Re: [AFMUG] Way too easy

[Lewis Bergman]

I have found that you don't want to make it too difficult to break into a
tower site.If they are remote, which most of mine are, we have a lock that
can be cut. I try to keep the curious and casual thieves out and try to
show an effort to keep the kids off the tower. Other than that. You just
give someone a reason to damage crap as they break in.

As a tower owner that owns a number of towers without any of my equipment
on them, explain to me why I would pay for a camera system? If I do, I have
to pay for connectivity to watch them or some type of service. The only
thing anyone can do is either steal grounding or cut the thing down.
Everything else is the tenant's problem. I don't know how others do it but
the way I ground a tower They can only cut and steal maybe $40 worth of
copper. Sure, it costs me maybe $500 to put it back but that is still less
than a camera system and monitoring. There is no financial incentive as a
tower owner to monitor this.

I have had copper grounding stolen. It costs me $450 to replace everything
and cadweld patches back in. Not enough to claim on insurance. No tenant
has ever asked if we monitor our towers for intrusion. I have been to
provide certification that we are monitoring for light outages, which is
required by FCC regulations. Just my 2 cents from the other side.

On Sun, Jul 26, 2020 at 8:47 PM Steve Jones 
wrote:

> Verizon sites all have a secondary access key. I was doing some
> contracting for them a few years ago. The mechanism was a little shocking
>
> On Sun, Jul 26, 2020, 9:26 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>> Tower sites almost always have combination locks not keys, and the tower
>> leasing companies often use the same combination everywhere.  They may have
>> multiple locks like one for Sprint one for Verizon one for the electric
>> company etc. but I’ll bet those are the same across the network also.  I’ve
>> even encountered different tower leasing companies that use the same
>> combination.
>>
>>
>>
>> I’ve never had access to a cell company shelter, but what do you want to
>> bet those don’t have unique combinations either.
>>
>>
>>
>> Also most towers have a sign saying it has security cameras.  Many don’t
>> have cameras, just a sign.
>>
>>
>>
>> Most of the people accessing cell sites seem to be contractors, from the
>> crews that install the equipment to the guys maintaining the HVAC and
>> generators and filters and bait stations and cutting the grass and spraying
>> Roundup to keep the weeds down.  Many people know the combinations.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
>> *Sent:* Saturday, July 25, 2020 11:07 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Way too easy
>>
>>
>>
>> You cant stop a thief with the keys. But I bet some bureaucrat somewhere
>> pushes a bill to "make sure this can never happen again" that will
>> ultimately make things worse.
>>
>> At least this wasn't a copper thief, those guys destroy everything, this
>> is just a matter of a router drop and dumping a backup config, easy peasy.
>>
>> I'm surprised bigger companies dont have cameras
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jul 25, 2020, 7:07 PM Jaime Solorza 
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> http://wirelessestimator.com/articles/2020/arrest-made-following-theft-of-sprint-network-routers-that-took-down-carriers-service-in-texas/
>>
>> --
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>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
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>>
> --
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>


-- 
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325-439-0533 Cell
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Re: [AFMUG] OT. Homemade Tortilla soup

[Lewis Bergman]

Bill, I made your Middle Eastern chicken thing with the tomatoes, curry,
onions etc with the eggs on top. That one is a winner. I'll have to cut
some spice for my wife next time but man that thing is good. I added some
Paprika to turn it a bit more red. The cumin is a nice brown color but she
isn't used to that.

On Sun, Jul 26, 2020 at 4:41 PM Bill Prince  wrote:

> Love me some sliced avo. We've been getting them on sale lately, and we
> have to eat them almost every day to use them up before they get too ripe.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
>
> On 7/26/2020 2:28 PM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>
> Sliced avocado, cheese, chicken, pico de Gallo y tortilla chips
> Yum
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


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325-439-0533 Cell
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Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Josh Luthman]

I was going to say this means you're all set, throw it up there and boot
the sucker.

Not sure how they're going to solve the GUI problem, but everyone seems to
agree it's misleading.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 12:03 AM Kurt Fankhauser 
wrote:

> Yes this was taken care of quickly on friday by Evan. My first time
> talking to a level 3 engineer with Cambium and I will say these guys are
> AWESOME. The whole "un-registered" status in CnMaestro apparently
> doesn't mean what I thought it did. Hitting the "sync" button is what I
> needed to do. Thanks Matt for getting this ticket escalated.
>
> On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 6:56 PM Matt Mangriotis via AF 
> wrote:
>
>> I got Kurt… he should be sorted.
>>
>>
>>
>> (We don’t ignore tickets… sometimes the support guys get a bit
>> overwhelmed and have to play catch-up, working to reduce that issue,
>> especially with CBRS in light of the upcoming October death of Part 90!).
>>
>>
>>
>> Matt
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Ken Hohhof
>> *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 4:17 PM
>> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
>> *Subject:* [ External ] Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
>> onboarding
>>
>>
>>
>> If Cambium support is ignoring your ticket, grab the email address of the
>> guy sending out emails about the cnMaestro Cloud software update progress
>> and send him a nice email asking for help.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Kurt Fankhauser
>> *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 3:45 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding
>>
>>
>>
>> here is what i am seeing in CNMaestro as soon as i hit the start button
>> it gives me an error says "already synced"
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 2:29 PM Josh Luthman 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Unregistered means you didn't start the process.  Once is registered you
>> have 3 days for the AP/SM to grab the grant.
>>
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 12:33 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>
>> Did you click the START button in Services>CBRS>Management Tool?  It
>> shouldn’t take more than a minute or two.  Actually it should go through
>> REGISTERED to GRANT to APPROVED pretty quick.
>>
>>
>>
>> The cnMaestro CBRS support folks are actually very helpful.  I’ve even
>> had them remote control my screen, fix things, and teach me how to do
>> stuff.  The trick may be getting the ticket past Level 1 support and
>> assigned to the right people.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Kurt Fankhauser
>> *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 10:53 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding
>>
>>
>>
>> ok thats what i thought, i did all that have two AP's that are showing up
>> in Maestro but CBRS status is "UNREGISTERED", has been that way for 4 days,
>> have a ticket in with cambium for the last 3 days and nothing so far.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 11:48 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>
>> You only need the account with Cambium.  But the CPI enters the
>> credentials each time he/she enters data, you can’t store them on cnMaestro.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Kurt Fankhauser
>> *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 9:28 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding
>>
>>
>>
>> After someone takes the CPI test and gets the CPI certificate from
>> Federated Wireless, do you then have to create an account on the Federated
>> Wireless system controller website or can you just start a CBRS account
>> with CN Maestro and upload the certificate on CN Maestro to then be able to
>> start on-boarding devices?
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>> 
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>> 
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>> 

Re: [AFMUG] Explain it to me Lucy

[Lewis Bergman]

Ahoy Mate

Looking good sporting that patch buddy. Where is your parrot?

On those PLC's, do they have a different gateway setup than the
cradlepoint? they should be responding directly to the IP talking to it so
it shouldn't matter but wondering. The PLC's are on the same network right?


On Sun, Jul 26, 2020 at 3:36 PM Jaime Solorza 
wrote:

> We have a Cradlepoint router with static IP and configured with 7 port
> forwarding IPs assigned to 2 PLCs, 4 VFDS and 1 HMI on 192.168.1.xxx
> network plus switch. Currently these devices are on the water companys
> SCADA netwotk going to a router for Internet Access with their tablets.
> I can see the IPs  (192.168.1.120-7) on wired devices screen of
> Cradlepoint from my home via remote access.  I can ping them and router as
> well.
> We can not access any of the PLCs or other devices at all...they all time
> out..cellular connections are solid...I have zero disconnects to
> Cradlepoint.
> This setup works perfectly well at other locations but difference is that
> other places, the port forward gear is not on a shared network.  We have
> Remote IQ Boots to reboot gear at hard to access locations.
> Do you think we need to ask them to add port Forwarding rules on their
> router?
> Should we isolate these 7 devices and just have them on Cradlepoint?
> Thanks guys who are smarter than me..
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


-- 
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325-439-0533 Cell
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Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Kurt Fankhauser]

I got the AP "transmitting" now. Hooked a couple clients up. Cambium told
me the GUI will be addressed in a future version of CNMaestro. It's fine
now. I'm actually quite impressed with how well the grant process works
with the 450 equipment.

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:25 AM Josh Luthman 
wrote:

> I was going to say this means you're all set, throw it up there and boot
> the sucker.
>
> Not sure how they're going to solve the GUI problem, but everyone seems to
> agree it's misleading.
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 12:03 AM Kurt Fankhauser 
> wrote:
>
>> Yes this was taken care of quickly on friday by Evan. My first time
>> talking to a level 3 engineer with Cambium and I will say these guys are
>> AWESOME. The whole "un-registered" status in CnMaestro apparently
>> doesn't mean what I thought it did. Hitting the "sync" button is what I
>> needed to do. Thanks Matt for getting this ticket escalated.
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 6:56 PM Matt Mangriotis via AF 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I got Kurt… he should be sorted.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> (We don’t ignore tickets… sometimes the support guys get a bit
>>> overwhelmed and have to play catch-up, working to reduce that issue,
>>> especially with CBRS in light of the upcoming October death of Part 90!).
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Matt
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Ken Hohhof
>>> *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 4:17 PM
>>> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
>>> *Subject:* [ External ] Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
>>> onboarding
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> If Cambium support is ignoring your ticket, grab the email address of
>>> the guy sending out emails about the cnMaestro Cloud software update
>>> progress and send him a nice email asking for help.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Kurt Fankhauser
>>> *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 3:45 PM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> here is what i am seeing in CNMaestro as soon as i hit the start button
>>> it gives me an error says "already synced"
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 2:29 PM Josh Luthman <
>>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Unregistered means you didn't start the process.  Once is registered you
>>> have 3 days for the AP/SM to grab the grant.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 12:33 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>>
>>> Did you click the START button in Services>CBRS>Management Tool?  It
>>> shouldn’t take more than a minute or two.  Actually it should go through
>>> REGISTERED to GRANT to APPROVED pretty quick.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The cnMaestro CBRS support folks are actually very helpful.  I’ve even
>>> had them remote control my screen, fix things, and teach me how to do
>>> stuff.  The trick may be getting the ticket past Level 1 support and
>>> assigned to the right people.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Kurt Fankhauser
>>> *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 10:53 AM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ok thats what i thought, i did all that have two AP's that are showing
>>> up in Maestro but CBRS status is "UNREGISTERED", has been that way for 4
>>> days, have a ticket in with cambium for the last 3 days and nothing so far.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 11:48 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>>
>>> You only need the account with Cambium.  But the CPI enters the
>>> credentials each time he/she enters data, you can’t store them on cnMaestro.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Kurt Fankhauser
>>> *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 9:28 AM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> After someone takes the CPI test and gets the CPI certificate from
>>> Federated Wireless, do you then have to create an account on the Federated
>>> Wireless system controller website or can you just start a CBRS account
>>> with CN Maestro and upload the certificate on CN Maestro to then be able to
>>> start on-boarding devices?
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>> 
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>> 

Re: [AFMUG] Explain it to me Lucy

[Jaime Solorza]

Yes ...on same network but not sure on their setup...not configured by us
but by Tonka Equipment techs...I can find out..

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020, 7:27 AM Lewis Bergman  wrote:

> Ahoy Mate
>
> Looking good sporting that patch buddy. Where is your parrot?
>
> On those PLC's, do they have a different gateway setup than the
> cradlepoint? they should be responding directly to the IP talking to it so
> it shouldn't matter but wondering. The PLC's are on the same network right?
>
>
> On Sun, Jul 26, 2020 at 3:36 PM Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
>> We have a Cradlepoint router with static IP and configured with 7 port
>> forwarding IPs assigned to 2 PLCs, 4 VFDS and 1 HMI on 192.168.1.xxx
>> network plus switch. Currently these devices are on the water companys
>> SCADA netwotk going to a router for Internet Access with their tablets.
>> I can see the IPs  (192.168.1.120-7) on wired devices screen of
>> Cradlepoint from my home via remote access.  I can ping them and router as
>> well.
>> We can not access any of the PLCs or other devices at all...they all time
>> out..cellular connections are solid...I have zero disconnects to
>> Cradlepoint.
>> This setup works perfectly well at other locations but difference is that
>> other places, the port forward gear is not on a shared network.  We have
>> Remote IQ Boots to reboot gear at hard to access locations.
>> Do you think we need to ask them to add port Forwarding rules on their
>> router?
>> Should we isolate these 7 devices and just have them on Cradlepoint?
>> Thanks guys who are smarter than me..
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
>
> --
> Lewis Bergman
> 325-439-0533 Cell
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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[AFMUG] MSRP

[Adam Moffett]

It seems like Juniper's actual prices are 60%-75% lower than MSRP 
depending on the item.


Like a $1200 list item is actually $400 in real life.  What's the 
rationale for pricing stuff like this?




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Re: [AFMUG] OT. Homemade Tortilla soup

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Shakshuka? Yeah. We have made that for either dinner or for
  breakfast. We made it few times with feta, but last time we didn't
  have enough feta, so we did the remaining with mozzarella. That
  was maybe more 'merican, but we liked it.


bp



On 7/27/2020 6:20 AM, Lewis Bergman
  wrote:


  
  Bill, I made your Middle Eastern chicken thing with
the tomatoes, curry, onions etc with the eggs on top. That one
is a winner. I'll have to cut some spice for my wife next time
but man that thing is good. I added some Paprika to turn it a
bit more red. The cumin is a nice brown color but she isn't used
to that.
  
  
On Sun, Jul 26, 2020 at 4:41
  PM Bill Prince  wrote:


  
Love me some sliced avo. We've been getting them on sale
  lately, and we have to eat them almost every day to use
  them up before they get too ripe.


bp



On 7/26/2020 2:28 PM, Jaime Solorza wrote:


  Sliced avocado, cheese, chicken, pico de
Gallo y tortilla chips
Yum
  
  
  

  
  -- 
  AF mailing list
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  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

  
  
  
  
  -- 
  
Lewis Bergman
  325-439-0533 Cell

  
  
  

  


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Re: [AFMUG] MSRP

[Bill Prince]

Kind of like the recent bill I got for a CT scan. MSRP was $5,900, but 
insurance paid $500. What's the rationale for that?


bp


On 7/27/2020 7:37 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:
It seems like Juniper's actual prices are 60%-75% lower than MSRP 
depending on the item.


Like a $1200 list item is actually $400 in real life.  What's the 
rationale for pricing stuff like this?






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Re: [AFMUG] MSRP

[Mark Radabaugh]

> On Jul 27, 2020, at 10:37 AM, Adam Moffett  wrote:
> 
> It seems like Juniper's actual prices are 60%-75% lower than MSRP depending 
> on the item.
> 
> Like a $1200 list item is actually $400 in real life.  What's the rationale 
> for pricing stuff like this?
> 

Discouraging new customers I guess.   

I think it’s targeted at the enterprise market and the outside managed services 
providers (MSP) who sell the equipment.   The typical business customer just 
goes with whatever the managed services provider recommends and is happy that 
the MSP gave them a 20% discount on the equipment, not realizing it was still 
double what the MSP paid for it.

Juniper does have a service provider team, but if you are not a Fortune 500 
company they really don’t care to deal with you.   Y’all are pesky, ask a lot 
of questions, bitch when the gear doesn’t work exactly right, don’t want to pay 
them to fix it, and keep bringing up $50 Mikrotik routers.   

Don’t take that the wrong way - the Juniper gear is great stuff.   You just 
have to find a way to beat the pricing down to something reasonable.   It can 
be done with some work and arm twisting.

Mark
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Re: [AFMUG] MSRP

[SmarterBroadband]

To keep the annual maintenance fee high? 

-Original Message-
From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 7:38 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] MSRP

It seems like Juniper's actual prices are 60%-75% lower than MSRP depending on 
the item.

Like a $1200 list item is actually $400 in real life.  What's the rationale for 
pricing stuff like this?



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Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Josh Luthman]

The GUI needs a bit of work, but otherwise it's ezpz.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:49 AM Kurt Fankhauser 
wrote:

> I got the AP "transmitting" now. Hooked a couple clients up. Cambium told
> me the GUI will be addressed in a future version of CNMaestro. It's fine
> now. I'm actually quite impressed with how well the grant process works
> with the 450 equipment.
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:25 AM Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
>
>> I was going to say this means you're all set, throw it up there and boot
>> the sucker.
>>
>> Not sure how they're going to solve the GUI problem, but everyone seems
>> to agree it's misleading.
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 12:03 AM Kurt Fankhauser <
>> lists.wavel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Yes this was taken care of quickly on friday by Evan. My first time
>>> talking to a level 3 engineer with Cambium and I will say these guys are
>>> AWESOME. The whole "un-registered" status in CnMaestro apparently
>>> doesn't mean what I thought it did. Hitting the "sync" button is what I
>>> needed to do. Thanks Matt for getting this ticket escalated.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 6:56 PM Matt Mangriotis via AF 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I got Kurt… he should be sorted.



 (We don’t ignore tickets… sometimes the support guys get a bit
 overwhelmed and have to play catch-up, working to reduce that issue,
 especially with CBRS in light of the upcoming October death of Part 90!).



 Matt



 *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Ken Hohhof
 *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 4:17 PM
 *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
 *Subject:* [ External ] Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
 onboarding



 If Cambium support is ignoring your ticket, grab the email address of
 the guy sending out emails about the cnMaestro Cloud software update
 progress and send him a nice email asking for help.



 *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Kurt Fankhauser
 *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 3:45 PM
 *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding



 here is what i am seeing in CNMaestro as soon as i hit the start button
 it gives me an error says "already synced"



 On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 2:29 PM Josh Luthman <
 j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:

 Unregistered means you didn't start the process.  Once is registered
 you have 3 days for the AP/SM to grab the grant.



 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373





 On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 12:33 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

 Did you click the START button in Services>CBRS>Management Tool?  It
 shouldn’t take more than a minute or two.  Actually it should go through
 REGISTERED to GRANT to APPROVED pretty quick.



 The cnMaestro CBRS support folks are actually very helpful.  I’ve even
 had them remote control my screen, fix things, and teach me how to do
 stuff.  The trick may be getting the ticket past Level 1 support and
 assigned to the right people.



 *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Kurt Fankhauser
 *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 10:53 AM
 *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding



 ok thats what i thought, i did all that have two AP's that are showing
 up in Maestro but CBRS status is "UNREGISTERED", has been that way for 4
 days, have a ticket in with cambium for the last 3 days and nothing so far.



 On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 11:48 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

 You only need the account with Cambium.  But the CPI enters the
 credentials each time he/she enters data, you can’t store them on 
 cnMaestro.



 *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Kurt Fankhauser
 *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 9:28 AM
 *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
 *Subject:* [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding



 After someone takes the CPI test and gets the CPI certificate from
 Federated Wireless, do you then have to create an account on the Federated
 Wireless system controller website or can you just start a CBRS account
 with CN Maestro and upload the certificate on CN Maestro to then be able to
 start on-boarding devices?

 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
 

Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Ken Hohhof]

Where it gets a little trickier is when you want to change parameters on a 
working system.  Like frequency, channel width, moving SM to a different AP, 
etc.  Cambium accommodates all of these with clever features, but it can be 
confusing to the operator if you don’t do it all the time.  Some of these you 
do from the device and the change just gets reflected in cnMaestro.

 

CBRS isn’t simple.

 

One other thing to get out of your brain is if you think the SAS hands out 
frequencies to GAA operators in a fashion that avoids interference.  You still 
have to do spectrum analysis and work around other operators just like 
unlicensed.  The SAS protects incumbents and PAL holders.  Other than that, it 
will happily give you a grant on 3555 even if another WISP is right next to you 
on 3555, at least that’s my understanding.

 

I’m not looking forward to what happens if/when the cellcos buy up a bunch of 
PALs.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 12:42 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment 
onboarding

 

The GUI needs a bit of work, but otherwise it's ezpz.


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:49 AM Kurt Fankhauser mailto:lists.wavel...@gmail.com> > wrote:

I got the AP "transmitting" now. Hooked a couple clients up. Cambium told me 
the GUI will be addressed in a future version of CNMaestro. It's fine now. I'm 
actually quite impressed with how well the grant process works with the 450 
equipment.

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:25 AM Josh Luthman mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> > wrote:

I was going to say this means you're all set, throw it up there and boot the 
sucker.

 

Not sure how they're going to solve the GUI problem, but everyone seems to 
agree it's misleading.


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 12:03 AM Kurt Fankhauser mailto:lists.wavel...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Yes this was taken care of quickly on friday by Evan. My first time talking to 
a level 3 engineer with Cambium and I will say these guys are AWESOME. The 
whole "un-registered" status in CnMaestro apparently doesn't mean what I 
thought it did. Hitting the "sync" button is what I needed to do. Thanks Matt 
for getting this ticket escalated. 

 

On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 6:56 PM Matt Mangriotis via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > wrote:

I got Kurt… he should be sorted.

 

(We don’t ignore tickets… sometimes the support guys get a bit overwhelmed and 
have to play catch-up, working to reduce that issue, especially with CBRS in 
light of the upcoming October death of Part 90!).

 

Matt

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Friday, July 24, 2020 4:17 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: [ External ] Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

 

If Cambium support is ignoring your ticket, grab the email address of the guy 
sending out emails about the cnMaestro Cloud software update progress and send 
him a nice email asking for help.

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Kurt Fankhauser
Sent: Friday, July 24, 2020 3:45 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

 

here is what i am seeing in CNMaestro as soon as i hit the start button it 
gives me an error says "already synced"

 

On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 2:29 PM Josh Luthman mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> > wrote:

Unregistered means you didn't start the process.  Once is registered you have 3 
days for the AP/SM to grab the grant.


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 12:33 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

Did you click the START button in Services>CBRS>Management Tool?  It shouldn’t 
take more than a minute or two.  Actually it should go through REGISTERED to 
GRANT to APPROVED pretty quick.

 

The cnMaestro CBRS support folks are actually very helpful.  I’ve even had them 
remote control my screen, fix things, and teach me how to do stuff.  The trick 
may be getting the ticket past Level 1 support and assigned to the right people.

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Kurt Fankhauser
Sent: Friday, July 24, 2020 10:53 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

 

ok thats what i thought, i did all that have two AP's that are showing up in 
Maestro but CBRS status is "UNREGISTERED", has been that way for 4 days, have a 
ticket in with cambium for the last 3 days and nothing so far.

 

On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 11:48 AM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

Y

Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Josh Luthman]

If all of them get bought I'm left with at minimum 80 MHz of GAA.  That's
the worst case scenario!  Before this I had 50 MHz in NN.

Now I'm not going to say I like the SAS requirement and especially after
Friday's issues showing what can happen when someone needed to plug their
coffee maker in, but any spectrum is a good asset.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 2:05 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Where it gets a little trickier is when you want to change parameters on a
> working system.  Like frequency, channel width, moving SM to a different
> AP, etc.  Cambium accommodates all of these with clever features, but it
> can be confusing to the operator if you don’t do it all the time.  Some of
> these you do from the device and the change just gets reflected in
> cnMaestro.
>
>
>
> CBRS isn’t simple.
>
>
>
> One other thing to get out of your brain is if you think the SAS hands out
> frequencies to GAA operators in a fashion that avoids interference.  You
> still have to do spectrum analysis and work around other operators just
> like unlicensed.  The SAS protects incumbents and PAL holders.  Other than
> that, it will happily give you a grant on 3555 even if another WISP is
> right next to you on 3555, at least that’s my understanding.
>
>
>
> I’m not looking forward to what happens if/when the cellcos buy up a bunch
> of PALs.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 12:42 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
> onboarding
>
>
>
> The GUI needs a bit of work, but otherwise it's ezpz.
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:49 AM Kurt Fankhauser 
> wrote:
>
> I got the AP "transmitting" now. Hooked a couple clients up. Cambium told
> me the GUI will be addressed in a future version of CNMaestro. It's fine
> now. I'm actually quite impressed with how well the grant process works
> with the 450 equipment.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:25 AM Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
>
> I was going to say this means you're all set, throw it up there and boot
> the sucker.
>
>
>
> Not sure how they're going to solve the GUI problem, but everyone seems to
> agree it's misleading.
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 12:03 AM Kurt Fankhauser 
> wrote:
>
> Yes this was taken care of quickly on friday by Evan. My first time
> talking to a level 3 engineer with Cambium and I will say these guys are
> AWESOME. The whole "un-registered" status in CnMaestro apparently
> doesn't mean what I thought it did. Hitting the "sync" button is what I
> needed to do. Thanks Matt for getting this ticket escalated.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 6:56 PM Matt Mangriotis via AF 
> wrote:
>
> I got Kurt… he should be sorted.
>
>
>
> (We don’t ignore tickets… sometimes the support guys get a bit overwhelmed
> and have to play catch-up, working to reduce that issue, especially with
> CBRS in light of the upcoming October death of Part 90!).
>
>
>
> Matt
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 4:17 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Subject:* [ External ] Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
> onboarding
>
>
>
> If Cambium support is ignoring your ticket, grab the email address of the
> guy sending out emails about the cnMaestro Cloud software update progress
> and send him a nice email asking for help.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Kurt Fankhauser
> *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 3:45 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding
>
>
>
> here is what i am seeing in CNMaestro as soon as i hit the start button it
> gives me an error says "already synced"
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 2:29 PM Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
>
> Unregistered means you didn't start the process.  Once is registered you
> have 3 days for the AP/SM to grab the grant.
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 12:33 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> Did you click the START button in Services>CBRS>Management Tool?  It
> shouldn’t take more than a minute or two.  Actually it should go through
> REGISTERED to GRANT to APPROVED pretty quick.
>
>
>
> The cnMaestro CBRS support folks are actually very helpful.  I’ve even had
> them remote control my screen, fix things, and teach me how to do stuff.
> The trick may be getting the ticket past Level 1 support and assigned to
> the right people.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Kurt Fankhauser
> *Sent:* Friday, July 24, 2020 10:53 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re

Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Ken Hohhof]

But I don’t think we’ve experienced yet what happens if we get kicked off a 
channel.  Right now in GAA, we can experience the telco firing up 80 MHz 
channels in GAA and causing interference, but our grant won’t be withdrawn.

 

But what if the telco has a couple PALs and submits a grant request, and the 
only way to accommodate their request is to repack and assign us a new 
frequency.  We can still get a channel, but it may be a different channel.  Is 
it like DFS or LBT and we automatically get moved to a different channel, or a 
narrower one, or whatever?  Maybe, but I don’t think so.  My guess is our grant 
just gets withdrawn, and within 5 minutes our customers are down, and we have 
to manually determine and submit a different grant request to get a new 
channel.  And we would need to quickly determine which channel to request 
because some could be occupied by other GAA users and there would be 
interference.

 

Or will it happen automagically and I’m being too pessimistic?  Not really sure 
how auto would work.  It seems like the SAS only approves or rejects grant 
requests, it doesn’t generate them on your behalf.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:12 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment 
onboarding

 

If all of them get bought I'm left with at minimum 80 MHz of GAA.  That's the 
worst case scenario!  Before this I had 50 MHz in NN.

 

Now I'm not going to say I like the SAS requirement and especially after 
Friday's issues showing what can happen when someone needed to plug their 
coffee maker in, but any spectrum is a good asset.

 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 2:05 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

Where it gets a little trickier is when you want to change parameters on a 
working system.  Like frequency, channel width, moving SM to a different AP, 
etc.  Cambium accommodates all of these with clever features, but it can be 
confusing to the operator if you don’t do it all the time.  Some of these you 
do from the device and the change just gets reflected in cnMaestro.

 

CBRS isn’t simple.

 

One other thing to get out of your brain is if you think the SAS hands out 
frequencies to GAA operators in a fashion that avoids interference.  You still 
have to do spectrum analysis and work around other operators just like 
unlicensed.  The SAS protects incumbents and PAL holders.  Other than that, it 
will happily give you a grant on 3555 even if another WISP is right next to you 
on 3555, at least that’s my understanding.

 

I’m not looking forward to what happens if/when the cellcos buy up a bunch of 
PALs.

 

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 12:42 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment 
onboarding

 

The GUI needs a bit of work, but otherwise it's ezpz.


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:49 AM Kurt Fankhauser mailto:lists.wavel...@gmail.com> > wrote:

I got the AP "transmitting" now. Hooked a couple clients up. Cambium told me 
the GUI will be addressed in a future version of CNMaestro. It's fine now. I'm 
actually quite impressed with how well the grant process works with the 450 
equipment.

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:25 AM Josh Luthman mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> > wrote:

I was going to say this means you're all set, throw it up there and boot the 
sucker.

 

Not sure how they're going to solve the GUI problem, but everyone seems to 
agree it's misleading.


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 12:03 AM Kurt Fankhauser mailto:lists.wavel...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Yes this was taken care of quickly on friday by Evan. My first time talking to 
a level 3 engineer with Cambium and I will say these guys are AWESOME. The 
whole "un-registered" status in CnMaestro apparently doesn't mean what I 
thought it did. Hitting the "sync" button is what I needed to do. Thanks Matt 
for getting this ticket escalated. 

 

On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 6:56 PM Matt Mangriotis via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > wrote:

I got Kurt… he should be sorted.

 

(We don’t ignore tickets… sometimes the support guys get a bit overwhelmed and 
have to play catch-up, working to reduce that issue, especially with CBRS in 
light of the upcoming October death of Part 90!).

 

Matt

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Friday, July 24, 2020 4:17 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: [ External ] Re: [AFMUG] Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

 

If Cambium supp

Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Josh Luthman]

Do you think the company that spend millions to operate in their PAL blocks
would be willing to operate in GAA at all?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:30 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> But I don’t think we’ve experienced yet what happens if we get kicked off
> a channel.  Right now in GAA, we can experience the telco firing up 80 MHz
> channels in GAA and causing interference, but our grant won’t be withdrawn.
>
>
>
> But what if the telco has a couple PALs and submits a grant request, and
> the only way to accommodate their request is to repack and assign us a new
> frequency.  We can still get a channel, but it may be a different channel.
> Is it like DFS or LBT and we automatically get moved to a different
> channel, or a narrower one, or whatever?  Maybe, but I don’t think so.  My
> guess is our grant just gets withdrawn, and within 5 minutes our customers
> are down, and we have to manually determine and submit a different grant
> request to get a new channel.  And we would need to quickly determine which
> channel to request because some could be occupied by other GAA users and
> there would be interference.
>
>
>
> Or will it happen automagically and I’m being too pessimistic?  Not really
> sure how auto would work.  It seems like the SAS only approves or rejects
> grant requests, it doesn’t generate them on your behalf.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 2:12 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
> onboarding
>
>
>
> If all of them get bought I'm left with at minimum 80 MHz of GAA.  That's
> the worst case scenario!  Before this I had 50 MHz in NN.
>
>
>
> Now I'm not going to say I like the SAS requirement and especially after
> Friday's issues showing what can happen when someone needed to plug their
> coffee maker in, but any spectrum is a good asset.
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 2:05 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> Where it gets a little trickier is when you want to change parameters on a
> working system.  Like frequency, channel width, moving SM to a different
> AP, etc.  Cambium accommodates all of these with clever features, but it
> can be confusing to the operator if you don’t do it all the time.  Some of
> these you do from the device and the change just gets reflected in
> cnMaestro.
>
>
>
> CBRS isn’t simple.
>
>
>
> One other thing to get out of your brain is if you think the SAS hands out
> frequencies to GAA operators in a fashion that avoids interference.  You
> still have to do spectrum analysis and work around other operators just
> like unlicensed.  The SAS protects incumbents and PAL holders.  Other than
> that, it will happily give you a grant on 3555 even if another WISP is
> right next to you on 3555, at least that’s my understanding.
>
>
>
> I’m not looking forward to what happens if/when the cellcos buy up a bunch
> of PALs.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 12:42 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
> onboarding
>
>
>
> The GUI needs a bit of work, but otherwise it's ezpz.
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:49 AM Kurt Fankhauser 
> wrote:
>
> I got the AP "transmitting" now. Hooked a couple clients up. Cambium told
> me the GUI will be addressed in a future version of CNMaestro. It's fine
> now. I'm actually quite impressed with how well the grant process works
> with the 450 equipment.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:25 AM Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
>
> I was going to say this means you're all set, throw it up there and boot
> the sucker.
>
>
>
> Not sure how they're going to solve the GUI problem, but everyone seems to
> agree it's misleading.
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 12:03 AM Kurt Fankhauser 
> wrote:
>
> Yes this was taken care of quickly on friday by Evan. My first time
> talking to a level 3 engineer with Cambium and I will say these guys are
> AWESOME. The whole "un-registered" status in CnMaestro apparently
> doesn't mean what I thought it did. Hitting the "sync" button is what I
> needed to do. Thanks Matt for getting this ticket escalated.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 6:56 PM Matt Mangriotis via AF 
> wrote:
>
> I got Kurt… he should be sorted.
>
>
>
> (We don’t ignore tickets… sometimes the support guys get a bit overwhelmed
> and have to play catch-up, working to reduce that issue, especially with
> CBRS in light of the upcoming October death of Part 90!).
>
>
>
> Matt
>
>

[AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

[Ken Hohhof]

I don't know why this is coming up now, maybe everybody thought the virus
would go away in a few months.  But I have churches either uploading their
worship services right afterward, or trying to live stream them, to Facebook
or YouTube.

 

Rural churches don't have tons of money, so they tend to be on our lowest
speed plan.  But even if I just upped their speed without increasing the
price, I don't think I can achieve what is in their mind, that the pastor
can upload the video from the church in 5 or 10 minutes after the service
and then go home.  Even on our highest wireless speed plan.  We have lots of
unused upstream bandwidth at the towers because of mostly licensed backhaul
links and symmetric bandwidth from upstream providers.  But the last mile
only has so much bandwidth because we set the down/up ratio typically to
75/25.

 

Has anyone faced this problem and solved it?

 

It seems to me some of the files are quite large.  Like 8 GB for an hour of
video.  And if they try to upload 2 or 3 of them simultaneously, the percent
completion advances so slowly they think it has stopped.

 

Does this mean they are recording in 1080p or god forbid 2160p, and maybe
60fps instead of 30 fps?  And then uploading the high res file, only perhaps
to have Facebook downconvert it?

 

Is there some video app they should be using to optimize the video before
uploading?  Preferably a free or cheap one?  And no an online converter,
because then you'd still have to upload the original file, right?

 

Or tell them yes your Internet is slow, take the laptop to somewhere with
cable or fiber and upload from there?  Even Comcast "gig speed" is only 35
Mbps upload.  Yes, that is potentially 15 times what we are giving them, but
still not fast enough to upload a 1 hour video in the blink of an eye.

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT: Details on the Starlink router

[Mike Hammett]

That does make sense that you need take rate when you are spending dollars per 
foot of network built. You've spent $1k to cross that lot, might as well get a 
customer hooked up at any price (assuming a comfortable ROI length). 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Mark Radabaugh"  
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"  
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2020 7:06:36 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Details on the Starlink router 

The fiber builds are targeting a different market than our fixed wireless. We 
have to build out fiber to our tower sites that are predominantly in small 
villages that have cable systems. The pricing and marketing is all aimed at 
competing with Spectrum and taking market share from them. I need the take rate 
more than I need the ARPU when we are competing with cable. 


Mark 





On Jul 16, 2020, at 12:16 AM, Darin Steffl < darin.ste...@mnwifi.com > wrote: 


Wouldn't you be better off selling one plan like Google? A gig for $70. Or at 
least get rid of the $50 plan. Do 50 Meg for $60 and gig for $70. That way it's 
almost a no brainer to go with the gig. 20x more speed for only $10 more!!! 


I bet your profit would be higher overall, even with slightly fewer customers. 
I don't think it's about the highest market share, but rather highest profit. 
We've been working on raising our ARPU for the wisp and we're over $82 right 
now. Yes we lose a handful of customers from price increases but we overall 
make more money since most don't cancel. Our customer count has increased every 
month since we started in 2012. Back then our arpu was about $54 and it's 
increased to $82 now. I've talked to wisps that are even higher in the triple 
digits. 


Any business not raising their prices when demand is this strong is leaving 
money on the table. This is totally dependent on competition I understand. For 
us, we try to be the most reliable with the best customer service. This allows 
us to sell a premium priced service compared to dsl and other wisps. Word of 
mouth from our existing customers drives our sales. 


On Wed, Jul 15, 2020, 7:35 PM Mark Radabaugh < m...@amplex.net > wrote: 









On Jul 15, 2020, at 6:55 PM, Ken Hohhof < af...@kwisp.com > wrote: 




So you’re selling 25M of bandwidth and 975M of bragging rights? 




Yep, exactly. And that’s all it is really. 








Gamers probably use the gig speed for awhile whenever a new gigantic game comes 
out. But that’s not like video streaming which I swear some people do 24x7. 




Once in a blue moon somebody manages to peg it out long enough to show up on a 
5 minute average. 


I found this interesting in that statistics: 


We offer 100Mb, 250Mb and GigE plans at $49.95, $59.95, and $79.95 

Of those plans 41% take the 100Mb plan, 38% select 250Mb, and 20% take the 
Gigabit plan. 


The typical distribution would be that the middle plan having the highest 
percentage - and it doesn't. To me that says that customers are seeing value 
and plenty of speed at 100Mb. A few guy who need bragging rights take the 
Gigabit plan. We thank them for the contribution to the retirement fund. 



Mark 

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Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Ken Hohhof]

I expect they’ll do both.

 

But are you planning to only use 3650-3700 because it’s dedicated GAA?  In 
3550-3650 I don’t think there’s dedicated GAA and PAL channels, and PAL 
licensed don’t come with assigned channels.  So the limit on number of PALs per 
county mean there would be at most 7 PALs in that 100 MHz, but I don’t think 
you can predict which channels would always be GAA, other than the old NN 50 
MHz.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment 
onboarding

 

Do you think the company that spend millions to operate in their PAL blocks 
would be willing to operate in GAA at all?


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:30 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

But I don’t think we’ve experienced yet what happens if we get kicked off a 
channel.  Right now in GAA, we can experience the telco firing up 80 MHz 
channels in GAA and causing interference, but our grant won’t be withdrawn.

 

But what if the telco has a couple PALs and submits a grant request, and the 
only way to accommodate their request is to repack and assign us a new 
frequency.  We can still get a channel, but it may be a different channel.  Is 
it like DFS or LBT and we automatically get moved to a different channel, or a 
narrower one, or whatever?  Maybe, but I don’t think so.  My guess is our grant 
just gets withdrawn, and within 5 minutes our customers are down, and we have 
to manually determine and submit a different grant request to get a new 
channel.  And we would need to quickly determine which channel to request 
because some could be occupied by other GAA users and there would be 
interference.

 

Or will it happen automagically and I’m being too pessimistic?  Not really sure 
how auto would work.  It seems like the SAS only approves or rejects grant 
requests, it doesn’t generate them on your behalf.

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:12 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment 
onboarding

 

If all of them get bought I'm left with at minimum 80 MHz of GAA.  That's the 
worst case scenario!  Before this I had 50 MHz in NN.

 

Now I'm not going to say I like the SAS requirement and especially after 
Friday's issues showing what can happen when someone needed to plug their 
coffee maker in, but any spectrum is a good asset.

 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 2:05 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

Where it gets a little trickier is when you want to change parameters on a 
working system.  Like frequency, channel width, moving SM to a different AP, 
etc.  Cambium accommodates all of these with clever features, but it can be 
confusing to the operator if you don’t do it all the time.  Some of these you 
do from the device and the change just gets reflected in cnMaestro.

 

CBRS isn’t simple.

 

One other thing to get out of your brain is if you think the SAS hands out 
frequencies to GAA operators in a fashion that avoids interference.  You still 
have to do spectrum analysis and work around other operators just like 
unlicensed.  The SAS protects incumbents and PAL holders.  Other than that, it 
will happily give you a grant on 3555 even if another WISP is right next to you 
on 3555, at least that’s my understanding.

 

I’m not looking forward to what happens if/when the cellcos buy up a bunch of 
PALs.

 

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 12:42 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment 
onboarding

 

The GUI needs a bit of work, but otherwise it's ezpz.


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:49 AM Kurt Fankhauser mailto:lists.wavel...@gmail.com> > wrote:

I got the AP "transmitting" now. Hooked a couple clients up. Cambium told me 
the GUI will be addressed in a future version of CNMaestro. It's fine now. I'm 
actually quite impressed with how well the grant process works with the 450 
equipment.

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:25 AM Josh Luthman mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> > wrote:

I was going to say this means you're all set, throw it up there and boot the 
sucker.

 

Not sure how they're going to solve the GUI problem, but everyone seems to 
agree it's misleading.


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 12:03 AM Kurt Fankhauser mailto:lists.wavel..

Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

[Josh Luthman]

Not a church customer, but someone that creates audiobooks or something
like that.  She was recording the video/audio uncompressed.  A 15 minute
video was like 8 GB and she was complaining it was taking hours to upload.
"But it was fast in Japan".

I told them to compress the video to a modern codec like x264 -
http://www.h264encoder.com/

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:56 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> I don’t know why this is coming up now, maybe everybody thought the virus
> would go away in a few months.  But I have churches either uploading their
> worship services right afterward, or trying to live stream them, to
> Facebook or YouTube.
>
>
>
> Rural churches don’t have tons of money, so they tend to be on our lowest
> speed plan.  But even if I just upped their speed without increasing the
> price, I don’t think I can achieve what is in their mind, that the pastor
> can upload the video from the church in 5 or 10 minutes after the service
> and then go home.  Even on our highest wireless speed plan.  We have lots
> of unused upstream bandwidth at the towers because of mostly licensed
> backhaul links and symmetric bandwidth from upstream providers.  But the
> last mile only has so much bandwidth because we set the down/up ratio
> typically to 75/25.
>
>
>
> Has anyone faced this problem and solved it?
>
>
>
> It seems to me some of the files are quite large.  Like 8 GB for an hour
> of video.  And if they try to upload 2 or 3 of them simultaneously, the
> percent completion advances so slowly they think it has stopped.
>
>
>
> Does this mean they are recording in 1080p or god forbid 2160p, and maybe
> 60fps instead of 30 fps?  And then uploading the high res file, only
> perhaps to have Facebook downconvert it?
>
>
>
> Is there some video app they should be using to optimize the video before
> uploading?  Preferably a free or cheap one?  And no an online converter,
> because then you’d still have to upload the original file, right?
>
>
>
> Or tell them yes your Internet is slow, take the laptop to somewhere with
> cable or fiber and upload from there?  Even Comcast “gig speed” is only 35
> Mbps upload.  Yes, that is potentially 15 times what we are giving them,
> but still not fast enough to upload a 1 hour video in the blink of an eye.
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Bill Prince]

  
  
This may only be an Android feature, and maybe only V10 and up
  (because I ain't going back), but the video recorder offers a
  couple of options when doing video. One is to do 30 fps instead f
  60 fps. The other is to use H.264.
I did have to do a short video the other day, and I think it
  offered me the option of lowering the resolution a bit. That said,
  a 10 second video still consumed 20 MB. I was trying to squeeze it
  down b/c the person I was doing it for asked me to email it. 20 MB
  in an email is still a push, so we ended up putting it in DropBox.



bp



On 7/27/2020 1:03 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:


  
  
  
  
I expect they’ll do both.
 
But are you planning to only use 3650-3700
  because it’s dedicated GAA?  In 3550-3650 I don’t think
  there’s dedicated GAA and PAL channels, and PAL licensed don’t
  come with assigned channels.  So the limit on number of PALs
  per county mean there would be at most 7 PALs in that 100 MHz,
  but I don’t think you can predict which channels would always
  be GAA, other than the old NN 50 MHz.
 

  From: AF
 On Behalf Of Josh
Luthman
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450
CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

 

  Do you think the company that spend
millions to operate in their PAL blocks would be willing to
operate in GAA at all?

  

  

   

Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373
  

  
   

 

  
On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:30 PM Ken
  Hohhof  wrote:
  
  

  
But
  I don’t think we’ve experienced yet what happens if we
  get kicked off a channel.  Right now in GAA, we can
  experience the telco firing up 80 MHz channels in GAA
  and causing interference, but our grant won’t be
  withdrawn.
 
But
  what if the telco has a couple PALs and submits a
  grant request, and the only way to accommodate their
  request is to repack and assign us a new frequency. 
  We can still get a channel, but it may be a different
  channel.  Is it like DFS or LBT and we automatically
  get moved to a different channel, or a narrower one,
  or whatever?  Maybe, but I don’t think so.  My guess
  is our grant just gets withdrawn, and within 5 minutes
  our customers are down, and we have to manually
  determine and submit a different grant request to get
  a new channel.  And we would need to quickly determine
  which channel to request because some could be
  occupied by other GAA users and there would be
  interference.
 
Or
  will it happen automagically and I’m being too
  pessimistic?  Not really sure how auto would work.  It
  seems like the SAS only approves or rejects grant
  requests, it doesn’t generate them on your behalf.
 

  From:
AF 
On Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:12 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium
450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

 

  If
all of them get bought I'm left with at minimum 80
MHz of GAA.  That's the worst case scenario!  Before
this I had 50 MHz in NN.
  
 
  
  
Now
  I'm not going to say I like the SAS requirement
  and especially after Friday's issues showing what
  can happen when someone needed to plug their
  coffee maker in, but any spectrum is a good asset.

  

  

Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

[Darin Steffl]

They're much better off live streaming it with at least 3 mbps upload speed
as it's transcoded by the device on the fly then. Live videos can still be
archived to watch later.

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020, 3:05 PM Josh Luthman 
wrote:

> Not a church customer, but someone that creates audiobooks or something
> like that.  She was recording the video/audio uncompressed.  A 15 minute
> video was like 8 GB and she was complaining it was taking hours to upload.
> "But it was fast in Japan".
>
> I told them to compress the video to a modern codec like x264 -
> http://www.h264encoder.com/
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:56 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>> I don’t know why this is coming up now, maybe everybody thought the virus
>> would go away in a few months.  But I have churches either uploading their
>> worship services right afterward, or trying to live stream them, to
>> Facebook or YouTube.
>>
>>
>>
>> Rural churches don’t have tons of money, so they tend to be on our lowest
>> speed plan.  But even if I just upped their speed without increasing the
>> price, I don’t think I can achieve what is in their mind, that the pastor
>> can upload the video from the church in 5 or 10 minutes after the service
>> and then go home.  Even on our highest wireless speed plan.  We have lots
>> of unused upstream bandwidth at the towers because of mostly licensed
>> backhaul links and symmetric bandwidth from upstream providers.  But the
>> last mile only has so much bandwidth because we set the down/up ratio
>> typically to 75/25.
>>
>>
>>
>> Has anyone faced this problem and solved it?
>>
>>
>>
>> It seems to me some of the files are quite large.  Like 8 GB for an hour
>> of video.  And if they try to upload 2 or 3 of them simultaneously, the
>> percent completion advances so slowly they think it has stopped.
>>
>>
>>
>> Does this mean they are recording in 1080p or god forbid 2160p, and maybe
>> 60fps instead of 30 fps?  And then uploading the high res file, only
>> perhaps to have Facebook downconvert it?
>>
>>
>>
>> Is there some video app they should be using to optimize the video before
>> uploading?  Preferably a free or cheap one?  And no an online converter,
>> because then you’d still have to upload the original file, right?
>>
>>
>>
>> Or tell them yes your Internet is slow, take the laptop to somewhere with
>> cable or fiber and upload from there?  Even Comcast “gig speed” is only 35
>> Mbps upload.  Yes, that is potentially 15 times what we are giving them,
>> but still not fast enough to upload a 1 hour video in the blink of an eye.
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Details on the Starlink router

[Carl Peterson]

I choose the cheapest one that includes cleaning the underbody.  In MN that
is generally what we're there for.

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 2:58 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> That does make sense that you need take rate when you are spending dollars
> per foot of network built. You've spent $1k to cross that lot, might as
> well get a customer hooked up at any price (assuming a comfortable ROI
> length).
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Mark Radabaugh" 
> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> *Sent: *Thursday, July 16, 2020 7:06:36 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] OT: Details on the Starlink router
>
> The fiber builds are targeting a different market than our fixed wireless.
>   We have to build out fiber to our tower sites that are predominantly in
> small villages that have cable systems.   The pricing and marketing is all
> aimed at competing with Spectrum and taking market share from them.  I need
> the take rate more than I need the ARPU when we are competing with cable.
>
> Mark
>
> On Jul 16, 2020, at 12:16 AM, Darin Steffl 
> wrote:
>
> Wouldn't you be better off selling one plan like Google? A gig for $70. Or
> at least get rid of the $50 plan. Do 50 Meg for $60 and gig for $70. That
> way it's almost a no brainer to go with the gig. 20x more speed for only
> $10 more!!!
>
> I bet your profit would be higher overall, even with slightly fewer
> customers. I don't think it's about the highest market share, but rather
> highest profit. We've been working on raising our ARPU for the wisp and
> we're over $82 right now. Yes we lose a handful of customers from price
> increases but we overall make more money since most don't cancel. Our
> customer count has increased every month since we started in 2012. Back
> then our arpu was about $54 and it's increased to $82 now. I've talked to
> wisps that are even higher in the triple digits.
>
> Any business not raising their prices when demand is this strong is
> leaving money on the table. This is totally dependent on competition I
> understand. For us, we try to be the most reliable with the best customer
> service. This allows us to sell a premium priced service compared to dsl
> and other wisps. Word of mouth from our existing customers drives our
> sales.
>
> On Wed, Jul 15, 2020, 7:35 PM Mark Radabaugh  wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On Jul 15, 2020, at 6:55 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>
>> So you’re selling 25M of bandwidth and 975M of bragging rights?
>>
>>
>> Yep, exactly.   And that’s all it is really.
>>
>>
>> Gamers probably use the gig speed for awhile whenever a new gigantic game
>> comes out.  But that’s not like video streaming which I swear some people
>> do 24x7.
>>
>>
>> Once in a blue moon somebody manages to peg it out long enough to show up
>> on a 5 minute average.
>>
>> I found this interesting in that statistics:
>>
>> We offer 100Mb, 250Mb and GigE plans at $49.95, $59.95, and $79.95
>>
>> Of those plans 41% take the 100Mb plan, 38% select 250Mb, and 20% take
>> the Gigabit plan.
>>
>> The  typical distribution would be that the middle plan having the
>> highest percentage - and it doesn't.   To me that says that customers are
>> seeing value and plenty of speed at 100Mb.   A few guy who need bragging
>> rights take the Gigabit plan.   We thank them for the contribution to the
>> retirement fund.
>>
>> Mark
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
> --
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

[Jaime Solorza]

I have a church using two Ubiquiti 900Mhz radios for remote cameras and
Internet feed on balcony.  They have one camera covering altar /pulpit area
and mics feed from their mixer.
Not sure what software and equipment they use but they do live feed ...
It's been up for two years.
It looks like the equipment we had for live feeding contentious board
meetings when I worked at TISD...I can't remember the name.



On Mon, Jul 27, 2020, 1:56 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> I don’t know why this is coming up now, maybe everybody thought the virus
> would go away in a few months.  But I have churches either uploading their
> worship services right afterward, or trying to live stream them, to
> Facebook or YouTube.
>
>
>
> Rural churches don’t have tons of money, so they tend to be on our lowest
> speed plan.  But even if I just upped their speed without increasing the
> price, I don’t think I can achieve what is in their mind, that the pastor
> can upload the video from the church in 5 or 10 minutes after the service
> and then go home.  Even on our highest wireless speed plan.  We have lots
> of unused upstream bandwidth at the towers because of mostly licensed
> backhaul links and symmetric bandwidth from upstream providers.  But the
> last mile only has so much bandwidth because we set the down/up ratio
> typically to 75/25.
>
>
>
> Has anyone faced this problem and solved it?
>
>
>
> It seems to me some of the files are quite large.  Like 8 GB for an hour
> of video.  And if they try to upload 2 or 3 of them simultaneously, the
> percent completion advances so slowly they think it has stopped.
>
>
>
> Does this mean they are recording in 1080p or god forbid 2160p, and maybe
> 60fps instead of 30 fps?  And then uploading the high res file, only
> perhaps to have Facebook downconvert it?
>
>
>
> Is there some video app they should be using to optimize the video before
> uploading?  Preferably a free or cheap one?  And no an online converter,
> because then you’d still have to upload the original file, right?
>
>
>
> Or tell them yes your Internet is slow, take the laptop to somewhere with
> cable or fiber and upload from there?  Even Comcast “gig speed” is only 35
> Mbps upload.  Yes, that is potentially 15 times what we are giving them,
> but still not fast enough to upload a 1 hour video in the blink of an eye.
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

[Matt Hoppes]

We stream live all Sunday to YouTube on 3 megabits. Works fine. 

Uploading - just start it and walk away. 

> On Jul 27, 2020, at 4:18 PM, Jaime Solorza  wrote:
> 
> 
> I have a church using two Ubiquiti 900Mhz radios for remote cameras and 
> Internet feed on balcony.  They have one camera covering altar /pulpit area 
> and mics feed from their mixer.
> Not sure what software and equipment they use but they do live feed ...
> It's been up for two years.
> It looks like the equipment we had for live feeding contentious board 
> meetings when I worked at TISD...I can't remember the name.
> 
> 
> 
>> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020, 1:56 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>> I don’t know why this is coming up now, maybe everybody thought the virus 
>> would go away in a few months.  But I have churches either uploading their 
>> worship services right afterward, or trying to live stream them, to Facebook 
>> or YouTube.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Rural churches don’t have tons of money, so they tend to be on our lowest 
>> speed plan.  But even if I just upped their speed without increasing the 
>> price, I don’t think I can achieve what is in their mind, that the pastor 
>> can upload the video from the church in 5 or 10 minutes after the service 
>> and then go home.  Even on our highest wireless speed plan.  We have lots of 
>> unused upstream bandwidth at the towers because of mostly licensed backhaul 
>> links and symmetric bandwidth from upstream providers.  But the last mile 
>> only has so much bandwidth because we set the down/up ratio typically to 
>> 75/25.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Has anyone faced this problem and solved it?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> It seems to me some of the files are quite large.  Like 8 GB for an hour of 
>> video.  And if they try to upload 2 or 3 of them simultaneously, the percent 
>> completion advances so slowly they think it has stopped.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Does this mean they are recording in 1080p or god forbid 2160p, and maybe 
>> 60fps instead of 30 fps?  And then uploading the high res file, only perhaps 
>> to have Facebook downconvert it?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Is there some video app they should be using to optimize the video before 
>> uploading?  Preferably a free or cheap one?  And no an online converter, 
>> because then you’d still have to upload the original file, right?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Or tell them yes your Internet is slow, take the laptop to somewhere with 
>> cable or fiber and upload from there?  Even Comcast “gig speed” is only 35 
>> Mbps upload.  Yes, that is potentially 15 times what we are giving them, but 
>> still not fast enough to upload a 1 hour video in the blink of an eye.
>> 
>> -- 
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

[chuck]

Yep, same here.  
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYEHT0mwCfo

Works great.  

From: Matt Hoppes 
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:30 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

We stream live all Sunday to YouTube on 3 megabits. Works fine. 

Uploading - just start it and walk away. 


  On Jul 27, 2020, at 4:18 PM, Jaime Solorza  wrote:


   
  I have a church using two Ubiquiti 900Mhz radios for remote cameras and 
Internet feed on balcony.  They have one camera covering altar /pulpit area and 
mics feed from their mixer. 
  Not sure what software and equipment they use but they do live feed ...
  It's been up for two years.
  It looks like the equipment we had for live feeding contentious board 
meetings when I worked at TISD...I can't remember the name.



  On Mon, Jul 27, 2020, 1:56 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

I don’t know why this is coming up now, maybe everybody thought the virus 
would go away in a few months.  But I have churches either uploading their 
worship services right afterward, or trying to live stream them, to Facebook or 
YouTube.



Rural churches don’t have tons of money, so they tend to be on our lowest 
speed plan.  But even if I just upped their speed without increasing the price, 
I don’t think I can achieve what is in their mind, that the pastor can upload 
the video from the church in 5 or 10 minutes after the service and then go 
home.  Even on our highest wireless speed plan.  We have lots of unused 
upstream bandwidth at the towers because of mostly licensed backhaul links and 
symmetric bandwidth from upstream providers.  But the last mile only has so 
much bandwidth because we set the down/up ratio typically to 75/25.



Has anyone faced this problem and solved it?



It seems to me some of the files are quite large.  Like 8 GB for an hour of 
video.  And if they try to upload 2 or 3 of them simultaneously, the percent 
completion advances so slowly they think it has stopped.



Does this mean they are recording in 1080p or god forbid 2160p, and maybe 
60fps instead of 30 fps?  And then uploading the high res file, only perhaps to 
have Facebook downconvert it?



Is there some video app they should be using to optimize the video before 
uploading?  Preferably a free or cheap one?  And no an online converter, 
because then you’d still have to upload the original file, right?



Or tell them yes your Internet is slow, take the laptop to somewhere with 
cable or fiber and upload from there?  Even Comcast “gig speed” is only 35 Mbps 
upload.  Yes, that is potentially 15 times what we are giving them, but still 
not fast enough to upload a 1 hour video in the blink of an eye.

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Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

[chuck]

Yep, same here.  
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYEHT0mwCfo

Works great.  

From: Matt Hoppes 
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:30 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

We stream live all Sunday to YouTube on 3 megabits. Works fine. 

Uploading - just start it and walk away. 


  On Jul 27, 2020, at 4:18 PM, Jaime Solorza  wrote:


   
  I have a church using two Ubiquiti 900Mhz radios for remote cameras and 
Internet feed on balcony.  They have one camera covering altar /pulpit area and 
mics feed from their mixer. 
  Not sure what software and equipment they use but they do live feed ...
  It's been up for two years.
  It looks like the equipment we had for live feeding contentious board 
meetings when I worked at TISD...I can't remember the name.



  On Mon, Jul 27, 2020, 1:56 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

I don’t know why this is coming up now, maybe everybody thought the virus 
would go away in a few months.  But I have churches either uploading their 
worship services right afterward, or trying to live stream them, to Facebook or 
YouTube.



Rural churches don’t have tons of money, so they tend to be on our lowest 
speed plan.  But even if I just upped their speed without increasing the price, 
I don’t think I can achieve what is in their mind, that the pastor can upload 
the video from the church in 5 or 10 minutes after the service and then go 
home.  Even on our highest wireless speed plan.  We have lots of unused 
upstream bandwidth at the towers because of mostly licensed backhaul links and 
symmetric bandwidth from upstream providers.  But the last mile only has so 
much bandwidth because we set the down/up ratio typically to 75/25.



Has anyone faced this problem and solved it?



It seems to me some of the files are quite large.  Like 8 GB for an hour of 
video.  And if they try to upload 2 or 3 of them simultaneously, the percent 
completion advances so slowly they think it has stopped.



Does this mean they are recording in 1080p or god forbid 2160p, and maybe 
60fps instead of 30 fps?  And then uploading the high res file, only perhaps to 
have Facebook downconvert it?



Is there some video app they should be using to optimize the video before 
uploading?  Preferably a free or cheap one?  And no an online converter, 
because then you’d still have to upload the original file, right?



Or tell them yes your Internet is slow, take the laptop to somewhere with 
cable or fiber and upload from there?  Even Comcast “gig speed” is only 35 Mbps 
upload.  Yes, that is potentially 15 times what we are giving them, but still 
not fast enough to upload a 1 hour video in the blink of an eye.

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  AF@af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

[chuck]

Yep, same here.  
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYEHT0mwCfo

Works great.  

From: Matt Hoppes 
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:30 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

We stream live all Sunday to YouTube on 3 megabits. Works fine. 

Uploading - just start it and walk away. 


  On Jul 27, 2020, at 4:18 PM, Jaime Solorza  wrote:


   
  I have a church using two Ubiquiti 900Mhz radios for remote cameras and 
Internet feed on balcony.  They have one camera covering altar /pulpit area and 
mics feed from their mixer. 
  Not sure what software and equipment they use but they do live feed ...
  It's been up for two years.
  It looks like the equipment we had for live feeding contentious board 
meetings when I worked at TISD...I can't remember the name.



  On Mon, Jul 27, 2020, 1:56 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

I don’t know why this is coming up now, maybe everybody thought the virus 
would go away in a few months.  But I have churches either uploading their 
worship services right afterward, or trying to live stream them, to Facebook or 
YouTube.



Rural churches don’t have tons of money, so they tend to be on our lowest 
speed plan.  But even if I just upped their speed without increasing the price, 
I don’t think I can achieve what is in their mind, that the pastor can upload 
the video from the church in 5 or 10 minutes after the service and then go 
home.  Even on our highest wireless speed plan.  We have lots of unused 
upstream bandwidth at the towers because of mostly licensed backhaul links and 
symmetric bandwidth from upstream providers.  But the last mile only has so 
much bandwidth because we set the down/up ratio typically to 75/25.



Has anyone faced this problem and solved it?



It seems to me some of the files are quite large.  Like 8 GB for an hour of 
video.  And if they try to upload 2 or 3 of them simultaneously, the percent 
completion advances so slowly they think it has stopped.



Does this mean they are recording in 1080p or god forbid 2160p, and maybe 
60fps instead of 30 fps?  And then uploading the high res file, only perhaps to 
have Facebook downconvert it?



Is there some video app they should be using to optimize the video before 
uploading?  Preferably a free or cheap one?  And no an online converter, 
because then you’d still have to upload the original file, right?



Or tell them yes your Internet is slow, take the laptop to somewhere with 
cable or fiber and upload from there?  Even Comcast “gig speed” is only 35 Mbps 
upload.  Yes, that is potentially 15 times what we are giving them, but still 
not fast enough to upload a 1 hour video in the blink of an eye.

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http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

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  AF@af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

[Ken Hohhof]

>From what you and Darrin are both saying, live streaming would actually be 
>better.  At least with YouTube.  I’d have to check if that’s an option with 
>Facebook.

 

I don’t think they are typically doing this from a phone.  More like an actual 
camera like you’d use to record a school play, probably connected to a laptop 
and then to the Internet.

 

I can give a church a somewhat higher upload speed than the tier they are 
paying for.  I can’t give them 100 Mbps upload so they can transfer a 1080p 
video in a minute.  In that case, it’s not the money, it’s I just can’t do it 
without putting in a dedicated link to the tower for them.  Or they could drive 
to the tower and plug into the tower router.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 3:30 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

 

We stream live all Sunday to YouTube on 3 megabits. Works fine. 

 

Uploading - just start it and walk away. 





On Jul 27, 2020, at 4:18 PM, Jaime Solorza mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com> > wrote:



I have a church using two Ubiquiti 900Mhz radios for remote cameras and 
Internet feed on balcony.  They have one camera covering altar /pulpit area and 
mics feed from their mixer.

Not sure what software and equipment they use but they do live feed ...

It's been up for two years.

It looks like the equipment we had for live feeding contentious board meetings 
when I worked at TISD...I can't remember the name.

 

 

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020, 1:56 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

I don’t know why this is coming up now, maybe everybody thought the virus would 
go away in a few months.  But I have churches either uploading their worship 
services right afterward, or trying to live stream them, to Facebook or YouTube.

 

Rural churches don’t have tons of money, so they tend to be on our lowest speed 
plan.  But even if I just upped their speed without increasing the price, I 
don’t think I can achieve what is in their mind, that the pastor can upload the 
video from the church in 5 or 10 minutes after the service and then go home.  
Even on our highest wireless speed plan.  We have lots of unused upstream 
bandwidth at the towers because of mostly licensed backhaul links and symmetric 
bandwidth from upstream providers.  But the last mile only has so much 
bandwidth because we set the down/up ratio typically to 75/25.

 

Has anyone faced this problem and solved it?

 

It seems to me some of the files are quite large.  Like 8 GB for an hour of 
video.  And if they try to upload 2 or 3 of them simultaneously, the percent 
completion advances so slowly they think it has stopped.

 

Does this mean they are recording in 1080p or god forbid 2160p, and maybe 60fps 
instead of 30 fps?  And then uploading the high res file, only perhaps to have 
Facebook downconvert it?

 

Is there some video app they should be using to optimize the video before 
uploading?  Preferably a free or cheap one?  And no an online converter, 
because then you’d still have to upload the original file, right?

 

Or tell them yes your Internet is slow, take the laptop to somewhere with cable 
or fiber and upload from there?  Even Comcast “gig speed” is only 35 Mbps 
upload.  Yes, that is potentially 15 times what we are giving them, but still 
not fast enough to upload a 1 hour video in the blink of an eye.

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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Details on the Starlink router

[Ken Hohhof]

Huh?  Wrong thread?  That sounds like a car wash decision.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Carl Peterson
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 3:13 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Details on the Starlink router

 

I choose the cheapest one that includes cleaning the underbody.  In MN that is 
generally what we're there for.  

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 2:58 PM Mike Hammett mailto:af...@ics-il.net> > wrote:

That does make sense that you need take rate when you are spending dollars per 
foot of network built. You've spent $1k to cross that lot, might as well get a 
customer hooked up at any price (assuming a comfortable ROI length).



-
Mike Hammett
  Intelligent Computing Solutions
   
  
  
 
  Midwest Internet Exchange
   
  
 
  The Brothers WISP
   
 





  _  


From: "Mark Radabaugh" mailto:m...@amplex.net> >
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Sent: Thursday, July 16, 2020 7:06:36 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Details on the Starlink router

The fiber builds are targeting a different market than our fixed wireless.   We 
have to build out fiber to our tower sites that are predominantly in small 
villages that have cable systems.   The pricing and marketing is all aimed at 
competing with Spectrum and taking market share from them.  I need the take 
rate more than I need the ARPU when we are competing with cable.

 

Mark 

 

On Jul 16, 2020, at 12:16 AM, Darin Steffl mailto:darin.ste...@mnwifi.com> > wrote:

 

Wouldn't you be better off selling one plan like Google? A gig for $70. Or at 
least get rid of the $50 plan. Do 50 Meg for $60 and gig for $70. That way it's 
almost a no brainer to go with the gig. 20x more speed for only $10 more!!! 

 

I bet your profit would be higher overall, even with slightly fewer customers. 
I don't think it's about the highest market share, but rather highest profit. 
We've been working on raising our ARPU for the wisp and we're over $82 right 
now. Yes we lose a handful of customers from price increases but we overall 
make more money since most don't cancel. Our customer count has increased every 
month since we started in 2012. Back then our arpu was about $54 and it's 
increased to $82 now. I've talked to wisps that are even higher in the triple 
digits. 

 

Any business not raising their prices when demand is this strong is leaving 
money on the table. This is totally dependent on competition I understand. For 
us, we try to be the most reliable with the best customer service. This allows 
us to sell a premium priced service compared to dsl and other wisps. Word of 
mouth from our existing customers drives our sales. 

 

On Wed, Jul 15, 2020, 7:35 PM Mark Radabaugh mailto:m...@amplex.net> > wrote:

 

 

On Jul 15, 2020, at 6:55 PM, Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

 

So you’re selling 25M of bandwidth and 975M of bragging rights?

 

Yep, exactly.   And that’s all it is really.

 

 

Gamers probably use the gig speed for awhile whenever a new gigantic game comes 
out.  But that’s not like video streaming which I swear some people do 24x7.

 

Once in a blue moon somebody manages to peg it out long enough to show up on a 
5 minute average.

 

I found this interesting in that statistics:

 

We offer 100Mb, 250Mb and GigE plans at $49.95, $59.95, and $79.95

Of those plans 41% take the 100Mb plan, 38% select 250Mb, and 20% take the 
Gigabit plan.

 

The  typical distribution would be that the middle plan having the highest 
percentage - and it doesn't.   To me that says that customers are seeing value 
and plenty of speed at 100Mb.   A few guy who need bragging rights take the 
Gigabit plan.   We thank them for the contribution to the retirement fund.

 

Mark

 

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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Details on the Starlink router

[Carl Peterson]

whoops

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:59 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Huh?  Wrong thread?  That sounds like a car wash decision.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Carl Peterson
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 3:13 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Details on the Starlink router
>
>
>
> I choose the cheapest one that includes cleaning the underbody.  In MN
> that is generally what we're there for.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 2:58 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:
>
> That does make sense that you need take rate when you are spending dollars
> per foot of network built. You've spent $1k to cross that lot, might as
> well get a customer hooked up at any price (assuming a comfortable ROI
> length).
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
>
> *From: *"Mark Radabaugh" 
> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> *Sent: *Thursday, July 16, 2020 7:06:36 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] OT: Details on the Starlink router
>
> The fiber builds are targeting a different market than our fixed wireless.
>   We have to build out fiber to our tower sites that are predominantly in
> small villages that have cable systems.   The pricing and marketing is all
> aimed at competing with Spectrum and taking market share from them.  I need
> the take rate more than I need the ARPU when we are competing with cable.
>
>
>
> Mark
>
>
>
> On Jul 16, 2020, at 12:16 AM, Darin Steffl 
> wrote:
>
>
>
> Wouldn't you be better off selling one plan like Google? A gig for $70. Or
> at least get rid of the $50 plan. Do 50 Meg for $60 and gig for $70. That
> way it's almost a no brainer to go with the gig. 20x more speed for only
> $10 more!!!
>
>
>
> I bet your profit would be higher overall, even with slightly fewer
> customers. I don't think it's about the highest market share, but rather
> highest profit. We've been working on raising our ARPU for the wisp and
> we're over $82 right now. Yes we lose a handful of customers from price
> increases but we overall make more money since most don't cancel. Our
> customer count has increased every month since we started in 2012. Back
> then our arpu was about $54 and it's increased to $82 now. I've talked to
> wisps that are even higher in the triple digits.
>
>
>
> Any business not raising their prices when demand is this strong is
> leaving money on the table. This is totally dependent on competition I
> understand. For us, we try to be the most reliable with the best customer
> service. This allows us to sell a premium priced service compared to dsl
> and other wisps. Word of mouth from our existing customers drives our
> sales.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jul 15, 2020, 7:35 PM Mark Radabaugh  wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jul 15, 2020, at 6:55 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>
>
> So you’re selling 25M of bandwidth and 975M of bragging rights?
>
>
>
> Yep, exactly.   And that’s all it is really.
>
>
>
>
>
> Gamers probably use the gig speed for awhile whenever a new gigantic game
> comes out.  But that’s not like video streaming which I swear some people
> do 24x7.
>
>
>
> Once in a blue moon somebody manages to peg it out long enough to show up
> on a 5 minute average.
>
>
>
> I found this interesting in that statistics:
>
>
>
> We offer 100Mb, 250Mb and GigE plans at $49.95, $59.95, and $79.95
>
> Of those plans 41% take the 100Mb plan, 38% select 250Mb, and 20% take the
> Gigabit plan.
>
>
>
> The  typical distribution would be that the middle plan having the highest
> percentage - and it doesn't.   To me that says that customers are seeing
> value and plenty of speed at 100Mb.   A few guy who need bragging rights
> take the Gigabit plan.   We thank them for the contribution to the
> retirement fund.
>
>
>
> Mark
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
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>
>
>
>
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>
>
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

[Darin Steffl]

Youtube should be used over Facebook. Anyone with a browser can view
youtube without an account but to watch on Facebook, you need an account
which turns some people off.

If possible, just give them 3-5 Mbps upload and tell them to live stream on
Youtube. They can still use a dedicated camera plugged into a laptop to
stream it instead of using a crappy webcam. This gives people what they
want which is live video plus it's saved for future viewing. And no long
uploads to wait for because it's compressed on the go.

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:57 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> From what you and Darrin are both saying, live streaming would actually be
> better.  At least with YouTube.  I’d have to check if that’s an option with
> Facebook.
>
>
>
> I don’t think they are typically doing this from a phone.  More like an
> actual camera like you’d use to record a school play, probably connected to
> a laptop and then to the Internet.
>
>
>
> I can give a church a somewhat higher upload speed than the tier they are
> paying for.  I can’t give them 100 Mbps upload so they can transfer a 1080p
> video in a minute.  In that case, it’s not the money, it’s I just can’t do
> it without putting in a dedicated link to the tower for them.  Or they
> could drive to the tower and plug into the tower router.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Matt Hoppes
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 3:30 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services
>
>
>
> We stream live all Sunday to YouTube on 3 megabits. Works fine.
>
>
>
> Uploading - just start it and walk away.
>
>
>
> On Jul 27, 2020, at 4:18 PM, Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
> 
>
> I have a church using two Ubiquiti 900Mhz radios for remote cameras and
> Internet feed on balcony.  They have one camera covering altar /pulpit area
> and mics feed from their mixer.
>
> Not sure what software and equipment they use but they do live feed ...
>
> It's been up for two years.
>
> It looks like the equipment we had for live feeding contentious board
> meetings when I worked at TISD...I can't remember the name.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020, 1:56 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> I don’t know why this is coming up now, maybe everybody thought the virus
> would go away in a few months.  But I have churches either uploading their
> worship services right afterward, or trying to live stream them, to
> Facebook or YouTube.
>
>
>
> Rural churches don’t have tons of money, so they tend to be on our lowest
> speed plan.  But even if I just upped their speed without increasing the
> price, I don’t think I can achieve what is in their mind, that the pastor
> can upload the video from the church in 5 or 10 minutes after the service
> and then go home.  Even on our highest wireless speed plan.  We have lots
> of unused upstream bandwidth at the towers because of mostly licensed
> backhaul links and symmetric bandwidth from upstream providers.  But the
> last mile only has so much bandwidth because we set the down/up ratio
> typically to 75/25.
>
>
>
> Has anyone faced this problem and solved it?
>
>
>
> It seems to me some of the files are quite large.  Like 8 GB for an hour
> of video.  And if they try to upload 2 or 3 of them simultaneously, the
> percent completion advances so slowly they think it has stopped.
>
>
>
> Does this mean they are recording in 1080p or god forbid 2160p, and maybe
> 60fps instead of 30 fps?  And then uploading the high res file, only
> perhaps to have Facebook downconvert it?
>
>
>
> Is there some video app they should be using to optimize the video before
> uploading?  Preferably a free or cheap one?  And no an online converter,
> because then you’d still have to upload the original file, right?
>
>
>
> Or tell them yes your Internet is slow, take the laptop to somewhere with
> cable or fiber and upload from there?  Even Comcast “gig speed” is only 35
> Mbps upload.  Yes, that is potentially 15 times what we are giving them,
> but still not fast enough to upload a 1 hour video in the blink of an eye.
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


-- 
Darin Steffl
Minnesota WiFi
www.mnwifi.com
507-634-WiFi
 Like us on Facebook

-- 
AF mailing list
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http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Josh Luthman]

Wrong thread dude

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 4:11 PM Bill Prince  wrote:

> This may only be an Android feature, and maybe only V10 and up (because I
> ain't going back), but the video recorder offers a couple of options when
> doing video. One is to do 30 fps instead f 60 fps. The other is to use
> H.264.
>
> I did have to do a short video the other day, and I think it offered me
> the option of lowering the resolution a bit. That said, a 10 second video
> still consumed 20 MB. I was trying to squeeze it down b/c the person I was
> doing it for asked me to email it. 20 MB in an email is still a push, so we
> ended up putting it in DropBox.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
>
> On 7/27/2020 1:03 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>
> I expect they’ll do both.
>
>
>
> But are you planning to only use 3650-3700 because it’s dedicated GAA?  In
> 3550-3650 I don’t think there’s dedicated GAA and PAL channels, and PAL
> licensed don’t come with assigned channels.  So the limit on number of PALs
> per county mean there would be at most 7 PALs in that 100 MHz, but I don’t
> think you can predict which channels would always be GAA, other than the
> old NN 50 MHz.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF   *On Behalf
> Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 2:53 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group  
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
> onboarding
>
>
>
> Do you think the company that spend millions to operate in their PAL
> blocks would be willing to operate in GAA at all?
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:30 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> But I don’t think we’ve experienced yet what happens if we get kicked off
> a channel.  Right now in GAA, we can experience the telco firing up 80 MHz
> channels in GAA and causing interference, but our grant won’t be withdrawn.
>
>
>
> But what if the telco has a couple PALs and submits a grant request, and
> the only way to accommodate their request is to repack and assign us a new
> frequency.  We can still get a channel, but it may be a different channel.
> Is it like DFS or LBT and we automatically get moved to a different
> channel, or a narrower one, or whatever?  Maybe, but I don’t think so.  My
> guess is our grant just gets withdrawn, and within 5 minutes our customers
> are down, and we have to manually determine and submit a different grant
> request to get a new channel.  And we would need to quickly determine which
> channel to request because some could be occupied by other GAA users and
> there would be interference.
>
>
>
> Or will it happen automagically and I’m being too pessimistic?  Not really
> sure how auto would work.  It seems like the SAS only approves or rejects
> grant requests, it doesn’t generate them on your behalf.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 2:12 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
> onboarding
>
>
>
> If all of them get bought I'm left with at minimum 80 MHz of GAA.  That's
> the worst case scenario!  Before this I had 50 MHz in NN.
>
>
>
> Now I'm not going to say I like the SAS requirement and especially after
> Friday's issues showing what can happen when someone needed to plug their
> coffee maker in, but any spectrum is a good asset.
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 2:05 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> Where it gets a little trickier is when you want to change parameters on a
> working system.  Like frequency, channel width, moving SM to a different
> AP, etc.  Cambium accommodates all of these with clever features, but it
> can be confusing to the operator if you don’t do it all the time.  Some of
> these you do from the device and the change just gets reflected in
> cnMaestro.
>
>
>
> CBRS isn’t simple.
>
>
>
> One other thing to get out of your brain is if you think the SAS hands out
> frequencies to GAA operators in a fashion that avoids interference.  You
> still have to do spectrum analysis and work around other operators just
> like unlicensed.  The SAS protects incumbents and PAL holders.  Other than
> that, it will happily give you a grant on 3555 even if another WISP is
> right next to you on 3555, at least that’s my understanding.
>
>
>
> I’m not looking forward to what happens if/when the cellcos buy up a bunch
> of PALs.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 12:42 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
> onboarding
>
>
>
> The GUI needs a bit of work, but otherwise it's ezpz.
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St

Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Josh Luthman]

Well I'm not limiting myself to that 50 MHz first off.  Secondly, I don't
know what the PAL frequencies will be but I'd obviously prefer to avoid
those.  Right now everything is wide open according to Google's SAS...

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 4:04 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> I expect they’ll do both.
>
>
>
> But are you planning to only use 3650-3700 because it’s dedicated GAA?  In
> 3550-3650 I don’t think there’s dedicated GAA and PAL channels, and PAL
> licensed don’t come with assigned channels.  So the limit on number of PALs
> per county mean there would be at most 7 PALs in that 100 MHz, but I don’t
> think you can predict which channels would always be GAA, other than the
> old NN 50 MHz.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 2:53 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
> onboarding
>
>
>
> Do you think the company that spend millions to operate in their PAL
> blocks would be willing to operate in GAA at all?
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:30 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> But I don’t think we’ve experienced yet what happens if we get kicked off
> a channel.  Right now in GAA, we can experience the telco firing up 80 MHz
> channels in GAA and causing interference, but our grant won’t be withdrawn.
>
>
>
> But what if the telco has a couple PALs and submits a grant request, and
> the only way to accommodate their request is to repack and assign us a new
> frequency.  We can still get a channel, but it may be a different channel.
> Is it like DFS or LBT and we automatically get moved to a different
> channel, or a narrower one, or whatever?  Maybe, but I don’t think so.  My
> guess is our grant just gets withdrawn, and within 5 minutes our customers
> are down, and we have to manually determine and submit a different grant
> request to get a new channel.  And we would need to quickly determine which
> channel to request because some could be occupied by other GAA users and
> there would be interference.
>
>
>
> Or will it happen automagically and I’m being too pessimistic?  Not really
> sure how auto would work.  It seems like the SAS only approves or rejects
> grant requests, it doesn’t generate them on your behalf.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 2:12 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
> onboarding
>
>
>
> If all of them get bought I'm left with at minimum 80 MHz of GAA.  That's
> the worst case scenario!  Before this I had 50 MHz in NN.
>
>
>
> Now I'm not going to say I like the SAS requirement and especially after
> Friday's issues showing what can happen when someone needed to plug their
> coffee maker in, but any spectrum is a good asset.
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 2:05 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> Where it gets a little trickier is when you want to change parameters on a
> working system.  Like frequency, channel width, moving SM to a different
> AP, etc.  Cambium accommodates all of these with clever features, but it
> can be confusing to the operator if you don’t do it all the time.  Some of
> these you do from the device and the change just gets reflected in
> cnMaestro.
>
>
>
> CBRS isn’t simple.
>
>
>
> One other thing to get out of your brain is if you think the SAS hands out
> frequencies to GAA operators in a fashion that avoids interference.  You
> still have to do spectrum analysis and work around other operators just
> like unlicensed.  The SAS protects incumbents and PAL holders.  Other than
> that, it will happily give you a grant on 3555 even if another WISP is
> right next to you on 3555, at least that’s my understanding.
>
>
>
> I’m not looking forward to what happens if/when the cellcos buy up a bunch
> of PALs.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 12:42 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
> onboarding
>
>
>
> The GUI needs a bit of work, but otherwise it's ezpz.
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:49 AM Kurt Fankhauser 
> wrote:
>
> I got the AP "transmitting" now. Hooked a couple clients up. Cambium told
> me the GUI will be addressed in a future version of CNMaestro. It's fine
> now. I'm actually quite impressed with how well the grant process works
> with the 450 equipment.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:25 AM Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
>
> I was going to say t

Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Got the repeat setting on your send button set too high?


bp



On 7/27/2020 1:37 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com
  wrote:


  
  

  Yep, same here.  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYEHT0mwCfo
   
  Works great.  
  

   
  
From: Matt Hoppes 
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:30 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users
Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or
  live streaming services
  

 
  
  
We stream live all Sunday to YouTube on 3
  megabits. Works fine. 
 
Uploading - just start it and walk away. 

  On Jul 27, 2020, at 4:18 PM, Jaime
Solorza  wrote:

  


  
I have a church using two Ubiquiti 900Mhz radios
  for remote cameras and Internet feed on balcony.  They
  have one camera covering altar /pulpit area and mics
  feed from their mixer.
  Not sure what software and equipment they use but
they do live feed ...
  It's been up for two years.
  It looks like the equipment we had for live
feeding contentious board meetings when I worked at
TISD...I can't remember the name.
   
   

 

  On Mon, Jul 27,
2020, 1:56 PM Ken Hohhof 
wrote:
  
  

  
I don’t know why this is
  coming up now, maybe everybody thought the
  virus would go away in a few months.  But I
  have churches either uploading their worship
  services right afterward, or trying to live
  stream them, to Facebook or YouTube.
 
Rural churches don’t have
  tons of money, so they tend to be on our
  lowest speed plan.  But even if I just upped
  their speed without increasing the price, I
  don’t think I can achieve what is in their
  mind, that the pastor can upload the video
  from the church in 5 or 10 minutes after the
  service and then go home.  Even on our highest
  wireless speed plan.  We have lots of unused
  upstream bandwidth at the towers because of
  mostly licensed backhaul links and symmetric
  bandwidth from upstream providers.  But the
  last mile only has so much bandwidth because
  we set the down/up ratio typically to 75/25.
 
Has anyone faced this
  problem and solved it?
 
It seems to me some of the
  files are quite large.  Like 8 GB for an hour
  of video.  And if they try to upload 2 or 3 of
  them simultaneously, the percent completion
  advances so slowly they think it has stopped.
 
Does this mean they are
  recording in 1080p or god forbid 2160p, and
  maybe 60fps instead of 30 fps?  And then
  uploading the high res file, only perhaps to
  have Facebook downconvert it?
 
Is there some video app
  they should be using to optimize the video
  before uploading?  Preferably a free or cheap
  one?  And no an online converter, because then
  you’d still have to upload the original file,
  right?
 
Or tell them yes your
  Internet is slow, take the laptop to somewhere
  with cable or fiber and upload from there? 
  Even Comcast “gig speed” is only 35 Mbps
  upload.  Yes, that is potentially 15 times
  what we are giving them, but still not fast
  enough to upload a 1 hour video in the blink
  

Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Bill Prince]

  
  
How did that happen?!?


bp



On 7/27/2020 2:25 PM, Josh Luthman
  wrote:


  
  Wrong thread dude

  

  
  
  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373
  


  
  
  
On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 4:11
  PM Bill Prince  wrote:


  
This may only be an Android feature, and maybe only V10
  and up (because I ain't going back), but the video
  recorder offers a couple of options when doing video. One
  is to do 30 fps instead f 60 fps. The other is to use
  H.264.
I did have to do a short video the other day, and I think
  it offered me the option of lowering the resolution a bit.
  That said, a 10 second video still consumed 20 MB. I was
  trying to squeeze it down b/c the person I was doing it
  for asked me to email it. 20 MB in an email is still a
  push, so we ended up putting it in DropBox.



bp



On 7/27/2020 1:03 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:


  
I expect they’ll do both.
 
But are you planning to only use
  3650-3700 because it’s dedicated GAA?  In 3550-3650 I
  don’t think there’s dedicated GAA and PAL channels,
  and PAL licensed don’t come with assigned channels. 
  So the limit on number of PALs per county mean there
  would be at most 7 PALs in that 100 MHz, but I don’t
  think you can predict which channels would always be
  GAA, other than the old NN 50 MHz.
 

  From: AF 
On Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium
450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

 

  Do you think the company that
spend millions to operate in their PAL blocks
would be willing to operate in GAA at all?
  
  

  

   

Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373
  

  
   

 

  
On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:30 PM
  Ken Hohhof 
  wrote:
  
  

  
But I don’t think we’ve
  experienced yet what happens if we get kicked
  off a channel.  Right now in GAA, we can
  experience the telco firing up 80 MHz channels
  in GAA and causing interference, but our grant
  won’t be withdrawn.
 
But what if the telco has a
  couple PALs and submits a grant request, and
  the only way to accommodate their request is
  to repack and assign us a new frequency.  We
  can still get a channel, but it may be a
  different channel.  Is it like DFS or LBT and
  we automatically get moved to a different
  channel, or a narrower one, or whatever? 
  Maybe, but I don’t think so.  My guess is our
  grant just gets withdrawn, and within 5
  minutes our customers are down, and we have to
  manually determine and submit a different
  grant request to get a new channel.  And we
  would need to quickly determine which channel
  to request because some could be occupied by
  other GAA users and there would be
  interference.
 
Or will it happen
  automagically 

Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Ken Hohhof]

I made that mistake also when we first went live with CBRS.  I was so happy to 
see all channels available.  Then someone pointed out that is only because 
there are no incumbents or PALs, and the SAS doesn’t protect GAA.  Obviously 
there are no PALs yet because the auction hasn’t taken place.

 

There won’t be specific frequencies assigned to PAL holders except on a 
grant-by-grant basis.  But once they get a grant, no GAA user can get a grant 
in that PAL protection area on the same channel.  That tells me a GAA user 
could get kicked off a channel because a PAL holder got a grant and now is 
being protected.  You could move to another channel, but I fear that will be a 
manual process.  Customers go down, WISP scrambles to find another clear 
channel, CPI enters data for new grant request.

 

I’d like to think the SAS would send a request to the domain proxy (cnMaestro) 
please move the following sector to new frequency XYZ, but I doubt that’s how 
it works.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 4:26 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment 
onboarding

 

Well I'm not limiting myself to that 50 MHz first off.  Secondly, I don't know 
what the PAL frequencies will be but I'd obviously prefer to avoid those.  
Right now everything is wide open according to Google's SAS...


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 4:04 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

I expect they’ll do both.

 

But are you planning to only use 3650-3700 because it’s dedicated GAA?  In 
3550-3650 I don’t think there’s dedicated GAA and PAL channels, and PAL 
licensed don’t come with assigned channels.  So the limit on number of PALs per 
county mean there would be at most 7 PALs in that 100 MHz, but I don’t think 
you can predict which channels would always be GAA, other than the old NN 50 
MHz.

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment 
onboarding

 

Do you think the company that spend millions to operate in their PAL blocks 
would be willing to operate in GAA at all?


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:30 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

But I don’t think we’ve experienced yet what happens if we get kicked off a 
channel.  Right now in GAA, we can experience the telco firing up 80 MHz 
channels in GAA and causing interference, but our grant won’t be withdrawn.

 

But what if the telco has a couple PALs and submits a grant request, and the 
only way to accommodate their request is to repack and assign us a new 
frequency.  We can still get a channel, but it may be a different channel.  Is 
it like DFS or LBT and we automatically get moved to a different channel, or a 
narrower one, or whatever?  Maybe, but I don’t think so.  My guess is our grant 
just gets withdrawn, and within 5 minutes our customers are down, and we have 
to manually determine and submit a different grant request to get a new 
channel.  And we would need to quickly determine which channel to request 
because some could be occupied by other GAA users and there would be 
interference.

 

Or will it happen automagically and I’m being too pessimistic?  Not really sure 
how auto would work.  It seems like the SAS only approves or rejects grant 
requests, it doesn’t generate them on your behalf.

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:12 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment 
onboarding

 

If all of them get bought I'm left with at minimum 80 MHz of GAA.  That's the 
worst case scenario!  Before this I had 50 MHz in NN.

 

Now I'm not going to say I like the SAS requirement and especially after 
Friday's issues showing what can happen when someone needed to plug their 
coffee maker in, but any spectrum is a good asset.

 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 2:05 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

Where it gets a little trickier is when you want to change parameters on a 
working system.  Like frequency, channel width, moving SM to a different AP, 
etc.  Cambium accommodates all of these with clever features, but it can be 
confusing to the operator if you don’t do it all the time.  Some of these you 
do from the device and the change just gets reflected in cnMaestro.

 

CBRS isn’t simple.

 

One other thing to get out of your brain is if you think the SAS hands out 
frequencies to GAA operat

[AFMUG] Auction results so far

[Mark Radabaugh]

https://auctiondata.fcc.gov/public/projects/auction105 


Not sure what the fascination with Calhoun County, IA is.

Mark-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Auction results so far

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Central location and relatively flat terrain. With enough power,
  they can cover the whole country.


bp



On 7/27/2020 3:42 PM, Mark Radabaugh
  wrote:


  
  https://auctiondata.fcc.gov/public/projects/auction105
  
  
  Not sure what the fascination with Calhoun County,
IA is.
  
  
  Mark
  
  

  


-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Auction results so far

[Jaime Solorza]

I heard it I heard I I heard it on the X

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020, 4:48 PM Bill Prince  wrote:

> Central location and relatively flat terrain. With enough power, they can
> cover the whole country.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
>
> On 7/27/2020 3:42 PM, Mark Radabaugh wrote:
>
> https://auctiondata.fcc.gov/public/projects/auction105
>
> Not sure what the fascination with Calhoun County, IA is.
>
> Mark
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Auction results so far

[Seth Mattinen]

On 7/27/20 15:42, Mark Radabaugh wrote:

https://auctiondata.fcc.gov/public/projects/auction105




I'm curious to see how many WISPs actually get a PAL when this is all done.

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Re: [AFMUG] Auction results so far

[Mark Radabaugh]

Aggregate demand of 38 licenses?   That’s at least 10 bidders fighting over one 
county.

I’m guessing it’s just bidders playing games.Pick a county with a lot of 
demand and pile on.   It’s a safe place to park a bid that you know you can get 
out of.

Going to suck if it’s a county you actually want though.   Price just keeps 
going up while the big boys play games.

Mark



> On Jul 27, 2020, at 6:48 PM, Bill Prince  wrote:
> 
> Central location and relatively flat terrain. With enough power, they can 
> cover the whole country.
> 
> 
> 
> bp
> 
> 
> On 7/27/2020 3:42 PM, Mark Radabaugh wrote:
>> https://auctiondata.fcc.gov/public/projects/auction105 
>> 
>> 
>> Not sure what the fascination with Calhoun County, IA is.
>> 
>> Mark
>> 
>> 
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

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Re: [AFMUG] Auction results so far

[Gino A. Villarini]

Nice dashboard

https://sashajavid.com/FCC_Auction105.php?



Gino Villarini
Founder/President
@gvillarini
t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
[https://mcusercontent.com/491678685aaddc31e08616413/images/756812e5-24a6-4693-a923-7a1d8f55546d.png]
[https://image.ibb.co/noQeyp/inc500.png] 
  
[https://image.ibb.co/e4pBB9/fb-logo.png]  
[https://image.ibb.co/nxuuW9/insta-logo.png] 
   
[https://image.ibb.co/jhSEW9/in-logo.png] 
 
[https://image.ibb.co/dqqq4U/tw-logo.png] 

[https://image.ibb.co/bAJcjU/yt-logo.png] 

[https://mcusercontent.com/491678685aaddc31e08616413/images/663fa299-7512-404f-ab00-6f8d11d8a417.png]
www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 
Guaynabo, PR 00968
From: AF  on behalf of Mark Radabaugh 
Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Date: Monday, July 27, 2020 at 6:57 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Auction results so far

Aggregate demand of 38 licenses?   That’s at least 10 bidders fighting over one 
county.

I’m guessing it’s just bidders playing games.Pick a county with a lot of 
demand and pile on.   It’s a safe place to park a bid that you know you can get 
out of.

Going to suck if it’s a county you actually want though.   Price just keeps 
going up while the big boys play games.

Mark



On Jul 27, 2020, at 6:48 PM, Bill Prince 
mailto:part15...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Central location and relatively flat terrain. With enough power, they can cover 
the whole country.


bp




On 7/27/2020 3:42 PM, Mark Radabaugh wrote:
https://auctiondata.fcc.gov/public/projects/auction105

Not sure what the fascination with Calhoun County, IA is.

Mark


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Re: [AFMUG] Auction results so far

[Dave]

My guess is none...

Im sooo sick of the BS games the FCC and 'BIG BOYZ' Are playing.

So funny how they say "Sure anyone can get a pal"

FCC should have shoved a big FU to all WISPs and just let us die.

When I first saw the pricing on our county and surrounding countys for 
bid I knew there was no chance.


Let the lawsuits FLY...


On 7/27/2020 5:51 PM, Seth Mattinen wrote:

On 7/27/20 15:42, Mark Radabaugh wrote:

https://auctiondata.fcc.gov/public/projects/auction105




I'm curious to see how many WISPs actually get a PAL when this is all 
done.




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Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Dave]

I have my whole network of 45 Aps a mix of medusa -450 over to CBRS and 
it was challenge for sure.


I am very happy with the outcome but not too sure on the future of some 
APs in the metro are where we heavily overlap with ATT and Verizon.


Already had to coordinate to get out of their way and us them. We did 
this manually.


I have done anything you can think of working with the sas and the 
management portal.


I think the Phase2 is going to be interesting.


On 7/27/2020 5:35 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:


I made that mistake also when we first went live with CBRS.  I was so 
happy to see all channels available.  Then someone pointed out that is 
only because there are no incumbents or PALs, and the SAS doesn’t 
protect GAA.  Obviously there are no PALs yet because the auction 
hasn’t taken place.


There won’t be specific frequencies assigned to PAL holders except on 
a grant-by-grant basis.  But once they get a grant, no GAA user can 
get a grant in that PAL protection area on the same channel.  That 
tells me a GAA user could get kicked off a channel because a PAL 
holder got a grant and now is being protected.  You could move to 
another channel, but I fear that will be a manual process.  Customers 
go down, WISP scrambles to find another clear channel, CPI enters data 
for new grant request.


I’d like to think the SAS would send a request to the domain proxy 
(cnMaestro) please move the following sector to new frequency XYZ, but 
I doubt that’s how it works.


*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
*Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 4:26 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS 
equipment onboarding


Well I'm not limiting myself to that 50 MHz first off.  Secondly, I 
don't know what the PAL frequencies will be but I'd obviously prefer 
to avoid those.  Right now everything is wide open according to 
Google's SAS...


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 4:04 PM Ken Hohhof > wrote:


I expect they’ll do both.

But are you planning to only use 3650-3700 because it’s dedicated
GAA?  In 3550-3650 I don’t think there’s dedicated GAA and PAL
channels, and PAL licensed don’t come with assigned channels.  So
the limit on number of PALs per county mean there would be at most
7 PALs in that 100 MHz, but I don’t think you can predict which
channels would always be GAA, other than the old NN 50 MHz.

*From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
*Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 2:53 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS
equipment onboarding

Do you think the company that spend millions to operate in their
PAL blocks would be willing to operate in GAA at all?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:30 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com>> wrote:

But I don’t think we’ve experienced yet what happens if we get
kicked off a channel.  Right now in GAA, we can experience the
telco firing up 80 MHz channels in GAA and causing
interference, but our grant won’t be withdrawn.

But what if the telco has a couple PALs and submits a grant
request, and the only way to accommodate their request is to
repack and assign us a new frequency.  We can still get a
channel, but it may be a different channel. Is it like DFS or
LBT and we automatically get moved to a different channel, or
a narrower one, or whatever?  Maybe, but I don’t think so.  My
guess is our grant just gets withdrawn, and within 5 minutes
our customers are down, and we have to manually determine and
submit a different grant request to get a new channel.  And we
would need to quickly determine which channel to request
because some could be occupied by other GAA users and there
would be interference.

Or will it happen automagically and I’m being too
pessimistic?  Not really sure how auto would work.  It seems
like the SAS only approves or rejects grant requests, it
doesn’t generate them on your behalf.

*From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
*Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 2:12 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS
equipment onboarding

If all of them get bought I'm left with at minimum 80 MHz of
GAA.  That's the worst case scenario!  Before this I had 50
MHz in NN.

Now I'm not going to say I like the SAS requirement and
especially after Friday's issues showing wh

Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Jon Langeler]

You coordinated with ATT and Verizon or local WISPs?

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


> On Jul 27, 2020, at 11:02 PM, Dave  wrote:
> 
> 
> I have my whole network of 45 Aps a mix of medusa -450 over to CBRS and it 
> was challenge for sure. 
> 
> I am very happy with the outcome but not too sure on the future of some APs 
> in the metro are where we heavily overlap with ATT and Verizon.
> 
> Already had to coordinate to get out of their way and us them. We did this 
> manually. 
> 
> I have done anything you can think of working with the sas and the management 
> portal. 
> 
> I think the Phase2 is going to be interesting. 
> 
> 
> 
>> On 7/27/2020 5:35 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>> I made that mistake also when we first went live with CBRS.  I was so happy 
>> to see all channels available.  Then someone pointed out that is only 
>> because there are no incumbents or PALs, and the SAS doesn’t protect GAA.  
>> Obviously there are no PALs yet because the auction hasn’t taken place.
>>  
>> There won’t be specific frequencies assigned to PAL holders except on a 
>> grant-by-grant basis.  But once they get a grant, no GAA user can get a 
>> grant in that PAL protection area on the same channel.  That tells me a GAA 
>> user could get kicked off a channel because a PAL holder got a grant and now 
>> is being protected.  You could move to another channel, but I fear that will 
>> be a manual process.  Customers go down, WISP scrambles to find another 
>> clear channel, CPI enters data for new grant request.
>>  
>> I’d like to think the SAS would send a request to the domain proxy 
>> (cnMaestro) please move the following sector to new frequency XYZ, but I 
>> doubt that’s how it works.
>>  
>> From: AF  On Behalf Of Josh Luthman
>> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 4:26 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment 
>> onboarding
>>  
>> Well I'm not limiting myself to that 50 MHz first off.  Secondly, I don't 
>> know what the PAL frequencies will be but I'd obviously prefer to avoid 
>> those.  Right now everything is wide open according to Google's SAS...
>>  
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>  
>>  
>> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 4:04 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>> I expect they’ll do both.
>>  
>> But are you planning to only use 3650-3700 because it’s dedicated GAA?  In 
>> 3550-3650 I don’t think there’s dedicated GAA and PAL channels, and PAL 
>> licensed don’t come with assigned channels.  So the limit on number of PALs 
>> per county mean there would be at most 7 PALs in that 100 MHz, but I don’t 
>> think you can predict which channels would always be GAA, other than the old 
>> NN 50 MHz.
>>  
>> From: AF  On Behalf Of Josh Luthman
>> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:53 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment 
>> onboarding
>>  
>> Do you think the company that spend millions to operate in their PAL blocks 
>> would be willing to operate in GAA at all?
>>  
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>  
>>  
>> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:30 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>> But I don’t think we’ve experienced yet what happens if we get kicked off a 
>> channel.  Right now in GAA, we can experience the telco firing up 80 MHz 
>> channels in GAA and causing interference, but our grant won’t be withdrawn.
>>  
>> But what if the telco has a couple PALs and submits a grant request, and the 
>> only way to accommodate their request is to repack and assign us a new 
>> frequency.  We can still get a channel, but it may be a different channel.  
>> Is it like DFS or LBT and we automatically get moved to a different channel, 
>> or a narrower one, or whatever?  Maybe, but I don’t think so.  My guess is 
>> our grant just gets withdrawn, and within 5 minutes our customers are down, 
>> and we have to manually determine and submit a different grant request to 
>> get a new channel.  And we would need to quickly determine which channel to 
>> request because some could be occupied by other GAA users and there would be 
>> interference.
>>  
>> Or will it happen automagically and I’m being too pessimistic?  Not really 
>> sure how auto would work.  It seems like the SAS only approves or rejects 
>> grant requests, it doesn’t generate them on your behalf.
>>  
>> From: AF  On Behalf Of Josh Luthman
>> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2020 2:12 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment 
>> onboarding
>>  
>> If all of them get bought I'm left with at minimum 80 MHz of GAA.  That's 
>> the worst case scenario!  Before this I had 50 MHz in NN.
>>  
>> Now I'm not going to say I like the SAS requirement and especially after 
>> Friday's issues showing what can happen when s

Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment onboarding

[Steve Jones]

I wish GAA would go to some sort of light PAL, with the higher EIRP and mix
of 450 and LTE its going to be a mess. I havent gotten a SAS administrator
yet, but im hoping one of the commercial competitive feature sets is rf
visualization so we can at least be able to see who is doing what and gain
some competitor contacts for mitigation. I went live with a 450 on 10mhz
right in between 2 20mhz channels of somebody elses according to the SA the
other day, and theyre fairly hot 20s, in the -70s. Would be nice if GAA was
just restricted overlaps to 10mhz if SAS sees a conflict. with some
mechanism for two CPIs to waive the restriction.
I really hope moving forward that any spectrum released by the FCC is SAS
managed. the wild west of radio is no good. there was a comment in WISP
talk the other day about 5ghz where the guy says he just overpowers his
competitors. People are naturally going to be dicks and irresponsible with
spectrum so we need the SAS adult in the room moving forward any time the
FCC gives us something they could otherwise monetize the hell out of.

also, does CBRS require cloud or on prem cnmaestro, or either?

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 10:26 PM Jon Langeler 
wrote:

> You coordinated with ATT and Verizon or local WISPs?
>
> Jon Langeler
> Michwave Technologies, Inc.
>
>
> On Jul 27, 2020, at 11:02 PM, Dave  wrote:
>
> 
>
> I have my whole network of 45 Aps a mix of medusa -450 over to CBRS and it
> was challenge for sure.
>
> I am very happy with the outcome but not too sure on the future of some
> APs in the metro are where we heavily overlap with ATT and Verizon.
>
> Already had to coordinate to get out of their way and us them. We did this
> manually.
>
> I have done anything you can think of working with the sas and the
> management portal.
>
> I think the Phase2 is going to be interesting.
>
>
> On 7/27/2020 5:35 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>
> I made that mistake also when we first went live with CBRS.  I was so
> happy to see all channels available.  Then someone pointed out that is only
> because there are no incumbents or PALs, and the SAS doesn’t protect GAA.
> Obviously there are no PALs yet because the auction hasn’t taken place.
>
>
>
> There won’t be specific frequencies assigned to PAL holders except on a
> grant-by-grant basis.  But once they get a grant, no GAA user can get a
> grant in that PAL protection area on the same channel.  That tells me a GAA
> user could get kicked off a channel because a PAL holder got a grant and
> now is being protected.  You could move to another channel, but I fear that
> will be a manual process.  Customers go down, WISP scrambles to find
> another clear channel, CPI enters data for new grant request.
>
>
>
> I’d like to think the SAS would send a request to the domain proxy
> (cnMaestro) please move the following sector to new frequency XYZ, but I
> doubt that’s how it works.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF   *On Behalf
> Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 4:26 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group  
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
> onboarding
>
>
>
> Well I'm not limiting myself to that 50 MHz first off.  Secondly, I don't
> know what the PAL frequencies will be but I'd obviously prefer to avoid
> those.  Right now everything is wide open according to Google's SAS...
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 4:04 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> I expect they’ll do both.
>
>
>
> But are you planning to only use 3650-3700 because it’s dedicated GAA?  In
> 3550-3650 I don’t think there’s dedicated GAA and PAL channels, and PAL
> licensed don’t come with assigned channels.  So the limit on number of PALs
> per county mean there would be at most 7 PALs in that 100 MHz, but I don’t
> think you can predict which channels would always be GAA, other than the
> old NN 50 MHz.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 2:53 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] [ External ] Re: Cambium 450 CBRS / SAS equipment
> onboarding
>
>
>
> Do you think the company that spend millions to operate in their PAL
> blocks would be willing to operate in GAA at all?
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 3:30 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> But I don’t think we’ve experienced yet what happens if we get kicked off
> a channel.  Right now in GAA, we can experience the telco firing up 80 MHz
> channels in GAA and causing interference, but our grant won’t be withdrawn.
>
>
>
> But what if the telco has a couple PALs and submits a grant request, and
> the only way to accommodate their request is to repack and assign us a new
> frequency.  We can still get a channel, but it may be a different channel.
> Is it like DFS or LBT and we automatically get moved to a d

Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services

[Steve Jones]

The first thing we recommend to churches is they shut off their wifi during
the service, its amazing how much of the live stream issues go away with
only the stream present on their connection. We also stress that we
arent even going to start troubleshooting if theyre planning on any really
high resolution stream on a free connection. we give free/discounted
service to churches. We also recommend nothing other than youtube, it seems
the most problem free streaming service. I think facebook is doing their
spying in the background

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 4:34 PM Bill Prince  wrote:

> Got the repeat setting on your send button set too high?
>
>
> bp
> 
>
>
> On 7/27/2020 1:37 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
> Yep, same here.
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYEHT0mwCfo
>
> Works great.
>
> *From:* Matt Hoppes
> *Sent:* Monday, July 27, 2020 2:30 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] churches uploading or live streaming services
>
> We stream live all Sunday to YouTube on 3 megabits. Works fine.
>
> Uploading - just start it and walk away.
>
> On Jul 27, 2020, at 4:18 PM, Jaime Solorza 
>  wrote:
>
> 
> I have a church using two Ubiquiti 900Mhz radios for remote cameras and
> Internet feed on balcony.  They have one camera covering altar /pulpit area
> and mics feed from their mixer.
> Not sure what software and equipment they use but they do live feed ...
> It's been up for two years.
> It looks like the equipment we had for live feeding contentious board
> meetings when I worked at TISD...I can't remember the name.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020, 1:56 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>> I don’t know why this is coming up now, maybe everybody thought the virus
>> would go away in a few months.  But I have churches either uploading their
>> worship services right afterward, or trying to live stream them, to
>> Facebook or YouTube.
>>
>>
>>
>> Rural churches don’t have tons of money, so they tend to be on our lowest
>> speed plan.  But even if I just upped their speed without increasing the
>> price, I don’t think I can achieve what is in their mind, that the pastor
>> can upload the video from the church in 5 or 10 minutes after the service
>> and then go home.  Even on our highest wireless speed plan.  We have lots
>> of unused upstream bandwidth at the towers because of mostly licensed
>> backhaul links and symmetric bandwidth from upstream providers.  But the
>> last mile only has so much bandwidth because we set the down/up ratio
>> typically to 75/25.
>>
>>
>>
>> Has anyone faced this problem and solved it?
>>
>>
>>
>> It seems to me some of the files are quite large.  Like 8 GB for an hour
>> of video.  And if they try to upload 2 or 3 of them simultaneously, the
>> percent completion advances so slowly they think it has stopped.
>>
>>
>>
>> Does this mean they are recording in 1080p or god forbid 2160p, and maybe
>> 60fps instead of 30 fps?  And then uploading the high res file, only
>> perhaps to have Facebook downconvert it?
>>
>>
>>
>> Is there some video app they should be using to optimize the video before
>> uploading?  Preferably a free or cheap one?  And no an online converter,
>> because then you’d still have to upload the original file, right?
>>
>>
>>
>> Or tell them yes your Internet is slow, take the laptop to somewhere with
>> cable or fiber and upload from there?  Even Comcast “gig speed” is only 35
>> Mbps upload.  Yes, that is potentially 15 times what we are giving them,
>> but still not fast enough to upload a 1 hour video in the blink of an eye.
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] Auction results so far

[Steve Jones]

Our starting bid was relatively inexpensive over the ten year term for our
5 counties and 4 pals each. Almost had the boss talked into giving it
serious consideration so i could pull the trigger on the auction. then the
world ended and that got back burnered. byt the time we came back to it
there was no time to learn enough about the auction

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:54 PM Dave  wrote:

> My guess is none...
>
> Im sooo sick of the BS games the FCC and 'BIG BOYZ' Are playing.
>
> So funny how they say "Sure anyone can get a pal"
>
> FCC should have shoved a big FU to all WISPs and just let us die.
>
> When I first saw the pricing on our county and surrounding countys for
> bid I knew there was no chance.
>
> Let the lawsuits FLY...
>
>
> On 7/27/2020 5:51 PM, Seth Mattinen wrote:
> > On 7/27/20 15:42, Mark Radabaugh wrote:
> >> https://auctiondata.fcc.gov/public/projects/auction105
> >>
> >
> >
> > I'm curious to see how many WISPs actually get a PAL when this is all
> > done.
> >
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
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Re: [AFMUG] Auction results so far

[Steve Jones]

What happens if there are unbid PALs?

On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 11:40 PM Steve Jones 
wrote:

> Our starting bid was relatively inexpensive over the ten year term for our
> 5 counties and 4 pals each. Almost had the boss talked into giving it
> serious consideration so i could pull the trigger on the auction. then the
> world ended and that got back burnered. byt the time we came back to it
> there was no time to learn enough about the auction
>
> On Mon, Jul 27, 2020 at 9:54 PM Dave  wrote:
>
>> My guess is none...
>>
>> Im sooo sick of the BS games the FCC and 'BIG BOYZ' Are playing.
>>
>> So funny how they say "Sure anyone can get a pal"
>>
>> FCC should have shoved a big FU to all WISPs and just let us die.
>>
>> When I first saw the pricing on our county and surrounding countys for
>> bid I knew there was no chance.
>>
>> Let the lawsuits FLY...
>>
>>
>> On 7/27/2020 5:51 PM, Seth Mattinen wrote:
>> > On 7/27/20 15:42, Mark Radabaugh wrote:
>> >> https://auctiondata.fcc.gov/public/projects/auction105
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> > I'm curious to see how many WISPs actually get a PAL when this is all
>> > done.
>> >
>>
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>
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