And, as a further hijack, were not Ritchey frames brazed to spec at Toyo in
Osaka?
From: David Estes
T
On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 2:03 PM, PATRICK MOORE wrote:
On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 12:52 PM, Tim McNamara wrote in
re of his custom Ritchey:
I dunno
On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 2:03 PM, PATRICK MOORE wrote:
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 12:52 PM, Tim McNamara wrote in
> re of his custom Ritchey:
>
> It is, without a doubt, the best handling bike I have ever ridden. I dunno
>> what it is that Tom Ritchey did when he came up with his frame design
On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 11:52 AM, Tim McNamara wrote:
>
> On Mar 14, 2009, at 10:43 PM, David Estes wrote:
>
> > On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 8:31 PM, Tim McNamara
> > wrote:
> > -snip-
> >
> >
> > I might very well ride the 23 pound country bike, reckoning its
> > greater robustness gives me a bette
On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 12:52 PM, Tim McNamara wrote
in re of his custom Ritchey:
It is, without a doubt, the best handling bike I have ever ridden. I dunno
> what it is that Tom Ritchey did when he came up with his frame design, but's
> it is the perfect balance of nimbleness and stability.
S
On Mar 14, 2009, at 10:43 PM, David Estes wrote:
> On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 8:31 PM, Tim McNamara
> wrote:
> -snip-
>
>
> I might very well ride the 23 pound country bike, reckoning its
> greater robustness gives me a better chance to finish the race
> without mechanical problems or punctures,
On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 6:42 AM, RonaTD wrote:
>
> On Mar 14, 11:59 pm, Patrick in VT wrote:
> > i maintain that a compact double and
> > 28s would do just fine on rouge-roubaix - thus, my contrary opinion to
> > the title of this thread.
>
> Well, since I created the thread and its title, I'll
On Mar 14, 11:59 pm, Patrick in VT wrote:
> i maintain that a compact double and
> 28s would do just fine on rouge-roubaix - thus, my contrary opinion to
> the title of this thread.
Well, since I created the thread and its title, I'll take the
opportunity to clarify. In fact, a compact double a
On Sun, 2009-03-15 at 05:48 -0700, AJ wrote:
>
> I enjoyed all the posts with my morning joe, seeing the opinions fly
> made for some interesting reading. My 2 cents; moved to Upstate N.Y.
> a couple of months ago from Tucson (I know, nuts!). Finally was able
> to get on a bike yesterdaywen
I enjoyed all the posts with my morning joe, seeing the opinions fly
made for some interesting reading. My 2 cents; moved to Upstate N.Y.
a couple of months ago from Tucson (I know, nuts!). Finally was able
to get on a bike yesterdaywent about 12 miles on my Rambo and
almost dropped a lung.
On Sat, 2009-03-14 at 21:59 -0700, Patrick in VT wrote:
> On Mar 14, 5:24 pm, Steve Palincsar wrote:
> > Well, being in a race means everybody but one person is a loser.
> > Period. And in every class but the top professionals, EVERYONE is a
> > loser, because none of the amateurs is as good as
On Mar 14, 6:05 pm, Angus wrote:
>there are many variables to account for.
yes, I've acknowledged this, verbatim.
and, again, i'm comparing country bikes to race bikes. not cf to ti
or steel race bikes, but country bikes to race bikes. if you think
the many variables can, on average, overcom
On Mar 14, 5:24 pm, Steve Palincsar wrote:
> On Sat, 2009-03-14 at 13:07 -0700, Patrick in VT wrote:
> The Hampsten Strada Bianca is arguably a country bike and also arguably
> a racing bike. Would have riders in this dirt road race been better
> served on a Strada Bianca than any made-for-23mm-
On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 8:31 PM, Tim McNamara wrote:
> -snip-
>
> I might very well ride the 23 pound country bike, reckoning its
> greater robustness gives me a better chance to finish the race
> without mechanical problems or punctures, which'll get you dropped
> faster than anything and put yo
I debated internally a lot about replying since the thread is mainly
about racing and not about Rivendells per se. And this seems to have
some potential for some hard feelings over legitimate disagreements
in cycling philosophy (I have been in a long drawn-out and rancorous
debate in rec.
Patrick in VT,
I will agree with you that, "everthing else being equal," a lighter
bike is a better option for a race.
But everthing else is not equal; there are many variables to account
for.
Joe Bartoe set faster times up hills with a heavier bike. I set my
fastest time trial times (when I d
On Sat, 2009-03-14 at 13:07 -0700, Patrick in VT wrote:
> the thread started off with a sentiment that the riders would be
> better served on country bikes in this *race.* I disagree, because I
> think, on the whole, a country bike would put the racer at a
> competitive disadvantage.
>
The Ham
Yes, agreed, agreed, and agreed. I would only add, what I wanted to say
originally (although didn't state it explicitly) was how 'bout racing on a
17.5lbs "country race bike". Fatter tired and some lower gears. Just
enough so the racer isn't punished (as much!), but can instead transmit that
ene
to be clear, I'm not saying its just about the bike. as others have
pointed out, there are many variables to account for.
my point is this: if you are in a race, riding a lighter bike is a
competitive advantage. and most people who race want the competitive
advantage, and rightly so. it's par
I own an AHH. It's standard configuration includes a triple, 32mm tires, and
fenders. No racks. It's a great bike for family rides, commuting, winter
training, and mixed terrain rides. I ride it occasionally on some of the
local club rides and can honestly say it does not hold me back. There is a
t
he
geometry of the Riv, just to see whether the weight made that much difference.
Much more than 2 cents this time,
Joe
> From: tim...@bitstream.net
> Subject: [RBW] Re: Country Bikes Needed Here, Too
> Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 00:27:10 -0500
> To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
>
I don't know about you guys, but on a significant climb I'm usually
already going about as hard as I can without risking blowing up
entirely. I don't have another 5% to give. Under those conditions,
losing 3 meters to the 'identical cyclist' means being out of
conversation (or drafting) range, a
On Mar 13, 2009, at 11:51 PM, benzzoy wrote:
> On Mar 12, 3:17 pm, Aaron Thomas wrote:
>> But when it comes to climbing, I cannot
>> help but think that the extra 6+ lbs I'm hauling on my 23-ish lb.
>> bike
>> (compared to their 16 -17lb bikes) puts me at a distinct
>> disadvantage.
>
On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 10:51 PM, benzzoy wrote:
>
> On Mar 12, 3:17 pm, Aaron Thomas wrote:
> > But when it comes to climbing, I cannot
> > help but think that the extra 6+ lbs I'm hauling on my 23-ish lb. bike
> > (compared to their 16 -17lb bikes) puts me at a distinct disadvantage.
>
>
On Mar 12, 3:17 pm, Aaron Thomas wrote:
> But when it comes to climbing, I cannot
> help but think that the extra 6+ lbs I'm hauling on my 23-ish lb. bike
> (compared to their 16 -17lb bikes) puts me at a distinct disadvantage.
If one discounts the psychology of having a heavier or lighter
Each to his own, of course. I personally would prefer a lightish road bike
with 28s (or perhaps 32s) for mild dirt and gravel than a 42mm plus
heavyweight, which leads to my question: at what point, all else being equal
of course, does weight difference matter? I expect 8 or 10 lbs will make a
diff
On Mar 12, 10:06 pm, Patrick in VT wrote:
\> i don't get this. most race routes do make for beautiful rides.
and
> the roads are there for anyone to ride, whenever they want and whether
> they race or not. Maybe were all just disillusioned by what bicycle
> racing has become - the drugs, the ad
On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 8:49 AM, David Estes wrote:
>
> On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 6:19 AM, Patrick in VT wrote:
>>
>> On Mar 12, 11:43 pm, David Estes wrote:
>> > I think they need to make the race longer! :-)
>>
>> are you familiar with the trans-iowa race? it kind of proves your
>> point - it
We don't have many racer types who shop at HC, but we have one who
regularly makes use of our repair/technical services. He's the kind of
guy who's always looking to shave grams or convert metal parts to
similar parts made of some non-metal. His knowledge of bicycles/parts
of this type is extensiv
On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 6:19 AM, Patrick in VT wrote:
>
> On Mar 12, 11:43 pm, David Estes wrote:
> > I think they need to make the race longer! :-)
>
> are you familiar with the trans-iowa race? it kind of proves your
> point - it's a 300 mile "race" on rough stuff and there is certainly a
>
On Mar 12, 11:43 pm, David Estes wrote:
> I think they need to make the race longer! :-)
are you familiar with the trans-iowa race? it kind of proves your
point - it's a 300 mile "race" on rough stuff and there is certainly a
difference in bike/equipment choices for that event.
--~--~---
On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 7:45 PM, Patrick in VT wrote:
>
> On Mar 12, 5:38 pm, David Estes wrote:
> > Patrick, what I was thinking, is why not have a Ti "country bike" racer.
>
> i see your point, and a Ti "country bike racer" is a step in the right
> direction (although that is some serious genr
On Mar 12, 9:57 pm, RonaTD wrote:
> "What a beautiful ride. Shame they had to ruin it by having a race."
i don't get this. most race routes do make for beautiful rides. and
the roads are there for anyone to ride, whenever they want and whether
they race or not. Maybe were all just disillusion
On Mar 12, 5:38 pm, David Estes wrote:
> Patrick, what I was thinking, is why not have a Ti "country bike" racer.
i see your point, and a Ti "country bike racer" is a step in the right
direction (although that is some serious genre-bending).
but I would argue that a race bike with 28s (some cha
Well put. The ride looked great. The music was horrible but really all
that says is that I'm getting old...
On Mar 12, 6:57 pm, RonaTD wrote:
> All the debate over whether the top finishers would have hurt their
> times by riding country bikes, imho, turns the point around 180
> degrees. My reac
All the debate over whether the top finishers would have hurt their
times by riding country bikes, imho, turns the point around 180
degrees. My reaction to the video is, "What a beautiful ride. Shame
they had to ruin it by having a race."
My second reaction is, they spent all that money on those
On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 3:15 PM, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
> On Thu, 2009-03-12 at 15:03 -0700, David Estes wrote:
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 2:47 PM, Steve Palincsar
> > wrote:
> >
> > On Thu, 2009-03-12 at 14:38 -0700, David Estes wrote:
> > > Patrick, what I was thinki
I'd have to agree with Patrick in VT. I ride my Romulus regularly with
a club thick with Cat 2 and 3-ish racers on carbon and ti bikes. With
speeds in the 20s on flats I manage to hold my own (more or less),
especially if I can draft. But when it comes to climbing, I cannot
help but think that the
On Thu, 2009-03-12 at 15:03 -0700, David Estes wrote:
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 2:47 PM, Steve Palincsar
> wrote:
>
> On Thu, 2009-03-12 at 14:38 -0700, David Estes wrote:
> > Patrick, what I was thinking, is why not have a Ti "country
> bike"
> > ra
On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 2:47 PM, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
> On Thu, 2009-03-12 at 14:38 -0700, David Estes wrote:
> > Patrick, what I was thinking, is why not have a Ti "country bike"
> > racer. Ti or CF, but with fatter tires and and extra chainring. So
> > weight isn't a problem (ok, maybe an
On Thu, 2009-03-12 at 14:38 -0700, David Estes wrote:
> Patrick, what I was thinking, is why not have a Ti "country bike"
> racer. Ti or CF, but with fatter tires and and extra chainring. So
> weight isn't a problem (ok, maybe an extra few hundred grams for the
> tires, extra ring, rear derailer
Patrick, what I was thinking, is why not have a Ti "country bike" racer. Ti
or CF, but with fatter tires and and extra chainring. So weight isn't a
problem (ok, maybe an extra few hundred grams for the tires, extra ring,
rear derailer). This bike would allow the athlete to ride with more comfort
"For me, the true disadvantage would be the engine, not the bike. "
but that's the point:
for a given group of racers with similar abilities, lighter bicycles
designed for racing offer the advantages needed to go faster, and
thus, win a race. not finish a race, or keep up with the peloton -
but
a disadvantage in those particular races. For me, the true
disadvantage would be the engine, not the bike.
Joe
> Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:11:28 -0700
> Subject: [RBW] Re: Country Bikes Needed Here, Too
> From: psh...@drm.com
> To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
>
>
> On M
On Mar 12, 1:11 pm, Patrick in VT wrote:> believe me,
i drink the same steel-bike-big-tire kool-aid as y'all do,
> but it's going to be a while before an AHH wins a serious bike race.
> which is fine b/c it's not a race bike!!
You could call Crumpton and order a CF version of a Hilsen, all you
On Mar 12, 11:54 am, Joe Bartoe wrote:
>The AHH easily outweighs the racing bike by a good 7 pounds, but >on my
>commute which is mostly flat with a 1.5 mile climb at the >end of it, I found
>that it went just as fast on the flats and >climbed just as fast.
this is a false comparison. you ar
Yep, something along those lines...
On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 9:54 AM, Aaron Thomas wrote:
>
> David, what you're describing sort of sounds like Hampsten Cycle's
> Strada Bianca:
>
> http://www.hampsten.com/Bikes/GravelRoad/stradabianca.html
>
> see Andy's Ti version:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/cldwjh
But I've read elsewhere that "it's not about the bike"... :)
On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 10:03 AM, Patrick in VT wrote:
>
> On Mar 12, 11:48 am, David Estes wrote:
> >Wouldn't the guys on the podium still be there if >they rode a Homer with
> Jack Browns and a granny >gear?
>
> no.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
On Mar 12, 11:48 am, David Estes wrote:
>Wouldn't the guys on the podium still be there if >they rode a Homer with Jack
>Browns and a granny >gear?
no.
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW
David, what you're describing sort of sounds like Hampsten Cycle's
Strada Bianca:
http://www.hampsten.com/Bikes/GravelRoad/stradabianca.html
see Andy's Ti version:
http://tinyurl.com/cldwjh
But he has a compact double, not a triple, and a 12-27 cassette.
On Mar 12, 8:58 am, David Estes wrote
On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 8:54 AM, Joe Bartoe wrote:
>
>
>
> > From: psh...@drm.com was the one to say it:
> >
> > These are races.
> >
> > No doubt a country bike would be great on those roads - but for
> > serious competition? Bike racing is not about being comfortable or
> > having an easy climb
> From: psh...@drm.com was the one to say it:
>
> These are races.
>
> No doubt a country bike would be great on those roads - but for
> serious competition? Bike racing is not about being comfortable or
> having an easy climb.
>
> I'm sure the top of the field did just fine on their carbon
Yes, but where does it say you have to be uncomfortable and inefficient to
race? Wouldn't the guys on the podium still be there if they rode a Homer
with Jack Browns and a granny gear? I think they would be win by an even
better margin and make the ride a bit more pleasant.
DE
On Thu, Mar 12, 2
well, I guess I'll be the one to say it:
These are races.
No doubt a country bike would be great on those roads - but for
serious competition? Bike racing is not about being comfortable or
having an easy climb.
I'm sure the top of the field did just fine on their carbon road bikes
- probably w
Dirt is good. Love that mixed terrain.
Cool video, thanks for sharing.
On Mar 11, 9:50 pm, RonaTD wrote:
> http://www.tunicatrails.org/VIDEO/rougeroubaix2009.html
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW
Yeah, I'm sure there were a few thought processes that went sort of
like this:
Pre-race:
"Install a triple or a 28? Nah, that's for wimps"
Post-race:
"Should have ridden my mountain bike with the triple and the 32...and
the big tires! Walking is embarassing!"
Looks like a cool race, sort of lik
That does look like a cool event. I bet a few folks rode cross bikes.
But yeah, a Hilsen, or even a Rambouillet with 28s would be better for
that than most of those bikes. I got the impression that some of the
folks did not enjoy that ride. Nothing worse than walking your bike
uphill in a road rac
THAT is so cool! Looks like a great such a great race! Need more like that
for sure.
Man, I'm thinking a Hilsen with a triple and some Jack Browns would be s
helpful there. All those skinny tired crabon bikes with racing doubles...
not so much.
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 7:50 PM, RonaTD wr
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