John D.

Remember when we used to zone each level of a dry pipe system in open
parking garages with a check valve to speed up trip time, or am I really
showing my age? Could each level of Ken's project be connected to a single
pipe, with or without a check valve that ran to the top and a single air
vent?

On Mon, Oct 9, 2023 at 9:54 AM <[email protected]> wrote:

> I thought so.
>
>
>
> If we look, the entire book, along with NFPA 25 is essentially per system
> based.
>
>
>
> Another such example below.
>
>
>
> R/
>
> Mat
>
>
>
> *29.6.1.1*
>
> Such general information shall be provided with a permanently marked
> weatherproof metal or rigid plastic sign, secured with corrosion-resistant
> wire, chain, or other acceptable means.
>
> *29.6.1.2*
>
> Such signs shall be placed at each system control riser, antifreeze loop,
> and auxiliary system control valve.
>
> *ENHANCED CONTENT*
>
> Collapse
>
> The general information sign is required to be located near its system
> control valve. Where valve manifolds are used, it is critical to provide
> numbering or labeling to allow the signs to be correlated to individual
> systems because the information signs summarize the basis of designs for
> each system.
>
>
>
>
>
> *Please rate our customer service
> <https://survey.medallia.com/?emailsignature&fc=3539&bg=Fire%20and%20Fabrication>*
>
>
>
> *Matthew J. Willis, CWBSP, CET*
>
> *Engineering Manager – Southwest Region*
>
> *FERGUSON FIRE DESIGN, LLC*
>
> *A Wholly Owned Subsidiary of Ferguson Fire & Fabrication, LLC*
>
> 3508 Hwy. 557
>
> West Monroe, LA. 71292
>
> C: 307-236-8249
>
> *[email protected] <[email protected]>*
>
> *www.FergusonFire.com <http://www.fergusonfire.com/>*
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* John Denhardt <[email protected]>
> *Sent:* Monday, October 9, 2023 12:35 PM
> *To:* Discussion list on issues relating to automatic fire sprinklers <
> [email protected]>
> *Subject:* [Sprinklerforum] Re: Air venting
>
>
>
> The language in NFPA 13 is clear from my perspective.  One air release per
> wet sprinkler system.
>
>
>
> For example - A 50 story building with one wet sprinkler zone control
> assembly per floor would require 50 air release valves.
>
>
>
> John
>
> John August Denhardt, P.E.
>
> Vice-President Engineering and Technical Services
>
> American Fire Sprinkler Association
>
> 301-343-1457
>
>
>
> On Oct 9, 2023, at 12:29, Fpdcdesign <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> 
>
> Ken, I think you would have to with the check valve. I would push back a
> little in that by adding a normally open valve and a flow switch or
> manifold would not change the physics of the system enough to warrant the
> additional vents. If you had a 2 story building without zone valves, you
> would only need one vent. However, if you add normally open valves and flow
> switches, you would now need 2 (or 3?). From the standpoint of physics, why?
>
>
>
> Todd G Williams, PE
>
> Fire Protection Design/Consulting
>
> Stonington, CT
>
> 860-535-2080 (ofc)
>
> 860-554-7054  (fax)
>
> 860-608-4559 (cell)
>
>
>
>
> On Oct 9, 2023 at 12:06 PM, <Ken Wagoner <[email protected]>>
> wrote:
>
> Yes, Todd, on each floor, as they're using a Victaulic UMC manifold which
> includes a check valve.
>
> thanks for the information,
>
> *Ken Wagoner, SET*
>
>
> *Parsley Consulting 500 West Mechanic Street Harrisonville, Missouri
> 64701-2235*
> *Phone: (760) 745-6181 *
> *Visit the website
> <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fwww.parsleyconsulting.com%2f&c=E,1,Y5zKJKPEh1mBEBqSR-VE9cUKl5y-eyP8BpvmE_5j9ZqW2eJbNphYzrCMBZ-2YuX6d-RRkHI4gQ1FV-cvOeCfRC58uZS9NiToZv2mx7909oCqLvCW_n5hDHeK&typo=1>*
>
> On 10/9/2023 10:49 AM, Fpdcdesign wrote:
>
> Is there a check valve on the floor control assembly?
>
>
>
> Todd G Williams, PE
>
> Fire Protection Design/Consulting
>
> Stonington, CT
>
> 860-535-2080 (ofc)
>
> 860-554-7054  (fax)
>
> 860-608-4559 (cell)
>
>
>
>
> On Oct 9, 2023 at 11:44 AM, <Ken Wagoner <[email protected]>>
> wrote:
>
> Forumites,
>
> I'm working on a multi-story building protected per NFPA 13.  As each
> floor has a separate control valve, is a means to vent trapped air required
> on each floor?  Or is it only required at the highest level of the building?
>
> My thinking is that each floor has a separate fire sprinklers system.
>
> Any thoughts?
>
> *Ken Wagoner, SET*
>
>
> *Parsley Consulting 500 West Mechanic Street Harrisonville, Missouri
> 64701-2235*
> *Phone: (760) 745-6181 *
> *Visit the website
> <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fwww.parsleyconsulting.com%2f&c=E,1,Y5zKJKPEh1mBEBqSR-VE9cUKl5y-eyP8BpvmE_5j9ZqW2eJbNphYzrCMBZ-2YuX6d-RRkHI4gQ1FV-cvOeCfRC58uZS9NiToZv2mx7909oCqLvCW_n5hDHeK&typo=1>*
>
>
>
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