Re: [PROPOSAL] Commons Incubator

[Craig L Russell]

On Apr 13, 2009, at 3:55 PM, Noel J. Bergman wrote:

Torsten Curdt wrote:

Noel J. Bergman wrote:

That's code. What about community, Torsten? What is the Community? It

has

been the Apache Commons as a collective, not sub-projects. Is that to change? We do not want Apache Commons to turn into an umbrella, right?

 We

need to keep that as a single community managing libraries of common
components.

Exactly! That's exactly why I think the Incubator does not work well
for small components. The Incubator is to build a community.

Exactly.  We agree.

all it's the whole Commons that is the community.

We agree, again.  :-)

So is it OK for commons to play mini Incubator with it's sandbox? I am

not sure I like this either.

OK, why not? Just asking. You and I have having a civil discussion. :-)

Too often had the discussion at Commons whether this library needs to
go through incubation or not. I guess what I am trying to say is that
there is something in the middle we need to find a procedure for.

OK, why don't you lay out some parameters?


is done by the PMC clearing it.

FWIW, *ALL* new code coming into the ASF does go through the Incubator, but that is because we are the repository for IP clearance; the actual clearance

Be it at Commons or at the Incubator. I don't care. It's just that

we need to find a procedure on how to deal with it. I think the idea
behind this thread was more to reach out to the Incubator experience
to find a proper way how to deal with such contributions.

Commons is probably more likely to get these kind of contributions and

versus it goes into Commons Sandbox, and they are granted karma for it

to in the end?

We have provisional communities, but not committers. How is it different if a new project comes into the Incubator and they have commit access to that, there? Is it just a matter of access control? Is that what this boils down

Some projects are just too small to warrant the target of a TLP
or even a sub project

We agree! We have several projects here that I believe belong in Commons!

Craig

For example, we have a great little project called Sanselan that is "code complete" but has not attracted a big enough community to become a TLP. Commons could be just the place for it. The alternatives for Sanselan are indefinite incubation, expulsion from Apache or incorporation into another TLP.

Teaching people "The Apache Way" after they got commit access sounds
as bad as forcing the original authors to keep sending patches

control to delineate what they can do?


-----

Torsten, my point is that when they land here, they do get commit access, and then they learn the ASF away. So, again, is this just about access

My view, and I believe Torstens view is that to become a committer means to join the dev lists, send in patches, be part of the community, gain trust with the project members and then after a while be voted in as a

committer.

Trust related to what?

Trust in that they understand how Apache works.

first.

We don't expect them to know that here, and we make them an ASF Committer

[The new Committer might] also the person that could have potential code

ownership problems, could try to lead the project like they were used
to before and so on. I would not consider them more trustworthy in
that sense just because they brought the code.

OK, perhaps we're getting somewhere ...

Torsten, are you asking that we setup something like Incubator Commons

Sandbox to Commons Sandbox?  Is this the idea?

Sandbox into which code goes, we make them Committers, the Mentors (likely from Commons) work with them here, then when you are satisfied that they get it, you (upon vote of the PMCs) svn move the code from Incubator Commons

They do need to do is become indoctrinated in the community, and if it

is

just a committer or few at a time into an entire community, Apache

Commons

ought to be able to handle that.

So we just hand out commit access and hope (or try to make them)
behave?

control.

        --- Noel



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LOL Well, that *is* what we do here, isn't it? That part is just access

Craig L Russell
Architect, Sun Java Enterprise System http://db.apache.org/jdo
408 276-5638 mailto:craig.russ...@sun.com
P.S. A good JDO? O, Gasp!

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