[RBW] Re: BMC Road vs Roadini

[William R.]

Daniel: my Roadini came with a seat post, as it seems others did. I was 
surprised to see the seatpost in there when I opened up the box. I thought I 
read in one of Grant’s posts that seatposts would not be included. Maybe they 
only had a certain amount.

Regarding tire clearance on the Roadini: I have found that 38 Compass Barlow 
Passes fit with a big BUT: you have to use a Paul Racer Medium brake on the 
front. And no fenders. Clearances are very good though.

I did have a BMC Road in the past and it was very nice indeed, but I agree with 
others that have suggested that it’s geo is more race geo oriented with shorter 
chainstays made it not quite as long haul comfortable and not as easy to get my 
position as upright as my 50’s body requires.

Bill in Westchester, NY

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Re: [RBW] Re: Seeking opinions on 11 speed roadie setup

[Tim Gavin]

Yes, all three major brands offer hidden cable routing.

Shimano was the holdout; they designed their system to avoid Campagnolo's
patents, so they kept the east-west cable exit through 9-speed.
However, some have criticized Shimano's 10-speed brifters for wearing
through cables rapidly (due to the 90-degree bend that's now inside the
shifter body).
Apparently Shimano changed the shift ratio for 11-speed road to pull less
cable per click, in order to help minimize this problem (and probably other
smart fixes inside the shifter body), but critics say it's still an issue.
I don't own any bikes with Shimano brifters, so I have no dog in the
fight.  Just passing along shop talk.


I'm happy with 10-speed SRAM Double-click shifters; I have them on my
plastic (CF) cyclocross/gravel bike.  For SRAM 10-speed only, their MTB
rear derailleurs are compatible with their road shifters.  This makes it
easy to mix wide-range cassettes and drop bars; most of SRAM's 10-speed MTB
RDs can accept a 42t cog with simply a longer B-screw.

You can also mix Shimano's 10-speed road shifters with their 9-speed RDs to
fit wide-range cassettes, but this doesn't avoid the 10-speed cable wear
issue, and Shimano's 9s RDs max out at a 36t cog.


I owned a Roadeo for a short while, and I put vintage 90s Sachs
(Campagnolo) Ergopower brifters on it.  It was fun to ride, but I stray off
pavement way too much to own a fancy road bike.  My 650b-converted Riv Road
Standard is "roadie" enough for me.

On Tue, Jan 16, 2018 at 1:33 AM, lum gim fong  wrote:

> ain’t they got brifters now that have the shifter cables running under
> bartape so ye can use a front bag now?
>
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[RBW] Re: Seeking opinions on 11 speed roadie setup

[Max S]

Back when we were young and good looking (in the '90s), I entered some 
races with an old-fashioned bike, downtube shifters, etc. So did my friend, 
initially. He was married, so unlike me, he didn't waste time on social 
life, instead training seriously. He won a bunch of races with his downtube 
shifters on an old steel bike, at a time when everyone else was on 9/10 sp 
drivetrains and riding Al / CF. When he moved up a couple of categories, he 
got himself a new Al/CF bike with Ultegra 9sp from BikesDirect (~$1,000 all 
in). Didn't slow him down, that's for sure. (At that point I also started 
using a lighter bike and 9 and 10 sp drivetrains – Shimano and Campy, 
respectively – but didn't see too many improvements. But I did start dating 
a beautiful girl. Win some, lose some, I guess.) 

Anyhow, I now have just one bike set up with Shimano DA 9sp brifters (Deda 
Zero Uno tubing, which is slightly oversize, fits 700c x 28 mm tires). I 
have logged faster times on it than on my other bikes even on the dirt 
roads. However, I think it's mostly because it reminds me of my racing 
days, so I try to hammer a bit more on that bike. :-) 

OK, OK, one potentially useful bit of info in this reply:  Modern Campy 11 
sp brifters are reported to have a cable pull such that when they're 
coupled to Shimano 9sp derailleurs (or 10sp road), they'll successfully 
shift across a 9 sp Shimano cassette. 

- M

On Sunday, January 14, 2018 at 3:24:44 AM UTC-5, Paul Y wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> Looking for opinions and perspective s before scratching an itch!
>
> I've been riding my Roadeo with a dura ace 7400 double crank (38 and 48t) 
> with a Sora 8 speed 11-25 cassette, Shimano bar ends (9 speed but running 
> friction) and an older XT rapid rise rear derailer.
>
> The gearing is pretty good for me - it's enough to manage 10 deg climbs 
> and truck along around 35 kph.
>
> I've been riding the Roadeo like a typical club rider might, generally 
> without fenders and wearing lycra, though I haven't actually been riding 
> with a club! The plan is to ride a few audaxes this year though.
>
> I'm tempted to change to a new Shimano 105 5800 drivetrain (11 speed) and 
> brifters, which should go on easily as I already have a 105 11-speed hub.
>
> I love the robustness of the current setup but always looking for ways to 
> get more speed ( and I'm constantly training / trying to build strength).
>
> Has anyone else transitioned their bike similarly? As in, going from Riv 
> values to modern racy (meshed with steel and larger tires)? I still have a 
> Sam setup as a practical bicycle so I guess that leaves me freedom to 
> embody another cycling personality.
>
> Thanks for reading, and hopefully sharing your feelings on this.
>
> Paul
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Fixed n’ Frosty Winter Medley

[Wally Estrella]

I’ve used the 12oz insulated in -10°F w/ some windchills.  After 4+ hours 
my tea was still very hot to the tongue.  This was also cinched up in a RJF 
bartender bag which has a thing foam liner.

On Monday, January 15, 2018 at 3:57:17 PM UTC-5, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>
> Och! I failed to respond to your temp. question. You’d asked how long the 
> insulated bottle keeps things hot. Lots of variables, including temp and 
> wind. It cooled down to luke warm after 3 hours of riding on one ride that 
> was 40+ mph winds and 0˚F. I bought two narrow mouth bottles hoping they 
> held heat better than the 20 oz. (which bleeds heat quickly), and they 
> absolutely do. I buy Klean Kanteen’s claim of 6 hrs, depending on temp and 
> wind. 
>
> With abandon, 
> Patrick 

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Re: [RBW] Fixed n’ Frosty Winter Medley

[Deacon Patrick]

Spot on, Wally! I carry my bottles in their cages, open and exposed to all air 
flow. Doing what you did would have allowed for the 6 hours — and is my plan 
for future longer excurtions in the nippy.

With abandon,
Patrick

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Re: [RBW] Fixed n’ Frosty Winter Medley

[Wally Estrella]

Barr mitts has a neoprene burrito wrap insulator for bottle cages.  
http://www.barmitts.com/products.php?page=winterbot


On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 11:44:47 AM UTC-5, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>
> Spot on, Wally! I carry my bottles in their cages, open and exposed to all 
> air flow. Doing what you did would have allowed for the 6 hours — and is my 
> plan for future longer excurtions in the nippy. 
>
> With abandon, 
> Patrick

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Re: [RBW] Fixed n’ Frosty Winter Medley

[Patrick Moore]

Thanks. I must get some Kleen Kanteens -- just bought 2 insulated bottles
on Amazon that were advertised as being 2.8" in diameter but turned out to
be 2.6 -- too small for a cage.

--- Just noticed that tops on your KKs are not covered -- how do you keep
dirt off? More important probably around my woods where there is much horse
shit.

On Mon, Jan 15, 2018 at 1:37 PM, Deacon Patrick  wrote:

> Thanks, Patrick. Frozen moustache/face feel: nose breathing helps with
> this a lot. My moustache and lower lip beard (goatee?) freeze together.
>
> Saddle: Rivet’s Diablo. http://rivetcycleworks.com
> Bottles: The orange is Klean Kanteen’s 20 oz. insulated narrow mouth
> bottle. https://www.kleankanteen.com/collections/insulated-bottles/p
> roducts/insulated-water-bottle-20oz?variant=1533621955
> The sooty stainless steal is their standard narow mouth single-wall 28oz.
> that I use to boil water when bikepacking (no pot to haul!).
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
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Re: [RBW] Fixed n’ Frosty Winter Medley

[Patrick Moore]

Should have responded in earlier reply.

Thanks, good to know. My rides don't involve much less tha 20*F so the KKs
ought to work nicely -- but again, how to keep dirt off the mouths?

On Mon, Jan 15, 2018 at 1:57 PM, Deacon Patrick  wrote:

> Och! I failed to respond to your temp. question. You’d asked how long the
> insulated bottle keeps things hot. Lots of variables, including temp and
> wind. It cooled down to luke warm after 3 hours of riding on one ride that
> was 40+ mph winds and 0˚F. I bought two narrow mouth bottles hoping they
> held heat better than the 20 oz. (which bleeds heat quickly), and they
> absolutely do. I buy Klean Kanteen’s claim of 6 hrs, depending on temp and
> wind.
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
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[RBW] Re: Seeking opinions on 11 speed roadie setup

[Belopsky]

Campy 11 works with 9speed Shimano
Campy 10 works well with 8speed Shimano
Campy 11/Shimano 11 are interchangeable as far as:
Campy 11 drivetrain w/ Shimano 11speed cassette or vice-versa

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Re: [RBW] Fixed n’ Frosty Winter Medley

[Deacon Patrick]

We get cow cookies and horse hockey pretty commonly round here (several horse 
barns on the MUP to Woodland Park, open grazing in the National Forest, BLM, 
etc.) and I just don’t worry about it, save I don’t use the pop-up sport lids, 
just the screw on lids. I drink so infrequently I don’t need it save when I’m 
stopped anyway (if then), one of the nice benifits of both nose breathing and 
being low carb. Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick

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[RBW] Re: Seeking opinions on 11 speed roadie setup

[Brewster Fong]

On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 9:14:58 AM UTC-8, Belopsky wrote:
>
> Campy 11/Shimano 11 are interchangeable as far as:
> Campy 11 drivetrain w/ Shimano 11speed cassette or vice-versa
>

Agree. I'm using Sram etap with Campy 11 cassette/wheel and it works 
perfectly. 

But is there a way it doesn't work?   

Good Luck!

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Re: [RBW] Fixed n’ Frosty Winter Medley

[Wally Estrella]

Patrick:

The narrow mouth caps are screw in to the tops leaving the outside of the 
top exposed.  It looks like the wide mouth caps cover the outside of the 
top some, so it should keep any kicked up debris flavoring to a minimum.

CHEERS!
Wally in Maine


On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 12:12:07 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Thanks. I must get some Kleen Kanteens -- just bought 2 insulated bottles 
> on Amazon that were advertised as being 2.8" in diameter but turned out to 
> be 2.6 -- too small for a cage. 
>
> --- Just noticed that tops on your KKs are not covered -- how do you keep 
> dirt off? More important probably around my woods where there is much horse 
> shit.
>
> On Mon, Jan 15, 2018 at 1:37 PM, Deacon Patrick  > wrote:
>
>> Thanks, Patrick. Frozen moustache/face feel: nose breathing helps with 
>> this a lot. My moustache and lower lip beard (goatee?) freeze together.
>>
>> Saddle: Rivet’s Diablo. http://rivetcycleworks.com
>> Bottles: The orange is Klean Kanteen’s 20 oz. insulated narrow mouth 
>> bottle. 
>> https://www.kleankanteen.com/collections/insulated-bottles/products/insulated-water-bottle-20oz?variant=1533621955
>> The sooty stainless steal is their standard narow mouth single-wall 28oz. 
>> that I use to boil water when bikepacking (no pot to haul!).
>>
>> With abandon,
>> Patrick
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com .
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>> .
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>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>>
>
>
>
> -- 
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> Alburquerque, New Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique
> **
> **
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>

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Re: [RBW] Fixed n’ Frosty Winter Medley

[Patrick Moore]

Wally: you mean that these KKs come in a wide mouth (lid covers mouth)
model? I must look for those. Or put more tape on the bottles I did buy.

Speaking of horses: reminds me of the little diaper/catch-it bags carriage
horses in Kebek City used to wear, and of the line in Red Sky at Morning
where the father asks if they are importing the front end of horses to
Washington, DC for final assembly.

On Tue, Jan 16, 2018 at 11:25 AM, Wally Estrella 
wrote:

> Patrick:
>
> The narrow mouth caps are screw in to the tops leaving the outside of the
> top exposed.  It looks like the wide mouth caps cover the outside of the
> top some, so it should keep any kicked up debris flavoring to a minimum.
>
> CHEERS!
> Wally in Maine
>
>
> On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 12:12:07 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:
>>
>> Thanks. I must get some Kleen Kanteens -- just bought 2 insulated bottles
>> on Amazon that were advertised as being 2.8" in diameter but turned out to
>> be 2.6 -- too small for a cage.
>>
>> --- Just noticed that tops on your KKs are not covered -- how do you keep
>> dirt off? More important probably around my woods where there is much horse
>> shit.
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 15, 2018 at 1:37 PM, Deacon Patrick  wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks, Patrick. Frozen moustache/face feel: nose breathing helps with
>>> this a lot. My moustache and lower lip beard (goatee?) freeze together.
>>>
>>> Saddle: Rivet’s Diablo. http://rivetcycleworks.com
>>> Bottles: The orange is Klean Kanteen’s 20 oz. insulated narrow mouth
>>> bottle. https://www.kleankanteen.com/collections/insulated-bottles/p
>>> roducts/insulated-water-bottle-20oz?variant=1533621955
>>> The sooty stainless steal is their standard narow mouth single-wall
>>> 28oz. that I use to boil water when bikepacking (no pot to haul!).
>>>
>>> With abandon,
>>> Patrick
>>>
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
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>> Alburquerque, New Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique
>> 
>> 
>> *Auditis an me ludit amabilis insania?*
>>
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Re: [RBW] Fixed n’ Frosty Winter Medley

[Wally Estrella]

Yes, they do.  I think these are slightly larger in diameter than the 
normal KK's so am unsure if it'll fit into a cage.






On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 2:46:52 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Wally: you mean that these KKs come in a wide mouth (lid covers mouth) 
> model? I must look for those. Or put more tape on the bottles I did buy. 
>
> Speaking of horses: reminds me of the little diaper/catch-it bags carriage 
> horses in Kebek City used to wear, and of the line in Red Sky at Morning 
> where the father asks if they are importing the front end of horses to 
> Washington, DC for final assembly.
>
> On Tue, Jan 16, 2018 at 11:25 AM, Wally Estrella  > wrote:
>
>> Patrick:
>>
>> The narrow mouth caps are screw in to the tops leaving the outside of the 
>> top exposed.  It looks like the wide mouth caps cover the outside of the 
>> top some, so it should keep any kicked up debris flavoring to a minimum.
>>
>> CHEERS!
>> Wally in Maine
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 12:12:07 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:
>>>
>>> Thanks. I must get some Kleen Kanteens -- just bought 2 insulated 
>>> bottles on Amazon that were advertised as being 2.8" in diameter but turned 
>>> out to be 2.6 -- too small for a cage. 
>>>
>>> --- Just noticed that tops on your KKs are not covered -- how do you 
>>> keep dirt off? More important probably around my woods where there is much 
>>> horse shit.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jan 15, 2018 at 1:37 PM, Deacon Patrick  
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Thanks, Patrick. Frozen moustache/face feel: nose breathing helps with 
 this a lot. My moustache and lower lip beard (goatee?) freeze together.

 Saddle: Rivet’s Diablo. http://rivetcycleworks.com
 Bottles: The orange is Klean Kanteen’s 20 oz. insulated narrow mouth 
 bottle. 
 https://www.kleankanteen.com/collections/insulated-bottles/products/insulated-water-bottle-20oz?variant=1533621955
 The sooty stainless steal is their standard narow mouth single-wall 
 28oz. that I use to boil water when bikepacking (no pot to haul!).

 With abandon,
 Patrick

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>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>> *
>>> ***
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Re: [RBW] Re: Seeking opinions on 11 speed roadie setup

[Patrick Moore]

This brings up an interesting question: I know it applies mostly to racing
at close to 10/10s, but still: do any of you find that the easier shifting
when using brifters translates into measurable speed gains, on the average?
I realize that this depends on riding style and conditions, but I think the
question can be answered in a general way.

And while we're at it, do any of you find that more cogs means measurably
faster speeds?

I'll tell you what does make for measurably faster speeds, IME: freewheels!
Yes indeed, a freewheel will make you faster, at least if you are riding
where there are any steepish hills. I was struck -- the only time I
bothered to notice it -- when I compared my times on a given route with my
tank of a Fargo with very heavy wheels (800 gram rims, 800 gram tires, and
much taller to boot) against my times on the much lighter Rivendell road
fixies and found them much the same. Combine coasting with downshifting on
climbs and you might go faster --who'd a' thunk?

Patrick "fixed and slow is better than coasting and fast" Moore, who once
dated a woman because of a bike.

On Tue, Jan 16, 2018 at 8:05 AM, Max S  wrote:

> ...At that point I also started using a lighter bike and 9 and 10 sp
> drivetrains – Shimano and Campy, respectively – but didn't see too many
> improvements. But I did start dating a beautiful girl. Win some, lose some,
> I guess.)
>
> Anyhow, I now have just one bike set up with Shimano DA 9sp brifters (Deda
> Zero Uno tubing, which is slightly oversize, fits 700c x 28 mm tires). I
> have logged faster times on it than on my other bikes even on the dirt
> roads. However, I think it's mostly because it reminds me of my racing
> days, so I try to hammer a bit more on that bike. :-)
>

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Re: [RBW] Fixed n’ Frosty Winter Medley

[Patrick Moore]

Thanks, Wally. I'll check them out.

On Tue, Jan 16, 2018 at 12:56 PM, Wally Estrella 
wrote:

> Yes, they do.  I think these are slightly larger in diameter than the
> normal KK's so am unsure if it'll fit into a cage.
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 2:46:52 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:
>>
>> Wally: you mean that these KKs come in a wide mouth (lid covers mouth)
>> model? I must look for those. Or put more tape on the bottles I did buy.
>>
>> Speaking of horses: reminds me of the little diaper/catch-it bags
>> carriage horses in Kebek City used to wear, and of the line in Red Sky at
>> Morning where the father asks if they are importing the front end of horses
>> to Washington, DC for final assembly.
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 16, 2018 at 11:25 AM, Wally Estrella 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Patrick:
>>>
>>> The narrow mouth caps are screw in to the tops leaving the outside of
>>> the top exposed.  It looks like the wide mouth caps cover the outside of
>>> the top some, so it should keep any kicked up debris flavoring to a minimum.
>>>
>>> CHEERS!
>>> Wally in Maine
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 12:12:07 PM UTC-5, Patrick Moore wrote:

 Thanks. I must get some Kleen Kanteens -- just bought 2 insulated
 bottles on Amazon that were advertised as being 2.8" in diameter but turned
 out to be 2.6 -- too small for a cage.

 --- Just noticed that tops on your KKs are not covered -- how do you
 keep dirt off? More important probably around my woods where there is much
 horse shit.

 On Mon, Jan 15, 2018 at 1:37 PM, Deacon Patrick 
 wrote:

> Thanks, Patrick. Frozen moustache/face feel: nose breathing helps with
> this a lot. My moustache and lower lip beard (goatee?) freeze together.
>
> Saddle: Rivet’s Diablo. http://rivetcycleworks.com
> Bottles: The orange is Klean Kanteen’s 20 oz. insulated narrow mouth
> bottle. https://www.kleankanteen.com/collections/insulated-bottles/p
> roducts/insulated-water-bottle-20oz?variant=1533621955
> The sooty stainless steal is their standard narow mouth single-wall
> 28oz. that I use to boil water when bikepacking (no pot to haul!).
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
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>>
>>
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>> Alburquerque, New Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique
>> 
>> 
>> *Auditis an me ludit amabilis insania?*
>>
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[RBW] Re: Did you lose your Silver Roadeo?

['Hetchins52' via RBW Owners Bunch]

The René Rivera I know is Executive Director of Bike East Bay 
(https://bikeeastbay.org). René was also a member (and director) of the San 
Francisco Bike Coalition.
Makes it likely it was found in SF, Berkeley or Oakland.

David Lipsky
Berkeley, CA

On Sunday, January 14, 2018 at 8:16:31 PM UTC-8, drew wrote:
>
> A city or area of the country where you found it would be helpful. Then we 
> could potentially start asking around. 

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[RBW] Re: Did you lose your Silver Roadeo?

['Hetchins52' via RBW Owners Bunch]

If this is the René Rivera I know, he is the dedicated, hard-working, 
Executive Director of Bike East Bay (formerly the East Bay Bicycle 
Coalition). René was also a long time member of the SF Bike Coalition. 
So seems likely that it was found in San Francisco, Oakland or Berkeley.

David Lipsky
Berkeley, CA
Member, Bike East Bay ( https://bikeeastbay.org )


On Sunday, January 14, 2018 at 8:16:31 PM UTC-8, drew wrote:
>
> A city or area of the country where you found it would be helpful. Then we 
> could potentially start asking around. 

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[RBW] Re: Hubbuhubbuh with drop bars?

[Harald Kliems]

Just a quick update. The good news: I bought a tandem. The bad news: It's 
not a Riv. At a bike swap yesterday, I found a good deal on a 2001 
Cannondale tandem in our size. I'm a little sad that I won't get to own a 
Riv, but reason says that I made a good decision by starting our entry into 
the tandem world with something used. I've seen too many sad tandem 
classifieds from people who spent a lot of money on fancy tandems only to 
realize that the whole tandem thing is not for them...

 Harald. 

On Thursday, January 11, 2018 at 10:52:49 AM UTC-6, Harald Kliems wrote:
>
> Hi everyone:
> This is my first post in the group -- some of you may recognize my name 
> from the iBOB or 650B lists, though. I am not yet an RBW Owner. But I am in 
> the market for a tandem, and the HHH seems like a wonderful option. The 
> only major concern I have: Will I be able to set it up with drop bars? My 
> goal here is not to make it racier or something like that; it's just that 
> my wrists do not get along with anything that's not a drop bar. I was 
> wondering if anyone here has set up their HHH with drop bars and how they 
> like it. Looking at the geometry charts, I don't see any obvious issues (I 
> am 6'5" and therefore the larger reach of drop bars may actually be a 
> positive). But I'm by no means a tandem expert and I'd be curious to hear 
> some first-hand experiences. Or well-informed opinions. 
> Thanks,
>  Harald in Madison (WI)
>

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[RBW] Re: Seeking opinions on 11 speed roadie setup

[Jeffrey Arita]

Hi Paul,

I too have the itch.  I am the original owner of a Merlin Extralight ('95 
vintage).  I originally spec'd it with 8-speed Dura-Ace, early brifters.  
After awhile running the 8-speed drivetrain I converted the crank to a 
triple, using a 39-tooth 'tripleizer' along with a wider bb.  Run 
53-39-26.  Then I got a real 'job' and stopped cycling altogether.fast 
forward to 2011, I started cycling again (thank goodness).  I converted the 
cogset to a 9-speed and installed 9-speed bar-cons.  Still run the 53-39-26 
crankset.

Present Day: Boy that 11-speed cogset sure would be cool to run, along with 
a NEW wheelset, right?  But that would mean new shifters and perhaps a new 
rear derailleur.  One part of me says 'go for it' while the rational side 
of me says it won't make a huge difference.  I am sticking to my rational 
side for now ;)

Maybe check out a larger big chainring on your existing crank?  Increase 
your top-end?

Good luck,

Jeff

On Sunday, January 14, 2018 at 12:24:44 AM UTC-8, Paul Y wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> Looking for opinions and perspective s before scratching an itch!
>
> I've been riding my Roadeo with a dura ace 7400 double crank (38 and 48t) 
> with a Sora 8 speed 11-25 cassette, Shimano bar ends (9 speed but running 
> friction) and an older XT rapid rise rear derailer.
>
> The gearing is pretty good for me - it's enough to manage 10 deg climbs 
> and truck along around 35 kph.
>
> I've been riding the Roadeo like a typical club rider might, generally 
> without fenders and wearing lycra, though I haven't actually been riding 
> with a club! The plan is to ride a few audaxes this year though.
>
> I'm tempted to change to a new Shimano 105 5800 drivetrain (11 speed) and 
> brifters, which should go on easily as I already have a 105 11-speed hub.
>
> I love the robustness of the current setup but always looking for ways to 
> get more speed ( and I'm constantly training / trying to build strength).
>
> Has anyone else transitioned their bike similarly? As in, going from Riv 
> values to modern racy (meshed with steel and larger tires)? I still have a 
> Sam setup as a practical bicycle so I guess that leaves me freedom to 
> embody another cycling personality.
>
> Thanks for reading, and hopefully sharing your feelings on this.
>
> Paul
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Tubeless Maintenance

[Jeffrey Arita]

Thanks again, Patrick.  I just chatted with a fellow bikepacker who is 
building up his dream ride (Surly ECR) and he too heard good things re OS > 
Stan's.  He wants to go Rohloff, which I agreed was great.  He might have 
to go chain vs. Gates though.  Take care,

Jeff

On Sunday, January 14, 2018 at 2:23:59 AM UTC-8, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Jeff: I hope you find that OS works better. In a more recent post, just 
> this past Friday, I found ~200 gr of semi-dried OS lining the rear F Fred, 
> with 2904 miles on the clock.
>
> Patrick Moore
> iPhone
>
> On Jan 12, 2018, at 9:29 AM, Jeffrey Arita  > wrote:
>
> Patrick,
>
> Thank you for your observations re: Stan's.  I am really a noobie when it 
> comes to 'tubeless.'  I had to get an education last year while building up 
> his/her Divide bikes (Salsa Fargo's).  I went (of course) tubeless with 
> Stan's without any regard to other brands out there (my bad).  While out on 
> the Divide we kinda had hit and miss luck.  We ended up having to tube one 
> wheel on each our bikes (Stan's just would not seal the leak and the tire 
> plugs wouldn't hold and seal either).  OTOH upon getting to a campground we 
> could see a bunch of tiny little areas on our tires where Stan's was 
> bubbling out, many of them sealing up.
>
> Once I use up all the Stan's (I still have a bunch) I will definitely 
> check out Orange Seal!  Thanks again.
>
> Jeff
>
> On Sunday, November 5, 2017 at 10:07:25 AM UTC-8, Patrick Moore wrote:
>>
>> As I said earlier, my own experience with Stan's is that, when it dries, 
>> it does form little rubber marbles or octopuses or boogers, what have you; 
>> this both in tubes and in tires without tubes. In one tube, ridden for 12 
>> to 18 months with Stan's added initially but not thereafter (sealant seems 
>> to last much longer in tubes than in thinwall, tubeless tire casings), I 
>> finally got a thorn flat that pumping and spinning wouldn't seal; so I 
>> replaced the tube with the spare, thinking I'd add more sealant to the 
>> flatted one when I got home.
>>
>> Upon closer examination, at home, I discovered that the Stan's had dried 
>> into a bolus gathered near the valve.  So, I tossed that tube. 
>>
>> Orange Seal, OTOH, seems not to produce such boluses when it dries. I've 
>> not examined a tube that has contained OS for 18 months -- I've just been 
>> riding them and waiting for the flats that don't seem to occur or, at 
>> least, can be solved by pumping and spinning -- but again, when I opened my 
>> tubeless F Fred after the first year of OS, there was naught but a very 
>> fine film coating the innards of the casing.
>>
>> So, upshot: You really don't need to do anything, as long as you don't 
>> mind rubber marbles inside your tire; they don't weight much at all. OTOH, 
>> again IME, Stan's will form those marbles, so that there will be, or may 
>> well be, something for you to actually remove, if indeed you decide to go 
>> into the trouble of opening up the tire.
>>
>> Let us know what you find, if you do so!
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 5, 2017 at 6:32 AM, Kellie  wrote:
>>
>>> Well, I am using Stan's, but tubeless. Any Stan's users to weight in 
>>> here? Thanks Nels, Phillip and Patrick.
>>>
>>> On Saturday, November 4, 2017 at 2:16:57 PM UTC-7, Kellie wrote:

 So my sealant is lasting about 4 months before I have to replenish. 
 Should one do some cleaning of interior parts at some point to get rid of 
 dried, old sealant?

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>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
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>> Alburquerque, New Mexico, EUA
>> *
>> ***
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>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Tubeless Maintenance

[Patrick Moore]

Again, you are very welcome.

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[RBW] Re: Lightest canti-Rivendell is?

[stoker]

On Saturday, January 13, 2018 at 11:14:31 PM UTC-6, Belopsky wrote:
>
> I am really curious on the build specs. I'm assuming light wheelset which 
> brings the weight down..My Gunnar is more than 20..


It's a lightweight frameset - 7/4/7 TT, 8/5/8 DT, Lite seatstays. I weigh 
around 155.
Wheelset is Mavic Open Pro/Ultegra 6600 32H/DT Alu nips/DT 2.0/1.8 
spokes/12-28  SRAM 10 spd cassette
As I mentioned in my original reply, I am currently running Compass 700x32 
EL Stampede Pass tires.
Ritchey Logic crank w/Wolftooth 40T W/N chainring with alloy bolts. White 
Industries Ti BB. Shimano A600 pedals.
Shimano Ultegra post/IBIS Ti stem/Nitto M151F bar 46cm
Cane Creek 110 Classic threaded HS
Rival 1x10 brake/shifters/derailleur. Carbon levers, left lever gutted.
Brooks Cambium C15 

This is the current build that adds up to the weight that I noted in my 
original post. Please note some of the components have evolved since that 
image was taken.


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[RBW] Re: Seeking opinions on 11 speed roadie setup

[Brewster Fong]

I run 9 speed cassette on 2 bikes, 7 speed fw on another an 11 speed on my 
go-fast. I'm not sure what the "advantages" are, if any, of going to 11. 
Well, I guess if you like closer range of the cogs, there's more of them, 
so that's good. You can also find stuff that may not be available in 8 or 9 
speed like replacement parts.  For example, if that 8 speed STI shifters 
break, you may not be able to replace it. Same if 9 speed STI. Campy is a 
little better as you can rebuild them and small parts are available.

Further, if you're currently running 8/9 speed Shimano, you will probably 
need a new wheel to accommodate 11 speed. So you're looking at new 
shifters, RD, rear wheel and a chain.  So, if money isn't an issue, I say 
go for it. But at that point, it might be more cost effective to just get 
another bike.  So it comes down to how much do you want to spend.  I will 
say that e-shifting is pretty nice as you just tap the lever and it goes. 
Is it worth the extra $$$? Probably not as the latest mechanical shifting 
like DA 9000 is super smooth and amazing.  Still, it is a novelty and I 
hear that for cross "racers" they all inof course, YMMV!  Good Luck! 

On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 12:28:49 PM UTC-8, Jeffrey Arita wrote:
>
> Hi Paul,
>
> I too have the itch.  I am the original owner of a Merlin Extralight ('95 
> vintage).  I originally spec'd it with 8-speed Dura-Ace, early brifters.  
> After awhile running the 8-speed drivetrain I converted the crank to a 
> triple, using a 39-tooth 'tripleizer' along with a wider bb.  Run 
> 53-39-26.  Then I got a real 'job' and stopped cycling altogether.fast 
> forward to 2011, I started cycling again (thank goodness).  I converted the 
> cogset to a 9-speed and installed 9-speed bar-cons.  Still run the 53-39-26 
> crankset.
>
> Present Day: Boy that 11-speed cogset sure would be cool to run, along 
> with a NEW wheelset, right?  But that would mean new shifters and perhaps a 
> new rear derailleur.  One part of me says 'go for it' while the rational 
> side of me says it won't make a huge difference.  I am sticking to my 
> rational side for now ;)
>
> Maybe check out a larger big chainring on your existing crank?  Increase 
> your top-end?
>
> Good luck,
>
> Jeff
>
> On Sunday, January 14, 2018 at 12:24:44 AM UTC-8, Paul Y wrote:
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Looking for opinions and perspective s before scratching an itch!
>>
>> I've been riding my Roadeo with a dura ace 7400 double crank (38 and 48t) 
>> with a Sora 8 speed 11-25 cassette, Shimano bar ends (9 speed but running 
>> friction) and an older XT rapid rise rear derailer.
>>
>> The gearing is pretty good for me - it's enough to manage 10 deg climbs 
>> and truck along around 35 kph.
>>
>> I've been riding the Roadeo like a typical club rider might, generally 
>> without fenders and wearing lycra, though I haven't actually been riding 
>> with a club! The plan is to ride a few audaxes this year though.
>>
>> I'm tempted to change to a new Shimano 105 5800 drivetrain (11 speed) and 
>> brifters, which should go on easily as I already have a 105 11-speed hub.
>>
>> I love the robustness of the current setup but always looking for ways to 
>> get more speed ( and I'm constantly training / trying to build strength).
>>
>> Has anyone else transitioned their bike similarly? As in, going from Riv 
>> values to modern racy (meshed with steel and larger tires)? I still have a 
>> Sam setup as a practical bicycle so I guess that leaves me freedom to 
>> embody another cycling personality.
>>
>> Thanks for reading, and hopefully sharing your feelings on this.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: FS: Canti brake sets - Tektro, VO Grand Cru and Avid Shorty Ultimate

[Ash [who works to bike]]

Price drop:

Tektro CR710 - $35
VO Grand Cru Zeste - $60
Avid Short Ultimate - $75




On Saturday, 30 December 2017 16:00:48 UTC-8, Ash [who works to bike] wrote:
>
> Accumulated these in the process of deciding on brakes for my Appaloosa 
> back in June.  I have used them each for 100 miles or less.  
>
> Prices shipped (within USA).  All are front/back set.
>
> Tektro CR710 - $45
> VO Grand Cru Zeste - $70
> Avid Short Ultimate - $90
>
> Pictures:
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/ccarTTwW0tQrGxk42
>
>
>
>

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[RBW] FS: Shimano (mostly) 105 groupset-ish

[Belopsky]

I want to go Campy 11 on my Gunnar so..
For sale:

black black black

As seen here: https://photos.app.goo.gl/AFUzdCUFZ4BqGHnY2

Shimano FC-RS500 CX Crankset - 11 Speed - 36/46 / Black / 172.5mm
Shimano 5800 front derailleur 
Shimano 5800 rear derailleur
Shimano 5800 Shifters 2x11

Crankset 20miles of use.
Everything else 200miles

$300shipped

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[RBW] Re: Fenderless Sam: Snoqualmie or Barlow Pass?

[Deacon Patrick]

I forgot to mention I briefly experimented with running Orange seal in my tubes 
and the fuss and mess was too much for me. I don’t have issues here with 
thornes and I know how to (mostly) avoid pinch flats, so the only flats I get 
are due to big gashes from glass or other detrius. So my 30-35 psi with the 
Snoqualmie is tubed, as are my other psi’s for the other Compass tires.

With abandon,
Patrick

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Re: [RBW] Re: Fenderless Sam: Snoqualmie or Barlow Pass?

[Patrick Moore]

IME, even the best modern sealants work best on very small punctures, where
they work excellently. But for large holes say for big nails, again IME,
they are worse than no sealant, at least for tubes, since they don't seal
these and make a mess that prevents patching. I carry spare tubes on each
of my bikes for this eventuality.

But: though from thorns I used to consider 5 flats a week normal, I find
that big punctures, where I live, are more like 1 every 5 years, though I
don't usually ride where there are a lot of sharp rocks.



On Tue, Jan 16, 2018 at 2:36 PM, Deacon Patrick  wrote:

> I forgot to mention I briefly experimented with running Orange seal in my
> tubes and the fuss and mess was too much for me. I don’t have issues here
> with thornes and I know how to (mostly) avoid pinch flats, so the only
> flats I get are due to big gashes from glass or other detrius. So my 30-35
> psi with the Snoqualmie is tubed, as are my other psi’s for the other
> Compass tires.
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
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[RBW] Price decrease: FS: Black 52cm Clementine f/f/hs $700+

['Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Giving this a little nudge and a little price drop. $700 + bikeflights for 
frame and fork, headset, kickstand, and seat post. That's $150 off the 
current price, and there are no 52cm framesets currently available. Plus 
looks like a price increase is inevitable.  Frame is in great shape, and 
the glossy black paint is amazing. Thank you and please return to your 
regularly scheduled programming. I will oblige all inquiries off list. 

On Wednesday, January 10, 2018 at 1:44:52 PM UTC-5, Mark in Beacon wrote:
>
> I wish I was not writing this ad, but unfortunately, I need to generate 
> some cash, and my Clementine, aka Clem Smith Jr. L-style, is one of the few 
> bikes I own with any real measurable resale value. It has been truly a joy 
> to ride, and if my circumstances were different, I would keep this bike 
> until the day I could no longer pull myself onto the saddle.
>
> *Included:*
>
>
>- *First iteration black 52cm frame & fork; has the white paint 
>details, and "CLEMENTINE" written on the downtube*.
>- *Also included from the "complete bike" kit: headset, seat post, 
>brakes, kickstand, *
>
>  

>
>- Surly 8 pack rack that I modified slightly to work with this bike is 
>an extra $50 for frame buyer if desired, $80 if not sold with frame. 
>
>
> Bike is in very very good condition. It was well cared for and always 
> parked indoors on both ends of the commute.
>
> I won't disassemble the bike until it sells, so between that and finding a 
> big enough box (fork will be removed), it will not be arriving to you 
> overnight. $750 plus bikeflights .
>
> Here are some pictures of the complete bicycle: 
> https://goo.gl/photos/Xyf3kVj4ENcXVSiw5
>
>
>

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[RBW] Black 52cm Clementine F/F/HS $700 plus bikeflights

['Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch]

I wish I was not writing this ad, but unfortunately, I need to generate 
some cash, and my Clementine, aka Clem Smith Jr. L-style, is one of the few 
bikes I own with any real measurable resale value. It has been truly a joy 
to ride, and if my circumstances were different, I would keep this bike 
until the day I could no longer pull myself onto the saddle.

$700 + bikeflights for black 52cm frame and fork, headset, brake levers and 
calipers, kickstand, and seat post, excellent condition. That's $150 off 
the current price, and there are no 52cm framesets currently available. 
Plus looks like a price increase is inevitable.  Frame is in great shape, 
and the glossy black paint is amazing. Thank you and please return to your 
regularly scheduled programming. I will oblige all inquiries off list. 
 
*Included:*

*First iteration black 52cm frame & fork; has the white paint details, and 
"CLEMENTINE" written on the downtube*.

*Also included from the "complete bike" kit: headset, seat post, brake 
levers and calipers, kickstand, *
 
Surly 8 pack rack that I modified slightly to work with this bike is an 
extra $50 for frame buyer if desired, $80 if not sold with frame. 

Frame is in very very good condition. It was well cared for and always 
parked indoors on both ends of the commute.

Here are some pictures of the complete bicycle: 
https://goo.gl/photos/Xyf3kVj4ENcXVSiw5

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[RBW] interesting article on fenders from Compass

['Ann L' via RBW Owners Bunch]

https://janheine.wordpress.com/?utm_source=Retail+Customer+Newsletter&utm_campaign=72d051e458-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2018_01_15&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_f74fbd5ca8-72d051e458-108574281&mc_cid=72d051e458&mc_eid=4f91954305

I thought this was an interesting read, especially with the recent posts 
about fenders.

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[RBW] New Roadini or hang on to Sam

[Broccoli Cog]

Hello friends, I'm looking to do a road bike build and I am having trouble 
deciding between keeping the Sam Hillborne frameset that I already own or 
go in an entirely different direction starting from scratch with a new 
Roadini frameset. I purchased the drop bar Sam as a complete in 2016. This 
was my first Riv and I completely embraced the Rivendell philosophy of 
"just ride". That drop bar Sam eventually morphed into an upright Albatross 
set up. I got away from the drop bars because I wanted to try upright 
riding to gain maximum comfort. This setup eventually became my S240 bike 
and I became much more interested in riding with a heavy touring load. As 
my interest in camping and touring grew I decided that I wanted a dedicated 
tourer so I picked up an Appaloosa frame and swapped most of the parts over 
from the Sam.  The Sam frameset is currently sitting in my basement. 

I have decided that my riding would be best served by having two different 
bike setups. I want to keep the Appaloosa for camping, touring, grocery 
getting, commuting and casual riding with the Mrs. I want a second bike to 
be a dedicated drop bar road bike that is unencumbered with racks and large 
bags. I am thinking about building the Sam back up as a traditional sporty 
road bike with a compact double crankset, the noodle bars that I already 
own along with JB 33.'s and fenders. I want this bike to be my 
relatively fast bike that I ride when I am looking to go out and get a 
quick ride for pure recreation and fitness. I may even be ambitious enough 
to go do a group ride with my old riding buddies from back in my racer 
wannabe days. Lately, the Roadini has been the object of my desire. I am 
thinking that if I get back into riding on the road in a typical club rider 
fashion that I would be better served by having a more traditional road 
bike like the Roadini. My vision for a Roadini would be to build it up in a 
retro style with downtube shifters, Noodles, Sugino compact double and 28 
to 33mm tires. 

I think my desire for the Roadini is mostly driven by new bike lust. I feel 
like I am constantly chasing that feeling you get when you buy a new bike. 
The reality is what I have found through the years and many bike purchases 
later is that "new bike day" euphoria typically fades fades and I ended up 
chasing that feeling again with something else. I know that you guys are 
not my therapist but can anybody share their thoughts on what decision to 
make? Should I keep the Sam  and reinvent it as a sporty road bike or 
should I take the plunge and go for a new Roadini to satisfy my sporty road 
bike urge?


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[RBW] Re: New Roadini or hang on to Sam

[Belopsky]

For the sake of someone I know who may want a Sam - what size?

On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 7:40:04 PM UTC-5, Broccoli Cog wrote:
>
> Hello friends, I'm looking to do a road bike build and I am having trouble 
> deciding between keeping the Sam Hillborne frameset that I already own or 
> go in an entirely different direction starting from scratch with a new 
> Roadini frameset. I purchased the drop bar Sam as a complete in 2016. This 
> was my first Riv and I completely embraced the Rivendell philosophy of 
> "just ride". That drop bar Sam eventually morphed into an upright Albatross 
> set up. I got away from the drop bars because I wanted to try upright 
> riding to gain maximum comfort. This setup eventually became my S240 bike 
> and I became much more interested in riding with a heavy touring load. As 
> my interest in camping and touring grew I decided that I wanted a dedicated 
> tourer so I picked up an Appaloosa frame and swapped most of the parts over 
> from the Sam.  The Sam frameset is currently sitting in my basement. 
>
> I have decided that my riding would be best served by having two different 
> bike setups. I want to keep the Appaloosa for camping, touring, grocery 
> getting, commuting and casual riding with the Mrs. I want a second bike to 
> be a dedicated drop bar road bike that is unencumbered with racks and large 
> bags. I am thinking about building the Sam back up as a traditional sporty 
> road bike with a compact double crankset, the noodle bars that I already 
> own along with JB 33.'s and fenders. I want this bike to be my 
> relatively fast bike that I ride when I am looking to go out and get a 
> quick ride for pure recreation and fitness. I may even be ambitious enough 
> to go do a group ride with my old riding buddies from back in my racer 
> wannabe days. Lately, the Roadini has been the object of my desire. I am 
> thinking that if I get back into riding on the road in a typical club rider 
> fashion that I would be better served by having a more traditional road 
> bike like the Roadini. My vision for a Roadini would be to build it up in a 
> retro style with downtube shifters, Noodles, Sugino compact double and 28 
> to 33mm tires. 
>
> I think my desire for the Roadini is mostly driven by new bike lust. I 
> feel like I am constantly chasing that feeling you get when you buy a new 
> bike. The reality is what I have found through the years and many bike 
> purchases later is that "new bike day" euphoria typically fades fades and I 
> ended up chasing that feeling again with something else. I know that you 
> guys are not my therapist but can anybody share their thoughts on what 
> decision to make? Should I keep the Sam  and reinvent it as a sporty road 
> bike or should I take the plunge and go for a new Roadini to satisfy my 
> sporty road bike urge?
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: New Roadini or hang on to Sam

[Broccoli Cog]

It's a 62 2TT

On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 8:06:27 PM UTC-5, Belopsky wrote:
>
> For the sake of someone I know who may want a Sam - what size?
>
> On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 7:40:04 PM UTC-5, Broccoli Cog wrote:
>>
>> Hello friends, I'm looking to do a road bike build and I am having 
>> trouble deciding between keeping the Sam Hillborne frameset that I already 
>> own or go in an entirely different direction starting from scratch with a 
>> new Roadini frameset. I purchased the drop bar Sam as a complete in 2016. 
>> This was my first Riv and I completely embraced the Rivendell philosophy of 
>> "just ride". That drop bar Sam eventually morphed into an upright Albatross 
>> set up. I got away from the drop bars because I wanted to try upright 
>> riding to gain maximum comfort. This setup eventually became my S240 bike 
>> and I became much more interested in riding with a heavy touring load. As 
>> my interest in camping and touring grew I decided that I wanted a dedicated 
>> tourer so I picked up an Appaloosa frame and swapped most of the parts over 
>> from the Sam.  The Sam frameset is currently sitting in my basement. 
>>
>> I have decided that my riding would be best served by having two 
>> different bike setups. I want to keep the Appaloosa for camping, touring, 
>> grocery getting, commuting and casual riding with the Mrs. I want a second 
>> bike to be a dedicated drop bar road bike that is unencumbered with racks 
>> and large bags. I am thinking about building the Sam back up as a 
>> traditional sporty road bike with a compact double crankset, the noodle 
>> bars that I already own along with JB 33.'s and fenders. I want this 
>> bike to be my relatively fast bike that I ride when I am looking to go out 
>> and get a quick ride for pure recreation and fitness. I may even be 
>> ambitious enough to go do a group ride with my old riding buddies from back 
>> in my racer wannabe days. Lately, the Roadini has been the object of my 
>> desire. I am thinking that if I get back into riding on the road in a 
>> typical club rider fashion that I would be better served by having a more 
>> traditional road bike like the Roadini. My vision for a Roadini would be to 
>> build it up in a retro style with downtube shifters, Noodles, Sugino 
>> compact double and 28 to 33mm tires. 
>>
>> I think my desire for the Roadini is mostly driven by new bike lust. I 
>> feel like I am constantly chasing that feeling you get when you buy a new 
>> bike. The reality is what I have found through the years and many bike 
>> purchases later is that "new bike day" euphoria typically fades fades and I 
>> ended up chasing that feeling again with something else. I know that you 
>> guys are not my therapist but can anybody share their thoughts on what 
>> decision to make? Should I keep the Sam  and reinvent it as a sporty road 
>> bike or should I take the plunge and go for a new Roadini to satisfy my 
>> sporty road bike urge?
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] New Roadini or hang on to Sam

[Deacon Patrick]

The fruits of contentment are poisoned by the pursuit of instant gratification. 
The challenge of practicing contentment is to delight in what you have. Simple. 
Hard. Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick

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[RBW] New Roadini or hang on to Sam

[lum gim fong]

Call RBW And ask which of their bikes has the thinnest tubing and shortest 
chains stays. I’m no expert but I think that will give you the snappiest ride.

Roadeo?

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[RBW] New Roadini or hang on to Sam

[John G.]

Bill Lindsay posted some advice on this in a different thread, and I thought it 
was very wise. I’ll try to find it when I’m on not on mobile. Keep the Sam for 
now, and build it up with some light components. See how you like it, and if 
you’re not a fan, get the Roadini and port the parts over.

If you are looking for a faster bike, I’d prioritize some nice wheels. HED 
Belgiums are great. Spend money on wheels before components.

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[RBW] Lightest 650b wheelset that can take a 42mm tire?

[lum gim fong]

Anyone know what that is these days?

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[RBW] Re: New Roadini or hang on to Sam

[Bob Lovejoy]

Here is (hopefully) a link to Bill's post that John referenced:
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rbw-owners-bunch/9i5ROKi9ETs/gQjYkP6hCwAJ

And I thought it wise too, enough that the Sam path is what I will be 
taking.

That said, the 61cm Roadini (1TT) versus the 62cm Sam (2TT) might be a 
slightly different analysis.  One thing to certainly ponder is how the Sam 
fits you versus how the Roadini might fit.  I was right in the middle of 
the recommended range for a 58cm Sam versus right on the edge for the 
Roadini and I valued fit above most other things.  

I know, maybe not much help!  Good luck in the deciding though...!

Bob Lovejoy
Galesburg, IL 

On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 8:19:03 PM UTC-6, John G. wrote:
>
> Bill Lindsay posted some advice on this in a different thread, and I 
> thought it was very wise. I’ll try to find it when I’m on not on mobile. 
> Keep the Sam for now, and build it up with some light components. See how 
> you like it, and if you’re not a fan, get the Roadini and port the parts 
> over. 
>
> If you are looking for a faster bike, I’d prioritize some nice wheels. HED 
> Belgiums are great. Spend money on wheels before components. 
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Fixed n’ Frosty Winter Medley

[Coal Bee Rye Anne]

I have a few Kleen kanteen as well as hydro flask and they both come in a 
variety of sizes and wide/narrow mouth openings... but it seems the narrow 
mouth generally are internally threaded for the cap (exposing the mouth lip to 
dirt, etc. as previously noted) and the wide mouth have external threads where 
the wide mouth cap covers the entire mouth opening.  Interestingly, the larger 
capacity bottles I’ve found were narrow mouth and smaller capacity more often 
had wide mouth. I also have one HydroFlask that came with and fits a wide Kleen 
Kanteen branded cap but other HydroFlasks have different caps and are not 
interchangeable.  Guess there were just some design changes there at some point?

32oz insulated and 40oz non-insulated have the same outer diameter and both fit 
the same oversized VO Mojave cages (although due to some slight tolerance 
differences I used spare cotton bar tape to shim a couple that were slightly 
loose and rattled too much.)

Same applies to the narrower variety... I have an insulated 20oz wide mouth 
that’s the same outer dimensions as 24oz non-insulated widemouth and both fit 
KingCage iris cages.

Brian Cole 
Lawrenceville NJ

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[RBW] Re: New Roadini or hang on to Sam

[iamkeith]

On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 6:32:49 PM UTC-7, lum gim fong wrote:

Call RBW And ask which of their bikes has the thinnest tubing and shortest 
> chains stays. I’m no expert but I think 


... they will tell you that your priorities are skewed and that you're 
shopping at the wrong bike company.
 
;-)

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[RBW] WTB: 58 cm Joe Appaloosa, butternut

[Jim S.]

Anybody looking to sell their 58 Joe Appaloosa in butternut? I could buy 
frame or complete. Send me a PM if interested, thanks.

Jim Simeri

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Re: [RBW] Fixed n’ Frosty Winter Medley

[Coal Bee Rye Anne]

Actually, I just confirmed what I thought was a 24oz is really a 27oz 
non-insulated widemouth Kleen Kanteen that fits the iris cage same as my 20oz 
insulated HydroFlask.  These are the two that have the same interchangeable KK 
wide caps.  The 27oz KK is a little taller so I think the 24oz non-insulated 
ones are more of an exact match outer dimensionally to 20oz insulated.

We then have 32oz insulated and 40oz non-insulated KKanteens that have the same 
interchangeable narrow caps and then a 32oz insulated wide mouth HydroFlask 
with proprietary cap but all three bottles fit the Mojave cage.

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[RBW] Looking for Riv Reader #37

[steve]

Does anyone have an extra or one they no longer need?  Would like to see 
this one.  

Steve

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[RBW] Re: New Roadini or hang on to Sam

[dstein]

If money isn't an issue and you can offset the costs by selling the Sam, 
I'd sell it and get a Roadini. For paved riding with no racks/load I'd 
place my bets there. I have ridden a Sam, but not a Roadini or Rodeo so 
can't comment specifically on the ride comparison though. I have ridden a 
Sam and a more sporty Rosco Road bike and the difference is pretty 
noticeable to me. And fit is important as someone else mentioned. But 
something to be said for a sporty, stripped down road bike meant for all 
paved rides. If money is an issue or you think you'd be overextending 
yourself, then stick with what you got, it'll be fine ;).

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Bike Syndrome

[Scott McLain]

Bikes are no different from fly rods, guitars, golf clubs, or potato chips.  
It’s hard to stop at just one!

Just go with the Atlantis.  Enjoy it.  Then when you get the itch buy something 
used off the list.  Like a Ram or Saluki, just for fun.

Skimp on your car.

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Bike Syndrome

[Curtis McKenzie]

Dear Scott,

With utmost respect you left out banjos and chisels.  We all have our
weaknesses. Grin.

Best,

Curtis

On Jan 16, 2018 9:02 PM, "Scott McLain"  wrote:

> Bikes are no different from fly rods, guitars, golf clubs, or potato
> chips.  It’s hard to stop at just one!
>
> Just go with the Atlantis.  Enjoy it.  Then when you get the itch buy
> something used off the list.  Like a Ram or Saluki, just for fun.
>
> Skimp on your car.
>
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[RBW] Re: New Roadini or hang on to Sam

[Nate in Oakland]

I commute on a Sam and love it.  I’ve test ridden a Roadini for about an hour, 
and now I can’t get that bike out of my head.  I don’t know if it’s just 
because it didn’t have all the heavy commuter gear, but it felt real quick and 
springy compared to Sam.  Oh, and still smth. I really don’t have room for 
another bike and the Roadini isn’t useful enough to replace my Sam, but 
ooh I want it!

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[RBW] Re: Front rack for panniers and handlebar bag

[Craig Montgomery]

Big rack...good. I like it because it keeps the weight in close to the 
forks and it's very solid.  

https://www.flickr.com/photos/24722971@N05/38959268282/in/dateposted/

I found the 27F gets kind of flexible if you go heavy:
 https://www.flickr.com/photos/24722971@N05/8537639981 
It puts the weight out from the forks and it has a tendency to sway. But I 
tend to go heavy on the front end. 

The small front like a 32F or Mark's rack is also a good combo with a Tubus 
and allows the versatility dougP talks about. 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/24722971@N05/34846762581/in/album-72157684433492685/

If you're going heavy I'd do the big solid Big Rack. Past that anything 
will do. Pass and Stow looks good but if you're going to load up that 
platform I'd have a low trail front end. 

Craig in Tucson




On Friday, January 12, 2018 at 5:59:41 PM UTC-7, John G. wrote:
>
> Hey folks,
>
> I'm looking for recommendations for a front rack that will let me use 
> lowrider panniers AND a handlebar bag. I'm sure the Nitto Big Front Rack 
> works, but has anyone used something else and loved it?
>

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[RBW] Re: New Roadini or hang on to Sam

[Philip Reimer]

Here are my thoughts. If your Sam would fit me, you should get rid of it!

In all honesty I almost always feel that new bike urge. And it is fun to 
get a new one. But taking that old bike for a spin usually makes me fall in 
love again and takes care of my desire for something new. So get some parts 
bake on the Sam, as close as possible to what you want without spending any 
money. Take it for a ride, and let that be your decision maker. I bet after 
30 minutes on the bike you will know what to do.

Phil

On Tuesday, January 16, 2018 at 7:40:04 PM UTC-5, Broccoli Cog wrote:
>
> Hello friends, I'm looking to do a road bike build and I am having trouble 
> deciding between keeping the Sam Hillborne frameset that I already own or 
> go in an entirely different direction starting from scratch with a new 
> Roadini frameset. I purchased the drop bar Sam as a complete in 2016. This 
> was my first Riv and I completely embraced the Rivendell philosophy of 
> "just ride". That drop bar Sam eventually morphed into an upright Albatross 
> set up. I got away from the drop bars because I wanted to try upright 
> riding to gain maximum comfort. This setup eventually became my S240 bike 
> and I became much more interested in riding with a heavy touring load. As 
> my interest in camping and touring grew I decided that I wanted a dedicated 
> tourer so I picked up an Appaloosa frame and swapped most of the parts over 
> from the Sam.  The Sam frameset is currently sitting in my basement. 
>
> I have decided that my riding would be best served by having two different 
> bike setups. I want to keep the Appaloosa for camping, touring, grocery 
> getting, commuting and casual riding with the Mrs. I want a second bike to 
> be a dedicated drop bar road bike that is unencumbered with racks and large 
> bags. I am thinking about building the Sam back up as a traditional sporty 
> road bike with a compact double crankset, the noodle bars that I already 
> own along with JB 33.'s and fenders. I want this bike to be my 
> relatively fast bike that I ride when I am looking to go out and get a 
> quick ride for pure recreation and fitness. I may even be ambitious enough 
> to go do a group ride with my old riding buddies from back in my racer 
> wannabe days. Lately, the Roadini has been the object of my desire. I am 
> thinking that if I get back into riding on the road in a typical club rider 
> fashion that I would be better served by having a more traditional road 
> bike like the Roadini. My vision for a Roadini would be to build it up in a 
> retro style with downtube shifters, Noodles, Sugino compact double and 28 
> to 33mm tires. 
>
> I think my desire for the Roadini is mostly driven by new bike lust. I 
> feel like I am constantly chasing that feeling you get when you buy a new 
> bike. The reality is what I have found through the years and many bike 
> purchases later is that "new bike day" euphoria typically fades fades and I 
> ended up chasing that feeling again with something else. I know that you 
> guys are not my therapist but can anybody share their thoughts on what 
> decision to make? Should I keep the Sam  and reinvent it as a sporty road 
> bike or should I take the plunge and go for a new Roadini to satisfy my 
> sporty road bike urge?
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Seeking opinions on 11 speed roadie setup

[lum gim fong]

Single speed riders are shiftless people.





















😩😉🚴🏻🚴🏻🚴🏻🚴🏻🚴🏻🚴🏻🚴🏻


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Re: [RBW] Lightest 650b wheelset that can take a 42mm tire?

[Reed Kennedy]

Probably something like this:
https://pacenticycledesign.com/products/brevet-wheel-set-27-5-650b-rim-brake-11speed-shimano

Though if you wanted to get truly silly you could buy A23 rims in 36 hole,
build them up skipping every other hole with only 18 spokes, and use one of
the ridiculous-light hubsets you could probably get them down to around
1200 grams without values or rim tape.

They wouldn’t be good for much, but you could do it.

I might be able to provide a more useful answer if you say more about what
you actually plan to use them for.


Reed

On Tue, Jan 16, 2018 at 6:27 PM lum gim fong  wrote:

> Anyone know what that is these days?
>
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