Re: A few things who still suck in RedHat 8 aka constructive criticism
Great. Not to be a dick but. I think RH has done a great thing for the overall MARKET in 8.0. But what RH needs to remember and I think what I see you are angry at is that 8.0 is not for you and not for the typical LINUX user. But by no means is 8.0 NOT Linux, in fact I think it is the embodiment of what LINUX really is. What I mean by that is that they exercised they're right to MODIFY something to achieve the desire. I think to appease more users RH needs to come out w/ a TECHNICAL & NON-TECHNICAL distribution. > On Friday 22 November 2002 11:58 am, Jean Francois Martinez wrote: > > Let's see, I am stuck trying to install kdeadmin and koffice from > source, and I am finding that RH has customized things so that we > either have to use the RH version of KDE, or forget it. > > As far as I am concerned: > > RH broke the beauty of Linux. And the beauty of RH, which was real linux > until recently. > > I'm off shopping for Mandrake 9.0 tommorrow. > > -- > Rob Blomquist > Kirkland, WA > > On the side of the software box, in the 'System Requirements' section, > it said 'Requires Windows 95 or better'. So I installed Linux and lived > happily ever after. > > > > -- > Psyche-list mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Creating Bootable Installation CD
Title: Message Dear folks, I recently downloaded RH 8 (Psyche) release from one of my friend..and i burnt the CDs. The problem was, the CD was not bootable. Anyway, i used the boot image /images/boot.img found on disk 1 to create a boot disk (floppy), and installed RH 8 on my machine Now, what i would like to do is, i would like to create a BOOTABLE INSTALLATION CD (DISK 1) I tried giving the following command : # mkisofs -o rh8img.iso -b /mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin -c isolinux/boot.cat -no-emul-boot -boot-load-size 4 -boot-info-table -R -J -V -T /mnt/cdrom/ but i got the following error msg : mkisofs: Uh oh, I cant find the boot image '/mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin' # ls /mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin -l-r--r--r-- 2 root root 8696 Sep 11 02:21 /mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin What could be the problem and what is the CORRECT way of creating a bootable installation CD ? regards,Arjun
Re: A few things who still suck in RedHat 8 aka constructive criticism
On Sat, Nov 23, 2002 00:31:01 at 12:31:01AM -0800, David Durst ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: > > I think to appease more users RH needs to come out w/ a TECHNICAL & > NON-TECHNICAL distribution. > David, I agree with you, but one can already have a "TECHNICAL" RH 8.0 distribution, as you call it. Isn't it equivalent to "install the base system and do everything else from sources and/or your own RPMs"? In that way you still have base Red Hat packages and structure, RPM, updated software, etc... and your very own system, don't you? As long as Red Hat keeps as lean and mean as possible the base install, and sorts out RPM dependencies so that one installs only what is *really* needed for a specific application, it doesn't really matter what the default "full desktop" looks like, does it? Actually it is probably better for new Linux users if the first thing they see looks familiar. Experienced users will make their own system anyway, whatever the default is (I installed psyche three weeks ago, use it as desktop daily, and never seen Bluecurve, KDE or Gnome yet..) Ciao, Marco Fioretti Red Hat for low memory: www.rule-project.org/en/ -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: A few things who still suck in RedHat 8 aka constructivecriticism
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 08:03, Warren Togami wrote: > Jean Francois Martinez wrote: > > 1) Better package management: At last we got an RPM front end who > > Use apt-get and Synaptic for better package management. Find this and > many other tips on my Red Hat 8.0 Tips & Tricks page. > > http://www.mplug.org/phpwiki/index.php/RedHat8.0TipsTricks > Plese. I do not want the problem solved for myself I want solved for everyone and that means a native form. And I don't want to fuel the arrogance of Debian wanabees: it has more than enough fuel by itself. :-) JFM -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: A few things who still suck in RedHat 8 aka constructive criticism
On Sat, Nov 23, 2002 11:42:46 at 11:42:46AM +0100, Jean Francois Martinez ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: > > > > Plese. I do not want the problem solved for myself I want > solved for everyone and that means a native form. Why can't that "native form" be "completely intgrate apt-get for RPM and synaptic" in standard Red Hat? > And I don't want to > fuel the arrogance of Debian wanabees: it has more than enough fuel by > itself. :-) > Even if that were true, do you really care? Why should you? *If* porting apt-get is technically wrong, please explain why; if it is a good solution, refusing it only because it comes from Debian is arrogance too, isn't it? Ciao, Marco Fioretti Red Hat for low memory: www.rule-project.org/en/ -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: A few things who still suck in RedHat 8 aka constructive criticism
On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, Marco Fioretti wrote: >> Plese. I do not want the problem solved for myself I want >> solved for everyone and that means a native form. > >Why can't that "native form" be "completely intgrate apt-get for RPM >and synaptic" in standard Red Hat? If you wan't Debian, then by all means go use Debian. Red Hat is about as likely to add apt-get to Red Hat Linux, as Debian is to include up2date in Debian GNU/Linux. >> And I don't want to fuel the arrogance of Debian wanabees: >> it has more than enough fuel by itself. :-) > >Even if that were true, do you really care? Why should you? *If* >porting apt-get is technically wrong, please explain why; if it >is a good solution, refusing it only because it comes from >Debian is arrogance too, isn't it? Wether or not apt-get is a good solution or not depends on a given person's individual tastes. Red Hat provides up2date, for this purpose in Red Hat Linux. The beauty of open source, is that if you wish to use some tool that does not come with your chosen OS, or is not supported by your chosen distribution, you have a variety of options available, including, but not limited to: - Download and install the given unsupported software - Switch to a different distribution that comes with, and possibly even supports the particular software that you wish to use. Open source does give people these, and many more choices. -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: DELL Optiplex GX260 / 1702FP monitor / Intel i845 video...
On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, Ken Kleiner wrote: >X11 doesn't seem to want to work on our latest DELL GX260 with a >DELL Flat panel screen. > > The system has a Intel i845 card in it, which the OS sees fine, and works >well with a DELL 21" tube monitor (X and text). > > We've tried plugging in a DELL FP1702 (flat panel) monitor into the system >and running > > redhat-config-xfree86 --reconfig --noui --verbose > > This created what appears to be the proper entries in XF86Config, but >X still crashes with server errors. > > I've tried trying just a new install (booting off of RH 8.0 CD) and even >choosing the 'text' install, but that yields a black output screen with >the 'cannot display this video mode' message on the monitor (coming from >the monitor). > > Any ideas or working configs? Intel i845 video hardware is not supported by Red Hat Linux 8.0, nor by XFree86 4.2.x. Support for this hardware will be in XFree86 4.3.0. -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: DELL Optiplex GX260 / 1702FP monitor / Intel i845 video... FIX
On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, Stephen Mah wrote: >Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 14:53:45 -0800 >From: Stephen Mah <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed >List-Id: Discussion of Red Hat Linux 8.0 (Psyche) >Subject: Re: DELL Optiplex GX260 / 1702FP monitor / Intel i845 video... FIX > >Ken, > >I finally got my Dell GX260 to work with >XFree86-4.2.99.2-0.20021105.0.i386 rpm files from Mike Harris at Redhat. >They can be found here: >ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris/testing/extremely-unstable-development-code/XFree86/4.2.99.2-0.20021110.5/i386/ >There are about 30 rpm files. There is a README file in the ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris/testing directory that I urge everyone to read before even thinking of trying these RPM packages. I specifically request that NOBODY email me asking me questions or asking for ANY help on getting these X RPM's to work on their system. I only say this because I get inundated with email, and I do not have time for helping people with developmental software. >It's experiemental code, that's un-supported. It is stable on my 260, so >I'm not complaining. >I'm getting 1024x768 @ 24bit on my Compaq TFT5005. > >Please read: >ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris/testing/extremely-unstable-development-code/README-XFree86.txt Yes.. Please please please everyone, read this README. >Oh, one more thing, I had to add Xft-2.0-1.rpm because if was >complaining about the libXft.so.2 library. I'm not sure what the deal is >with this. But, it worked after I installed it. It also added a cool 3d >like cursor. No, all you needed to do was run "ldconfig" manually at the commandline. I have no idea why this occurs yet. I'll be fixing it sometime though. Hope this helps. TTYL -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Dist. Suggestions
On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, David Durst wrote: >Ok, maybe OpenLDAP does come w/ it. My mistake - but when you click >to do a FULL INSTALL it doesn't. A full install does not install every single RPM package. There is a reason for that. >And great RH doesn't support Binary Modules - you can get a >source version compile it on your own and then send it out as a >binary. If the source were available, then it WOULD NOT BE BINARY ONLY now would it? Binary only modules, by definition, are modules to which the source code is NOT AVAILABLE. >Or maybe I am getting it wrong here, lemme look at it the other >way. You don't want to support the project of a module? If so >then why dist software at all? Red Hat got where it is today by following a set of principles and values that have made it one of the largest and most used Linux distributions. Why distribute it all? Simple, because it is popular, and gaining more popularity daily - without including binary only modules. Feel free to select a different distribution that does ship binary only modules - you do have that choice. >It just a piece of software that POSSIBLE could be borken when >you ship it but that should be no concern of yours considering >XMMS & Postgres :) We can fix xmms and postgresql. Nice try. Invalid point. >Just ship the damn module so RH 8.1 or whatever can support >about 75% of the wireless NICS on the market. Absolutely and completely totally _NO_. Switch to another distribution that ships it if you must. >This discussion reminds me of the pre Donald Becker days and >dealing w/ regular NIC cards. This discussion reminds me of getting a root canal, and I've never gotten one. -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: A few things who still suck in RedHat 8 aka constructive criticism
On Fri, 22 Nov 2002, Rob Blomquist wrote: >Let's see, I am stuck trying to install kdeadmin and koffice from source, and >I am finding that RH has customized things so that we either have to use the >RH version of KDE, or forget it. What is wrong with the included kdeadmin and koffice that are part of Red Hat Linux 8.0? -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: sbin and /usr/sbin
On Fri, 22 Nov 2002, Tommy McNeely wrote: >Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 16:32:34 -0700 >From: Tommy McNeely <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed >List-Id: Discussion of Red Hat Linux 8.0 (Psyche) >Subject: sbin and /usr/sbin > > >in /etc/profile, I have had to comment out the "if" and "fi" lines to make >the "sbin" paths automatically be part of a "users" path.. (like for >traceroute)... why do I have to do this?? > ># Path manipulation >#if [ `id -u` = 0 ]; then >pathmunge /sbin >pathmunge /usr/sbin >pathmunge /usr/local/sbin >#fi > > >just cause its in the sbin path does not mean that only root can run it... >sbin is for "static-binaries" right?? /sbin and /usr/sbin have never been part of a user's path in traditional Unix and Linux systems. While some distributions may possibly put these directories in users paths by default, it is by no means a standard. -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
RE: Creating Bootable Installation CD
Title: Message hi all, can anyone tell me how to create a bootable Installation CD ? (i have the RH 8 cd 1 with me, which is not bootable..) Any help / pointers would be of great help. regards,Arjun -Original Message-From: Arjun Karkal Prabhu Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 3:04 PMTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Subject: Creating Bootable Installation CD Dear folks, I recently downloaded RH 8 (Psyche) release from one of my friend..and i burnt the CDs. The problem was, the CD was not bootable. Anyway, i used the boot image /images/boot.img found on disk 1 to create a boot disk (floppy), and installed RH 8 on my machine Now, what i would like to do is, i would like to create a BOOTABLE INSTALLATION CD (DISK 1) I tried giving the following command : # mkisofs -o rh8img.iso -b /mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin -c isolinux/boot.cat -no-emul-boot -boot-load-size 4 -boot-info-table -R -J -V -T /mnt/cdrom/ but i got the following error msg : mkisofs: Uh oh, I cant find the boot image '/mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin' # ls /mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin -l-r--r--r-- 2 root root 8696 Sep 11 02:21 /mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin What could be the problem and what is the CORRECT way of creating a bootable installation CD ? regards,Arjun
Re: Creating Bootable Installation CD
On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, Arjun Karkal Prabhu wrote: >I recently downloaded RH 8 (Psyche) release from one of my friend..and i >burnt the CDs. > >The problem was, the CD was not bootable. >Anyway, i used the boot image /images/boot.img found on disk 1 to create >a boot disk (floppy), and installed RH 8 on my machine > >Now, what i would like to do is, i would like to create a BOOTABLE >INSTALLATION CD (DISK 1) >I tried giving the following command : > ># mkisofs -o rh8img.iso -b /mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin -c >isolinux/boot.cat -no-emul-boot -boot-load-size 4 -boot-info-table -R >-J -V -T /mnt/cdrom/ > >but i got the following error msg : > >mkisofs: Uh oh, I cant find the boot image >'/mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin' > ># ls /mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin -l >-r--r--r--2 root root 8696 Sep 11 02:21 >/mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin > >What could be the problem >and what is the CORRECT way of creating a bootable installation CD ? The first CD of Red Hat Linux _is_ bootable. You do not need to do anything special to boot from it other than burning it to disk like any other ISO image, and booting from it. If it does not work then either: - your media is bad - your system is not configured properly in the CMOS or otherwise to boot from CD - there is a bug I would suspect #1 or #2 first. -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
RE: Creating Bootable Installation CD
Hello. Did you checked md5 sum after download? If is ok and You burned well the cd1 is bootable. Josep Begin of Quote Arjun Karkal Prabhu : > >hi all, > >can anyone tell me how to create a bootable Installation CD ? >(i have the RH 8 cd 1 with me, which is not bootable..) > > >Any help / pointers would be of great help. > > >regards, >Arjun > > > > -Original Message- >From: Arjun Karkal Prabhu >Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 3:04 PM >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Creating Bootable Installation CD >Dear folks, > >I recently downloaded RH 8 (Psyche) release from one of my friend..and i burnt the >CDs. > >The problem was, the CD was not bootable. >Anyway, i used the boot image /images/boot.img found on disk 1 to create a boot disk >(floppy), and installed RH 8 on my machine > >Now, what i would like to do is, i would like to create a BOOTABLE INSTALLATION CD >(DISK 1) >I tried giving the following command : > ># mkisofs -o rh8img.iso -b /mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin -c isolinux/boot.cat >-no-emul-boot -boot-load-size 4 -boot-info-table -R -J -V -T /mnt/cdrom/ > >but i got the following error msg : > >mkisofs: Uh oh, I cant find the boot image '/mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin' > ># ls /mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin -l >-r--r--r--2 root root 8696 Sep 11 02:21 >/mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin > >What could be the problem >and what is the CORRECT way of creating a bootable installation CD ? > > >regards, >Arjun -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
RE: Creating Bootable Installation CD
Hi Actually, my friend had the Installation CD, which was bootable (on my system)... So, I used the following command To create a ISO. # mkisofs -f -iso-level=1 -J -r -T -pad -v -o CD1.ISO -V "RHcd1" /mnt/cdrom/ Now, using this CD1.ISO, which I created, I wrote the CD using Easy CD creator. -The Media is OK. -The CMOS can boot other bootable CD. I think there is something wrong with the above command that I gave. (bcoz, I created the CD1.ISO) Now, what I want is, to create a BOOTABLE installation CD. How do I proceed ? regards, Arjun -Original Message- From: Josep M. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 6:56 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: Creating Bootable Installation CD Hello. Did you checked md5 sum after download? If is ok and You burned well the cd1 is bootable. Josep Begin of Quote Arjun Karkal Prabhu : > >hi all, > >can anyone tell me how to create a bootable Installation CD ? >(i have the RH 8 cd 1 with me, which is not bootable..) > > >Any help / pointers would be of great help. > > >regards, >Arjun > > > > -Original Message- >From: Arjun Karkal Prabhu >Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 3:04 PM >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Creating Bootable Installation CD >Dear folks, > >I recently downloaded RH 8 (Psyche) release from one of my friend..and i burnt the CDs. > >The problem was, the CD was not bootable. >Anyway, i used the boot image /images/boot.img found on disk 1 to create a boot disk (floppy), and installed RH 8 on my machine > >Now, what i would like to do is, i would like to create a BOOTABLE INSTALLATION CD (DISK 1) >I tried giving the following command : > ># mkisofs -o rh8img.iso -b /mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin -c isolinux/boot.cat -no-emul-boot -boot-load-size 4 -boot-info-table -R -J -V -T /mnt/cdrom/ > >but i got the following error msg : > >mkisofs: Uh oh, I cant find the boot image '/mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin' > ># ls /mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin -l >-r--r--r--2 root root 8696 Sep 11 02:21 /mnt/cdrom/isolinux/isolinux.bin > >What could be the problem >and what is the CORRECT way of creating a bootable installation CD ? > > >regards, >Arjun -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Video Card recommendation
On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, Markku Kolkka wrote: >Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 02:04:30 +0200 >From: Markku Kolkka <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" >List-Id: Discussion of Red Hat Linux 8.0 (Psyche) >Subject: Re: Video Card recommendation > >Viestissä Keskiviikko 20. Marraskuuta 2002 13:12, Mike A. Harris kirjoitti: >> Again, "Built by ATI" are the only cards tested, officially >> supported, and likely to work without trouble. > >So Red Hat is only officially supporting North American customers and the rest >of the world (who can only buy "powered by ATI" cards) is left stranded? No, you totally completely did not understand what I am saying. Red Hat does not own the XFree86 project. XFree86.org is its own organization, and its own project, and the work done by XFree86.org developing XFree86 is made publically available under the MIT license (similar to the BSD license) for anyone to use. Red Hat, like all other distributions, ships XFree86 with our Linux distribution. If XFree86 source code does not contain any support at all for a given video card, then that video card is _unsupported_ period, both at the XFree86 level, and also at the Red Hat level. You can try every Linux distribution available on the Internet, and you get *no working video* period. The ATI video drivers are developed and maintained by several people including but not limited to ATI, Marc Aurele La France, Kevin Martin, Keith Whitwell, and various other contributors, bugfix contributors, etc. Pretty much *ALL* of the developers working on the ATI drivers, are using real "Built by ATI" hardware. That means that "Built by ATI" hardware is the most tested hardware, and is the hardware developers have when bugs get reported. "Powered by ATI" hardware produced by 3rd party vendors, may follow ATI's own board designs faithfully, or they may drift off on their own, use cheaper memory, or make other modifications. It is possible that those modifications may be different enough that it warrants changes to be made to video drivers in order for the driver to work with the given video card. Without video driver modifications, a given board may not work at all, or may possibly just have some weird glitches, or perhaps unstable video output due to bad timings. As such, until the video drivers are MODIFIED, such hardware WILL NOT WORK. You can use any Linux distribution you like, and you will get the same result - non-working video. How can these cards be supported then? Well, first of all, some of them DO work, and if they do, that is great. But developers generally do NOT have these boards, and there are many different manufacturers producing them, so it is not easily possible to obtain every single possible board out there and make it work. Ultimately, it is up to the hardware vendor to submit patches to XFree86.org to make their hardware work. They KNOW their hardware, and what modifications are needed to video drivers to work properly. We, do not. In order to make a video card work, you need to have that card, and have the specs for it. In the case of clone cards, knowing what specific differences the vendor has made to the design may be sufficient. In any case, support doesn't just fall out of the air, and people are not able to just write support for something without the proper details. As such, if you want a good chance at having working ATI card, then I suggest you get a "Built by ATI" card, as I KNOW that pretty much all ATI built video hardware works. For "Powered by ATI" hardware, I have indeed received bug reports, and there is NOTHING that I can do to fix the problem currently. I do not have the problem card(s), nor the details required in order to add support. They may or may not work, it is entirely a dice roll that the end user makes. If and when enhancements become available that support cards that do not work, then they will be added to Red Hat Linux at some point as well. >Should I switch to some European-based distro? That would just get you a European based Linux distribution that also does not support the exact same video hardware, and for the exact same reasons specified above. >What's Red Hat Europe doing? Working on Red Hat Linux, the same as the rest of us. I *KNOW* that some of the Powered by ATI cards do not work, and if I could fix them easily, then I would of course - as would anyone. Since that is not easily possible at this time, I do my best to INFORM our users what hardware to be a bit wary of, so they can avoid purchasing a video card that can only be used as a doorstop. And what do I get in return? People threatening to use some other distribution that also does not support the same hardware. Oh well, I guess that is the price one pays to try to help someone. -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc.
(no subject)
Hello all, I'm having problems getting sound to work in Psyche. First it did'nt work at all. Then I installed Alsa and I'm getting something now but still not good. Here's the beef. I have installed alsa as per the installation rules, have modified the etc/modules.files and loaded the modules for my sound card (VIA8233). Here are the symptoms _Now when I open any application I get a weird throbbing sound which stops after a while. _When I open the Gnome Sound Controller all the devices are marked as locked. If I uncheck the Locked box, close Gnome Sound Controller and reopen it, the Locked Box is checked again. And after trying to unckeck them Gnome Sound controller crashes. I see the following error message : This version of the Gnome Volume Controller has been compiled with the version 3.8.2 of OSS but your system is using the 3.8.16 version. _ When I launch XMMS and tr to play a song nothing happens and XMMS stops reacting to commands and finally crashes. I'm using xmms-1.2.7-13. _ When I use Mplayer I get sound ok when it uses oss but not when I instruct the soft to use alsa9. These are the symptoms. Now here is my configuration : kernel 2.4.18-18.8.0 alsa-kernel-0.9.0-fr0rc6.1_2.4.18_18.8.0 alsa-driver-0.9.0-fr0rc6.1 /etc/modules.conf alias char-major-116 snd alias snd-card-0 snd-via82xx # module options should go here # OSS/Free portion alias char-major-14 soundcore alias sound-slot-0 snd-card-0 # card #1 alias sound-service-0-0 snd-mixer-oss alias sound-service-0-1 snd-seq-oss alias sound-service-0-3 snd-pcm-oss alias sound-service-0-8 snd-seq-oss alias sound-service-0-12 snd-pcm-oss #post-install snd-card-0 /usr/sbin/alsactl restore >/dev/null 2>&1 || : #pre-remove snd-card-0 /usr/sbin/alsactl store >/dev/null 2>&1 || : post-install sound-slot-0 /bin/aumix-minimal -f /etc/.aumixrc -L >/dev/null 2>&1 || : pre-remove sound-slot-0 /bin/aumix-minimal -f /etc/.aumixrc -S >/dev/null 2>&1 | | : Sound modules loaded : snd-seq-oss33600 0 (autoclean) snd-seq-midi-event 5672 0 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss] snd-seq47152 2 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi-event] sr_mod 18168 0 (autoclean) snd-pcm-oss43780 0 (autoclean) snd-mixer-oss 15320 0 (autoclean) [snd-pcm-oss] snd-via82xx11628 6 (autoclean) snd-pcm82144 2 (autoclean) [snd-pcm-oss snd-via82xx] snd-timer 15368 0 (autoclean) [snd-seq snd-pcm] snd-mpu401-uart 4716 0 (autoclean) [snd-via82xx] snd-rawmidi18336 0 (autoclean) [snd-mpu401-uart] snd-seq-device 6144 0 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss snd-seq snd-rawmidi] snd-ac97-codec 35940 0 (autoclean) [snd-via82xx] snd39820 9 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi-event snd-seq snd-pcm-oss snd-mixer-oss snd-via82xx snd-pcm snd-timer snd-mpu401-uart snd-rawmidi snd-seq-device snd-ac97-codec] soundcore 6500 5 (autoclean) [snd] Anyone have an idea ? -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Video Card recommendation
On 21 Nov 2002, Edward C. Bailey wrote: >> "Markku" == Markku Kolkka <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > >Markku> Viestissä Keskiviikko 20. Marraskuuta 2002 13:12, Mike A. Harris >Markku> kirjoitti: >>> Again, "Built by ATI" are the only cards tested, officially supported, >>> and likely to work without trouble. > >Markku> So Red Hat is only officially supporting North American customers >Markku> and the rest of the world (who can only buy "powered by ATI" cards) >Markku> is left stranded? Should I switch to some European-based distro? >Markku> What's Red Hat Europe doing? > >(I'll save Mike the keystrokes to answer this, as I've heard his answer >several times before.) > >It is not a Red Hat issue. The issue is that the XFree team members >get hardware from ATI, and have not gotten hardware from any of the >"powered by ATI" vendors. Without the hardware in hand, it is very >difficult to know what will work, and what won't. > >Oh, and you can drop the snide remarks. Or switch to some >European-based distro. :-) Sure. Go ahead and say everything that I was going to say, and do it in 1/4 the space. And I don't read it until *AFTER* replying. GRRR. That's it, I'm going to use a European based Linux distribution from now on. Perhaps Red Hat Linux European Edition. That will teach you! ;o) -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Video Card recommendation
On 20 Nov 2002, Keith Winston wrote: >Date: 20 Nov 2002 19:18:09 -0500 >From: Keith Winston <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: text/plain >List-Id: Discussion of Red Hat Linux 8.0 (Psyche) >Subject: Re: Video Card recommendation > >On Wed, 2002-11-20 at 06:12, Mike A. Harris wrote: >> >> Again, "Built by ATI" are the only cards tested, officially >> supported, and likely to work without trouble. > >Mike, > >You seem to have a lot of knowledge about the ATI Radeons. Can you >confirm that the 3D acceleration works with the _Mobility_ Radeon 7500 >in laptops with the open source driver (radeon)? I've heard second hand >that 3D works fine with the mobile 7500, but have you seen it? I do not have any laptop, nor Mobility Radeon hardware personally. I know that it works at least for some people. I added support for the ATI Radeon Mobility FireGL 7800, which is reported by many people to work in 2D and 3D currently. It's a nice fast laptop chip too. Other than that, all I can suggest is querying bugzilla for both open and closed XFree86 bug reports containing the workds "Radeon Mobility". That might provide useful info. Hope this helps, TTYL -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
RE: Creating Bootable Installation CD
On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, Arjun Karkal Prabhu wrote: >Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 19:02:51 +0530 >From: Arjun Karkal Prabhu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="us-ascii" >List-Id: Discussion of Red Hat Linux 8.0 (Psyche) >Subject: RE: Creating Bootable Installation CD > >Hi >Actually, my friend had the Installation CD, which was bootable (on my >system)... So, I used the following command >To create a ISO. ># mkisofs -f -iso-level=1 -J -r -T -pad -v -o CD1.ISO -V "RHcd1" >/mnt/cdrom/ >Now, using this CD1.ISO, which I created, I wrote the CD using Easy CD >creator. > >-The Media is OK. >-The CMOS can boot other bootable CD. > >I think there is something wrong with the above command that I gave. >(bcoz, I created the CD1.ISO) > >Now, what I want is, to create a BOOTABLE installation CD. How do I >proceed ? You should have just copied the CD, then it would have worked (assuming no bad media or bad burn). Instead, you copied the *contents* of the CD and remastered a new ISO image. That does not provide any useful benefit, and is why it wont boot. Just copy the CD properly and it should work. Again assuming the original CD is not bad, and that your burn is successful and passes mediacheck. -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
RE: Creating Bootable Installation CD
Dear Mike, The problem is, I don't have access to the original source CD now :( So, can u suggest some way by which I can make the CD bootable ? (creating one more cd, which is bootable) (bcoz, I already have the contents..) I don't mind trying. Its worth the effort. Also, I tried burning a bootable CD in NERO, using the Floppy which I created...(to create a boot image) It booted fine, but then the installation program said that I could not find the RH CD 1 ! I would be really grateful if anyone of you could help me. regards, Arjun -Original Message- From: Mike A. Harris [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 7:21 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: Creating Bootable Installation CD On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, Arjun Karkal Prabhu wrote: >Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 19:02:51 +0530 >From: Arjun Karkal Prabhu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="us-ascii" >List-Id: Discussion of Red Hat Linux 8.0 (Psyche) >Subject: RE: Creating Bootable Installation CD > >Hi >Actually, my friend had the Installation CD, which was bootable (on my >system)... So, I used the following command >To create a ISO. ># mkisofs -f -iso-level=1 -J -r -T -pad -v -o CD1.ISO -V "RHcd1" >/mnt/cdrom/ >Now, using this CD1.ISO, which I created, I wrote the CD using Easy CD >creator. > >-The Media is OK. >-The CMOS can boot other bootable CD. > >I think there is something wrong with the above command that I gave. >(bcoz, I created the CD1.ISO) > >Now, what I want is, to create a BOOTABLE installation CD. How do I >proceed ? You should have just copied the CD, then it would have worked (assuming no bad media or bad burn). Instead, you copied the *contents* of the CD and remastered a new ISO image. That does not provide any useful benefit, and is why it wont boot. Just copy the CD properly and it should work. Again assuming the original CD is not bad, and that your burn is successful and passes mediacheck. -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Booting directly into init 5 skips most (all?) init scripts.
On Sat, Nov 23, 2002 at 12:18:58AM -0500, Walter Francis wrote: > This is strange, I can't figure it out, but I'm determined to get this > fixed.. Since I installed 7.3 on this laptop I've had to boot into init 3, > then init 5, otherwise all the init.d scripts don't get ran. > > To put it another way, if I boot into init 3 directly all the init.d stuff > gets ran like it should, sendmail, syslog, et al... but if I boot directly > into init 5 all of this stuff seems to get skipped, no syslog, sendmail, > wireless, network, etc.. > > I've been plodding through /etc/rc.d/rc and some other stuff tonight, but > there's a lot there, so I'm hoping someone has heard of this or might have > an idea what's up.. I was hoping the update to RH 8.0 might fix the problem > but it did not. > > I've tried checkconfig --del and --add on all the stuff I want running to > make sure the links were right, the perms are right, everything looks > right.. I'm really at a loss. > > Thanks :) 1. I would assume you checked with chkconfig --list that things like sendmail are listed as on at level 5. 2. When you check /ec/rc.d/rc5.d are there links for sendmail, etc If either or both are true then sendmail should be started at run level 5. I would be interested in what you found when you did those two things. -- --- Aaron Konstam Computer Science Trinity University 715 Stadium Dr. San Antonio, TX 78212-7200 telephone: (210)-999-7484 email:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Booting directly into init 5 skips most (all?) init scripts.
- Original Message - From: "Aaron Konstam" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 8:21 AM Subject: Re: Booting directly into init 5 skips most (all?) init scripts. For those that don't know, unless these emails are going through slowly, then the person resolved this issue already. I believe he mentioned he had commented out lines in /etc/inittab that caused level 5 (and I think 6) not to boot, and remembered and all is well. That or I misread what he stated, Mike -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
A lot of sound problems bis
Hello all, I'm having problems getting sound to work in Psyche. First it did'nt work at all. Then I installed Alsa and I'm getting something now but still not good. Here's the beef. I have installed alsa as per the installation rules, have modified the etc/modules.files and loaded the modules for my sound card (VIA8233). Here are the symptoms _Now when I open any application I get a weird throbbing sound which stops after a while. _When I open the Gnome Sound Controller all the devices are marked as locked. If I uncheck the Locked box, close Gnome Sound Controller and reopen it, the Locked Box is checked again. And after trying to unckeck them Gnomkeerah kernel: ALSA ../../../alsa-kernel/core/seq/oss/seq_oss_init.c:211: no device founde Sound controller crashes. I see the following error message : This version of the Gnome Volume Controller has been compiled with the version 3.8.2 of OSS but your system is using the 3.8.16 version. _ When I launch XMMS and tr to play a song nothing happens and XMMS stops reacting to commands and finally crashes. I'm using xmms-1.2.7-13. _ When I use Mplayer I get sound ok when it uses oss but not when I instruct the soft to use alsa9. _ When I look in /var/log/messages I see this : keerah kernel: ALSA ../../../alsa-kernel/core/seq/oss/seq_oss_init.c:211: no device found ov 23 14:30:39 keerah modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-slot-1 Nov 23 14:30:39 keerah modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-service-1-0 Nov 23 14:33:28 keerah modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-slot-1 Nov 23 14:33:28 keerah modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-service-1-0 Nov 23 14:38:34 keerah modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-slot-1 Nov 23 14:38:34 keerah modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-service-1-0 These are the symptoms. Now here is my configuration : kernel 2.4.18-18.8.0 alsa-kernel-0.9.0-fr0rc6.1_2.4.18_18.8.0 alsa-driver-0.9.0-fr0rc6.1 /etc/modules.conf alias char-major-116 snd alias snd-card-0 snd-via82xx # module options should go here # OSS/Free portion alias char-major-14 soundcore alias sound-slot-0 snd-card-0 # card #1 alias sound-service-0-0 snd-mixer-oss alias sound-service-0-1 snd-seq-oss alias sound-service-0-3 snd-pcm-oss alias sound-service-0-8 snd-seq-oss alias sound-service-0-12 snd-pcm-oss #post-install snd-card-0 /usr/sbin/alsactl restore >/dev/null 2>&1 || : #pre-remove snd-card-0 /usr/sbin/alsactl store >/dev/null 2>&1 || : post-install sound-slot-0 /bin/aumix-minimal -f /etc/.aumixrc -L >/dev/null 2>&1 || : pre-remove sound-slot-0 /bin/aumix-minimal -f /etc/.aumixrc -S >/dev/null 2>&1 | | : Sound modules loaded : snd-seq-oss33600 0 (autoclean) snd-seq-midi-event 5672 0 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss] snd-seq47152 2 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi-event] sr_mod 18168 0 (autoclean) snd-pcm-oss43780 0 (autoclean) snd-mixer-oss 15320 0 (autoclean) [snd-pcm-oss] snd-via82xx11628 6 (autoclean) snd-pcm82144 2 (autoclean) [snd-pcm-oss snd-via82xx] snd-timer 15368 0 (autoclean) [snd-seq snd-pcm] snd-mpu401-uart 4716 0 (autoclean) [snd-via82xx] snd-rawmidi18336 0 (autoclean) [snd-mpu401-uart] snd-seq-device 6144 0 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss snd-seq snd-rawmidi] snd-ac97-codec 35940 0 (autoclean) [snd-via82xx] snd39820 9 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi-event snd-seq snd-pcm-oss snd-mixer-oss snd-via82xx snd-pcm snd-timer snd-mpu401-uart snd-rawmidi snd-seq-device snd-ac97-codec] soundcore 6500 5 (autoclean) [snd] Anyone have an idea ? -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
quit whining
I have only been using Linux since this past spring. I decided to get invovlved in the opensource community for several reasons. 1-I am a teacher and a single parent and I just could not financially keep up with Micro$lop's mercenary upgrade schedules. 2-The principles of sharing, community support and innovation appeal to me. 3-I wanted to learn more about computers than simply how to use M$ software. I have tried several distributions (Blue Linux, Debian-based Corel, Lycoris and the Red Hat based k12ltsp version, and now, Psyche). The ones I have stuck with most have been the k12ltsp, which was a RH 7.2 based project, and, now Psyche. They have allowed me, in a very short time period, to upgrade to linux from M$. I now do 99% of what I previously did in Doze on my 'nix box, plus, I have acquired software that does literally hundreds of more things without spending any significant money. The Red Hat interfaces have proven familiar enough to make me comfortable in moving, and things mostly work right out of the box. I have learned many things about fixing issues and about personalizing and configuring my RH box. Both Red Hat and the Red Hat users community have simplified these things. I use my computer to create and edit documents for school and other purposes, manipulate photos and create art (I am an amateur photographer and artist), create and edit web pages, a! ccess the internet for research and pleasure, communicate via e-mail, irc and instant messaging, participate in various online communities, and many more things. I am also acquiring my Master in Library and Information Sciences in an online distance education program. I have been able to do all of these things with only a little learning in Red Hat. I can say in all truth that I now can do far more on my machine than I could running Doze98se. I, for one, am very happy about Red Hat and even about the progress I have seen it make in only the very short time that I have been using it. In fact, I spent less time learning to get up to speed with Red Hat than I did with doze! So, why is everyone whining? The very few issues I still have are not Red Hat's fault: 1-my scanner does not work in Linux. The manufacturer is to blame here. 2-having difficulty burning music cd's. (mp3's) 3-Have not yet figured out how to run a database app. on one machine (not server/client). (Okay, on this one, why don't they make Tora configure upon install to do this?) 4-some documentation is not written in plain English that I can follow--it assumes too much to be useful to some newbies without a strong tech background (I am an English teacher, not a computer science wiz). I like Red Hat. Tony http://www.School-Library.net Read, Connect, Learn! _ Select your own custom email address for FREE! Get [EMAIL PROTECTED] w/No Ads, 6MB, POP & more! http://www.everyone.net/selectmail?campaign=tag -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Creating Bootable Installation CD
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Sat, 23 Nov 2002 19:27:22 +0530, Arjun Karkal Prabhu wrote: > The problem is, I don't have access to the original source CD now :( > > So, can u suggest some way by which I can make the CD bootable ? > (creating one more cd, which is bootable) > (bcoz, I already have the contents..) > > I don't mind trying. Its worth the effort. This is how the original CD was created: mkisofs -A "Red Hat Linux/i386 8.0" -V "Red Hat Linuix/i386 8.0" \ -J -R -v -T -x ./lost+found -o psyche-i386-disc1.iso \ -b isolinux/isolinux.bin -c isolinux/boot.cat -no-emul-boot \ - -boot-load-size 4 -boot-info-table Though, I would recommend you get a complete and good version of the CDs or ISO images. - -- -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE935d30iMVcrivHFQRArmLAJ9wKxXItznYFVOJ08rkt+OoCFo8MACePpgV 65rLgMfco6b6VvITU2khsnE= =UNQa -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: quit whining
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 09:38, anthony baldwin wrote: > I have only been using Linux since this past spring. [snip] > The very few issues I still have are not Red Hat's fault: > 1-my scanner does not work in Linux. The manufacturer is to blame here. > 2-having difficulty burning music cd's. (mp3's) > 3-Have not yet figured out how to run a database app. on one machine (not >server/client). (Okay, on this one, why don't they make Tora configure upon install >to do this?) > 4-some documentation is not written in plain English that I can follow--it assumes >too much to be useful to some newbies without a strong tech background (I am an >English teacher, not a computer science wiz). Amen, brutha, to your post. I am replying to you off-list to offer a little help on your problem number 2. First, the CDROM burning HowTo has good information on burning music CDs. You probably already know about the Linux Documentation Project at: http://www.tldp.org/ Anyway, to burn MP3s back to music CDs, you have convert them back into CD audio format, then burn the CD, essentially reversing the process of ripping them to MP3. The conversion from MP3 to CD audio is done with a program called mpg123 (or the open source program mpg321 which does the same thing). These programs don't come with Red Hat 8.0, but you can download mpg321 from http://psyche.freshrpms.net in RPM format. All GUI CD burning software uses the command line cdrecord program. I have preferred to just burn CDs from shell scripts since I've had varying degrees of success with the GUI tools. Here is the script I use to burn music CDs. This script assumes that you already have CD burning set up on your machine (the HowTo covers this extensively). You will need to change the input directory in the For statement (/home/keithw/datacore/burn/data/). Dump some mp3s in a directory and enter that directory in the For statement. You _might_ need to change the dev=0,0,0 in the cdrecord statements if your CD burning device is not the first SCSI device. Best Regards, Keith -- LPIC-2, MCSE, N+ We drive on this highway of fire Got spam? Get spastic http://spastic.sourceforge.net #!/bin/bash # # This is a CD-R script for burning mp3 files directly to CD. # The mpg123 program converts mp3s to cdr format, and cdrecord burns # the tracks on the CD. # for I in /home/keithw/datacore/burn/data/*.mp3 do #mpg123 --cdr - "$I" | cdrecord dev=0,0,0 -audio -pad -v -speed=2 -nofix - mpg321 --cdr - "$I" | cdrecord dev=0,0,0 -audio -pad -v -speed=2 -nofix - done cdrecord dev=0,0,0 -fix
Re: sbin and /usr/sbin
On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, Mike A. Harris wrote: > On Fri, 22 Nov 2002, Tommy McNeely wrote: > > >in /etc/profile, I have had to comment out the "if" and "fi" lines to make > >the "sbin" paths automatically be part of a "users" path.. (like for > >traceroute)... why do I have to do this?? > > > ># Path manipulation > >#if [ `id -u` = 0 ]; then > >pathmunge /sbin > >pathmunge /usr/sbin > >pathmunge /usr/local/sbin > >#fi > > > > > >just cause its in the sbin path does not mean that only root can run it... > >sbin is for "static-binaries" right?? > > /sbin and /usr/sbin have never been part of a user's path in > traditional Unix and Linux systems. While some distributions may > possibly put these directories in users paths by default, it is > by no means a standard. i have, for a long time, *personally* added /sbin and /usr/sbin to my own non-root account search path, so that i can run commands like "ifconfig" and "mount" just to *display* that info. i've always felt that having /sbin and /usr/sbin as part of a non-root search path was convenient; however, i've also always felt that it's a decision that should be left to the users and not added at the system-wide config level. rday p.s. if that was totally confusing, it means i'm agreeing with mike. i think. Robert P. J. Day, RHCE, RHCI Eno River Technologies, Chapel Hill NC Unix, Linux and Open Source corporate training http://www.linux-migration.org -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: quit whining
Oops, posted to the list. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
system-wide configuration for user accounts
i'm curious about how people set up system-wide config for user accounts on their hosts, as i'm designing the account admin chapter for my migration web site and i want to make sure i give good advice. once upon a time, an admin would add sys-wide stuff in /etc/profile, to affect everyone. these days, we have the /etc/profile.d/*sh directory structure. while newly-installed RPMs are certainly free to add RPM-specific files here that will be consulted upon login, i also like to throw extra stuff in here related to the app manually; eg., when i added sun's j2sdk package, i manually added a "java.sh" file to that directory which extended the search PATH. is this considered acceptable behavior? to just manually toss extra files in there? it certainly is a cleaner and more modular approach than constantly hacking /etc/profile. rday Robert P. J. Day, RHCE, RHCI Eno River Technologies, Chapel Hill NC Unix, Linux and Open Source corporate training http://www.linux-migration.org -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: A few things who still suck in RedHat 8 aka constructivecriticism
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 02:11, Rob Blomquist wrote: > I'm off shopping for Mandrake 9.0 tommorrow. Good luck. You might want to look at SuSE as well. -- "Khamaaa, Ham, HA!" -- Goku, 'Dragon Ball' signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: sbin and /usr/sbin
On Sat, Nov 23, 2002 at 10:33:24AM -0500, Robert P. J. Day wrote: > On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, Mike A. Harris wrote: > > > /sbin and /usr/sbin have never been part of a user's path in > > traditional Unix and Linux systems. While some distributions may > > possibly put these directories in users paths by default, it is > > by no means a standard. > > i have, for a long time, *personally* added /sbin and /usr/sbin to > my own non-root account search path, so that i can run commands like > "ifconfig" and "mount" just to *display* that info. I add /sbin and /usr/sbin to my path for those reasons, plus making it easy to run those commands privileged via sudo (eg, sudo service restart). I also agree that it's a user-specific thing, but if the system administrator wants to make those available to all users at login time, then he can do so. Nobody is forcing anybody to accept the default paths - they're just defaults that work well for most people. -- Ed Wilts, Mounds View, MN, USA mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Member #1, Red Hat Community Ambassador Program -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: system-wide configuration for user accounts
On Saturday 23 November 2002 08:16, Robert P. J. Day uttered: > is this considered acceptable behavior? to just manually > toss extra files in there? it certainly is a cleaner and > more modular approach than constantly hacking /etc/profile. Yes, this is definitely how I would do it on my systems. /etc/profile stays sane from the get go, and all "additions" to it would go to /etc/profile.d/ I think it's a great way to handle things. -- Jesse Keating For Web Services and Linux Consulting, Visit --> j2Solutions.net Mondo DevTeam (www.mondorescue.org) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Video Card recommendation
Viestissä Lauantai 23. Marraskuuta 2002 15:43, Mike A. Harris kirjoitti: > As such, if you want a good chance at having > working ATI card, then I suggest you get a "Built by ATI" card, My point was that I _can't_ buy a "Built by ATI" card because they are sold only in USA and Canada. The rest of the world gets "Powered by ATI" cards. -- Markku Kolkka [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: A few things who still suck in RedHat 8 aka constructivecriticism
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 11:21, Joe Klemmer wrote: > On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 02:11, Rob Blomquist wrote: > > > I'm off shopping for Mandrake 9.0 tommorrow. > > Good luck. You might want to look at SuSE as well. I switched to Mandrake 9 about a month ago and have been nothing but happy. It's great! Anthony -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Upgrade from 7.3 to 8.0
I have just tried to upgrade from 7.3 to 8.0 but the procedure stopped after checking dependencies and informed us that there was error (I apologize for not taking note of which error...) and that was aborted and that I could safely reboot my machine. In the text upgrade, I got the message that some file was missing (common lib or something like this). Any other simmilar experience with upgrade?? The same machine was able to install RH8.0 with no pain (don't ask why I reverted to 7.3, just because I had no time to tune new installation to connect to Internet, I will try again a scratch installation next week. Tnx Antonio Montagnani -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
RE: Creating Bootable Installation CD (Done!)
Hi all, Thanks a lot for the help. I got the CD to boot, And start the installation Program. Special Thanks to Michael Schwendt [[EMAIL PROTECTED]] for guiding me. Here what I did. First, copied the contents of the Non Bootable Install CD 1 to a temp directory on the HDD. Then, I gave this command : mkisofs -A "Red Hat Linux/i386 8.0" -V "Red Hat Linuix/i386 8.0" \ -J -R -v -T -x ./lost+found -o psyche-i386-disc1.iso \ -b isolinux/isolinux.bin -c isolinux/boot.cat -no-emul-boot \ -boot-load-size 4 -boot-info-table temp/ The above command creaetd the ISO file. Then., used KonCD, to burn the CD. Job done :) Thanks a lot again for all the people how replied and helped me. regards, -Arjun Prabhu K * http://www.arjunprabhu.com <~>-Original Message- <~>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <~>[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Michael Schwendt <~>Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 8:28 PM <~>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <~>Subject: Re: Creating Bootable Installation CD <~> <~> <~>-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- <~>Hash: SHA1 <~> <~>On Sat, 23 Nov 2002 19:27:22 +0530, Arjun Karkal Prabhu wrote: <~> <~>> The problem is, I don't have access to the original source <~>CD now :( <~>> <~>> So, can u suggest some way by which I can make the CD bootable ? <~>> (creating one more cd, which is bootable) <~>> (bcoz, I already have the contents..) <~>> <~>> I don't mind trying. Its worth the effort. <~> <~>This is how the original CD was created: <~> <~>mkisofs -A "Red Hat Linux/i386 8.0" -V "Red Hat Linuix/i386 8.0" \ <~> -J -R -v -T -x ./lost+found -o psyche-i386-disc1.iso \ <~> -b isolinux/isolinux.bin -c isolinux/boot.cat -no-emul-boot \ <~>- -boot-load-size 4 -boot-info-table <~> <~>Though, I would recommend you get a complete and good version of the <~>CDs or ISO images. <~> <~>- -- <~>-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- <~>Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) <~> <~>iD8DBQE935d30iMVcrivHFQRArmLAJ9wKxXItznYFVOJ08rkt+OoCFo8MACePpgV <~>65rLgMfco6b6VvITU2khsnE= <~>=UNQa <~>-END PGP SIGNATURE- <~> <~> <~> <~>-- <~>Psyche-list mailing list <~>[EMAIL PROTECTED] <~>https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list <~> -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Upgrade from 7.3 to 8.0
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 11:46, antonio montagnani wrote: > I have just tried to upgrade from 7.3 to 8.0 but the procedure stopped > after checking dependencies and informed us that there was error (I > apologize for not taking note of which error...) and that was aborted > and that I could safely reboot my machine. > > In the text upgrade, I got the message that some file was missing > (common lib or something like this). > > Any other simmilar experience with upgrade?? I have never had a satisfactory upgrade experience from any version of any OS to any other version. I've had upgrades that mostly work, but there is always cruft from the previous one hanging around that eventually causes me problems. I've found this to be true in Linux and Windows. I always back up my data, do a clean install, then restore my data. Best Regards, Keith -- LPIC-2, MCSE, N+ We drive on this highway of fire Got spam? Get spastic http://spastic.sourceforge.net -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Upgrade from 7.3 to 8.0
On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, antonio montagnani wrote: > I have just tried to upgrade from 7.3 to 8.0 but the procedure stopped > after checking dependencies and informed us that there was error (I > apologize for not taking note of which error...) and that was aborted > and that I could safely reboot my machine. > > In the text upgrade, I got the message that some file was missing > (common lib or something like this). I upgraded a couple of machines 7.3 to 8.0 without problems. The first think I would check is your CDs are burnt correctly - run linux mediacheck from the CD boot prompt. I don't have any further ideas, though knowing the error message more precisely would help. Michael Young -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
another mp3 to cd method ...
How about just openning the mp3s in xmms and: options preferences and chaging the ouput plugin to: Diskwriter plugin... Then just use your favorite gui to roast them. Jim _ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: sbin and /usr/sbin
Tommy McNeely wrote: > > in /etc/profile, I have had to comment out the "if" and "fi" lines to > make the "sbin" paths automatically be part of a "users" path.. (like > for traceroute)... why do I have to do this?? Because for security issues only root should be able to run them. Some sbin programs only work correctly if run by root. > just cause its in the sbin path does not mean that only root can run > it... sbin is for "static-binaries" right?? No, system binaries. Best regards, Martin Stricker -- Homepage: http://www.martin-stricker.de/ Linux Migration Project: http://www.linux-migration.org/ Red Hat Linux 7.3 for low memory: http://www.rule-project.org/ Registered Linux user #210635: http://counter.li.org/ -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Distros are all good (was: Re: A few things who still suck inRedHat 8 aka constructive criticism)
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 11:34, Anthony Abby wrote: > > > I'm off shopping for Mandrake 9.0 tommorrow. > > > > Good luck. You might want to look at SuSE as well. > > I switched to Mandrake 9 about a month ago and have been nothing but > happy. It's great! FWLIW, I have found that if you use any of the major distros you really won't go wrong. Even some of the "lesser" distros like Gentoo or Lunar Linux and Vector or Arch Linux and even the Lycoris and Xandros[*] distros are all very good. Heck, the "Roll Your Own" projects are very useful. -- "Khamaaa, Ham, HA!" -- Goku, 'Dragon Ball' signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Distros are all good (was: Re: A few things who still suck inRedHat 8 aka constructive criticism)
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 14:14, Joe Klemmer wrote: > On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 11:34, Anthony Abby wrote: > > > > > I'm off shopping for Mandrake 9.0 tommorrow. > > > > > > Good luck. You might want to look at SuSE as well. > > > > I switched to Mandrake 9 about a month ago and have been nothing but > > happy. It's great! > > FWLIW, I have found that if you use any of the major distros you really > won't go wrong. Even some of the "lesser" distros like Gentoo or Lunar > Linux and Vector or Arch Linux and even the Lycoris and Xandros[*] > distros are all very good. Heck, the "Roll Your Own" projects are very > useful. Generally I think all the major distros are basically the same. What's different is the philosophy under which they're created. Until Redhat 8.0, I was a tried and true Redhat supporter. Loved Redhat, but what they did to KDE really turned me off. After installing 8.0 I tried restoring KDE to it's true appearance and just found it to be too much work. I prefer a distro that works more in harmony with KDE/Gnome instead of taking sides, and then melding them both to suit its own particular self. That's why I chose to migrate to Mandrake. Mandrake can do everything Red Hat can do, obviously, but I like how they paid very close attention to their all inclusive control center. You can do everything on the system from a single application.. which is really nice. Not to mention they support KDE and haven't mucked with it. Just a very nice experience all around. Anthony -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Acrobat reader
I downloaded Adobe Acrobat Reader from adobe's site. Version 5.0.6 It doesnt work. I get the following error message. ./acroread Warning: charset "UTF-8" not supported, using "ISO8859-1". Aborted So I dug out hte old version 4 copy that used to work on RH7.1 doesn't work as well but I get different error massage. ./acroread: /usr/local/Acrobat4/Reader/intellinux/bin/acroread: /lib/ld-linux.so.1: bad ELF interpreter: No such file or directory ./acroread: line 364: /usr/local/Acrobat4/Reader/intellinux/bin/acroread: Success I checked and I have no ld-linux.so.1 only ld-linux.so.2 could this be the same problem with Acrobat 5? Cheers Gerhardus PS. Thankx for everybody who helped me with my stupid questions. I'm just sick of my Suse counterparts lauthing at me. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: system-wide configuration for user accounts
On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, Robert P. J. Day wrote:
> i'm curious about how people set up system-wide config
>for user accounts on their hosts, as i'm designing the
>account admin chapter for my migration web site and i want
>to make sure i give good advice.
>
> once upon a time, an admin would add sys-wide stuff in
>/etc/profile, to affect everyone.
>
> these days, we have the /etc/profile.d/*sh directory
>structure. while newly-installed RPMs are certainly free
>to add RPM-specific files here that will be consulted upon
>login, i also like to throw extra stuff in here related
>to the app manually; eg., when i added sun's j2sdk package,
>i manually added a "java.sh" file to that directory which
>extended the search PATH.
>
> is this considered acceptable behavior? to just manually
>toss extra files in there? it certainly is a cleaner and
>more modular approach than constantly hacking /etc/profile.
Absolutely. Just be sure to do either:
1) Package the scripts in rpm packages and install them, so that
RPM is aware the files are there, and wont overwrite them if
you install some other package that has files named the same.
or
2) Choose file names for all of your personal scripts that are
guaranteed to be unique, and unlikely that some rpm package
would conflict with it. You can do this by choosing something
unique like "sun_java_custom_startup.sh" or by namespacing all
your custom files with a common prefix:
"rpjd_java.sh" or ${hostname}_java.sh or some such unique
identifier.
That way you needn't wory about some other package installing a
"java.sh" script there.
HTH
--
Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris
OS Systems Engineer
XFree86 maintainer
Red Hat Inc.
--
Psyche-list mailing list
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Video Card recommendation
On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, Markku Kolkka wrote: >Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 18:35:42 +0200 >From: Markku Kolkka <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" >List-Id: Discussion of Red Hat Linux 8.0 (Psyche) >Subject: Re: Video Card recommendation > >Viestissä Lauantai 23. Marraskuuta 2002 15:43, Mike A. Harris kirjoitti: >> As such, if you want a good chance at having >> working ATI card, then I suggest you get a "Built by ATI" card, > >My point was that I _can't_ buy a "Built by ATI" card because >they are sold only in USA and Canada. The rest of the world gets >"Powered by ATI" cards. And how am I supposed to be expected to resolve that? If you want Linux support for your video hardware, it is your responsibility to either purchase supported hardware, or to contact a given manufacturer and request that they support Linux. For the case of these cards, it is probably less than a days work, if that for one of their engineers to hack on a 5 line patch or similar. It is ultimately _not_ our responsibility. The Linux community has developed a lot of software and a lot of drivers, some by poking and prodding the hardware. That is not efficient however. If a manufacturer does not drectly support Linux, then it is best to avoid that vendor. Having few hardware choices in a given part of the world, is a problem that is not up to the OS vendor to solve really. Mind you, I certainly try to do so whenever possible. -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Acrobat reader
On 23 Nov 2002, Gerhardus Scheltema wrote: >Date: 23 Nov 2002 21:32:00 +0200 >From: Gerhardus Scheltema <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Psyche List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Content-Type: text/plain >List-Id: Discussion of Red Hat Linux 8.0 (Psyche) >Subject: Acrobat reader > >I downloaded Adobe Acrobat Reader from adobe's site. Version 5.0.6 >It doesnt work. I get the following error message. > >./acroread >Warning: charset "UTF-8" not supported, using "ISO8859-1". >Aborted > >So I dug out hte old version 4 copy that used to work on RH7.1 doesn't >work as well but I get different error massage. > >./acroread: /usr/local/Acrobat4/Reader/intellinux/bin/acroread: >/lib/ld-linux.so.1: bad ELF interpreter: No such file or directory >./acroread: line 364: >/usr/local/Acrobat4/Reader/intellinux/bin/acroread: Success > >I checked and I have no ld-linux.so.1 only ld-linux.so.2 could this be >the same problem with Acrobat 5? > >Cheers > >Gerhardus > >PS. Thankx for everybody who helped me with my stupid questions. I'm >just sick of my Suse counterparts lauthing at me. This is documented in the Red Hat Linux 8.0 RELEASE-NOTES in the root dir of the first CDROM, and presented to users during installation. Also located in an installed system at: /usr/share/doc/redhat-release-8.0/RELEASE-NOTES-i386 Hope this helps. -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Acrobat reader
Found Solution Thanx, its in the LANG env setting. missed that one Big Duh! Gerhardus On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 21:32, Gerhardus Scheltema wrote: > I downloaded Adobe Acrobat Reader from adobe's site. Version 5.0.6 > It doesnt work. I get the following error message. > > ./acroread > Warning: charset "UTF-8" not supported, using "ISO8859-1". > Aborted > > So I dug out hte old version 4 copy that used to work on RH7.1 doesn't > work as well but I get different error massage. > > ./acroread: /usr/local/Acrobat4/Reader/intellinux/bin/acroread: > /lib/ld-linux.so.1: bad ELF interpreter: No such file or directory > ./acroread: line 364: > /usr/local/Acrobat4/Reader/intellinux/bin/acroread: Success > > I checked and I have no ld-linux.so.1 only ld-linux.so.2 could this be > the same problem with Acrobat 5? > > Cheers > > Gerhardus > > PS. Thankx for everybody who helped me with my stupid questions. I'm > just sick of my Suse counterparts lauthing at me. > > > > > -- > Psyche-list mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Distros are all good (was: Re: A few things who still suck inRedHat 8 aka constructive criticism)
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 14:23, Anthony Abby wrote: > That's why I chose to migrate to Mandrake. Mandrake can do everything > Red Hat can do, obviously, but I like how they paid very close attention > to their all inclusive control center. You can do everything on the > system from a single application.. which is really nice. Not to mention > they support KDE and haven't mucked with it. Just a very nice > experience all around. I have found that KDE is better than GNOME still, though the gap is closing. However, they are both nearly unusable compared to XFce. Still, they make Linux easier to use for people with little or no tech knowledge/skills. And RH 8 has just moved the bar higher for this. GNOME and KDE will need to try and reach the level of the Bluecurve theme should they ever wish to make it into the corporate world. Mandrake is a good distro. The only problem I have encountered is their messing up the configuration aspects of apps. They often put config files in places you'd never imagine and cause the need for Mdk specific rpms to be made. With the advent of UnitedLinux I think that SuSE is going to take a place in the corporate world, too. -- "Khamaaa, Ham, HA!" -- Goku, 'Dragon Ball' signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Acrobat reader
I'm using the rpm available here and it works fine with 8.0: http://www.gurulabs.com/downloads.html On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 14:32, Gerhardus Scheltema wrote: > I downloaded Adobe Acrobat Reader from adobe's site. Version 5.0.6 > It doesnt work. I get the following error message. > > ./acroread > Warning: charset "UTF-8" not supported, using "ISO8859-1". > Aborted > > So I dug out hte old version 4 copy that used to work on RH7.1 doesn't > work as well but I get different error massage. > > ./acroread: /usr/local/Acrobat4/Reader/intellinux/bin/acroread: > /lib/ld-linux.so.1: bad ELF interpreter: No such file or directory > ./acroread: line 364: > /usr/local/Acrobat4/Reader/intellinux/bin/acroread: Success > > I checked and I have no ld-linux.so.1 only ld-linux.so.2 could this be > the same problem with Acrobat 5? > > Cheers > > Gerhardus > > PS. Thankx for everybody who helped me with my stupid questions. I'm > just sick of my Suse counterparts lauthing at me. > > > > > -- > Psyche-list mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list > -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Help! Shutdown problems: Umount2 - Device or resource busy...
Hi. I've got a shutdown problem. After I updated Samba to version samba-2.2.7-2 I started getting the following error message (not sure if it is samba related): Unmounting file systems: umount2 Device or resource busy umount /dev/hda2 not mounted umount /usr: Illegal seek [FAILED] INIT: no more processes lef in this runleve. Shutdown procedure halts <<< Pressing CTRL ALT DEL shows this message: Shutdown: warning: cannot open /var/run/shutdown.pid I tried to remove /etc/mtab, for a system rebuild of that file, but that didn't help. I read somewhere that symlinks to dirs on unmounted volumes may cause this kind of problem. So what am I to do, please help :) Any info that may help is appreciated. Thnx, /dA_K6 Some system info: /etc/mtab none /proc proc rw 0 0 usbdevfs /proc/bus/usb usbdevfs rw 0 0 /dev/hda1 /boot ext3 rw 0 0 none /dev/pts devpts rw,gid=5,mode=620 0 0 /dev/hda3 /home ext3 rw 0 0 none /dev/shm tmpfs rw 0 0 /dev/hda2 /usr ext3 rw 0 0 /dev/hda6 /var ext3 rw 0 0 /proc/mounts rootfs / rootfs rw 0 0 /dev/root / ext3 rw 0 0 /proc /proc proc rw 0 0 usbdevfs /proc/bus/usb usbdevfs rw 0 0 /dev/hda1 /boot ext3 rw 0 0 none /dev/pts devpts rw 0 0 /dev/hda3 /home ext3 rw 0 0 none /dev/shm tmpfs rw 0 0 /dev/hda2 /usr ext3 rw 0 0 /dev/hda6 /var ext3 rw 0 0 /etc/fstab LABEL=/ / ext3defaults1 1 LABEL=/boot /boot ext3defaults1 2 none/dev/ptsdevpts gid=5,mode=620 0 0 LABEL=/home /home ext3defaults1 2 none/proc procdefaults0 0 none/dev/shmtmpfs defaults0 0 LABEL=/usr /usrext3defaults1 2 LABEL=/var /varext3defaults1 2 /dev/hda7 swapswapdefaults0 0 /dev/cdrom /mnt/cdrom iso9660 noauto,owner,kudzu,ro 0 0 /dev/fd0/mnt/floppy autonoauto,owner,kudzu 0 0 _ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
RE: Video Card recommendation
Good god. Is there a command line for the mail server to send a consolidated mail? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Mike A. Harris Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 1:50 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Video Card recommendation On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, Markku Kolkka wrote: >Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 18:35:42 +0200 >From: Markku Kolkka <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" >List-Id: Discussion of Red Hat Linux 8.0 (Psyche) >Subject: Re: Video Card recommendation > >Viestissä Lauantai 23. Marraskuuta 2002 15:43, Mike A. Harris kirjoitti: >> As such, if you want a good chance at having >> working ATI card, then I suggest you get a "Built by ATI" card, > >My point was that I _can't_ buy a "Built by ATI" card because >they are sold only in USA and Canada. The rest of the world gets >"Powered by ATI" cards. And how am I supposed to be expected to resolve that? If you want Linux support for your video hardware, it is your responsibility to either purchase supported hardware, or to contact a given manufacturer and request that they support Linux. For the case of these cards, it is probably less than a days work, if that for one of their engineers to hack on a 5 line patch or similar. It is ultimately _not_ our responsibility. The Linux community has developed a lot of software and a lot of drivers, some by poking and prodding the hardware. That is not efficient however. If a manufacturer does not drectly support Linux, then it is best to avoid that vendor. Having few hardware choices in a given part of the world, is a problem that is not up to the OS vendor to solve really. Mind you, I certainly try to do so whenever possible. -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: A few things who still suck in RedHat 8 aka constructive criticism
Mandrake 8.* and 9.0 never did work for me, I tried 3 different cd's for MD 9.0, invariably the installer has troubles to open and install packages, mostly the kernel and or xfree. I gave up, no such problems with SuSE or Redhat 8.0 Herman On Sunday 24 November 2002 5:34 am, Anthony Abby wrote: > On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 11:21, Joe Klemmer wrote: > > On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 02:11, Rob Blomquist wrote: > > > I'm off shopping for Mandrake 9.0 tommorrow. > > > > Good luck. You might want to look at SuSE as well. > > I switched to Mandrake 9 about a month ago and have been nothing but > happy. It's great! > > Anthony -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Upgrade from 7.3 to 8.0
True, after burning a cd with all the data needed for a backup, a new install is about 1 hour at the most, unlike windows (been there done that) so it's a lot less problematic to simply do a clean install. Cheers, Herman On Sunday 24 November 2002 6:15 am, Keith Winston wrote: > On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 11:46, antonio montagnani wrote: > > I have just tried to upgrade from 7.3 to 8.0 but the procedure > > stopped after checking dependencies and informed us that there was > > error (I apologize for not taking note of which error...) and that > > was aborted and that I could safely reboot my machine. > > > > In the text upgrade, I got the message that some file was missing > > (common lib or something like this). > > > > Any other simmilar experience with upgrade?? > > I have never had a satisfactory upgrade experience from any version > of any OS to any other version. I've had upgrades that mostly work, > but there is always cruft from the previous one hanging around that > eventually causes me problems. I've found this to be true in Linux > and Windows. I always back up my data, do a clean install, then > restore my data. > > Best Regards, > Keith -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Gnome Sytem Monitor and Terminal Memory Usage
On Fri, Nov 22, 2002 at 06:22:15PM -0500, Andy Zirkel wrote: > Gnome System Monitor consistently eats up Memory. It's been running for > about two hours and is using 350 megs of ram, climbing steadily. Gnome > Terminal acts similarly but it will use memory as text scrolls past, > usually hogging upwards of 100 megs. This just doesn't seem normal for > a terminal. I realize it's keeping the text that scrolls past, but even > after the buffer is filled it continues to enlarge in size. I'm sure > someone has noticed this before. I can't really do without the > terminal. Can anyone help me out? > Xft in 8.0 leaks memory on X servers that lack the RENDER extension. This manifests most noticeably with apps that update text often, e.g. the terminal or system monitor, but will happen with any app that uses the new font system. You can see if your X server has RENDER using "xdpyinfo" Havoc -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Video Card recommendation
For what it's worth, I believe that ATI have just released the first of their consolidated drivers that support all of the 9x00 cards under linux. -- Gerry "The lyfe so short, the craft so long to learne" Chaucer -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
For example:
how to use env LANG=C acroread in the plugin? Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 16:00:43 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Hi, Also located in an installed system at: /usr/share/doc/redhat-release-8.0/RELEASE-NOTES-i386 Does anyone know how to use the info from the release-8.0/RELEASE-NOTES-i386 (env LANG=C) to stop the acroread plugin from crashing? Thanks, Jim _ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Dist. Suggestions
> On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, David Durst wrote: > >>Ok, maybe OpenLDAP does come w/ it. My mistake - but when you click to >> do a FULL INSTALL it doesn't. > > A full install does not install every single RPM package. There > is a reason for that. > >>And great RH doesn't support Binary Modules - you can get a >>source version compile it on your own and then send it out as a >>binary. > Sounds like you are clueless for what I am asking. And you never stated Binary ONLY modules, I believe you said binary modules (Which really doesn't make sense but I read into it to make it make sense) > If the source were available, then it WOULD NOT BE BINARY ONLY > now would it? Binary only modules, by definition, are modules to which > the source code is NOT AVAILABLE. > > >>Or maybe I am getting it wrong here, lemme look at it the other >>way. You don't want to support the project of a module? If so >>then why dist software at all? > > Red Hat got where it is today by following a set of principles > and values that have made it one of the largest and most used > Linux distributions. Why distribute it all? Simple, because it > is popular, and gaining more popularity daily - without including > binary only modules. You are still misunderstanding what I am stating, your point was "We can't fix it". The counter point to that is U you guys have a habit of shipping broken software. So FIXING software for you guys is sometimes a DEAD DUCK point. > > Feel free to select a different distribution that does ship > binary only modules - you do have that choice. > > >>It just a piece of software that POSSIBLE could be borken when >>you ship it but that should be no concern of yours considering >>XMMS & Postgres :) > > We can fix xmms and postgresql. Nice try. Invalid point. Yep exactly, you don't get what I am saying. > >>Just ship the damn module so RH 8.1 or whatever can support >>about 75% of the wireless NICS on the market. > > Absolutely and completely totally _NO_. Switch to another > distribution that ships it if you must. > H, this is a great stand to take. Our customers want their computers to work, HA! corporate users want their wireless NICS to work. What are you gonna say. Let me quote you correctly: "Absolutely and completely totally _NO_. Switch to another distribution that ships it if you must." I thank god that you are not the CEO of RH, because if you were and or if the CEO does shares your same opinions about overall SOFTWARE SUPPORT & DIST., RH is bound to fail. That is when you tell the market, screw you we will not PUT ON a seperate CD drivers thar are not GPL (And look into it before you open your mouth, the drivers I am speaking of are OPEN SOURCE just not GPL - http://www.linux-wlan.com/linux-wlan/) > >>This discussion reminds me of the pre Donald Becker days and >>dealing w/ regular NIC cards. > > This discussion reminds me of getting a root canal, and I've > never gotten one. > You remind me of every other SIMPSONS COMIC BOOK STORE LOOKING GUY that holds linux back. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: sbin and /usr/sbin
On 19:31 23 Nov 2002, Martin Stricker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: | Tommy McNeely wrote: | > in /etc/profile, I have had to comment out the "if" and "fi" lines to | > make the "sbin" paths automatically be part of a "users" path.. (like | > for traceroute)... why do I have to do this?? | | Because for security issues only root should be able to run them. Some | sbin programs only work correctly if run by root. Feh. They should be _harmless_ if run by nonroot. It's generally safe for mortal users to have them available, and often useful. Chuck 'em at the _end_ of $PATH if it bothers you. | > just cause its in the sbin path does not mean that only root can run | > it... sbin is for "static-binaries" right?? | | No, system binaries. These days, maybe. In older times, it did mean static - these binaries would run before the shared libraries in /usr were available. It may as well mean "standalone", because these are basic tools that must work when little of the system is active or available. Cheers, -- Cameron Simpson, DoD#743[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.zip.com.au/~cs/ I have no help to send, therefore I must go myself. - Aragorn son of Arathorn -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Installing RH8.0 for a particular CPU architecture.
I'm doing some network testing for a final year project at University, and have come across a need for another machine which I can't get my hands on until I drive back to my folks house next week. I have a spare hard-drive kicking around- I want to get RH8.0 installed before I get the machine. Before getting started I'm stuck on the following. The box I have here is an athlon, but the eventual box will only be a i586 chip. Is there a parameter I can pass to the installer to stop i686+athlon packages been installed? Thanks, -- NAME: Adam Allen. EMAIL : [EMAIL PROTECTED] COMMENT : insert your favourite signature comment here PGP : http://search.keyserver.net:11371/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=adam%40dynamicinteraction.co.uk signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
knoppix cd
I had been using the Knoppix cd for a few days before I discovered all of the great fonts. I have scp'ied the fonts onto my redhat8 system, and they are really nice to have to use. My daughter will really enjoy having them to use on her rh8 box. Take a look at them if you have a chance. They are a nice add-on to rh8. The entire cd is actually a work of art. Jim _ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Dynamic PDF using PHP in Apache 2.0
I read Keith Winston's message and wanted to know what classes he or anyone has found to create a dynamic PDF file from PHP using Apache 2.0 on RH8.0. I am in the process of configuring a web server for a non-profit organization that needs to fill in forms and have them printed. I just switched like everyone else to RH8.0 and I have not fully investigated the implications of Apache 2.0 and what it does with PHP and what features I can use that I could use in Apache 1.3.XX. I was debating about switching back to 7.3 and running Apache 1.3.23 in order to get PDF capability. BTW, I really am enjoying RH8.0 -- Brooks Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Dist. Suggestions
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 18:40, David Durst wrote: > You remind me of every other SIMPSONS COMIC BOOK STORE LOOKING GUY > that holds linux back. It seems to me that you are not satisfied with RH the distro and RH the company. If this is true then I don't understand your continuation of this pointless and counterproductive discussion. -- "Khamaaa, Ham, HA!" -- Goku, 'Dragon Ball' signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: A few things who still suck in RedHat 8 aka constructivecriticism
Haven't tried Mandrake 9 but watched as others at the local LUG struggled with problems in the prior version much the same as some do with RH8. I imagine the next major version of RH will at least match Mandrake 9 (such is the nature of competition). I switched to RH8 from SuSE8 and am pleased that I did so. My intention is to stay with RH8, to learn it well, and to benefit from the upcoming improvements. Jumping from distro to distro has proven to be a terrible time-waster for me -- too much learning curve. Hope you find what you need, and soon! ;-) doc On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 11:21, Joe Klemmer wrote: > On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 02:11, Rob Blomquist wrote: > > > I'm off shopping for Mandrake 9.0 tommorrow. > > Good luck. You might want to look at SuSE as well. > > -- > "Khamaaa, Ham, HA!" > -- Goku, 'Dragon Ball' -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
psyche-list@redhat.com
Paul Watkins wrote:
Question 1:
I don't know why you're occasionally having relaying problems...
Question 2: I have dhcpd setup to dynamically assign the IP addresses on
the internal network and for that purpose it works fine (most of the
workstations are a mix of windows 2000, windows xp and windows millenium).
But I can't seem to get DNS and the gateway passed to the workstations.
For example, in the beginning of this email where the configuration is
described, the gateway is 192.168.0.1 -- how do I pass this and the dns
information to the workstations so that the ip and dns can automatically
be set rather than setting each machine manually.
See an example file below, with three subnets. Note that the machine
name -> IP mappings are defined in DNS in my case, and that DNS server
happens to be on the DHCP server machine. I suspect that /etc/hosts
entries on the DHCP server would work as well, but I haven't tested that
configuration.
Alan
--
Alan Peery
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
ddns-update-style ad-hoc;
subnet 10.88.22.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 {
range 10.88.22.129 10.88.22.250;
default-lease-time 600;
max-lease-time 7200;
option subnet-mask 255.255.255.0;
option broadcast-address 10.88.22.255;
option routers 10.88.22.1;
# use this server, and an external DNS server
option domain-name-servers 10.88.22.1,212.67.96.129;
option domain-name "peery.info";
}
host xxxblp {
hardware ethernet 00:60:08:F3:37:F5;
fixed-address aspex-blp.peery.info;
}
host sol9 {
hardware ethernet 00:50:56:18:07:01;
fixed-address sol9.peery.info;
}
host rocinante {
hardware ethernet 00:06:5B:BC:F7:2E;
fixed-address rocinante.peery.info;
}
subnet 10.88.23.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 {
range 10.88.23.129 10.88.23.250;
default-lease-time 600;
max-lease-time 7200;
option subnet-mask 255.255.255.0;
option broadcast-address 10.88.23.255;
option routers 10.88.23.1;
# use this server, and an external DNS server
option domain-name-servers 10.88.23.1,212.67.96.129;
option domain-name "peery.info";
}
subnet 10.88.24.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 {
range 10.88.24.129 10.88.24.250;
default-lease-time 600;
max-lease-time 7200;
option subnet-mask 255.255.255.0;
option broadcast-address 10.88.24.255;
option routers 10.88.24.1;
# use this server, and an external DNS server
option domain-name-servers 10.88.24.1,212.67.96.129;
option domain-name "peery.info";
}
--
Psyche-list mailing list
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Gnome Memory used > 1 Gb
Philippe wrote: On Thu, 2002-11-21 at 11:25, Havoc Pennington wrote: On Thu, Nov 21, 2002 at 09:57:38AM +0700, PHD wrote: the gnome terminal was using 1.1 GB of memory (include swap) Can you avoid the memory leak simply by using xterms? They will presumably use monospaced fonts, and may not exercise the leaking code as much... Alan -- Alan Peery [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Sayonara (Was - Re: Dist. Suggestions)
On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, David Durst wrote: >> A full install does not install every single RPM package. There >> is a reason for that. > >Sounds like you are clueless for what I am asking. >And you never stated Binary ONLY modules, I believe you said >binary modules (Which really doesn't make sense but I read into it >to make it make sense) Don't mince words. Binary only modules are binary only modules. It is stupid to think that Red Hat would ship binary modules and not ship the source code, or that Red Hat would ship binary modules that someone else compiled if source was available. There was no lack of clarity in what I said. >>>Or maybe I am getting it wrong here, lemme look at it the other >>>way. You don't want to support the project of a module? If so >>>then why dist software at all? >> >> Red Hat got where it is today by following a set of principles >> and values that have made it one of the largest and most used >> Linux distributions. Why distribute it all? Simple, because it >> is popular, and gaining more popularity daily - without including >> binary only modules. > >You are still misunderstanding what I am stating, your point was >"We can't fix it". The counter point to that is U you guys >have a habit of shipping broken software. So FIXING software >for you guys is sometimes a DEAD DUCK point. Bullshit. That is just a pure insult. It isn't even worth reading any further messages that you write. Welcome to my killfile after this message. >> Absolutely and completely totally _NO_. Switch to another >> distribution that ships it if you must. >> > >H, this is a great stand to take. >Our customers want their computers to work, HA! corporate users want >their wireless NICS to work. What are you gonna say. >Let me quote you correctly: "Absolutely and completely totally _NO_. >Switch to another distribution that ships it if you must." Precicely. You have that option, and are free to exercise it. >I thank god that you are not the CEO of RH, because if you were >and or if the CEO does shares your same opinions about overall >SOFTWARE SUPPORT & DIST., RH is bound to fail. That is when you >tell the market, screw you we will not PUT ON a seperate CD >drivers thar are not GPL (And look into it before you open your >mouth, the drivers I am speaking of are OPEN SOURCE just not GPL >- http://www.linux-wlan.com/linux-wlan/) Open source drivers are a different story. In one breath you are demanding we ship proprietary drivers, and in another one you are claiming that they are open source. Considering that, and considering your above statements differentiating "binary module" and "binary only module" (which are identical in the context of the discussion), I don't think you even understand the difference. >> This discussion reminds me of getting a root canal, and I've >> never gotten one. > >You remind me of every other SIMPSONS COMIC BOOK STORE LOOKING GUY >that holds linux back. You remind me of that one random annoying person on our mailing lists each release, that makes me sick enough to not want to help people on our lists any more, as I'm not paid to do so, and I no longer enjoy the experience. So on that note, I bid the mailing list goodbye. I don't need to waste my time reading and responding to this mindless drivel. Feel free to fight amongst yourselves. -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: X freezes
Brian Schmidt wrote: I'm certainly no X expert, but I poked through /var/log/XFree86.0.log and didn't find anything that screamed out at me as an indicator of the problem. I thought most of the X windows sessions in 8.0 are writing the user level debugging into a file in the users home directory, but I didn't find one in a quick scan just now. Maybe it's a debug only option in the various session startup scripts. Alan -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Dist. Suggestions
> On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 18:40, David Durst wrote: > >> You remind me of every other SIMPSONS COMIC BOOK STORE LOOKING GUY >> that holds linux back. > > It seems to me that you are not satisfied with RH the > distro and RH the company. If this is true then I don't understand your > continuation of this pointless and counterproductive discussion. > > -- > "Khamaaa, Ham, HA!" > -- Goku, 'Dragon Ball' No, that is not it. For those of you that never bothered to read the original POST. The above person that the post is intended for never BOTHERED to do his homework on what I was asking. That is why I have responded in the irritated way I have. I will not bother to respond to you comment about being pointless and counterproductive discussion, just refer to the above about NOT READING THE ORIGINAL POST. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: 'bounce' messages with evolution?
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 20:20, Brian K. Jones wrote: > > Just noticing there's no 'bounce' option in evolution that I can find. > > Evolution 1.2 has what I think is the equivalent: > > Actions -> Forward -> Redirect I have both pine and Evolution 1.2 in action here, and both the Bounce in pine and Redirect in Evolution appear to perform the same function: They redirect the mail to a new recipient while maintaining the original To: and From: headers. I resent two messages to a friend using OE and found that the messages appeared to be to my account, but had been received by him (like a Bcc would do). (But: in pine, the Resent headers were shown. These were not shown at all in Evolution or OutlookExpress, and would only be visible in headers.) Thanks for pointing out this feature to me. -Ryan -- Powered by Red Hat Linux 8.0 -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: sbin and /usr/sbin
yea ... hehe .. after writing that.. I was looking for an example in Solaris.. and couldn't find it.. but *sbin was in my path :-/ ... we have a "CUE" (common user environment) that pollutes every single "standard" user setup AT SUN ... :) thats where I got my SBIN path the way I wanted it.. but I do like that it is not TOO HARD to make it the way _I_ like it :) .. I like the pathmunge :) Tommy --On Saturday, November 23, 2002 8:17 AM -0500 "Mike A. Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Fri, 22 Nov 2002, Tommy McNeely wrote: Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 16:32:34 -0700 From: Tommy McNeely <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed List-Id: Discussion of Red Hat Linux 8.0 (Psyche) Subject: sbin and /usr/sbin in /etc/profile, I have had to comment out the "if" and "fi" lines to make the "sbin" paths automatically be part of a "users" path.. (like for traceroute)... why do I have to do this?? # Path manipulation # if [ `id -u` = 0 ]; then pathmunge /sbin pathmunge /usr/sbin pathmunge /usr/local/sbin # fi just cause its in the sbin path does not mean that only root can run it... sbin is for "static-binaries" right?? /sbin and /usr/sbin have never been part of a user's path in traditional Unix and Linux systems. While some distributions may possibly put these directories in users paths by default, it is by no means a standard. -- Mike A. Harris ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris OS Systems Engineer XFree86 maintainer Red Hat Inc. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list -- Tommy McNeely -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sun Microsystems - IT Ops - Broomfield Campus Support Phone: x50888 / 303-464-4888 -- Fax: 720-566-3168 Pager: 800-200-5968 / [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Dist. Suggestions
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 18:39, David Durst wrote: > > On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 18:40, David Durst wrote: > > > >> You remind me of every other SIMPSONS COMIC BOOK STORE LOOKING GUY > >> that holds linux back. > > > > It seems to me that you are not satisfied with RH the > > distro and RH the company. If this is true then I don't understand your > > continuation of this pointless and counterproductive discussion. > > > > -- > > "Khamaaa, Ham, HA!" > > -- Goku, 'Dragon Ball' > No, that is not it. > For those of you that never bothered to read the original POST. > The above person that the post is intended for never BOTHERED to do his > homework on what I was asking. > That is why I have responded in the irritated way I have. > > I will not bother to respond to you comment about being pointless and > counterproductive discussion, just refer to the above about NOT READING > THE ORIGINAL POST. > - There was no point to make it personal. There is no point to suggest that anyone here 'holds linux back' If you can't make your point without resorting to personal insults then you haven't made your point at all. I think that everyone understood that you want things in the distro that RH isn't gonna include but you decided to deliver it with the subtlety of a sledgehammer. Lighten up - express yourself calmly and move on. If there's a chance that it's gonna do a bit of good, I would suggest that you send a private email to Mike Harris and apologize for offending him. Craig -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Dist. Suggestions
> If there's a chance that it's gonna do a bit of good, I would suggest > that you send a private email to Mike Harris and apologize for offending > him. > > Craig Please refer to the ORINGAL postins and side threat about MISTATING THE PROBLEM. I made my point calmly, I will not apologize to Mike. He made it personal in his first & second posting back to me. The reason the Mike & Others are so admit about not putting something in the distro is because they never bothered to look into what I was asking for in the first place. They assumed something about what I was asking, and they keep holding to this assumption (NOTE this has been mostly MIKE). After he made it personal and continued to go by his assumption I was finally irritated enough to insult him. NOTE - IF YOU FEEL LIKE POSTING SOMETHING BACK TO THIS PLEASE READ THE ORIGINAL THREAD! -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Sayonara (Was - Re: Dist. Suggestions)
"Mike A. Harris" wrote: > . . . text whacked > > Feel free to fight amongst yourselves. > Wish you could ignore the agitator & not leave the forum, Mike. I try to read all the posts by RH employees. I never know what info I may find valuable in those posts. -toby -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Dist. Suggestions
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 20:39, David Durst wrote: > I will not bother to respond to you comment about being pointless and > counterproductive discussion, just refer to the above about NOT READING > THE ORIGINAL POST. Dave, I have been following this thread from the afore mentioned original post. Buried within the copious volumes of ranting you did you actually had a small point. Unfortunately, you did everything you possibly could to obscure it with irrational attacks that, it seamed, were only meant to insult and hurt others. I must say that I am tempted to follow Mikes lead and feed your email to spammassassin but I'm not yet convinced you are a complete and utter waste with nothing to contribute to this list. -- "Khamaaa, Ham, HA!" -- Goku, 'Dragon Ball' signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Dist. Suggestions
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 21:39, David Durst wrote: > Please refer to the ORINGAL postins and side threat about MISTATING THE > PROBLEM. Ok, I tried but I can't... > I made my point calmly, I will not apologize to Mike. He made it personal > in his first & second posting back to me. Bull-fucking-shit! > The reason the Mike & Others are so admit about not putting something in > the distro is because they never bothered to look into what I was asking > for in the first place. See above. > They assumed something about what I was asking, and they keep holding to > this assumption (NOTE this has been mostly MIKE). After he made it personal > and continued to go by his assumption I was finally irritated enough to > insult him. Double see above. > NOTE - IF YOU FEEL LIKE POSTING SOMETHING BACK TO THIS PLEASE READ THE > ORIGINAL THREAD! You have now convinced me that you are a complete and utter waste of existence and all email from you is now forwarded to /dev/null. -- "Khamaaa, Ham, HA!" -- Goku, 'Dragon Ball' signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: sbin and /usr/sbin
On Sun, 24 Nov 2002, Cameron Simpson wrote:
> | > just cause its in the sbin path does not mean that only root can run
> | > it... sbin is for "static-binaries" right??
> |
> | No, system binaries.
>
> These days, maybe. In older times, it did mean static - these binaries
> would run before the shared libraries in /usr were available. It may
> as well mean "standalone", because these are basic tools that must work
> when little of the system is active or available.
i don't think that's right. from what i remember, the directories
/bin, /lib (and later /sbin) would normally be made available
fairly early in the boot process (since they were part of the
root filesystem), while /usr/{bin,lib,sbin} might be mounted
later in the boot process.
i'm pretty sure the directories /sbin and /usr/sbin were invented
initially for system binaries -- those meant to be run only by
the superuser. but i'm willing to be corrected.
rday
--
Psyche-list mailing list
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Sayonara (Was - Re: Dist. Suggestions)
Amazing, someone got under Mike's collar. I wonder who could bozo
well enough to manage that?
{O.O}
From: "Mike A. Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, David Durst wrote:
>
> >> A full install does not install every single RPM package. There
> >> is a reason for that.
> >
> >Sounds like you are clueless for what I am asking.
> >And you never stated Binary ONLY modules, I believe you said
> >binary modules (Which really doesn't make sense but I read into it
> >to make it make sense)
>
> Don't mince words. Binary only modules are binary only modules.
> It is stupid to think that Red Hat would ship binary modules and
> not ship the source code, or that Red Hat would ship binary
> modules that someone else compiled if source was available.
>
> There was no lack of clarity in what I said.
So the bozo is unsure of the concept that Red Hat does not ship
software it cannot compile and repair of needed. Some bozo must have
an nvidia whazzitwonderfancyschmancyvideocard, eh? I can understand
his frustration. But nvidia will not release source and Red Hat will
not stand behind anything for which they do not have source. Poof.
So somehow bozo is blaming Mike? Naughty naughty. Mike doesn't make
policy. Mike is not boss. Mike either does what boss wans or Beros
out to unemployment, however temporarily. (And this is NOT a good
market for that kind of a move.)
> >>>Or maybe I am getting it wrong here, lemme look at it the other
> >>>way. You don't want to support the project of a module? If so
> >>>then why dist software at all?
> >>
> >> Red Hat got where it is today by following a set of principles
> >> and values that have made it one of the largest and most used
> >> Linux distributions. Why distribute it all? Simple, because it
> >> is popular, and gaining more popularity daily - without including
> >> binary only modules.
> >
> >You are still misunderstanding what I am stating, your point was
> >"We can't fix it". The counter point to that is U you guys
> >have a habit of shipping broken software. So FIXING software
> >for you guys is sometimes a DEAD DUCK point.
>
> Bullshit. That is just a pure insult. It isn't even worth
> reading any further messages that you write. Welcome to my
> killfile after this message.
Ah bozo hasn't the *FOGGIEST* remotest inkling of a smidgin of a clue
where Red Hat software comes from. Red Hat does not write it all, sir
Bozo. Red Hat collates it and distributes it and attempts to perform
some bug fixes which it passes back to the official package maintainer.
Expect bugs. Don't blame them on Red Hat. Blame them on the package
maintainer - UNLESS Red Hat has made significant custom changes to
the package and it is these custom changes that have broken things. Red
Hat has made the conscious decision to distribute only code to which it
has source so that it has a chance of responding to critical problems
with repairs. It has never, however, claimed to have usurped the
maintainer's position as custodian of the master source accepting full
responsibility for all code bugs in anything it ships. Open Sores^H^H^Hurce
does not work that way. It works as well as it does BECAUSE source IS
available making repairs by the likes of Red Hat, Mandrake, SUSE, Debian,
or others feasible. It makes open source software more nimble with respect
to serious bug repairs than Apple or Microsoft could ever manage, in most
cases. (Sometimes a maintainer dissappears. That causes problems if nobody
else wants to take on the job And in some cases, such as nvidia, there
never is source available so fixes are impossible. That this bozo made
the error in presuming an equation of unfixable with merely broken and
fixable is a reflection of his lack of experience, thought, intellect,
or a combination of any two of the three or even all three at once. ie.
he revealed himself as a card carrying bozo.
> >> Absolutely and completely totally _NO_. Switch to another
> >> distribution that ships it if you must.
> >>
> >
> >H, this is a great stand to take.
> >Our customers want their computers to work, HA! corporate users want
> >their wireless NICS to work. What are you gonna say.
> >Let me quote you correctly: "Absolutely and completely totally _NO_.
> >Switch to another distribution that ships it if you must."
>
> Precicely. You have that option, and are free to exercise it.
Indeed, he is in a position to REQUEST. He is not in a position to
demand. He is apparently too inexperienced with the world to have
learned the difference. Incidentally, Red Hat's attidude about modules
for which no source is available, such as nvidia drivers, is the same
as that of the Linux Kernel developers. If they cannot get their
fingers into the code themselves to fix what may be broken they want
nothing to do with it and indeed mark it as unfit for consumption or
at least unfit for support queries, complaints, bug reports, or even
toilet paper.
> >I thank god that you are not the CEO of RH, b
Re: Sayonara (Was - Re: Dist. Suggestions)
On Saturday 23 November 2002 18:50, jdow uttered: > Indeed, he is in a position to REQUEST. He is not in a position to > demand. He is apparently too inexperienced with the world to have > learned the difference. Incidentally, Red Hat's attidude about modules > for which no source is available, such as nvidia drivers, is the same > as that of the Linux Kernel developers. If they cannot get their > fingers into the code themselves to fix what may be broken they want > nothing to do with it and indeed mark it as unfit for consumption or > at least unfit for support queries, complaints, bug reports, or even > toilet paper. Hell, if Linus had his way, the Linux kernel would _not_ run non-gpl code period. There is a big heated argument over LSM right now, where Linus is forcing a patch that keeps LSM from loading closed source modules, and thus threatening the financial stability of a few security vendors... Be glad, dear twit, that you even have ability to run closed-source modules currently. It could change, and then who would you bitch at? -- Jesse Keating For Web Services and Linux Consulting, Visit --> j2Solutions.net Mondo DevTeam (www.mondorescue.org) Was I helpful? Let others know: http://svcs.affero.net/rm.php?r=jkeating -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Dist. Suggestions
> On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 20:39, David Durst wrote: > >> I will not bother to respond to you comment about being pointless and >> counterproductive discussion, just refer to the above about NOT >> READING THE ORIGINAL POST. > > Dave, I have been following this thread from the afore mentioned > original post. Buried within the copious volumes of ranting you did you > actually had a small point. Unfortunately, you did everything you > possibly could to obscure it with irrational attacks that, it seamed, > were only meant to insult and hurt others. I must say that I am tempted > to follow Mikes lead and feed your email to spammassassin but I'm not > yet convinced you are a complete and utter waste with nothing to > contribute to this list. Can you please state what you THINK was my actual point then? -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Sayonara (Was - Re: Dist. Suggestions)
> Amazing, someone got under Mike's collar. I wonder who could bozo > well enough to manage that? I didn't ask for a NVIDIA driver? I asked for a DRIVER that is under a OSS license, I believe the MPL. Hmmm wait sorry, that alone should make this a MUTE point in that RH can distribute MPL software w/ GPL. But somehow every moron w/ a bone to pick with MS decided to jump on this whole point about JAVA and how it can't be distributed. HEY GUESS WHAT THAT WAS CALMLY PUT DOWN ON A SIDE THREAD - WHEN I RESTATED THE ISSUE/REQUEST. So don't give me a bullshit point about not being able to fix the damn driver. I am completely aware of why one would not distribute software in a main dist. than one could not fix or support - BUT THEN AGAIN I DIDN'T ASK FOR A MAIN DIST. DID I. NO I asked for a SOFTWARES CD. Which in basic is kind of like DEMO software. And still after all the ranting no-one even looked into the driver. So for all of those that say they followed this post HA. Yeah right. Obviously this guy didn't. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Sayonara (Was - Re: Dist. Suggestions)
> On Saturday 23 November 2002 18:50, jdow uttered: >> Indeed, he is in a position to REQUEST. He is not in a position to >> demand. He is apparently too inexperienced with the world to have >> learned the difference. Incidentally, Red Hat's attidude about modules >> for which no source is available, such as nvidia drivers, is the same >> as that of the Linux Kernel developers. If they cannot get their >> fingers into the code themselves to fix what may be broken they want >> nothing to do with it and indeed mark it as unfit for consumption or >> at least unfit for support queries, complaints, bug reports, or even >> toilet paper. > > Hell, if Linus had his way, the Linux kernel would _not_ run non-gpl > code period. There is a big heated argument over LSM right now, where > Linus is forcing a patch that keeps LSM from loading closed source > modules, and thus threatening the financial stability of a few security > vendors... > > Be glad, dear twit, that you even have ability to run closed-source > modules currently. It could change, and then who would you bitch at? Once again, someone that didn't read the ORIGINAL POST and still thinks the driver I asked for is a CLOSED SOURCE DRIVER. Ha! -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Dist. Suggestions
On Sun, 2002-11-24 at 02:39, David Durst wrote: > > If there's a chance that it's gonna do a bit of good, I would suggest > > that you send a private email to Mike Harris and apologize for offending > > him. > > > > Craig > Please refer to the ORINGAL postins and side threat about MISTATING THE > PROBLEM. > > I made my point calmly, I will not apologize to Mike. He made it personal > in his first & second posting back to me. > > The reason the Mike & Others are so admit about not putting something in > the distro is because they never bothered to look into what I was asking > for in the first place. > > They assumed something about what I was asking, and they keep holding to > this assumption (NOTE this has been mostly MIKE). After he made it personal > and continued to go by his assumption I was finally irritated enough to > insult him. > > NOTE - IF YOU FEEL LIKE POSTING SOMETHING BACK TO THIS PLEASE READ THE > ORIGINAL THREAD! > Hi all, Debate and opinion is good here. However, you crossed the line to being demanding it's seems to me and the caps shouting doesn't help. If you have a problem or issue that can't be fixed here, Red Hat has a very good tech support services, which are available for little cost. They can help you on very specific area's and possibly inform you on company policy on why things are or are not part of the distro, especially binary modules ... whatever. Red Hat do things right and sometimes do things wrong - Nobody is perfect. However, I see Red Hat do it their way (as all distro's do) for the overall majority of customers and I think that approach is working. Yes 8.0 is querky, what .0 isn't, but look deeper and you can see work Red Hat is doing that other distro's aren't. Improvement to X config I refer to the new 'Display settings' on the desktop (thanks Mike :)), saving alot of hassle for most. The included updates to the GNU shellutils, which are actaully not released, but allow those of us with Athlon systems to use 'uname -p' and get a correct 'Athlon' result, not the result 'unknown' which you will get with most distro's including Mandrake 9. We all see problems with 8.0 for example: 1. No errata yet to get memprof to allow file selection. 2. No Gnome menu editing. This one Havoc nicely clarified on this list with explanation of how to manually edit menu's for the time being. Though knowing if the needed changes will be ready for 8.1 would be nice, but it maybe too soon for Havoc to give a yes or no answer? 3. Why when you use the tree in Nautilus. When you access a folder in in the main window. Why isn't it also being moved to that folder in the tree? This one is a Gnome problem generally i.e. not Red Hat specific. 4. Some UTF font problems with apps like xchat. This needs to be addressed by the xchat people. I see no reason to get all bent out of shape about these. Well if they are still in 8.1 - maybe that is the time to? :) Be nice and stay calm! Regards Philip Wyett -- AIM: PhilipWyett ICQ: 135463069 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Public key ID: 39018C68 Public key stored at: http://www.keyserver.net -- signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Sayonara (Was - Re: Dist. Suggestions)
> "Mike A. Harris" wrote: >> > > > . . . text whacked > >> >> Feel free to fight amongst yourselves. >> > > > Wish you could ignore the agitator & not leave the forum, Mike. I try to > read all the posts by RH employees. I never know what info I may find > valuable in those posts. It might have been valuable if PEOPLE didn't jump to conclusion and make assumptions about what I had asked. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Dynamic PDF using PHP in Apache 2.0
On Sunday 24 November 2002 07:19, Brooks Kelley wrote: > I read Keith Winston's message and wanted to know what classes he or > anyone has found to create a dynamic PDF file from PHP using Apache 2.0 > on RH8.0. > > I am in the process of configuring a web server for a non-profit > organization that needs to fill in forms and have them printed. > > I just switched like everyone else to RH8.0 and I have not fully > investigated the implications of Apache 2.0 and what it does with PHP > and what features I can use that I could use in Apache 1.3.XX. > > I was debating about switching back to 7.3 and running Apache 1.3.23 in > order to get PDF capability. google for "php pdf class", there are at least two classes out there which can produce PDF *without* using the standard PDF library. IE it produces PDF using only native PHP. -- Jason Wong -> Gremlins Associates -> www.gremlins.biz /* He who laughs last usually had to have joke explained. */ -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Dist. Suggestions
> On Sun, 2002-11-24 at 02:39, David Durst wrote: >> > If there's a chance that it's gonna do a bit of good, I would >> suggest that you send a private email to Mike Harris and apologize >> for offending him. >> > >> > Craig >> Please refer to the ORINGAL postins and side threat about MISTATING >> THE PROBLEM. >> >> I made my point calmly, I will not apologize to Mike. He made it >> personal in his first & second posting back to me. >> >> The reason the Mike & Others are so admit about not putting something >> in the distro is because they never bothered to look into what I was >> asking for in the first place. >> >> They assumed something about what I was asking, and they keep holding >> to this assumption (NOTE this has been mostly MIKE). After he made it >> personal and continued to go by his assumption I was finally irritated >> enough to insult him. >> >> NOTE - IF YOU FEEL LIKE POSTING SOMETHING BACK TO THIS PLEASE READ THE >> ORIGINAL THREAD! >> > > Hi all, > > Debate and opinion is good here. However, you crossed the line to being > demanding it's seems to me and the caps shouting doesn't help. If you > have a problem or issue that can't be fixed here, Red Hat has a very > good tech support services, which are available for little cost. They > can help you on very specific area's and possibly inform you on company > policy on why things are or are not part of the distro, especially > binary modules ... whatever. > > Red Hat do things right and sometimes do things wrong - Nobody is > perfect. However, I see Red Hat do it their way (as all distro's do) for > the overall majority of customers and I think that approach is working. > Yes 8.0 is querky, what .0 isn't, but look deeper and you can see work > Red Hat is doing that other distro's aren't. Improvement to X config I > refer to the new 'Display settings' on the desktop (thanks Mike :)), > saving alot of hassle for most. The included updates to the GNU > shellutils, which are actaully not released, but allow those of us with > Athlon systems to use 'uname -p' and get a correct 'Athlon' result, not > the result 'unknown' which you will get with most distro's including > Mandrake 9. > > We all see problems with 8.0 for example: > > 1. No errata yet to get memprof to allow file selection. > 2. No Gnome menu editing. This one Havoc nicely clarified on this list >with explanation of how to manually edit menu's for the time being. > Though knowing if the needed changes will be ready for 8.1 would be > nice, but it maybe too soon for Havoc to give a yes or no answer? > 3. Why when you use the tree in Nautilus. When you access a folder in >in the main window. Why isn't it also being moved to that folder in > the tree? This one is a Gnome problem generally i.e. not Red Hat > specific. > 4. Some UTF font problems with apps like xchat. This needs to be >addressed by the xchat people. > > I see no reason to get all bent out of shape about these. Well if they > are still in 8.1 - maybe that is the time to? :) > Thank you for actually be intellegent. Yes I do agree that I like RHs work, I had made a suggestion to include some softwares that are not neccesarly OSS. The first 2 responses I got were intellegent like this and brought light to some of the problems which started a different thread in which I restated the problem. Then I kept getting flames from the people I have been going at it with since. As far as I was concerned the issue was settled as of friday, then these guys kept coming back w/ these arguements that were unfounded about how closed source software was the devil and all othe sort of things that were not applicable, and I got pissed off that they didn't bother to do their homework before spouting off. But yes I do agree with you that RH has done a good job, but if memory serves me correctly if it were not for alot of people requesting the changes that RH made it wouldn't have happened. I remember the problems that RH fix in 8.0 were mentioned and complained about in 6.2 so complaining has to start somewhere and sometime. For all that will bother to read this post, it has not always been RHs policy to not distribute closed source software - Remember staroffice and the cold fusion demo. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Sayonara (Was - Re: Dist. Suggestions)
On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 22:41, David Durst wrote: > Once again, someone that didn't read the ORIGINAL POST and still thinks > the driver I asked for is a CLOSED SOURCE DRIVER. > You are a stupid moron, David Durst. Nobody on this list will miss you if you decide to leave, but *A LOT* of people (including myself) will miss Mike, since he has been very helpful to everybody. What have you done to help the community, by the way? Can you enlight us, please? -- ¡Sé libre, usa software libre! Be free, use free software! http://www.imoqland.com/ -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Sayonara (Was - Re: Dist. Suggestions)
Mike A. Harris wrote: You remind me of that one random annoying person on our mailing lists each release, that makes me sick enough to not want to help people on our lists any more, as I'm not paid to do so, and I no longer enjoy the experience. So on that note, I bid the mailing list goodbye. I don't need to waste my time reading and responding to this mindless drivel. Feel free to fight amongst yourselves. Ok, I pretty much ignored this thread about 30 emails ago. After reading the first couple of replies from the OP, I filtered him to the Trash folder. There are users on this list that are, and have been a great help to me and many others. Whenever I see a post from any of these people, I make it a point to read what they have to say. Mike Harris is one of those people. I completely respect his tips and expert advice. I also understand that he responds to questions and problems on this list out of his desire to help people, and out of his love and passion for linux. He has made it clear that monitoring the lists is not part of his job; he does this on his own time. Why someone would want to incessantly bash such a valuable resource is beyond me. I have tried three other linux distros, and two of them had horrible to non-existent support. I am very happy with RedHat. I think back to when I loaded 5.2, and see how far the RedHat distro has come since them. So, if you don't like what you see now, be patient, file bugs or RFE's, or switch to something else. I think most of the people on this list are here because they are happy with RedHat. No, it's not perfect, but it keeps getting better and better. Remember the security bugs that affected other distros (eg. sendmail and openssh)? RedHat had already found and corrected those problems. I hope Mike will get a good night's sleep, (if he ever sleeps), and laugh about this after a while. After what was said, and the way it was said, I would not blame him for leaving the list. But, I sure hope he stays. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Sayonara (Was - Re: Dist. Suggestions)
I know its pittifull compared to Mikes achievements and all, and I am sure its lame in comparison to you and all also. So I will just go and un-install all 1500 RH machines I have installed at small companies. Thanks for your great insight into the underlying problem This is the exact sorta talk that will destroy the community if you are not carefull. Look I apologize for being a dick to Mike, but he should not have been a dick first. > On Sat, 2002-11-23 at 22:41, David Durst wrote: > >> Once again, someone that didn't read the ORIGINAL POST and still >> thinks the driver I asked for is a CLOSED SOURCE DRIVER. >> > > You are a stupid moron, David Durst. Nobody on this list will miss you > if you decide to leave, but *A LOT* of people (including myself) will > miss Mike, since he has been very helpful to everybody. > > What have you done to help the community, by the way? Can you enlight > us, please? > > -- > ¡Sé libre, usa software libre! > Be free, use free software! > http://www.imoqland.com/ > > > > -- > Psyche-list mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Sayonara (Was - Re: Dist. Suggestions)
> Mike A. Harris wrote: > >>You remind me of that one random annoying person on our mailing >>lists each release, that makes me sick enough to not want to help >> people on our lists any more, as I'm not paid to do so, and I no >> longer enjoy the experience. >> >>So on that note, I bid the mailing list goodbye. I don't need to waste >> my time reading and responding to this mindless drivel. >> >>Feel free to fight amongst yourselves. Wow, I was not aware Mike was leaving. That was not the intent I apologize if that helps. But it probably won't. -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Sayonara (Was - Re: Dist. Suggestions)
> Don't mince words. Binary only modules are binary only modules. It is > stupid to think that Red Hat would ship binary modules and > not ship the source code, or that Red Hat would ship binary > modules that someone else compiled if source was available. > > There was no lack of clarity in what I said. Can someone please point to me where I demanded proprietry kernel modules? Please someone help me here cause I don't remember writing that. I complained of Drivers that are not GPL not being distributed, by no means are NON-GPL modules proprietary. >>> >>> Red Hat got where it is today by following a set of principles >>> and values that have made it one of the largest and most used >>> Linux distributions. Why distribute it all? Simple, because it is >>> popular, and gaining more popularity daily - without including binary >>> only modules. >> >>You are still misunderstanding what I am stating, your point was >>"We can't fix it". The counter point to that is U you guys >>have a habit of shipping broken software. So FIXING software >>for you guys is sometimes a DEAD DUCK point. > > Bullshit. That is just a pure insult. It isn't even worth > reading any further messages that you write. Welcome to my > killfile after this message. Yeah at that point it was a insult Mike, because you kept hounding this point with out looking at the drivers I was asking for. >>H, this is a great stand to take. >>Our customers want their computers to work, HA! corporate users want >> their wireless NICS to work. What are you gonna say. >>Let me quote you correctly: "Absolutely and completely totally _NO_. >> Switch to another distribution that ships it if you must." > > Precicely. You have that option, and are free to exercise it. > > >>I thank god that you are not the CEO of RH, because if you were >>and or if the CEO does shares your same opinions about overall >>SOFTWARE SUPPORT & DIST., RH is bound to fail. That is when you >>tell the market, screw you we will not PUT ON a seperate CD >>drivers thar are not GPL (And look into it before you open your >>mouth, the drivers I am speaking of are OPEN SOURCE just not GPL >>- http://www.linux-wlan.com/linux-wlan/) > > Open source drivers are a different story. In one breath you are > demanding we ship proprietary drivers. Once again where did I say that (The only piece that could be considered propriety that I asked for was JAVA) > claiming that they are open source. Considering that, and They are MPL, go to the link Mike > considering your above statements differentiating "binary > module" and "binary only module" (which are identical in the > context of the discussion), I don't think you even understand the > difference. I do, one is compiled (Binary Module) that you could possible have the access to the source to. The other (Binary ONLY module) you don't have the source to. And my reason for insulting you is because you have a condisending way of dealing w/ people. PLEASE IF I DID SHOW ME WHERE I ASKED FOR A BINARY ONLY PROPRIETARY KERNEL MODULE!!! -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
One of the original Dist Suggestion Posts
After digging throught my sent box I pulled this back out, I post this back to Mike a while back, this was not insulting to him outside of him being pissed at the Donald Becker comment. So lets get this straight I didn't as for a proprietary driver, MPL is not proprietary and if it is Mozilla is proprietary. If I remember his post back he insulted my posting by comparing it to a root canal. That made it personal. So lets get it straight. >Ok, maybe OpenLDAP does come w/ it. My mistake - but when you click to >do a FULL INSTALL it doesn't. >And great RH doesn't support Binary Modules - you can get a source >version compile it on your own and then send it out as a binary. >Or maybe I am getting it wrong here, lemme look at it the other way. You >don't want to support the project of a module? >If so then why dist software at all? >It just a piece of software that POSSIBLE could be borken when you ship >it but that should be no concern of yours considering XMMS & Postgres :) >Just ship the damn module so RH 8.1 or whatever can support about 75% of >the wireless NICS on the market. >This discussion reminds me of the pre Donald Becker days and dealing w/ >regular NIC cards. > On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, David Durst wrote: > >>I recently upgraded from RH 7.3 to 8.0 and at first I loved it, the I >> realized that it kind of sucked. >> >>Let me explain and I will get to my suggestions about the way RHs Next >> major released should be. >> >>1st. Lack of REAL Software (OpenLDAP) > > Perhaps you did not get a copy of the official Red Hat Linux 8.0 then. > Red Hat Linux 8.0 does come with openldap. > > [root@devel /]# cat /etc/redhat-release ; rpm -q openldap > Red Hat Linux release 8.0 (Psyche) > openldap-2.0.25-1 > > >>2nd. Lack of Wireless LAN Drivers (PRISM2) >> >>Ok now I know everyone is gonna jump on this and say that OpenLDAP (I >> don't think its GPL) and PRISM2 Drivers are not GPL. > > [root@devel /]# rpm -qi openldap | grep License > Size: 1215211 License: OpenLDAP > > >>Well that is where my suggestion comes in, in 7.3 Staroffice a >>NON-GPL software came w/ the dist. on a seperate CD. > > The distribution itself is comprised of open source CD images. > The boxed products come with some extra CDs which are NOT part of Red > Hat Linux, but which are bundled in with the OS inside the > box. StarOffice being one of those items in the past. > >>Does anyone support the IDEA of dist. NON-GPL software on a >>seperate CD??? > > The boxed set already comes with exactly that. > >>I think it would make alot of people much happier if they didn't have >> to go reading through mailing lists to find out how to get >>a Netgear wireless NIC to work under 8.0. > > Red Hat does not support binary kernel modules. > >>Along w/ that is there is a serious need for a Directory Service so it >> is just a thought. > > Such as the openldap directory service that is included with Red Hat > Linux 8.0 perhaps? > > > -- > Mike A. Harrisftp://people.redhat.com/mharris > OS Systems Engineer > XFree86 maintainer > Red Hat Inc. > > > > -- > Psyche-list mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Sayonara (Was - Re: Dist. Suggestions)
On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, David Durst wrote: > So I will just go and un-install all 1500 RH machines I have installed at > small companies. Hey, if you want support from Red Hat, you're free to buy it from them. > This is the exact sorta talk that will destroy the community if you > are not carefull. It's the kind of demanding, ranting, trolling people like you trying to achieve that, and failing btw. > Look I apologize for being a dick to Mike, but he should not have been > a dick first. The 'he started it' method. Oh grow up. -- Riemer Palstra // [EMAIL PROTECTED] // http://palstra.com/ A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
Re: Dist. Suggestions
On Sat, 23 Nov 2002, David Durst wrote: > Thank you for actually be intellegent. Please learn how to spell intelligent before judging other people on that quality. > Then I kept getting flames from the people I have been going at it with > since. Posting sentences in all caps, insulting people, hey now, strange that you get insulted isn't it? > then these guys kept coming back w/ these arguements that were unfounded > about how closed source software was the devil and all othe sort of things > that were not applicable, Oh, just learn how te read and come back in a few months... > For all that will bother to read this post, it has not always been RHs > policy to not distribute closed source software - Remember staroffice and > the cold fusion demo. So you didn't read Mike's posts then, did you? -- Riemer Palstra // [EMAIL PROTECTED] // http://palstra.com/ A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? -- Psyche-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://listman.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/psyche-list
