path to python file given module
Is there a way to get a relative or absolute path to a python file once it's been imported as a module? For example, I type: >>> import filegen and I want a string that represents the path to filegen.py (either relative to current working directory or the absolute path) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: path to python file given module
that method doesn't seem to work as well on UNIX:
wla apocalypse[94] ~/filegen > ls
filegen.py OLDwla_csv2objects.py wlaclasses.py
filegen.pyc templates/ wlaclasses.pyc
gen_all_from_csv.py test.py*
wla apocalypse[95] ~/filegen > python
...
>>> import filegen, inspect
>>> inspect.getsourcefile(filegen)
'filegen.py'
>>> inspect.getsourcefile(filegen.Lecture)
'wlaclasses.py'
>>> import os
>>> os.chdir('..')
>>> inspect.getsourcefile(filegen)
>>> print inspect.getsourcefile(filegen)
None
>>> print inspect.getsourcefile(filegen.Lecture)
None
--
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Re: path to python file given module
It works now. Thanks. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Cannot install readline in pythonbrew install of 3.3.0
Hi, I hope someone can help with this problem with pythonbrew on my mac running OS X 10.8.3 with updated Xcode and CLT. $PATH = /Users/Gene/.pythonbrew/bin:/Users/Gene/.pythonbrew/pythons/Python-3.3.0/bin:/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.7/bin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/sbin $PYTHONPATH = /Users/Gene/.pythonbrew/pythons/Python-3.3.0/lib The python 3.3.0 install using pythonbrew was made with default options and seems to be working okay but when I easy_install readline per ipython recommend: BTW, readline has been installed for the system python 2.7.3 on this Mac for over a year and works fine. Switched to Python-3.3.0 easy_install readline Searching for readline Reading http://pypi.python.org/simple/readline/ Reading http://github.com/ludwigschwardt/python-readline Reading http://www.python.org/ Best match: readline 6.2.4.1 Downloading http://pypi.python.org/packages/source/r/readline/readline-6.2.4.1.tar.gz#md5=578237939c81fdbc2c8334d168b17907 Processing readline-6.2.4.1.tar.gz Writing /var/folders/51/k4qphs517k3c9dv55_23b6j8gp/T/easy_install-ypwvg6/readline-6.2.4.1/setup.cfg Running readline-6.2.4.1/setup.py -q bdist_egg --dist-dir /var/folders/51/k4qphs517k3c9dv55_23b6j8gp/T/easy_install-ypwvg6/readline-6.2.4.1/egg-dist-tmp-9hwdkl In file included from /Users/Ceti/.pythonbrew/pythons/Python-3.3.0/include/python3.3m/Python.h:112:0, from Modules/3.x/readline.c:8: /Users/Ceti/.pythonbrew/pythons/Python-3.3.0/include/python3.3m/modsupport.h:29:1: warning: ‘PyArg_ParseTuple’ is an unrecognized format function type [-Wformat=] PyAPI_FUNC(int) PyArg_ParseTuple(PyObject *, const char *, ...) Py_FORMAT_PARSETUPLE(PyArg_ParseTuple, 2, 3); ^ /var/folders/51/k4qphs517k3c9dv55_23b6j8gp/T//ccEk88Hx.s:9:`_begidx(%rip)' is not a valid base/index expression /var/folders/51/k4qphs517k3c9dv55_23b6j8gp/T//ccEk88Hx.s:10:bad register name `%rax)' /var/folders/51/k4qphs517k3c9dv55_23b6j8gp/T//ccEk88Hx.s:20:`_endidx(%rip)' is not a valid base/index expression /var/folders/51/k4qphs517k3c9dv55_23b6j8gp/T//ccEk88Hx.s:21:bad register name `%rax)' /var/folders/51/k4qphs517k3c9dv55_23b6j8gp/T//ccEk88Hx.s:31:bad register name `%rdi' /var/folders/51/k4qphs517k3c9dv55_23b6j8gp/T//ccEk88Hx.s:48:bad register name `%r15' These "bad register name" errors stream for many pages then the install fails. Here's the last line of the install: error: Setup script exited with error: command 'gcc' failed with exit status 1 Any ideas? Thanks, Gene -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: what's so difficult about namespace?
On Nov 26, 1:29 am, Xah Lee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > comp.lang.lisp,comp.lang.functional,comp.lang.perl.misc,comp.lang.python,comp.lang.java.programmer > > 2008-11-25 > > Recently, Steve Yegge implemented Javascript in Emacs lisp, and > compared the 2 languages. > > http://steve-yegge.blogspot.com/http://code.google.com/p/ejacs/ > > One of his point is about emacs lisp's lack of namespace. > > Btw, there's a question i have about namespace that always puzzled me. > > In many languages, they don't have namespace and is often a well known > sour point for the lang. For example, Scheme has this problem up till > R6RS last year. PHP didn't have namespace for the past decade till > about this year. Javascript, which i only have working expertise, > didn't have namespace as he mentioned in his blog. Elisp doesn't have > name space and it is a well known major issue. > > Of languages that do have namespace that i have at least working > expertise: Mathematica, Perl, Python, Java. Knowing these langs > sufficiently well, i do not see anything special about namespace. The > _essence_ of namespace is that a char is choosen as a separator, and > the compiler just use this char to split/connect identifiers. > Although i have close to zero knowledge about compiler or parser, but > from a math point of view and my own 18 years of programing > experience, i cannot fathom what could possibly be difficult of > introducing or implementing a namespace mechanism into a language. I > do not understand, why so many languages that lacks so much needed > namespace for so long? If it is a social problem, i don't imagine they > would last so long. It must be some technical issue? > > Could any compiler expert give some explanation? > > Thanks. > > Xah > ∑http://xahlee.org/ > > ☄ When multiple existing systems are combined, namespaces provide a quick way to prevent name clashes. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: what's so difficult about namespace?
On Nov 26, 9:15 am, Xah Lee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Nov 26, 5:45 am, Joshua Cranmer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > i cannot fathom what could possibly be difficult of > > > introducing or implementing a namespace mechanism into a language. > > > Namespaces go to the very core of a language, name resolution. > > Retroactively adding such a feature is extremely difficult because there > > is a strong chance of accidentally breaking existing code. > > could you give some technical detail on this? > > i don't know compiler so am probably being foolish here... but i > suppose ultimately name resolution and storage at heart is something > like a hashtable... namely, > > put ‹identifier 1› table > put ‹identifier 2› table > > and lookup is just > > retrieve ‹identifier› table > > and now suppose we introduced namespace, so i imagine the compiler > simply just concat namespace component befor put, and split before > retrieve? > > Xah > ∑http://xahlee.org/ > > ☄ I'm sorry for the earlier post. I read your question too quickly. I've implemented a few research compilers; none in production. You're totally right in the case where the language has general nested lexical scoping. Namespaces just add an "outermost" scope. If you've done a good engineering job, the compiler change is trivial. In fact I added namespaces like this to an assembler that had lexical scoping. It took about an hour including writing a test suite. If you already have a bunch of compilers for a language like pre- namespace C or Javascript or Basic that doesn't allow for lexical scoping, then the addition is likely to be non-trivial because the implementation compiler language is often C and C programmers will tend to declare a single, global symbol table. So adding a separate outer scope involves hunting down all the global references and replacing them with references to the current namespace table. We can tut tut about this being bad design, but there you have it... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
If programming languages were religions...
very interesting http://www.aegisub.net/2008/12/if-programming-languages-were-religions.html "Python would be Humanism: It's simple, unrestrictive, and all you need to follow it is common sense. Many of the followers claim to feel relieved from all the burden imposed by other languages, and that they have rediscovered the joy of programming. There are some who say that it is a form of pseudo-code" compare to "Perl would be Voodoo - An incomprehensible series of arcane incantations that involve the blood of goats and permanently corrupt your soul. Often used when your boss requires you to do an urgent task at 21:00 on friday night." and others -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: C interpreter in Lisp/scheme/python
On Jun 13, 7:07 pm, bolega wrote: > I am trying to compare LISP/Scheme/Python for their expressiveness. > > For this, I propose a vanilla C interpreter. I have seen a book which > writes C interpreter in C. > > The criteria would be the small size and high readability of the code. > > Are there already answers anywhere ? > > How would a gury approach such a project ? Probably doesn't meet your intent, but this is a really impressive bit of (whacky) art: http://www.ioccc.org/1996/august.hint and find the code at http://www.ioccc.org/years-spoiler.html under 1996. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: "Strong typing vs. strong testing"
On Sep 30, 3:45 pm, RG wrote: > In article <7xr5gbxfry@ruckus.brouhaha.com>, > Paul Rubin wrote: > > > > > > > RG writes: > > > Yes, I know I could have used lint. But that misses the point. For any > > > static analyzer, because of the halting problem, I can construct a > > > program that either contains an error that the analyzer will not catch, > > > or for which the analyzer will produce a false positive. > > > Can you describe any plausible real-world programs where the effort of > > complicated static is justified, and for which the halting problem gets > > in the way of analysis? By "real world", I meanI wouldn't consider > > searching for counterexamples to the Collatz conjecture to qualify as > > sufficiently real-world and sufficiently complex for fancy static > > analysis. And even if it did, the static analyzer could deliver a > > partial result, like "this function either returns a counterexample to > > the Collatz conjecture or else it doesn't return". > > > D. Turner wrote a famous paper arguing something like the above, saying > > basically that Turing completeness of programming languages is > > overrated: > > > http://www.jucs.org/jucs_10_7/total_functional_programming > > > The main example of a sensible program that can't be written in a > > non-complete language is an interpreter for a Turing-complete language. > > But presumably a high-assurance application should never contain such a > > thing, since the interpreted programs themselves then wouldn't have > > static assurance. > > There are only two possibilities: either you have a finite-state > machine, or you have a Turning machine. (Well, OK, you could have a > pushdown automaton, but there are no programming languages that model a > PDA. Well, OK, there's Forth, but AFAIK there are no static type > checkers for Forth. Besides, who uses Forth? ;-) > > If you have a finite state machine everything is trivial. If you have a > Turing machine everything is generally impossible. This is an > oversimplification but not far from the fundamental underlying truth. > > My favorite practical example is the square root function. The standard > C library defines a square root function on floats (actually on > doubles), which is to say, over a finite-state model with 2^64 states. > The model is not well defined over half of that range (negative > numbers), which the static type checker cannot catch because there is no > such thing as an unsigned double. > > But the fun doesn't stop there. Doubles >= 0.0 are not the only thing > one might reasonably want to take a square root of, and indeed C++ > overloads sqrt to work on complex and valarray types in addition to > floats of various lengths (though you still have to manually keep track > of whether or not the argument to sqrt might be a negative real). But > what if I want an exact integer square root? Or a square root of a data > type that represents irrational numbers not as floating point > approximations but as exact symbolic representations? I haven't worked > out the details, but I'd be surprised if none of these variations turned > out to be Turing complete. > > The Turner paper is right on point: there's a fundamental distinction > between the (known) finite and the (potentially) infinite. In my > experience most of the cool interesting stuff has been found in the > latter domain, and trying to shoehorn the latter into the former is more > trouble then it's worth. > The FA or TM dichotomy is more painful to contemplate than you say. Making appropriate simplifications for input, any modern computer is a FA with 2^(a few trillion) states. Consequently, the gestalt of computer science seems to be to take it on faith that at some very large number of states, the FA behavior makes a transition to TM behavior for all possible practical purposes (and I mean all). So what is it--really--that's trivial to analyze? And what is impossible? I'm sorry this is drifting OT and will stop here. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Changing filenames from Greeklish => Greek (subprocess complain)
On Sunday 02 June 2013 13:10:30 Chris Angelico did opine: > On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at 2:21 AM, حéêüëلïٍ تïٌلٍ wrote: > > Paying for someone to just remove a dash to get the script working is > > too much to ask for > > One dash: 1c > Knowing where to remove it: $99.99 > Total bill: $100.00 > > Knowing that it ought really to be "utf8mb4" and giving hints that the > docs should be read rather than just taking this simple example and > plugging it in: Priceless. > > ChrisA Chuckle. Chris, I do believe you have topped yourself. Love it. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! My views <http://www.armchairpatriot.com/What%20Has%20America%20Become.shtml> Unnamed Law: If it happens, it must be possible. A pen in the hand of this president is far more dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of law-abiding citizens. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: RFD: rename comp.lang.python to comp.support.superhost
On Friday 14 June 2013 08:33:36 Roy Smith did opine: > In article > <8a333cd0-c1cf-4f41-ac49-65f0b23ed...@ow4g2000pbc.googlegroups.com>, > > alex23 wrote: > > On Jun 14, 2:24 am, حéêüëلïٍ تïٌلٍ wrote: > > > iam researchign a solution to this as we speak. > > > > Spamming endless "ZOMG HELP ME I'M INCOMPETENT" posts isn't > > "research". > > But it could be an argument. Did you just want the five minutes or the > full half hour? One old (78) farts take on this endless thread is that its a sign that those who had it made in Greece, before the bill for it came due, are now being forced to actually (gasp, a 4 letter word) "work" for a living, eg producing something of value to others. But, since you can take the boy out of the country, but you can't take the country out of the boy, he is still asking for someone else to not only translate his horribly broken english, but to do the work for him, gratis of course. In the meantime, it is difficult to define which of the 10,000 monkeys with keyboards is trying to do this since it seems the list is getting the output of a different keyboard every day. Cheers, Lurker Gene out -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: newbie question
On Saturday 22 June 2013 22:46:51 christheco...@gmail.com did opine: > Writing simple program asking a question with the answer being > "yes"...how do I allow the correct answer if user types Yes, yes, or > YES? > > Thanks AND each character coming in from the keyboard with $DF before adding it to the comparison buffer. Makes it all uppercase. Then compare it to the uppercase YES. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! My views <http://www.armchairpatriot.com/What%20Has%20America%20Become.shtml> Although golf was originally restricted to wealthy, overweight Protestants, today it's open to anybody who owns hideous clothing. -- Dave Barry A pen in the hand of this president is far more dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of law-abiding citizens. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Limit Lines of Output
On Tuesday 25 June 2013 17:47:22 Joshua Landau did opine:
> On 25 June 2013 21:22, Bryan Britten wrote:
> > Ah, I always forget to mention my OS on these forums. I'm running
> > Windows.
>
> Supposedly, Windows has "more"
> [http://superuser.com/questions/426226/less-or-more-in-windows],
Yes, but less is more than more.
> For Linux+less; this works:
>
> from subprocess import Popen, PIPE
> less = Popen("less", stdin=PIPE)
> less.stdin.write(b"\n".join("This is line number
> {}".format(i).encode("UTF-8") for i in range(1000)))
> less.wait()
Cheers, Gene
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up!
My views
<http://www.armchairpatriot.com/What%20Has%20America%20Become.shtml>
Campbell's Law:
Nature abhors a vacuous experimenter.
A pen in the hand of this president is far more
dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of
law-abiding citizens.
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Homework help requested (not what you think!)
On Thursday 18 July 2013 09:04:32 Albert van der Horst did opine:
> In article ,
>
> Chris Angelico wrote:
> >On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 8:43 AM, John Ladasky
> >
> > wrote:
> >> I think that they're disappointed when I show them how much they have
> >> to
> >
> >understand just to write a program that plays Tic Tac Toe.
> >
> >
> >The disillusionment of every novice programmer, I think. It starts out
> >as "I want to learn programming and make a game". Real programming is
> >more like "I can automate mundane tasks", which doesn't sound half as
> >exciting. But this is why I'm dubious of programming courses that
> >actually try to hold onto the "let's make a game" concept, because the
> >students are likely to get a bit of a let-down on realizing that it
> >really doesn't work that easily ("this is a two-week course, at the
> >end of it I should have written the next
> >for all my friends").
>
> Now comes the Forth experience.
>
> I did the following experiment with a psychology student, who had
> never been exposed to computers and had no prior experience. He
> aquired a Jupiter Ace, which has Forth as a built in language. So his
> only exposure was to Forth. Now I started to teach him programming,
> using the cartoon book "starting Forth". Once in a weeek we sat
> together and worked through some exercises.
>
> After 6 weeks he surprised me. He had programmed the game pong
> which is a simple table tennis like game, where you have to
> keep a ball in play.
> He never gave me a a chance to prevent him having a traumatic experience
> of failure by telling him that was not a task a novice should start.
> Or for that matter that such any real time programming requires
> considerable up front planning and design.
> [This was an adult, and at the time university students in the
> Netherlands were certified intelligent and skilled and disciplined
> in learning.]
>
> The lesson that is in there for you is to not hold your students back.
> They may surprise you!
>
> Groetjes Albert
>
I'll 2nd those thoughts, and tell 2 or 3 stories.
When the Timex 1000 was new, I bought one for my kids and turned them loose
with it. Within a week my 10 year old had composed a car graphic, and
written a small program to drive it around on the screen.
Back in a slightly newer time frame, Mr. Brodie's Forth, where you built
your own extensions to the language, was used for a time at a small CA
hospital as the hospitals accounting system, on a machine with only 64k of
dram. A TRS-80 Color Computer we now call the old grey ghost.
Fast forward 5 years from then, I wrote a program to work with a Grass
Valley Group 300-3A/B television video switcher, which you could teach to
do tricks, but it didn't have a means to save and reload them without
buying a $20,000 EDISK accessory package.
So I wrote one in Basic09, running on a Color Computer 2, still only 64k of
dram, based on a copy of the com protocol that had come with the switcher
when we had purchased it used from KTLA-TV. I wrote it on station time,
and sold the station the hardware at about what it was worth at the time
for a coco2 and 2 disk drives, $275. 14 years later as I was getting ready
to retire and no one else knew that switcher, it was replaced, and my 'E-
DISK' was no longer needed, so they gave it to me, so I still have it in my
'coco' collection in the basement.
Moral of course is never tell somebody it can't be done, he'll eat your
lunch by doing it. Oh, BTW, mine was 4x faster, and instead of a 2 hex
digit display for file names, gave the tech directors English filenames on
a small video screen. They loved it because each one could then have his
own personalized bag of video tricks to use during a news cast.
> >ChrisA
Cheers, Gene
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up!
My views
<http://www.armchairpatriot.com/What%20Has%20America%20Become.shtml>
Syntactic sugar causes cancer of the semicolon.
-- Epigrams in Programming, ACM SIGPLAN Sept. 1982
A pen in the hand of this president is far more
dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of
law-abiding citizens.
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: How to safely maintain a status file
On Thursday 12 July 2012 23:21:16 Steven D'Aprano did opine:
> On Fri, 13 Jul 2012 12:12:01 +1000, Chris Angelico wrote:
> > On Fri, Jul 13, 2012 at 11:20 AM, Rick Johnson
> >
> > wrote:
> >> On Jul 12, 2:39 pm, Christian Heimes wrote:
> >>> Windows's file system layer is not POSIX compatible. For example you
> >>> can't remove or replace a file while it is opened by a process.
> >>
> >> Sounds like a reasonable fail-safe to me.
>
> Rick has obviously never tried to open a file for reading when somebody
> else has it opened, also for reading, and discovered that despite
> Windows being allegedly a multi-user operating system, you can't
> actually have multiple users read the same files at the same time.
>
Chuckle. That was one of the 'features' that os9 on the trs-80 color
computer had back in the 80's, and it was clean and well done because of
the locking model the random block file manager had in OS9 for 6809 cpu's,
no relation to the Mac OS9 other than a similar name. That color computer
has a separate, text only video card I could plug in and display on an 80
column amber screen monitor.
When I wanted to impress the visiting frogs, I often did something I have
never been able to do on any other operating system since, start assembling
a long assembly language file on one of the screens on the color monitor,
hit the clear key to advance to the amber screen and start a listing on it
of the assemblers output listing file.
Because the file locking was applied only to the sector (256 bytes on that
machine) being written at the instant, the listing would fly by till it
caught up with the assemblers output, running into the lock and then
dutifully following along, one sector behind the assemblers output, until
the assembly was finished. That was in 1986 folks, and in the year of our
Lord 2012, 26 years later, I still cannot do that in linux. When I ask why
not, the replies seem to think I'm from outer space. Its apparently a
concept that is not even attempted to be understood by the linux code
carvers.
Something is drastically wrong with that picture IMO.
> (At least not unless the application takes steps to allow it.)
>
> Or tried to back-up files while some application has got them opened.
That in fact, ran me out of the amiga business in 1999, a 30Gb drive failed
on my full blown 040 + 64 megs of dram A2000. When the warranty drive
arrived is when I found that due to file locks on the startup files, all of
them involved with the booting of that machine, my high priced Diavolo Pro
backup tapes didn't contain a single one of those files. The linux box
with Red Hat 5.0 on it that I had built in late 1998 to see what linux was
all about found space under that desk yet that evening and I never looked
back.
> Or
> open a file while an anti-virus scanner is oh-so-slowly scanning it.
>
> Opening files for exclusive read *by default* is a pointless and silly
> limitation. It's also unsafe: if a process opens a file for exclusive
> read, and then dies, *no other process* can close that file.
>
> At least on POSIX systems, not even root can override a mandatory
> exclusive lock (it would be pretty pointless if it could), so a rogue or
> buggy program could wreck havoc with mandatory exclusive file locks.
> That's why Linux, by default, treats exclusive file locks as advisory
> (cooperative), not mandatory.
>
> In general, file locking is harder than it sounds, with many traps for
> the unwary, and of course the semantics are dependent on both the
> operating system and the file system.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_locking
>
> > POSIX says that files and file names are independent. I can open a
> > file based on its name, delete the file based on its name, and still
> > have the open file there. When it's closed, it'll be wiped from the
> > disk.
>
> One neat trick is to open a file, then delete it from disk while it is
> still open. So long as your process is still running, you can write to
> this ghost file, as normal, but no other process can (easily) see it.
> And when your process ends, the file contents is automatically deleted.
>
> This is remarkably similar to what Python does with namespaces and
> dicts:
>
> # create a fake "file system"
> ns = {'a': [], 'b': [], 'c': []}
> # open a file
> myfile = ns['a']
> # write to it
> myfile.append('some data')
> # delete it from the "file system"
> del ns['a']
> # but I can still read and write to it
> myfile.append('more data')
> print(myfile[0])
> # but anyone else will get an error if they try
> another_file = ns['a']
Cheers, Gene
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up!
You just wait, I'll sin till I blow up!
-- Dylan Thomas
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Gender, Representativeness and Reputation in StackOverflow
On Monday 23 July 2012 19:42:29 Alexander Serebrenik did opine: > 1) The paper referenced contains 4 pages, so it should be available via > IEEXplore. Moreover, you can find a copy on > http://www.win.tue.nl/~aserebre/MSR2012.pdf > > 2) Since the survey is only one of the techniques we intend to use, and > it will be augmented by analysing the data publicly available in the SE > dump, I believe the selection bias is appropriately addressed. I think you are missing the point, Alexander. From my limited reading here as I lurk, you seem to taking freely available data and putting it behind the infamous IEEE paywall. If that isn't the case, I apologize. That sort of thing will always tend to chase the folks who could probably make the best use of it, away. I could well be full of it, but that is how this now old man who has been chasing electrons and making them do work useful for me and my employers for the last 62 years, sees and tastes my experiences with IEEE. Its a bad taste in my mouth every time we meet. If you think I'm kidding about the years above, I had fingerprints on the pcb's of the two tv cameras that were on the Trieste when it, Lt. Walsh and Jacques Cousteau went down into the mohole in Feb. 1960. That, and $1.32 will get you a 16 oz cup of coffee to go at my local 7-11. :) Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! Faster, faster, you fool, you fool! -- Bill Cosby -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Arithmetic with Boolean values
On Sunday 12 August 2012 20:27:13 Alister did opine: > On Sun, 12 Aug 2012 19:20:26 +0100, Mark Lawrence wrote: > > On 12/08/2012 17:59, Paul Rubin wrote: > >>> which can be simplified to: > >> > >>> for x in range(len(L)//2 + len(L)%2): > >> for x in range(sum(divmod(len(L), 2))): ... > > > > So who's going to be first in with "and thou shalt not count to 4..."? > > Five is right out Can some smart ass (like me) suggest 69! If it doesn't get summarily tossed, it could take a week or so to run. :-) Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! e-credibility: the non-guaranteeable likelihood that the electronic data you're seeing is genuine rather than somebody's made-up crap. -- Karl Lehenbauer -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Obnoxious postings from Google Groups (was: datetime issue)
On Sunday 16 September 2012 12:08:47 pandora.ko...@gmail.com did opine: > Whaen i tried to post just now by hitting sumbit, google groups told me > that the following addresssed has benn found in this thread! i guess is > used them all to notify everything! > > cdf072b2-7359-4417-b1e4-d984e4317...@googlegroups.com > mailman.774.1347735926.27098.python-l...@python.org > nikos.gr...@gmail.com Look, this googlegroups thing acting as a spam gateway has long since gotten old. Whatever agent/program you are using must be a busted windows application because it is not showing you the last line of every post that comes through the list server which is: <http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list> There is, immediately above that line a '-- ' (note the space after, and its always after a linefeed or carriage return so its the first character of a line, and its code to all sane email agents that anything below it is a signature and not to be copied into a reply. Windows email tends to clip it off and a windows user will never see it! So that is why many of us lament, in long strings of expletives, the brokenness of windows email agents. Subscribing to the mailing list is a 2 step process. First you click on the above link and fill out the form and "submit" it. That will, in a minute or so, cause an email to be sent to the address you used in the form. You MUST reply to that message to confirm the subscription. Whatever email agent you use from there is up to you, but I'd suggest Thunderbird. I personally am partial to kmail, but then I'm running linux on everything here, no M$ stuff allowed on the premises. Its not open for discussion and has not been in 28 years since I discovered the trs-80 color computer and an operating system for it called OS9. Sorry folks, my rant for the day because of that gateway. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! Succumb to natural tendencies. Be hateful and boring. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Obnoxious postings from Google Groups (was: datetime issue)
On Sunday 16 September 2012 12:29:39 pandora.ko...@gmail.com did opine: > > > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list > > > > email client to python-list@python.org > > wait a minute! i must use my ISP's news server and then post o > comp.lang.python no? No. > What is python-list@python.org how can i post there? Install thunderbird. Its a real email agent, even on a windows box. But first you must subscribe as I discussed in a previous msg. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! Q: How was Thomas J. Watson buried? A: 9 edge down. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: subprocess call is not waiting.
On Wednesday 19 September 2012 11:56:44 Hans Mulder did opine: > On 19/09/12 12:26:30, andrea crotti wrote: > > 2012/9/18 Dennis Lee Bieber : > >> Unless you have a really massive result set from that "ls", > >> that > >> > >> command probably ran so fast that it is blocked waiting for someone > >> to read the PIPE. > > > > I tried also with "ls -lR /" and that definitively takes a while to > > run, when I do this: > > > > proc = subprocess.Popen(['ls', '-lR', '/'], stdout=subprocess.PIPE, > > stderr=subprocess.PIPE) > > > > nothing is running, only when I actually do > > proc.communicate() > > > > I see the process running in top.. > > Is it still an observation problem? > > Yes: using "top" is an observation problem. > > "Top", as the name suggests, shows only the most active processes. > Which is why I run htop in a shell 100% of the time. With htop, you can scroll down and see everything. > It's quite possible that your 'ls' process is not active, because > it's waiting for your Python process to read some data from the pipe. > > Try using "ps" instead. Look in thte man page for the correct > options (they differ between platforms). The default options do > not show all processes, so they may not show the process you're > looking for. > > > Anyway I also need to know when the process is over while waiting, so > > probably a thread is the only way.. > > This sounds confused. > > You don't need threads. When 'ls' finishes, you'll read end-of-file > on the proc.stdout pipe. You should then call proc.wait() to reap > its exit status (if you don't, you'll leave a zombie process). > Since the process has already finished, the proc.wait() call will > not actually do any waiting. > > > Hope this helps, > > -- HansM Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! To know Edina is to reject it. -- Dudley Riggs, "The Year the Grinch Stole the Election" -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: A desperate lunge for on-topic-ness
On Thursday 18 October 2012 18:40:52 Grant Edwards did opine: > On 2012-10-18, Den wrote: > > On Wednesday, October 17, 2012 11:06:43 PM UTC-7, Zero Piraeus wrote: > >> What are people's preferred strategies for dealing with lines that go > > > >> over 79 characters? A few I can think of off the bat: > > I personally just keep typing until my statement is finished. This > > is my program, not PEP's. > > > > But I have to say I'm amused by the whole question, and others > > related to PEP8. A quick aside, the width of our roads all go back > > to the width of a two horse rig. The suggested maximum of 80 > > characters goes back to teletype machines, and IBM cards, and > > character based terminals > > > > Should that really be the basis for a suggested style now? > > You don't expect me to through my Heathkit H19 terminal in the trash, > do you? :) Or me to delete the vt-220 I wrote to run on a TRS-80 Color Computer running OS-9 for an OS, 20 years ago when the Dec made one ate its H.O.T. & Dec would not sell me a H.O.T. since it was over 5 years old and wanted $2995 for brand new vt-550 (with no guarantee it would be compatible)? That, and their field service engineers inability to fix a crashing hourly or more PDP-11/723a amply explains why DEC is no longer with us. That single obstinate computer made the CBS tv network design a new system and distribute it gratis to every network affiliate they had, somewhere around 125 stations, at a cost of at least 10G's a station. Screw that. I had better things to than throw more good money after bad. So did CBS at the time. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! How sharper than a hound's tooth it is to have a thankless serpent. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: A desperate lunge for on-topic-ness
On Sunday 21 October 2012 07:02:26 Steven D'Aprano did opine: > On Sat, 20 Oct 2012 14:18:47 +, Grant Edwards wrote: > > On 2012-10-20, Dennis Lee Bieber wrote: > >>Strangely, we've gone from 80-character fixed width displays to > >> > >> who-knows-what (if I drop my font size I can probably get nearly 200 > >> characters across in full-screen mode)... > >> > >>But at the same time we've gone from 132-character line-printers > >> > >> using fan-fold 11x17 pages, to office inkjet/laser printers using > >> 8.5x11 paper, defaulting to portrait orientation -- with a 10 > >> character/inch font, and 1/4" left/right margins, we're back to 80 > >> character limitation > >> > >> > >> > > True, but nobody prints source code out on paper do they? > > I do. > > There's nothing better than spreading out a dozen sheets of source code > over a table to get a good, high-level overview of what does what in > preparation to refactoring it. > > > Seriously -- I can't remember the last time I printed souce code... > > I've never printed souce code either *wink* So do I, but I often am looking at assembler listings with the assembler set for 132 chars a line to preserve the src codes comments, so lp gets a use 17 cpi option on the cli that makes the listing. I probably recycle 2 reams of paper a year doing exactly that. Those who won't take advantage of that are doomed to publish buggy code. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! Not all men who drink are poets. Some of us drink because we aren't poets. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Where are documentation for Gnome
On Sunday 28 October 2012 16:45:12 GangGreene did opine: > On Sun, 28 Oct 2012 16:29:07 +, Mark Lawrence wrote: > > On 13/10/2012 18:49, Santosh Kumar wrote: > > > > > > Try your local garden centre. > > I inquired at the local garden centre, Just got strange looks > > Are you sure that is the correct place? ;) I think I'll stick around and see where this goes... Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! Be careful what you set your heart on -- for it will surely be yours. -- James Baldwin, "Nobody Knows My Name" -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Spam source (Re: Horror Horror Horror!!!!!)
On Sunday 18 November 2012 21:18:16 Robert Miles did opine: > On Sunday, November 18, 2012 1:35:00 PM UTC-6, Terry Reedy wrote: > > The question was raised as to how much spam comes from googlegroups. > > > > Not all, but more that half, I believe. This one does. > > > > > > > > From: MoneyMaker > > > > ... > > > > Message-ID: <2d2a0b98-c587-4459-9489-680b1ddc4...@googlegroups.com> > > That depends on your definition of spam. This one does not appear to be > trying to sell anything, and therefore does not meet some of the > stricter definitions. Definitely off-topic, though. Not withstanding, it was fed to sa-learn -spam here. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! Only God can make random selections. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Tcl wasn't installed properly
On Friday 07 December 2012 02:25:33 bhargavigosw...@gmail.com did opine: > I faced the same problem during my last installation of ns2.35 in ubuntu > 11.04. After I install ns2.35, got message of successful installation > of ns. Then I set path in /.bashrc. Then I gave ns command which gave > me same error which you got. > > The problem is because, ns executable is also at /usr which is > conflicting. > Than change the order in your $PATH, or better yet, do as below, because the $PATH is normally ordered to find locally installed stuff first. > Solution: > 1. Go to location root-usr-local-bin by giving following command in > terminal cd /usr/local/bin > 2. There you would find the ns file. We just need to remove it by giving > following command rm ns > 3. Thats it, you are done. Now your ns starts running successfully. > > Happy Learning. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! BOFH excuse #276: U.S. Postal Service I was taught to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder to find any... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Is there a quick & accurate way to test a python install?
Greetings;
I had an app that is a heavy user of python crash on exit earlier today,
and ever since, the app complains it can't find something in the python
tree, and eventually the app exits.
The leading few lines of the dmesg report are:
Starting LinuxCNC...
redis server started as: 'redis-server ', logging to: /dev/null
(time=1355621147.276382,pid=5133): Registering server on TCP port 5005.
(time=1355621147.276602,pid=5133): running server for TCP port 5005
(connection_socket = 3).
io started
iocontrol: machine: 'my-lathe' version 'unknown'
halcmd loadusr io started
task pid=5195
task: machine: 'my-lathe' version 'unknown'
emcTaskOnce: Python plugin configuredemcTaskOnce: extract(task_instance):
KeyError: ('task',)
emcTaskOnce: no Python Task() instance available, using default iocontrol-
based task methods
waiting for s.axes
waiting for s.axes
waiting for s.axes
waiting for s.axes
waiting for s.axes
waiting for s.axes
waiting for s.axes
waiting for s.axes
waiting for s.axes
A configuration error is preventing LinuxCNC from starting.
Then it throws several stanza's of unload messages, culmination in a
SEGMENTATION FAULT.
How can I check & see if my python install if alive?
Thanks.
Cheers, Gene
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up!
Restaurant package, not for resale.
I was taught to respect my elders, but its getting
harder and harder to find any...
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is there a quick & accurate way to test a python install?
On Saturday 15 December 2012 21:19:37 Terry Reedy did opine: > On 12/15/2012 8:38 PM, Gene Heskett wrote: > > see > 26.11.2. I'm not a python guru, Terry, so you will have to expand on this 26.11.2. Thanks > Running tests using the command-line interface > for your version. Note that there are a few errors all the time, at > least when testing a user installation on windows, and you will have to > hit return a few times to go past some tests meant to raise errors. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! For gin, in cruel Sober truth, Supplies the fuel For flaming youth. -- Noel Coward I was taught to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder to find any... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is there a quick & accurate way to test a python install?
On Saturday 15 December 2012 21:52:00 Terry Reedy did opine: > On 12/15/2012 9:21 PM, Gene Heskett wrote: > > On Saturday 15 December 2012 21:19:37 Terry Reedy did opine: > >> On 12/15/2012 8:38 PM, Gene Heskett wrote: > >> > >> see > >> 26.11.2. > > > > I'm not a python guru, Terry, so you will have to expand on this > > 26.11.2. > > http://docs.python.org/3/library/test.html#running-tests-using-the-comma > nd-line-interface This is 2.6, on ubuntu-10.04.4 LTS > 3.x on command line: python -m test > "Under the hood, it uses test.regrtest; the call python -m test.regrtest > used in previous Python versions [ie, 2.x] still works)." > > Followed by more options and os specifics. It is also possible to run > interactively. 'import test; test.main()' may do it, but it have been > awhile and is not documented. I googled and found something like that, but the machine thats bad throws the same error stanza as one that seems to work. From the machine with the problem: gene@lathe:/usr/lib/python2.6/test$ python -m test.regrtest test_grammar test_grammar skipped -- No module named test_grammar test_opcodes test_opcodes skipped -- No module named test_opcodes test_dict test_dict skipped -- No module named test_dict test_builtin test_builtin skipped -- No module named test_builtin test_exceptions test_exceptions skipped -- No module named test_exceptions test_types test_types skipped -- No module named test_types test_unittest test_unittest skipped -- No module named test_unittest test_doctest test_doctest skipped -- No module named test_doctest test_doctest2 test_doctest2 skipped -- No module named test_doctest2 9 tests skipped: test_builtin test_dict test_doctest test_doctest2 test_exceptions test_grammar test_opcodes test_types test_unittest Traceback (most recent call last): File "/usr/lib/python2.6/runpy.py", line 122, in _run_module_as_main "__main__", fname, loader, pkg_name) File "/usr/lib/python2.6/runpy.py", line 34, in _run_code exec code in run_globals File "/usr/lib/python2.6/test/regrtest.py", line 1199, in main() File "/usr/lib/python2.6/test/regrtest.py", line 423, in main e = _ExpectedSkips() File "/usr/lib/python2.6/test/regrtest.py", line 1112, in __init__ from test import test_timeout ImportError: cannot import name test_timeout gene@lathe:/usr/lib/python2.6/test$ I think that looks identical to this machine, given the identical command line. Any other ideas, or is the above all foobar? Thanks Terry. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! Drinking coffee for instant relaxation? That's like drinking alcohol for instant motor skills. -- Marc Price I was taught to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder to find any... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is there a quick & accurate way to test a python install?
On Saturday 15 December 2012 22:07:54 Terry Reedy did opine: > On 12/15/2012 9:21 PM, Gene Heskett wrote: > > On Saturday 15 December 2012 21:19:37 Terry Reedy did opine: > >> On 12/15/2012 8:38 PM, Gene Heskett wrote: > >> > >> see > >> 26.11.2. > > > > I'm not a python guru, Terry, so you will have to expand on this > > 26.11.2. > > http://docs.python.org/3/library/test.html#running-tests-using-the-comma > nd-line-interface > > 3.x on command line: python -m test > "Under the hood, it uses test.regrtest; the call python -m test.regrtest > used in previous Python versions [ie, 2.x] still works)." > > Followed by more options and os specifics. It is also possible to run > interactively. 'import test; test.main()' may do it, but it have been > awhile and is not documented. Ok, from that docs page: root@coyote:/usr/lib/python2.6/test# python -m test -h /usr/bin/python: test is a package and cannot be directly executed Same return on all 3 machines. ?? Thanks Terry. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! I prefer the most unjust peace to the most righteous war. -- Cicero Even peace may be purchased at too high a price. -- Poor Richard I was taught to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder to find any... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is there a quick & accurate way to test a python install?
On Sunday 16 December 2012 01:33:35 Terry Reedy did opine: > On 12/15/2012 9:59 PM, Gene Heskett wrote: > > This is 2.6, on ubuntu-10.04.4 LTS > > > > gene@lathe:/usr/lib/python2.6/test$ python -m test.regrtest > > That should be the right incantation for 2.6. > > > test_grammar > > test_grammar skipped -- No module named test_grammar > > test_opcodes > > test_opcodes skipped -- No module named test_opcodes > > test_dict > > test_dict skipped -- No module named test_dict > > test_builtin > > You appear to have some of /Lib/test/ present, including > Lib/test/regrtest.py, but not move of the test_xxx.py files. I do not > know what is normal for an Ubuntu distribution. On Windows, I believe it > is all or nothing. /usr/lib/test? gene@lathe:/usr/lib/python2.6$ locate lib/test /opt/libreoffice3.5/program/python-core-2.6.1/lib/idlelib/testcode.py /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/launchpadlib/testing /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/launchpadlib/tests /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/launchpadlib/testing/__init__.py /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/launchpadlib/testing/__init__.pyc /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/launchpadlib/testing/helpers.py /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/launchpadlib/testing/helpers.pyc /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/launchpadlib/tests/__init__.py /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/launchpadlib/tests/__init__.pyc /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/launchpadlib/tests/test_launchpad.py /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/launchpadlib/tests/test_launchpad.pyc There are half a dozen or more branches of the python tree that claim to have test things, but the universal answer is: gene@lathe:/usr/lib/python2.6$ cd /usr/share/pyshared/numpy/lib/tests gene@lathe:/usr/share/pyshared/numpy/lib/tests$ python -m test -uall /usr/bin/python: test is a package and cannot be directly executed I have installed several more python 'likely suspects' but have not changed a thing in the results. > > > ImportError: cannot import name test_timeout > > I have no idea why this one gave an exception rather than a skip. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! Human kind cannot bear very much reality. -- T. S. Eliot, "Four Quartets: Burnt Norton" I was taught to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder to find any... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is there a quick & accurate way to test a python install?
On Sunday 16 December 2012 14:55:53 Terry Reedy did opine: > On 12/16/2012 6:22 AM, Gene Heskett wrote: > > On Sunday 16 December 2012 01:33:35 Terry Reedy did opine: > >> You appear to have some of /Lib/test/ present, including > >> Lib/test/regrtest.py, but not move of the test_xxx.py files. I do not > >> know what is normal for an Ubuntu distribution. On Windows, I believe > >> it is all or nothing. > > > > /usr/lib/test? > > No. I am on Windows and by /Lib I mean the directory containing > Python-coded stdlib modules. It is on sys.path. For me, the path entry > is 'C:\\Programs\\Python33\\lib'. (Windows paths are case indifferent > for matching.) /test is one of several package subdirectories in /Lib. Nothing even remotely related in the linux /lib tree: gene@coyote:/$ ls -lR /lib|grep test -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 6592 2010-07-27 13:58 raid6test.ko drwxr-xr-x 2 root root 4096 2010-07-27 23:16 tests /lib/modules/2.6.32-122-rtai/kernel/drivers/mtd/tests: -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 14752 2010-07-27 13:58 mtd_oobtest.ko -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 12668 2010-07-27 13:58 mtd_pagetest.ko -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 7260 2010-07-27 13:58 mtd_readtest.ko -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 10304 2010-07-27 13:58 mtd_speedtest.ko -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 8552 2010-07-27 13:58 mtd_stresstest.ko -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 12220 2010-07-27 13:58 mtd_subpagetest.ko -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 13336 2010-07-27 13:58 mtd_torturetest.ko -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 5816 2010-07-27 13:58 rtc-test.ko -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 6968 2010-07-27 13:58 comedi_test.ko -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 29556 2010-07-27 13:59 usbtest.ko I knew there was a certain amount of isolation between the windows version and the linux version, but this seems total, so perhaps someone actually running linux can chip in here, with suggestions that are valid for the linux version? Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! There is no sincerer love than the love of food. -- George Bernard Shaw I was taught to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder to find any... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
License status of pycollada?
Greetings all; Trying to collect all the dependencies of FreeCad-0.13, but it appears that pycollada is behind some sort of a login/paywall on github. Is anyone here familiar with how that works? Thanks. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! My views <http://www.armchairpatriot.com/What%20Has%20America%20Become.shtml> Mr. Cole's Axiom: The sum of the intelligence on the planet is a constant; the population is growing. I was taught to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder to find any... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: License status of pycollada?
On Tuesday 08 January 2013 14:09:55 Jeff Terrace did opine: Message additions Copyright Tuesday 08 January 2013 by Gene Heskett > Hi Gene, > > I'm the maintainer of pycollada. No such paywall exists, and a login is > not required. I'm not sure how you came across that. > Google search. > As Chris said, it's a standard BSD license. I'd be happy to help with > packaging, so feel free to contact me. It doesn't seem to be that important at the moment. I did find the src tarball later on another site, but it bails out because something is missing, gene@coyote:~/src/pycollada-0.4$ python setup.py Traceback (most recent call last): File "setup.py", line 2, in from setuptools import find_packages, setup ImportError: No module named setuptools I should go look for setuptools. matplotlib also fails to configure, numpy is a version too old on 10.04.4 Ubuntu, with no update for it available for that old a Ubuntu. 10.04.4 LTS only has 1.3, so I am blocked there too. ATM, no biggie. Thanks for the email. I'm going to go make some swarf freehand. > Jeff Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! My views <http://www.armchairpatriot.com/What%20Has%20America%20Become.shtml> The possession of a book becomes a substitute for reading it. -- Anthony Burgess I was taught to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder to find any... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Algorithm. Tony Gaddis book 2 Starting python3
On Sunday 27 January 2013 13:05:27 george...@talktalk.net did opine: Message additions Copyright Sunday 27 January 2013 by Gene Heskett > Hi > Question 3 Chp2 Page 76 > Adds2 to a and assigns the result to b. > I have several attemtps,would like to check my answer.help please > At 80 i need all the help i can find. > Thanks George Smart Darn, I've just been dethroned from my resident oldest fart on this list throne, I'm only 78. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> is up! My views <http://www.armchairpatriot.com/What%20Has%20America%20Become.shtml> Thyme's Law: Everything goes wrong at once. I was taught to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder to find any... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: TEST AN EXECUTABLE PYTHON SCRIPT SPEED UNDER A PYTHON SHELL
On Thursday, February 16, 2012 08:40:04 PM Arnaud Delobelle did opine: > On 16 February 2012 21:10, Prasad, Ramit wrote: > >>> When you reply to a known bot, please include some indication of the > >>> fact, so we know your message can be ignored as well. > >> > >>Sometimes I wonder about 8. Is there a real person there, as well > >>as the bot? A lot of his/its > >> > > posts look too intelligent to be computer-generated - or maybe I'm > > underestimating the quality of AI. > > > > I was wondering the exact same thing. > > I think it may be that what you are underestimating is your ability, > as a human being, to create meaning where there is none. Ouch! Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> Why do seagulls live near the sea? 'Cause if they lived near the bay, they'd be called baygulls. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Questionnaire on motivation analysis of open source and open content
On Wednesday, February 22, 2012 03:14:51 PM George Tsinarakis did opine: > Dear Sirs, > > We are researchers in Technical University of Crete and our current > research is in the field of motivation analysis of open source and open > content software projects participants. We would like to ask you to fill > a questionnaire and forward it to people involved in such teams and > projects. The web address is the following: > > https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/viewform?formkey=dHdqZUgyay0waXNRbW > FvV3hleVBZSWc6MQ > > All personal information will be kept confidential and will be used for > academic purposes only. For further information please do not hesitate > to contact with us. > > > > Thank you in advance > > Dr G. Tsinarakis (*&^%(*%$ phishing folks never give up... Nuke that subscription forthwith, with extreme prejudice. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> "We can't schedule an orgy, it might be construed as fighting" --Stanley Sutton -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: is this foolish?
On Thursday, April 12, 2012 10:40:47 AM Tim Golden did opine: > On 12/04/2012 10:35, Cameron Simpson wrote: > > I've found myself using a Python gotcha as a feature. > Tim: your setup of using the CC: line for every thing with a blank To: line is landing your posts in my spam folder. Do you have a specific reason for not using a To: line? I am not inclined to change my filer rules because that particular rule catches a lot of the incoming spam. > Have a look at Peter Inglesby's lightning talk from a > recent London Python Dojo: > > http://inglesp.github.com/2012/03/24/mutable-default-arguments.html > > TJG Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: <http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene> He who invents adages for others to peruse takes along rowboat when going on cruise. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Lisp refactoring puzzle
On Tuesday, July 12, 2011 02:08:02 PM Terry Reedy did opine: > On 7/11/2011 11:37 PM, Xah Lee wrote: > > watch the first episode of Douglas Crockford's talk here: > > http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/theater/video.php?v=crockonjs-1 > > The link includes a transcript of the talk, which I read > > I suspect Lee likes Crockford because they both think they are smarter > than everyone else. Writing about Smalltalk, for instance, Crockford > says: > > "I don't know why it is, but a lot of programmers just couldn't get used > to this syntax. [everything is done by sending a message with arguments > to some object] ...So this may be a superior notation, but it was > profoundly rejected. By who? By us, by the programmers, because we > couldn't understand it." > > Actually, I and others see Smalltalk as deeply flawed because its > message passing syntax arbitrarily breaks symmetries in operations. For > instance, in the expression 'a+b', both operands have equivalent roles > in the operation for all normal interpretations of '+'.# On the other > hand, in the expression 'a.extend(b)', where a is a list and b any > iterable and the result is to mutate a but not b, a and b have very > different roles in both the operation and the expression that invokes > it. > > # Under the covers, Python implements 'a+b' as first 'a.__add__(b)', but > it also tries 'b.__radd__(a)' if the first does not work. This > introduces a slight asymmetry in that a gets first say at defining the > meaning of 'a+b', but it does not get the only say. And, as far as I can > presently remember, this asymmetry is never visible with builtins. In > fact, this implementation makes it possible for 'a+b' and 'b+a' to both > give the same answer when a is a builtin and b is a user-class instance. > > Crockford is right that he does not 'know why it is' that not everyone > loves Smalltalk. He should have stopped there instead of projecting his > ignorance on everyone else. > I have my own reasons to hate smalltalk but won't elaborate. > As a side note, the same principle of expressions matching operations in > symmetry suggest that majority of up are quite sensible and not dumb > idiots for preferring 'f(x)' to the '(f x)' of Lisp. In a function call, > the function has a different role than the arguments, so it is > appropriate that it have a different role in the expression. Which should be well documented if one expects the programmers to use it properly. So far, I have only found two languages that are adequately defined and implemented. K&R C, and the now essentially defunct Amiga ARexx. But I should preface that by saying that I have not yet adequately studied python, one of the reasons I joined this list. Specifically, I am trying to install the altera quartus software so I can program one of their DE1 boards, but because the majority of the linux distro's have not kept their repo's zlib packages up to date, one of the quartus imports, gzdirect is on the missing list and I am dead in the water until I install zlib version 1.2.5. I hope this list serves me as a tutorial to fill in the gaps of my python knowledge which at the moment seem too wide to jump over. I hope I can ask intelligent, if newbie, questions occasionally. Now, I hate to mention it Terry, but your clock seems to be about 126 months behind the rest of the world. Does your system not run ntpd by default? The date in the header from your machine is "Mon Jan 1 14:11:11 2001". Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) What makes us so bitter against people who outwit us is that they think themselves cleverer than we are. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Lisp refactoring puzzle
On Wednesday, July 13, 2011 05:34:23 AM Terry Reedy did opine: > On 7/12/2011 2:23 PM, gene heskett wrote: > > Now, I hate to mention it Terry, but your clock seems to be about 126 > > months behind the rest of the world. > > Please do not hate to be helpful. It was a bad malfunction perhaps due > to a run-down battery on a machine turned off for two weeks. I will keep > watch to see if it happens again overnight. > > > Does your system not run ntpd by default? > > Is that *nix or Windows? That's a *nix name. I have no clue what winderz might call it as I've only ever had one winderz machine here. My laptop had a copy of XP on it when I bought it years ago, shrunk it to 10Gb and let it live for about 6 months, but its had several fedora's, 2 different MDV installs, and now PCLos on it after discovering the windows bcm4318 driver was a bigger POS than the current linux driver. Everything else here is either 25 years old & running nitros9, or some flavor of *buntu LTS. IOW, all my windows are glass. ;-) > My XP system only checks the net time > automatically once a week and refused to update at first on request > because the dates did not match. Typically windows stupidity. If I click > 'Update from internet', it should believe that I really mean it. Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Swap read error. You lose your mind. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Functional style programming in python: what will you talk about if you have an hour on this topic?
On Wednesday, July 13, 2011 09:38:26 AM Anthony Kong did opine: > (My post did not appear in the mailing list, so this is my second try. > Apology if it ends up posted twice) > Actually, it did, but gmail, in its infinite wisdom, thinks an echo of your post to a mailing list is a duplicate, and deletes it. For this exact reason, I only use gmail for two or 3 of the nearly 40 lists I'm on. [...] Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) He is considered a most graceful speaker who can say nothing in the most words. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: a little parsing challenge ☺
On Sunday, July 17, 2011 10:12:27 AM Xah Lee did opine:
> 2011-07-16
>
> folks, this one will be interesting one.
>
> the problem is to write a script that can check a dir of text files
> (and all subdirs) and reports if a file has any mismatched matching
> brackets.
>
> • The files will be utf-8 encoded (unix style line ending).
>
> • If a file has mismatched matching-pairs, the script will display the
> file name, and the line number and column number of the first
> instance where a mismatched bracket occures. (or, just the char number
> instead (as in emacs's “point”))
>
> • the matching pairs are all single unicode chars. They are these and
> nothing else: () {} [] “” ‹› «» 【】 〈〉 《》 「」 『』
> Note that ‘single curly quote’ is not consider matching pair here.
>
> • You script must be standalone. Must not be using some parser tools.
> But can call lib that's part of standard distribution in your lang.
>
> Here's a example of mismatched bracket: ([)], (“[[”), ((, 】etc. (and
> yes, the brackets may be nested. There are usually text between these
> chars.)
>
> I'll be writing a emacs lisp solution and post in 2 days. Ι welcome
> other lang implementations. In particular, perl, python, php, ruby,
> tcl, lua, Haskell, Ocaml. I'll also be able to eval common lisp
> (clisp) and Scheme lisp (scsh), Java. Other lang such as Clojure,
> Scala, C, C++, or any others, are all welcome, but i won't be able to
> eval it. javascript implementation will be very interesting too, but
> please indicate which and where to install the command line version.
>
> I hope you'll find this a interesting “challenge”. This is a parsing
> problem. I haven't studied parsers except some Wikipedia reading, so
> my solution will probably be naive. I hope to see and learn from your
> solution too.
>
> i hope you'll participate. Just post solution here. Thanks.
>
> Xah
This is a very old solution, some of it nearly 30 years old.
Written in C, the trick is in doing it in python I guess.
==begin cntx.c===
/*^k^s
.ds2
.hb
.fb^k^s^b Cntx.c, page #^k^s^b
*
* *
* CC (C Checker) *
* *
* C Source Brackets, Parenthesis, brace,*
*quote and comment Checker *
* *
*T. Jennings -- Sometime in 1983 *
*Slightly tweaked and renamed MINILINT *
* KAB Aug 84 *
*Ported to OS9 and further tweaked *
* Brian Paquette March 91 *
* Brackets, single, double quote counters added*
* & renamed Cntx 04/09/91*
* by Gene Heskett *
* *
* some additional code for ignoring "syntax" chars inside of *
* double quoted strings added 3/21/93 by Gene Heskett *
* same for single quoted stuffs 7/10/93 by Gene Heskett*
* And long lines handling ability added too.*
* Adding tab ignorers and a counter to tally how many 11/21/93 *
/
#define OS9 /* used for nested comment handling*/
/* comment out for non OS9/6809*/
#include
#include
#include
#define FALSE 0
#define TRUE 1
#ifdef OS9
#define NO " No "
#define YES " Yes "
char *cmnt;
#endif
/* Very crude but very effective C source debugger. Counts the numbers of
matching braces, parentheses and comments, and displays them at the left
edge of the screen. The best way to see what it does is to do it; try
cntx -v cntx.c
Properly handles parens and braces inside comments; they are ignored.
Also ignores single quotes if doubles are odd number, so singles
can be used in a printf string for punctuation. IF you see the doubles
are odd at line end (the printout tally), all bets are OFF!
Enter cntx on the command line by itself for a usage note.
*/
main(argc,argv)
int argc;
char *argv[];
{
FILE *f;
char c,secnd_c,lastc;
int bracket,parens,braces,squote,dquote,comments;
int perr,bkerr,brerr,sqerr,dqerr;
int verbose,okay;
int filearg = 0;
int line, col, tabc;
if ((argc < 2)||(argc > 3)) getout(0);
if (argc == 3)
{
verbose = TRUE; /* already tested for -v switch
Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.
On Sunday, July 17, 2011 10:28:16 AM Dotan Cohen did opine: > On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 19:51, rantingrick wrote: > > -- > > Evidence: Tabs ARE superior! > > -- > > I am also a recent spaces-to-tabs convert. One of the reasons is that > I've discovered that programing in a non-fixed width font is a real > pleasure, but the spaces are too narrow. Tabs alleviate that. > > I'm still looking for the perfect programming font. Suggestions > welcomed. When you find it Dotan, let me know, I've been looking since the later '70's. Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Men will always be men -- no matter where they are. -- Harry Mudd, "Mudd's Women", stardate 1329.8 -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.
On Sunday, July 17, 2011 08:24:12 PM Dotan Cohen did opine: > On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 17:29, gene heskett wrote: > >> I'm still looking for the perfect programming font. Suggestions > >> welcomed. > > > > When you find it Dotan, let me know, I've been looking since the later > > '70's. > > Hey there Gene! Are you not on every mailing list on the internet old > man?!? Nope, I miss quite a few in fact. Old? I might be looking at 77 yo in a couple months, and a few things don't work anymore because I'm too sweet (type 2 diabetic), but I can occasionally claim to be a JOAT in a serious tone of voice. Hell Dotan, I even know how vacuum tubes work, including some of the exotic ones, like klystrons. I had to wait till they had invented transistors before I could use my first one, 10 years after I had decided I wanted to be an electronics whiz in about '39 cuz my uncle kept himself in beer money fixing radios. > I have also come to the conclusion that the perfect woman, the perfect > physics theory, and the perfect programming font are all illusions > that men will stride their entire lives in search for but will never > find. ROTFLMAO! And right you are. It took me several decades (and 3 women I'll explain someday) to reach that conclusion. Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) The person who makes no mistakes does not usually make anything. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Tabs -vs- Spaces: Tabs should have won.
On Monday, July 18, 2011 09:32:19 AM Tim Chase did opine: > On 07/17/2011 08:01 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > > Roy Smith wrote: > >> We don't have that problem any more. It truly boggles my > >> mind that we're still churning out people with 80 column > >> minds. I'm willing to entertain arguments about readability > >> of long lines, but the idea that there's something magic > >> about 80 columns is hogwash. > > > > I agree! Which is why I set my line width to 78 columns. > > Bah, when I started programming > on the Apple ][+, we had no > lower-case and a 40-column limit > on the TV display. > But you try and tell the young > people today that... > and they won't believe ya'. > > -tkc > > (expecting somebody to come back with a bit more retro-computing > Four Yorkshiremen bit..."spinning 360k 5.25" floppy drives? We > should be so lucky. I had to hand jump 2000-amp bits with only my > tongue, for a CPU architecture invented by Navajo code-talkers...") No, but my first computer was an RCA Cosmac Super Elf, with a 6 digit led display. I added another 4k of static ram ($400 for the s100 board kit, and about $100 for the S-100 4 slot backplane, and about $125 for a cash register style cabinet that I hid the rest of the hardware, including a 6 volt gell cell for backup battery in) This had an RCA 1802 CPU which had a very interesting architecture. Writing, in machine code entered through its monitor, a program that drove the rest of the hardware and connected to the remote controls of the U- Matic tape machines of the day, including the display hardware I built from scratch with mostly TTL parts, it was replacing the most labor intensive step in preparing a commercial for use with an Automatic station break machine by applying a new frame accurate academy leader and the tones to control it directly to the finished commercial tape. That automated a very timing critical step, and removed a dub cycle from commercial production at KRCR in 1979, and was still in use in 1994 the last time I checked. How many of our code projects can make that claim? I still have a paper copy of the code in a bag on the top shelf. Interesting sidelight here. In 1980, Microtime brought a much more primative device to do that to the NAB show, which I stopped and looked at, and when I could control my laughing, said I had already done that, functionally far better than this attempt. Since they are as lawyer top loaded as Apple, I guess they assumed I had also copyrighted and patented it, so it was gone the next day & they wouldn't even admit they had had it the day before. In 1987 I made a better version of the EDISK that Grass Valley sold as an accessory for the 300 series video production switchers, for $20,000. Theirs had a 2 digit display for file names & ran at 1200 baud. Mine had a whopping 32 column display and english filenames and ran at 4800 baud, running on a TRS-80 Color Computer, I had $245 in the hardware. It was still in use when I retired in 2002, but when that forced a replacement of the 300 because of custom parts availability, the new CE gave me back the old machine. I still have it, and several more of them. The 6809 was not the crippled, drain bamaged processor the 6502 was. OS-9, the color computers multiuser/multitasking OS, has now grown to also execute on the hitachi 6309 cpu chip, and is about 2x faster now than then, and we now call it Nitros9. That is essentially todays linux, running on an 8 bit bus, and was my teacher, causing me to only have one legal winderz install in the house ever as it was on the laptop (XP) I bought quite a few years back now. Long since history, that machine has had linux on it for about 6 years now. FWIW, I met one of the code talkers when I was the CE at KIVA-TV in the late 70's. That was another example of how we have screwed the "First Americans' and I had better not get started. Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Beneath this stone lies Murphy, They buried him today, He lived the life of Riley, While Riley was away. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: List spam
On Thursday, August 18, 2011 09:51:04 AM Philip Semanchuk did opine: > On Aug 18, 2011, at 8:58 AM, Jason Staudenmayer wrote: > > I really like this list as part of my learning tools but the amount of > > spam that I've been getting from it is CRAZY. Doesn't anything get > > scanned before it sent to the list? > > This has been discussed on the list a number of times before, so I'll > refer you to the archives for details. > > Basically, the mailing list receives postings from Google Groups and > vice versa. Most of the spam comes from Google Groups. If you add a > mail filter that deletes anything with the "Organization" header set to > "http://groups.google.com";, you won't see much spam anymore. In my > experience, you'll also miss a number of legitimate postings. > > HTH > Philip I am about to do just that, block groups.google.com. AFAIAC, if someone wants to contribute to this mailing list, they can damned well join THIS list if they want their posts to be read by the subscribers to this list. Google is not too big to block as I just told them while fwding that last bit of boilerplate to them at groups-abuse AT google dot com. Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Such a fine first dream! But they laughed at me; they said I had made it up. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: List spam
On Thursday, August 18, 2011 12:08:00 PM Ghodmode did opine: > On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 9:39 PM, Philip Semanchuk wrote: > > On Aug 18, 2011, at 8:58 AM, Jason Staudenmayer wrote: > >> I really like this list as part of my learning tools but the amount > >> of spam that I've been getting from it is CRAZY. Doesn't anything > >> get scanned before it sent to the list? > > > > This has been discussed on the list a number of times before, so I'll > > refer you to the archives for details. > > > > Basically, the mailing list receives postings from Google Groups and > > vice versa. Most of the spam comes from Google Groups. If you add a > > mail filter that deletes anything with the "Organization" header set > > to "http://groups.google.com";, you won't see much spam anymore. In my > > experience, you'll also miss a number of legitimate postings. > > You are absolutely right, it has been brought up before. But I'm glad > it's been brought up again. It's such a problem that it degrades the > usefulness of the list and the community. > > Most of the mailing lists I'm on are managed using Google Groups and > many of them are on mailman, like this list. I don't see spam on > them, so I don't know what's going on here. > > It's not really filtering at all. Most lists only allow members to > post and the admins are quick to boot offenders. > > For the most part, I'm just a lurker, so my suggestion shouldn't carry > as much weight, but here it is anyway... > > Make an effort to curb the spam even if it means killing the newsgroup > availability. Choose mailman or Google Groups, or another single > solution. Make it members only, but allow anyone to register with an > automated confirmation email and a CAPTCHA. Appoint a list admin who > has a few minutes each day to scan subjects of emails for spammers and > remove them from the members list. > > ... problem solved. > > Yes. I'm saying we should abandon those who only follow the list via > newsgroups. > Yes. I'm willing to do the work, but I'm not the right choice. +100 (or whatever it takes) > > HTH > > Philip > > -- > Ghodmode > http://www.ghodmode.com/blog Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) The state of innocence contains the germs of all future sin. -- Alexandre Arnoux, "Etudes et caprices" -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: List spam
On Thursday, August 18, 2011 12:08:38 PM Alain Ketterlin did opine: > "Jason Staudenmayer" writes: > > I really like this list as part of my learning tools but the amount of > > spam that I've been getting from it is CRAZY. Doesn't anything get > > scanned before it sent to the list? > > I'm using nntp to read this newsgroup (through an academic server). > No spam at all. > > -- Alain. Which I think re-enforces the conclusion I have reached, and that is that the most obnoxious spammer here is injecting his spam directly to a machine handling google's groups that is downstream of any filtering they claim to do. Short answer is to disconnect the the NNTP link and make this list into a REAL mailing list. Subscribers only, or get past a GOOD captcha. Spammers have stuff that can do the average captcha in a second or less, so choose the images wisely and randomize both the background and the text. Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) The state of innocence contains the germs of all future sin. -- Alexandre Arnoux, "Etudes et caprices" -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: List spam
On Thursday, August 18, 2011 12:14:39 PM Alain Ketterlin did opine: > Ghodmode writes: > > [...] > > > Make an effort to curb the spam even if it means killing the newsgroup > > availability. Choose mailman or Google Groups, or another single > > solution. Make it members only, but allow anyone to register with an > > automated confirmation email and a CAPTCHA. Appoint a list admin who > > has a few minutes each day to scan subjects of emails for spammers and > > remove them from the members list. > > Or save work and find a public nntp server (or setup one, or ask your > provider), and use a news reader to follow the list (even thunderbird > can do this). No spam, no need to store messages on your machine, > auto-purge after a configurable delay, etc. > > Problem solved. > > -- Alain. That is asking the user to take considerable effort and resources to do that. What is wrong with the mailing list only approach? Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) The plot was designed in a light vein that somehow became varicose. -- David Lardner -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: List spam
On Thursday, August 18, 2011 02:12:58 PM Alain Ketterlin did opine: > gene heskett writes: > >> Or save work and find a public nntp server (or setup one, or ask your > >> provider), and use a news reader to follow the list (even thunderbird > >> can do this). No spam, no need to store messages on your machine, > >> auto-purge after a configurable delay, etc. > > > > That is asking the user to take considerable effort and resources to > > do that. What is wrong with the mailing list only approach? > > Nothing really. > > Regarding effort and resources, once you've found a NNTP server there's > very little effort (probably less than subscribing to a mailing list). I > have 4 lines in my .emacs. And this lets me browse dozens of groups (or > thousands if I had time for this). It might not be easy to find a server > which will let you post, but that's because a few years back many > internet providers decided that nntp was too much traffic. I guess it > would now be considered ridiculous compared to the average web-site. > > But I'd like to return the question. What's wrong with nntp? The sheer volume of traffic eats 99% of an ISP's bandwidth. The last time I checked with one of the local ISP's that I quit using years ago because it was 30 miles away and was then long distance, giving me $300 phone bills, they said their server died (again, and that then traffic was such that a 300GB hard drive was being subject to a posting lifetime of 3 hours because it was filling the drive that quickly. At the time, they had 5 T1 circuits, and NNTP was eating 4 of them. To an ISP, that stuff is found on the ground behind the male of the bovine specie. No ISP I have access to a mail account on, except google, has the resources to maintain a full listing nnpt server. > It looks > like everybody agrees that nntp brings spam. I just wanted to say that's > not true, I use nntp extensively and haven't seen spam for months (I'm > talking about 15-20 groups, not comp.lang.python only). > > The real problem here seems to be google groups, which in some way > forwards spam to the mailing-list. How this happens is beyond my > understanding. But let's try to fix the real problem. I could just nuke them, but I suppose I'd then have to resubscribe to about 10 of my mailing lists through the server this msg comes from. That is gradually happening anyway because posting through a gmail account, you cannot turn off the dup deletions, so one never knows if ones post to a list got there until someone replies, you don't get an echo. I have even tried CCing this address as some have suggested, but that doesn't work either. gmail is NOT the huge thing it was touted to be, not by a hell of a long row of apple trees. > -- Alain. Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) "It's not just a computer -- it's your ass." -- Cal Keegan -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: List spam
On Thursday, August 18, 2011 02:26:24 PM Peter Pearson did opine: > On Thu, 18 Aug 2011 12:15:59 -0400, gene heskett > wrote: [snip] > > > What is wrong with the mailing list only approach? > > In the mailing-list approach, how do I search for prior discussions > on a subject? (I'm not particularly opposed to the mailing list, > I'm just an NNTP follower worried about the uncertainties of change.) If the message still exists in your local email corpus, kmail for one has no problems searching it. However, since my corpus is close to 10gigs because my inbox and one list are not expired, the rest of them are expired on a selectable schedule that only saves the last 2000 or so msgs. Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Hoare's Law of Large Problems: Inside every large problem is a small problem struggling to get out. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: List spam
On Thursday, August 18, 2011 05:18:42 PM Terry Reedy did opine: > On 8/18/2011 12:14 PM, gene heskett wrote: > > into a REAL mailing list. Subscribers only, or get past a GOOD > > captcha. > > I just had an idea. Ask 'What is python? __" or "What > can you do with a python?' with a free-form fill in the blank answer. > Look for 'computer', 'program' or 'language' in the response. 'snake' > fails the test. > > Or 'Enter a Python keyword (search the tutorial if you do not know any) > ' Sounds good, but now you've trained the spammer who is without a doubt watching this list. Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) QOTD: "I may not be able to walk, but I drive from the sitting position." -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: List spam
On Thursday, August 18, 2011 10:23:49 PM Steven D'Aprano did opine: > gene heskett wrote: > >> But I'd like to return the question. What's wrong with nntp? > > > > The sheer volume of traffic eats 99% of an ISP's bandwidth. > > I doubt that very much, particularly if the ISP drops the binary > newsgroups. [...] > It's not like you have to install a second Interweb tube just for > bittorrent, or that bittorrent packets cost more than HTTP packets. Fer > fecks sake, the ISP doesn't even have to run a bittorrent server! It's > practically free money to the ISP, packets go in, packets go out, they > don't have to do a bloody thing with them. Except pay for the bandwidth to get the bytes into their system. > Now, an ISP might not have the bandwidth to supply all the needs of > their customers, that's a separate issue. Yes it is, which is why Hughs has a bandwidth limit cap they lift in the middle of the night when overall traffic is zilch. The bird(s) only have so much bandwidth and it costs tens of millions to 'lay another fiber' when its 22,300 miles up. OTOH, they have to pay for that bandwidth 24/7, so if they can move the relatively few high traffic folks usage to 3-5 AM, they can service more people watching old black and white John Holmes clips at 9-11pm. ;-) > But complaining that the > problem is specifically because they use bittorrent, as if it would > disappear if they changed to HTTP, is bogus. Agreed, that's 100% a red herring. Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Q: How many mathematicians does it take to screw in a light bulb? A: One. He gives it to six Californians, thereby reducing the problem to the earlier joke. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: List spam
On Thursday, August 18, 2011 12:16:50 PM Jason Staudenmayer did opine: [...] > I do know it is ironic that I forgot to stop the footer for the one > reply. It's not my choice to add it but I was able to find a way around > that work policy for list emails. I'm a strong opponent of dropping any > email with a stupid footer spam. > > Jason I'm a strong "proponent" of dropping any email with a stupid footer spam. There, I fixed it for you. ;-) Sorry, couldn't resist, Jason. At nearly 77, I am a firm believer that one can grow old without growing up. ;p) Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Renning's Maxim: Man is the highest animal. Man does the classifying. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: try... except with unknown error types
On Tuesday, August 23, 2011 04:42:04 AM Chris Angelico did opine: > On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 8:21 AM, Paul Rubin wrote: > > Chris Angelico writes: > >> Ehh, granted. Definitely a case of "should". But certainly, there > >> won't be an infinite number of new exceptions invented; > > > > Right, the number is finite, but the issue is that it's unknown. It's > > like never knowing whether you've fixed the last bug in a program. > > Yeah. Oh, I know when I've fixed the last bug in a program. It's the > day the program gets deleted. Until then? Nope. > > ChrisA OTOH, ChrisA, I have it on good authority that no program is ever finished, until someone shoots the programmer. :) Cheers, gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) <http://204.111.25.156:85/gene/> Practice is the best of all instructors. -- Publilius -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: The Incredible Growth of Python (stackoverflow.blog)
On Saturday 09 September 2017 21:48:44 Chris Angelico wrote: > On Sun, Sep 10, 2017 at 11:41 AM, Gregory Ewing > > wrote: > > Pavol Lisy wrote: > >> Interesting reading: > >> https://stackoverflow.blog/2017/09/06/incredible-growth-python/?cb= > >>1 > > > > So, Python's rate of expansion is accelerating, like > > the universe. Does that mean there's some kind of dark > > energy fuelling its growth? > > The Python Secret Underground emphatically does not exist. > > ChrisA Humm. here all this time I thought you were a charter member. :) Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: The Incredible Growth of Python (stackoverflow.blog)
On Sunday 10 September 2017 01:06:00 Ben Finney wrote: > Gene Heskett writes: > > On Saturday 09 September 2017 21:48:44 Chris Angelico wrote: > > > The Python Secret Underground emphatically does not exist. > > > > Humm. here all this time I thought you were a charter member. :) > > With all the authority vested in me as a charter member, I can > categorically say the Python Secret Underground does not exist. > Chuckle. But this is far out in the puckerbrush, and I'm out of string for my weed-eater. And we got here in record time. ;-) > -- > \ “Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering?” “Well, I think > | `\ so, Brain, but first you'd have to take that whole bridge > | _o__) apart, wouldn't you?” —_Pinky and The > Brain_ | Ben Finney Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: People choosing Python 3
On Sunday 10 September 2017 05:25:51 Leam Hall wrote: > On 09/10/2017 04:19 AM, Chris Warrick wrote: > > On 10 September 2017 at 09:30, Marko Rauhamaa wrote: > >> INADA Naoki : > >>> I can't wait Python 3 is the default Python of Red Hat, and > >>> "python" command means Python 3 on Debian and Ubuntu. > >> > >> I can't wait till Python 3 is available on Red Hat. > > > > Python 3.4 is available in EPEL. RHEL 8 will switch to Python 3 as > > the main Python interpreter (assuming dnf replaces yum, as it did in > > Fedora a while back). > > I'm not sure that RHEL 8 will be Python 3 for the OS tools. Even if it > is, which version? > > From a non-rpm perspective Python 3.6.2 compiles nicely on CentOS 6. > Once compiled it seems easy to use pip3 to install stuff without > trampling on the OS's Python 2 install. > > Just have to make sure your PATH is set right. By putting > /usr/local/bin after /usr/bin I can use "py.test" to run tests under > Python 2 and "pytest" for Python 3. > > Leam But that is contrary to the usual practice, fixed so that stuff built and installed locally, with identical names to the distro's /usr/bin contents, is found first in /usr/local/bin and the newer version is used. That "usual practice" is going to be a very high hill to climb. I personally would never consider it as a solution to this p2 vs p3 problem. > p.s. Sorry Chris, meant to send this to the list. You get it twice. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Even Older Man Yells at Whippersnappers
On Tuesday 19 September 2017 13:38:42 ROGER GRAYDON CHRISTMAN wrote: > I recall giving a quiz to my college students sometime back around > the late nineties which had a little bit of arithmetic involved in the > answer. It's been too long ago to still have the exact details, but I > remember a couple solutions that would be of the form: > > 5 + 10 + 1*2 > > And then the student would write he was unable to actually > compute that without a calculator. And yes, I deliberately > designed the questions to have such easy numbers to work with. > > Roger Christman > Pennsylvania State University Why do we buy them books and send them to school? Yes, that is a real question. We ought to be suing the schools for malpractice. And the parents for child abuse because they didn't see to it the child was being properly taught. I know from raising some of those questions at a school board meeting, occasioned by my trying to act like a parent when I took on a woman with 3 children fathered by a myotonic muscular dystrophy victim. Those offspring typically have a 30 year lifespan so they are long passed now. And being told they have to follow the federal recipes. So who the hell do we sue to put some "education" back into the classroom? The only way we'll fix it is to cost the decision makers their salaries. And we start that by talking to the candidates, and voting them in or out accordingly in those regions where they are elected. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Even Older Man Yells At Whippersnappers
On Wednesday 20 September 2017 05:09:53 Gregory Ewing wrote: > Rhodri James wrote: > > Tsk. You should have learned (a fake simplified) assembler first, > > Never mind that fake assembly rubbish, learn a real assembly > language! And hand-assemble it and toggle it into the front > panel switches like I did! > > -- > Greg So did I Greg, except the cosmac super elf I started on, at least had a hex monitor for an os. This was in 1978. Wrote a commercial preparation utility for an automatic station break machine when I was at KRCR-TV in Redding CA. I of course went on down the road in due time. Fast fwd 15 years, I'd changed women and was then the CE at WDTV-5 here in WV, but had some vacation time so we flew back to Oregon to visit an aunt who was running out of time. While "in the neighborhood" I called the tv station and found that my gismo was still in several times a day use. Thats an eon or two in a stations tech equipment time. Funny part is that the next spring, at the annual NAB show in Lost Wages, I spotted the makings of a similar device in the Microtime booth, and commented that mine could do this and that that theirs couldn't. Microtime was rather famous for having more lawyers than engineers. The product disappeared from the display, and was never seen or admitted to even exist again. So I was the only one to ever do that particular job, no one ever did anything similar, but back in the days when tv stations below the top 25 were all running Sony 3/4" u-matic video Tape machines, the image quality lost in making a copy was substantial, and my gismo saved a one generation copy that markedly improved the image quality of our commercial breaks. Thats good for Nielson ratings, 2 points in the next book, at a market 162 station. The average General Manager would kill for a 2 point better Nielson book. And I had fun doing it! Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Even Older Man Yells At Whippersnappers
On Wednesday 20 September 2017 10:29:08 Larry Martell wrote: > On Wed, Sep 20, 2017 at 5:09 AM, Gregory Ewing > > wrote: > > Never mind that fake assembly rubbish, learn a real assembly > > language! And hand-assemble it and toggle it into the front > > panel switches like I did! > > 1979, I was working at Bausch and Lomb in Rochester NY. We had a 16 > bit Data General Nova 'Minicomputer'. It had 4 registers, called > accumulators. It had 16 front panel toggle switches, one for each bit, > one that said 'deposit', and one that said run. It had a dial with > stops for AC0, AC1, AC2, AC3 (for the 4 accumulators), PC (program > counter), address and contents. > > When you powered up the machine it did not boot. You had to hand enter > a short bootstrap program in binary. Do to this you had to turn the > dial to address, key in a 16 bit address, click deposit, turn the dial > to contents, key in a 16 bit line of assembly code, click deposit, and > repeat this for each line of code (there were like 5 or 6). Then key > in the address of where you wanted to run from turn the dial to PC, > deposit, and click run. Any mistake and it would not boot. Often took > 3 or 4 tries. > > After a few weeks of this I was sick of it. I had the boot code burned > into an EEPROM (which I had to send out to be programmed). Then I > build a very small wire wrapped board with the EEPROM and an > oscillator and few TTL chips. I tapped into the 5V power on the CPU > board and used the leading edge of that to trigger a one shot which > 'woke up' my circuit, and caused it to clock out the code from the > EEPROM and load it to the appropriate place, set the program counter > and start the program. I drilled holes in the CPU board and mounted > this with little plastic standoffs. > > I did this all on my own, coming in on the weekends, without company > approval, and when it was working I showed my boss. He was blown away > and he was sure we could patent this and sell it. He had me formalize > the design, write it up, have an actual PCB made, go to the company > lawyers, the whole 9 yards. Then Data General announced the new > version of the Nova with auto boot. Chuckle, love it Larry. But then I am sure it was not that much of a problem for you. That super elf? Used a broadcast audio cart in an old machine whose capstan was badly worn so it played a regular cart at about 90% speed for its non-volatile memory. Didn't bither the elf a bot, never had it fail to load and run the next copy of my program. I had saved 4 or 5 copies on a 2 minute cart. Then did another for backup, and a 3rd cart I took home. Fast fwd to 2017, it and a paper copy of that machine code is on the top shelf here in this room. Yeah, I've had packratitis all my life. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Thread safety issue (I think) with defaultdict
On Friday 03 November 2017 10:50:13 Chris Angelico wrote: > On Fri, Nov 3, 2017 at 10:26 PM, Rhodri James wrote: > > On 02/11/17 20:24, Chris Angelico wrote: > >> Thank you. I've had this argument with many people, smart people > >> (like Steven), people who haven't grokked that all concurrency has > >> costs - that threads aren't magically more dangerous than other > >> options. > > > > I'm with Steven. To be fair, the danger with threads is that most > > people don't understand thread-safety, and in particular don't > > understand either that they have a responsibility to ensure that > > shared data access is done properly or what the cost of that is. > > I've seen far too much thread-based code over the years that would > > have been markedly less buggy and not much slower if it had been > > written sequentially. > > Yes, but what you're seeing is that *concurrent* code is more > complicated than *sequential* code. Would the code in question have > been less buggy if it had used multiprocessing instead of > multithreading? What if it used explicit yield points? Multiprocessing > brings with it a whole lot of extra complications around moving data > around. Multithreading brings with it a whole lot of extra > complications around NOT moving data around. Yield points bring with > them the risk of locking another thread out unexpectedly (particularly > since certain system calls aren't async-friendly on certain OSes). All > three models have their pitfalls. It's not that threads are somehow > worse than every other model. > > ChrisA I think that this discussion of threads and threading must be a different context than threading as I am using it in linuxcnc. There, one assigns a function to run in a certain sequence in an assigned thread, which there can be several of. There, each thread is assigned a repetition rate, and the higher repetition rate stuff can always interrupt the slower threaded function in order to get the real time stuff done in a usable for the job time frame, and the high frequency thread can be as fast as every 25 microseconds on a good motherboard. Surprisingly, this seems to be far more board dependent than processor dependent, altho its pushing an AMD processor quite hard at 40 microseconds, while the slower intel atoms can do 25 microseconds with about the same effort. This is where a stepper motor is being stepped by software which didles pins on a parport. And it limits how fast you can move the motor compared to using an fpga card running at 200 MHz, not because of the step rate, but because of the latency of the mobo/cpu combination. Jitter in step rate issuance is death to high performance with stepper motors because torque to do usefull work vanishes when the instant speed of the motor is wobbling with that timing jitter. OTOH, hand controls of a machine using an encoder dial are nicely done in a thread running at 100 Hz, far more reliably that I can do it from the keyboard on a raspberry pi 3b. Why? The dials data goes into linuxcnc by way of a hardware fpga card that talks to the pi over an SPI buss, with the pi writing 32 bit packets at 41 megabaud, and reading the results at 25 megabaud. It doesn't have to get thru that usb2 internal hub in the pi that all the other i/o has to go thru. Mouse and keyboard events get dropped on the floor, particularly dangerous when its a keyup event that gets dropped. The machine keeps moving until it crashes into something, often breaking drive parts or cutting tooling, all of which cost real money. My point is that with an interpretor such as hal managing things, threads Just Work(TM). It does of course take a specially built kernel to do that magic. I'll get me coat. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: we want python software
oing to the OP, is exactly what you, Ethan and others are attempting > to do to KM. You consider KM's actions to have violated *your* social > norm of "be nice" and consequently you are trying to shame KM into > changing his behaviour to meet those norms, by chastising him and > telling him off for supposedly attacking the OP, for being > condescending, for being hateful. > > Ironically, it appears that both KM and the OP are newbies. Aren't we > supposed to be more welcoming to newbies? > > > You can be far more courteous > > than this, even if you refuse to help. Particularly, the "you > > people" sounds like a blanket statement, which is almost certainly > > not useful to the discussion. > > I think that given both posters appear to be Indian, perhaps there's > some cultural baggage that we outsiders aren't privy too. I might > guess that it could have something to do with the (allegedly) high > incidence of academic dishonesty and cheating amongst India's > students, many students feeling that they are entitled to pass courses > without doing any work or studying. > > http://beta.latimes.com/world/asia/la-fg-c1-india-cheating-20140416-m- >story.html > > > You (and a few others) have "attacked" (criticised) someone who shows > signs of being concerned about the quality of discussion in this > forum, while encouraging somebody who shows signs of possibly becoming > an entitled, needy, demanding Help Vampire: > > http://www.skidmore.edu/~pdwyer/e/eoc/help_vampire.htm > > Now to be fair to the OP, Jyothiswaroop Reddy, may not realise he is > breaking a social norm for a tech group, perhaps due to cluelessness, > inexperience, or a lifetime of entitlement where his every need has > been done for him. I'm not saying he should be shunned. > > But a swift kick up the (virtual) behind is a wake-up call. KM's > comments were tough but fair: Jyothiswaroop *is* wasting people's time > with a simple problem that he should be capable of solving himself, or > at least making an attempt to solve it himself, and it doesn't require > much nous to google for "Download Python" before asking for help. > > In our urge to be inclusive, we forget that it is just basic simple > politeness that before asking strangers for a favour, we should make > an honest attempt to solve the problem ourselves. If you don't, but > still expect others to solve your problems for you, that's a violation > of some pretty deeply embedded cultural norms about social cheating > (taking advantage of others without giving back). Those norms are so > deeply embedded they might even be biological. I can completely > understand KM's apparant anger. > > The bottom line is, I disagree that KM's posts were out of line and > more worthy of chastisement than Jyothiswaroop's post. > > > > > > [1] I cannot compile Python 3.6 or better on any of the computers I > have access to at the moment -- although it's probably time for me to > try again in case those dependency problems have been fixed. > > [2] Given the historical practice of suttee (sati) and the questions > it raises about colonial imperialism[3], as well as the still-current > practice of dowry murder[4] and even more vicious crimes[5] in India, > accusing KM of setting another person on fire (even metaphorically) is > not something I'd do so casually. > > [3] http://www.victorianweb.org/history/empire/india/suttee.html > > [4] https://preview.tinyurl.com/y86vglvm > > [5] https://preview.tinyurl.com/hnaa29w > > > -- > Steve > “Cheer up,” they said, “things could be worse.” So I cheered up, and > sure enough, things got worse. +100 Steve, spot on IOW. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Politeness (was: we want python software)
On Wednesday 06 December 2017 11:28:22 Random832 wrote: > On Wed, Dec 6, 2017, at 11:18, Steve D'Aprano wrote: > > You suggested that if he wasn't familiar with free software, his > > request that people send him a copy of Python wouldn't look so odd. > > Okay, if Python weren't free software, it would be non-free > > software, and you are saying that it wouldn't look so odd for > > somebody to join a mailing list and request a bunch of strangers to > > gift him a copy of non-free software. > > The third possibility is that he believes that this list is official > in some corporate sense, that if he asks for the software and it is > not free he will receive a price quote. Sadly, that an attitude even college profs don't get, having gotten their sheepskin with only M$ stuff, that something could be both free and good. It's a concept that makes no sense to the teachers, so of course they don't teach it either. Hell of a way to run a train. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Politeness (was: we want python software)
On Wednesday 06 December 2017 12:14:32 Ian Kelly wrote: > On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 9:42 AM, Gene Heskett wrote: > > On Wednesday 06 December 2017 11:28:22 Random832 wrote: > >> The third possibility is that he believes that this list is > >> official in some corporate sense, that if he asks for the software > >> and it is not free he will receive a price quote. > > > > Sadly, that an attitude even college profs don't get, having gotten > > their sheepskin with only M$ stuff, that something could be both > > free and good. > > > > It's a concept that makes no sense to the teachers, so of course > > they don't teach it either. Hell of a way to run a train. > > Depends where you went to school, probably. The CS department at my > college was all over using Linux and free software. Then why not promote that seat of higher learning by naming it? Word of mouth publicity is the best kind. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Politeness (was: we want python software)
On Wednesday 06 December 2017 15:33:40 Ian Kelly wrote: > On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 10:56 AM, Gene Heskett wrote: > > On Wednesday 06 December 2017 12:14:32 Ian Kelly wrote: > >> On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 9:42 AM, Gene Heskett > > > > wrote: > >> > On Wednesday 06 December 2017 11:28:22 Random832 wrote: > >> >> The third possibility is that he believes that this list is > >> >> official in some corporate sense, that if he asks for the > >> >> software and it is not free he will receive a price quote. > >> > > >> > Sadly, that an attitude even college profs don't get, having > >> > gotten their sheepskin with only M$ stuff, that something could > >> > be both free and good. > >> > > >> > It's a concept that makes no sense to the teachers, so of course > >> > they don't teach it either. Hell of a way to run a train. > >> > >> Depends where you went to school, probably. The CS department at my > >> college was all over using Linux and free software. > > > > Then why not promote that seat of higher learning by naming it? Word > > of mouth publicity is the best kind. > > Earlham College. Thank you, but at first the only Earlham I could think of was Earlham, IA. Which isn't the home of a higher ed facility that I know of. Sounds like an interesting place that google sent me to. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: repeating posts
On Saturday 09 December 2017 00:35:15 Rustom Mody wrote: > Repeating old posts again appearing > > [No not complaining… I know people are working on it. Thanks Skip and > whoever else] > > Just thought I'd mention they are now mildly mojibaked Not familiar with that term. For me they are highly spammy, and are winding up in my spam box, scoreing around 8 because the headers are so mucked up. I train Bayes on that folder daily, move it to another folder so I can retrieve it if I want to. Thats a very rare occurrence. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: [TKinter]How to set LabelFrames font and color from option file
On Thursday 14 December 2017 04:35:02 Beppe wrote:
> Hi to everybody,
>
> I don't succeed in planning the value of the font and color in the
> LabelFrames using the option_db file, such as
>
> *LabelFrame*font: Helvetica 14
> *LabelFrame*foreground: red
>
> exist a list of the keywordses to use?
>
> thanks
>
> beppe
In pyvcp, the xml file can have:
("Helvetica",16)
...
It has a default, which I haven't changed, but the above
("Helvetica",12)
s/b how you do it.
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
--
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: [TKinter]How to set LabelFrames font and color from option file
On Thursday 14 December 2017 10:00:07 Beppe wrote:
> Il giorno giovedì 14 dicembre 2017 15:18:31 UTC+1, Peter Otten ha
scritto:
> > Beppe wrote:
> > > I don't succeed in planning the value of the font and color in the
> > > LabelFrames using the option_db file, such as
> > >
> > > *LabelFrame*font: Helvetica 14
> > > *LabelFrame*foreground: red
> > >
> > > exist a list of the keywordses to use?
> > >
> > >>> import tkinter as tk
> > >>> root = tk.Tk()
> > >>> lf = tk.LabelFrame(root)
> > >>> lf["class"]
> >
> > 'Labelframe'
> >
> > Do you spot the difference? The class of the LabelFrame widget is
> > Labelframe with a lowercase f. Once you change your database entries
> > to
> >
> > *Labelframe*font: Helvetica 14
> > *Labelframe*foreground: red
> >
> > everything should work as expected.
>
> perfect, it works too much well, even my buttons now are helvetica 14
> and red ;(
In that event, you can label the text buttons like this:
"checkbutton1"
"CamSW"
('Hack',12)
For a different font.
I'd assume ('green') might work, but haven't tried it since it
cannot be changed with the halpin state. Then it would be useful to
report status w/o having the put an led underline under it for state.
That would save a considerable acreage in screen real estate if it were
possible on an already busy linuxcnc gui. IMO the enforced blank space
around text is also a huge waster of screen real estate.
You can find some tut's on doing all this in the linuxcnc
Documentation.pdf, downloadable from linuxcnc.org, in my version
starting on page 366. Under "pyvcp" If you know of others, plz advise.
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
--
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: [TKinter]How to set LabelFrames font and color from option file
On Thursday 14 December 2017 11:29:03 Beppe wrote: > Il giorno giovedì 14 dicembre 2017 16:36:24 UTC+1, Peter Otten ha scritto: > > Beppe wrote: > > > Il giorno giovedì 14 dicembre 2017 15:18:31 UTC+1, Peter Otten ha scritto: > > >> Beppe wrote: > > >> > I don't succeed in planning the value of the font and color in > > >> > the LabelFrames using the option_db file, such as > > >> > > > >> > *LabelFrame*font: Helvetica 14 > > >> > *LabelFrame*foreground: red > > >> > > > >> > exist a list of the keywordses to use? > > >> > > > >> >>> import tkinter as tk > > >> >>> root = tk.Tk() > > >> >>> lf = tk.LabelFrame(root) > > >> >>> lf["class"] > > >> > > >> 'Labelframe' > > >> > > >> Do you spot the difference? The class of the LabelFrame widget is > > >> Labelframe with a lowercase f. Once you change your database > > >> entries to > > >> > > >> *Labelframe*font: Helvetica 14 > > >> *Labelframe*foreground: red > > >> > > >> everything should work as expected. > > > > > > perfect, it works too much well, even my buttons now are helvetica > > > 14 and red ;( > > > > I does what you tell it to do. Remove the second wildcard if you > > only want to change the Labelframe style: > > > > *Labelframe.font: Helvetica 14 > > *Labelframe.foreground: red > > Does that mean buttons inerith text from labelframe?!?! it looks so. They do if you do not specify differently within the content Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python Learning
On Monday 18 December 2017 09:19:01 Chris Angelico wrote: > On Tue, Dec 19, 2017 at 1:09 AM, Rhodri James wrote: > > On 18/12/17 13:28, Marko Rauhamaa wrote: > >> However, I have been doing quite a bit of hiring, quite > >> successfully, I might add. I am not prejudiced one way or another. > >> Your résumé doesn't count. Your education doesn't count. What you > >> can do for the team counts, and that is measured during the > >> interview process. > > > > While I agree with most of what you say, I disagree with you here. > > Your CV (résumé) does count, just not necessarily in the way most > > people expect. > > > > I haven't often been involved in hiring, but the few times I have we > > had more applicants than it was feasible to interview. We used CVs > > as the only thing we had to filter with, looking for *interesting* > > people. > > This is NORMALLY going to be the case. How many hours does it take to > truly evaluate a candidate? You can't afford to interview a hundred > people only to find that ninety of them are hopelessly unqualified. > Somehow, you have to sift out the most likely candidates, and THEN you > actually meet with them. > > But Marko is partly right too. Your CV/résumé isn't going to land you > the job, nor is your education. But they might land you the interview. > With the students I work with, there's a dedicated Careers Services > team that help them to polish their portfolio projects, because a > portfolio is *way* more indicative than a CV or a college degree; but > even then, the best portfolio in the world is only good enough to get > you as far as an interview. > > > Exactly what > > "interesting" meant was somewhat arbitrary; we put one person > > through to interview because she was a cellist, and that would have > > given us a complete string quartet (she didn't get the job, sadly). > > Heh. Pity. That would be fun. > > ChrisA I'll have to agree with most of this about "interesting" people. But one thing I always note from the resume or CV is any certifications they may carry. I am a C.E.T., and that card laid in front of an HR/GM type has gotten me every job I've applied for since 1972, but sadly those are rare birds indeed as I've not in the 45 years since, encountered another such individual. So I've had to depend on their familiarity with a soldering iron and some scope probes to determine if they would be useful to me. That certification is required to get a business license for an electronics service business in Kalipornia, weeds out the fly by nighters there was a plague of back in the 60's _& 70's. There really ought to be a similar program for coders. I'd probably fail that one, but generally my code works, and does not crash. And I've learned a lot while fixing it if it does crash. :) Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python Learning
On Monday 18 December 2017 16:05:10 Rob Gaddi wrote: > On 12/18/2017 08:45 AM, Larry Martell wrote: > > On Mon, Dec 18, 2017 at 11:33 AM, Marko Rauhamaa wrote: > >> However, one great way to stand out is a portfolio of GitHub > >> projects. Several people have gotten an offer largely based on > >> those (after they aced the technical interviews). For example, we > >> just hired someone who had written a game in sed. That doesn't make > >> him an "interesting person," nor do we look for game or sed > >> developers. But that silly exercise deeply resonated with our team. > >> We expect to have great synergy with him. > > > > I have been excluded from even getting an interview because I did > > not have a portfolio of GitHub projects. I think that is a bad > > filter. I work 60-70 hours a week for pay, and I have a family and > > personal interests. > > When I'm hiring I don't necessarily need a candidate to have an > extensive open-source portfolio, but I need to see some kind of > portfolio, just as a bar of "This is what I consider my good work to > be." The idea that someone is going to have years of experience, but > not a single page of code that they can let me look over always > strikes me as odd. I've known Larry for years via another list. He has worked on a lot of stuff in the financial arena, wrapped in non-disclosure clauses that prevent him from even saying what color he dots the i's with, so he gets work as much by word of mouth as other more conventional paths. To not hire him because he doesn't have a big portfolio could be a mistake, Rob. Its up to you. > -- > Rob Gaddi, Highland Technology -- www.highlandtechnology.com > Email address domain is currently out of order. See above to fix. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: is comp.lang.python still the pinnacle of the py community ?
On Friday 05 January 2018 16:06:34 Kim of K. wrote: > post frequency is down to a precarious level Thats because the huge majority of us who are here to learn a tidbit here and there, shove that stuff off to a spamassassin training directory, where its studied by sa-learn --spam for a second or two, and deleted the next day. . And your posts are about to be added to that. Say something helpfull to the python knowledge base, or STFU, this is not intended to be your private podium to call the rest of the world un-enlightened or names. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: [OT] Re: has sourceforge exposed the dirty little secret ?
On Sunday 07 January 2018 16:22:57 Christian Gollwitzer wrote: > Am 05.01.18 um 22:15 schrieb Michael Torrie: > > Please, no! We don't need emoji in this group. Fortunately the vast > > majority of posters use plain text (as is the etiquette) and so we > > don't have to worry about that kind of nonsense. > > It's not needed, but shouldn't pose any big problems with modern > software? I'm using Thunderbird over NNTP, and this shows up as > graphics to me: > > 🐍 💻 > But here its broken and I am looking at two pairs of vertical boxes because it is not properly mime'd. If you use chars or gliphs from a non-default charset, it needs to demarcated with a mime-boundary marker followed by the new type definition. Your email/news agent did not do that. > (a snake and a computer) Unless this message is blocked at the > NNTP-List boundary, it should show the same on any recent mail reader. > > Christian Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: [OT] Re: has sourceforge exposed the dirty little secret ?
On Sunday 07 January 2018 17:37:14 Random832 wrote: > On Sun, Jan 7, 2018, at 17:27, Gene Heskett wrote: > > > 🐍 💻 > > > > But here its broken and I am looking at two pairs of vertical boxes > > because it is not properly mime'd. If you use chars or gliphs from a > > non-default charset, it needs to demarcated with a mime-boundary > > marker followed by the new type definition. Your email/news agent > > did not do that. > > UTF-8 is the default character set, and anyway his message does have a > content-type of 'text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"'. Your > environment not having font support and/or support for non-BMP > characters is not a deficiency in the message. That, now that you mention it, could also effect this as I see it, my default kmail message body font is hack 14 in deference to the age of my eyes. My system default font is I believe utf-8. That is not a kmail settable option. But if I uncheck the "use custom fonts", it is still two pair of character outlines. So to what family of fonts do these characters belong? Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: [OT] Re: has sourceforge exposed the dirty little secret ?
On Sunday 07 January 2018 18:25:52 Random832 wrote: > On Sun, Jan 7, 2018, at 17:47, Richard Damon wrote: > > But it also says: > > > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > > > Which is incorrect, as the message is actually 8bit encoded (since > > the Emoji aren't in the first 127 characters, so their UTF-8 > > encoding isn't 7-bit. Some software might have messed up the message > > in transit due to that error. > > Well, the fact that the emoji survived the round-trip and showed up > properly in his reply (and yours) led me to rule out the possibility > that anything like that had happened. Plus, if that had happened, the > result wouldn't be boxes, but a series of ASCII characters (some of > which are control characters, and some of which are printable). Its just boxes here, and I just spent the better part of half an hour trying all the fonts available to kmail, without see anything but variable sizes of twin boxes. Looking at the raw message its also marked transfer content encoding = base64, which I'd assume destroys any semblance of an 8 bit encoding. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: [OT] Re: has sourceforge exposed the dirty little secret ?
On Sunday 07 January 2018 19:04:12 Chris Angelico wrote: > On Mon, Jan 8, 2018 at 10:50 AM, Gene Heskett wrote: > > On Sunday 07 January 2018 17:37:14 Random832 wrote: > >> On Sun, Jan 7, 2018, at 17:27, Gene Heskett wrote: > >> > > 🐍 💻 > >> > > >> > But here its broken and I am looking at two pairs of vertical > >> > boxes because it is not properly mime'd. If you use chars or > >> > gliphs from a non-default charset, it needs to demarcated with a > >> > mime-boundary marker followed by the new type definition. Your > >> > email/news agent did not do that. > >> > >> UTF-8 is the default character set, and anyway his message does > >> have a content-type of 'text/plain; charset="utf-8"; > >> Format="flowed"'. Your environment not having font support and/or > >> support for non-BMP characters is not a deficiency in the message. > > > > That, now that you mention it, could also effect this as I see it, > > my default kmail message body font is hack 14 in deference to the > > age of my eyes. > > > > My system default font is I believe utf-8. That is not a kmail > > settable option. But if I uncheck the "use custom fonts", it is > > still two pair of character outlines. So to what family of fonts do > > these characters belong? > > You're conflating a few different things here. The character set is > the Universal Character Set, basically synonymous with "Unicode". The > encoding is UTF-8 and is a way to represent Unicode characters as > bytes. The transfer encoding is base 64 (sometimes called "MIME > encoding"), at least in the email version of it - I don't know what > the original NG post used, and it may have been different. The font > used is a mapping from character codes to displayable glyphs. > That was looking at the original message. And its body was indeed a blob of base64. > Everything except the font is under the sender's control, and (at > least in the mailing list version) was all fine. If your font can't > handle those characters, the font renderer should still recognize that > they are characters, and put boxes (maybe with the codepoints written > in them). > > On my Debian Linux systems, I can "sudo apt install unifont" to grab a > font that's used as a fallback for any characters not found in other > fonts. Quoting from the package's description: > > "The philosophy behind this font, though, is that anything meaningful > is better than an empty box for an unknown glyph." > > It's not perfect, but it's way better than nothing. I don't know how > many of the emoji are included, but it's worth a try. > > ChrisA Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: [OT] Re: has sourceforge exposed the dirty little secret ?
On Sunday 07 January 2018 19:04:12 Chris Angelico wrote: > On Mon, Jan 8, 2018 at 10:50 AM, Gene Heskett wrote: > > On Sunday 07 January 2018 17:37:14 Random832 wrote: > >> On Sun, Jan 7, 2018, at 17:27, Gene Heskett wrote: > >> > > 🐍 💻 > >> > > >> > But here its broken and I am looking at two pairs of vertical > >> > boxes because it is not properly mime'd. If you use chars or > >> > gliphs from a non-default charset, it needs to demarcated with a > >> > mime-boundary marker followed by the new type definition. Your > >> > email/news agent did not do that. > >> > >> UTF-8 is the default character set, and anyway his message does > >> have a content-type of 'text/plain; charset="utf-8"; > >> Format="flowed"'. Your environment not having font support and/or > >> support for non-BMP characters is not a deficiency in the message. > > > > That, now that you mention it, could also effect this as I see it, > > my default kmail message body font is hack 14 in deference to the > > age of my eyes. > > > > My system default font is I believe utf-8. That is not a kmail > > settable option. But if I uncheck the "use custom fonts", it is > > still two pair of character outlines. So to what family of fonts do > > these characters belong? > > You're conflating a few different things here. The character set is > the Universal Character Set, basically synonymous with "Unicode". The > encoding is UTF-8 and is a way to represent Unicode characters as > bytes. The transfer encoding is base 64 (sometimes called "MIME > encoding"), at least in the email version of it - I don't know what > the original NG post used, and it may have been different. The font > used is a mapping from character codes to displayable glyphs. > > Everything except the font is under the sender's control, and (at > least in the mailing list version) was all fine. If your font can't > handle those characters, the font renderer should still recognize that > they are characters, and put boxes (maybe with the codepoints written > in them). > > On my Debian Linux systems, I can "sudo apt install unifont" to grab a > font that's used as a fallback for any characters not found in other > fonts. Quoting from the package's description: > > "The philosophy behind this font, though, is that anything meaningful > is better than an empty box for an unknown glyph." And here, unifont showed them as empty boxes. So does that point the finger of guilt to kmail? This is the TDE, R14.0.5 version. Hundreds of bugs fixed since the fork at KDE-3.5. > It's not perfect, but it's way better than nothing. I don't know how > many of the emoji are included, but it's worth a try. > > ChrisA I'll leave it set to use this unifont & see how it displays the smileys ;-) Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: [OT] Re: has sourceforge exposed the dirty little secret ?
On Sunday 07 January 2018 19:38:37 Chris Angelico wrote: > On Mon, Jan 8, 2018 at 11:33 AM, Gene Heskett wrote: > > And here, unifont showed them as empty boxes. So does that point the > > finger of guilt to kmail? This is the TDE, R14.0.5 version. Hundreds > > of bugs fixed since the fork at KDE-3.5. > > Huh. I've no idea, We are in the same boat. :) > then, but it's entirely possible that (a) the font > actually doesn't have those characters, or (b) kmail uses a 16-bit > renderer. Both of which are unk to me. I like the rest of how kmail works, and have written automatic scripts to reduce the actual work involved, so I am not likely to change agents without a better reason than a couple boxes where someone, think its cute, decides to test the rest of the systems. I believe there is a french saying about such that boils down to a shrug. ;-) But its also something I've not seen in something approaching 70 years, last in some required school reading in the middle 40's IIRC, so its still a shrug. I thought maybe I'd gain a clue by starting a discussion, but either it didn't or it flew by without even the loss of a feather. Solution buried deeper in the system than my bash speaking shovel can reach. ;) Take care all, and have a better 2018. Orders from Grandpa Gene. > The latter is why Idle can't render astral characters - > Tcl/Tk is limited to the BMP. > > ChrisA Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: documentation on read.encode
On Tuesday 16 January 2018 14:19:38 Larry Martell wrote: > On Tue, Jan 16, 2018 at 12:00 PM, Larry Martell wrote: > > Looking for 2.7 docs on read.encode - googling did not turn up > > anything. > > > > Specifically, looking for the supported options for base64, and how > > to specify them, e.g. Base64.NO_WRAP > > So I just realized that encode() is not a method of read() it's a > string method. But I still have the same question - can I pass in any > flags? > > My issue is that I am base64 encoding PNG images on linux and it's > putting a LF at the end of each line. If I do the same on Windows it's > putting CR/LF. I want the files to be encoded with no platform > dependences. Googling I found mention of Base64.NO_WRAP and I want to > pass that into encode() - can I do that? Di you not have the manpages installed? In my copy of the manpage: base64 [OPTION]... [FILE] where option is: -w, --wrap=COLS wrap encoded lines after COLS character (default 76). Use 0 to disable line wrapping. Seems pretty simple. Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Where has the practice of sending screen shots as source code come from?
On Sunday 28 January 2018 10:55:30 Peter J. Holzer wrote: > On 2018-01-28 15:04:26 +, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > > I'm seeing this annoying practice more and more often. Even for > > trivial pieces of text, a few lines, people post screenshots instead > > of copying the code. > > > > Where has this meme come from? > > Twitter? You can't send more than 140 characters[1], but you can send > an image, so just put your text in an image to get around pesky size > restrictions. > > But no, our users have done that for much longer than twitter exists. > The typical mail to support doesn't contain an error message in plain > text, not even a screenshot, it contains a word (or excel) file with a > screenshot of the error message (typically scaled down so that the > error message isn't readable any more). > > It reminds me about the old joke about the mathematician making > coffee: He finds an empty cup in the sink, rinses it, puts some ground > coffee and water into the coffee maker, waits for the water to run > through and pours the coffee into the cup. > The next day he wants some coffee again. But there is no cup in the > sink. Instead there is a cup in the cupboard. So he takes the cup from > the cupboard and puts it into the sink. Now he has reduced the problem > to a previously solved problem and proceeds as before. > > Similarly the user sending a wort attachment instead of a plain text > message knows how to take a screenshot, knows how to paste that into > word and knows how to attach a word file to an email. So they combine > those steps. They may or may not know how to copy some text into the > email (to be fair, Windows error messages often cannot be copied), but > it simply doesn't occur to them. > > I used to think that programmers (or techies in general) ought to be > able to write emails in a fashion that makes it easy to extract the > necessary information. I have since been disabused of the notion. > Programmers are just as thoughtless and unable to put themselves into > the recipient's shoes as the general population. > > Oh, and finally there is tools: I switched to Outlook for in-company > mails a year ago (because my boss wants me to top-post and I simply > can't do that if I have a decent editor, but with a crappy program > like Outlook I can) and it is just amazing how time consuming it is to > format a mail containing code examples to be readable. Taking a > screenshot and pasting it into the mail is faster (even though > Outlooks inline image handling is also atrocious). > > > (The day a programmer posts a WAV file of themselves reading their > > code out aloud, is the day I turn my modem off and leave the > > internet forever.) > > When the first MIME RFCs came out, a co-worker predicted that we would > soon get audio-clips as signatures. Thank god he was wrong about that. > > hp > > [1] 280 now. But by mentioning it, somebody will now do it. The problem will be what the hell do you play it with... -- Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: This newsgroup (comp.lang.python) may soon be blocked by Google Gro
On Friday 09 February 2018 23:44:54 Steven D'Aprano wrote: > On Fri, 09 Feb 2018 17:30:57 -0800, codewizard wrote: > > Regardless of what the policies are and how well they're enforced, > > if the mailing list is cut off from GG, I will stop reading it. > > There is *absolutely nothing* we can do about that. Google doesn't > listen to us, and the suggestion that we can influence them because > Guido van Rossum used to work for them many years ago is naive. > > We cannot influence Google's decision about the newsgroup; we cannot > convince your boss to allow access to the newsgroup at work; and > apparently we can't convince you that just because you will no longer > be able to access it from work, doesn't mean you have to stop > accessing it from home. Oh well, such is life. > > (Ironically, the vast bulk of spam on the newsgroup comes from Google > Groups itself, so if this does happen, it will probably be a nett win > for the community, even if it does negatively impact some > individuals.) > > > Probably > > not a big loss to anyone else, but you might wonder how many others > > are in the same situation... > > There's nothing we can do about it, so there is no point wasting time > wondering. > The list I see here is much much cleaner, as anything from google groups has been diverted to /dev/null for a year or more. We don't need the blather that comes out of googlegroups. If google is unhappy and cuts it off, methinks they should run a broom through their own real estate first. > > -- > Steve -- Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Problem: Need galileo running on debian wheezy
I know its supposed to be in the debian stretch repo's. I've been told to get a fitbit, but they don't support linux of any flavor, and that leaves galileo as the possible solution? So how should I proceed since the only stretch machine I have ATM is an arm64, aka a rock64. -- Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Problem: Need galileo running on debian wheezy
I know its supposed to be in the debian stretch repo's. I've been told to get a fitbit, but they don't support linux of any flavor, and that leaves galileo as the possible solution? So how should I proceed since the only stretch machine I have ATM is an arm64, aka a rock64. -- Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Problem: Need galileo running on debian wheezy
On Thursday 01 March 2018 15:31:32 Cousin Stanley wrote: > Gene Heskett wrote: > > I know its supposed to be in the debian stretch repo's. > > > > I've been told to get a fitbit, but they don't support linux > > of any flavor, and that leaves galileo as the possible solution? > > > > So how should I proceed since the only stretch machine I have ATM > > is an arm64, aka a rock64. > > The galileo package is available under debian stretch > on my rock64 > > # apt-cache policy galileo > > galileo: > Installed: (none) > Candidate: 0.5.1-4 > Version table: >0.5.1-4 500 > 500 http://approx:/debian stretch/main arm64 Packages > > >Package details > > # apt-cache show galileo > > > However, I have no clue as to its usage or effectiveness Its supposed to be an interface that can talk to a fitbit. But the one I bought is wifi only I think since the usb clipon intended to be used for recharging it, has only 2 contacts. And the rock64 doesn't have wifi hardware that I know of. One of the reasons I bought a couple of them, as its required it be turned off on a pi for anything like rt-preempt use on a pi as its noise interferes with everything else but then found there is no simple "make install" for a realtime kernel thats doesn't just brick the sdcard. And everytime someone on the pine64 forum points me at another way to do it, I grab the sw, only to find its not been updated since 2012? I've wasted $250 so far trying. Anyway, I'll bring in the 2nd one and see if an lshw shows a wifi with a minimal stretch +xfce install. Quick answer, no. That leaves an r-pi3b, which does have wifi. But since its busy drowning frogs outside, I'll see if I can find a stretch install for it tomorrow. Currently has a jessie install. So, is galileo shown for armhf's? The reason for posting here is that galileo is supposedly written in python, but don't know if 2 or 3. Thanks, Stanley. > > -- > Stanley C. Kitching > Human Being > Phoenix, Arizona -- Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Problem: Need galileo running on debian wheezy
On Thursday 01 March 2018 17:29:27 Wildman via Python-list wrote: > On Thu, 01 Mar 2018 13:44:27 -0500, Gene Heskett wrote: > > I know its supposed to be in the debian stretch repo's. > > > > I've been told to get a fitbit, but they don't support linux of any > > flavor, and that leaves galileo as the possible solution? > > > > So how should I proceed since the only stretch machine I have ATM is > > an arm64, aka a rock64. > > > > -- > > Cheers, Gene Heskett > > I would suggest to download it from stretch's repo > and open it with gdebi. It will tell you if the > depends are met. Or better yet since this elderly Asus board doesn't have a wifi, and all slots are full, lashup an r-pi 3b with a copy of stretch tomorrow, as it does have a wifi. Right now its busy drowning frogs out. With mixed intermittent horizontal rain. > -- > GNU/Linux user #557453 > The cow died so I don't need your bull! Thanks Wildman. -- Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Problem: Need galileo running on debian wheezy
On Friday 02 March 2018 10:27:57 Cousin Stanley wrote: > Gene Heskett wrote: > > > > And the rock64 doesn't have wifi hardware > > that I know of. > > > > I did manage to get wifi working on my rock64 > using a usb wifi dongle ordered from their store fitbit says its BTLE, claims a 20 foot range. > It was a bit fiddly to set up, somewhat shaky > connection-wise, and slower than I was comfortable with > so I went with an ethernet connection which is quick > and stable > > > So, is galileo shown for armhf's ? > > The galileo package information > doesn't explicitly mention arm > > However, I've had no problem > with any other python package > on the rock64 here > > dpkg-print-architecture indicates that it is arm64 > and I pull the debian stretch packages and updates from > > o http://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ stretch main non-free contrib > > o http://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ stretch-updates main contrib > non-free > > o http://ppa.launchpad.net/ayufan/rock64-ppa/ubuntu xenial main > So I have several choices, not all of which are arm64 based. I also have an old hp lappy I could put stretch on. And I found a BT dongle but no clue yet if compatible with the BTLE of the fitbit. More checking to see if it can pair. But I just now installed the rest of the BT toy's, but not checked for function yet. Might have to buy another dongle. And/or find a place to put things in this midden heap. Too many years in the same house, but its paid off too. Thanks. > > The reason for posting here is that galileo > > is supposedly written in python, > > but don't know if 2 or 3. > > The stretch package depends information for galileo > indicates it is for python3 > > $ apt-cache show galileo > .... > Depends: python3-requests (>= 2), python3-usb (>= 1.0.0~b2), > python3:any (>= 3.4~) > > > -- > Stanley C. Kitching > Human Being > Phoenix, Arizona -- Cheers, Gene Heskett -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
python 3.10 vs breakage
Greetings all; Its now become obvious that 3.10 has broken some things. I can't build linuxcnc with it. And Octoprint has quit talking to 3d printers, now pronterface won't buy it, can't find a 4.0.7 version of wxPython with it sitting there staring at us. Whats chances of a fixed version for bookworm? Or even a bugs fixed release for bullseye? Thanks all. Cheers, Gene Heskett. -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable. - Louis D. Brandeis Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: python 3.10 vs breakage
On 8/26/22 16:54, Paul Bryan wrote: Why can't you build linuxcnc with it? Why has Octoprint quit talking to 3d printers? Why won't pronterface buy it? Why can't you find a 4.0.7 version of wxPython? Why is it sitting there staring at you? What is bookworm? What is bullseye? Bullseye is the current debian-11, buster is last years, bookworm is next. Linuxcnc builds just fine on armhf buster, with its python-3.9.4. fails from 3.10 in bullseye. Pronterface.py can't find wxPython 4.0 or greater, with 4.0.7 installed. Octoprint did work, but has now stopped. So my 3d printing has become a sneakernet exercise again. Adding 3 to 5 more steps between OpenCSAD and the printer that will make my designs. The error code file from this mornings attempt to run pronterface.py is at <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/armhf> Is there a workaround? Thank you. On Fri, 2022-08-26 at 16:37 -0400, gene heskett wrote: Greetings all; Its now become obvious that 3.10 has broken some things. I can't build linuxcnc with it. And Octoprint has quit talking to 3d printers, now pronterface won't buy it, can't find a 4.0.7 version of wxPython with it sitting there staring at us. Whats chances of a fixed version for bookworm? Or even a bugs fixed release for bullseye? Thanks all. Cheers, Gene Heskett. -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable. - Louis D. Brandeis Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/> Cheers, Gene Heskett. -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable. - Louis D. Brandeis Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: python 3.10 vs breakage
On 8/26/22 21:35, Michael Torrie wrote: On 8/26/22 14:37, gene heskett wrote: Greetings all; Its now become obvious that 3.10 has broken some things. I can't build linuxcnc with it. And Octoprint has quit talking to 3d printers, now pronterface won't buy it, can't find a 4.0.7 version of wxPython with it sitting there staring at us. I have Fedora 35 here, nearing it's end of life. It has Python 3.10.6, and wxPython 4.0.7. I installed Pronterface 2.0.0 from the Fedora repos and it runs fine as near as I can tell. So there's no inherent incompatibility with Python 3.10 and wxPython 4.0.7. Whats chances of a fixed version for bookworm? Or even a bugs fixed release for bullseye? Seems like it is a distro-specific problem; I cannot replicate your error with pronterface on Fedora 35. I have no idea why octoprint won't work. This is good to know as it helps to narrow down the battlefield. Octoprint now gets stuck claiming the printer is continuously requesting a repeat of line one, but It works fine if the gcode file is put on its sd card and printed from the printers menu. Octoprint is supposed to be able to handle more than one printer, but this change occurred after I had plugged in another printer and tried to add it. It was working great with a prusa mk3S+. And I'm trying to resurrect an Ender 5 Plus that has forgotten how to use any of the 3 BLTouch's I have. So I've replaced the head with a volcano version of an E3D-V6 and have a prox switch with the wrong logic output mounted in place of the BLTouch. It seems amazon is not immune to ID10T vendors. I ordered npn-no's and got pnp-nc's. Even the label on the devices cable is wrong. The head replacement includes an Orbiter V2 extruder sitting on top of the volcano, with me designing and printing the adapters. but still with the long capricorn tube feed to absorb the jerking on the feed spool the mk3s+ does. Even with the much improved grip a bondtech LGX extruder on the mk3s+ gives, I can still see artifacts of the spool jerk as it runs left/right in the print. Vertical flex in the head transport suspension rods I believe. So I've eliminated that geometry error on the Ender 5 plus by interposing a fixed length of tubing so it doesn't jerk on the spool as the head moves. The Dell with an i5 in it had its video out nullified by some noisy weather 20 days back, so I pulled out a 5 amp 5 volt box and hung a rock64/w/4gigs on it to run octoprint on, but it quit working on the mk3s+ when I plugged in the Ender. I'll probably have to re-install it all. Easy enough since I have armbian bullseye's img file here. The target of all this is production of a woodworking tool using modern cnc wood carving and 3d printing, of a device I see selling in the 3 digit price range on ebay that you'll hand down to your great grandkids if they are interested in fine woodworking as a means to buy groceries, good housing and nice wheels. At my age, I'm that great great grandpa. Looking to supplement my SS in my dotage. A retired broadcast engineer, a C.E.T., approaching the end of my time here as I look at the calendar and see my 88th coming up shortly. I'd like to leave something useful behind. It will take at least 2 working printers to keep up with the output of one of my milling machines if sales materialize. 3d printers are not fast. A screw I can carve in 2 days, takes about 2 weeks to print the rest of it. Production, 20 a year, maybe. Thanks everybody. Take care and stay well. Cheers, Gene Heskett. -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable. - Louis D. Brandeis Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
What can I do about this?
Greatings all; Persuant to my claim the py3.10 is busted, here is a sample. This is me, trying to make pronterface, inside a venv: When the package manager version will only run the gui-less "pronsole" but nothing else from that all python kit runs as it should or at all. From the package-managers install in /usr/share/doc/printrun-common/ I copied requirements.txt into the venv, and ran this command line: gene@rock64:~/venv$ pip3 install -r requirements.txt Defaulting to user installation because normal site-packages is not writeable Ignoring pyobjc-framework-Cocoa: markers 'sys_platform == "darwin"' don't match your environment Ignoring pyreadline: markers 'sys_platform == "win32"' don't match your environment Requirement already satisfied: pyserial>=3.0 in /usr/lib/python3/dist-packages (from -r requirements.txt (line 1)) (3.5) Collecting wxPython>=4.1 Using cached wxPython-4.2.0.tar.gz (71.0 MB) Preparing metadata (setup.py) ... error error: subprocess-exited-with-error × python setup.py egg_info did not run successfully. │ exit code: 1 ╰─> [8 lines of output] Traceback (most recent call last): File "", line 2, in File "", line 34, in File "/tmp/pip-install-c9gmbpsr/wxpython_1a0e096c87d84229b709c31ccb920a24/setup.py", line 27, in from buildtools.config import Config, msg, opj, runcmd, canGetSOName, getSOName File "/tmp/pip-install-c9gmbpsr/wxpython_1a0e096c87d84229b709c31ccb920a24/buildtools/config.py", line 30, in from attrdict import AttrDict ModuleNotFoundError: No module named 'attrdict' [end of output] note: This error originates from a subprocess, and is likely not a problem with pip. error: metadata-generation-failed × Encountered error while generating package metadata. ╰─> See above for output. note: This is an issue with the package mentioned above, not pip. hint: See above for details. What do I need to do to fix this? It supposedly works on a rpi4b, but this is a rock64, V2, older stuff with 4 gigs of dram. Thank you for any help you can toss my way. Cheers, Gene Heskett. -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable. - Louis D. Brandeis Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: What can I do about this?
On 8/28/22 19:36, Chris Angelico wrote: On Mon, 29 Aug 2022 at 08:41, gene heskett wrote: Greatings all; Persuant to my claim the py3.10 is busted, here is a sample. This is me, trying to make pronterface, inside a venv: When the package manager version will only run the gui-less "pronsole" but nothing else from that all python kit runs as it should or at all. From the package-managers install in /usr/share/doc/printrun-common/ I copied requirements.txt into the venv, and ran this command line: gene@rock64:~/venv$ pip3 install -r requirements.txt Defaulting to user installation because normal site-packages is not writeable I don't think Python 3.10 is busted; it's more likely your venv is not providing a pip3 command. Try "pip3 --version", gene@rock64:~/venv$ pip3 --version pip 22.0.2 from /usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/pip (python 3.10) "python3 --version", gene@rock64:~/venv$ python3 --version Python 3.10.4 and then "python3 -m pip install -r requirements.txt". gene@rock64:~/venv$ python3 -m pip install -r requirements.txt Defaulting to user installation because normal site-packages is not writeable Ignoring pyobjc-framework-Cocoa: markers 'sys_platform == "darwin"' don't match your environment Ignoring pyreadline: markers 'sys_platform == "win32"' don't match your environment Requirement already satisfied: pyserial>=3.0 in /usr/lib/python3/dist-packages (from -r requirements.txt (line 1)) (3.5) Collecting wxPython>=4.1 Using cached wxPython-4.2.0.tar.gz (71.0 MB) Preparing metadata (setup.py) ... error error: subprocess-exited-with-error × python setup.py egg_info did not run successfully. │ exit code: 1 ╰─> [8 lines of output] Traceback (most recent call last): File "", line 2, in File "", line 34, in File "/tmp/pip-install-g3phtj8f/wxpython_17898b1c7a6f49a690adac623d839514/setup.py", line 27, in from buildtools.config import Config, msg, opj, runcmd, canGetSOName, getSOName File "/tmp/pip-install-g3phtj8f/wxpython_17898b1c7a6f49a690adac623d839514/buildtools/config.py", line 30, in from attrdict import AttrDict ModuleNotFoundError: No module named 'attrdict' [end of output] note: This error originates from a subprocess, and is likely not a problem with pip. error: metadata-generation-failed × Encountered error while generating package metadata. ╰─> See above for output. note: This is an issue with the package mentioned above, not pip. hint: See above for details. Why do you keep blaming Python as if it's fundamentally broken? ChrisA Given the above output, do you have a better target? It also fails to build linuxcnc on bullseye for armhf, on an rpi4b with 2 gigs of dram. Works perfectly on buster, but I expect that has been fixed since linuxcnc looks like its good to go for inclusion in bookworm. Take care and stay well Chris. Cheers, Gene Heskett. -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable. - Louis D. Brandeis Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: What can I do about this?
On 8/28/22 19:39, Peter J. Holzer wrote: On 2022-08-28 18:40:17 -0400, gene heskett wrote: Persuant to my claim the py3.10 is busted, here is a sample. This is me, trying to make pronterface, inside a venv: When the package manager version will only run the gui-less "pronsole" but nothing else from that all python kit runs as it should or at all. From the package-managers install in /usr/share/doc/printrun-common/ I copied requirements.txt into the venv, and ran this command line: gene@rock64:~/venv$ pip3 install -r requirements.txt You are almost certainly *not* in a venv here. First, your prompt doesn't show the name of the venv, I've created that several times, as octoprint won''t run without it either. I found a way to autostart it on reboots and octoprint seems happy with it Defaulting to user installation because normal site-packages is not writeable and second, because of this message, which you don't get if you invoke pip inside a venv (at least not if you can write it). So, first thing to do is to create the venv and activate it. Procedure? Or a url to it? Thank you Peter. Take care & stay well. hp Cheers, Gene Heskett. -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable. - Louis D. Brandeis Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: What can I do about this?
On 8/28/22 20:51, gene heskett wrote: On 8/28/22 19:36, Chris Angelico wrote: On Mon, 29 Aug 2022 at 08:41, gene heskett wrote: Greatings all; Persuant to my claim the py3.10 is busted, here is a sample. This is me, trying to make pronterface, inside a venv: When the package manager version will only run the gui-less "pronsole" but nothing else from that all python kit runs as it should or at all. From the package-managers install in /usr/share/doc/printrun-common/ I copied requirements.txt into the venv, and ran this command line: gene@rock64:~/venv$ pip3 install -r requirements.txt Defaulting to user installation because normal site-packages is not writeable I don't think Python 3.10 is busted; it's more likely your venv is not providing a pip3 command. Try "pip3 --version", gene@rock64:~/venv$ pip3 --version pip 22.0.2 from /usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/pip (python 3.10) "python3 --version", gene@rock64:~/venv$ python3 --version Python 3.10.4 and then "python3 -m pip install -r requirements.txt". gene@rock64:~/venv$ python3 -m pip install -r requirements.txt Defaulting to user installation because normal site-packages is not writeable Ignoring pyobjc-framework-Cocoa: markers 'sys_platform == "darwin"' don't match your environment Ignoring pyreadline: markers 'sys_platform == "win32"' don't match your environment Requirement already satisfied: pyserial>=3.0 in /usr/lib/python3/dist-packages (from -r requirements.txt (line 1)) (3.5) Collecting wxPython>=4.1 Using cached wxPython-4.2.0.tar.gz (71.0 MB) Preparing metadata (setup.py) ... error error: subprocess-exited-with-error × python setup.py egg_info did not run successfully. │ exit code: 1 ╰─> [8 lines of output] Traceback (most recent call last): File "", line 2, in File "", line 34, in File "/tmp/pip-install-g3phtj8f/wxpython_17898b1c7a6f49a690adac623d839514/setup.py", line 27, in from buildtools.config import Config, msg, opj, runcmd, canGetSOName, getSOName File "/tmp/pip-install-g3phtj8f/wxpython_17898b1c7a6f49a690adac623d839514/buildtools/config.py", line 30, in from attrdict import AttrDict ModuleNotFoundError: No module named 'attrdict' [end of output] note: This error originates from a subprocess, and is likely not a problem with pip. error: metadata-generation-failed × Encountered error while generating package metadata. ╰─> See above for output. note: This is an issue with the package mentioned above, not pip. hint: See above for details. Why do you keep blaming Python as if it's fundamentally broken? ChrisA Given the above output, do you have a better target? It also fails to build linuxcnc on bullseye for armhf, on an rpi4b with 2 gigs of dram. Works perfectly on buster, but I expect that has been fixed since linuxcnc looks like its good to go for inclusion in bookworm. I;ve created a separate venv to install printrun, I does not work either. So in that venv, I've done a git clone of printrun. Then after that, it appears there is no such critter as a wxPython.whl for the arms, only x86_64's. So whats the diff if it run ok on a pi, or claims it does. I don't have a spare rpi4b and they are equ to teeth for a chicken ATM. What, on the arms, substitutes for the missing "*.whl" file? Take care and stay well Chris. Cheers, Gene Heskett. Cheers, Gene Heskett. -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable. - Louis D. Brandeis Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: What can I do about this?
On 8/29/22 05:25, Roel Schroeven wrote:
Op 29/08/2022 om 2:55 schreef gene heskett:
On 8/28/22 19:39, Peter J. Holzer wrote:
On 2022-08-28 18:40:17 -0400, gene heskett wrote:
Persuant to my claim the py3.10 is busted, here is a sample. This
is me,
trying to make
pronterface, inside a venv: When the package manager version will
only run
the gui-less "pronsole"
but nothing else from that all python kit runs as it should or at all.
From the package-managers install in
/usr/share/doc/printrun-common/ I
copied requirements.txt
into the venv, and ran this command line:
gene@rock64:~/venv$ pip3 install -r requirements.txt
You are almost certainly *not* in a venv here. First, your prompt
doesn't show the name of the venv,
I've created that several times, as octoprint won''t run without it
either.
I found a way to autostart it on reboots and octoprint seems happy
with it
I agree with Peter: it doesn't look as if you are invoking the pip3 in
the venv. Just making the venv-directory the current directory doesn't
activate it.
As a diagnostic, ask the OS which pip3 is actually used:
$ type -a pip3
I get different answers in or out of the venv
venv) gene@rock64:~/printrun/Printrun$ type -a pip3
pip3 is /home/gene/printrun/Printrun/venv/bin/pip3
pip3 is /usr/bin/pip3
pip3 is /bin/pip3
or:
gene@rock64:~/src/wxPython-4.2.0$ type -a pip3
pip3 is /usr/bin/pip3
pip3 is /bin/pip3
but with all the build instructions I've now followed, I now have at
least 3 different
venv subdirs scattered about.
one in /home/gene,
one in /home/gene/Octoprint,
and one in /home/gene/printrun
each with its own bin subdir, but not identical contents.
Does that show the pip3 installed in the venv? Or the system-wide one?
If it's not the pip3 in the venv, well, then that's the problem (or at
least part of the problem). Solution: first check whether the venv
really contains 'pip3' (as opposed to eg. just 'pip'): list the
contents of the bin subdirectory of the venv.
gene@rock64:~/venv/bin$ ls -l
total 36
-rw-r--r-- 1 gene gene 1982 Aug 21 13:12 activate
-rw-r--r-- 1 gene gene 908 Aug 21 13:12 activate.csh
-rw-r--r-- 1 gene gene 2050 Aug 21 13:12 activate.fish
-rw-r--r-- 1 gene gene 9033 Aug 21 13:12 Activate.ps1
-rwxrwxr-x 1 gene gene 232 Aug 21 13:12 pip
-rwxrwxr-x 1 gene gene 232 Aug 21 13:12 pip3
-rwxrwxr-x 1 gene gene 232 Aug 21 13:12 pip3.10
lrwxrwxrwx 1 gene gene 7 Aug 21 13:11 python -> python3
lrwxrwxrwx 1 gene gene 16 Aug 21 13:11 python3 -> /usr/bin/python3
lrwxrwxrwx 1 gene gene 7 Aug 21 13:11 python3.10 -> python3
If not, use 'pip' or whatever instead. Then to make sure you use the
one in the venv, either activate the venv or explicitly specify the
path when invoking pip/pip3 (and likewise for python/python3).
So either (assuming you're using bash):
$ source {path_to_venv}/bin/pip3 # activate the venv
$ type -a pip3 # check whether now the correct pip3 is used
$ pip3 install -r requirements.txt # finally invoke pip3
or:
$ {path_to_venv}/bin/pip3 install -r requirements.txt
Activating the venv is easier if you're going to use multiple commands
in the venv. Note that activating the venv only has effect on the
current shell; other shells are unaffected, and when you close the
current shell the venv is not activated anymore.
Explicitly using the path is easier for one-off calls, or in things
like crontab.
I've not had to deal with venv's before. Can more than one of these venv
things
peacefully coexist? Seems like they should. If there is sufficient nv
memory,
But I am a 100% new bee here. The card itself is a 64GB.
I also have the git clone of wxPython-4.2.0, but nothing I can invoke
there builds it.
But there are no specific linux instructions there, osx and winders
only. The package
managers version of wxPython-4.0.7 apparently is not new enough.
It seems to me these utility's ought to be able to all live in one venv,
or there should be
an env python path that is specific to each application. This would lead
to a huge waste
of nv storage by duplicating a venv for each app, not sensible when the
target of the venv
is a common arm64 system. All broadcom for gpio etc.
Presently, Octoprint works, and so does pronsole which has no gui, but
Octoprint
is a one printer show, and I've a small farm of printers. Most of which have
failed the PETG test ,but that claimed to be PETG compatible, but
quickly failed
when fed a roll of it. PETG is the same plastic forever bottles are made
from, much
stronger than the PLA most folks use for artwork and what I'm doing
needs its
physical strength. It also raises the printhead temp around 50C, which
causes
teflon to slowly ablate with phosgene gas as output. Dangerous stuff,
and high
maintenance too.
What I hope to be the 2nd workhorse is an Ender 5 Plus, a huge core-xy
thing that
now has
Re: What can I do about this?
On 8/29/22 12:50, Mark Bourne wrote:
Roel Schroeven wrote:
Op 29/08/2022 om 2:55 schreef gene heskett:
On 8/28/22 19:39, Peter J. Holzer wrote:
On 2022-08-28 18:40:17 -0400, gene heskett wrote:
Persuant to my claim the py3.10 is busted, here is a sample. This
is me,
trying to make
pronterface, inside a venv: When the package manager version will
only run
the gui-less "pronsole"
but nothing else from that all python kit runs as it should or at
all.
From the package-managers install in
/usr/share/doc/printrun-common/ I
copied requirements.txt
into the venv, and ran this command line:
gene@rock64:~/venv$ pip3 install -r requirements.txt
You are almost certainly *not* in a venv here. First, your prompt
doesn't show the name of the venv,
I've created that several times, as octoprint won''t run without it
either.
I found a way to autostart it on reboots and octoprint seems happy
with it
I agree with Peter: it doesn't look as if you are invoking the pip3
in the venv. Just making the venv-directory the current directory
doesn't activate it.
As a diagnostic, ask the OS which pip3 is actually used:
$ type -a pip3
Does that show the pip3 installed in the venv? Or the system-wide
one? If it's not the pip3 in the venv, well, then that's the problem
(or at least part of the problem). Solution: first check whether the
venv really contains 'pip3' (as opposed to eg. just 'pip'): list the
contents of the bin subdirectory of the venv. If not, use 'pip' or
whatever instead. Then to make sure you use the one in the venv,
either activate the venv or explicitly specify the path when invoking
pip/pip3 (and likewise for python/python3).
So either (assuming you're using bash):
$ source {path_to_venv}/bin/pip3 # activate the venv
I think this first line should probably be:
$ source {path_to_venv}/bin/activate # activate the venv
i.e. with `activate` rather than `pip3`?
$ type -a pip3 # check whether now the correct pip3 is used
$ pip3 install -r requirements.txt # finally invoke pip3
or:
$ {path_to_venv}/bin/pip3 install -r requirements.txt
That got me to showstopper #2: (lengthy warniing)
(venv) gene@rock64:~/printrun/Printrun$ ./venv/bin/pip3 install -r
requirements.txt
Ignoring pyobjc-framework-Cocoa: markers 'sys_platform == "darwin"'
don't match your environment
Ignoring pyreadline: markers 'sys_platform == "win32"' don't match your
environment
Requirement already satisfied: pyserial>=3.0 in
./venv/lib/python3.10/site-packages (from -r requirements.txt (line 1))
(3.5)
Collecting wxPython==4.1.0
Using cached wxPython-4.1.0.tar.gz (65.8 MB)
Preparing metadata (setup.py) ... done
Collecting numpy>=1.8.2
Using cached
numpy-1.23.2-cp310-cp310-manylinux_2_17_aarch64.manylinux2014_aarch64.whl
(13.9 MB)
Requirement already satisfied: pyglet>=1.1 in
./venv/lib/python3.10/site-packages (from -r requirements.txt (line 4))
(1.5.26)
Collecting cffi
Using cached
cffi-1.15.1-cp310-cp310-manylinux_2_17_aarch64.manylinux2014_aarch64.whl
(449 kB)
Collecting cairocffi
Using cached cairocffi-1.3.0.tar.gz (88 kB)
Preparing metadata (setup.py) ... done
Collecting cairosvg>=1.0.9
Using cached CairoSVG-2.5.2-py3-none-any.whl (45 kB)
Collecting psutil>=2.1
Using cached psutil-5.9.1-cp310-cp310-linux_aarch64.whl
Collecting lxml>=2.9.1
Using cached
lxml-4.9.1-cp310-cp310-manylinux_2_17_aarch64.manylinux2014_aarch64.manylinux_2_24_aarch64.whl
(6.6 MB)
Collecting appdirs>=1.4.0
Using cached appdirs-1.4.4-py2.py3-none-any.whl (9.6 kB)
Collecting dbus-python>=1.2.0
Using cached dbus-python-1.2.18.tar.gz (578 kB)
Preparing metadata (setup.py) ... done
Collecting pillow
Using cached Pillow-9.2.0-cp310-cp310-manylinux_2_28_aarch64.whl (3.1 MB)
Collecting six
Using cached six-1.16.0-py2.py3-none-any.whl (11 kB)
Collecting pycparser
Using cached pycparser-2.21-py2.py3-none-any.whl (118 kB)
Collecting cssselect2
Using cached cssselect2-0.6.0-py3-none-any.whl (15 kB)
Collecting tinycss2
Using cached tinycss2-1.1.1-py3-none-any.whl (21 kB)
Collecting defusedxml
Using cached defusedxml-0.7.1-py2.py3-none-any.whl (25 kB)
Requirement already satisfied: webencodings in
./venv/lib/python3.10/site-packages (from
cssselect2->cairosvg>=1.0.9->-r requirements.txt (line 7)) (0.5.1)
Using legacy 'setup.py install' for wxPython, since package 'wheel' is
not installed.
Using legacy 'setup.py install' for cairocffi, since package 'wheel' is
not installed.
Using legacy 'setup.py install' for dbus-python, since package 'wheel'
is not installed.
Installing collected packages: dbus-python, appdirs, tinycss2, six,
pycparser, psutil, pillow, numpy, lxml, defusedxml, wxPython,
cssselect2, cffi, cairocffi, cairosvg
Running setup.py install for dbus-pyt
Re: What can I do about this?
On 8/29/22 15:12, Peter J. Holzer wrote:
On 2022-08-29 13:43:18 -0400, gene heskett wrote:
On 8/29/22 12:50, Mark Bourne wrote:
Roel Schroeven wrote:
$ pip3 install -r requirements.txt # finally invoke pip3
or:
$ {path_to_venv}/bin/pip3 install -r requirements.txt
That got me to showstopper #2: (lengthy warniing)
[...]
checking for dbus-1 >= 1.8... no
configure: error: Package requirements (dbus-1 >= 1.8) were not met:
No package 'dbus-1' found
Since this message comes from configure, it is probably looking
for the development version of the dbus library here.
apt search dbus-1
reveals (among other things):
libdbus-1-dev/jammy 1.12.20-2ubuntu4 amd64
simple interprocess messaging system (development headers)
(this is on Ubuntu, so the version number is probably different, but the
package name should be the same as on Debian.)
So you invoke
apt install libdbus-1-dev
and try again. At which point you will probably discove another missing
library. Rinse and repeat.
You left out the wash, ;) The next missing dev was a gtk thingy, but
search only returned
one .dev. One for spice-gtk, and that pulled in around 100 more
packages, and now its stuck
on wxPython for about 35 minutes and, way into swap, like several
hundred megs &
growing. I even went to its keyboard and shut down chromium to give it
more play
room. Didn't seem to help though. But it hasn't errored, and swap is
going down a
meg here and there. Pounding that poor, cheap sd card all to hell I
expect. At some point,
I'll unpack a startech usb3-sata cable and try an SSD. But I'll not
disturb this just yet.
Works well on an r-pi4b where I can build linuxcnc in half an hour from
the git pull. I
run a 3/4 ton, 80 yo Sheldon lathe with linuxcnc just to see if I could
do it, first on an rpi3b.
Had to build my own realtime kernel and figure out how to install it
because I wanted to
do it on a pi, got black holed on their forum. The amazing part is that
the tarball to install
it is only 28 megs uncompressed.
Ideally the README should mention such dependencies, but since the exact
names of the packages depend on the distribution, it will often be vague
unless you happen to use the same distribution as the developer.
Your forgot to mention that each packager is working in his own sound
proof booth, so
each comes up with a somewhat different way to pound that square peg
into a 7 point hole.
;o)>
It was obviously going to take hours so I took a nap and 4 hours later
it had left out a
few things but kept on going until it hit another showstopper while
building wxPython-4.1.
At which point it spit out 2600 some lines of backtrace.
Ending with this:
In file included from
../../../../sip/cpp/sip_glcanvaswxGLContext.cpp:10:
../../../../sip/cpp/sipAPI_glcanvas.h:865:198: error:
‘wxGLCanvasName’ was not declared in this scope; did you mean ‘wxGLCanvas’?
865 | wxGLCanvas(wxWindow *parent, const wxGLAttributes
&dispAttrs, wxWindowID id=wxID_ANY, const wxPoint
&pos=wxDefaultPosition, const wxSize &size=wxDefaultSize, long style=0,
const wxString &name=wxGLCanvasName, const wxPalette &palette=wxNullPalette)
| ^~
| wxGLCanvas
Waf: Leaving directory
`/tmp/pip-install-1myz6noi/wxpython_5fdcad39f0c544599dd49fdd522391f2/build/waf/3.1/gtk3'
Build failed
-> task in '_glcanvas' failed with exit status 1 (run with -v to
display more information)
-> task in '_glcanvas' failed with exit status 1 (run with -v to
display more information)
-> task in '_glcanvas' failed with exit status 1 (run with -v to
display more information)
-> task in '_glcanvas' failed with exit status 1 (run with -v to
display more information)
Command '"/home/gene/printrun/Printrun/venv/bin/python3"
/tmp/pip-install-1myz6noi/wxpython_5fdcad39f0c544599dd49fdd522391f2/bin/waf-2.0.19
--wx_config=/tmp/pip-install-1myz6noi/wxpython_5fdcad39f0c544599dd49fdd522391f2/build/wxbld/gtk3/wx-config
--gtk3 --python="/home/gene/printrun/Printrun/venv/bin/python3"
--out=build/waf/3.1/gtk3 configure build ' failed with exit code 1.
Finished command: build_py (100m40.712s)
Finished command: build (171m37.482s)
Command '"/home/gene/printrun/Printrun/venv/bin/python3" -u
build.py build' failed with exit code 1.
[end of output]
note: This error originates from a subprocess, and is likely not a
problem with pip.
error: legacy-install-failure
× Encountered error while trying to install package.
╰─> wxPython
note: This is an issue with the package mentioned above, not pip.
hint: See above for output from the failure.
Now, I have the unpacked tarball of wxPython-4.2.0 sitting in
/home/gene/src.
Where would I mv it to to substituted
venv questions
Greetings all; The command to setup a venv, "python -m venv venv" has no man page that I have found. So I'm guessing that one of the venv's is the name of the one being created. Probably argv(3) in c parlance. What I am thinking about is setting up two venv's more or less named for the printer that copy of octoprint will administer, So how about some tutorial on creating the venv? But that might create another problem. how to differentiate the servers, both of which will want to use localhost:5000 to serve up their web pages we run things with. Suggested solutions? Cheers, Gene Heskett. -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable. - Louis D. Brandeis Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Running two separate servers (was Re: venv questions)
On 8/29/22 23:22, Chris Angelico wrote: On Tue, 30 Aug 2022 at 12:59, gene heskett wrote: But that might create another problem. how to differentiate the servers, both of which will want to use localhost:5000 to serve up their web pages we run things with. Suggested solutions? This is nothing to do with venvs, so I'm forking the thread. By far the easiest way to differentiate them is to NOT have them both on localhost:5000. Depending on how you invoke the servers, you should be able to find a way to configure one (or both) of them to a different port; common methods include a "--port" argument, setting the PORT environment variable, and poking in the code to find the number 5000 and changing it to some other value. (Less common methods include poking in ctypes to find the number 5000 and changing it to some other value. Mentioned only because I realise the alternative interpretation of my previous comment.) Another method would be to change the "localhost" part. The standard for IP addresses is that 127.x.y.z means localhost, regardless of what x, y, and z are; so you could have one of them bind to 127.0.0.2 and the other to 127.0.0.3, which you could then use in your browser the same way (http://127.0.0.2:5000/ and http://127.0.0.3:5000/ respectively). But if you can't change anything else, you'll have to make the two processes cooperate in some way, or worst case, just make sure you shut one down before you start the other up. ChrisA That is a limitation I'd druther not have to deal with Chris. I want two separate octoprint servers running with no interaction between them. So I'm thinking of venv's named rock64prusa, and rock64ender5+, each with "port#" on my local net. So chromium could have two tabs open, one to localhost:5000 and one to localhost:5001, totally independent of each other. I already have that in my /etc/hosts file. No dns resolving involved. And from snooping just now, the port # is set it /etc/default/octoprint, so copy /etc/default/octoprint to octoprint-prusa, and to octoprint-ender5+, do the same in /etc/init.d, and change the port # & venv name in the -ender5+ version. Then reconfigure the ender5+ version to drive that printer. With the venv isolation, it should work, with a browser tab at localhost:5000 and another tab at localhost:5001, each pointing at its own directory tree in /home/gene. The separation is also because of the way linux finds usb facilities, the prusa is always /dev/ttyACM0 and the ender5+ is almost always /dev/ttyUSB0. in this case I've a 4 port usb hub with port disabling switches plugged into the rock64. One of the things I want to try is plugging in a startech usb3 to sata adapter with a small SSD plugged into it, and move the /tmp directory off that poor u-sd card to prolong its life. And each with its own input buffer that cura can see from here. The new cura 5.1 has its own set of problems, not being able to see octoprints defaulted input buffer hidden behind a dotted directory being a starter, toss in that it has no way to look at .. and that requires a user session of mc just to move the gcode produced to be printed from a local dir here to the input buffer of that instance of octoprint. Back at this come daylight. Thank you Chris. Cheers, Gene Heskett. -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable. - Louis D. Brandeis Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Running two separate servers (was Re: venv questions)
On 8/30/22 06:52, Chris Angelico wrote: On Tue, 30 Aug 2022 at 19:51, gene heskett wrote: So I'm thinking of venv's named rock64prusa, and rock64ender5+, each with "port#" on my local net. So chromium could have two tabs open, one to localhost:5000 and one to localhost:5001, totally independent of each other. As I said, that has absolutely nothing to do with venvs, so you'd have to figure out how to change their port numbers independently. (Although you could probably add an env var to the venv's activation script, if that would help.) ChrisA The short script as /etc/default/octoprint has that PORT item. I see no reason it couldn't be renamed and edited to affect the desired separation. (venv) gene@rock64:~/printrun/Printrun/venv$ cat /etc/default/octoprint == # Configuration for /etc/init.d/octoprint # The init.d script will only run if this variable non-empty. OCTOPRINT_USER=gene # base directory to use, change this for cura in both copies so cura can see it on the /sshnet # make it unique and get rid of the dot. BASEDIR=/home/gene/.octoprint # configuration file to use, relocate this for uniqueness CONFIGFILE=/home/gene/.octoprint/config.yaml # On what port to run daemon, default is 5000, anything not it use for 2nd ender5+ version PORT=5000 # Path to the OctoPrint executable, you need to set this to match your installation! # change the venv to a unique name DAEMON=/home/gene/OctoPrint/venv/bin/octoprint # What arguments to pass to octoprint, usually no need to touch this DAEMON_ARGS="--port=$PORT" # Umask of files octoprint generates, Change this to 000 if running octoprint as its own, separate user UMASK=022 # Process priority, 0 here will result in a priority 20 process. # -2 ensures Octoprint has a slight priority over user processes. NICELEVEL=-2 # Should we run at startup? START=yes EOF Edit two copies of this in defaults with individual names, Edit 2 copies of /etc/init.d/octoprint with unique names make two uniquely named venv's. The two should never meet nor interfere with each other. So far, I've got it running in a venv named prusa-mk3s. Now checking to see if it see's a gcode file uploaded directly from cura here on this machine. Short answer is no, octoprint cannot see an uploads directory in the prusa-mk3s directory. In fact, it cannot see, or even create a new uploads directory. But I made one with mc, put a gcode file there, not seen, got po'd and gave it 755 perms, bingo, it needed exec perms, and cura wasn't setting them. Chalk up another bitch at cura. Or at octoprint, gcode is a text file fur crying in the beer. The rwXrwXrwX should not affect it IMO. I need another batch of cable clips to neaten up the ender5+, so let me see if it can do that. Now that I have the rules in hand, maybe I can make a second copy work at the same time. IF I can figure out how to make it use a unique name for its PID identifier . Might have to change a character in the launchers name w/o changing the script. Or better yet, rename the executable? IDK. And hour lateer, cable clips went nice and clean, so the first instance is working fine. And there isn't a PID for octoprint anyplace in /var unless its under the snakes umbrella. Progress, discovering bugs and work-arounds in octoprint. Now I'm waiting on the mail for parts. Among other things a bigger PSU for the rock64. See if that reduces the video glitches from usb activity. Cheers, Gene Heskett. -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable. - Louis D. Brandeis Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: NEO6 GPS with Py PICO with micropython
On 11/29/22 06:56, KK CHN wrote: List , I am following this tutorial to get latitude and longitude data using NEO6 GPS module and Py PICO to read the GPS data from the device. I followed the code specified in this tutorial. https://microcontrollerslab.com/neo-6m-gps-module-raspberry-pi-pico-micropython/ I have installed thony IDE in my Desktop(windows PC) and run the code after the devices all connected and using USB cable connected to my PC. When I ran the program I am able to see the output of latitude and longitude in the console of thony IDE. But between certain intervals of a few seconds I am getting the latitude and longitude data ( its printing GPS data not found ?? ) in the python console. The satellite count from the $GGPA output showing 03 .. and the GPS data not found repeating randomly for intervals of seconds. Any hints why it is missing the GPS data (randomly) ?? PS:- The GPS device I placed outside my window and connected to the PC with a USB cable from the PICO module. GPS device NEO6 light (Red LED ) blinking even though the " GPS data not found" messages in th python console. Any hints ?? most welcome Yours, Krishane From a retired broadcast engineer, intimately familiar with vswr: std, wire only usb cables can get to acting flaky at 5 feet. If the cable to the receiver is more than that, a higher quality cable may be required. The better cable will probably have active electronics in the molded on ends that treats the cable as a transmission line, Which if done right can go as much as ten meters at usb2 speeds. Cheers, Gene Heskett. -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable. - Louis D. Brandeis Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/> -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
