DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2019-02-10 Thread Gaelan Steele
Given the amount of slang crap going around, you might want to fix your AGAINT Gaelan > On Feb 10, 2019, at 9:35 AM, Edward Murphy wrote: > > I vote as follows: > > 8152 FOR > 8153 FOR (inadvertent mistakes can be papered over by auto-ratification) > 8154 AGAINT > 8155 PRESENT > 8156 FOR > 815

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes & Stuff

2017-09-10 Thread Josh T
Yeah, that's the one. CB: you get yourself a freebie since someone else dug it up for you. 天火狐 On 10 September 2017 at 20:12, VJ Rada wrote: > I cause 天火狐 using eir latest agency which I believe is 狐票店 but I make > no promises, to vote in the ADoP and PM elections in this way ""I > endorse the

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2017-05-15 Thread Nic Evans
I'm interpreting this as a conditional vote on 7849-7851, meaning it's a Present on 7849. If this had been written as "In all agoran decisions, currently up for vote, written by ais523:" then there'd be no vote on 7849. (I'm clarifying my decisions because I'm expecting CoEs all over.) On 05/09/

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes, votes, votes...

2013-07-21 Thread omd
On Sun, Jul 21, 2013 at 10:39 AM, Jonathan Rouillard wrote: > I vote PRESENT on every proposal I haven't voted on yet, but CAN vote on. I believe that's all proposals ever submitted that you haven't voted on. HTH!

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2013-07-15 Thread Sean Hunt
On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 6:26 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > On Mon, 15 Jul 2013, Sean Hunt wrote: >> I vote ENDORSE G. in all Agoran Decisions currently in their voting periods >> (yes, even the non-proposal ones). > > You might need to retract a previous vote before I buy that last bit ;). Well, I vo

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2013-07-15 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Mon, 15 Jul 2013, Sean Hunt wrote: > I vote ENDORSE G. in all Agoran Decisions currently in their voting periods > (yes, even the non-proposal ones). You might need to retract a previous vote before I buy that last bit ;).

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2013-04-14 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Sun, 14 Apr 2013, omd wrote: > On Sun, Apr 14, 2013 at 2:00 AM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > The most someone can get is just under 3xbase, I'm not sure this really > > that unfair compared to a lot of past systems? Or am I missing > > something. -G. > > Oops, I forgot that the default limit is

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2013-04-14 Thread omd
On Sun, Apr 14, 2013 at 2:00 AM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > The most someone can get is just under 3xbase, I'm not sure this really > that unfair compared to a lot of past systems? Or am I missing > something. -G. Oops, I forgot that the default limit is now 4... In general I think the limit should

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2013-04-13 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Sun, 14 Apr 2013, omd wrote: > On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 5:46 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > >> 7386 2.0 Ordinary scshunt Eraser > > FOR. Sorry Bayes, the small positive you contribute isn't worth the > > large negatives brought by the rest of the golems. > > For the record, just the other

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2013-04-13 Thread omd
On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 5:46 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: >> 7386 2.0 Ordinary scshunt Eraser > FOR. Sorry Bayes, the small positive you contribute isn't worth the > large negatives brought by the rest of the golems. For the record, just the other day I was planning to make a new Bayes with a

DIS: Re: BUS: votes

2012-07-06 Thread Ed Murphy
G. wrote: [I think I'm just outside the voting period unless there's been apathy. Nonetheless]. You are, and there hasn't been.

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2010-09-01 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Wed, 1 Sep 2010, omd wrote: > On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 5:38 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > On Wed, 1 Sep 2010, com...@gmail.com wrote: > >> I vote FOR all decisions to adopt proposals currently in their voting > >> periods. > > > > I retract my previous votes on all decisions with ongoing voting p

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2010-04-05 Thread Ed Murphy
comex wrote: > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 1:45 AM, Sean Hunt wrote: >> To remove ambiguity, I vote FOR each Agoran Decision for which I have not >> cast a vote. > > Me too. For 6682-85, I already had votes recorded for both of you: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 13:17:39 -0600 (yoyo) coppro F A A A Sun, 21

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2010-03-27 Thread Sgeo
On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 11:20 AM, comex wrote: > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 1:45 AM, Sean Hunt wrote: >> To remove ambiguity, I vote FOR each Agoran Decision for which I have not >> cast a vote. > > Me too. > What's going on?

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-28 Thread Alex Smith
On Fri, 2009-03-27 at 17:21 -0700, Ed Murphy wrote: > ais523 wrote: > > > The bug is in rule 754, which doesn't define > > "announcement" anywhere in the published versions of the FLR or SLR for > > months. > > Rule 478, last paragraph. Nope, it defines action by announcement in terms of announc

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Fri, 27 Mar 2009, comex wrote: > Unfortunately, I'm not sure that I can unilaterally avoid this sort of > error in the future. If someone else can make that guarantee, let > them be Rulekeepor; otherwise, Goethe, there is always the chance of > an accidental, hard-to-catch difference between

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Ed Murphy
ais523 wrote: > On Fri, 2009-03-27 at 14:55 -0400, Geoffrey Spear wrote: >> On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 2:51 PM, Sean Hunt wrote: >>> Also, perhaps we should allow the Assessor to end a voting period early >>> if there is a certain amount of positive votes (say, VI twice the AI and >>> at least half

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Ed Murphy
ais523 wrote: > The bug is in rule 754, which doesn't define > "announcement" anywhere in the published versions of the FLR or SLR for > months. Rule 478, last paragraph.

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Fri, 27 Mar 2009, Alex Smith wrote: > On Fri, 2009-03-27 at 11:31 -0700, Kerim Aydin wrote: >> On Fri, 27 Mar 2009, Alex Smith wrote: >>> The bug is in rule 754, which doesn't define >>> "announcement" anywhere in the published versions of the FLR or SLR for >>> months. >> >> Actually, we've

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread comex
On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 3:19 PM, Sean Hunt wrote: > soon as sufficient support is garnered. This takes precedence over rule > 1728, section b). That section only applies for actions to be performed without objections. > When a proposal is instantly adopted, it is removed from the Proposal > Pool

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Sean Hunt
Alex Smith wrote: > On Fri, 2009-03-27 at 14:55 -0400, Geoffrey Spear wrote: >> On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 2:51 PM, Sean Hunt wrote: >>> Also, perhaps we should allow the Assessor to end a voting period early >>> if there is a certain amount of positive votes (say, VI twice the AI and >>> at least ha

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Alex Smith
On Fri, 2009-03-27 at 14:55 -0400, Geoffrey Spear wrote: > On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 2:51 PM, Sean Hunt wrote: > > Also, perhaps we should allow the Assessor to end a voting period early > > if there is a certain amount of positive votes (say, VI twice the AI and > > at least half of all active play

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Geoffrey Spear
On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 2:51 PM, Sean Hunt wrote: > Also, perhaps we should allow the Assessor to end a voting period early > if there is a certain amount of positive votes (say, VI twice the AI and > at least half of all active players voting). Tweaks? (Allow arbitrary changes to the gamestate w

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Sean Hunt
Sean Hunt wrote: > I admit that I knew of this too. > > I retract any votes I submitted for proposal 6166 and vote AGAINST it. TtttPF. Also, perhaps we should allow the Assessor to end a voting period early if there is a certain amount of positive votes (say, VI twice the AI and at least half of

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Sean Hunt
Alex Smith wrote: > On Fri, 2009-03-27 at 09:23 -0700, Kerim Aydin wrote: >> I vote FOR Proposal 6165 and AGAINST proposal 6166 (not because of lack of >> trust of comex-as-rulekeepor, but because I never thought ruleset >> ratification >> was a good idea to begin with...ratify everything else bu

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Alex Smith
On Fri, 2009-03-27 at 11:31 -0700, Kerim Aydin wrote: > On Fri, 27 Mar 2009, Alex Smith wrote: > > The bug is in rule 754, which doesn't define > > "announcement" anywhere in the published versions of the FLR or SLR for > > months. > > Actually, we've got a judicial precedent (I'll look up the nu

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Fri, 27 Mar 2009, Alex Smith wrote: > The bug is in rule 754, which doesn't define > "announcement" anywhere in the published versions of the FLR or SLR for > months. Actually, we've got a judicial precedent (I'll look up the number later unless someone else does) that a common-language defin

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Fri, 27 Mar 2009, Alex Smith wrote: > B's trouble is that massive gamestate recalculation is kind-of common > there, and hard resets aren't nearly common enough. Recently, we > actually discovered that nothing at all had happened since the last hard > reset (due to various bugs), and we hard-re

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Alex Smith
On Fri, 2009-03-27 at 10:29 -0700, Kerim Aydin wrote: > I understand the tradeoff, I just prefer to ratify change events (e.g. > proposals) rather than the state for the ruleset in particular. Unlike > those who like hard-resets every time there's uncertainty (B? Or at > least my impression of B)

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Fri, 27 Mar 2009, Alex Smith wrote: > On Fri, 2009-03-27 at 09:23 -0700, Kerim Aydin wrote: >> I vote FOR Proposal 6165 and AGAINST proposal 6166 (not because of lack of >> trust of comex-as-rulekeepor, but because I never thought ruleset >> ratification >> was a good idea to begin with...rati

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-27 Thread Alex Smith
On Fri, 2009-03-27 at 09:23 -0700, Kerim Aydin wrote: > I vote FOR Proposal 6165 and AGAINST proposal 6166 (not because of lack of > trust of comex-as-rulekeepor, but because I never thought ruleset > ratification > was a good idea to begin with...ratify everything else but let the rules be > co

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2009-03-19 Thread Ed Murphy
coppro wrote: > 6147: FOR The DB says you previously voted AGAINST this, thus this vote is ineffective for being over your voting limit.

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2008-10-29 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Wed, 29 Oct 2008, Ian Kelly wrote: > On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 7:45 PM, Kerim Aydin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> One of the main ways equity works is by allowing direct holdings adjustments >> of contract-governed assets. Equity is only power 1.7. -Goethe > > What in R2169 authorizes that? Th

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2008-10-29 Thread Ed Murphy
comex wrote: > On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 5:36 PM, Kerim Aydin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>> 5823 D 1 2.0 rootSecure contract adjustments >> AGAINST. It breaks Equity. > In that case I retract my votes and vote FOR. You voted FOR the first time, so this is effectively a no-op.

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2008-10-29 Thread Ian Kelly
On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 7:45 PM, Kerim Aydin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Wed, 29 Oct 2008, Ian Kelly wrote: >> On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 3:36 PM, Kerim Aydin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: 5823 D 1 2.0 rootSecure contract adjustments >>> AGAINST. It breaks Equity. > > One of t

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2008-10-29 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Wed, 29 Oct 2008, Ian Kelly wrote: > On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 3:36 PM, Kerim Aydin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>> 5823 D 1 2.0 rootSecure contract adjustments >> AGAINST. It breaks Equity. One of the main ways equity works is by allowing direct holdings adjustments of contract-

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2008-10-29 Thread Ian Kelly
On Wed, Oct 29, 2008 at 3:36 PM, Kerim Aydin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> 5823 D 1 2.0 rootSecure contract adjustments > AGAINST. It breaks Equity. How so? -root

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2008-10-13 Thread Benjamin Schultz
On Oct 13, 2008, at 9:20 AM, Elliott Hird wrote: On 13 Oct 2008, at 14:15, Benjamin Schultz wrote: 5765 O 1 1.0 Wooble 1 x FOR, 1 x AGAINST Well, it's readable now. :P (I'm sure your mailer has a "reply" button, though, that'd also handle quoting for you...) My rea

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2008-10-13 Thread Elliott Hird
On 13 Oct 2008, at 14:15, Benjamin Schultz wrote: 5765 O 1 1.0 Wooble 1 x FOR, 1 x AGAINST Well, it's readable now. :P (I'm sure your mailer has a "reply" button, though, that'd also handle quoting for you...) -- ehird

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2008-10-10 Thread ehird
On 10 Oct 2008, at 03:42, Benjamin Schultz wrote: On Oct 7, 2008, at 6:35 PM, comex wrote: On Tue, Oct 7, 2008 at 6:30 PM, Benjamin Schultz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: (list of numbers which provides absolutely no context, forcing me to go back to the relevant distributions to find out what's

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2008-10-09 Thread Benjamin Schultz
On Oct 7, 2008, at 6:35 PM, comex wrote: On Tue, Oct 7, 2008 at 6:30 PM, Benjamin Schultz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: (list of numbers which provides absolutely no context, forcing me to go back to the relevant distributions to find out what's being voted on) *sigh*. What, you don't have n

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2008-10-07 Thread ehird
On 7 Oct 2008, at 23:35, comex wrote: On Tue, Oct 7, 2008 at 6:30 PM, Benjamin Schultz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: (list of numbers which provides absolutely no context, forcing me to go back to the relevant distributions to find out what's being voted on) *sigh*. Yeah, we got Bayes to sup

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2008-10-07 Thread comex
On Tue, Oct 7, 2008 at 6:30 PM, Benjamin Schultz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > (list of numbers which provides absolutely no context, forcing me to > go back to the relevant distributions to find out what's being voted > on) *sigh*.

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes for Ambassador and Herald

2008-05-11 Thread Iammars
Nomic Wiki Page updating On Sun, May 11, 2008 at 3:45 PM, Josiah Worcester <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 08:09 Sun 11 May , Ed Murphy wrote: >> pikhq wrote: >> >> >When I was Ambassador, I actually posted my report monthly; >> >this is something that no Ambassador in recent m

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes for Ambassador and Herald

2008-05-11 Thread Josiah Worcester
On 08:09 Sun 11 May , Ed Murphy wrote: > pikhq wrote: > > >When I was Ambassador, I actually posted my report monthly; > >this is something that no Ambassador in recent memory actually > >did. > > You still are Ambassador, and you still haven't addressed the > unfulfil

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes for Ambassador and Herald

2008-05-11 Thread Ed Murphy
pikhq wrote: >When I was Ambassador, I actually posted my report monthly; >this is something that no Ambassador in recent memory actually >did. You still are Ambassador, and you still haven't addressed the unfulfilled duties referenced by CFJs 1918-19.

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes for Ambassador and Herald

2008-05-11 Thread Josiah Worcester
On 12:35 Sun 11 May , Alexander Smith wrote: > For Ambassador, I vote COMEX. > For Herald, I vote IAMMARS. > -- > ais523 For both, I don't care, for I intend to run for the positions again. My soon-to-be-campaign speech: Rather than neglect my duties, I went on hold. Rather than

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-12-31 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Mon, 31 Dec 2007, Ed Murphy wrote: >> But you can't figure out if the proposal "would meet quorum" until the >> moment after the voting period has ended. -Goethe > > I don't understand how this in any way acknowledges my previous > comment on the matter. Oh I see what you're saying, you're r

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-12-31 Thread Ed Murphy
Goethe wrote: On Mon, 31 Dec 2007, Ed Murphy wrote: Goethe wrote: On Tue, 25 Dec 2007, Ed Murphy wrote: All AGAINST votes in this message are cast only on the condition that the proposal in question would meet quorum even if I didn't vote on it. Interesting. Technically, this isn't known "w

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-12-31 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Mon, 31 Dec 2007, Ed Murphy wrote: > Goethe wrote: >> On Tue, 25 Dec 2007, Ed Murphy wrote: >>> All AGAINST votes in this message are cast only on the condition that >>> the proposal in question would meet quorum even if I didn't vote on it. >> >> Interesting. Technically, this isn't known "w

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-12-31 Thread Ed Murphy
Goethe wrote: On Tue, 25 Dec 2007, Ed Murphy wrote: All AGAINST votes in this message are cast only on the condition that the proposal in question would meet quorum even if I didn't vote on it. Interesting. Technically, this isn't known "within" the voting period but only at the endpoint. R

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-12-26 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Tue, 25 Dec 2007, Ed Murphy wrote: > All AGAINST votes in this message are cast only on the condition that > the proposal in question would meet quorum even if I didn't vote on it. Interesting. Technically, this isn't known "within" the voting period but only at the endpoint. R2127 probably

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes on 5303-5319

2007-11-21 Thread comex
On Wednesday 21 November 2007, Benjamin Schultz wrote: > I thought someone else brought that up... "urgency" is not in the > units of "days." > >(f) The vote collector of such a decision CANNOT resolve it if >it was initiated more than fourteen days ago, or less than >

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes on 5303-5319

2007-11-21 Thread Benjamin Schultz
On Nov 21, 2007, at 10:16 PM, comex wrote: On Wednesday 21 November 2007, Benjamin Schultz wrote: 5311: AGAINST (units mismatch) ? I thought someone else brought that up... "urgency" is not in the units of "days." (f) The vote collector of such a decision CANNOT resolve it if

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes on 5303-5319

2007-11-21 Thread comex
On Wednesday 21 November 2007, Benjamin Schultz wrote: > 5311: AGAINST (units mismatch) ? signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-11-10 Thread Ed Murphy
Zefram wrote: Ed Murphy wrote: 5295 AGAINST (the pool should remain part of the report) Why? The promotor is obliged to distribute everything in the pool each week, so separate reporting of the pool is redundant. A few different reasons. Retaining the obligation increases the Promotor's i

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-11-10 Thread Zefram
Ed Murphy wrote: >5295 AGAINST (the pool should remain part of the report) Why? The promotor is obliged to distribute everything in the pool each week, so separate reporting of the pool is redundant. -zefram

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-11-07 Thread Zefram
Ed Murphy wrote: >Not sure. Would you see any problems with "To perform an action 'by >announcement' is to announce that one performs it"? I see a problem with it. It implies that a rule that says "the speaker CAN doff eir hat by announcement" are claiming to control the POSSIBILITY of the speak

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-11-07 Thread Ed Murphy
root wrote: On 11/7/07, Ed Murphy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: 5287 AGAINST (these are privileges, not duties) The speaker's assignment of the privileges is a duty. I would support that change if it were proposed separately. Also, when it comes time to revoke MwP from someone, non-players (if

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-11-07 Thread Ian Kelly
On 11/7/07, Ed Murphy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > 5287 AGAINST (these are privileges, not duties) The speaker's assignment of the privileges is a duty. > 5291 AGAINST (I don't see the need) The need is that the paragraph has been misinterpreted more than once recently. If the proposal were disin

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-10-27 Thread Ed Murphy
Zefram wrote: Josiah Worcester wrote: He registered 5 minutes previous, making him a first-class player, and therefore an eligible voter. R1950: The eligible voters on a democratic proposal are those entities that were active first-class players at the start of its voting p

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-10-27 Thread Zefram
Josiah Worcester wrote: >He registered 5 minutes previous, making him a first-class player, and >therefore an eligible voter. R1950: The eligible voters on a democratic proposal are those entities that were active first-class players at the start of its voting period. R2156:

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-10-27 Thread Josiah Worcester
On Saturday 27 October 2007 02:03:51 Zefram wrote: > Ed Murphy wrote: > >5261 AGAINST x 5 > >5262 PRESENT > >5263 AGAINST > >5264 AGAINST x 5 > >5265 AGAINST > >5266 AGAINST > >5267 AGAINST > >5268 AGAINST > > You're not an eligible voter on any of these. > > -zefram > He registered 5 minutes p

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-08-21 Thread Ed Murphy
Zefram wrote: Ed Murphy wrote: 5171 AGAINST (invisible F) Ah, you're in the "unless" == "iff not" camp too? Curious. I had no idea that interpretation of "unless" existed in formal logic. I've always used it to mean "if not". I'm undecided. I think the matter warrants further discussion.

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-08-21 Thread Zefram
Peekee wrote: >I am happy unless it rains. > >does this mean it is impossible for me to be happy when it is raining? Another example to ponder: Murphy CANNOT spend blue VCs UNLESS e is holding a strawberry. Would that mean that e CAN spend blue VCs in all cases if e is holding a strawberry

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-08-21 Thread Peekee
I agree with zefram, so do other people. http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Formal_Logic/Sentential_Logic/Translations#Unless "x unless y" <=> "if (not y) then x" <=> "x or y" if (not y) then x follows. if y then x may or may not be true. I am happy unless it rains. does this mean it is impossible

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-08-21 Thread Zefram
Ed Murphy wrote: >5171 AGAINST (invisible F) Ah, you're in the "unless" == "iff not" camp too? Curious. I had no idea that interpretation of "unless" existed in formal logic. I've always used it to mean "if not". -zefram

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-08-08 Thread Zefram
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >5124 AGAINST What's the problem with proper disinterest? Having the penalty apply to disinterested proposals provides a perverse incentive for people to vote on disinterested proposals contrary to their actual opinion of the proposal. That's what disinterest is meant to

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: votes on Proposals 4958-4969

2007-05-15 Thread Benjamin Schultz
On May 10, 2007, at 7:44 PM, Zefram wrote: Benjamin Schultz wrote: I like this phrasing. Any comments, Zefram, on the phrase "widely spoken Human language"? It's woolly. Pick a specific minimum number of native speakers and then we'll be getting into feasible territory. Wikipedia lists 35

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: votes on Proposals 4958-4969

2007-05-10 Thread Zefram
Benjamin Schultz wrote: >I like this phrasing. Any comments, Zefram, on the phrase "widely >spoken Human language"? It's woolly. Pick a specific minimum number of native speakers and then we'll be getting into feasible territory. Wikipedia lists 35 languages with more than 30 million native s

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: votes on Proposals 4958-4969

2007-05-10 Thread Benjamin Schultz
On May 9, 2007, at 6:35 PM, Roger Hicks wrote: Perhaps "widely spoken human language" or "commonly used human language"? I think both of those wordings would eliminate "I just made up a language where the name of each player translates to Bear". At least it should hold up under CfJ I like

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: votes on Proposals 4958-4969

2007-05-09 Thread Zefram
Benjamin Schultz wrote: >What phrasing do you recommend? It's not the phrasing that's the problem, it's the concept. Even looking only at geographical regions where bears have historically been found, there are thousands of natural human spoken languages, no doubt some of them still unknown to sc

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: votes on Proposals 4958-4969

2007-05-09 Thread Roger Hicks
Perhaps "widely spoken human language" or "commonly used human language"? I think both of those wordings would eliminate "I just made up a language where the name of each player translates to Bear". At least it should hold up under CfJ BobTHJ On 5/9/07, Benjamin Schultz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote

DIS: Re: BUS: votes on Proposals 4958-4969

2007-05-09 Thread Benjamin Schultz
On May 9, 2007, at 2:04 PM, Zefram wrote: I vote: 4958: FOR*8 4959: AGAINST*8 ("any Human language" makes it impossible to administer) What phrasing do you recommend? I want to make sure that languages other than USian English are okay, but neither Klingon nor C++ are okay. - Benjam

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-05 Thread Ed Murphy
Maud wrote: On 5/4/07, Zefram <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Related question: if Agoran decisions have not been properly initiated on proposals for the past few months, does the last paragraph of R2034 still manage to make the result announcements effective? Rule 2034 does seem to apply here, an

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-05 Thread Michael Slone
On 5/5/07, Roger Hicks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Wow will every official post I make spark this much controversy? This could be quite exciting :) It's possible, but let's hope not. While controversy is fine, there is also merit in actually playing the game! (Of course, for some people, the

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-05 Thread Michael Slone
On 5/4/07, Zefram <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Related question: if Agoran decisions have not been properly initiated on proposals for the past few months, does the last paragraph of R2034 still manage to make the result announcements effective? Rule 2034 does seem to apply here, and to any other

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Roger Hicks
Wow will every official post I make spark this much controversy? This could be quite exciting :) BobTHJ On 5/4/07, Zefram <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Michael Slone wrote: >The rules do not vanish when we choose to ignore them. Quite so, but we have a history of allowing paraphrases and implic

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Kerim Aydin
Zefram wrote: > I don't agree with your adoption of the R991 criterion, at least as > sole criterion for determining public agreement. You can read R991 such > that submission of a CFJ (even if the CFJ is later dismissed or refused) > proves a lack of public agreement, but I think lack of public

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Zefram
Kerim Aydin wrote: >We now have a lack of agreement for this particular distribution. R107 doesn't say when the public have to agree on the set of eligible voters. I think we were all in agreement on who was eligible at the start of the voting period. If eligibility for a decision can change ove

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Zefram
Kerim Aydin wrote: >means this distribution (but not prior ones, where there was no >such disagreement in evidence!) was invald. Curious argument. I never read "sufficient to enable ..." that way before. It would mean that the null description, as has previously been used, would be sufficient if

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Kerim Aydin
Maud wrote: > Since adopting a proposal is an Agoran decision, every notice of > proposal distribution which omits a description of the class of > eligible voters is invalid. An Agoran decision is not actually > initiated except by a valid notice. See rule 107. We are now splintering into two s

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Zefram
Michael Slone wrote: >The rules do not vanish when we choose to ignore them. Quite so, but we have a history of allowing paraphrases and implicitudes. If you seriously doubt the efficacy of present proposal distributions, please CFJ on it. Related question: if Agoran decisions have not been prope

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Kerim Aydin
Maud wrote: > Now, I know we've been following a judicial path lately, but in this > case we ought to pursue a legislative solution, even if only to make > the rules clear. There are many cases where a concise legislative solution is perferrable, even in a "judicial" game. This is one of them.

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Michael Slone
On 5/4/07, Zefram <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I note, in passing, that we don't in practice require the notice defined by R107 to be explicit. The rules do not vanish when we choose to ignore them. -- C. Maud Image (Michael Slone) I think someone has a comprehension problem here. I don't think

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Michael Slone
On 5/4/07, Kerim Aydin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: The "class" of eligible voters may (or may not) be "all current players and all persons who register during the voting period." There is nothing in the above clause preventing this interpretation. The act of registration (which makes a person in

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Zefram
Michael Slone wrote: >(2) people who join in the middle of the voting period can't vote. This could be construed as a feature. I thought it was intended as one. -zefram

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Zefram
Michael Slone wrote: >By rule 107 (b), the notice initiating an Agoran decision must give a >``description of the class of eligible voters sufficient to enable >public agreement on which persons are eligible''. Therefore, the >class of eligible voters is set when the decision is initiated and >can

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Michael Slone
On 5/4/07, Roger Hicks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Well, then it appears I submitted an invalid ballot. Such is life. Well, this points up two problems with the current rules: (1) it's too hard to tell who is eligible to vote; and (2) people who join in the middle of the voting period can't vo

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Kerim Aydin
Maud wrote: > By rule 107 (b), the notice initiating an Agoran decision must give a > ``description of the class of eligible voters sufficient to enable > public agreement on which persons are eligible''. Therefore, the > class of eligible voters is set when the decision is initiated and > cannot

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Roger Hicks
Well, then it appears I submitted an invalid ballot. Such is life. On 5/4/07, Michael Slone <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 5/4/07, Zefram <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Anyone fancy another group of massively-linked CFJs? I don't think that will be necessary. By rule 107 (b), the notice initiati

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Michael Slone
On 5/4/07, Zefram <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Anyone fancy another group of massively-linked CFJs? I don't think that will be necessary. By rule 107 (b), the notice initiating an Agoran decision must give a ``description of the class of eligible voters sufficient to enable public agreement on w

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Zefram
Roger Hicks wrote: >I hereby submit the following CFJ: That's the spirit! By the way, submitting a CFJ is legal even if you're not a player, which is just as well with your registration still uncertain. But unfortunately that uncertainty does mean that your CFJ doesn't only hinge on the eligibil

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Zefram
Roger Hicks wrote: >1. I understand my registration may be under dispute. However, if the CFJ >returns in my favor, shouldn't my votes be counted? Yes, that's the way it works. We often have official reports track actions of questioned legality, noted as being subject to CFJ. I said in my previo

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Roger Hicks
1. I understand my registration may be under dispute. However, if the CFJ returns in my favor, shouldn't my votes be counted? 2. I can't find anything in the rules stating that my votes are invalid simply because my registration occurred after proposals were distributed. If I'm missing something

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread Zefram
quazie wrote: >1 - has BobTHJ actually registered yet? (I believe thats in CFJ) E is definitely registered now. CFJ only concerns time of registration, the two options differing by about eight hours. >2 - if BobTHJ did register, didn't registration happen after the >proposals in question were

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes 4947-4957

2007-05-04 Thread quazie
Roger Hicks wrote: BobTHJ votes as follows: 4947 - FOR 4948 - FOR 4949 - FOR 4950 - FOR 4951 - FOR 4952 - AGAINST 4953 - FOR 4954 - AGAINST 4955 - AGAINST 4956 - FOR 4957 - AGAINST 1 - has BobTHJ actually registered yet? (I believe thats in CFJ) 2 - if BobTHJ did register, didn't registratio

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-04-24 Thread Benjamin Schultz
On Apr 20, 2007, at 8:35 AM, Zefram wrote: Benjamin Schultz wrote: I am willing to change my votes in return for tangible offers. What constitutes tangibility? That's a very good point, seeing as this game is entirely intangible. Promises to do something at a later date don't se

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-04-20 Thread Kerim Aydin
Zefram wrote: > What constitutes tangibility? Voting FOR 4930 (democratic for *just* this reason), then a mini- conspiracy to spend enough VCs on em so e wins, thus resetting eir voting power? -Goethe

DIS: Re: BUS: Votes

2007-04-20 Thread Zefram
Benjamin Schultz wrote: >I am willing to change my votes in return for tangible >offers. What constitutes tangibility? -zefram

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