, view archives and so on. >> _______________________________________________ >> Sursound mailing list >> Sursound@music.vt.edu >> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe here, >> edit account or options, view archives and so on. >> > > > > -- > Dr. Augustine Leudar > Artistic Director Magik Door LTD > Company Number : NI635217 > Registered 63 Ballycoan rd, > Belfast BT88LL > www.magikdoor.net > > -- Dr. Augustine Leudar Artistic Director Magik Door LTD Company Number : NI635217 Registered 63 Ballycoan rd, Belfast BT88LL www.magikdoor.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/attachments/20180327/b6e8b70c/attachment.html> _______________________________________________ Sursound mailing list Sursound@music.vt.edu https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe here, edit account or options, view archives and so on.
