Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Chris Moore]

Riccardo,

Actually that is what I was hinting at to be honest, as i feel the method of 
selecting text within Safari is rather sloppy.  You can also navigate by line 
within iOS, so hoped that feature would come across to OS X.  Navigating by 
line is also useful when trying to read pages that have been styled into 
columns via CSS instead of a table.  This can be done in JAWS quite nicely.

Chris 
On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:11, Ricardo Walker wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> I doubt you will see the reading by line with the down arrow.  That would 
> radically change the way VO navigates the web, and I'm not sure it would be 
> for the better.  It would be selecting text easier though.
> 
> Ricardo Walker
> rica...@appletothecore.info
> Twitter:@apple2thecore
> www.appletothecore.info
> 
> On Jul 2, 2012, at 6:37 PM, Chris Moore  wrote:
> 
>> Hmmm I remember a while back putting a list of 15 improvements.  I can't 
>> remember them all now, so perhaps I have just learnt to live without them.  
>> I did report them to Apple though as bugs and feature enhancements.
>> 
>> The VoiceOver busy is the biggest annoyance which is caused by  the pathetic 
>> slow buffering system voice over uses.  So I would like to see that 
>> rewritten from the ground up.  There are a few random performance bugs that 
>> happen now and then which require me to switch voice over off then back on 
>> again.  So overall performance could do with being improved.
>> 
>> I would also like to know what web page I am looking at when switching 
>> between tabs, being told that is an HTML page is not exactly helpful.  I 
>> would also like to navigate line by line just by pressing the down arrow or 
>> up key.  VO still needs a bit of work when reporting how many HMTL  elements 
>> are on a web page, some windows screen readers seem to find more tables and 
>> headings than VO,  especially in the buggy rotor.
>> 
>> I would like the ability to edit form fields in a PDF with Preview, but I 
>> believe this is coming in the next Mountain Lion release (according to 
>> Apple's website).  
>> 
>> I would appreciate MIDI event editing in GarageBand, and a huge update to 
>> iWork.  There just is not enough accessible productive software on the Mac.  
>> There is more to using a Mac than just Skype and Mail surely?
>> 
>> Not sure if that bug still exists when using the real speak voices where the 
>> pitch used to shift up and down randomly.  I stopped using those voices as 
>> it became too annoying.
>> 
>> I would also like the ability to edit voice over's dictionary.  For example 
>> if you type third as in the number 3 followed by the letters r and d, you 
>> get 3rd (three road), surely this should be a third?  So I think the ability 
>> to edit some of VO's assumptions would be nice, or maybe VO should grow up 
>> and become a tad more intelligent.  I would like more control over how VO 
>> reads out numbers too.
>> 
>> Maybe developers should also be given the option to name what VO calls an 
>> HTML area, as something else?  For example when using adium the chat window 
>> is called an HTML area, am sure a chat window or conversation window would 
>> be more meaningful.
>> 
>> Last but not least, I find VO a bit slow when first entering the iTunes 
>> store.  The page takes a while to render.  Well actually visually it does 
>> not, but VO seems to think it does.  Actually come to mention it when VO 
>> says something is busy, a sighted person can still move the mouse and 
>> perform the action they require, it is just VO's buffer which is busy.
>> 
>> I spotted another bug today too.  When ordering a smart case for my iPad, VO 
>> was unable to read out the colour options.  When trying to select a colour, 
>> VO simply said "space radio button" for each of the 6 colours.  The work 
>> around seemed to be select a colour, go back to the top of the screen and 
>> read out the description to see if the default green had changed.  Or look 
>> in the basket and hope to god you have not selected pink.  I eventually 
>> performed this task via the Apple Store app on my iPhone which performed 
>> perfectly.
>> 
>> Chris 
>> On 2 Jul 2012, at 19:16, Daniel McGee wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi all, a while ago on this list I saw someone mention that they would like 
>>> so and so bug to be fixed in Mountain Lion. 
>>> I would just really like to start a discussion on if there are not many 
>>> enhancements to Voiceover in the next OS, then what bugs would you like 
>>> fixed and hope Apple has done there job with it. 
>>> I'll go 1st. 
>>> For me its safari. two things for me. 
>>> 1. Now and then when I go back a page with CMD left bracket Voiceover 
>>> doesn't announce my list of headings or links that I have set in VO 
>>> utility. 
>>> 2. continuing this previous page thing, because I don't always know when 
>>> the page is fully loaded when going back, I get the lovely "Voiceover 
>>> Busy!" Not! 
>>> This is using Lion V7.4 and Safari 5.1.7 
>>> 
>>> So what are yours

Re: podcast app

[Garth Humphreys]

You mentioned wanting to be able to save some of your podcasts, in Downcast you 
can tap on the More Details button next to the episode you want to keep and 
toggle the Lock/unlock button. From here you can also export the episode.

Garth
iblindtech.com

On 03/07/2012, at 1:44 PM, Tim Emmons wrote:

> Hey guys, just to chime in, I'm using downcast as well. the Podcast app, 
> seems clunky at best compared to downcast. Podcasts app freezes on me when I 
> played with it and I promptly deleted it and went back to downcast and have 
> had no problems. Now if I can just figure out how to save podcasts and 
> possibly put them in the cloud for later since there are some music podcasts 
> that I would like to keep around, then I'd be all good, but other than that, 
> no complaints, loving downcast, Apple could take note from the creator of 
> downcast. Take care guys, talk to you soon. 
> On Jul 2, 2012, at 9:51 PM, Sarai Bucciarelli wrote:
> 
>> Hi:
>> I'm using the Podcast app from Apple.
>> On Jul 2, 2012, at 9:22 PM, Cheree Heppe wrote:
>> 
>>> Cheree Heppe here:
>>> 
>>> I'm using Downcast and haven't had a problem yet.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> Cheree Heppe
>>> 
>>> - Original Message - 
>>> From: "Sarai Bucciarelli" 
>>> To: 
>>> Sent: Monday, July 02, 2012 19:17
>>> Subject: podcast app
>>> 
>>> 
 Hi:
 Anyone having issues with the Podcast app? Mine is freezing, and VO stops. 
 I have the iPhone 4.
 
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Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Chris Moore]

Colin,

I totally forgot about this hidden little gem.  Thanks that is one annoyance 
ticked off my list :)

Chris 
On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:40, Red.Falcon wrote:

> Hi there!
> I do not know if this is something you might find useful!
> But open VO+H+H will bring up vo commands and in the first option general 
> there is add pronunciation in which you can put in the first field the word  
> you want to change then in the second field write it so it sounds the way you 
> wish it to sound!
> And if that is to your satisfaction then you can set other options after the 
> second field!
> As a example I got mine to say Boy zone in stead of boys1!
> And mine does say third when I put 3rd I changed my numbers from digits to 
> words and now 1000 says one thousand!
> 
> hth Colin
> 
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:02, Jesus Garcia wrote:
> 
>> thank you very much, as I said new user this is good very good. Never saw
>> that in the documentation or the tutorials. I hope someone soon does a high
>> end tutorial from beginning to end on voice over with the common apps such
>> as safari, the email and text editor. I certainly would be prepared to pay
>> for something along those lines.
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Ricardo Walker
>> Sent: Monday, July 02, 2012 18:59
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or
>> squashed in Mountain Lion?
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> pressing VO command H brings you to the next heading.  Adding shift to that
>> goes to the previous heading.
>> 
>> Ricardo Walker
>> rica...@appletothecore.info
>> Twitter:@apple2thecore
>> www.appletothecore.info
>> 
>> On Jul 2, 2012, at 6:53 PM, Jesus Garcia  wrote:
>> 
>>> So, long as we are talking about fixes one would like to see I would 
>>> also like to see a little easier navigation of headings on web pages. 
>>> Perhaps as a relative new user to the mac I am missing something, but 
>>> I find it easier to navigate HTML headings in web pages with windows 
>>> screen readers then with voice over. Again this may be my missing 
>>> something major. And yes the dictionary would be nice my name 
>>> especially I would like to hear it with its Spanish pronunciation 
>>> again a miner issue, but one I would like to be able to correct.
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Moore
>>> Sent: Monday, July 02, 2012 18:37
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be 
>>> fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?
>>> 
>>> Hmmm I remember a while back putting a list of 15 improvements.  I 
>>> can't remember them all now, so perhaps I have just learnt to live without
>> them.
>>> I did report them to Apple though as bugs and feature enhancements.
>>> 
>>> The VoiceOver busy is the biggest annoyance which is caused by  the 
>>> pathetic slow buffering system voice over uses.  So I would like to 
>>> see that rewritten from the ground up.  There are a few random 
>>> performance bugs that happen now and then which require me to switch 
>>> voice over off then back on again.  So overall performance could do with
>> being improved.
>>> 
>>> I would also like to know what web page I am looking at when switching 
>>> between tabs, being told that is an HTML page is not exactly helpful.  
>>> I would also like to navigate line by line just by pressing the down 
>>> arrow or up key.  VO still needs a bit of work when reporting how many 
>>> HMTL  elements are on a web page, some windows screen readers seem to 
>>> find more tables and headings than VO,  especially in the buggy rotor.
>>> 
>>> I would like the ability to edit form fields in a PDF with Preview, 
>>> but I believe this is coming in the next Mountain Lion release 
>>> (according to Apple's website).
>>> 
>>> I would appreciate MIDI event editing in GarageBand, and a huge update 
>>> to iWork.  There just is not enough accessible productive software on the
>> Mac.
>>> There is more to using a Mac than just Skype and Mail surely?
>>> 
>>> Not sure if that bug still exists when using the real speak voices 
>>> where the pitch used to shift up and down randomly.  I stopped using 
>>> those voices as it became too annoying.
>>> 
>>> I would also like the ability to edit voice over's dictionary.  For 
>>> example if you type third as in the number 3 followed by the letters r 
>>> and d, you get 3rd (three road), surely this should be a third?  So I 
>>> think the ability to edit some of VO's assumptions would be nice, or 
>>> maybe VO should grow up and become a tad more intelligent.  I would 
>>> like more control over how VO reads out numbers too.
>>> 
>>> Maybe developers should also be given the option to name what VO calls 
>>> an HTML area, as something else?  For example when using adium the 

Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Garth Humphreys]

I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom and just some 
improvements to Zoom in general. I mostly don't use Zoom on my Mac but this 
only because it is so poor when compared to things like ZoomText in the windows 
world. It is probably great if you don't need to use Voice Over or if you only 
need a little enlargement but it falls completely short for me.

Garth
iblindtech.com

On 03/07/2012, at 6:26 PM, Chris Moore wrote:

> Riccardo,
> 
> Actually that is what I was hinting at to be honest, as i feel the method of 
> selecting text within Safari is rather sloppy.  You can also navigate by line 
> within iOS, so hoped that feature would come across to OS X.  Navigating by 
> line is also useful when trying to read pages that have been styled into 
> columns via CSS instead of a table.  This can be done in JAWS quite nicely.
> 
> Chris 
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:11, Ricardo Walker wrote:
> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I doubt you will see the reading by line with the down arrow.  That would 
>> radically change the way VO navigates the web, and I'm not sure it would be 
>> for the better.  It would be selecting text easier though.
>> 
>> Ricardo Walker
>> rica...@appletothecore.info
>> Twitter:@apple2thecore
>> www.appletothecore.info
>> 
>> On Jul 2, 2012, at 6:37 PM, Chris Moore  wrote:
>> 
>>> Hmmm I remember a while back putting a list of 15 improvements.  I can't 
>>> remember them all now, so perhaps I have just learnt to live without them.  
>>> I did report them to Apple though as bugs and feature enhancements.
>>> 
>>> The VoiceOver busy is the biggest annoyance which is caused by  the 
>>> pathetic slow buffering system voice over uses.  So I would like to see 
>>> that rewritten from the ground up.  There are a few random performance bugs 
>>> that happen now and then which require me to switch voice over off then 
>>> back on again.  So overall performance could do with being improved.
>>> 
>>> I would also like to know what web page I am looking at when switching 
>>> between tabs, being told that is an HTML page is not exactly helpful.  I 
>>> would also like to navigate line by line just by pressing the down arrow or 
>>> up key.  VO still needs a bit of work when reporting how many HMTL  
>>> elements are on a web page, some windows screen readers seem to find more 
>>> tables and headings than VO,  especially in the buggy rotor.
>>> 
>>> I would like the ability to edit form fields in a PDF with Preview, but I 
>>> believe this is coming in the next Mountain Lion release (according to 
>>> Apple's website).  
>>> 
>>> I would appreciate MIDI event editing in GarageBand, and a huge update to 
>>> iWork.  There just is not enough accessible productive software on the Mac. 
>>>  There is more to using a Mac than just Skype and Mail surely?
>>> 
>>> Not sure if that bug still exists when using the real speak voices where 
>>> the pitch used to shift up and down randomly.  I stopped using those voices 
>>> as it became too annoying.
>>> 
>>> I would also like the ability to edit voice over's dictionary.  For example 
>>> if you type third as in the number 3 followed by the letters r and d, you 
>>> get 3rd (three road), surely this should be a third?  So I think the 
>>> ability to edit some of VO's assumptions would be nice, or maybe VO should 
>>> grow up and become a tad more intelligent.  I would like more control over 
>>> how VO reads out numbers too.
>>> 
>>> Maybe developers should also be given the option to name what VO calls an 
>>> HTML area, as something else?  For example when using adium the chat window 
>>> is called an HTML area, am sure a chat window or conversation window would 
>>> be more meaningful.
>>> 
>>> Last but not least, I find VO a bit slow when first entering the iTunes 
>>> store.  The page takes a while to render.  Well actually visually it does 
>>> not, but VO seems to think it does.  Actually come to mention it when VO 
>>> says something is busy, a sighted person can still move the mouse and 
>>> perform the action they require, it is just VO's buffer which is busy.
>>> 
>>> I spotted another bug today too.  When ordering a smart case for my iPad, 
>>> VO was unable to read out the colour options.  When trying to select a 
>>> colour, VO simply said "space radio button" for each of the 6 colours.  The 
>>> work around seemed to be select a colour, go back to the top of the screen 
>>> and read out the description to see if the default green had changed.  Or 
>>> look in the basket and hope to god you have not selected pink.  I 
>>> eventually performed this task via the Apple Store app on my iPhone which 
>>> performed perfectly.
>>> 
>>> Chris 
>>> On 2 Jul 2012, at 19:16, Daniel McGee wrote:
>>> 
 Hi all, a while ago on this list I saw someone mention that they would 
 like so and so bug to be fixed in Mountain Lion. 
 I would just really like to start a discussion on if there are not many 
 enhancements to Voiceover in the next OS, t

Re: podcast app

[Chris Moore]

Two words spring to mind when using the Apple podcast app "half baked".  Let's 
hope it gets updated in iOS 6.  I would also like to see the app sync my 
podcast playlist that is on iTunes via iCloud.

I don't think Downcast need to worry at this stage.
On 3 Jul 2012, at 03:17, Sarai Bucciarelli wrote:

> Hi:
> Anyone having issues with the Podcast app? Mine is freezing, and VO stops. I 
> have the iPhone 4.
> 
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Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Chris Moore]

What improvements would you like fixed in particular when it comes to zoom?
On 3 Jul 2012, at 09:44, Garth Humphreys wrote:

> I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom and just some 
> improvements to Zoom in general. I mostly don't use Zoom on my Mac but this 
> only because it is so poor when compared to things like ZoomText in the 
> windows world. It is probably great if you don't need to use Voice Over or if 
> you only need a little enlargement but it falls completely short for me.
> 
> Garth
> iblindtech.com
> 
> On 03/07/2012, at 6:26 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
> 
>> Riccardo,
>> 
>> Actually that is what I was hinting at to be honest, as i feel the method of 
>> selecting text within Safari is rather sloppy.  You can also navigate by 
>> line within iOS, so hoped that feature would come across to OS X.  
>> Navigating by line is also useful when trying to read pages that have been 
>> styled into columns via CSS instead of a table.  This can be done in JAWS 
>> quite nicely.
>> 
>> Chris 
>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:11, Ricardo Walker wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> I doubt you will see the reading by line with the down arrow.  That would 
>>> radically change the way VO navigates the web, and I'm not sure it would be 
>>> for the better.  It would be selecting text easier though.
>>> 
>>> Ricardo Walker
>>> rica...@appletothecore.info
>>> Twitter:@apple2thecore
>>> www.appletothecore.info
>>> 
>>> On Jul 2, 2012, at 6:37 PM, Chris Moore  wrote:
>>> 
 Hmmm I remember a while back putting a list of 15 improvements.  I can't 
 remember them all now, so perhaps I have just learnt to live without them. 
  I did report them to Apple though as bugs and feature enhancements.
 
 The VoiceOver busy is the biggest annoyance which is caused by  the 
 pathetic slow buffering system voice over uses.  So I would like to see 
 that rewritten from the ground up.  There are a few random performance 
 bugs that happen now and then which require me to switch voice over off 
 then back on again.  So overall performance could do with being improved.
 
 I would also like to know what web page I am looking at when switching 
 between tabs, being told that is an HTML page is not exactly helpful.  I 
 would also like to navigate line by line just by pressing the down arrow 
 or up key.  VO still needs a bit of work when reporting how many HMTL  
 elements are on a web page, some windows screen readers seem to find more 
 tables and headings than VO,  especially in the buggy rotor.
 
 I would like the ability to edit form fields in a PDF with Preview, but I 
 believe this is coming in the next Mountain Lion release (according to 
 Apple's website).  
 
 I would appreciate MIDI event editing in GarageBand, and a huge update to 
 iWork.  There just is not enough accessible productive software on the 
 Mac.  There is more to using a Mac than just Skype and Mail surely?
 
 Not sure if that bug still exists when using the real speak voices where 
 the pitch used to shift up and down randomly.  I stopped using those 
 voices as it became too annoying.
 
 I would also like the ability to edit voice over's dictionary.  For 
 example if you type third as in the number 3 followed by the letters r and 
 d, you get 3rd (three road), surely this should be a third?  So I think 
 the ability to edit some of VO's assumptions would be nice, or maybe VO 
 should grow up and become a tad more intelligent.  I would like more 
 control over how VO reads out numbers too.
 
 Maybe developers should also be given the option to name what VO calls an 
 HTML area, as something else?  For example when using adium the chat 
 window is called an HTML area, am sure a chat window or conversation 
 window would be more meaningful.
 
 Last but not least, I find VO a bit slow when first entering the iTunes 
 store.  The page takes a while to render.  Well actually visually it does 
 not, but VO seems to think it does.  Actually come to mention it when VO 
 says something is busy, a sighted person can still move the mouse and 
 perform the action they require, it is just VO's buffer which is busy.
 
 I spotted another bug today too.  When ordering a smart case for my iPad, 
 VO was unable to read out the colour options.  When trying to select a 
 colour, VO simply said "space radio button" for each of the 6 colours.  
 The work around seemed to be select a colour, go back to the top of the 
 screen and read out the description to see if the default green had 
 changed.  Or look in the basket and hope to god you have not selected 
 pink.  I eventually performed this task via the Apple Store app on my 
 iPhone which performed perfectly.
 
 Chris 
 On 2 Jul 2012, at 19:16, Daniel McGee wrote:
 
> Hi all, a while ag

Re: found scanning program for the Mac

[Ray Foret Jr]

Open book on the Mac?  Forget it.  This here sounds like it might be worth 
serious consideration.  thanks.


Sincerely,
The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!

Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!

Skype name:
barefootedray

On Jul 2, 2012, at 10:08 PM, Eugenia Firth wrote:

> Forgot to put the name of the program I talked about. It is from Abisee at 
> abisee.com. They had it working on a Macbook Pro. 
> Eugenia Firth
> gigifi...@sbcglobal.net
> 
> 
> 
> On Jul 2, 2012, at 9:54 PM, Eugenia Firth wrote:
> 
>> Hi guys. 
>> I wanted to tell y'all about the scanning program that I saw at the exhibits 
>> at NFB today. True, it costs $1200, but it comes with a camera sort of like 
>> the Purl camera. 
>> 
>> I had to get it going for them because the guy that knew about it wasn't at 
>> the table at the time I showed up. He came right after I got it going. It 
>> wouldn't talk at first. Who knows where it was on the screen. Like OpenBook, 
>> you don't use the screen reader while it's running. However, I had to turn 
>> their VoiceOver on, press command q and get out of their program, and then 
>> call it back up again, after I turned off their track pad. The person that 
>> was sitting there keeping watch while the developer was gone for a little 
>> bit, I guess was a Windows user. Anyway, I got the program going. 
>> 
>> The developer that came back was very knowledgeable. He told me they had a 
>> former Kurzweil engineer with them. When I did the scan, it reading was 
>> incredibly good, even in the light my husband said was glaring on the paper. 
>> 
>> I have a Purl camera I am considering selling. It doesn't have much use on 
>> it, and maybe I ought to sell OpenBook while I'm at it. However, I don't 
>> know if I can. The state gave me OpenBook, but I bought the Purl camera 
>> myself. I'll have to find out what I can do about OpenBook. 
>> 
>> Eugenia Firth
>> gigifi...@sbcglobal.net
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Garth Humphreys]

There are a few bugs when zoomed to high levels, i.e., more than 14X or so. If 
you have VO running and zoom set to follow the keyboard focus you will find 
that the command tab to switch between apps becomes unreliable and navigating 
the menu bar with the arrow keys is also unreliable. Also I don't like the way 
it tracks and works with reading text. I'd like better colour options and 
keyboard commands to adjust them, or at least for the invert brightness 
keyboard command not to conflict with a Voice Over command. You would think 
that Apple would be able to sort out keyboard command conflicts between two of 
their own accessibility utilities. I am sure there are work arounds for some of 
these but a work around isn't the same as fixing the problem. For example the 
menu navigation issue I mentioned does not occur if you use swipes on the 
trackpad with trackpad commander to navigate the menu. It only happens with the 
arrow keys - strange but there you are.

If I used it regularly I would probably come across more of the issues. It 
really doesn't seem to me that apple intended the two utilities to work 
together or at least that this was an edge case. It would seem to me that they 
expected people to use either option exclusively and if so, they are probably 
right. Most people probably do use one or the other.

I'd also love to see the safari busy issue buried deep. 

The addition of the ability to set the caps lock key to act as the VO modifier 
would also be great. 

Garth
iblindtech.com
On 03/07/2012, at 6:48 PM, Chris Moore wrote:

> What improvements would you like fixed in particular when it comes to zoom?
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 09:44, Garth Humphreys wrote:
> 
>> I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom and just 
>> some improvements to Zoom in general. I mostly don't use Zoom on my Mac but 
>> this only because it is so poor when compared to things like ZoomText in the 
>> windows world. It is probably great if you don't need to use Voice Over or 
>> if you only need a little enlargement but it falls completely short for me.
>> 
>> Garth
>> iblindtech.com
>> 
>> On 03/07/2012, at 6:26 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
>> 
>>> Riccardo,
>>> 
>>> Actually that is what I was hinting at to be honest, as i feel the method 
>>> of selecting text within Safari is rather sloppy.  You can also navigate by 
>>> line within iOS, so hoped that feature would come across to OS X.  
>>> Navigating by line is also useful when trying to read pages that have been 
>>> styled into columns via CSS instead of a table.  This can be done in JAWS 
>>> quite nicely.
>>> 
>>> Chris 
>>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:11, Ricardo Walker wrote:
>>> 
 Hi,
 
 I doubt you will see the reading by line with the down arrow.  That would 
 radically change the way VO navigates the web, and I'm not sure it would 
 be for the better.  It would be selecting text easier though.
 
 Ricardo Walker
 rica...@appletothecore.info
 Twitter:@apple2thecore
 www.appletothecore.info
 
 On Jul 2, 2012, at 6:37 PM, Chris Moore  wrote:
 
> Hmmm I remember a while back putting a list of 15 improvements.  I can't 
> remember them all now, so perhaps I have just learnt to live without 
> them.  I did report them to Apple though as bugs and feature enhancements.
> 
> The VoiceOver busy is the biggest annoyance which is caused by  the 
> pathetic slow buffering system voice over uses.  So I would like to see 
> that rewritten from the ground up.  There are a few random performance 
> bugs that happen now and then which require me to switch voice over off 
> then back on again.  So overall performance could do with being improved.
> 
> I would also like to know what web page I am looking at when switching 
> between tabs, being told that is an HTML page is not exactly helpful.  I 
> would also like to navigate line by line just by pressing the down arrow 
> or up key.  VO still needs a bit of work when reporting how many HMTL  
> elements are on a web page, some windows screen readers seem to find more 
> tables and headings than VO,  especially in the buggy rotor.
> 
> I would like the ability to edit form fields in a PDF with Preview, but I 
> believe this is coming in the next Mountain Lion release (according to 
> Apple's website).  
> 
> I would appreciate MIDI event editing in GarageBand, and a huge update to 
> iWork.  There just is not enough accessible productive software on the 
> Mac.  There is more to using a Mac than just Skype and Mail surely?
> 
> Not sure if that bug still exists when using the real speak voices where 
> the pitch used to shift up and down randomly.  I stopped using those 
> voices as it became too annoying.
> 
> I would also like the ability to edit voice over's dictionary.  For 
> example if you type third as in the number 3 followed by the let

Skype Phone for Mac

[Allison Manzino]

Hi everyone,

Does anyone know of a phone that works with Skype on the Mac? Either a USB 
phone or a dual phone with speech? I justt got an offer from Skype to purchase 
a cordless phone for only $9, but I don't know whether I'd be able to configure 
Skype myself or not. Any thoughts or suggestions? Thank you for your 
assistance. This list has been most helpful to me in the past.

Allison

Life is not measured by the breaths we take, but by the moments that take our 
breath away

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Re: Skype Phone for Mac

[Kawal Gucukoglu]

HelloAlison.

Even better than that as I did this and now I have Skype on my chordless phone 
and do not miss a call.

If you visit Skype.com and look for making calls from your home phone, then you 
will see an adaptor which is a small box which you plug in from your network 
into your home phone.

It's easy to configure yourself.  I use it all the time now.

Even the software is easy to use from your mac.

If you visit connectme.local then all the informationis on there.  You can even 
add contacts as speed dials and just use your home phone to connect to your 
friends.  I do this all the time.

Hope this is useful.  By the way, you can also use your home phone in the 
normal way by pressing hash then the number.  If you want to dial using your 
skype, you press star star 3 or star star 2 for any other contact but you have 
to set it up using www.connectme.local

Hope is of some use to you as I love it and I do not have to use my Mac or I 
phone but can use all those clients in conjunction with my skype adaptor.

Kawal.

On 3 Jul 2012, at 10:34 AM, Allison Manzino  wrote:

> Hi everyone,
> 
> Does anyone know of a phone that works with Skype on the Mac? Either a USB 
> phone or a dual phone with speech? I justt got an offer from Skype to 
> purchase a cordless phone for only $9, but I don't know whether I'd be able 
> to configure Skype myself or not. Any thoughts or suggestions? Thank you for 
> your assistance. This list has been most helpful to me in the past.
> 
> Allison
> 
> Life is not measured by the breaths we take, but by the moments that take our 
> breath away
> 
> -- 
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> "MacVisionaries" group.
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Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Simon Cavendish]

I'd like to have Braille tables for some languages fixed in Mountain Lion. I've 
been writing to Accessibility about it a few times but ominously have not had a 
single response to reassure me that they are going to do so. Braille tables 
swapping on te the fly would be a good feature, very much like being able to 
switch languages. 
On 2 Jul 2012, at 19:42, Matthew Campbell wrote:

> Hi.
> As for me, I'd like to see a few things fixed. I wouldn't however, call them 
> bugs, more accessibility issues.
> I'd like to see table's in textedit and other word processors become 
> accessible to VoiceOver.
> The connect as button in the network view of finder isn't accessible while 
> using column view. I'd like to see this fixed even though it's been that way 
> since 10.5 Leopard.
> Another thing that would be nice to see fixed is the iWork suite as a whole. 
> I'd like to be able to use all 3 apps without having to jump through numerous 
> whoops, standing on my head, and counting backwards from 1000. 
> Finally, I'll add my voice to better performance from VoiceOver in Safari. 
> This "Busy, busy, busy," nonsense is really annoying! Another safari thing 
> that'd be nice to see is if VoiceOver would respond when pressing the regular 
> arrow keys by them selves. Pressing the arrows for a sighted user scrolls the 
> web page and until safari 5.1, this worked with VoiceOver rather nicely. Last 
> but not least is link menus only work randomly when one presses VO shift M 
> instead of all of the time as they should.
> 
> On 2012-07-02, at 2:33 PM, Ricardo Walker wrote:
> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> besides the busy thing in Safari, I honestly can't thing of anything as far 
>> as bugs go.  I'm sure there is a couple more but, I probably run into them 
>> infrequently.
>> 
>> Ricardo Walker
>> rica...@appletothecore.info
>> Twitter:@apple2thecore
>> www.appletothecore.info
>> 
>> On Jul 2, 2012, at 2:16 PM, Daniel McGee  
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi all, a while ago on this list I saw someone mention that they would like 
>>> so and so bug to be fixed in Mountain Lion. 
>>> I would just really like to start a discussion on if there are not many 
>>> enhancements to Voiceover in the next OS, then what bugs would you like 
>>> fixed and hope Apple has done there job with it. 
>>> I'll go 1st. 
>>> For me its safari. two things for me. 
>>> 1. Now and then when I go back a page with CMD left bracket Voiceover 
>>> doesn't announce my list of headings or links that I have set in VO 
>>> utility. 
>>> 2. continuing this previous page thing, because I don't always know when 
>>> the page is fully loaded when going back, I get the lovely "Voiceover 
>>> Busy!" Not! 
>>> This is using Lion V7.4 and Safari 5.1.7 
>>> 
>>> So what are yours? 
>>> 
>>> I hope this will become an interesting topic because I'm interested to see 
>>> what people can come up with and I'm sure there will be some good ones! 
>>> 
>>> So everyone, the dance floor is yours! LOL 
>>> 
>>> Daniel   
>>> 
>>> -- 
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>>> 
>> 
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> 
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Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Ricardo Walker]

Hi,

I wonder how many zoom users are out there?  I ask because, I wonder if there 
are enough users to give Apple enough feedback.  My vision isn't good enough to 
really use zoom for any extensive length of time so, I can't really point 
anything out.  Well, except the way it bounces Voiceover around when trying to 
navigate menus.  I think this is probably do to me having the mouse cursor 
following Voiceover though. 

Ricardo Walker
rica...@appletothecore.info
Twitter:@apple2thecore
www.appletothecore.info

On Jul 3, 2012, at 4:44 AM, Garth Humphreys  wrote:

> I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom and just some 
> improvements to Zoom in general. I mostly don't use Zoom on my Mac but this 
> only because it is so poor when compared to things like ZoomText in the 
> windows world. It is probably great if you don't need to use Voice Over or if 
> you only need a little enlargement but it falls completely short for me.
> 
> Garth
> iblindtech.com
> 
> On 03/07/2012, at 6:26 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
> 
>> Riccardo,
>> 
>> Actually that is what I was hinting at to be honest, as i feel the method of 
>> selecting text within Safari is rather sloppy.  You can also navigate by 
>> line within iOS, so hoped that feature would come across to OS X.  
>> Navigating by line is also useful when trying to read pages that have been 
>> styled into columns via CSS instead of a table.  This can be done in JAWS 
>> quite nicely.
>> 
>> Chris 
>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:11, Ricardo Walker wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> I doubt you will see the reading by line with the down arrow.  That would 
>>> radically change the way VO navigates the web, and I'm not sure it would be 
>>> for the better.  It would be selecting text easier though.
>>> 
>>> Ricardo Walker
>>> rica...@appletothecore.info
>>> Twitter:@apple2thecore
>>> www.appletothecore.info
>>> 
>>> On Jul 2, 2012, at 6:37 PM, Chris Moore  wrote:
>>> 
 Hmmm I remember a while back putting a list of 15 improvements.  I can't 
 remember them all now, so perhaps I have just learnt to live without them. 
  I did report them to Apple though as bugs and feature enhancements.
 
 The VoiceOver busy is the biggest annoyance which is caused by  the 
 pathetic slow buffering system voice over uses.  So I would like to see 
 that rewritten from the ground up.  There are a few random performance 
 bugs that happen now and then which require me to switch voice over off 
 then back on again.  So overall performance could do with being improved.
 
 I would also like to know what web page I am looking at when switching 
 between tabs, being told that is an HTML page is not exactly helpful.  I 
 would also like to navigate line by line just by pressing the down arrow 
 or up key.  VO still needs a bit of work when reporting how many HMTL  
 elements are on a web page, some windows screen readers seem to find more 
 tables and headings than VO,  especially in the buggy rotor.
 
 I would like the ability to edit form fields in a PDF with Preview, but I 
 believe this is coming in the next Mountain Lion release (according to 
 Apple's website).  
 
 I would appreciate MIDI event editing in GarageBand, and a huge update to 
 iWork.  There just is not enough accessible productive software on the 
 Mac.  There is more to using a Mac than just Skype and Mail surely?
 
 Not sure if that bug still exists when using the real speak voices where 
 the pitch used to shift up and down randomly.  I stopped using those 
 voices as it became too annoying.
 
 I would also like the ability to edit voice over's dictionary.  For 
 example if you type third as in the number 3 followed by the letters r and 
 d, you get 3rd (three road), surely this should be a third?  So I think 
 the ability to edit some of VO's assumptions would be nice, or maybe VO 
 should grow up and become a tad more intelligent.  I would like more 
 control over how VO reads out numbers too.
 
 Maybe developers should also be given the option to name what VO calls an 
 HTML area, as something else?  For example when using adium the chat 
 window is called an HTML area, am sure a chat window or conversation 
 window would be more meaningful.
 
 Last but not least, I find VO a bit slow when first entering the iTunes 
 store.  The page takes a while to render.  Well actually visually it does 
 not, but VO seems to think it does.  Actually come to mention it when VO 
 says something is busy, a sighted person can still move the mouse and 
 perform the action they require, it is just VO's buffer which is busy.
 
 I spotted another bug today too.  When ordering a smart case for my iPad, 
 VO was unable to read out the colour options.  When trying to select a 
 colour, VO simply said "space radio button" for each of the 6 colours

Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Garth Humphreys]

Hi Ricardo, I wonder the same thing. I also wonder how am many people like me 
would use Zoom if only it worked a bit better. With VO At work where we are 
firmly set in the windows world, I primarily use JAWS but use ZoomText in 
conjunction with it. I have it set to about 30 times on a 28 inch screen. The 
point is that I use zoom text because at times it can add to my experience and 
efficiency even if a lot of the time I am actually relying on JAWS. With 

I feel that Zoom on the Mac actually takes away from my experience of Voice 
Over.

I hope there are a few other people out there giving there feedback. 


Garth
iblindtech.com

On 03/07/2012, at 7:55 PM, Ricardo Walker wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> I wonder how many zoom users are out there?  I ask because, I wonder if there 
> are enough users to give Apple enough feedback.  My vision isn't good enough 
> to really use zoom for any extensive length of time so, I can't really point 
> anything out.  Well, except the way it bounces Voiceover around when trying 
> to navigate menus.  I think this is probably do to me having the mouse cursor 
> following Voiceover though. 
> 
> Ricardo Walker
> rica...@appletothecore.info
> Twitter:@apple2thecore
> www.appletothecore.info
> 
> On Jul 3, 2012, at 4:44 AM, Garth Humphreys  wrote:
> 
>> I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom and just 
>> some improvements to Zoom in general. I mostly don't use Zoom on my Mac but 
>> this only because it is so poor when compared to things like ZoomText in the 
>> windows world. It is probably great if you don't need to use Voice Over or 
>> if you only need a little enlargement but it falls completely short for me.
>> 
>> Garth
>> iblindtech.com
>> 
>> On 03/07/2012, at 6:26 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
>> 
>>> Riccardo,
>>> 
>>> Actually that is what I was hinting at to be honest, as i feel the method 
>>> of selecting text within Safari is rather sloppy.  You can also navigate by 
>>> line within iOS, so hoped that feature would come across to OS X.  
>>> Navigating by line is also useful when trying to read pages that have been 
>>> styled into columns via CSS instead of a table.  This can be done in JAWS 
>>> quite nicely.
>>> 
>>> Chris 
>>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:11, Ricardo Walker wrote:
>>> 
 Hi,
 
 I doubt you will see the reading by line with the down arrow.  That would 
 radically change the way VO navigates the web, and I'm not sure it would 
 be for the better.  It would be selecting text easier though.
 
 Ricardo Walker
 rica...@appletothecore.info
 Twitter:@apple2thecore
 www.appletothecore.info
 
 On Jul 2, 2012, at 6:37 PM, Chris Moore  wrote:
 
> Hmmm I remember a while back putting a list of 15 improvements.  I can't 
> remember them all now, so perhaps I have just learnt to live without 
> them.  I did report them to Apple though as bugs and feature enhancements.
> 
> The VoiceOver busy is the biggest annoyance which is caused by  the 
> pathetic slow buffering system voice over uses.  So I would like to see 
> that rewritten from the ground up.  There are a few random performance 
> bugs that happen now and then which require me to switch voice over off 
> then back on again.  So overall performance could do with being improved.
> 
> I would also like to know what web page I am looking at when switching 
> between tabs, being told that is an HTML page is not exactly helpful.  I 
> would also like to navigate line by line just by pressing the down arrow 
> or up key.  VO still needs a bit of work when reporting how many HMTL  
> elements are on a web page, some windows screen readers seem to find more 
> tables and headings than VO,  especially in the buggy rotor.
> 
> I would like the ability to edit form fields in a PDF with Preview, but I 
> believe this is coming in the next Mountain Lion release (according to 
> Apple's website).  
> 
> I would appreciate MIDI event editing in GarageBand, and a huge update to 
> iWork.  There just is not enough accessible productive software on the 
> Mac.  There is more to using a Mac than just Skype and Mail surely?
> 
> Not sure if that bug still exists when using the real speak voices where 
> the pitch used to shift up and down randomly.  I stopped using those 
> voices as it became too annoying.
> 
> I would also like the ability to edit voice over's dictionary.  For 
> example if you type third as in the number 3 followed by the letters r 
> and d, you get 3rd (three road), surely this should be a third?  So I 
> think the ability to edit some of VO's assumptions would be nice, or 
> maybe VO should grow up and become a tad more intelligent.  I would like 
> more control over how VO reads out numbers too.
> 
> Maybe developers should also be given the option to name what VO calls an 
> HTML area, as so

Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Chris Moore]

Well with any luck Apple may head in this direction, as they appear to have got 
the message with iOS 6 that zoom and voice over at the same time would be 
beneficial.  If it was improved and there were better contrast colour schemes, 
I may consider using it myself.  I sometimes fire up ZoomText on my work PC 
when using JAWS to sometimes find that button within a web page that JAWS can't 
see or a dialog window that JAWS refuses to read.

So where would you see using the caps lock over using quick nav?

Thanks 

Chris 
On 3 Jul 2012, at 10:31, Garth Humphreys wrote:

> There are a few bugs when zoomed to high levels, i.e., more than 14X or so. 
> If you have VO running and zoom set to follow the keyboard focus you will 
> find that the command tab to switch between apps becomes unreliable and 
> navigating the menu bar with the arrow keys is also unreliable. Also I don't 
> like the way it tracks and works with reading text. I'd like better colour 
> options and keyboard commands to adjust them, or at least for the invert 
> brightness keyboard command not to conflict with a Voice Over command. You 
> would think that Apple would be able to sort out keyboard command conflicts 
> between two of their own accessibility utilities. I am sure there are work 
> arounds for some of these but a work around isn't the same as fixing the 
> problem. For example the menu navigation issue I mentioned does not occur if 
> you use swipes on the trackpad with trackpad commander to navigate the menu. 
> It only happens with the arrow keys - strange but there you are.
> 
> If I used it regularly I would probably come across more of the issues. It 
> really doesn't seem to me that apple intended the two utilities to work 
> together or at least that this was an edge case. It would seem to me that 
> they expected people to use either option exclusively and if so, they are 
> probably right. Most people probably do use one or the other.
> 
> I'd also love to see the safari busy issue buried deep. 
> 
> The addition of the ability to set the caps lock key to act as the VO 
> modifier would also be great. 
> 
> Garth
> iblindtech.com
> On 03/07/2012, at 6:48 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
> 
>> What improvements would you like fixed in particular when it comes to zoom?
>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 09:44, Garth Humphreys wrote:
>> 
>>> I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom and just 
>>> some improvements to Zoom in general. I mostly don't use Zoom on my Mac but 
>>> this only because it is so poor when compared to things like ZoomText in 
>>> the windows world. It is probably great if you don't need to use Voice Over 
>>> or if you only need a little enlargement but it falls completely short for 
>>> me.
>>> 
>>> Garth
>>> iblindtech.com
>>> 
>>> On 03/07/2012, at 6:26 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
>>> 
 Riccardo,
 
 Actually that is what I was hinting at to be honest, as i feel the method 
 of selecting text within Safari is rather sloppy.  You can also navigate 
 by line within iOS, so hoped that feature would come across to OS X.  
 Navigating by line is also useful when trying to read pages that have been 
 styled into columns via CSS instead of a table.  This can be done in JAWS 
 quite nicely.
 
 Chris 
 On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:11, Ricardo Walker wrote:
 
> Hi,
> 
> I doubt you will see the reading by line with the down arrow.  That would 
> radically change the way VO navigates the web, and I'm not sure it would 
> be for the better.  It would be selecting text easier though.
> 
> Ricardo Walker
> rica...@appletothecore.info
> Twitter:@apple2thecore
> www.appletothecore.info
> 
> On Jul 2, 2012, at 6:37 PM, Chris Moore  
> wrote:
> 
>> Hmmm I remember a while back putting a list of 15 improvements.  I can't 
>> remember them all now, so perhaps I have just learnt to live without 
>> them.  I did report them to Apple though as bugs and feature 
>> enhancements.
>> 
>> The VoiceOver busy is the biggest annoyance which is caused by  the 
>> pathetic slow buffering system voice over uses.  So I would like to see 
>> that rewritten from the ground up.  There are a few random performance 
>> bugs that happen now and then which require me to switch voice over off 
>> then back on again.  So overall performance could do with being improved.
>> 
>> I would also like to know what web page I am looking at when switching 
>> between tabs, being told that is an HTML page is not exactly helpful.  I 
>> would also like to navigate line by line just by pressing the down arrow 
>> or up key.  VO still needs a bit of work when reporting how many HMTL  
>> elements are on a web page, some windows screen readers seem to find 
>> more tables and headings than VO,  especially in the buggy rotor.
>> 
>> I would like the ability to edit form fields in a PDF with Prev

Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Garth Humphreys]

I prefer not to have to take my fingers off the home keys. It is not so much 
with the arrow keys that I would want to use the caps lock key but with the 
other vo commands. I can't help think that the caps lock key is a complete 
waste of prime keyboard real-estate, if you know what I mean. It is much more 
efficient to my way of thinking to just move your little finger to the caps 
lock key as compared to either removing your left or right hand from it's home 
keys to press the current VO modifiers.

Garth
iblindtech.com

On 03/07/2012, at 8:39 PM, Chris Moore wrote:

> Well with any luck Apple may head in this direction, as they appear to have 
> got the message with iOS 6 that zoom and voice over at the same time would be 
> beneficial.  If it was improved and there were better contrast colour 
> schemes, I may consider using it myself.  I sometimes fire up ZoomText on my 
> work PC when using JAWS to sometimes find that button within a web page that 
> JAWS can't see or a dialog window that JAWS refuses to read.
> 
> So where would you see using the caps lock over using quick nav?
> 
> Thanks 
> 
> Chris 
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 10:31, Garth Humphreys wrote:
> 
>> There are a few bugs when zoomed to high levels, i.e., more than 14X or so. 
>> If you have VO running and zoom set to follow the keyboard focus you will 
>> find that the command tab to switch between apps becomes unreliable and 
>> navigating the menu bar with the arrow keys is also unreliable. Also I don't 
>> like the way it tracks and works with reading text. I'd like better colour 
>> options and keyboard commands to adjust them, or at least for the invert 
>> brightness keyboard command not to conflict with a Voice Over command. You 
>> would think that Apple would be able to sort out keyboard command conflicts 
>> between two of their own accessibility utilities. I am sure there are work 
>> arounds for some of these but a work around isn't the same as fixing the 
>> problem. For example the menu navigation issue I mentioned does not occur if 
>> you use swipes on the trackpad with trackpad commander to navigate the menu. 
>> It only happens with the arrow keys - strange but there you are.
>> 
>> If I used it regularly I would probably come across more of the issues. It 
>> really doesn't seem to me that apple intended the two utilities to work 
>> together or at least that this was an edge case. It would seem to me that 
>> they expected people to use either option exclusively and if so, they are 
>> probably right. Most people probably do use one or the other.
>> 
>> I'd also love to see the safari busy issue buried deep. 
>> 
>> The addition of the ability to set the caps lock key to act as the VO 
>> modifier would also be great. 
>> 
>> Garth
>> iblindtech.com
>> On 03/07/2012, at 6:48 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
>> 
>>> What improvements would you like fixed in particular when it comes to zoom?
>>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 09:44, Garth Humphreys wrote:
>>> 
 I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom and just 
 some improvements to Zoom in general. I mostly don't use Zoom on my Mac 
 but this only because it is so poor when compared to things like ZoomText 
 in the windows world. It is probably great if you don't need to use Voice 
 Over or if you only need a little enlargement but it falls completely 
 short for me.
 
 Garth
 iblindtech.com
 
 On 03/07/2012, at 6:26 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
 
> Riccardo,
> 
> Actually that is what I was hinting at to be honest, as i feel the method 
> of selecting text within Safari is rather sloppy.  You can also navigate 
> by line within iOS, so hoped that feature would come across to OS X.  
> Navigating by line is also useful when trying to read pages that have 
> been styled into columns via CSS instead of a table.  This can be done in 
> JAWS quite nicely.
> 
> Chris 
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:11, Ricardo Walker wrote:
> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I doubt you will see the reading by line with the down arrow.  That 
>> would radically change the way VO navigates the web, and I'm not sure it 
>> would be for the better.  It would be selecting text easier though.
>> 
>> Ricardo Walker
>> rica...@appletothecore.info
>> Twitter:@apple2thecore
>> www.appletothecore.info
>> 
>> On Jul 2, 2012, at 6:37 PM, Chris Moore  
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> Hmmm I remember a while back putting a list of 15 improvements.  I 
>>> can't remember them all now, so perhaps I have just learnt to live 
>>> without them.  I did report them to Apple though as bugs and feature 
>>> enhancements.
>>> 
>>> The VoiceOver busy is the biggest annoyance which is caused by  the 
>>> pathetic slow buffering system voice over uses.  So I would like to see 
>>> that rewritten from the ground up.  There are a few random performance 
>>> bugs that happen now and t

Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Chris Moore]

I guess that makes sense.  I suppose that is the charm of VO, it can be used in 
so many different ways.  

If I am using my iMac, then I tend to use the numeric keypad., and if I am 
using my iOS devices I use quick nav via a bluetooth keyboard, and when using 
my Macbook I use the track pad.

Caps lock gets my vote too then if anyone at Apple is listening.

HOw about built in OCR anyone? or would anyone like to see eloquence added to 
the voice list too?

Chris 


On 3 Jul 2012, at 12:18, Garth Humphreys wrote:

> I prefer not to have to take my fingers off the home keys. It is not so much 
> with the arrow keys that I would want to use the caps lock key but with the 
> other vo commands. I can't help think that the caps lock key is a complete 
> waste of prime keyboard real-estate, if you know what I mean. It is much more 
> efficient to my way of thinking to just move your little finger to the caps 
> lock key as compared to either removing your left or right hand from it's 
> home keys to press the current VO modifiers.
> 
> Garth
> iblindtech.com
> 
> On 03/07/2012, at 8:39 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
> 
>> Well with any luck Apple may head in this direction, as they appear to have 
>> got the message with iOS 6 that zoom and voice over at the same time would 
>> be beneficial.  If it was improved and there were better contrast colour 
>> schemes, I may consider using it myself.  I sometimes fire up ZoomText on my 
>> work PC when using JAWS to sometimes find that button within a web page that 
>> JAWS can't see or a dialog window that JAWS refuses to read.
>> 
>> So where would you see using the caps lock over using quick nav?
>> 
>> Thanks 
>> 
>> Chris 
>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 10:31, Garth Humphreys wrote:
>> 
>>> There are a few bugs when zoomed to high levels, i.e., more than 14X or so. 
>>> If you have VO running and zoom set to follow the keyboard focus you will 
>>> find that the command tab to switch between apps becomes unreliable and 
>>> navigating the menu bar with the arrow keys is also unreliable. Also I 
>>> don't like the way it tracks and works with reading text. I'd like better 
>>> colour options and keyboard commands to adjust them, or at least for the 
>>> invert brightness keyboard command not to conflict with a Voice Over 
>>> command. You would think that Apple would be able to sort out keyboard 
>>> command conflicts between two of their own accessibility utilities. I am 
>>> sure there are work arounds for some of these but a work around isn't the 
>>> same as fixing the problem. For example the menu navigation issue I 
>>> mentioned does not occur if you use swipes on the trackpad with trackpad 
>>> commander to navigate the menu. It only happens with the arrow keys - 
>>> strange but there you are.
>>> 
>>> If I used it regularly I would probably come across more of the issues. It 
>>> really doesn't seem to me that apple intended the two utilities to work 
>>> together or at least that this was an edge case. It would seem to me that 
>>> they expected people to use either option exclusively and if so, they are 
>>> probably right. Most people probably do use one or the other.
>>> 
>>> I'd also love to see the safari busy issue buried deep. 
>>> 
>>> The addition of the ability to set the caps lock key to act as the VO 
>>> modifier would also be great. 
>>> 
>>> Garth
>>> iblindtech.com
>>> On 03/07/2012, at 6:48 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
>>> 
 What improvements would you like fixed in particular when it comes to zoom?
 On 3 Jul 2012, at 09:44, Garth Humphreys wrote:
 
> I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom and just 
> some improvements to Zoom in general. I mostly don't use Zoom on my Mac 
> but this only because it is so poor when compared to things like ZoomText 
> in the windows world. It is probably great if you don't need to use Voice 
> Over or if you only need a little enlargement but it falls completely 
> short for me.
> 
> Garth
> iblindtech.com
> 
> On 03/07/2012, at 6:26 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
> 
>> Riccardo,
>> 
>> Actually that is what I was hinting at to be honest, as i feel the 
>> method of selecting text within Safari is rather sloppy.  You can also 
>> navigate by line within iOS, so hoped that feature would come across to 
>> OS X.  Navigating by line is also useful when trying to read pages that 
>> have been styled into columns via CSS instead of a table.  This can be 
>> done in JAWS quite nicely.
>> 
>> Chris 
>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:11, Ricardo Walker wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> I doubt you will see the reading by line with the down arrow.  That 
>>> would radically change the way VO navigates the web, and I'm not sure 
>>> it would be for the better.  It would be selecting text easier though.
>>> 
>>> Ricardo Walker
>>> rica...@appletothecore.info
>>> Twitter:@apple2thecore
>>> www.a

Re: please help with the space key

[Søren Jensen]

Hi.

The only thing I can think off which hasn't been mentioned yet is the keyboard 
settings in the universal settings in system preferences. I don't know if 
something there can make this happen with your space bar.
Best regards:
Søren Jensen
Mail & MSN:
s...@coolfortheblind.dk
Website:
http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/

Den 02/07/2012 kl. 22.58 skrev Mark BurningHawk Baxter:

> Too bad; trying an external keyboard was a great troubleshooting idea.   Does 
> the same thing happen to the space bar when you turn track pad commander off? 
>  
> 
> 
> • Mark BurningHawk Baxter
> • AIM, Skype and Twitter:  BurningHawk1969
> • MSN:  burninghawk1...@hotmail.com
> • My home page:
> • http://MarkBurningHawk.net/
> 
> -- 
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Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Daniel McGee]

eloquence 100% is for me. If I had this, then I wouldn't be using windows 
anymore there's something about the voice that I can listen to it and I don't 
get tired of it. I have a hearing impairment and find it is more clear 
understandable in words than these silly nuance voices. I don't want that to be 
offending to anyone who uses the nuance real speak voices but for me, I just 
don't understand them clearly, to slow no matter how much I speed them up I 
can't understand them when they are really fast anyway and lastly too slow even 
when I can follow them. 
Ohand caps lock gets my vote too. 
If the day comes where Apple have eloquence added to the list of VO voices, 
will be the day where I differently upgrade my OS! 

How do others feel about eloquence being added? 
You got me started on this one! LOL 

Daniel 
On 3 Jul 2012, at 12:47, Chris Moore wrote:

> I guess that makes sense.  I suppose that is the charm of VO, it can be used 
> in so many different ways.  
> 
> If I am using my iMac, then I tend to use the numeric keypad., and if I am 
> using my iOS devices I use quick nav via a bluetooth keyboard, and when using 
> my Macbook I use the track pad.
> 
> Caps lock gets my vote too then if anyone at Apple is listening.
> 
> HOw about built in OCR anyone? or would anyone like to see eloquence added to 
> the voice list too?
> 
> Chris 
> 
> 
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 12:18, Garth Humphreys wrote:
> 
>> I prefer not to have to take my fingers off the home keys. It is not so much 
>> with the arrow keys that I would want to use the caps lock key but with the 
>> other vo commands. I can't help think that the caps lock key is a complete 
>> waste of prime keyboard real-estate, if you know what I mean. It is much 
>> more efficient to my way of thinking to just move your little finger to the 
>> caps lock key as compared to either removing your left or right hand from 
>> it's home keys to press the current VO modifiers.
>> 
>> Garth
>> iblindtech.com
>> 
>> On 03/07/2012, at 8:39 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
>> 
>>> Well with any luck Apple may head in this direction, as they appear to have 
>>> got the message with iOS 6 that zoom and voice over at the same time would 
>>> be beneficial.  If it was improved and there were better contrast colour 
>>> schemes, I may consider using it myself.  I sometimes fire up ZoomText on 
>>> my work PC when using JAWS to sometimes find that button within a web page 
>>> that JAWS can't see or a dialog window that JAWS refuses to read.
>>> 
>>> So where would you see using the caps lock over using quick nav?
>>> 
>>> Thanks 
>>> 
>>> Chris 
>>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 10:31, Garth Humphreys wrote:
>>> 
 There are a few bugs when zoomed to high levels, i.e., more than 14X or 
 so. If you have VO running and zoom set to follow the keyboard focus you 
 will find that the command tab to switch between apps becomes unreliable 
 and navigating the menu bar with the arrow keys is also unreliable. Also I 
 don't like the way it tracks and works with reading text. I'd like better 
 colour options and keyboard commands to adjust them, or at least for the 
 invert brightness keyboard command not to conflict with a Voice Over 
 command. You would think that Apple would be able to sort out keyboard 
 command conflicts between two of their own accessibility utilities. I am 
 sure there are work arounds for some of these but a work around isn't the 
 same as fixing the problem. For example the menu navigation issue I 
 mentioned does not occur if you use swipes on the trackpad with trackpad 
 commander to navigate the menu. It only happens with the arrow keys - 
 strange but there you are.
 
 If I used it regularly I would probably come across more of the issues. It 
 really doesn't seem to me that apple intended the two utilities to work 
 together or at least that this was an edge case. It would seem to me that 
 they expected people to use either option exclusively and if so, they are 
 probably right. Most people probably do use one or the other.
 
 I'd also love to see the safari busy issue buried deep. 
 
 The addition of the ability to set the caps lock key to act as the VO 
 modifier would also be great. 
 
 Garth
 iblindtech.com
 On 03/07/2012, at 6:48 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
 
> What improvements would you like fixed in particular when it comes to 
> zoom?
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 09:44, Garth Humphreys wrote:
> 
>> I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom and just 
>> some improvements to Zoom in general. I mostly don't use Zoom on my Mac 
>> but this only because it is so poor when compared to things like 
>> ZoomText in the windows world. It is probably great if you don't need to 
>> use Voice Over or if you only need a little enlargement but it falls 
>> completely short for me.
>> 
>> Garth
>> ib

Re: found scanning program for the Mac

[erik burggraaf]

Hi, I've been using this for a year and a half.  There are pitfalls, not least 
of which is the pricetag, but I've recommended it for at least 3 or 4 clients 
and it does an amazing job.

I've also got the hovercam T5V here which would be a cheeper alternative but I 
haven't gotten it to work yet.

Best,

Erik Burggraaf
Introducing Ebony Consulting business card transcription service, starting at 
$0.45 per card or $35 per hundred cards.
Ebony Consulting toll-free: 1-888-255-5194
or on the web at http://www.erik-burggraaf.com

On 2012-07-03, at 5:17 AM, Ray Foret Jr wrote:

> Open book on the Mac?  Forget it.  This here sounds like it might be worth 
> serious consideration.  thanks.
> 
> 
> Sincerely,
> The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
> 
> Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
> 
> Skype name:
> barefootedray
> 
> On Jul 2, 2012, at 10:08 PM, Eugenia Firth wrote:
> 
>> Forgot to put the name of the program I talked about. It is from Abisee at 
>> abisee.com. They had it working on a Macbook Pro. 
>> Eugenia Firth
>> gigifi...@sbcglobal.net
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Jul 2, 2012, at 9:54 PM, Eugenia Firth wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi guys. 
>>> I wanted to tell y'all about the scanning program that I saw at the 
>>> exhibits at NFB today. True, it costs $1200, but it comes with a camera 
>>> sort of like the Purl camera. 
>>> 
>>> I had to get it going for them because the guy that knew about it wasn't at 
>>> the table at the time I showed up. He came right after I got it going. It 
>>> wouldn't talk at first. Who knows where it was on the screen. Like 
>>> OpenBook, you don't use the screen reader while it's running. However, I 
>>> had to turn their VoiceOver on, press command q and get out of their 
>>> program, and then call it back up again, after I turned off their track 
>>> pad. The person that was sitting there keeping watch while the developer 
>>> was gone for a little bit, I guess was a Windows user. Anyway, I got the 
>>> program going. 
>>> 
>>> The developer that came back was very knowledgeable. He told me they had a 
>>> former Kurzweil engineer with them. When I did the scan, it reading was 
>>> incredibly good, even in the light my husband said was glaring on the 
>>> paper. 
>>> 
>>> I have a Purl camera I am considering selling. It doesn't have much use on 
>>> it, and maybe I ought to sell OpenBook while I'm at it. However, I don't 
>>> know if I can. The state gave me OpenBook, but I bought the Purl camera 
>>> myself. I'll have to find out what I can do about OpenBook. 
>>> 
>>> Eugenia Firth
>>> gigifi...@sbcglobal.net
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
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>>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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>>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
>> 
>> 
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> 
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RE: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Missy Hoppe]

While I agree 100 percent that Eloquence is the only speech that is efficient 
enough to actually get things done with, I've
never been particularly fond of it. Not sure that makes sense given that I've 
used Glen more or less exclusively for the past
12 years or so, but on the whole, I think Eloquence is seriously over-rated. 
True, it's the only thing I use on the PC side,
but that's out of necessity, not because I find it pleasant or anything. I 
don't use the RealSpeak voices on the mac either,
though. I even bought the acapella voices, but still find myself only using 
Alex as a general rule. So, while I can see both
sides of the coin on the eloquence thing, it's nothing I'd get all excited 
about if Apple ever incorporated it. In most
cases, Alex is responsive enough for my needs on the mac. I'd love to see a 
female equivelent of Alex, though. Alice,
perhaps? It's just that when it comes to those higher quality voices, I find 
the female ones slightly easier to understand in
most cases.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Daniel McGee
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 9:39 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or 
squashed in Mountain Lion?

eloquence 100% is for me. If I had this, then I wouldn't be using windows 
anymore there's something about the voice that I
can listen to it and I don't get tired of it. I have a hearing impairment and 
find it is more clear understandable in words
than these silly nuance voices. I don't want that to be offending to anyone who 
uses the nuance real speak voices but for me,
I just don't understand them clearly, to slow no matter how much I speed them 
up I can't understand them when they are really
fast anyway and lastly too slow even when I can follow them.
Ohand caps lock gets my vote too.
If the day comes where Apple have eloquence added to the list of VO voices, 
will be the day where I differently upgrade my
OS!

How do others feel about eloquence being added?
You got me started on this one! LOL

Daniel
On 3 Jul 2012, at 12:47, Chris Moore wrote:

> I guess that makes sense.  I suppose that is the charm of VO, it can be used 
> in so many different ways.
>
> If I am using my iMac, then I tend to use the numeric keypad., and if I am 
> using my iOS devices I use quick nav via a
bluetooth keyboard, and when using my Macbook I use the track pad.
>
> Caps lock gets my vote too then if anyone at Apple is listening.
>
> HOw about built in OCR anyone? or would anyone like to see eloquence added to 
> the voice list too?
>
> Chris
>
>
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 12:18, Garth Humphreys wrote:
>
>> I prefer not to have to take my fingers off the home keys. It is not so much 
>> with the arrow keys that I would want to use
the caps lock key but with the other vo commands. I can't help think that the 
caps lock key is a complete waste of prime
keyboard real-estate, if you know what I mean. It is much more efficient to my 
way of thinking to just move your little
finger to the caps lock key as compared to either removing your left or right 
hand from it's home keys to press the current
VO modifiers.
>>
>> Garth
>> iblindtech.com
>>
>> On 03/07/2012, at 8:39 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
>>
>>> Well with any luck Apple may head in this direction, as they appear to have 
>>> got the message with iOS 6 that zoom and
voice over at the same time would be beneficial.  If it was improved and there 
were better contrast colour schemes, I may
consider using it myself.  I sometimes fire up ZoomText on my work PC when 
using JAWS to sometimes find that button within a
web page that JAWS can't see or a dialog window that JAWS refuses to read.
>>>
>>> So where would you see using the caps lock over using quick nav?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> Chris
>>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 10:31, Garth Humphreys wrote:
>>>
 There are a few bugs when zoomed to high levels, i.e., more than 14X or 
 so. If you have VO running and zoom set to
follow the keyboard focus you will find that the command tab to switch between 
apps becomes unreliable and navigating the
menu bar with the arrow keys is also unreliable. Also I don't like the way it 
tracks and works with reading text. I'd like
better colour options and keyboard commands to adjust them, or at least for the 
invert brightness keyboard command not to
conflict with a Voice Over command. You would think that Apple would be able to 
sort out keyboard command conflicts between
two of their own accessibility utilities. I am sure there are work arounds for 
some of these but a work around isn't the same
as fixing the problem. For example the menu navigation issue I mentioned does 
not occur if you use swipes on the trackpad
with trackpad commander to navigate the menu. It only happens with the arrow 
keys - strange but there you are.

 If I used it regularly I would probably come across more of the issues. It 

Re: found scanning program for the Mac

[Krysti .Power]

What is openbook this scanning program sounds interesting
On 2012-07-02 11:54 PM, "Eugenia Firth"  wrote:

> Hi guys.
> I wanted to tell y'all about the scanning program that I saw at the
> exhibits at NFB today. True, it costs $1200, but it comes with a camera
> sort of like the Purl camera.
>
> I had to get it going for them because the guy that knew about it wasn't
> at the table at the time I showed up. He came right after I got it going.
> It wouldn't talk at first. Who knows where it was on the screen. Like
> OpenBook, you don't use the screen reader while it's running. However, I
> had to turn their VoiceOver on, press command q and get out of their
> program, and then call it back up again, after I turned off their track
> pad. The person that was sitting there keeping watch while the developer
> was gone for a little bit, I guess was a Windows user. Anyway, I got the
> program going.
>
> The developer that came back was very knowledgeable. He told me they had a
> former Kurzweil engineer with them. When I did the scan, it reading was
> incredibly good, even in the light my husband said was glaring on the
> paper.
>
> I have a Purl camera I am considering selling. It doesn't have much use on
> it, and maybe I ought to sell OpenBook while I'm at it. However, I don't
> know if I can. The state gave me OpenBook, but I bought the Purl camera
> myself. I'll have to find out what I can do about OpenBook.
>
> Eugenia Firth
> gigifi...@sbcglobal.net
>
>
>
>  --
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> "MacVisionaries" group.
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RE: found scanning program for the Mac

[Daniel Miller]

OpenBook is an OCR program for Windows.

I'd assume you're talking about iPal, correct, for the mac, that is?

 

From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Krysti .Power
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 8:48 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: found scanning program for the Mac

 

What is openbook this scanning program sounds interesting

On 2012-07-02 11:54 PM, "Eugenia Firth"  wrote:

Hi guys. 

I wanted to tell y'all about the scanning program that I saw at the exhibits
at NFB today. True, it costs $1200, but it comes with a camera sort of like
the Purl camera. 

 

I had to get it going for them because the guy that knew about it wasn't at
the table at the time I showed up. He came right after I got it going. It
wouldn't talk at first. Who knows where it was on the screen. Like OpenBook,
you don't use the screen reader while it's running. However, I had to turn
their VoiceOver on, press command q and get out of their program, and then
call it back up again, after I turned off their track pad. The person that
was sitting there keeping watch while the developer was gone for a little
bit, I guess was a Windows user. Anyway, I got the program going. 

 

The developer that came back was very knowledgeable. He told me they had a
former Kurzweil engineer with them. When I did the scan, it reading was
incredibly good, even in the light my husband said was glaring on the paper.


 

I have a Purl camera I am considering selling. It doesn't have much use on
it, and maybe I ought to sell OpenBook while I'm at it. However, I don't
know if I can. The state gave me OpenBook, but I bought the Purl camera
myself. I'll have to find out what I can do about OpenBook. 

 

Eugenia Firth

gigifi...@sbcglobal.net

 

 

 

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 .
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Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Kevin Mattingly]

I'd rather have the dectalk voices. 
On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:38 AM, Daniel McGee wrote:

> eloquence 100% is for me. If I had this, then I wouldn't be using windows 
> anymore there's something about the voice that I can listen to it and I don't 
> get tired of it. I have a hearing impairment and find it is more clear 
> understandable in words than these silly nuance voices. I don't want that to 
> be offending to anyone who uses the nuance real speak voices but for me, I 
> just don't understand them clearly, to slow no matter how much I speed them 
> up I can't understand them when they are really fast anyway and lastly too 
> slow even when I can follow them. 
> Ohand caps lock gets my vote too. 
> If the day comes where Apple have eloquence added to the list of VO voices, 
> will be the day where I differently upgrade my OS! 
> 
> How do others feel about eloquence being added? 
> You got me started on this one! LOL 
> 
> Daniel 
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 12:47, Chris Moore wrote:
> 
>> I guess that makes sense.  I suppose that is the charm of VO, it can be used 
>> in so many different ways.  
>> 
>> If I am using my iMac, then I tend to use the numeric keypad., and if I am 
>> using my iOS devices I use quick nav via a bluetooth keyboard, and when 
>> using my Macbook I use the track pad.
>> 
>> Caps lock gets my vote too then if anyone at Apple is listening.
>> 
>> HOw about built in OCR anyone? or would anyone like to see eloquence added 
>> to the voice list too?
>> 
>> Chris 
>> 
>> 
>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 12:18, Garth Humphreys wrote:
>> 
>>> I prefer not to have to take my fingers off the home keys. It is not so 
>>> much with the arrow keys that I would want to use the caps lock key but 
>>> with the other vo commands. I can't help think that the caps lock key is a 
>>> complete waste of prime keyboard real-estate, if you know what I mean. It 
>>> is much more efficient to my way of thinking to just move your little 
>>> finger to the caps lock key as compared to either removing your left or 
>>> right hand from it's home keys to press the current VO modifiers.
>>> 
>>> Garth
>>> iblindtech.com
>>> 
>>> On 03/07/2012, at 8:39 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
>>> 
 Well with any luck Apple may head in this direction, as they appear to 
 have got the message with iOS 6 that zoom and voice over at the same time 
 would be beneficial.  If it was improved and there were better contrast 
 colour schemes, I may consider using it myself.  I sometimes fire up 
 ZoomText on my work PC when using JAWS to sometimes find that button 
 within a web page that JAWS can't see or a dialog window that JAWS refuses 
 to read.
 
 So where would you see using the caps lock over using quick nav?
 
 Thanks 
 
 Chris 
 On 3 Jul 2012, at 10:31, Garth Humphreys wrote:
 
> There are a few bugs when zoomed to high levels, i.e., more than 14X or 
> so. If you have VO running and zoom set to follow the keyboard focus you 
> will find that the command tab to switch between apps becomes unreliable 
> and navigating the menu bar with the arrow keys is also unreliable. Also 
> I don't like the way it tracks and works with reading text. I'd like 
> better colour options and keyboard commands to adjust them, or at least 
> for the invert brightness keyboard command not to conflict with a Voice 
> Over command. You would think that Apple would be able to sort out 
> keyboard command conflicts between two of their own accessibility 
> utilities. I am sure there are work arounds for some of these but a work 
> around isn't the same as fixing the problem. For example the menu 
> navigation issue I mentioned does not occur if you use swipes on the 
> trackpad with trackpad commander to navigate the menu. It only happens 
> with the arrow keys - strange but there you are.
> 
> If I used it regularly I would probably come across more of the issues. 
> It really doesn't seem to me that apple intended the two utilities to 
> work together or at least that this was an edge case. It would seem to me 
> that they expected people to use either option exclusively and if so, 
> they are probably right. Most people probably do use one or the other.
> 
> I'd also love to see the safari busy issue buried deep. 
> 
> The addition of the ability to set the caps lock key to act as the VO 
> modifier would also be great. 
> 
> Garth
> iblindtech.com
> On 03/07/2012, at 6:48 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
> 
>> What improvements would you like fixed in particular when it comes to 
>> zoom?
>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 09:44, Garth Humphreys wrote:
>> 
>>> I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom and 
>>> just some improvements to Zoom in general. I mostly don't use Zoom on 
>>> my Mac but this only because it is so poor when compared to things like 
>>> Zoo

RE: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Daniel Miller]

Hi,

While I agree a female equivalent to Alex would be a necessary addition, I
just don't see apple ever incorporating Eloquence or the Dectalk voices, for
that matter. For one thing, why incorporate an inferior voice from Nuance
when you've already got their high quality realspeak? I completely
understand that Eloquence is the voice of choice for many people, but we'll
have to make do with what apple provides.
I personally hate eloquence, and only use it out of necessity like Missy
said.


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Kevin Mattingly
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 9:02 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or
squashed in Mountain Lion?

I'd rather have the dectalk voices. 
On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:38 AM, Daniel McGee wrote:

> eloquence 100% is for me. If I had this, then I wouldn't be using windows
anymore there's something about the voice that I can listen to it and I
don't get tired of it. I have a hearing impairment and find it is more clear
understandable in words than these silly nuance voices. I don't want that to
be offending to anyone who uses the nuance real speak voices but for me, I
just don't understand them clearly, to slow no matter how much I speed them
up I can't understand them when they are really fast anyway and lastly too
slow even when I can follow them. 
> Ohand caps lock gets my vote too. 
> If the day comes where Apple have eloquence added to the list of VO
voices, will be the day where I differently upgrade my OS! 
> 
> How do others feel about eloquence being added? 
> You got me started on this one! LOL 
> 
> Daniel 
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 12:47, Chris Moore wrote:
> 
>> I guess that makes sense.  I suppose that is the charm of VO, it can be
used in so many different ways.  
>> 
>> If I am using my iMac, then I tend to use the numeric keypad., and if I
am using my iOS devices I use quick nav via a bluetooth keyboard, and when
using my Macbook I use the track pad.
>> 
>> Caps lock gets my vote too then if anyone at Apple is listening.
>> 
>> HOw about built in OCR anyone? or would anyone like to see eloquence
added to the voice list too?
>> 
>> Chris 
>> 
>> 
>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 12:18, Garth Humphreys wrote:
>> 
>>> I prefer not to have to take my fingers off the home keys. It is not so
much with the arrow keys that I would want to use the caps lock key but with
the other vo commands. I can't help think that the caps lock key is a
complete waste of prime keyboard real-estate, if you know what I mean. It is
much more efficient to my way of thinking to just move your little finger to
the caps lock key as compared to either removing your left or right hand
from it's home keys to press the current VO modifiers.
>>> 
>>> Garth
>>> iblindtech.com
>>> 
>>> On 03/07/2012, at 8:39 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
>>> 
 Well with any luck Apple may head in this direction, as they appear to
have got the message with iOS 6 that zoom and voice over at the same time
would be beneficial.  If it was improved and there were better contrast
colour schemes, I may consider using it myself.  I sometimes fire up
ZoomText on my work PC when using JAWS to sometimes find that button within
a web page that JAWS can't see or a dialog window that JAWS refuses to read.
 
 So where would you see using the caps lock over using quick nav?
 
 Thanks 
 
 Chris 
 On 3 Jul 2012, at 10:31, Garth Humphreys wrote:
 
> There are a few bugs when zoomed to high levels, i.e., more than 14X
or so. If you have VO running and zoom set to follow the keyboard focus you
will find that the command tab to switch between apps becomes unreliable and
navigating the menu bar with the arrow keys is also unreliable. Also I don't
like the way it tracks and works with reading text. I'd like better colour
options and keyboard commands to adjust them, or at least for the invert
brightness keyboard command not to conflict with a Voice Over command. You
would think that Apple would be able to sort out keyboard command conflicts
between two of their own accessibility utilities. I am sure there are work
arounds for some of these but a work around isn't the same as fixing the
problem. For example the menu navigation issue I mentioned does not occur if
you use swipes on the trackpad with trackpad commander to navigate the menu.
It only happens with the arrow keys - strange but there you are.
> 
> If I used it regularly I would probably come across more of the
issues. It really doesn't seem to me that apple intended the two utilities
to work together or at least that this was an edge case. It would seem to me
that they expected people to use either option exclusively and if so, they
are probably right. Most people probably do use one or the other.
> 
> I'd also love to see the safari busy issue buried deep. 
> 
> The addition of the abili

Facebook frustration

[Søren Jensen]

Hi.

Before I give up and consider deleting my Facebook account, I'll bring up 
discussion to see if any of you have considered the same frustrations when 
using Facebook.

I've read on Applevis that setting Safari to react like Firefox or Internet 
explorer should make the mobile site of Facebook very useable. That won't work 
for me all the time. I experience things like the language changes, normal 
links which I could read a few seconds ago are translated into english 
graphical links, and when I click on these, nothing happens. The only way I can 
come back to the site again is by reloading the page, and if that won't work, I 
type m.facebook.com again in the address bar to reload the page. Then I'm able 
to navigate the site for a few minutes, and then the same happens over and over 
again. this makes the site nearly impossible and very frustrating to use!

I've got a mail from Facebook telling me that someone has tagged me on a 
picture. If I click the link to show what picture it is and to comment, the 
normal unusable Facebook site comes up. I expected to find this notification on 
the mobile version, but I can't find it anywhere while going through my 
frontpage. How do I figure out what picture some random person has tagged me 
on, and how do I add a comment so I can ask this question?

Each time I'm trying to give Facebook a chance I run into issues like this. 
Every time I spoke to other blind people who're using Facebook, they don't use 
these features, they keep say just use the mobile site or they don't have a Mac 
where all these issues seems to happen. The Facebook support says that 
screenreader users just have to use the mobile site, but what do we do when 
they only supports Internet explorer?
I'm really considering deleting my Facebook acount and make the totally switch 
to Twitter. If family and friends won't follow, well, that's their choice. I 
find myself spending hours on trying to navigate the Facebook site. SOmetimes 
it works and other times it's just impossible.

I really hope to get lots of great input here...
Best regards:
Søren Jensen
Mail & MSN:
s...@coolfortheblind.dk
Website:
http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/

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Re: Facebook frustration

[Laura ann Grymes, LMT]

I have been able to view post and am now enjoying using voice book vo on iOS.
The developer will add new features as the app grows and I look forward to that.
I have not had the issues your describing on m.facebook.com with language.
that sounds tedious and frustrating.

I check statuses mostly now with voicebook when I am on FB.
I look forward to new developments with it soon.
I use the macbook m.facebook.com and firefox fix lately and it works.
I change and sometimes use other sites of facebook too depending on what I am 
trying to do.
I agree its combersome and frustrating.
Laura Ann

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Re: Facebook frustration

[Rahul Bajaj]

Hey Søren,

Even I use  Facebook a lot and access almost all the features apart from 
tagging people, I guess.
However, ever since I started using the mobile site and set Firefox as the 
browser, I stopped facing any problems.
As far as commenting on  photos is concerned, you can do 2 things:
1. on the main page of the mobile site, you will almost always see a link that 
says something like "XYZ person tagged you in, say, 3 photos. If you don't see 
it there, click on the 'see all' link and you should find the notification 
there.
2. If that method doesn't work, simply open your profile in the mobile site by 
clicking the 'profile' link and, on that page, you will find a list of 
activities in which you were involved i.e. the  photos in which you were 
tagged, the status updates that you commented on, etc.

I personally don't encounter the other problems that you wrote about, so I 
would be unable to give any suggestions.
Sometimes, if the site doesn't work, just close Safari, open it again, select 
Firefox from the develop menu and go to the mobile site again.

 Feel free to mail me off-list if there's anything that I can help you 
with.
Like I said, I use Facebook a lot and I know what it feels like when using such 
a simple thing becomes so complicated.

Cheers,
Rahul   
 

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Re: Facebook frustration

[Pete Nalda]

Lately, I've heard people changing the user agent and using the full site. I 
use the full site myself with VO, and have no problems. This is with Safari on 
os x 10.6.8

Egun On, Lagunak! Basque for G'day, Mates
Louie P. (Pete) Nalda
Http://www.myspace.com/lpnalda
Http://www.facebook.com/lpnalda
Http://www.linkedin.com/in/lpnalda
Twitter @lpnalda



On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:12 AM, Søren Jensen  wrote:

> Hi.
> 
> Before I give up and consider deleting my Facebook account, I'll bring up 
> discussion to see if any of you have considered the same frustrations when 
> using Facebook.
> 
> I've read on Applevis that setting Safari to react like Firefox or Internet 
> explorer should make the mobile site of Facebook very useable. That won't 
> work for me all the time. I experience things like the language changes, 
> normal links which I could read a few seconds ago are translated into english 
> graphical links, and when I click on these, nothing happens. The only way I 
> can come back to the site again is by reloading the page, and if that won't 
> work, I type m.facebook.com again in the address bar to reload the page. Then 
> I'm able to navigate the site for a few minutes, and then the same happens 
> over and over again. this makes the site nearly impossible and very 
> frustrating to use!
> 
> I've got a mail from Facebook telling me that someone has tagged me on a 
> picture. If I click the link to show what picture it is and to comment, the 
> normal unusable Facebook site comes up. I expected to find this notification 
> on the mobile version, but I can't find it anywhere while going through my 
> frontpage. How do I figure out what picture some random person has tagged me 
> on, and how do I add a comment so I can ask this question?
> 
> Each time I'm trying to give Facebook a chance I run into issues like this. 
> Every time I spoke to other blind people who're using Facebook, they don't 
> use these features, they keep say just use the mobile site or they don't have 
> a Mac where all these issues seems to happen. The Facebook support says that 
> screenreader users just have to use the mobile site, but what do we do when 
> they only supports Internet explorer?
> I'm really considering deleting my Facebook acount and make the totally 
> switch to Twitter. If family and friends won't follow, well, that's their 
> choice. I find myself spending hours on trying to navigate the Facebook site. 
> SOmetimes it works and other times it's just impossible.
> 
> I really hope to get lots of great input here...
> Best regards:
> Søren Jensen
> Mail & MSN:
> s...@coolfortheblind.dk
> Website:
> http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/
> 
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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> 

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Re: Facebook frustration

[Maxwell Ivey]

hello; we are all frustrated with Facebook, but its just so hard to give it up 
completely.  what i do is to subscribe to as many people as possible out of my 
friends list.  then i set notifications to send me an email anytime anything 
happens.  then i just hit reply in my mail program.  when i want to post a 
photo, video, or status update i go to the regular Facebook and use the control 
option i for a finder menu and choose update.  then i can arrow left or right 
to find the field i want.  If someone sends me a friend request, i click the 
link in the message for accept or ignore. i wish you luck, max 
On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:12 AM, Søren Jensen wrote:

> Hi.
> 
> Before I give up and consider deleting my Facebook account, I'll bring up 
> discussion to see if any of you have considered the same frustrations when 
> using Facebook.
> 
> I've read on Applevis that setting Safari to react like Firefox or Internet 
> explorer should make the mobile site of Facebook very useable. That won't 
> work for me all the time. I experience things like the language changes, 
> normal links which I could read a few seconds ago are translated into english 
> graphical links, and when I click on these, nothing happens. The only way I 
> can come back to the site again is by reloading the page, and if that won't 
> work, I type m.facebook.com again in the address bar to reload the page. Then 
> I'm able to navigate the site for a few minutes, and then the same happens 
> over and over again. this makes the site nearly impossible and very 
> frustrating to use!
> 
> I've got a mail from Facebook telling me that someone has tagged me on a 
> picture. If I click the link to show what picture it is and to comment, the 
> normal unusable Facebook site comes up. I expected to find this notification 
> on the mobile version, but I can't find it anywhere while going through my 
> frontpage. How do I figure out what picture some random person has tagged me 
> on, and how do I add a comment so I can ask this question?
> 
> Each time I'm trying to give Facebook a chance I run into issues like this. 
> Every time I spoke to other blind people who're using Facebook, they don't 
> use these features, they keep say just use the mobile site or they don't have 
> a Mac where all these issues seems to happen. The Facebook support says that 
> screenreader users just have to use the mobile site, but what do we do when 
> they only supports Internet explorer?
> I'm really considering deleting my Facebook acount and make the totally 
> switch to Twitter. If family and friends won't follow, well, that's their 
> choice. I find myself spending hours on trying to navigate the Facebook site. 
> SOmetimes it works and other times it's just impossible.
> 
> I really hope to get lots of great input here...
> Best regards:
> Søren Jensen
> Mail & MSN:
> s...@coolfortheblind.dk
> Website:
> http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/
> 
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit this group at 
> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
> 

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Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[chris hallsworth]

Lol my opinion is if Nuance is so tight fist about Eloquence yet they 
are not with Vocalizer I cannot see Eloquence being featured any time soon.


On 03/07/2012 14:38, Daniel McGee wrote:

eloquence 100% is for me. If I had this, then I wouldn't be using windows 
anymore there's something about the voice that I can listen to it and I don't 
get tired of it. I have a hearing impairment and find it is more clear 
understandable in words than these silly nuance voices. I don't want that to be 
offending to anyone who uses the nuance real speak voices but for me, I just 
don't understand them clearly, to slow no matter how much I speed them up I 
can't understand them when they are really fast anyway and lastly too slow even 
when I can follow them.
Ohand caps lock gets my vote too.
If the day comes where Apple have eloquence added to the list of VO voices, 
will be the day where I differently upgrade my OS!

How do others feel about eloquence being added?
You got me started on this one! LOL

Daniel
On 3 Jul 2012, at 12:47, Chris Moore wrote:


I guess that makes sense.  I suppose that is the charm of VO, it can be used in 
so many different ways.

If I am using my iMac, then I tend to use the numeric keypad., and if I am 
using my iOS devices I use quick nav via a bluetooth keyboard, and when using 
my Macbook I use the track pad.

Caps lock gets my vote too then if anyone at Apple is listening.

HOw about built in OCR anyone? or would anyone like to see eloquence added to 
the voice list too?

Chris


On 3 Jul 2012, at 12:18, Garth Humphreys wrote:


I prefer not to have to take my fingers off the home keys. It is not so much 
with the arrow keys that I would want to use the caps lock key but with the 
other vo commands. I can't help think that the caps lock key is a complete 
waste of prime keyboard real-estate, if you know what I mean. It is much more 
efficient to my way of thinking to just move your little finger to the caps 
lock key as compared to either removing your left or right hand from it's home 
keys to press the current VO modifiers.

Garth
iblindtech.com

On 03/07/2012, at 8:39 PM, Chris Moore wrote:


Well with any luck Apple may head in this direction, as they appear to have got 
the message with iOS 6 that zoom and voice over at the same time would be 
beneficial.  If it was improved and there were better contrast colour schemes, 
I may consider using it myself.  I sometimes fire up ZoomText on my work PC 
when using JAWS to sometimes find that button within a web page that JAWS can't 
see or a dialog window that JAWS refuses to read.

So where would you see using the caps lock over using quick nav?

Thanks

Chris
On 3 Jul 2012, at 10:31, Garth Humphreys wrote:


There are a few bugs when zoomed to high levels, i.e., more than 14X or so. If 
you have VO running and zoom set to follow the keyboard focus you will find 
that the command tab to switch between apps becomes unreliable and navigating 
the menu bar with the arrow keys is also unreliable. Also I don't like the way 
it tracks and works with reading text. I'd like better colour options and 
keyboard commands to adjust them, or at least for the invert brightness 
keyboard command not to conflict with a Voice Over command. You would think 
that Apple would be able to sort out keyboard command conflicts between two of 
their own accessibility utilities. I am sure there are work arounds for some of 
these but a work around isn't the same as fixing the problem. For example the 
menu navigation issue I mentioned does not occur if you use swipes on the 
trackpad with trackpad commander to navigate the menu. It only happens with the 
arrow keys - strange but there you are.

If I used it regularly I would probably come across more of the issues. It 
really doesn't seem to me that apple intended the two utilities to work 
together or at least that this was an edge case. It would seem to me that they 
expected people to use either option exclusively and if so, they are probably 
right. Most people probably do use one or the other.

I'd also love to see the safari busy issue buried deep.

The addition of the ability to set the caps lock key to act as the VO modifier 
would also be great.

Garth
iblindtech.com
On 03/07/2012, at 6:48 PM, Chris Moore wrote:


What improvements would you like fixed in particular when it comes to zoom?
On 3 Jul 2012, at 09:44, Garth Humphreys wrote:


I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom and just some 
improvements to Zoom in general. I mostly don't use Zoom on my Mac but this 
only because it is so poor when compared to things like ZoomText in the windows 
world. It is probably great if you don't need to use Voice Over or if you only 
need a little enlargement but it falls completely short for me.

Garth
iblindtech.com

On 03/07/2012, at 6:26 PM, Chris Moore wrote:


Riccardo,

Actually that is what I was hinting at to be honest, as i feel the method of 
selecting text within Safari is ra

Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Anne Robertson]

Hello,

Vicky is supposed to be the female equivalent of Alex. Personally, I can't 
stand either of them. I've been using Fred for years because he's clear and 
quite neutral.


On 3 Jul 2012, at 16:05, Daniel Miller wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> While I agree a female equivalent to Alex would be a necessary addition, I
> just don't see apple ever incorporating Eloquence or the Dectalk voices, for
> that matter.

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GooglePlus, (was Facebook frustration)

[Donna Goodin]

Just curious, has anyone tried GooglePlus?  If so, how is it in terms of 
accessibility?
Cheers,
Donna
On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:49 AM, Maxwell Ivey wrote:

> hello; we are all frustrated with Facebook, but its just so hard to give it 
> up completely.  what i do is to subscribe to as many people as possible out 
> of my friends list.  then i set notifications to send me an email anytime 
> anything happens.  then i just hit reply in my mail program.  when i want to 
> post a photo, video, or status update i go to the regular Facebook and use 
> the control option i for a finder menu and choose update.  then i can arrow 
> left or right to find the field i want.  If someone sends me a friend 
> request, i click the link in the message for accept or ignore. i wish you 
> luck, max 
> On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:12 AM, Søren Jensen wrote:
> 
>> Hi.
>> 
>> Before I give up and consider deleting my Facebook account, I'll bring up 
>> discussion to see if any of you have considered the same frustrations when 
>> using Facebook.
>> 
>> I've read on Applevis that setting Safari to react like Firefox or Internet 
>> explorer should make the mobile site of Facebook very useable. That won't 
>> work for me all the time. I experience things like the language changes, 
>> normal links which I could read a few seconds ago are translated into 
>> english graphical links, and when I click on these, nothing happens. The 
>> only way I can come back to the site again is by reloading the page, and if 
>> that won't work, I type m.facebook.com again in the address bar to reload 
>> the page. Then I'm able to navigate the site for a few minutes, and then the 
>> same happens over and over again. this makes the site nearly impossible and 
>> very frustrating to use!
>> 
>> I've got a mail from Facebook telling me that someone has tagged me on a 
>> picture. If I click the link to show what picture it is and to comment, the 
>> normal unusable Facebook site comes up. I expected to find this notification 
>> on the mobile version, but I can't find it anywhere while going through my 
>> frontpage. How do I figure out what picture some random person has tagged me 
>> on, and how do I add a comment so I can ask this question?
>> 
>> Each time I'm trying to give Facebook a chance I run into issues like this. 
>> Every time I spoke to other blind people who're using Facebook, they don't 
>> use these features, they keep say just use the mobile site or they don't 
>> have a Mac where all these issues seems to happen. The Facebook support says 
>> that screenreader users just have to use the mobile site, but what do we do 
>> when they only supports Internet explorer?
>> I'm really considering deleting my Facebook acount and make the totally 
>> switch to Twitter. If family and friends won't follow, well, that's their 
>> choice. I find myself spending hours on trying to navigate the Facebook 
>> site. SOmetimes it works and other times it's just impossible.
>> 
>> I really hope to get lots of great input here...
>> Best regards:
>> Søren Jensen
>> Mail & MSN:
>> s...@coolfortheblind.dk
>> Website:
>> http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/
>> 
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Combining more than one base station on my home network

[Andrew Lamanche]

Dear Listers,

I wonder whether I might have your opinion / thoughts on the following:

My family has kindly given me a present of an airport extreme latest
model. This was prompted by the difficulties I had with my original
time capsule which I bought in 2008. It has 500 GB disk, and as I now
have more than two macs backing up to it, I started receiving messages
that one of my machines could no longer back up to the disk because
there was no more room on it.

The new airport extreme is very welcome as it has the dual band width
and apparently better coverage throughout my home. I plan to connect
to the new airport extreme an external hard drive to use it for time
machine backups for all my computers. I also am planning on connecting
to its usb port a usb hub and connect my printer to it and the
external drive just mentioned. So far I think I understand what I am
going to do.


Now, as for the old time capsule, which I understand is an airport
extreme with a hard drive - do you think I need to find a home for it
because now it is surplus to requirement, or can I somehow make it a
part of my network and use it for wireless storage of let's say, parts
of my iTunes library, or for backing up one of my computers? If I can
still incorporate it to my advantage, what options do I have, and if
it has become a part of my network, is there a danger that it may slow
it down because of its current speed? Can the old time capsule be used
wirelessly or does it have to be used via an ethernet? If via the
ethernet, where would I plug it in? Would I need to plug it in into
the one of the ethernet ports on the new airport extreme?

I'd be grateful if you could shed some light on this. Please right off
list, if you wish.

With best regards and thanks in advance

Andrew

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Re: Facebook frustration

[Mark BurningHawk Baxter]

Seren:

I amusing Snow Leopard on an MBP15 circa 2008, with the latest 10.6.8 updates 
including Safari.  I use the main site, not the mobile site, and while I don't 
use a few of the features you want to use, like tagging people and so on, I 
keep up with it fairly well.  It's quite possible that you are more intense 
about your social networks, though, so if I can assist, I shall, but don't get 
your hopes up. :)

Here are a few tips that I use.  First, let me say that both the main and the 
mobile site have a fairly rapid auto-refresh feature.  I have not yet figured 
out a way to turn this off or even slow it down.  This means that a lot of the 
navigation frustration you experience--being sent back to the top of the page 
or to links you weren't near, etc., is going to persist.  The only really good 
strategies for dealing with this are:
 • 1) Use the Items Chooser to get back to the last unique thing you remember 
about where you were--a person's name, a word or phrase in a wall post, 
something that wasn't too many VO presses away from your last known position. 
and
 •2) My Vo/Safari set-up brings me back, after an auto-refresh, to the last 
position where I actively did something on the page--left a comment, clicked a 
photo, used an edit box, whatever.  That at least gives me a starting point, 
and I can decide  the most efficient way back to where I want to be.

In terms of general navigation, VO Command H, navigating by headiness, is your 
BFF.  Each friend's post or new item in your timeline has its own heading.  
Interacting with lists of lots of items never hurts either, once you've gotten 
to where you want to be via heading hopping.  (that's what I call it. heading 
hopping...)

I hope this little bit helps, and if you like, Skype me sometime and we can go 
into more detail.  I admit, once again, that my approach to FB and even Twitter 
is lukewarm, at best, but I believe there are ways of making it work.


 • Mark BurningHawk Baxter
 • AIM, Skype and Twitter:  BurningHawk1969
 • MSN:  burninghawk1...@hotmail.com
 • My home page:
 • http://MarkBurningHawk.net/

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Re: Success in tagging on Facebook

[Traci]

As far as I know, you cannot tag via the iPhone apps.

Sorry, I don't use m.facebook much.  The few times I've used it though, I 
believe the layout is much cleaner & simpler.

Traci
Sent by Macbook Air Mail

On Jul 2, 2012, at 1:57 PM, Rachel Feinberg wrote:

> This is great to hear, that tagging is so easily done, on the main site at 
> least.
> When I go to the mobile  site on the mac, however, it seems to look a lot 
> more like the  main site. Is there something I should be doing differently?
> Or does m.facebook.com really display that much differently?
> Thanks,
> Rachel
> On Jul 2, 2012, at 1:04 PM, Rahul Bajaj wrote:
> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Thank you very much for sharing your experience.
>> Even I've tried that method a couple of times, but I usually don't have to 
>> tag people a lot of times anyway, so I really haven't tried it much.
>> BTW, I was wondering, can you tag friends using apps like Focus for 
>> Facebook, etc on the iPhone?
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> RB  
>> 
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> 
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Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Chris Moore]

I thought Victoria was prior voice to Alex?  Personally I quite like Alex, and 
can't stand Fred.  He sounds rather creepy and too robotic.  I guess it depends 
on what you are used to and how long you have been using TTS.
On 3 Jul 2012, at 16:21, Anne Robertson wrote:

> Hello,
> 
> Vicky is supposed to be the female equivalent of Alex. Personally, I can't 
> stand either of them. I've been using Fred for years because he's clear and 
> quite neutral.
> 
> 
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 16:05, Daniel Miller wrote:
> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> While I agree a female equivalent to Alex would be a necessary addition, I
>> just don't see apple ever incorporating Eloquence or the Dectalk voices, for
>> that matter.
> 
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RE: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Daniel Miller]

Ugh, I hate Vicky and Victoria. I hate Fred too. I wish they'd use Alex for
the OS X installer.


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Moore
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 10:57 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or
squashed in Mountain Lion?

I thought Victoria was prior voice to Alex?  Personally I quite like Alex,
and can't stand Fred.  He sounds rather creepy and too robotic.  I guess it
depends on what you are used to and how long you have been using TTS.
On 3 Jul 2012, at 16:21, Anne Robertson wrote:

> Hello,
> 
> Vicky is supposed to be the female equivalent of Alex. Personally, I can't
stand either of them. I've been using Fred for years because he's clear and
quite neutral.
> 
> 
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 16:05, Daniel Miller wrote:
> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> While I agree a female equivalent to Alex would be a necessary 
>> addition, I just don't see apple ever incorporating Eloquence or the 
>> Dectalk voices, for that matter.
> 
> --
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> 

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RE: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Missy Hoppe]

Same here. Both Vicky and Victoria sound too robotic for me; more like Fred 
than Alex. Vicky doesn't have nearly the realism
as Alex, so I can't imagine that she's meant to be his female counterpart. Oh 
well. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.
Honestly, I don't understand all the fuss about the Nuance voices. Over all, I 
don't like any of them, with the possible
exceptions of Karen and Lee, and I really wish that Apple would have just 
created their own voices or gone with a different
tts provider. In all honesty, 1 of the many reasons I'm still not the proud 
owner of an I device is that I can't stand the
Samantha voice. If there was a way to use almost any other kind of voice by 
default on an Iphone, I'd try to save up for 1 in
a heartbeat. I understand that mobile Alex isn't an option, but honestly! Why 
couldn't Apple have used the Acapella voices
instead, or the Ivona voices; they're very good too.
OK. End of rant. LOL!


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Chris Moore
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 11:57 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or 
squashed in Mountain Lion?

I thought Victoria was prior voice to Alex?  Personally I quite like Alex, and 
can't stand Fred.  He sounds rather creepy and
too robotic.  I guess it depends on what you are used to and how long you have 
been using TTS.
On 3 Jul 2012, at 16:21, Anne Robertson wrote:

> Hello,
>
> Vicky is supposed to be the female equivalent of Alex. Personally, I can't 
> stand either of them. I've been using Fred for
years because he's clear and quite neutral.
>
>
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 16:05, Daniel Miller wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> While I agree a female equivalent to Alex would be a necessary
>> addition, I just don't see apple ever incorporating Eloquence or the
>> Dectalk voices, for that matter.
>
> --
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>

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Re: Success in tagging on Facebook

[Christina]

Hi,

You can tag with the official iPhone app when you are adding a picture.  I've 
only done it once but I have done it and it wasn't too bad of a process.  It 
was a bit time consuming for me though. :)  However, I do not know of a way to 
tag in a plain status update.  I only have tagged with a photo in the official 
FB app on my iPhone.

Christina C
On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:54 AM, Traci wrote:

> As far as I know, you cannot tag via the iPhone apps.
> 
> Sorry, I don't use m.facebook much.  The few times I've used it though, I 
> believe the layout is much cleaner & simpler.
> 
> Traci
> Sent by Macbook Air Mail
> 
> On Jul 2, 2012, at 1:57 PM, Rachel Feinberg wrote:
> 
>> This is great to hear, that tagging is so easily done, on the main site at 
>> least.
>> When I go to the mobile  site on the mac, however, it seems to look a lot 
>> more like the  main site. Is there something I should be doing differently?
>> Or does m.facebook.com really display that much differently?
>> Thanks,
>> Rachel
>> On Jul 2, 2012, at 1:04 PM, Rahul Bajaj wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> Thank you very much for sharing your experience.
>>> Even I've tried that method a couple of times, but I usually don't have to 
>>> tag people a lot of times anyway, so I really haven't tried it much.
>>> BTW, I was wondering, can you tag friends using apps like Focus for 
>>> Facebook, etc on the iPhone?
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> RB  
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
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>>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>>> For more options, visit this group at 
>>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
>>> 
>> 
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> 
> 
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RE: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Missy Hoppe]

Ah! That would be sweet: Alex reading the OSX install. I'd almost rather see 
Apple get rid of Fred, Vicky and Victoria
altogether since there are so many better options out there.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Daniel Miller
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 12:12 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or 
squashed in Mountain Lion?

Ugh, I hate Vicky and Victoria. I hate Fred too. I wish they'd use Alex for the 
OS X installer.


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Moore
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 10:57 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or 
squashed in Mountain Lion?

I thought Victoria was prior voice to Alex?  Personally I quite like Alex, and 
can't stand Fred.  He sounds rather creepy and
too robotic.  I guess it depends on what you are used to and how long you have 
been using TTS.
On 3 Jul 2012, at 16:21, Anne Robertson wrote:

> Hello,
>
> Vicky is supposed to be the female equivalent of Alex. Personally, I
> can't
stand either of them. I've been using Fred for years because he's clear and 
quite neutral.
>
>
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 16:05, Daniel Miller wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> While I agree a female equivalent to Alex would be a necessary
>> addition, I just don't see apple ever incorporating Eloquence or the
>> Dectalk voices, for that matter.
>
> --
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>

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RE: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Daniel Miller]

Alas it would be, but I have my theories on why they use fred for that
purpose.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Missy Hoppe
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 11:17 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or
squashed in Mountain Lion?

Ah! That would be sweet: Alex reading the OSX install. I'd almost rather see
Apple get rid of Fred, Vicky and Victoria altogether since there are so many
better options out there.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Daniel Miller
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 12:12 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or
squashed in Mountain Lion?

Ugh, I hate Vicky and Victoria. I hate Fred too. I wish they'd use Alex for
the OS X installer.


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Moore
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 10:57 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or
squashed in Mountain Lion?

I thought Victoria was prior voice to Alex?  Personally I quite like Alex,
and can't stand Fred.  He sounds rather creepy and too robotic.  I guess it
depends on what you are used to and how long you have been using TTS.
On 3 Jul 2012, at 16:21, Anne Robertson wrote:

> Hello,
>
> Vicky is supposed to be the female equivalent of Alex. Personally, I 
> can't
stand either of them. I've been using Fred for years because he's clear and
quite neutral.
>
>
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 16:05, Daniel Miller wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> While I agree a female equivalent to Alex would be a necessary 
>> addition, I just don't see apple ever incorporating Eloquence or the 
>> Dectalk voices, for that matter.
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
> Groups
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>

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Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Anne Robertson]

Fred is used during installation because it requires the least system 
resources, which is also why Fred is the most responsive voice and why it is my 
preferred voice for practical purposes.

I use Acapela voices sometimes for reading for pleasure, and have Fiona, the 
Scottish voice that comes with Lion, as my system voice. Interestingly, when I 
sync my iPod Nano, iTunes tells me that my system voice does not use the same 
language as my iPod. So Scots don't speak English? Very strange.

Cheers,

Anne


On 3 Jul 2012, at 18:32, Daniel Miller wrote:

> Alas it would be, but I have my theories on why they use fred for that
> purpose.

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RE: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Daniel Miller]

That's what I was going to say actually. Lol. I personally think it's an
inferior voice.


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Anne Robertson
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 11:57 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or
squashed in Mountain Lion?

Fred is used during installation because it requires the least system
resources, which is also why Fred is the most responsive voice and why it is
my preferred voice for practical purposes.

I use Acapela voices sometimes for reading for pleasure, and have Fiona, the
Scottish voice that comes with Lion, as my system voice. Interestingly, when
I sync my iPod Nano, iTunes tells me that my system voice does not use the
same language as my iPod. So Scots don't speak English? Very strange.

Cheers,

Anne


On 3 Jul 2012, at 18:32, Daniel Miller wrote:

> Alas it would be, but I have my theories on why they use fred for that 
> purpose.

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Re: Combining more than one base station on my home network

[Tim Kilburn]

Hi,

You can combine multiple Base Stations using the Airport Utility.  I would set 
up your network using the newest Extreme then you can add the TC in two 
different ways.

1.  Join an Existing network:  This will simply make the TC a member of the 
network but it will not be an Access Point.  You'll have access to the TC's HD 
and such but it will not transmit.  You could also connect some USB devices 
such as printers through it so as not to create a bottle-neck at the Extreme.

2.  Extend a Wireless Network:  This will connect the devices wirelessly and 
both will act as Access Points.  That is, whichever Access Point is closer will 
be the one that your Mac or other device will connect with.  The connection 
between the two devices is not as quick as a direct connection so depending on 
which Access Point you connect to, will determine your network speed.  The 
overall network speed should not be affected overly much though.

These connectivity options are found within the Wireless tab of the Airport 
Utility.  In my opinion, unless you have a rather large house with lots of 
floors, I'd simply use option one.

HTH

Later...

Tim Kilburn
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On 2012-07-03, at 9:38 AM, Andrew Lamanche wrote:

> Dear Listers,
> 
> I wonder whether I might have your opinion / thoughts on the following:
> 
> My family has kindly given me a present of an airport extreme latest
> model. This was prompted by the difficulties I had with my original
> time capsule which I bought in 2008. It has 500 GB disk, and as I now
> have more than two macs backing up to it, I started receiving messages
> that one of my machines could no longer back up to the disk because
> there was no more room on it.
> 
> The new airport extreme is very welcome as it has the dual band width
> and apparently better coverage throughout my home. I plan to connect
> to the new airport extreme an external hard drive to use it for time
> machine backups for all my computers. I also am planning on connecting
> to its usb port a usb hub and connect my printer to it and the
> external drive just mentioned. So far I think I understand what I am
> going to do.
> 
> 
> Now, as for the old time capsule, which I understand is an airport
> extreme with a hard drive - do you think I need to find a home for it
> because now it is surplus to requirement, or can I somehow make it a
> part of my network and use it for wireless storage of let's say, parts
> of my iTunes library, or for backing up one of my computers? If I can
> still incorporate it to my advantage, what options do I have, and if
> it has become a part of my network, is there a danger that it may slow
> it down because of its current speed? Can the old time capsule be used
> wirelessly or does it have to be used via an ethernet? If via the
> ethernet, where would I plug it in? Would I need to plug it in into
> the one of the ethernet ports on the new airport extreme?
> 
> I'd be grateful if you could shed some light on this. Please right off
> list, if you wish.
> 
> With best regards and thanks in advance
> 
> Andrew
> 
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Re: found scanning program for the Mac

[Mary Otten]

What does this program have that docu-scan doesn't have? That one costs 300 
bucks, plus the camera for another 300 from amazon. As I understand it, the 300 
dollar camera t5-v from Hovercam has the same resolution as the one from 
Abissee. So what does the Abisee product have to make it worth 1200 bucks? 
Mary Otten
motte...@gmail.com


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Re: found scanning program for the Mac

[erik burggraaf]

Well, for one thing, it does it's processing locally, not in the cloud.  That's 
convenient because it means you don't have to be connected to the net and it's 
also nice from a security standpoint.  It's also much faster processing locally.

The featureset of the Eyepal is not really worth the price point it's true; 
never-the-less, the fact that you can simply plug it in and it works is a huge 
benefit.  I was funded for one, so I bought it and I rely on it.  If I'd had to 
buy it myself the price would be a showstopper.  But it does what the brochure 
says.

Best,

Erik Burggraaf
Introducing Ebony Consulting business card transcription service, starting at 
$0.45 per card or $35 per hundred cards.
Ebony Consulting toll-free: 1-888-255-5194
or on the web at http://www.erik-burggraaf.com

On 2012-07-03, at 1:26 PM, Mary Otten wrote:

> 
> What does this program have that docu-scan doesn't have? That one costs 300 
> bucks, plus the camera for another 300 from amazon. As I understand it, the 
> 300 dollar camera t5-v from Hovercam has the same resolution as the one from 
> Abissee. So what does the Abisee product have to make it worth 1200 bucks? 
> Mary Otten
> motte...@gmail.com
> 
> 
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Re: found scanning program for the Mac

[Eugenia Firth]

Hi Erik. 
Do you think the price would be worth it if you had a lot of scanning to do? 
The thing I saw was like the Purl camera, very fast and you didn't have to 
close a scanner or anything like that. For me, I may wait because I don't do 
that much scanning right now. But Kurzweil 1000 for Windows, is not a lot 
cheaper than this one. OpenBook isn't either if you want the Purl camera, and 
you're using Windows, of course. 

I kind of gathered there are two readers: the one that connects to the computer 
and the stand alone one. Did I get that right? 

Eugenia Firth
gigifi...@sbcglobal.net



On Jul 3, 2012, at 12:38 PM, erik burggraaf wrote:

> Well, for one thing, it does it's processing locally, not in the cloud.  
> That's convenient because it means you don't have to be connected to the net 
> and it's also nice from a security standpoint.  It's also much faster 
> processing locally.
> 
> The featureset of the Eyepal is not really worth the price point it's true; 
> never-the-less, the fact that you can simply plug it in and it works is a 
> huge benefit.  I was funded for one, so I bought it and I rely on it.  If I'd 
> had to buy it myself the price would be a showstopper.  But it does what the 
> brochure says.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Erik Burggraaf
> Introducing Ebony Consulting business card transcription service, starting at 
> $0.45 per card or $35 per hundred cards.
> Ebony Consulting toll-free: 1-888-255-5194
> or on the web at http://www.erik-burggraaf.com
> 
> On 2012-07-03, at 1:26 PM, Mary Otten wrote:
> 
>> 
>> What does this program have that docu-scan doesn't have? That one costs 300 
>> bucks, plus the camera for another 300 from amazon. As I understand it, the 
>> 300 dollar camera t5-v from Hovercam has the same resolution as the one from 
>> Abissee. So what does the Abisee product have to make it worth 1200 bucks? 
>> Mary Otten
>> motte...@gmail.com
>> 
>> 
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Re: GooglePlus, (was Facebook frustration)

[Søren Jensen]

Hi.
I hear that Google plus isn't very accessible at all.
Best regards:
Søren Jensen
Mail & MSN:
s...@coolfortheblind.dk
Website:
http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/

Den 03/07/2012 kl. 17.21 skrev Donna Goodin:

> Just curious, has anyone tried GooglePlus?  If so, how is it in terms of 
> accessibility?
> Cheers,
> Donna
> On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:49 AM, Maxwell Ivey wrote:
> 
>> hello; we are all frustrated with Facebook, but its just so hard to give it 
>> up completely.  what i do is to subscribe to as many people as possible out 
>> of my friends list.  then i set notifications to send me an email anytime 
>> anything happens.  then i just hit reply in my mail program.  when i want to 
>> post a photo, video, or status update i go to the regular Facebook and use 
>> the control option i for a finder menu and choose update.  then i can arrow 
>> left or right to find the field i want.  If someone sends me a friend 
>> request, i click the link in the message for accept or ignore. i wish you 
>> luck, max 
>> On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:12 AM, Søren Jensen wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi.
>>> 
>>> Before I give up and consider deleting my Facebook account, I'll bring up 
>>> discussion to see if any of you have considered the same frustrations when 
>>> using Facebook.
>>> 
>>> I've read on Applevis that setting Safari to react like Firefox or Internet 
>>> explorer should make the mobile site of Facebook very useable. That won't 
>>> work for me all the time. I experience things like the language changes, 
>>> normal links which I could read a few seconds ago are translated into 
>>> english graphical links, and when I click on these, nothing happens. The 
>>> only way I can come back to the site again is by reloading the page, and if 
>>> that won't work, I type m.facebook.com again in the address bar to reload 
>>> the page. Then I'm able to navigate the site for a few minutes, and then 
>>> the same happens over and over again. this makes the site nearly impossible 
>>> and very frustrating to use!
>>> 
>>> I've got a mail from Facebook telling me that someone has tagged me on a 
>>> picture. If I click the link to show what picture it is and to comment, the 
>>> normal unusable Facebook site comes up. I expected to find this 
>>> notification on the mobile version, but I can't find it anywhere while 
>>> going through my frontpage. How do I figure out what picture some random 
>>> person has tagged me on, and how do I add a comment so I can ask this 
>>> question?
>>> 
>>> Each time I'm trying to give Facebook a chance I run into issues like this. 
>>> Every time I spoke to other blind people who're using Facebook, they don't 
>>> use these features, they keep say just use the mobile site or they don't 
>>> have a Mac where all these issues seems to happen. The Facebook support 
>>> says that screenreader users just have to use the mobile site, but what do 
>>> we do when they only supports Internet explorer?
>>> I'm really considering deleting my Facebook acount and make the totally 
>>> switch to Twitter. If family and friends won't follow, well, that's their 
>>> choice. I find myself spending hours on trying to navigate the Facebook 
>>> site. SOmetimes it works and other times it's just impossible.
>>> 
>>> I really hope to get lots of great input here...
>>> Best regards:
>>> Søren Jensen
>>> Mail & MSN:
>>> s...@coolfortheblind.dk
>>> Website:
>>> http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/
>>> 
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>>> 
>> 
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Sendero

[Eugenia Firth]

Hi guys. 
I also found out something else. Sendero is working on a  serious GPS for the 
iPhone. I asked Mike May if bus information was going to be part of it. He said 
yes. That makes me really happy because I'm tired of looking up information on 
our DART web site when it's accessible but not really convenient sometimes 
because of the way they set it up. My sighted husband complains too, so I don't 
think do is purely accessibility that's the problem. 




Eugenia Firth
gigifi...@sbcglobal.net



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Re: Facebook frustration

[Søren Jensen]

Hi.
Wow, thanks so much for all your replies. It seems as I have to experiment some 
more with the normal Facebook page again.
I don't know what causes this weird language switching issue. It wouldn't make 
much sense if I recorded what happens, because the main page is in danish.
I have had some weird issues on my 15 inch Macbook pro in Safari, which other 
people who are using a Macbook pro 13 inch or an iMac never had experienced. I 
don't know if that goes for Facebook as well. On the normal Facebook page, 
Voiceover suddenly jumps randomly around, or Safari says busy all the time, 
which makes it difficult to navigate.
I'll try to clear up the cash in Safari to see if that helps, or simply try 
with Google Chrome. :)

thanks for explaining how to comment on the photo I'm tagged on. I'll try this.
I'll let you know if I figure out something regarding these issues I'm having.

Best regards:
Søren Jensen
Mail & MSN:
s...@coolfortheblind.dk
Website:
http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/

Den 03/07/2012 kl. 17.48 skrev Mark BurningHawk Baxter:

> Seren:
> 
> I amusing Snow Leopard on an MBP15 circa 2008, with the latest 10.6.8 updates 
> including Safari.  I use the main site, not the mobile site, and while I 
> don't use a few of the features you want to use, like tagging people and so 
> on, I keep up with it fairly well.  It's quite possible that you are more 
> intense about your social networks, though, so if I can assist, I shall, but 
> don't get your hopes up. :)
> 
> Here are a few tips that I use.  First, let me say that both the main and the 
> mobile site have a fairly rapid auto-refresh feature.  I have not yet figured 
> out a way to turn this off or even slow it down.  This means that a lot of 
> the navigation frustration you experience--being sent back to the top of the 
> page or to links you weren't near, etc., is going to persist.  The only 
> really good strategies for dealing with this are:
> • 1) Use the Items Chooser to get back to the last unique thing you remember 
> about where you were--a person's name, a word or phrase in a wall post, 
> something that wasn't too many VO presses away from your last known position. 
> and
> •2) My Vo/Safari set-up brings me back, after an auto-refresh, to the last 
> position where I actively did something on the page--left a comment, clicked 
> a photo, used an edit box, whatever.  That at least gives me a starting 
> point, and I can decide  the most efficient way back to where I want to be.
> 
> In terms of general navigation, VO Command H, navigating by headiness, is 
> your BFF.  Each friend's post or new item in your timeline has its own 
> heading.  Interacting with lists of lots of items never hurts either, once 
> you've gotten to where you want to be via heading hopping.  (that's what I 
> call it. heading hopping...)
> 
> I hope this little bit helps, and if you like, Skype me sometime and we can 
> go into more detail.  I admit, once again, that my approach to FB and even 
> Twitter is lukewarm, at best, but I believe there are ways of making it work.
> 
> 
> • Mark BurningHawk Baxter
> • AIM, Skype and Twitter:  BurningHawk1969
> • MSN:  burninghawk1...@hotmail.com
> • My home page:
> • http://MarkBurningHawk.net/
> 
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Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Wes Smith]

I prefer Qlex...can't stand Fred

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 3, 2012, at 10:32 AM, Daniel Miller  wrote:

> Alas it would be, but I have my theories on why they use fred for that
> purpose.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Missy Hoppe
> Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 11:17 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: RE: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or
> squashed in Mountain Lion?
>
> Ah! That would be sweet: Alex reading the OSX install. I'd almost rather see
> Apple get rid of Fred, Vicky and Victoria altogether since there are so many
> better options out there.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Daniel Miller
> Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 12:12 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: RE: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or
> squashed in Mountain Lion?
>
> Ugh, I hate Vicky and Victoria. I hate Fred too. I wish they'd use Alex for
> the OS X installer.
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Moore
> Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 10:57 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or
> squashed in Mountain Lion?
>
> I thought Victoria was prior voice to Alex?  Personally I quite like Alex,
> and can't stand Fred.  He sounds rather creepy and too robotic.  I guess it
> depends on what you are used to and how long you have been using TTS.
> On 3 Jul 2012, at 16:21, Anne Robertson wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>> Vicky is supposed to be the female equivalent of Alex. Personally, I
>> can't
> stand either of them. I've been using Fred for years because he's clear and
> quite neutral.
>>
>>
>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 16:05, Daniel Miller wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> While I agree a female equivalent to Alex would be a necessary
>>> addition, I just don't see apple ever incorporating Eloquence or the
>>> Dectalk voices, for that matter.
>>
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Re: Creative Writing Apps?

[Esther]

Hi CJ,

While I think Scrivener is likely to be the app you might want, I thought I'd 
mention that Ulysses is on sale today for $1.99 at the Mac App Store, as part 
of an indie developer promotion called "two dollar Tuesday". These special 
prices are only good for the day, though.

HTH.  Cheers,

Esther

On Jun 25, 2012, at 8:25 AM, CJ Daniel wrote:

> Ester, et al,
> 
> Thanks for the replies.  I was unaware of the demo for Scrivener.  I'll be 
> giving that a try.  
> 
> Again, thanks,
> 
> CJ
> 
> 
> On Jun 24, 2012, at 10:53 PM, Esther wrote:
> 
>> Hi CJ,
>> 
>> You might want to take a look at Scrivener, which has had several posts in 
>> the archives from people who have used this app.  Here's a link to a review 
>> that Austin Seraphin posted on his blog:
>> http://behindthecurtain.us/2011/09/07/scrivener/
>> 
>> Also, the Literature and Latte site that makes scrivener has a 30-day free 
>> trial download page:
>> http://www.literatureandlatte.com/trial.php
>> 
>> They now have a Windows version of Scrivener, too.  And I think they also 
>> offer an education discount, but you may have to supply additional 
>> information.
>> 
>> HTH. Cheers,
>> 
>> Esther 
>> 
>> 
>> On Jun 22, 2012, at 12:22 PM, CJ Daniel wrote:
>> 
>>> Hello All,
>>> 
>>> I'm considering the purchase of a creative writing application from the App 
>>> Store.  I've had Pages for a while & find that it is not what I'm looking 
>>> for.  So, I've done some research & come up with some candidates.  I'm 
>>> considering these three applications.  I.E. Manuscript, Scrivener, or 
>>> Ulysses.  I'm wondering if anyone can comment on the accessibility of these 
>>> or any other creative writing applications for use on the Mac with 
>>> VoiceOver.
>>> 
>>> Many thanks in advance,
>>> 
>>> CJ
>>> 
>>> 
>> 

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Re: GooglePlus, (was Facebook frustration)

[Pete Nalda]

Yeah, not very accessible at all. Yeah, there are work arounds, but they are 
complicated,  in the stream, you'll see the names, but you'll have to feel for 
the post (good luck), then you can read and plus 1 (like), and comment. At 
least the main screen ( where you get to the stream, circles, etc) is 
accessible. 

Egun On, Lagunak! Basque for G'day, Mates
Louie P. (Pete) Nalda
Http://www.myspace.com/lpnalda
Http://www.facebook.com/lpnalda
Http://www.linkedin.com/in/lpnalda
Twitter @lpnalda



On Jul 3, 2012, at 1:01 PM, Søren Jensen  wrote:

> Hi.
> I hear that Google plus isn't very accessible at all.
> Best regards:
> Søren Jensen
> Mail & MSN:
> s...@coolfortheblind.dk
> Website:
> http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/
> 
> Den 03/07/2012 kl. 17.21 skrev Donna Goodin:
> 
>> Just curious, has anyone tried GooglePlus?  If so, how is it in terms of 
>> accessibility?
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:49 AM, Maxwell Ivey wrote:
>> 
>>> hello; we are all frustrated with Facebook, but its just so hard to give it 
>>> up completely.  what i do is to subscribe to as many people as possible out 
>>> of my friends list.  then i set notifications to send me an email anytime 
>>> anything happens.  then i just hit reply in my mail program.  when i want 
>>> to post a photo, video, or status update i go to the regular Facebook and 
>>> use the control option i for a finder menu and choose update.  then i can 
>>> arrow left or right to find the field i want.  If someone sends me a friend 
>>> request, i click the link in the message for accept or ignore. i wish you 
>>> luck, max 
>>> On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:12 AM, Søren Jensen wrote:
>>> 
 Hi.
 
 Before I give up and consider deleting my Facebook account, I'll bring up 
 discussion to see if any of you have considered the same frustrations when 
 using Facebook.
 
 I've read on Applevis that setting Safari to react like Firefox or 
 Internet explorer should make the mobile site of Facebook very useable. 
 That won't work for me all the time. I experience things like the language 
 changes, normal links which I could read a few seconds ago are translated 
 into english graphical links, and when I click on these, nothing happens. 
 The only way I can come back to the site again is by reloading the page, 
 and if that won't work, I type m.facebook.com again in the address bar to 
 reload the page. Then I'm able to navigate the site for a few minutes, and 
 then the same happens over and over again. this makes the site nearly 
 impossible and very frustrating to use!
 
 I've got a mail from Facebook telling me that someone has tagged me on a 
 picture. If I click the link to show what picture it is and to comment, 
 the normal unusable Facebook site comes up. I expected to find this 
 notification on the mobile version, but I can't find it anywhere while 
 going through my frontpage. How do I figure out what picture some random 
 person has tagged me on, and how do I add a comment so I can ask this 
 question?
 
 Each time I'm trying to give Facebook a chance I run into issues like 
 this. Every time I spoke to other blind people who're using Facebook, they 
 don't use these features, they keep say just use the mobile site or they 
 don't have a Mac where all these issues seems to happen. The Facebook 
 support says that screenreader users just have to use the mobile site, but 
 what do we do when they only supports Internet explorer?
 I'm really considering deleting my Facebook acount and make the totally 
 switch to Twitter. If family and friends won't follow, well, that's their 
 choice. I find myself spending hours on trying to navigate the Facebook 
 site. SOmetimes it works and other times it's just impossible.
 
 I really hope to get lots of great input here...
 Best regards:
 Søren Jensen
 Mail & MSN:
 s...@coolfortheblind.dk
 Website:
 http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/
 
 -- 
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 To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
 macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
 For more options, visit this group at 
 http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
 
>>> 
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>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
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>>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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>>> 
>> 
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>> To post to th

About imput volume

[Francisco Salvador Crespo]

Hi,

I'd like to know how to set an input volume and that the system doesn't change 
it. Because when i'm talking by Skype the other person tells me that sometimes 
can't ear my voice

Some help will be appreciated

Thanks,
Francisco Salvador Crespo
Cómo contactarme/How to contact me
Mail: crespofranciscosalva...@gmail.com
Messenger: crespofranciscosalva...@gmail.com
Skype: franciscosabalero
Twitter: crespofrancisco
Facebook: Francisco Salvador Crespo

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Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Pete Nalda]

I think you're right on the mark here on that one. I'd like to see a windowed 
option, and a way to have white over Black in that window, which would Make it 
look more like ZT's doc reader. 


Egun On, Lagunak! Basque for G'day, Mates
Louie P. (Pete) Nalda
Http://www.myspace.com/lpnalda
Http://www.facebook.com/lpnalda
Http://www.linkedin.com/in/lpnalda
Twitter @lpnalda



On Jul 3, 2012, at 3:44 AM, Garth Humphreys  wrote:

> I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom and just some 
> improvements to Zoom in general. I mostly don't use Zoom on my Mac but this 
> only because it is so poor when compared to things like ZoomText in the 
> windows world. It is probably great if you don't need to use Voice Over or if 
> you only need a little enlargement but it falls completely short for me.
> 
> Garth
> iblindtech.com
> 
> On 03/07/2012, at 6:26 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
> 
>> Riccardo,
>> 
>> Actually that is what I was hinting at to be honest, as i feel the method of 
>> selecting text within Safari is rather sloppy.  You can also navigate by 
>> line within iOS, so hoped that feature would come across to OS X.  
>> Navigating by line is also useful when trying to read pages that have been 
>> styled into columns via CSS instead of a table.  This can be done in JAWS 
>> quite nicely.
>> 
>> Chris 
>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:11, Ricardo Walker wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> I doubt you will see the reading by line with the down arrow.  That would 
>>> radically change the way VO navigates the web, and I'm not sure it would be 
>>> for the better.  It would be selecting text easier though.
>>> 
>>> Ricardo Walker
>>> rica...@appletothecore.info
>>> Twitter:@apple2thecore
>>> www.appletothecore.info
>>> 
>>> On Jul 2, 2012, at 6:37 PM, Chris Moore  wrote:
>>> 
 Hmmm I remember a while back putting a list of 15 improvements.  I can't 
 remember them all now, so perhaps I have just learnt to live without them. 
  I did report them to Apple though as bugs and feature enhancements.
 
 The VoiceOver busy is the biggest annoyance which is caused by  the 
 pathetic slow buffering system voice over uses.  So I would like to see 
 that rewritten from the ground up.  There are a few random performance 
 bugs that happen now and then which require me to switch voice over off 
 then back on again.  So overall performance could do with being improved.
 
 I would also like to know what web page I am looking at when switching 
 between tabs, being told that is an HTML page is not exactly helpful.  I 
 would also like to navigate line by line just by pressing the down arrow 
 or up key.  VO still needs a bit of work when reporting how many HMTL  
 elements are on a web page, some windows screen readers seem to find more 
 tables and headings than VO,  especially in the buggy rotor.
 
 I would like the ability to edit form fields in a PDF with Preview, but I 
 believe this is coming in the next Mountain Lion release (according to 
 Apple's website).  
 
 I would appreciate MIDI event editing in GarageBand, and a huge update to 
 iWork.  There just is not enough accessible productive software on the 
 Mac.  There is more to using a Mac than just Skype and Mail surely?
 
 Not sure if that bug still exists when using the real speak voices where 
 the pitch used to shift up and down randomly. I stopped using those voices 
 as it became too annoying.
 
 I would also like the ability to edit voice over's dictionary. For example 
 if you type third as in the number 3 followed by the letters r and d, you 
 get 3rd (three road), surely this should be a third?  So I think the 
 ability to edit some of VO's assumptions would be nice, or maybe VO should 
 grow up and become a tad more intelligent. I would like more control over 
 how VO reads out numbers too.
 
 Maybe developers should also be given the option to name what VO calls an 
 HTML area, as something else?  For example when using adium the chat 
 window is called an HTML area, am sure a chat window or conversation 
 window would be more meaningful.
 
 Last but not least, I find VO a bit slow when first entering the iTunes 
 store.  The page takes a while to render.  Well actually visually it does 
 not, but VO seems to think it does.  Actually come to mention it when VO 
 says something is busy, a sighted person can still move the mouse and 
 perform the action they require, it is just VO's buffer which is busy.
 
 I spotted another bug today too.  When ordering a smart case for my iPad, 
 VO was unable to read out the colour options.  When trying to select a 
 colour, VO simply said "space radio button" for each of the 6 colours.  
 The work around seemed to be select a colour, go back to the top of the 
 screen and read out the description to see if the default

Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Pete Nalda]

Command tab is flakey even w/o vo  with zoom above 14x. 

Egun On, Lagunak! Basque for G'day, Mates
Louie P. (Pete) Nalda
Http://www.myspace.com/lpnalda
Http://www.facebook.com/lpnalda
Http://www.linkedin.com/in/lpnalda
Twitter @lpnalda



On Jul 3, 2012, at 4:31 AM, Garth Humphreys  wrote:

> There are a few bugs when zoomed to high levels, i.e., more than 14X or so. 
> If you have VO running and zoom set to follow the keyboard focus you will 
> find that the command tab to switch between apps becomes unreliable and 
> navigating the menu bar with the arrow keys is also unreliable. Also I don't 
> like the way it tracks and works with reading text. I'd like better colour 
> options and keyboard commands to adjust them, or at least for the invert 
> brightness keyboard command not to conflict with a Voice Over command. You 
> would think that Apple would be able to sort out keyboard command conflicts 
> between two of their own accessibility utilities. I am sure there are work 
> arounds for some of these but a work around isn't the same as fixing the 
> problem. For example the menu navigation issue I mentioned does not occur if 
> you use swipes on the trackpad with trackpad commander to navigate the menu. 
> It only happens with the arrow keys - strange but there you are.
> 
> If I used it regularly I would probably come across more of the issues. It 
> really doesn't seem to me that apple intended the two utilities to work 
> together or at least that this was an edge case. It would seem to me that 
> they expected people to use either option exclusively and if so, they are 
> probably right. Most people probably do use one or the other.
> 
> I'd also love to see the safari busy issue buried deep. 
> 
> The addition of the ability to set the caps lock key to act as the VO 
> modifier would also be great. 
> 
> Garth
> iblindtech.com
> On 03/07/2012, at 6:48 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
> 
>> What improvements would you like fixed in particular when it comes to zoom?
>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 09:44, Garth Humphreys wrote:
>> 
>>> I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom and just 
>>> some improvements to Zoom in general. I mostly don't use Zoom on my Mac but 
>>> this only because it is so poor when compared to things like ZoomText in 
>>> the windows world. It is probably great if you don't need to use Voice Over 
>>> or if you only need a little enlargement but it falls completely short for 
>>> me.
>>> 
>>> Garth
>>> iblindtech.com
>>> 
>>> On 03/07/2012, at 6:26 PM, Chris Moore wrote:
>>> 
 Riccardo,
 
 Actually that is what I was hinting at to be honest, as i feel the method 
 of selecting text within Safari is rather sloppy.  You can also navigate 
 by line within iOS, so hoped that feature would come across to OS X.  
 Navigating by line is also useful when trying to read pages that have been 
 styled into columns via CSS instead of a table.  This can be done in JAWS 
 quite nicely.
 
 Chris 
 On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:11, Ricardo Walker wrote:
 
> Hi,
> 
> I doubt you will see the reading by line with the down arrow.  That would 
> radically change the way VO navigates the web, and I'm not sure it would 
> be for the better.  It would be selecting text easier though.
> 
> Ricardo Walker
> rica...@appletothecore.info
> Twitter:@apple2thecore
> www.appletothecore.info
> 
> On Jul 2, 2012, at 6:37 PM, Chris Moore  
> wrote:
> 
>> Hmmm I remember a while back putting a list of 15 improvements.  I can't 
>> remember them all now, so perhaps I have just learnt to live without 
>> them.  I did report them to Apple though as bugs and feature 
>> enhancements.
>> 
>> The VoiceOver busy is the biggest annoyance which is caused by  the 
>> pathetic slow buffering system voice over uses.  So I would like to see 
>> that rewritten from the ground up.  There are a few random performance 
>> bugs that happen now and then which require me to switch voice over off 
>> then back on again.  So overall performance could do with being improved.
>> 
>> I would also like to know what web page I am looking at when switching 
>> between tabs, being told that is an HTML page is not exactly helpful.  I 
>> would also like to navigate line by line just by pressing the down arrow 
>> or up key.  VO still needs a bit of work when reporting how many HMTL  
>> elements are on a web page, some windows screen readers seem to find 
>> more tables and headings than VO,  especially in the buggy rotor.
>> 
>> I would like the ability to edit form fields in a PDF with Preview, but 
>> I believe this is coming in the next Mountain Lion release (according to 
>> Apple's website).  
>> 
>> I would appreciate MIDI event editing in GarageBand, and a huge update 
>> to iWork.  There just is not enough accessible productive software on 

Re: GooglePlus, (was Facebook frustration)

[Donna Goodin]

Hmm, that's too bad.  Facebook is annoying me.  
thanks,
Donna
On Jul 3, 2012, at 1:01 PM, Søren Jensen wrote:

> Hi.
> I hear that Google plus isn't very accessible at all.
> Best regards:
> Søren Jensen
> Mail & MSN:
> s...@coolfortheblind.dk
> Website:
> http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/
> 
> Den 03/07/2012 kl. 17.21 skrev Donna Goodin:
> 
>> Just curious, has anyone tried GooglePlus?  If so, how is it in terms of 
>> accessibility?
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:49 AM, Maxwell Ivey wrote:
>> 
>>> hello; we are all frustrated with Facebook, but its just so hard to give it 
>>> up completely.  what i do is to subscribe to as many people as possible out 
>>> of my friends list.  then i set notifications to send me an email anytime 
>>> anything happens.  then i just hit reply in my mail program.  when i want 
>>> to post a photo, video, or status update i go to the regular Facebook and 
>>> use the control option i for a finder menu and choose update.  then i can 
>>> arrow left or right to find the field i want.  If someone sends me a friend 
>>> request, i click the link in the message for accept or ignore. i wish you 
>>> luck, max 
>>> On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:12 AM, Søren Jensen wrote:
>>> 
 Hi.
 
 Before I give up and consider deleting my Facebook account, I'll bring up 
 discussion to see if any of you have considered the same frustrations when 
 using Facebook.
 
 I've read on Applevis that setting Safari to react like Firefox or 
 Internet explorer should make the mobile site of Facebook very useable. 
 That won't work for me all the time. I experience things like the language 
 changes, normal links which I could read a few seconds ago are translated 
 into english graphical links, and when I click on these, nothing happens. 
 The only way I can come back to the site again is by reloading the page, 
 and if that won't work, I type m.facebook.com again in the address bar to 
 reload the page. Then I'm able to navigate the site for a few minutes, and 
 then the same happens over and over again. this makes the site nearly 
 impossible and very frustrating to use!
 
 I've got a mail from Facebook telling me that someone has tagged me on a 
 picture. If I click the link to show what picture it is and to comment, 
 the normal unusable Facebook site comes up. I expected to find this 
 notification on the mobile version, but I can't find it anywhere while 
 going through my frontpage. How do I figure out what picture some random 
 person has tagged me on, and how do I add a comment so I can ask this 
 question?
 
 Each time I'm trying to give Facebook a chance I run into issues like 
 this. Every time I spoke to other blind people who're using Facebook, they 
 don't use these features, they keep say just use the mobile site or they 
 don't have a Mac where all these issues seems to happen. The Facebook 
 support says that screenreader users just have to use the mobile site, but 
 what do we do when they only supports Internet explorer?
 I'm really considering deleting my Facebook acount and make the totally 
 switch to Twitter. If family and friends won't follow, well, that's their 
 choice. I find myself spending hours on trying to navigate the Facebook 
 site. SOmetimes it works and other times it's just impossible.
 
 I really hope to get lots of great input here...
 Best regards:
 Søren Jensen
 Mail & MSN:
 s...@coolfortheblind.dk
 Website:
 http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/
 
 -- 
 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
 "MacVisionaries" group.
 To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
 To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
 macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
 For more options, visit this group at 
 http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
>>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>>> For more options, visit this group at 
>>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
>>> 
>> 
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>> "MacVisionaries" group.
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>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
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> 
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Re: GooglePlus, (was Facebook frustration)

[Donna Goodin]

Well, I may give it a try.  Thanks for letting me know.
BEst,
Donna
On Jul 3, 2012, at 3:36 PM, Pete Nalda wrote:

> Yeah, not very accessible at all. Yeah, there are work arounds, but they are 
> complicated,  in the stream, you'll see the names, but you'll have to feel 
> for the post (good luck), then you can read and plus 1 (like), and comment. 
> At least the main screen ( where you get to the stream, circles, etc) is 
> accessible. 
> 
> Egun On, Lagunak! Basque for G'day, Mates
> Louie P. (Pete) Nalda
> Http://www.myspace.com/lpnalda
> Http://www.facebook.com/lpnalda
> Http://www.linkedin.com/in/lpnalda
> Twitter @lpnalda
> 
> 
> 
> On Jul 3, 2012, at 1:01 PM, Søren Jensen  wrote:
> 
>> Hi.
>> I hear that Google plus isn't very accessible at all.
>> Best regards:
>> Søren Jensen
>> Mail & MSN:
>> s...@coolfortheblind.dk
>> Website:
>> http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/
>> 
>> Den 03/07/2012 kl. 17.21 skrev Donna Goodin:
>> 
>>> Just curious, has anyone tried GooglePlus?  If so, how is it in terms of 
>>> accessibility?
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:49 AM, Maxwell Ivey wrote:
>>> 
 hello; we are all frustrated with Facebook, but its just so hard to give 
 it up completely.  what i do is to subscribe to as many people as possible 
 out of my friends list.  then i set notifications to send me an email 
 anytime anything happens.  then i just hit reply in my mail program.  when 
 i want to post a photo, video, or status update i go to the regular 
 Facebook and use the control option i for a finder menu and choose update. 
  then i can arrow left or right to find the field i want.  If someone 
 sends me a friend request, i click the link in the message for accept or 
 ignore. i wish you luck, max 
 On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:12 AM, Søren Jensen wrote:
 
> Hi.
> 
> Before I give up and consider deleting my Facebook account, I'll bring up 
> discussion to see if any of you have considered the same frustrations 
> when using Facebook.
> 
> I've read on Applevis that setting Safari to react like Firefox or 
> Internet explorer should make the mobile site of Facebook very useable. 
> That won't work for me all the time. I experience things like the 
> language changes, normal links which I could read a few seconds ago are 
> translated into english graphical links, and when I click on these, 
> nothing happens. The only way I can come back to the site again is by 
> reloading the page, and if that won't work, I type m.facebook.com again 
> in the address bar to reload the page. Then I'm able to navigate the site 
> for a few minutes, and then the same happens over and over again. this 
> makes the site nearly impossible and very frustrating to use!
> 
> I've got a mail from Facebook telling me that someone has tagged me on a 
> picture. If I click the link to show what picture it is and to comment, 
> the normal unusable Facebook site comes up. I expected to find this 
> notification on the mobile version, but I can't find it anywhere while 
> going through my frontpage. How do I figure out what picture some random 
> person has tagged me on, and how do I add a comment so I can ask this 
> question?
> 
> Each time I'm trying to give Facebook a chance I run into issues like 
> this. Every time I spoke to other blind people who're using Facebook, 
> they don't use these features, they keep say just use the mobile site or 
> they don't have a Mac where all these issues seems to happen. The 
> Facebook support says that screenreader users just have to use the mobile 
> site, but what do we do when they only supports Internet explorer?
> I'm really considering deleting my Facebook acount and make the totally 
> switch to Twitter. If family and friends won't follow, well, that's their 
> choice. I find myself spending hours on trying to navigate the Facebook 
> site. SOmetimes it works and other times it's just impossible.
> 
> I really hope to get lots of great input here...
> Best regards:
> Søren Jensen
> Mail & MSN:
> s...@coolfortheblind.dk
> Website:
> http://www.coolfortheblind.dk/
> 
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit this group at 
> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
> 
 
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Re: Sendero

[Annie Skov Nielsen]

When will the sendero GPS come out?

Best regards Annie.
Den Jul 3, 2012 kl. 8:04 PM skrev Eugenia Firth:

> Hi guys. 
> I also found out something else. Sendero is working on a  serious GPS for the 
> iPhone. I asked Mike May if bus information was going to be part of it. He 
> said yes. That makes me really happy because I'm tired of looking up 
> information on our DART web site when it's accessible but not really 
> convenient sometimes because of the way they set it up. My sighted husband 
> complains too, so I don't think do is purely accessibility that's the 
> problem. 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eugenia Firth
> gigifi...@sbcglobal.net
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
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> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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RE: found scanning program for the Mac

[Bejarano, Rafael P.]

Thanks for passing this info along to us.  What is the name of the scanning 
program, and is there a website where I might go to learn more about it?

Cordially,
Rafael Bejarano

From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On 
Behalf Of Eugenia Firth [gigifi...@sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2012 9:54 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: found scanning program for the Mac

Hi guys.
I wanted to tell y'all about the scanning program that I saw at the exhibits at 
NFB today. True, it costs $1200, but it comes with a camera sort of like the 
Purl camera.

I had to get it going for them because the guy that knew about it wasn't at the 
table at the time I showed up. He came right after I got it going. It wouldn't 
talk at first. Who knows where it was on the screen. Like OpenBook, you don't 
use the screen reader while it's running. However, I had to turn their 
VoiceOver on, press command q and get out of their program, and then call it 
back up again, after I turned off their track pad. The person that was sitting 
there keeping watch while the developer was gone for a little bit, I guess was 
a Windows user. Anyway, I got the program going.

The developer that came back was very knowledgeable. He told me they had a 
former Kurzweil engineer with them. When I did the scan, it reading was 
incredibly good, even in the light my husband said was glaring on the paper.

I have a Purl camera I am considering selling. It doesn't have much use on it, 
and maybe I ought to sell OpenBook while I'm at it. However, I don't know if I 
can. The state gave me OpenBook, but I bought the Purl camera myself. I'll have 
to find out what I can do about OpenBook.

Eugenia Firth
gigifi...@sbcglobal.net




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Re: found scanning program for the Mac

[erik burggraaf]

Hi Gigi,

It's very comperable to the pearl.  If you had a load of scanning to do for 
university or some such you'd be happy to pay.  It saves lifting large books, 
or bending or cutting them.  It's fast.  It's accurate.  It's friendly to 
different lighting although it does work best in bright artificial light.

I still say the pricepoint is really high, but I also understand there are good 
reasons why some one would be happy to pay.

You are right.  There is a stand alone version for about 800 bucks more, but 
it's not worth the money under any circumstances.  It has no onboard memory to 
speak of and doesn't handle external memory well.  It requires the purchase of 
an extra $500 keypad component to access all the features.  It's big and clunky 
although not nearly so much as the sara CE.

Hope this helps,

Erik Burggraaf
Introducing Ebony Consulting business card transcription service, starting at 
$0.45 per card or $35 per hundred cards.
Ebony Consulting toll-free: 1-888-255-5194
or on the web at http://www.erik-burggraaf.com

On 2012-07-03, at 1:49 PM, Eugenia Firth wrote:

> Hi Erik. 
> Do you think the price would be worth it if you had a lot of scanning to do? 
> The thing I saw was like the Purl camera, very fast and you didn't have to 
> close a scanner or anything like that. For me, I may wait because I don't do 
> that much scanning right now. But Kurzweil 1000 for Windows, is not a lot 
> cheaper than this one. OpenBook isn't either if you want the Purl camera, and 
> you're using Windows, of course. 
> 
> I kind of gathered there are two readers: the one that connects to the 
> computer and the stand alone one. Did I get that right? 
> 
> Eugenia Firth
> gigifi...@sbcglobal.net
> 
> 
> 
> On Jul 3, 2012, at 12:38 PM, erik burggraaf wrote:
> 
>> Well, for one thing, it does it's processing locally, not in the cloud.  
>> That's convenient because it means you don't have to be connected to the net 
>> and it's also nice from a security standpoint.  It's also much faster 
>> processing locally.
>> 
>> The featureset of the Eyepal is not really worth the price point it's true; 
>> never-the-less, the fact that you can simply plug it in and it works is a 
>> huge benefit.  I was funded for one, so I bought it and I rely on it.  If 
>> I'd had to buy it myself the price would be a showstopper.  But it does what 
>> the brochure says.
>> 
>> Best,
>> 
>> Erik Burggraaf
>> Introducing Ebony Consulting business card transcription service, starting 
>> at $0.45 per card or $35 per hundred cards.
>> Ebony Consulting toll-free: 1-888-255-5194
>> or on the web at http://www.erik-burggraaf.com
>> 
>> On 2012-07-03, at 1:26 PM, Mary Otten wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>> What does this program have that docu-scan doesn't have? That one costs 300 
>>> bucks, plus the camera for another 300 from amazon. As I understand it, the 
>>> 300 dollar camera t5-v from Hovercam has the same resolution as the one 
>>> from Abissee. So what does the Abisee product have to make it worth 1200 
>>> bucks? 
>>> Mary Otten
>>> motte...@gmail.com
>>> 
>>> 
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>> 
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Re: found scanning program for the Mac

[Mary Otten]

So what advantage is there to the camera that comes with the Abisee as opposed 
to the 300 dollar Hovercam t5v? I understand that some folks might have 
security issues with scanning into the cloud. Frankly, I don't scan anything 
anywhere that I would worry about somebody else seeing, because when it comes 
to things like bills or other documents that have to be perfect, especially 
those with numbers, I don't trust any ocr, even though it has certainly 
improved. It still makes errors especially in anything that has a more complex 
format.  
Mary Otten
motte...@gmail.com


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Re: found scanning program for the Mac

[erik burggraaf]

Hi Mary,  I don't have docuscan.  I know all there is to know for good or ill 
about the EyePal, and there's plenty of both.  I know there are logistical 
problems with scanning in the cloud.  Speed, server and internet dependencies 
and security issues.  I can't speak to the interface of docuscan from 
experience though.

I do have a hovercam demo unit.  It looks pretty nice, which is just as well 
since it's completely decorative at the moment.  There's no mac twane driver 
that I've found so I can't use it with finereader express.  The twane driver on 
windows is pooched and neither omnipage nor kurzweil 12 will use the thing.  
Tested on two different machines.

I'd like to buy docuscan and play with it just to use the hovercam if for no 
other reason.  Now, if docuscan were able to process ocr locally, it would be a 
steel.  It is what it is though, and imho, overpriced on the basis that it runs 
in the cloud.

Best,

Erik Burggraaf
Introducing Ebony Consulting business card transcription service, starting at 
$0.45 per card or $35 per hundred cards.
Ebony Consulting toll-free: 1-888-255-5194
or on the web at http://www.erik-burggraaf.com

On 2012-07-03, at 9:18 PM, Mary Otten wrote:

> So what advantage is there to the camera that comes with the Abisee as 
> opposed to the 300 dollar Hovercam t5v? I understand that some folks might 
> have security issues with scanning into the cloud. Frankly, I don't scan 
> anything anywhere that I would worry about somebody else seeing, because when 
> it comes to things like bills or other documents that have to be perfect, 
> especially those with numbers, I don't trust any ocr, even though it has 
> certainly improved. It still makes errors especially in anything that has a 
> more complex format.  
> Mary Otten
> motte...@gmail.com
> 
> 
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Re: found scanning program for the Mac

[Eugenia Firth]

Hi Rafael.
The link for the web site is www.abisee.com. The company representative was 
passing out some business cards at the NFB exhibits. 

Eugenia Firth
gigifi...@sbcglobal.net



On Jul 3, 2012, at 7:45 PM, Bejarano, Rafael P. wrote:

> Thanks for passing this info along to us.  What is the name of the scanning 
> program, and is there a website where I might go to learn more about it?
> 
> Cordially,
> Rafael Bejarano
> 
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On 
> Behalf Of Eugenia Firth [gigifi...@sbcglobal.net]
> Sent: Monday, July 02, 2012 9:54 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: found scanning program for the Mac
> 
> Hi guys.
> I wanted to tell y'all about the scanning program that I saw at the exhibits 
> at NFB today. True, it costs $1200, but it comes with a camera sort of like 
> the Purl camera.
> 
> I had to get it going for them because the guy that knew about it wasn't at 
> the table at the time I showed up. He came right after I got it going. It 
> wouldn't talk at first. Who knows where it was on the screen. Like OpenBook, 
> you don't use the screen reader while it's running. However, I had to turn 
> their VoiceOver on, press command q and get out of their program, and then 
> call it back up again, after I turned off their track pad. The person that 
> was sitting there keeping watch while the developer was gone for a little 
> bit, I guess was a Windows user. Anyway, I got the program going.
> 
> The developer that came back was very knowledgeable. He told me they had a 
> former Kurzweil engineer with them. When I did the scan, it reading was 
> incredibly good, even in the light my husband said was glaring on the paper.
> 
> I have a Purl camera I am considering selling. It doesn't have much use on 
> it, and maybe I ought to sell OpenBook while I'm at it. However, I don't know 
> if I can. The state gave me OpenBook, but I bought the Purl camera myself. 
> I'll have to find out what I can do about OpenBook.
> 
> Eugenia Firth
> gigifi...@sbcglobal.net
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: Sendero

[Eugenia Firth]

Hi Annie.
I wish I knew. I asked, and they wouldn't commit to a time. I want it. 

I just got Ariadne a few days ago. I decided if it could get a guy through the 
forest, I should try it and see. I think it will have some uses, but I really 
want Sendero. Even the one I've got now has gotten me unlost a few times. 

Eugenia Firth
gigifi...@sbcglobal.net



On Jul 3, 2012, at 5:44 PM, Annie Skov Nielsen wrote:

> When will the sendero GPS come out?
> 
> Best regards Annie.
> Den Jul 3, 2012 kl. 8:04 PM skrev Eugenia Firth:
> 
>> Hi guys. 
>> I also found out something else. Sendero is working on a  serious GPS for 
>> the iPhone. I asked Mike May if bus information was going to be part of it. 
>> He said yes. That makes me really happy because I'm tired of looking up 
>> information on our DART web site when it's accessible but not really 
>> convenient sometimes because of the way they set it up. My sighted husband 
>> complains too, so I don't think do is purely accessibility that's the 
>> problem. 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Eugenia Firth
>> gigifi...@sbcglobal.net
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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Re: Creative Writing Apps?

[CJ Daniel]

Ester,

I had saved your original msg, for later reference.  And, low and behold, 
here's a new one.  That's so nice of you to remember my request.

Thanks again,

CJ


On Jul 3, 2012, at 11:42 AM, Esther wrote:

> Hi CJ,
> 
> While I think Scrivener is likely to be the app you might want, I thought I'd 
> mention that Ulysses is on sale today for $1.99 at the Mac App Store, as part 
> of an indie developer promotion called "two dollar Tuesday". These special 
> prices are only good for the day, though.
> 
> HTH.  Cheers,
> 
> Esther
> 
> On Jun 25, 2012, at 8:25 AM, CJ Daniel wrote:
> 
>> Ester, et al,
>> 
>> Thanks for the replies.  I was unaware of the demo for Scrivener.  I'll be 
>> giving that a try.  
>> 
>> Again, thanks,
>> 
>> CJ
>> 
>> 
>> On Jun 24, 2012, at 10:53 PM, Esther wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi CJ,
>>> 
>>> You might want to take a look at Scrivener, which has had several posts in 
>>> the archives from people who have used this app.  Here's a link to a review 
>>> that Austin Seraphin posted on his blog:
>>> http://behindthecurtain.us/2011/09/07/scrivener/
>>> 
>>> Also, the Literature and Latte site that makes scrivener has a 30-day free 
>>> trial download page:
>>> http://www.literatureandlatte.com/trial.php
>>> 
>>> They now have a Windows version of Scrivener, too.  And I think they also 
>>> offer an education discount, but you may have to supply additional 
>>> information.
>>> 
>>> HTH. Cheers,
>>> 
>>> Esther 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jun 22, 2012, at 12:22 PM, CJ Daniel wrote:
>>> 
 Hello All,
 
 I'm considering the purchase of a creative writing application from the 
 App Store.  I've had Pages for a while & find that it is not what I'm 
 looking for.  So, I've done some research & come up with some candidates.  
 I'm considering these three applications.  I.E. Manuscript, Scrivener, or 
 Ulysses.  I'm wondering if anyone can comment on the accessibility of 
 these or any other creative writing applications for use on the Mac with 
 VoiceOver.
 
 Many thanks in advance,
 
 CJ
 
 
>>> 
> 
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Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or squashed in Mountain Lion?

[Shawn Krasniuk]

Boo Eloquence! If I wanted to listen to that stupid robotic voice drone on and 
on, I'd switch back to PC and install Jaws or Window-Eyes. But I don't want to 
do that because I'm a Mac user, and I like listening to human-sounding voices. 
If I had to pick voices to be added to the Mac, I'd pick the Loquendo voices 
just because they do good inflections with exclamations. And sorry, but I don't 
think Ivona will ever come to Apple because I'm sure they don't want to follow 
Apple's speech API.

Shawn

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iMovie Podcast

[How to be Blind]

Hey all!
I have just completed a post and podcast on how to use iMovie to edit 
videos, add titles and transitions, and also insert music or sound effects.
Not everyone has as need for this but it has come up a few time so I 
wanted to share it. The Podcast should be in iTunes shortly if it's not already 
so you can find it there. Just search How to be Blind to subscribe.
Thanks and here is the link to my webpage where you can listen to the 
podcast and read the show notes.
http://htb2.com/

How to be Blind
Mike Malarsie
m...@howtobeblind.com

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Re: Sendero

[Pete Nalda]

I don't get it. How does Aridne  navigat one through a forest?

Egun On, Lagunak! Basque for G'day, Mates
Louie P. (Pete) Nalda
Http://www.myspace.com/lpnalda
Http://www.facebook.com/lpnalda
Http://www.linkedin.com/in/lpnalda
Twitter @lpnalda



On Jul 3, 2012, at 9:39 PM, Eugenia Firth  wrote:

> Hi Annie.
> I wish I knew. I asked, and they wouldn't commit to a time. I want it. 
> 
> I just got Ariadne a few days ago. I decided if it could get a guy through 
> the forest, I should try it and see. I think it will have some uses, but I 
> really want Sendero. Even the one I've got now has gotten me unlost a few 
> times. 
> 
> Eugenia Firth
> gigifi...@sbcglobal.net
> 
> 
> 
> On Jul 3, 2012, at 5:44 PM, Annie Skov Nielsen wrote:
> 
>> When will the sendero GPS come out?
>> 
>> Best regards Annie.
>> Den Jul 3, 2012 kl. 8:04 PM skrev Eugenia Firth:
>> 
>>> Hi guys. 
>>> I also found out something else. Sendero is working on a  serious GPS for 
>>> the iPhone. I asked Mike May if bus information was going to be part of it. 
>>> He said yes. That makes me really happy because I'm tired of looking up 
>>> information on our DART web site when it's accessible but not really 
>>> convenient sometimes because of the way they set it up. My sighted husband 
>>> complains too, so I don't think do is purely accessibility that's the 
>>> problem. 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Eugenia Firth
>>> gigifi...@sbcglobal.net
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
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>> 
>> 
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