Hi there. Is there a list somewhere of the built-in shortcut keys of osx? I guess there's a shortcut list somewhere, i just don't know where to search. /Krister 10 okt 2010 kl. 19.55 skrev Anne Robertson:
> Hello Neil, > > I've never used a PC so can't make comparisons. However, I currently have a > student who likes to use just one hand to operate his Mac and he does this by > using Quick Nav and Keyboard commander. > > Everyone has different needs, so you should put in the Keyboard Commander > shortcuts that you need and that are not duplicated by Quick Nav. You can > then do most things with your right hand. > > There is also nothing to stop you using the standard Mac shortcuts such as > Ctrl-F2 to go to the Apple menu, Ctrl-F3 to go to the Dock and Ctrl-F8 to go > to the Status menus. > > There are lots more like this and i tend to use them rather than the VO > equivalents. However, with the VO keys locked, I use the VO commands instead. > > Cheers, > > Anne > > > On 10 Oct 2010, at 19:02, Neil Barnfather - TalkNav wrote: > >> Dear All, >> >> Many of you will have seen me around before on the various lists so no need >> for introductions, I've been a PC user now for in excess of 20 years, and >> have attempted to make the switch to Mac now 3 times without success. >> >> The first point I want to make is that this is not for lack of desire upon >> my behalf, rather it is my hope that I am simply missing an essential piece >> of the puzzle. this missing part though appears, to me at least, to be the >> key, the magic link between making a successful jump or not. >> >> I've heard all the usual shpeal about, it's not like a PC, so you cannot >> think of it like that, put everything you've ever learned about screen >> readers aside and think differently or a fresh, it's just the learning >> curve, stick with it and you'll get there... >> >> All of which I've tried and failed at... and when I asked an Apple Genius to >> watch over me in a store to analyse where I was going wrong, his response, I >> don't understand, you've mastered OSx, it has to be Voice Over... >> >> So here it is, wide open for you, the cream of the switching community to >> hopefully answer once and for all. >> >> In an e-mail to Apple's illusive Accessibility team, I once commented that >> if you took 2 PC users, one sighted and one not, removed the mouse from the >> sighted user, that the 2 PC users would both use their computers in the same >> way. i.e. that the key strokes / commands are all the same. >> >> However, get 2 Mac users, one sighted one not, remove the mouse from the >> sighted user, the 2 users both use the keyboard differently. >> >> This thus forcing the Mac Voice Over user to learn the screen reader either >> before, or alongside, the actual computer and the OS itself. >> >> This of course not being so, from my perspective anyhow, on the PC, where >> both users, keyboard exclusive or not, both use the machine in the same way. >> >> My biggest hurdle to date is the keyboard commands and their implementation >> on the Mac, it's not that they are different, as I can live with that, it's >> the same as buying a new HiFi system, the buttons are in different places >> and of a different design. >> >> What I cannot seem to get over is that with a PC, 95% of what I do is one >> handed and in 95% of those instances can be achieved with one finger. >> leaving my left hand free to handle papers, telephones etc, etc. >> >> comparatively, with Voice Over and the Mac, I am finding that I have to use >> both hands for the most basic level of navigation, and also that many >> commands are as a minimal 3 keys to implement. >> >> Many have suggested work around such as the Magic Track Pad, indeed, this >> would in effect make the Mac behave similarly to the iPhone, iPod Touch, and >> iPad, all 3 of which I own. >> >> However, one cannot get over the fact that this detracts from productivity, >> or on the surface of it seems to, this being brought about by the user >> moving their hand(s) from the keyboard to the track pad and back again. >> >> *Note* I understand that Mac Book's have the track pad built in, but it's >> still relocating your hands from one input device to another and back again. >> >> So here's the question which really appears to be the initial clincher for >> me, is it possible to use a Mac with essentially one hand and even more >> importantly one finger for most commands and navigation. >> >> I would say, to be fair, that' it's the navigation with one hand or one >> finger that is the most important thing. all of JAWS commands require two >> fingers or more, but it's the navigation that I just cannot get myself >> passed. On my PC using JAWS virtually everything I'm doing is one fingered. >> >> So, is this possible on the Mac...? the caveat to this should be, that I do >> not see the point of spending countless hours re-allocating or arranging >> existing commands / navigation commands. It seems to me that Voice Over's >> biggest hurdle is the Voice Over command keys, Control + Options key, please >> forgive me if I missed up Control and Command. >> >> Please no-one, this is not a that's JAWS this is Voice Over question, this >> is a... Can I use Voice Over and the Mac with one hand or better still one >> finger for navigation of the Mac itself? >> >> Setting the record straight at the get go, this is not an Apple slating, I >> wish to make the switch, but it has to be because it's as easy or easier, >> the fact that Voice Over is more stable is a factor, but not a huge one. >> >> I do not buy all the security hype, nor the OS enhancements or stability >> front. Yes Voice Over is more stable than JAWS / Window Eyes, but >> principally because it is part of the operating platform, and not because >> its superior or that Mac OSx is. >> >> This statement about operating platforms may have held some degree of water >> back in the days gone by, but with Windows 7, and a decent PC specification, >> one can get as much performance and stability out of a PC as a Mac. >> moreover, in terms of security, I've never known anyone I know who has a >> brain using a PC to get a virus, the problem is that the PC world is where >> the masses are, and many of those masses are nits, and they do stupid >> things... when the PC pops up asking if they wish to install and download a >> virus to delete all their data, they um, then ah, and then click OK. well >> that's stupidity and not Windows being vulnerable. >> >> *Note* I do accept that if you introduce JAWS or Window Eyes to a PC that >> this can affect OS performance and stability. Indeed, my technical support >> staff have many a time commented, how to watch an amazing machine, filled >> with the latest technology, working like a dream turn to treacle, install >> JAWS. >> >> this is true, and is a significant factor to me wishing to jump ship, of >> course if FS did what Microsoft did with Windows 7, i.e. dropped the whole >> program and started a fresh, I believe that JAWS could seriously give Voice >> Over a run for its money on the stability front. as it happens this move is >> highly unlikely. >> >> So there it is folks, what do you Apple wizards think? >> >> best regards. >> >> Twitter @neilbarnfather >> >> Neil Barnfather >> Talks List Administrator >> >> TalkNav is a Nuance, Code Factory and Sendero dealer, for all your >> accessible phone, PDA and GPS related enquiries visit www.talknav.com >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "MacVisionaries" group. >> To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. 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