Whoops, forgot to include the link:
W. Richard Stevens' Home Page
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W. Richard Stevens' Home Page
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On Sunday, September 15, 2024 at 03:26:30 AM PDT, Meg McRoberts via
wrote:
Rich's homepage is still available. Maybe it
3:16:38 AM PDT, Damian McGuckin
wrote:
On Sun, 15 Sep 2024, Meg McRoberts via wrote:
> Which book? _Advanced Programming in the UNIX Environment_ mentions a
> groff package written by James Clark.The _Network Programming Vol 1:
> Network APIs and Sockets" also mentions this
Which book? _Advanced Programming in the UNIX Environment_ mentions a groff
package written by James Clark.The _Network Programming Vol 1: Network APIs and
Sockets" also mentions this package as well as some tools andscripts written by
Dave Hanson, Gary Wright, Jon Bentley, and Brian Kernighan
It might be worth contacting Brian Kernighan and asking for his blessing.He
has always been a very nice person and I suspect you could worksomething out.
At the very least, I'm sure he would not hurl expletivesat you for asking ;-)
On Thursday, May 18, 2023 at 04:19:18 AM PDT, Damian McGuc
Gr -- I give up, but the .DS/.DI should be on separate lines...
On Sunday, September 5, 2021, 2:31:21 AM PDT, Meg McRoberts via
wrote:
Shoot! This mail doesn't look like what I typed! Let me try the formatting
of the code snippet again...
On Sunday, September 5, 20
Shoot! This mail doesn't look like what I typed! Let me try the formatting
of the code snippet again...
On Sunday, September 5, 2021, 1:56:32 AM PDT, Meg McRoberts via
wrote:
Which macro set are you using? For mm, I think .DS/.DE used to do thisbut
it's been a while
Which macro set are you using? For mm, I think .DS/.DE used to do thisbut
it's been a while and things may have changed.
Try the following:
.DS
fun() {
echo "hello" > /dev/null 2>&1;
}
.DE
I added some additional spaces in front of the echo line -- I think the normis
to use 8 spaces or
Yes, there were a lot of writers working on those documents and some were
morerigorous in sticking to the standard than others. There was some editting
and wehad typesetters who looked for such things but I know that things slipped
through.I was mostly working on the more technical docs -- a lo
My recollection from Bell Labs (Naperville location in the mid-80's) was that
the lawyers hadcome up with some scheme where UNIX had to be all caps plus in a
"unique" font. These werethe days of nroff/mmx and the nascent times of
device-independent troff so we used the smallerall-caps "UNIX" st
Thanks, Warren,
You are right that gerrit is probably overkill for a project with relatively few
contributors, and people who seem to generally work well together with a
lot of dramatic flare-ups and such...
Interesting about lilypond... Gerrit seems to be associated with Jenkins, that
automatica
Hi all,
I'm pretty much a lurker on the list -- I like to write using groff but I don't
do macros and
tools work...
However, I am learning a bit about git, and working with some serious git
masters. The
flaw I see to Warner's proposed policy is that comments and discussions are not
stored
in t
Bonjour, Pierre-Jean,
I don't know much about vgrind, but the English word "grind" is a verb
that describes what you do to beef to get ground beef (aka hamburger)
or to grain to get flour. Given that "ground" is the past tense of grind,
it does look like it comes from the Anglo-Saxon or other Germ
That brings back memories of 1989 when I battled HP's Unix labs. The
>HP-UX reference was called "the brick" due to size and density, and I
>became known as "the bricktator" thanks to my monarchical management
>style. But I forced it through, and commands were in COURIER, not bold,
>and variab
Hi, Eric,
Nice to know that you're still monitoring this list...
I was involved in converting some documents from a home-grown
version of eroff/mm to Docbook back before Eric's tools were available
and I agree that there is a LOT more to it than just .EMPH. For example,
strings were identified as
When I started at Bell Labs in 1983, we had nroff/mmx and then there
was troff that was only for typesetting. We wrote all the docs in nroff
then used troff to format this text for a typesetter and made any
necessary formatting changes on bluelines.
Pretty soon after that, we got device-independe
I loved Clarke's history/rant posting, BTW...
The other big output issue I know about is the lack of support for UTF-8.
I've written some man pages for Trend that I can build fine but when I
send the source to the R&D people in Taiwan and Nanjing, they have
trouble running them because all their s
I just checked and Amazon has 9 used copies available, two for
less that $10:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/0810462915/ref=dp_olp_used?ie=UTF8&condition=used
Six are available at half.com:
http://product.half.ebay.com/Unix-Text-Processing_W0QQtgZinfoQQprZ1500033
--- On Mon, 12/28/09, C
A general answer -- sort of ;-)
I was involved in some trial projects converting *roff
text to sgml and xml. Automated scripts did a fairly
decent job with some exceptions, like tables.
We had to make some arbitrary decisions. For example,
in *roff, we marked text as bold, italic, etc, but in t
I have no idea how to do that but I know it is possible - SCO
had a customized set of mm/man macros that provided
this functionality. We built the entire doc set (man pages
and manuals) into HTML and had hot-linked cross-reference
from any document to any document, with tools to check
the links be
My current job requires writing long, highly-technical documents in
Word and it is absolutely HORRID! I totally agree with you!
I've seen editors for HTML and XML where you have two windows, one
that contains the raw source and one that contains a reasonably-accurate
rendition of the formatted te
This is an option (but I have to learn advanced groff, I know only the
> basics of groff). When I started this thread, I thought there could be
> plenty of tools which does this job.
>
> I appreciate all the responses. Thank you very much.
>
> Srini.
>
> -Original Messa
the fax to customers and printing
> work.
>
> So even if I can convert groff to PDF or XML or PS file and let users
> edit the file, I need a way to convert it back to groff file. Unless I
> rewrite the code which uses groff file post editing.
>
>
> Thanks,
> Srini.
>
some tools which I could buy and
> workout this requirement, but looks like there are no tools out there
> which I can use.
>
> Srini.
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Meg McRoberts [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Monday, August 20, 2007 2:03 PM
> To: Ka
What sort of document is this? Is it mostly text or are there
a lot of tables, graphics, and such?
I can think of a few ways that one might get the content into
some sort of WYSIWYG editor, but the fancier the formatting,
the less satisfactory these will be:
- Run the text into formatted ASCII t
> The problem is Berkeley Unix vs. AT&T Unix. AT&T put admin commands
> in section 1M and file formats in section 4. Berkeley put them in
> 8 and 5. Linux apparently followed the Berkeley convention. HP made
> the change from Berkeley to the AT&T arrangement at HP-UX 5.0 in 1985,
> and it appe
One small thought about man page compatibility... We have a fundamental
problem between Linux and most Unix systems because of the section-naming
differences. I have never figured out a good way around that. My current
job includes responsibility for a handful of man pages about applications
tha
Yes, this is exactly what we need! I find that most people
tend to take an existing man page to use as the basis for a
new page anyhow, often with interesting results. A template
file that is designed for this purpose would be much better,
although we may need more than one -- the structure of pa
n text format and other people
could work in WYSIWYG but we can all share the files...
Right now, I'm writing fairly technical documentation in Word,
of all things! How awful is that, in so many ways! ;-)
--- Zvezdan Petkovic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Thu, Dec 28, 2006 at 08
retty major effort) but it would be nice if the tools
didn't prevent it...
--- "Eric S. Raymond" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Meg McRoberts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> > I do like mm's .ne functionality -- this allows the writer to specify
> > that the nex
Eric, I really like your long-term vision, but have some questions
to extend it a bit.
If all this were implemented, would you envision that people writing
new man pages would write them using -man or would they use docbook?
My concern right now is with man pages for third-party software.
I work
Personally, I would prefer having .nf/.in/.fi used in man pages
over .DS/.DE -- the display macros hold the contents on a single
page and when writing man pages that might be rendered in plain text,
PDF/PS, or HTML, I'm not crazy about this model.
I am only a writer who has written a lot of docs u
> To summarize:
>
> . .EX/.EE and .DS/.DE should be added to the man macros.
>
> . .SY and .OP together with .TQ (as the `standard' extension to .TP)
> should be used within man pages, but its definitions should be
> copied to the limbo of each man page since we can't assume that
>
Interesting -- thanks for sending this on.
Dumb question: What consitutes "modifiable documentation"? Are documents
in a format that requires a proprietary tool considered modifiable?
I'm thinking of Word/OpenOffice or Framemaker. What about PDF files?
There is now software to turn PDF files int
(I decided to change the subject header)
I TOTALLY agree! I'm on this list because I love groff; I
spent 20+ years writing complex technical documents with groff
and sputter constantly about trying to do this sort of writing
in Word (or Word-like) tools.
The practical problem I face is that few
> I've been fiddling with OpenOffice lately. It's not a beauty, but it's
> sturdy and does a pretty good job importing & exporting Word
> files. I've literally had cases where OpenOffice had better luck
> with a seriously gnarly Word file than did Word itself.
In this context, I consider OpenOffic
> You can teach them, and a lot more of them know it than you think, they
> write man pages.
Older engineers know (or once knew) some *roff... Not so much
the younger ones. A whole generation went through college without
learning much of anything about Unix/Linux, sadly. I work with
a lot of f
I don't know if the offers to see naked pictures of Ted's
wife and such actually went through the mailing list --
they just came with the spoofed sender stuff... Come to
think of it, it's been a while since we've had any problems,
hasn't it? Hopefully that's all in the past...
We all know that t
Sadly, I fear that it's too late to really save groff...
But the advantage of a GUI is that casual users could use
the GUI and the rest of us could use real groff. It's
hard to justify doc tools that are fairly complicated
to use and known by very few these days...
I spend my days writing large,
Maybe this tool should not be incorporated into groff
but done separately... XMetal and the like aren't part
of XML... I think I like the idea of groff remaining
"pure" anyhow, and it might spare us some bureaucratic
headaches.
Theoretically, one could develop the front-end as a commercial
produ
> I really would like to see the UTP improved, this is, all references
> to dead features/programs should be removed, and the new groff
> features should be incorporated as extensions.
Yes, I know we talked about that... It's just a question of time.
There's a small number of you who really know
> Talk with Werner, and submit your request via Savannah.
This makes sense. So how many official developers does groff have?
>It would be nice to provide some sample scripts, or perhaps
>
> I think this is an excellent idea.
I realized after I posted this that it sounded like I was saying
Welcome, David!
> I have just been made a
> developer of the groff project to assist with your documentation,
> and with the texinfo manual, (and perhaps your website?).
This is great! Excuse my ignorance, but how exactly is one made
a developer of a specific project? I'm just curious how these
I believe Amber's question was not how to build a PDF or PS
file, but how to create cross-references that become hot links
in the build document. I don't think raw groff has this
capability...
I did once work with an mm derivate that had this capability
and it was pretty nicely done. Alas, I jus
ed page at the end here
for your perusal...
meg
--- Keith MARSHALL <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Meg McRoberts wrote:
> > Thanks, Jorgen, I had missed this -- I'm not technical enough
> > to recognize that these *m strings were SGR. However, I just
> > tried add
Thanks, Jorgen, I had missed this -- I'm not technical enough
to recognize that these *m strings were SGR. However, I just
tried adding -c and -C to my groff line and I still have the
same thing. Here's my command line:
groff -mandoc -stC -Tlatin1 tmsplx.xml.5 | col -b > catman/tmsplx.xml.5
Apo
I'm getting escape characters in my -man output -- the 0m
stuff. I googled and it isn't just me:
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/bug-groff/2003-03/msg0.html
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/bug-groff/2002-08/msg00092.html
http://www.wplug.org/pipermail/wplug/2003-March/015970.html
I'm r
Do the -man macros also need to source devtag.tmac? I'm having
some problems with them since I updated -- maybe this is the solution?
meg
--- Werner LEMBERG <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > The -mm macros need to source devtag.tmac, just as the -ms macros
> > do.
>
> Fixed in the CVS. Thanks
I sent Peter's mail to one of our malware specialists at Trend Micro.
This is his response:
--
This is where the problem with most mailing lists comes in.
Most mailing lists prevent outsiders from posting messages but insiders can pos
> I've also found that the cross-ref macros in -mm are easily detachable. I
> posted a version adapted to -ms here some time back; you should be able to
> find
> them with a little searching for my name in the archive! They work fine; I
> wrote an article using -ms and the adapted -mm macros, w
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