On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 5:47 PM Dave Fisher <w...@apache.org> wrote: > Hi - > > I perceived sarcasm from you as well.
What does that have to do with a new product? Let’s focus on meaningful work, not assassinating character because we don’t like, or like an idea. > > > I’m personally unsure about the best way to earn Apache merit badges. > > I would say that the metrics for badges ought not parallel too much other > merit measures like committer, PMC, membership, and the rest. If too close > then there will be questions for PMCs which naturally differ on > measurements for committers and PMC membership in their community. ASF participation is public, and apparent; the badge reflects the work. > > > Something like emails, commit lines, issues, etcetera. > > Just my thoughts. > > Regards, > Dave > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Apr 5, 2021, at 5:24 PM, Matthew Sacks <matt...@matthewsacks.com> > wrote: > > > > If you think there’s snark in my reply, you’ve misinterpreted it as I’m > > dead serious. Instead of letting personal opinions on awards because of > > what sounds like a bad personal experience indicates to me the real > > benefit if the proposal was missed, and why put down an idea that > promotes > > pride in one's work? > > > > That is not the ASF I know. > > The ASF I know is board members personally showing me around when I had a > > very uninteresting project that turned into a podling. > > > > It helps encourage involvement in contributions to open source, the whole > > point of the badge. > > > > Also, his assessment was completely based on personal opinion, nothing to > > do with benefit or no benefit to the ASF. > > > > Putting down good ideas is more damaging to focus soon than me asking for > > real facts when presented with personal convictions. > > > > Thanks for the etiquette suggestion. > > > > Regardless of your suggestions, on etiquette, It seems the majority is in > > favor. > > > > So now we vote? > > > > > >> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 4:58 PM Craig Russell <apache....@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> > >> Hi Matthew, > >> > >> Your message makes me think you did not get past Daniel's first eight > >> words. > >> > >> If you read the message, he gives a few reasons to dislike badges. > >> > >> Your snarky response is not a good example of healthy community > discussion. > >> > >> Craig > >> > >>> On Apr 5, 2021, at 4:14 PM, Matthew Sacks <matt...@matthewsacks.com> > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> Thanks for your input. > >>> > >>> “I don’t like it” is your only reason? > >>> > >>> Perhaps we should get rid of the corporate thank you page? > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 1:47 PM Daniel Ferradal <dferra...@apache.org> > >> wrote: > >>> > >>>> Hello, > >>>> > >>>> In my humble opinion, I don't like labels, medals, awards, bands, > >>>> distinctions, badges, ribbons, stars, trophies or anything similar > >>>> that distinguish anyone from any other. As I see it, it's a form of > >>>> manipulation to persuade people to achieve more than they might want > >>>> and may probably lead to people feeling better than others or just the > >>>> opposite, which is worse. > >>>> > >>>> ASF being what it is, all volunteers doing whatever they can or want, > >>>> time, life, family or will permits, but a necessary few that work > >>>> professionally to maintain operation, I don't like the idea of using > >>>> this kind of "corporate encouragement". > >>>> > >>>> I understand the idea behind this is probably well meant, but that > >>>> does not make me like it anyway. > >>>> > >>>> Cheers. > >>>> > >>>> El lun, 5 abr 2021 a las 18:06, Matthew Sacks > >>>> (<matt...@matthewsacks.com>) escribió: > >>>>> > >>>>> If I can get a vm as you suggested I’m happy to start a PoC. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 8:52 AM Rich Bowen <rbo...@rcbowen.com> > wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> On 4/5/21 10:46 AM, Matthew Sacks wrote: > >>>>>>> So far response has been more yay than nay. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Next steps to turn this into a teak initiative? > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Vote? > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Podling setup or is this going to be an Infra service? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> There are, I believe, two possible ways forward here: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> 1) We request a VM from infra, and someone volunteers to stand this > up > >>>>>> and maintain it. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> 2) We persuade Infra that this is a necessary service that they > should > >>>>>> host for the Foundation. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> My recommendation would be to go route 1 to start, and then judge, > >>>> based > >>>>>> on adoption, whether 2 is justified. The problem with 1, of course, > is > >>>>>> that it requires a volunteer who is willing to move forward with it > >> and > >>>>>> keep it alive. > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> The https://www.badgr.org looks like a good way to implement, > maybe. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 7:25 AM Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> This sounds cool! > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 at 08:20, lidong dai <dailidon...@gmail.com> > >>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> wow, I like this idea very much! > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Best Regards > >>>>>>>>> --------------- > >>>>>>>>> DolphinScheduler PMC chair > >>>>>>>>> Lidong Dai > >>>>>>>>> dailidon...@gmail.com > >>>>>>>>> --------------- > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 9:16 PM Matthew Sacks < > >>>> matt...@matthewsacks.com > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> Note text: “something like”. I didn’t advocate using NFT’s > >>>> themselves. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 5:43 AM Jarek Potiuk <ja...@potiuk.com> > >>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> AaaaH .. No NFT please :). > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> J. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 2:30 PM Matthew Sacks < > >>>>>>>> matt...@matthewsacks.com> > >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Does Badgr have some kind of certification method to validate > >>>> the > >>>>>>>> badge > >>>>>>>>>>>> authenticity? > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> I was thinking something like NFT’s for the badge graphic. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 5:26 AM Rich Bowen <rbo...@rcbowen.com > > > >>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 4/5/21 8:19 AM, Daniel Gruno wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I had a similar idea some years back, but with a slightly > more > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> tongue-in-cheek approach. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Some sample "merits" I had in mind then: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - 1,000 commits within a year > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - 5,000 commits in total > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - 1,000 emails to our lists > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Annoyed Sally more than 5 times > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Caused at least one CVE > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> - *Fixed* at least that one CVE... > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, you can see what I'm talking about. It's probably not > >>>>>>>> what > >>>>>>>>>> many > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> people would be wanting... :p (I would tick all the above > >>>>>>>> boxes > >>>>>>>>>>> btw!) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> But activity-based merits could be a fun comdev projects. We > >>>>>>>> have > >>>>>>>>>>>> access > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> to the stats through Kibble, so we could auto-generate a > bunch > >>>>>>>> of > >>>>>>>>>>> them. > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Elsewhere in the thread I mention https://www.badgr.org/ > which > >>>>>>>> has a > >>>>>>>>>>>>> small advantage that it already exists and has an active > >>>>>>>> developer > >>>>>>>>>>>>> community. I wonder what ability there is to feed data from > >>>>>>>> Kibble > >>>>>>>>>> into > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Badgr. > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> And I think I qualify for the "Annoyed Sally" badge a *bunch* > >>>> of > >>>>>>>>>> times > >>>>>>>>>>>>> over. :D > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> --Rich > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 05/04/2021 14.10, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I like the idea. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's very similar to what has already been done at the > >>>>>>>> ApacheCon > >>>>>>>>>>> every > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> year. you got the "badges" that you could attach to your > >>>>>>>> generic > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "conference badge". > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/wusheng1108/status/1171101885664595968 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> J. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 5, 2021 at 1:43 PM Liu Ted > >>>>>>>> <tedl...@yahoo.com.invalid > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I like this idea. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ted Liu > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 在 2021 年 4月 月 5 日週一，時間：16:42 ， Matthew Sacks > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <matt...@matthewsacks.com> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 寫道： Summary: Digital Merit badges > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ASF participation and responsibility are based on merit. > So > >>>>>>>> like > >>>>>>>>>>>> other > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> merit-based organizations, why not have a digital merit > >>>>>>>> badge. It > >>>>>>>>>>>> would > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> slow your name and summarize your involvement and > >>>>>>>> contributions > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (volunteer, > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> committer, member, board member, founding member, etc.). > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also, what projects you work on. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Other examples of design: Trust Certification badges: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>> > >> > https://trustarc.com/truste-certifications/enterprise-privacy-certification/ > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What it’s not: social score, that’s not what I’m > proposing. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If an ASF member, committee, and volunteer involvement are > >>>>>>>> based > >>>>>>>>>> on > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> merit, > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> why not have a digital merit badge that shows what they’ve > >>>>>>>> done? > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Like other organizations based on merit, there are usually > >>>>>>>> badges > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recognizing one's contributions to that contributor. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I’m thinking to list the following on the badge: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - committer, member, volunteer, board member, founder, etc > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - year joined > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you click the badge, it will take you to a profile page > >>>>>>>> with: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Projects they contribute/contributed to > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Apachcon participation, presentations, etc > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Apache.org personal homepage (if they have one) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From a marketing perspective, it also expands the ASF > >>>>>>>> “brand” > >>>>>>>>>> and > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reputation. You have many of the best software engineers > and > >>>>>>>> IT > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> professionals in the world helping make better software > >>>>>>>> available > >>>>>>>>>>> to > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> commercial companies as well as public organizations and > >>>>>>>>>>> individuals > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If LinkedIn displayed a dynamically generated badge > >>>>>>>> validated by > >>>>>>>>>> an > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ASF-hosted infra API (blockchain validated) on Roy > Fielding > >>>>>>>> or > >>>>>>>>>>>> JimJag’s > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> LinkedIn page, for example, wouldn’t that be of interest > in > >>>>>>>>>>> expanding > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ASF > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reach? It could increase volunteering, donations, page > >>>>>>>> views, and > >>>>>>>>>>>> more > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> benefits. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Not just LinkedIn, but maybe RedHat, Microsoft, maybe > Apple > >>>>>>>>>>> (probably > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not), > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oracle, IBM, AWS, Google could get a Platinum sponsor > badge > >>>>>>>> to > >>>>>>>>>> show > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> their > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pride for supporting the ASF as a major corporation. More > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> corporations will > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> follow suit. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thoughts? > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thank you, Matthew > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: > dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: > >>>> dev-h...@community.apache.org > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Rich Bowen - rbo...@rcbowen.com > >>>>>>>>>>>>> @rbowen > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > >>>>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: > dev-h...@community.apache.org > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>>> Thank you, Matthew > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>> +48 660 796 129 > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>> Thank you, Matthew > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > >>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>> Thank you, Matthew > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> -- > >>>>>> Rich Bowen > >>>>>> rbo...@rcbowen.com > >>>>>> > >>>>> -- > >>>>> Thank you, Matthew > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> Daniel Ferradal > >>>> HTTPD Project > >>>> #httpd help at Freenode > >>>> > >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>> Thank you, Matthew > >> > >> Craig L Russell > >> c...@apache.org > >> > >> > >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > >> > >> -- > > Thank you, Matthew > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > -- Thank you, Matthew
