On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 8:24 PM Matthew Sacks <matt...@matthewsacks.com> wrote:
> If you think there’s snark in my reply, you’ve misinterpreted it as I’m > dead serious. Instead of letting personal opinions on awards because of > what sounds like a bad personal experience indicates to me the real > benefit if the proposal was missed, and why put down an idea that promotes > pride in one's work? > he gave you reasons why. I wonder if you could try to rephrase what you have understood him to say? I sense a disconnect that this might be helpful for. > That is not the ASF I know. > The ASF I know is board members personally showing me around when I had a > very uninteresting project that turned into a podling. > > It helps encourage involvement in contributions to open source, the whole > point of the badge. > > Also, his assessment was completely based on personal opinion, nothing to > do with benefit or no benefit to the ASF. His assessment happens to align with modern motivation theory afaict. > > Putting down good ideas is more damaging to focus soon than me asking for > real facts when presented with personal convictions. He’s not putting down a good idea so much as assessing the goodness of an idea. What you offered was an idea - not necessarily a *good* idea, that it seems is still being considered. > > > Thanks for the etiquette suggestion. > > Regardless of your suggestions, on etiquette, It seems the majority is in > favor. > > So now we vote? Do what you want but I’d encourage you to let the world turn a couple more times first. Responding to Dave and others response about using metrics other than our typical roles instead reminds me of a Dilbert cartoon:) https://dilbert.com/strip/1995-11-13 Thanks —tim > > > On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 4:58 PM Craig Russell <apache....@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Hi Matthew, > > > > Your message makes me think you did not get past Daniel's first eight > > words. > > > > If you read the message, he gives a few reasons to dislike badges. > > > > Your snarky response is not a good example of healthy community > discussion. > > > > Craig > > > > > On Apr 5, 2021, at 4:14 PM, Matthew Sacks <matt...@matthewsacks.com> > > wrote: > > > > > > Thanks for your input. > > > > > > “I don’t like it” is your only reason? > > > > > > Perhaps we should get rid of the corporate thank you page? > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 1:47 PM Daniel Ferradal <dferra...@apache.org> > > wrote: > > > > > >> Hello, > > >> > > >> In my humble opinion, I don't like labels, medals, awards, bands, > > >> distinctions, badges, ribbons, stars, trophies or anything similar > > >> that distinguish anyone from any other. As I see it, it's a form of > > >> manipulation to persuade people to achieve more than they might want > > >> and may probably lead to people feeling better than others or just the > > >> opposite, which is worse. > > >> > > >> ASF being what it is, all volunteers doing whatever they can or want, > > >> time, life, family or will permits, but a necessary few that work > > >> professionally to maintain operation, I don't like the idea of using > > >> this kind of "corporate encouragement". > > >> > > >> I understand the idea behind this is probably well meant, but that > > >> does not make me like it anyway. > > >> > > >> Cheers. > > >> > > >> El lun, 5 abr 2021 a las 18:06, Matthew Sacks > > >> (<matt...@matthewsacks.com>) escribió: > > >>> > > >>> If I can get a vm as you suggested I’m happy to start a PoC. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 8:52 AM Rich Bowen <rbo...@rcbowen.com> > wrote: > > >>> > > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>>> On 4/5/21 10:46 AM, Matthew Sacks wrote: > > >>>>> So far response has been more yay than nay. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Next steps to turn this into a teak initiative? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Vote? > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Podling setup or is this going to be an Infra service? > > >>>> > > >>>> There are, I believe, two possible ways forward here: > > >>>> > > >>>> 1) We request a VM from infra, and someone volunteers to stand this > up > > >>>> and maintain it. > > >>>> > > >>>> 2) We persuade Infra that this is a necessary service that they > should > > >>>> host for the Foundation. > > >>>> > > >>>> My recommendation would be to go route 1 to start, and then judge, > > >> based > > >>>> on adoption, whether 2 is justified. The problem with 1, of course, > is > > >>>> that it requires a volunteer who is willing to move forward with it > > and > > >>>> keep it alive. > > >>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> The https://www.badgr.org looks like a good way to implement, > maybe. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 7:25 AM Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > >>>>> > > >>>>>> This sounds cool! > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 at 08:20, lidong dai <dailidon...@gmail.com> > > >> wrote: > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> wow, I like this idea very much! > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> Best Regards > > >>>>>>> --------------- > > >>>>>>> DolphinScheduler PMC chair > > >>>>>>> Lidong Dai > > >>>>>>> dailidon...@gmail.com > > >>>>>>> --------------- > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 9:16 PM Matthew Sacks < > > >> matt...@matthewsacks.com > > >>>>> > > >>>>>>> wrote: > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> Note text: “something like”. I didn’t advocate using NFT’s > > >> themselves. > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 5:43 AM Jarek Potiuk <ja...@potiuk.com> > > >> wrote: > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> AaaaH .. No NFT please :). > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> J. > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 2:30 PM Matthew Sacks < > > >>>>>> matt...@matthewsacks.com> > > >>>>>>>>> wrote: > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> Does Badgr have some kind of certification method to validate > > >> the > > >>>>>> badge > > >>>>>>>>>> authenticity? > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> I was thinking something like NFT’s for the badge graphic. > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 5:26 AM Rich Bowen <rbo...@rcbowen.com > > > > >>>>>> wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> On 4/5/21 8:19 AM, Daniel Gruno wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>>>> I had a similar idea some years back, but with a slightly > more > > >>>>>>>>>>>> tongue-in-cheek approach. > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Some sample "merits" I had in mind then: > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - 1,000 commits within a year > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - 5,000 commits in total > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - 1,000 emails to our lists > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Annoyed Sally more than 5 times > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Caused at least one CVE > > >>>>>>>>>>>> - *Fixed* at least that one CVE... > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Well, you can see what I'm talking about. It's probably not > > >>>>>> what > > >>>>>>>> many > > >>>>>>>>>>>> people would be wanting... :p (I would tick all the above > > >>>>>> boxes > > >>>>>>>>> btw!) > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> But activity-based merits could be a fun comdev projects. We > > >>>>>> have > > >>>>>>>>>> access > > >>>>>>>>>>>> to the stats through Kibble, so we could auto-generate a > bunch > > >>>>>> of > > >>>>>>>>> them. > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> Elsewhere in the thread I mention https://www.badgr.org/ > which > > >>>>>> has a > > >>>>>>>>>>> small advantage that it already exists and has an active > > >>>>>> developer > > >>>>>>>>>>> community. I wonder what ability there is to feed data from > > >>>>>> Kibble > > >>>>>>>> into > > >>>>>>>>>>> Badgr. > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> And I think I qualify for the "Annoyed Sally" badge a *bunch* > > >> of > > >>>>>>>> times > > >>>>>>>>>>> over. :D > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> --Rich > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> On 05/04/2021 14.10, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I like the idea. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> It's very similar to what has already been done at the > > >>>>>> ApacheCon > > >>>>>>>>> every > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> year. you got the "badges" that you could attach to your > > >>>>>> generic > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> "conference badge". > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/wusheng1108/status/1171101885664595968 > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> J. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 1:43 PM Liu Ted > > >>>>>> <tedl...@yahoo.com.invalid > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I like this idea. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ted Liu > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> 在 2021 年 4月 月 5 日週一，時間：16:42 ， Matthew Sacks > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> <matt...@matthewsacks.com> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> 寫道： Summary: Digital Merit badges > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ASF participation and responsibility are based on merit. > So > > >>>>>> like > > >>>>>>>>>> other > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> merit-based organizations, why not have a digital merit > > >>>>>> badge. It > > >>>>>>>>>> would > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> slow your name and summarize your involvement and > > >>>>>> contributions > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> (volunteer, > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> committer, member, board member, founding member, etc.). > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also, what projects you work on. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Other examples of design: Trust Certification badges: > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >>>> > > >> > > > https://trustarc.com/truste-certifications/enterprise-privacy-certification/ > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> What it’s not: social score, that’s not what I’m > proposing. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> If an ASF member, committee, and volunteer involvement are > > >>>>>> based > > >>>>>>>> on > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> merit, > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> why not have a digital merit badge that shows what they’ve > > >>>>>> done? > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Like other organizations based on merit, there are usually > > >>>>>> badges > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> recognizing one's contributions to that contributor. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I’m thinking to list the following on the badge: > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - committer, member, volunteer, board member, founder, etc > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - year joined > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you click the badge, it will take you to a profile page > > >>>>>> with: > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Projects they contribute/contributed to > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Apachcon participation, presentations, etc > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Apache.org personal homepage (if they have one) > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> From a marketing perspective, it also expands the ASF > > >>>>>> “brand” > > >>>>>>>> and > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> reputation. You have many of the best software engineers > and > > >>>>>> IT > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> professionals in the world helping make better software > > >>>>>> available > > >>>>>>>>> to > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> commercial companies as well as public organizations and > > >>>>>>>>> individuals > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> If LinkedIn displayed a dynamically generated badge > > >>>>>> validated by > > >>>>>>>> an > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ASF-hosted infra API (blockchain validated) on Roy > Fielding > > >>>>>> or > > >>>>>>>>>> JimJag’s > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> LinkedIn page, for example, wouldn’t that be of interest > in > > >>>>>>>>> expanding > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ASF > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> reach? It could increase volunteering, donations, page > > >>>>>> views, and > > >>>>>>>>>> more > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> benefits. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Not just LinkedIn, but maybe RedHat, Microsoft, maybe > Apple > > >>>>>>>>> (probably > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> not), > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oracle, IBM, AWS, Google could get a Platinum sponsor > badge > > >>>>>> to > > >>>>>>>> show > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> their > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> pride for supporting the ASF as a major corporation. More > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> corporations will > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> follow suit. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thoughts? > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thank you, Matthew > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> > > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: > dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > >>>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: > > >> dev-h...@community.apache.org > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> -- > > >>>>>>>>>>> Rich Bowen - rbo...@rcbowen.com > > >>>>>>>>>>> @rbowen > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > >>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: > dev-h...@community.apache.org > > >>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>> -- > > >>>>>>>>>> Thank you, Matthew > > >>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>> -- > > >>>>>>>>> +48 660 796 129 > > >>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>> -- > > >>>>>>>> Thank you, Matthew > > >>>>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > >>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> -- > > >>>>> Thank you, Matthew > > >>>>> > > >>>> > > >>>> -- > > >>>> Rich Bowen > > >>>> rbo...@rcbowen.com > > >>>> > > >>> -- > > >>> Thank you, Matthew > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> -- > > >> Daniel Ferradal > > >> HTTPD Project > > >> #httpd help at Freenode > > >> > > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > >> > > >> -- > > > Thank you, Matthew > > > > Craig L Russell > > c...@apache.org > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > > > -- > Thank you, Matthew >
