Hi List
I looks like I have at last got a KK8-E CPU set to continue
getting my 8/e back running again.
Rather than make mistakes first and ask for help later I thought I might
ask advice first.
The system has a working rebuilt PSU with all of the caps reformed or
replaced. Voltage
On Thu, 3 Aug 2017, emanuel stiebler wrote:
On 2017-08-03 11:12, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote:
It would be nice, though if someone just finished a MSCP controller with a
CF or SD on it.
I don't think there is enough demand for it. So to finish it would take some
effort, and the boards wouldn't
So, we've got an IBM 5285 (5280 series) programmable data station. This is
a *heavy* and nice beast ;-) Its architecture is a bit unusual but
interesting. Problem is, I don't have any software for it expect one disk
that IPLs and that contains four more or less crappy games.
(can be found at ft
On 2017-08-04 04:14, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote:
On Thu, 3 Aug 2017, emanuel stiebler wrote:
On 2017-08-03 11:12, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote:
It would be nice, though if someone just finished a MSCP controller
with a CF or SD on it.
I don't think there is enough demand for it. So to fin
I'd also be interested in one of the rs/6000 machines, though i'm located
in Sweden making shipping a potential issue for me as well.
Best regards,
Kristian Valind
ons 2 aug. 2017 kl. 02:16 skrev Henry via cctalk :
> So in good news I'm getting married, to a beautiful American I'm stealing
> to
> From: Christian Corti
> I don't like the idea of CF or SD at all. I'd pretty much prefer PATA
> or SATA, because ... Real drives are also much more reliable than flash
> drives,
I found this interesting/troubling, because Dave Bridgham and I decided to
use SD cards, after I init
> On Aug 3, 2017, at 4:28 PM, Ulrich Tagge via cctalk
> wrote:
>
> Hi All,
> All my 8" SSDD /SSSDdisks are non formatted, which was the reason for my
> initial troubles.
> Nevertheless, my IBM System /23 (Type 5324) can format disks in three
> different formats:
>
> _1. IBM System /23 Format_
On Fri, 2017-08-04 at 08:53 -0400, Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote:
>
> But are SD cards really that unreliable?
It depends on exactly how you measure "reliable". There are a few
different things going on, and it differs from one SD card to another.
Firstly, there are multiple types of flash mem
On 08/04/2017 02:24 AM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote:
Programmers console is in its slot. Bad bulbs (not LEDs) have been
replaced
Power up and all the lamps come on either bright or dim (off) except
the RUN light.
So questions:
1. Should the run light glow dimly?
Probably all lights
Going with SLC/"industrial" Flash is indeed the key to avoiding random
failures. I have many deployed systems using industrial Flash modules (IDE
DOMs) running 24/7 in critical production environments, mostly running
machine tools and semiconductor production line equipment. We still do
regular bac
On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 9:42 AM, Phil Blundell via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> On Fri, 2017-08-04 at 08:53 -0400, Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote:
> >
> > But are SD cards really that unreliable?
>
> It depends on exactly how you measure "reliable". There are a few
> different things go
On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 9:49 AM, systems_glitch via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> Going with SLC/"industrial" Flash is indeed the key to avoiding random
> failures. I have many deployed systems using industrial Flash modules (IDE
> DOMs) running 24/7 in critical production environments,
> On Aug 4, 2017, at 4:14 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk
> wrote:
>
> On Thu, 3 Aug 2017, emanuel stiebler wrote:
>> On 2017-08-03 11:12, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote:
>>> It would be nice, though if someone just finished a MSCP controller with a
>>> CF or SD on it.
>>
>> I don't think there is
On Fri, 4 Aug 2017, Noel Chiappa wrote:
But are SD cards really that unreliable? If they were, I'd have thought I'd
Yes they are. Just have look around in the world of cameras and
smartphones where people suffer from losing their photos just because an
SD card decides to fail. I have several
On Fri, 4 Aug 2017, Paul Koning wrote:
On Aug 4, 2017, at 4:14 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk
wrote: I don't like the idea of CF or SD at
all. I'd pretty much prefer PATA or SATA, because ...
CF is PATA, just a different connector.
If the board provides a PATA connector, I'm fine. Then you
On 8/4/17 7:07 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote:
> If you really want a non-rotating media, then I
> suggest that you use SATA SSDs.
Can you actually buy SATA PHYs in small quantities now
or even SATA to PATA bridges?
I remember looking for them in the past and either not
being able to buy
On Fri, 2017-08-04 at 07:20 -0700, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote:
>
> Can you actually buy SATA PHYs in small quantities now
> or even SATA to PATA bridges?
I can't think of anybody who makes discrete SATA PHYs, and there isn't
a standardized interface for the other side of the PHY so I suspect
ther
There are indeed cheap SATA -> IDE bridge ICs. I'm currently evaluating
some small, cheap IDE -> mSATA SSD adapters for disk replacements in
industrial systems. The module with a mSATA socket and 44-pin laptop sized
IDE connector is less than $10 from various online retailers.
Thanks,
Jonathan
On
On 8/3/17 2:45 PM, Curious Marc via cctech wrote:
> Wow, that's mighty impressive. I knew about your FPGA 360/65 project but had
> never seen your website before.
There is also a simulation book in the works in cooperation with 'vaxman'
http://www.analogmuseum.org/english/about_me/
https://ww
My Convex C220 arrived about a week ago, so I now have a C1, C1 XL, and a
C220. A C240 will follow in a few weeks. Along with the C220 came some
installation tapes, and a large volume of documentation (some 300
documents). As long as I don¹t receive any objections to the being online
from HP (curr
On 8/4/17 7:37 AM, Phil Blundell via cctalk wrote:
> ASSPs like TI's TUSB9260
which turns up a big fat nothing in a web search
is there a data sheet somewhere?
the 6250 is a SATA 2 to USB using an 8051 core, but I suspect you
can't get the code for that.
one of the common pata-sata bridges fr
On 8/4/17 7:44 AM, systems_glitch via cctalk wrote:
> There are indeed cheap SATA -> IDE bridge ICs.
yup, I'm running around 50 of them in my upgraded XServe RAIDs
when I converted to 1tb 2.5" SATA-2 drives in 2015.
On Fri, 4 Aug 2017, Al Kossow wrote:
Can you actually buy SATA PHYs in small quantities now
or even SATA to PATA bridges?
I would go for a cheap external bridge, something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B008X8NK0I
http://www.dx.com/en/p/jm20330-2-5-3-5-sata-to-40-pin-ide-adapter-card-gree
the cheap bridges are actually based on the 20330
you can find a real data sheet if you search for JM20330_datasheet_v2.5.pdf
hard enough
some discussions of their use with ssd trim
https://forum.thinkpads.com//viewtopic.php?t=115329
On 8/4/17 8:08 AM, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote:
>
>
> On 8/
On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 1:24 AM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> 1. Should the run light glow dimly?
>
Without looking at the schematics I can't tell you if they bothered to put
the resistor in there to make
it glow dimly but I can tell you that it isn't necessary for th
> On Aug 4, 2017, at 1:14 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk
> wrote:
>
> On Thu, 3 Aug 2017, emanuel stiebler wrote:
>> On 2017-08-03 11:12, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote:
>>> It would be nice, though if someone just finished a MSCP controller with a
>>> CF or SD on it.
>>
>> I don't think there is
On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 7:15 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk
wrote:
> So, we've got an IBM 5285 (5280 series) programmable data station. This is a
> *heavy* and nice beast ;-) Its architecture is a bit unusual but
> interesting. Problem is, I don't have any software for it expect one disk
> that IPL
https://halsoft.wordpress.com/2008/06/02/the-next-generation-key-punch-the-ibm-5280/
http://www.computerhistory.org/collections/catalog/102675777
i'll see what's there..
On 8/4/17 9:04 AM, Jason T via cctalk wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 7:15 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk
> wrote:
>> So, we
On 8/4/17 9:20 AM, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote:
> https://halsoft.wordpress.com/2008/06/02/the-next-generation-key-punch-the-ibm-5280/
>
> http://www.computerhistory.org/collections/catalog/102675777
>
> i'll see what's there..
>
weird, it doesn't look like I scanned these. I thought I did..
On 8/4/17 05:49, systems_glitch via cctalk wrote:
> Going with SLC/"industrial" Flash is indeed the key to avoiding random
> failures. I have many deployed systems using industrial Flash modules (IDE
> DOMs)
As Noel said, he initially talked using an IDE interface for the QSIC.
I proposed SD car
> On Aug 4, 2017, at 1:17 PM, David Bridgham via cctalk
> wrote:
>
> ...
> So my question is: do industrial SD cards exist?
Yes; we've been using them for years now in the products I work on. While you
can still wear them out if you beat on them hard enough, they do have good
reliability.
On 8/4/17 09:26, Paul Koning wrote:
>> So my question is: do industrial SD cards exist?
> Yes; we've been using them for years now in the products I work on. While
> you can still wear them out if you beat on them hard enough, they do have
> good reliability.
Okay, that's good news then. Any
On Fri, 2017-08-04 at 09:17 -0800, David Bridgham via cctalk wrote:
>
So my question is: do industrial SD cards exist?
Yes they do. Most of the big card manufacturers have an "industrial"
range, for example:
https://www.sandisk.co.uk/oem-design/industrial/industrial-cards
There are also specia
On 8/4/17 10:34 AM, Phil Blundell via cctalk wrote:
> On Fri, 2017-08-04 at 09:17 -0800, David Bridgham via cctalk wrote:
>>
> So my question is: do industrial SD cards exist?
>
> Yes they do. Most of the big card manufacturers have an "industrial"
> range, for example:
>
> https://www.sandisk
> From: Paul Koning
>> do industrial SD cards exist?
> If you have a ready-made SD interface, these cards work nicely. If you
> need to build one from scratch it gets tricky, because the interface is
> fairly high speed serial (packet based) signaling, and the
> initializa
On 2017-08-04 13:17, David Bridgham via cctalk wrote:
I don't think I'm up to going with a higher-end FPGA and trying to
implement SATA even though in many ways I think that's the right
answer. If there's a SATA PHY chip, that's a maybe.
Forget about SATA, even if some people like it here;-)
On 2017-08-04 13:51, Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote:
> From: Paul Koning
>> do industrial SD cards exist?
> If you have a ready-made SD interface, these cards work nicely. If you
> need to build one from scratch it gets tricky, because the interface is
> fairly high speed ser
> From: Al Kossow
> but it looks like they are going EOL
Is that just this particular product (individual SD/etc products seem to go
out all the time, as new and bigger ones come out), or industrial SD cards in
general? I hope not that latter, that would blow a large hole in out strategy!
On 2017-08-04 14:01, Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote:
> From: Al Kossow
> but it looks like they are going EOL
Is that just this particular product (individual SD/etc products seem to go
out all the time, as new and bigger ones come out), or industrial SD cards in
general? I hope not that
On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 11:17 AM, David Bridgham via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
>
> So my question is: do industrial SD cards exist?
>
Yes. They have for about a decade. Almost all SD cards these days could
easily handle an I/O write rate that a PDP-11 is able to generate. It takes
abou
> From: Emanuel Stiebler
> If I would do it again, it would be USB only with some sd-card slots.
Exactly our plan (although the USB is left until after we get the SD running).
> USB with 480MHz is fast enough
I think our plan was to skip that speed, and go with the next one down, on
On 8/4/2017 8:07 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote:
On Fri, 4 Aug 2017, Noel Chiappa wrote:
But are SD cards really that unreliable? If they were, I'd have
thought I'd
Yes they are. Just have look around in the world of cameras and
smartphones where people suffer from losing their photos j
I just uploaded GA21-9353-1_5280_Functions_Reference_Manual_Apr81 w/o OCR
to bitsavers.org/pdf/ibm/5280 mirrors should have it in an hour
that is essentially the architecture manual
I'll do some more work on the manuals once a big OCR batch job finishes
The floppies we have are utils, comm utils
On 8/4/17 11:14 AM, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote:
> most SD cards can easily handle 100-200 writes
The issue would be things like the swap partition on a unix disk
or whatever the equivalent is under RSX
On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 12:18 PM, Noel Chiappa via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > USB with 480MHz is fast enough
>
> I think our plan was to skip that speed, and go with the next one down, on
> the grounds that the analog part at that speed would be too tricky for us.
I did some g
On 2017-08-04 14:18, Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote:
Exactly our plan (although the USB is left until after we get the SD running).
> USB with 480MHz is fast enough
I think our plan was to skip that speed, and go with the next one down,
Probably sufficient for a start ...
> on
the grounds
> On Aug 4, 2017, at 2:36 PM, Al Kossow via cctalk
> wrote:
>
>
>
> On 8/4/17 11:14 AM, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote:
>> most SD cards can easily handle 100-200 writes
>
> The issue would be things like the swap partition on a unix disk
> or whatever the equivalent is under RSX
Probably not
On 2017-08-04 14:38, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote:
On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 12:18 PM, Noel Chiappa via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> USB with 480MHz is fast enough
I think our plan was to skip that speed, and go with the next one down, on
the grounds that the analog part at that s
On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 12:36 PM, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote:
>
>
> On 8/4/17 11:14 AM, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote:
> > most SD cards can easily handle 100-200 writes
>
> The issue would be things like the swap partition on a unix disk
> or whatever the equivalent is under RSX
>
Right. But sinc
> From: Al Kossow
> The issue would be things like the swap partition on a unix disk or
> whatever the equivalent is under RSX
Which is why, as I mentioned, that we're including the ability to have
virtual disks which store their data in RAM, not on permanent storage - their
contents
On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 12:47 PM, Paul Koning via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
>
> > On Aug 4, 2017, at 2:36 PM, Al Kossow via cctalk
> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > On 8/4/17 11:14 AM, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote:
> >> most SD cards can easily handle 100-200 writes
> >
> > The issue would be
Hello all,
Does anyone know if there is some physical jumper or OpenBoot parameter
required in order to enable multiprocessor support on a SPARCstation 20?
Have tried two sets of known-good, matching processors, both sets of which
worked in another SS20, but this SS20 shows only CPU#0.
Thank
Hi Jerry,
You’ve made pretty good progress.
Yes with the right input and help this can happen. ;-)
And all the help is much appreciated!
If you haven’t already, Google for and look at the manual for the SQ739. I
think you will find that most of the
commands for the on-board diagnostics are th
> From: Emanuel Stiebler
>> on the grounds that the analog part at that speed would be too tricky
>> for us.
> No, it isn't.
You _are_ talking to two people who are so clueless about analog that we
didn't bother putting ground lines between each pair of signal lines in a
cable...
On 8/4/17 10:46, emanuel stiebler via cctalk wrote:
>> > USB with 480MHz is fast enough
>>
>> I think our plan was to skip that speed, and go with the next one down,
> Probably sufficient for a start ...
> > on
>> the grounds that the analog part at that speed would be too tricky
>> for us.
>
On 2017-08-04 15:04, Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote:
> From: Paul Koning
> flash storage devices do wear leveling. The fact that you're writing to
> the same block number doesn't mean you're actually writing to the same
> spot on the physical flash memory.
Yeah, but why 'waste'
On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 1:04 PM, Noel Chiappa via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > From: Paul Koning
>
> > flash storage devices do wear leveling. The fact that you're writing
> to
> > the same block number doesn't mean you're actually writing to the
> same
> > spot on th
On Fri, 2017-08-04 at 15:04 -0400, Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote:
>
> And this path allowed us to get rolling without having to go through
> the PC-board fab cycle... (including the complexity of doing boards
> with gold fingers).
Just as an aside on that, I doubt you really need the hard gold fi
On Fri, 4 Aug 2017, John P. Willis via cctalk wrote:
Does anyone know if there is some physical jumper or OpenBoot parameter
required in order to enable multiprocessor support on a SPARCstation 20?
I do not know of such a switch/jumper. Both my SS2 I upgraded
to 2-CPU and 2*2 CPU did not req
On 2017-08-04 14:54, Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote:
> From: Warner Losh
> had problems finding out just how fast Q-Bus can go
Something like 700 nsec for a cycle (best case), so assuming 16-bit
transfers, a max of a little over 20 Mbit/sec.
From an old email from tim Shoppa who teste
On 8/4/17 11:16, emanuel stiebler via cctalk wrote:
> Use the memory as disk cache locally. Otherwise you need to write
> drivers for all different versions of OSs out there. Transparent cache,
> write through ...
>
> Then no changes are needed on the system
Well, we are going to make the RAM loo
On 2017-08-04 15:15, David Bridgham via cctalk wrote:
On 8/4/17 10:46, emanuel stiebler via cctalk wrote:
Definitely I'll stick with 12Mb/s USB to start (for sure on our
wire-wrapped prototype board) but I'd love to boost that to 480Mb/s
later. The analog issue is one thing that made me dubio
On 2017-08-04 15:18, Phil Blundell via cctalk wrote:
On Fri, 2017-08-04 at 15:04 -0400, Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote:
And this path allowed us to get rolling without having to go through
the PC-board fab cycle... (including the complexity of doing boards
with gold fingers).
Just as an aside
> From: David Bridgham dab at froghouse.org
> I'm going to have enough fun with trying to implement the USB stack in
> the FPGA
ISTR discussing putting a PDP-11 into the FPGA (there are Verilog PDP-11's
available), so we could write our USB code in C (I'd use the Unix V6 compiler
to
Indeed, you'll need 2.25R if you want to use some Ross HyperSPARC modules.
I don't know if the ROM image is available on the Internet nowadays, but
I've got a 2.25R ROM in one of my SS10s, I could dump it for you if you
can't find it elsewhere.
IIRC, the standard TI SuperSPARC modules don't requir
and we do have a 5285
http://www.computerhistory.org/collections/catalog/102633515
I need to see if that floppy in the picture is still in the left-hand drive
On 8/4/17 11:34 AM, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote:
> I just uploaded GA21-9353-1_5280_Functions_Reference_Manual_Apr81 w/o OCR
> to bitsaver
> On Aug 4, 2017, at 3:46 PM, Noel Chiappa via cctalk
> wrote:
>
>> From: David Bridgham dab at froghouse.org
>
>> I'm going to have enough fun with trying to implement the USB stack in
>> the FPGA
>
> ISTR discussing putting a PDP-11 into the FPGA (there are Verilog PDP-11's
> available), s
Yes, the 8/e has the 'keep-alive current'. The lamps are driven by an 8V
line that runs from the power supply to the programmer's panel. -- Ian
On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 8:23 AM, Doug Ingraham via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 1:24 AM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk <
>
On Fri, 4 Aug 2017, systems_glitch via cctalk wrote:
Indeed, you'll need 2.25R if you want to use some Ross HyperSPARC modules.
I don't know if the ROM image is available on the Internet nowadays, but
I've got a 2.25R ROM in one of my SS10s, I could dump it for you if you
can't find it elsewhere
On 8/4/2017 12:49 PM, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote:
On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 12:36 PM, Al Kossow via cctalk
wrote:
On 8/4/17 11:14 AM, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote:
most SD cards can easily handle 100-200 writes
The issue would be things like the swap partition on a unix disk
or whatever t
> On Aug 4, 2017, at 1:20 PM, Paul Koning via cctalk
> wrote:
>
>
>> On Aug 4, 2017, at 3:46 PM, Noel Chiappa via cctalk
>> wrote:
>>
>>> From: David Bridgham dab at froghouse.org
>>
>>> I'm going to have enough fun with trying to implement the USB stack in
>>> the FPGA
>>
>> ISTR discus
> On Aug 4, 2017, at 1:27 PM, ben via cctalk wrote:
>
> On 8/4/2017 12:49 PM, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote:
>> On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 12:36 PM, Al Kossow via cctalk >> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> On 8/4/17 11:14 AM, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote:
most SD cards can easily handle 100-200 writes
>>>
On 8/4/17 9:23 AM, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote:
> weird, it doesn't look like I scanned these. I thought I did..
I did, it's under "528x" but OS X collation puts it with 3 digit part numbers
(grrr..)
On 8/4/17 11:25, emanuel stiebler wrote:
> http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/DeviceDoc/1678B.pdf
> that the one I use a lot...
Oh, a USB PHY chip. Yeah, that might be the way to go now that we're
not counting I/O pins.
>> 1:1 block mapping. I'm going to have enough fun with trying to
>
Hi Guys
Thanks for the info so far. Well I have moved on. I now have
the minimum configuration.
Programmers console, M8300,M8310,M8320,M8330,M849 and 4k of core memory.
The M8320 is at the far end of the bus.
Well much as I feared I cant write to memory using Load Address ,
set
> On Aug 4, 2017, at 1:09 PM, Ulrich Tagge via cctalk
> wrote:
>
> Hi Jerry,
>> You’ve made pretty good progress.
> Yes with the right input and help this can happen. ;-)
> And all the help is much appreciated!
Glad to share.
>>
>> If you haven’t already, Google for and look at the manual fo
What are the 4 games?
null
On 08/04/2017 05:31 PM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote:
Hi Guys
Thanks for the info so far. Well I have moved on.
I now have the minimum configuration.
Programmers console, M8300,M8310,M8320,M8330,M849 and 4k
of core memory.
The M8320 is at the far end of the bus.
Well much as I f
> -Original Message-
> From: Rob Jarratt [mailto:robert.jarr...@ntlworld.com]
> Sent: 15 July 2017 22:11
> To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
(cctalk@classiccmp.org)
>
> Subject: Looking for a TURBOchannel Extender Cable
>
> Today I finally got the DECstation 5000/240
I've loaded up the car and will be putting the following in the
Consignment Room at VCF West in the morning. These were all rescued from
Mesa Electronics a couple months ago.
I'm asking for a $5 donation to VCFed for 24 of these items, just to
support the event (one is free). There are multiple ex
80 matches
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