No, I am not saying that. Of course it takes energy to get a fuel in your tank. But Hydrogen is special, you have to put at least 2kWh in to get out 1kWh at a minimum! (Current Hydrogen cycles are about 3kWh in!)
Fossil and Nuclear are provided courtesy of nature, and it furnishes the bulk of energy trapped inside. Hydrogen must be manufactured. You cannot put "just water" into a system and have it produce energy. If you believe this, you were asleep in science class as a kid. I'm not responding to any more of your insanity. On Mon, Nov 6, 2023 at 4:12 PM (-Phil-) <philp...@gmail.com> wrote: > No, I am not saying that. Of course it takes energy to get a fuel in > your tank. But Hydrogen is special, you have to put at least 2kWh in to > get out 1kWh at a minimum! (Current Hydrogen cycles are about 3kWh in!) > > Fossil and Nuclear are provided courtesy of nature, and it furnishes the > bulk of energy trapped inside. Hydrogen must be manufactured. You cannot > put "just water" into a system and have it produce energy. If you believe > this, you were asleep in science class as a kid. I'm not responding to > any more of your insanity. > > On Mon, Nov 6, 2023 at 4:01 PM 63urban via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote: > >> Not one of the energy sources you have list magically materializes inside >> your automobile with no external expenditure of energy. Not petro products >> and not nuclear. It is interesting how champions of one thing maximize the >> inputs of their opponents thing while dancing like a feather over the >> issues of their thing.Has anyone actually looked at the approach Toyota is >> taking with hydrogen. They have taken their proven hybrid platform and >> introduced a hydrogen component that takes on-board water and produces the >> hydrogen at a rate required to fuel an ice.So the only infrastructure >> required is water. If they can do this in an automobile that changes the >> energy dynamic across the entire spectrum. It absolutely shrinks battery >> demandIt absolutely shinks electrical infrastructure demands as everyone >> can the generate their own power locally. Demand for copper shrinks Demand >> for all the metals required for batteries shrink.There is zero pollution >> generated in the operation of these engines. And we are still talking about >> ev traction for the most part with little to none of the side >> effects.Regardless of how the modern nuclear advertising campaign is green >> washing their waste and risk situation none of it is necessary. There are >> new and emerging technologies which will solve all of these issues.NickSent >> from my Bell Samsung device over Canada's largest network. >> -------- Original message --------From: "(-Phil-) via EV" < >> ev@lists.evdl.org> Date: 2023-11-06 4:42 p.m. (GMT-05:00) To: Electric >> Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.evdl.org> Cc: "(-Phil-)" < >> p...@ingineerix.com> Subject: Re: [EVDL] OFF TOPIC Re: EV's not a green >> success. WHERE does the Hydrogen come from? You can't mine it, you can't >> harvestit, you have to either crack it from fossil fuels, or split it from >> water,which takes a lot of energy (at least 2X what you get back). It's >> nodifferent than a battery. You have to put energy in to get it, then >> youget it out about half when you burn it or run it in a fuel cell. It's >> justan energy storage system, a little more energy-dense than >> currentbatteries, and can be recharged a little faster. It may have >> goodapplication in future aircraft and shipping, maybe long-haul trucking, >> butthat's about it. It's definitely not something you'd want to use >> forstationary storage, as it's too wasteful. Using for transportation, >> youmight accept the horrible efficiency in exchange for the convenience >> anddensity.I shouldn't have to explain this to anyone on this list! On >> Monday, November 6, 2023 at 12:40:07 PM PST, 63urban via EV < >> ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote:>> Please explain how a flammable gas is not >> an energy source?>-------------- next part --------------An HTML attachment >> was scrubbed...URL: < >> http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20231106/0315c512/attachment.htm>_______________________________________________Address >> messages to e...@lists.evdl.orgNo other addresses in TO and CC fieldsHELP: >> http://www.evdl.org/help/ >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: < >> http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20231106/5f755c97/attachment.htm >> > >> _______________________________________________ >> Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org >> No other addresses in TO and CC fields >> HELP: http://www.evdl.org/help/ >> >> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20231106/ad363798/attachment.htm> _______________________________________________ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields HELP: http://www.evdl.org/help/
