Re: Subscription Information

[Michael Babcock]

hi;
you going to the msatc in anchorage in august?
and it's
discuss-subscr...@macvisionaries.com
i think
mike

On Jul 13, 2009, at 10:41 PM, Richie Gardenhire wrote:

Hi Mike, Could you send me the subscription info for the Macvoiceover  
list?  I had some issues with my Mail program and I finally got it to  
work, but in the process, I lost a lot of my mail.  Thanks. Richie  
Gardenhire, Anchorage, Alaska.

Michael Babcock
GW Hosting, Your Dedicated Home On The Web
Phone: +1-888-272-3555, ext 54121
email: michael.babc...@gwhosting.net
administrative e-mail: ad...@gwhosting.net
url: http://gwhosting.net


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Thuy]

Not strictly true that you have to close down one app to use another.
It's like windows mobile, where you press the home key to launch a new
process. Then when you want to go back to the previous one, just
select it and you're back where you left off. Since screenreaders can
only give one focus at any given moment (and presumably we can only
interact with one thing at a time), this seems to make a lot of sense
to me, otherwise you would have multiple voices babbling away if you
really did want to be 'multi-tasking'?!



On 14/07/2009, william lomas  wrote:
> I agree with this.
>
> 1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
> 2. the thought of having to keep closing application x to use
> application y will be frustrating for symbian users, since i can have
> the web and an sms window open at same time
>
> 3. Using speech on a call on a symbian phone is in my view easier
> since if one dials numbers for an automated system, it is easier I
> think in my view, to type the number on a keypad, rather than having
> to mess around finding it on a dial pad etc
>
> On 13 Jul 2009, at 22:41, Damon Fibraio wrote:
>
>> I’m not 100 percent sure.
>>
>> --
>> Damon Fibraio
>> screen names -- aol: dfibraio...msn dfibr...@comcast.net. skype:
>> dfibraio
>> Find me on facebook as Damon fibraio or twitter as dfibraio
>> personal music site: http://www.keyboardguy.com.
>> Band web sites: THD, http://www.thdband.com. Days Before Tomorrow,
>> http://www.daysbeforetomorrow.com
>>
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> ] On Behalf Of patrickneazer
>> Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 4:31 PM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: Article Slamming the iPhone
>>
>> Hello Damon and all:
>>
>> I have no idea what to say in response to your question because I
>> have both an Iphone and a symbian 60 phone and I am sold on the
>> performance of the Iphone.
>>
>> So, let me ask a question of you and then possibly I would know
>> better how to respond.
>>
>> What sorts of comparisons are you wanting to make. What for example
>> would you want to see that would provide you with some sense that
>> the Iphone truly would be worth the effort and enthusiasm others are
>> putting into it.
>>
>> I am not advocating that you drink the coolaide. I am asking however
>> what flavor of drink would you like to order.
>>
>>
>> On Jul 13, 2009, at 3:22 PM, Damon Fibraio wrote:
>>
>>
>> OK. I understand what you are saying. But is there anything about
>> the I-phone beyond that? I mean, featurewise or functionality. I am
>> replying to somebody who said they get more from the i-phone than
>> they get from their windows mobile phone and I am curious to know
>> why. What is different? I mean, I have been on the net with my
>> blackjack 2. Why is the i-phone better and easier? What else does
>> the i-phone do besides make calls and get on the net, for example?
>> This goes beyond the fact that voice over is built in and it saves
>> money. I got that part. I just hear that people are finding this
>> more powerful than a windows smart phone and I am curious to know how.
>>
>> --
>> Damon Fibraio
>> screen names -- aol: dfibraio...msn dfibr...@comcast.net. skype:
>> dfibraio
>> Find me on facebook as Damon fibraio or twitter as dfibraio
>> personal music site: http://www.keyboardguy.com.
>> Band web sites: THD, http://www.thdband.com. Days Before Tomorrow,
>> http://www.daysbeforetomorrow.com
>>
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> ] On Behalf Of Scott Howell
>> Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 3:11 PM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: Article Slamming the iPhone
>>
>> Well let me put it into perspective from my point of view. When it
>> comes right down to it, cost, cost, and cost. All the adaptive
>> solutions you mention cost lots of money. I'm by no means unable to
>> afford the adaptive solutions, but I also realize that the adaptive
>> market is small and the cost will be considerably more do to the
>> limited market. However, why should I pay oh, maybe $150 for the
>> phone, $300  or so for the screen reader, and then another $895 for
>> the GPS solution. So, now I have invested $1,345 into a phone that
>> will get me around and generally offer me fairly accessible benefits
>> to some apps. Where now with the iPhone I can spend $199 or $299 and
>> get great access to pretty much anything I need, tight integration
>> with my Mac without needing a third-party app that I would likely
>> have to pay for, and a future of other capabilities that will not
>> cost me nearly as much. So, really in my opinion I'd rather spend
>> the money on other things and really to be honest, it always will
>> come down to what works for you and fits within your budget. If you
>> are happy with the setup you have, then that is great and I am
>> pleased for you. However, the other thing here is choice and that is
>> probably a close se

Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[william lomas]

no but I mean that one can keep an application open on a nokia phone  
hold down menu to get back to it with no problems but it seems on an i  
phone you can't keep say an SMS open whilst on the web or something to  
come back to later
WIll

On 14 Jul 2009, at 09:04, Thuy wrote:

>
> Not strictly true that you have to close down one app to use another.
> It's like windows mobile, where you press the home key to launch a new
> process. Then when you want to go back to the previous one, just
> select it and you're back where you left off. Since screenreaders can
> only give one focus at any given moment (and presumably we can only
> interact with one thing at a time), this seems to make a lot of sense
> to me, otherwise you would have multiple voices babbling away if you
> really did want to be 'multi-tasking'?!
>
>
>
> On 14/07/2009, william lomas  wrote:
>> I agree with this.
>>
>> 1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
>> 2. the thought of having to keep closing application x to use
>> application y will be frustrating for symbian users, since i can have
>> the web and an sms window open at same time
>>
>> 3. Using speech on a call on a symbian phone is in my view easier
>> since if one dials numbers for an automated system, it is easier I
>> think in my view, to type the number on a keypad, rather than having
>> to mess around finding it on a dial pad etc
>>
>> On 13 Jul 2009, at 22:41, Damon Fibraio wrote:
>>
>>> I’m not 100 percent sure.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Damon Fibraio
>>> screen names -- aol: dfibraio...msn dfibr...@comcast.net. skype:
>>> dfibraio
>>> Find me on facebook as Damon fibraio or twitter as dfibraio
>>> personal music site: http://www.keyboardguy.com.
>>> Band web sites: THD, http://www.thdband.com. Days Before Tomorrow,
>>> http://www.daysbeforetomorrow.com
>>>
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> ] On Behalf Of patrickneazer
>>> Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 4:31 PM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: Article Slamming the iPhone
>>>
>>> Hello Damon and all:
>>>
>>> I have no idea what to say in response to your question because I
>>> have both an Iphone and a symbian 60 phone and I am sold on the
>>> performance of the Iphone.
>>>
>>> So, let me ask a question of you and then possibly I would know
>>> better how to respond.
>>>
>>> What sorts of comparisons are you wanting to make. What for example
>>> would you want to see that would provide you with some sense that
>>> the Iphone truly would be worth the effort and enthusiasm others are
>>> putting into it.
>>>
>>> I am not advocating that you drink the coolaide. I am asking however
>>> what flavor of drink would you like to order.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jul 13, 2009, at 3:22 PM, Damon Fibraio wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> OK. I understand what you are saying. But is there anything about
>>> the I-phone beyond that? I mean, featurewise or functionality. I am
>>> replying to somebody who said they get more from the i-phone than
>>> they get from their windows mobile phone and I am curious to know
>>> why. What is different? I mean, I have been on the net with my
>>> blackjack 2. Why is the i-phone better and easier? What else does
>>> the i-phone do besides make calls and get on the net, for example?
>>> This goes beyond the fact that voice over is built in and it saves
>>> money. I got that part. I just hear that people are finding this
>>> more powerful than a windows smart phone and I am curious to know  
>>> how.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Damon Fibraio
>>> screen names -- aol: dfibraio...msn dfibr...@comcast.net. skype:
>>> dfibraio
>>> Find me on facebook as Damon fibraio or twitter as dfibraio
>>> personal music site: http://www.keyboardguy.com.
>>> Band web sites: THD, http://www.thdband.com. Days Before Tomorrow,
>>> http://www.daysbeforetomorrow.com
>>>
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> ] On Behalf Of Scott Howell
>>> Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 3:11 PM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: Article Slamming the iPhone
>>>
>>> Well let me put it into perspective from my point of view. When it
>>> comes right down to it, cost, cost, and cost. All the adaptive
>>> solutions you mention cost lots of money. I'm by no means unable to
>>> afford the adaptive solutions, but I also realize that the adaptive
>>> market is small and the cost will be considerably more do to the
>>> limited market. However, why should I pay oh, maybe $150 for the
>>> phone, $300  or so for the screen reader, and then another $895 for
>>> the GPS solution. So, now I have invested $1,345 into a phone that
>>> will get me around and generally offer me fairly accessible benefits
>>> to some apps. Where now with the iPhone I can spend $199 or $299 and
>>> get great access to pretty much anything I need, tight integration
>>> with my Mac without needing a third-party app that I would likely
>>> have to pay for, and a future of

RE: Mae, iMac, Macbooks and other Apple computers.

[Simon Fogarty]

Correction,

 The mac book air is very thin and lite due to no optical drive built in.
however you can purchase as well an external DVD drive unit. That connects
through usb, as does the local area wired network connection,  the air has a
small / thin form factor  and is extremely lyte weight.
Very cool design but I wouldn't own one. They'd be to easy to break.



-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
Sent: Monday, 13 July 2009 8:51 a.m.
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Mae, iMac, Macbooks and other Apple computers.


Hi Mae,
The really short answer is the MBA hasn't any sort of optical drive.  
Not quite sure how that works  other than you're supposed to be able  
to network with another computer, say your desktop that has such a  
drive, CD/DVD drive in other words and somehow use that as, I'm  
guessing an external drive.
Seems kinda strange to me. *shrugs*

The MacBook Pro has a bit more power, larger built in HD and some  
other things for well. LOL uber techy folks.
Anyone else who can jump in with a better explanation, feel free.
HTH
  Jenny
Olathe, Kansas 



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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Scott Howell]

Gee Will, that sounds like how any computer would work, don't you  
agree? After all, you can really only do one task while the machine  
does something in the background. :)
On Jul 14, 2009, at 4:04 AM, Thuy wrote:

>
> Not strictly true that you have to close down one app to use another.
> It's like windows mobile, where you press the home key to launch a new
> process. Then when you want to go back to the previous one, just
> select it and you're back where you left off. Since screenreaders can
> only give one focus at any given moment (and presumably we can only
> interact with one thing at a time), this seems to make a lot of sense
> to me, otherwise you would have multiple voices babbling away if you
> really did want to be 'multi-tasking'?!
>
>
>
> On 14/07/2009, william lomas  wrote:
>> I agree with this.
>>
>> 1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
>> 2. the thought of having to keep closing application x to use
>> application y will be frustrating for symbian users, since i can have
>> the web and an sms window open at same time
>>
>> 3. Using speech on a call on a symbian phone is in my view easier
>> since if one dials numbers for an automated system, it is easier I
>> think in my view, to type the number on a keypad, rather than having
>> to mess around finding it on a dial pad etc
>>
>> On 13 Jul 2009, at 22:41, Damon Fibraio wrote:
>>
>>> I’m not 100 percent sure.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Damon Fibraio
>>> screen names -- aol: dfibraio...msn dfibr...@comcast.net. skype:
>>> dfibraio
>>> Find me on facebook as Damon fibraio or twitter as dfibraio
>>> personal music site: http://www.keyboardguy.com.
>>> Band web sites: THD, http://www.thdband.com. Days Before Tomorrow,
>>> http://www.daysbeforetomorrow.com
>>>
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> ] On Behalf Of patrickneazer
>>> Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 4:31 PM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: Article Slamming the iPhone
>>>
>>> Hello Damon and all:
>>>
>>> I have no idea what to say in response to your question because I
>>> have both an Iphone and a symbian 60 phone and I am sold on the
>>> performance of the Iphone.
>>>
>>> So, let me ask a question of you and then possibly I would know
>>> better how to respond.
>>>
>>> What sorts of comparisons are you wanting to make. What for example
>>> would you want to see that would provide you with some sense that
>>> the Iphone truly would be worth the effort and enthusiasm others are
>>> putting into it.
>>>
>>> I am not advocating that you drink the coolaide. I am asking however
>>> what flavor of drink would you like to order.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jul 13, 2009, at 3:22 PM, Damon Fibraio wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> OK. I understand what you are saying. But is there anything about
>>> the I-phone beyond that? I mean, featurewise or functionality. I am
>>> replying to somebody who said they get more from the i-phone than
>>> they get from their windows mobile phone and I am curious to know
>>> why. What is different? I mean, I have been on the net with my
>>> blackjack 2. Why is the i-phone better and easier? What else does
>>> the i-phone do besides make calls and get on the net, for example?
>>> This goes beyond the fact that voice over is built in and it saves
>>> money. I got that part. I just hear that people are finding this
>>> more powerful than a windows smart phone and I am curious to know  
>>> how.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Damon Fibraio
>>> screen names -- aol: dfibraio...msn dfibr...@comcast.net. skype:
>>> dfibraio
>>> Find me on facebook as Damon fibraio or twitter as dfibraio
>>> personal music site: http://www.keyboardguy.com.
>>> Band web sites: THD, http://www.thdband.com. Days Before Tomorrow,
>>> http://www.daysbeforetomorrow.com
>>>
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> ] On Behalf Of Scott Howell
>>> Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 3:11 PM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: Article Slamming the iPhone
>>>
>>> Well let me put it into perspective from my point of view. When it
>>> comes right down to it, cost, cost, and cost. All the adaptive
>>> solutions you mention cost lots of money. I'm by no means unable to
>>> afford the adaptive solutions, but I also realize that the adaptive
>>> market is small and the cost will be considerably more do to the
>>> limited market. However, why should I pay oh, maybe $150 for the
>>> phone, $300  or so for the screen reader, and then another $895 for
>>> the GPS solution. So, now I have invested $1,345 into a phone that
>>> will get me around and generally offer me fairly accessible benefits
>>> to some apps. Where now with the iPhone I can spend $199 or $299 and
>>> get great access to pretty much anything I need, tight integration
>>> with my Mac without needing a third-party app that I would likely
>>> have to pay for, and a future of other capabilities that will not
>>> cost me nearly as much. So

RE: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Simon Fogarty]

I haven't but I also don't use the iphone, I have looked at it a little over
the last few days and can say that apple are going to damage the symbian
market / talks capable devices in future editions due to their work on built
in accessibility. 
 I wouldn't go for the current IPhone but that's only really as it wont
allow full access to the device but hells bells they've done some work 



-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Larry Wanger
Sent: Monday, 13 July 2009 3:04 p.m.
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Article Slamming the iPhone


Yes, I read it. What do you expectt from leadership of companies being  
turned on their ear by the Apple accessibility model? Its a growing  
problem for them. Too bad!

On Jul 12, 2009, at 6:43 PM, Richie Gardenhire wrote:

>
> Did anyone read the article forwarded by Jonathan Mosen on various
> lists, which slammed the iPhone?  I got it from a friend of mine and I
> told her that, if she had any prejudices against the iPhone, to talk
> to people who has the iPhone and can speak from firsthand
> experiences.  Richie Gardenhire, Anchorage, Alaska.  PS  I plan to
> purchase my iPhone in August.
>
> >




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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Scott Howell]

Mike, let me correct you. You indicated that one could not move by  
headings etc. with the iPhone. Here is an excerp from the Apple site,  
describing the web rotor.

"VoiceOver features an innovative new virtual control called a  
“rotor.” Turning the rotor— by rotating two fingers on the screen as  
if you were turning an actual dial — changes the way VoiceOver moves  
through a document based on a setting you choose. For example, a flick  
up or down might move through text word by word. But when you choose  
the “character” setting, each time you flick up or down VoiceOver will  
move through the text character by character — perfect when you’re  
proofreading or editing text.
You can also use the rotor to navigate web pages. When you’re on a web  
page, the rotor contains the names of common items, such as headers,  
links, form elements, images, and more. You select a setting, then  
flick up and down to move to the previous or next occurrence of that  
item on the page, skipping over items in between."
Therefore, you can in fact navigate by headings and more. This  
information can be found at 
http://www.apple.com/accessibility/iphone/vision.html 
.



On Jul 13, 2009, at 10:27 PM, Mike Reiser wrote:

>
> I don't have an iphone yet but from what I've read, it's less  
> tedious to
> serf the web with the iphone than with mobile speak, sense you can  
> move
> by headings and sutch.
>
> Mike


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Jenny Kennedy (Howard)]

Yes,.

I think it is odd that in the blind/vi community when a "new" kid  
comes on the block and is a more cost effective or something outside  
th Microsoft norm that it is met with a lot of bad thoughts. It seems  
some folks are fearful of changes and advancements?
Find that strange as well because isn't just dismissing say the Mac/ 
iPhone because it has never been used by the blind, and yes I know  
about outspoken I'm just generalising. A lot like the sighted  
dismissing us because they knew a blind person once who had no skills?  
I'm probily taking it too far but find these little things to be  
interesting.

Also I can not wait until I can get an iPhone.
Jenny

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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Koumanova Rostislava]

i bet that if it was free all of them would love it!
i hate these folks.
rossy
Il giorno 13/lug/09, alle ore 19:51, John Panarese ha scritto:

>
>I know a few folks have said this, but you have to consider the
> special interests of the article's author.  A quick attempt to try to
> take some of the excitement and buzz of the iPhone out of the
> picture.  Yes, as Scott and others have said, the logic can be turned
> on just about every innovation and step forward the blind have had to
> deal with as technology as progressed.  Once again, Apple has done
> what was said to be the impossible, and has improved the options and
> capabilities for all blind people, and grudging credit is given at
> best.  It's actually quite sad.  When VoiceOver first came out and I
> heard a respected AFB person try to explain to me that a free screen
> reader on the Mac was "bad" for the blind, I knew then that there were
> going to be some people who would rather put politics and special
> interests ahead of advancement for blind users.
>
>
> Take Care
>
> John Panarese
>
> On Jul 13, 2009, at 1:36 PM, Scott Howell wrote:
>
>> Hey Josh, I think the same question can be asked of those users who
>> first laid hands on one of those touch-screen PDAs, but I guess some
>> of those or most had keyboards. However, then we can take this same
>> logic to any new interface. For example, those who remember the days
>> of switching from DOS to Windows or who used the Linux command line
>> and then moved to Gnome etc. Ah how the debate rages, but alas this
>> to shall pass. I myself can't wait to get an iPhone and I can
>> already see all the advantages it will offer over the windows mobile
>> device I am using currently and don't much care for.
>> On Jul 13, 2009, at 1:18 PM, Josh de Lioncourt wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> What I'd like to ask all these folks saying the iPhone is so
>>> inefficient is: How efficient were you three weeks after the first
>>> time you ever touched a QWERTY keyboard? It's a whole new model for
>>> human interface interaction. After three weeks, I have no problems
>>> just touching the battery status, or really much of anything else.
>>> Things are not hard to find. They do not move around, and the flick
>>> method of navigation is great when you are having trouble with a
>>> brand-new and unfamiliar screen.
>>>
>>> Sitting with an iPhone for an hour and then declaring it slow,
>>> inefficient, and difficult to navigate is just silly. :) The ever
>>> growing number of VI iPhone users will tell you the same. Sure, it
>>> takes time to be comfortable. Once you are, it's fantastic. :)
>>>
>>> Josh de Lioncourt
>>> …my other mail provider is an owl…
>>>
>>> Twitter: http://twitter.com/Lioncourt
>>> Music: http://stage19music.com
>>> Mac-cessibility: http://www.Lioncourt.com
>>> Blog: http://lioncourtsmusings.blogspot.com
>>> GoodReads: http://goodreads.com/Lioncourt
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>>
>
>
> >


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Re: Mae, iMac, Macbooks and other Apple computers.

[Scott Howell]

Actually I don't think they are any easier to break than any other  
MacBook. They seem to have a very durable
case. I think like any notebook, if your careless it would be more apt  
to be damaged, but the aluminum case does give it more stability  
perhaps than if it were some plastic type material.
On Jul 14, 2009, at 5:31 AM, Simon Fogarty wrote:

>
> Correction,
>
> The mac book air is very thin and lite due to no optical drive built  
> in.
> however you can purchase as well an external DVD drive unit. That  
> connects
> through usb, as does the local area wired network connection,  the  
> air has a
> small / thin form factor  and is extremely lyte weight.
> Very cool design but I wouldn't own one. They'd be to easy to break.
>


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Scott Howell]

What access do you not have to the device? I'm curious since I do not  
have one yet.

On Jul 14, 2009, at 5:37 AM, Simon Fogarty wrote:

>
> I haven't but I also don't use the iphone, I have looked at it a  
> little over
> the last few days and can say that apple are going to damage the  
> symbian
> market / talks capable devices in future editions due to their work  
> on built
> in accessibility.
> I wouldn't go for the current IPhone but that's only really as it wont
> allow full access to the device but hells bells they've done some work


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RE: Mae, iMac, Macbooks and other Apple computers.

[Simon Fogarty]

Dude, I  could almost garuntee that I'd break it. And that's not to say it
hasn't got a stable case and good design / make, I'm just hard on my
devices.


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Scott Howell
Sent: Tuesday, 14 July 2009 10:33 p.m.
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Mae, iMac, Macbooks and other Apple computers.


Actually I don't think they are any easier to break than any other  
MacBook. They seem to have a very durable
case. I think like any notebook, if your careless it would be more apt  
to be damaged, but the aluminum case does give it more stability  
perhaps than if it were some plastic type material.
On Jul 14, 2009, at 5:31 AM, Simon Fogarty wrote:

>
> Correction,
>
> The mac book air is very thin and lite due to no optical drive built  
> in.
> however you can purchase as well an external DVD drive unit. That  
> connects
> through usb, as does the local area wired network connection,  the  
> air has a
> small / thin form factor  and is extremely lyte weight.
> Very cool design but I wouldn't own one. They'd be to easy to break.
>




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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Scott Howell]

Jenny, I think there is more than just fear unless you mean the fear  
of those adaptive technology developers. They are the ones who have to  
fear Apple more than consumers. Of course there are those consumers  
who simply discount something new because it is different than what  
they have grown used too. Of course this applies in the "non-disabled"  
community. I have a co-worker who spent not a great deal less than I  
did for my MacBook Pro, but she got considerably less computer, but  
she would not consider a Mac for any reason. Her justification is that  
windows meets her needs for what she wants to do and she does  not  
want to learn something different. So, I respect her decision, but she  
never attempted to look at a Mac, so she can't really say if one would  
be better than the other and I had to commend her for not bashing the  
Mac. :)
On Jul 14, 2009, at 5:54 AM, Jenny Kennedy (Howard) wrote:

>
> Yes,.
>
> I think it is odd that in the blind/vi community when a "new" kid
> comes on the block and is a more cost effective or something outside
> th Microsoft norm that it is met with a lot of bad thoughts. It seems
> some folks are fearful of changes and advancements?
> Find that strange as well because isn't just dismissing say the Mac/
> iPhone because it has never been used by the blind, and yes I know
> about outspoken I'm just generalising. A lot like the sighted
> dismissing us because they knew a blind person once who had no skills?
> I'm probily taking it too far but find these little things to be
> interesting.
>
> Also I can not wait until I can get an iPhone.
> Jenny
>
> >


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Re: Mae, iMac, Macbooks and other Apple computers.

[Scott Howell]

Ahha, your a rough dude. :) Now now, show those poor devices a little  
tlc. :) Remember you can't fold it up and stuff into a pocket. :)
On Jul 14, 2009, at 6:36 AM, Simon Fogarty wrote:

>
> Dude, I  could almost garuntee that I'd break it. And that's not to  
> say it
> hasn't got a stable case and good design / make, I'm just hard on my
> devices.


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Saving key assignments in num pad commander? Also. What/Where are portable preffrences in VO?

[Jenny Kennedy (Howard)]

Good morning everyone,

I've a few questions regarding VO utilities. Firstly the num pad  
commander.
I went to tweak a few key assignments in the NPC and noticed that  
other key settings seem to of reset themselves.  It doesn't seem like  
there is a "save" setting on the page and I am a bit perplexed by  
this.  Although it just crossed my mind there might be usefulness in  
the apple/file menu.  This also may be a answer to the next question  
but I'm going to ask it anyway.

What are "portable preferences" and how do you make/save them?
I'm guessing it is a file you can put on a thumb drive that will load  
your personal VO settings on any mac. but not quite sure.



Best Wishes
Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
Olathe, Kansas USA

Join me on FaceBook:
Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search  
for it in groups or contact me for details.

Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan


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"New Mail" sound

[Jenny Kennedy (Howard)]

Hi there,
I am wondering if there is a way to change that bonkey little  
squeltchey sound that plays when new mail is received. If so what file  
format must the sound file be in?
Thanks :-)

Best Wishes
Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
Olathe, Kansas USA

Join me on FaceBook:
Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search  
for it in groups or contact me for details.

Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan


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Re: "New Mail" sound

[Alex]

Hi,

It is in preferences of Mail.app. The file must be in *.aiff format.

regards,
Alex,


On Jul 14, 2009, at 6:10 AM, Jenny Kennedy (Howard) wrote:

>
> Hi there,
> I am wondering if there is a way to change that bonkey little
> squeltchey sound that plays when new mail is received. If so what file
> format must the sound file be in?
> Thanks :-)
>
> Best Wishes
> Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
> blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
> Olathe, Kansas USA
>
> Join me on FaceBook:
> Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
> And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search
> for it in groups or contact me for details.
>
> Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan
>
>
> >


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Re: "New Mail" sound

[Thomas McMahan]

ANy number of file types work for sounds with mail.  I know mp3 does  
deffinitely work, have a ton of sound effects for mail to use if I  
choose.

Go to preferences under general is where you can change the current  
sound.  It's a pop-up menu, at the bottom is add/remove sound, should  
be able then to find whatever file you want and save it in there,  
then go back and select it under "New mail sound."  Also you can have  
different rules have sounds as well, for example I have certain  
addresses that come across which are junk mail.  I set rules for them  
to automatically deleet, and as an aditional option I have the rule  
play the sound of a toilet flushing.  I then know it happened, but I  
never have to put up with their mail.

73.
On Jul 14, 2009, at 8:10 AM, Jenny Kennedy (Howard) wrote:

>
> Hi there,
> I am wondering if there is a way to change that bonkey little
> squeltchey sound that plays when new mail is received. If so what file
> format must the sound file be in?
> Thanks :-)
>
> Best Wishes
> Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
> blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
> Olathe, Kansas USA
>
> Join me on FaceBook:
> Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
> And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search
> for it in groups or contact me for details.
>
> Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan
>
>
> >


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[kaare dehard]

I'll certainly think about the iphone when the time comes that I  
require a replacement, but since I just bought mine in april I have to  
run it til I see something for the money I spent.
Talks is servicable for my needs for now, but eventually I'll want a  
new phone in a few years.
On 14-Jul-09, at 5:37 AM, Simon Fogarty wrote:

>
> I haven't but I also don't use the iphone, I have looked at it a  
> little over
> the last few days and can say that apple are going to damage the  
> symbian
> market / talks capable devices in future editions due to their work  
> on built
> in accessibility.
> I wouldn't go for the current IPhone but that's only really as it wont
> allow full access to the device but hells bells they've done some work
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Larry Wanger
> Sent: Monday, 13 July 2009 3:04 p.m.
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Article Slamming the iPhone
>
>
> Yes, I read it. What do you expectt from leadership of companies being
> turned on their ear by the Apple accessibility model? Its a growing
> problem for them. Too bad!
>
> On Jul 12, 2009, at 6:43 PM, Richie Gardenhire wrote:
>
>>
>> Did anyone read the article forwarded by Jonathan Mosen on various
>> lists, which slammed the iPhone?  I got it from a friend of mine  
>> and I
>> told her that, if she had any prejudices against the iPhone, to talk
>> to people who has the iPhone and can speak from firsthand
>> experiences.  Richie Gardenhire, Anchorage, Alaska.  PS  I plan to
>> purchase my iPhone in August.
>>
>>>
>
>
>
>
> >


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[kaare dehard]

Sometimes people get the mental equivalent of muscle memory for a  
particular style of doing something and they find it hard to be  
uprooted, then of course, frustration creeps in so they end up  
justifying their decisions based on a lot of emotional attachment  
rather than facts. I think that this happens everywhere not just in  
the vi community. We just notice it more here:)
On 14-Jul-09, at 6:37 AM, Scott Howell wrote:

>
> Jenny, I think there is more than just fear unless you mean the fear
> of those adaptive technology developers. They are the ones who have to
> fear Apple more than consumers. Of course there are those consumers
> who simply discount something new because it is different than what
> they have grown used too. Of course this applies in the "non-disabled"
> community. I have a co-worker who spent not a great deal less than I
> did for my MacBook Pro, but she got considerably less computer, but
> she would not consider a Mac for any reason. Her justification is that
> windows meets her needs for what she wants to do and she does  not
> want to learn something different. So, I respect her decision, but she
> never attempted to look at a Mac, so she can't really say if one would
> be better than the other and I had to commend her for not bashing the
> Mac. :)
> On Jul 14, 2009, at 5:54 AM, Jenny Kennedy (Howard) wrote:
>
>>
>> Yes,.
>>
>> I think it is odd that in the blind/vi community when a "new" kid
>> comes on the block and is a more cost effective or something outside
>> th Microsoft norm that it is met with a lot of bad thoughts. It seems
>> some folks are fearful of changes and advancements?
>> Find that strange as well because isn't just dismissing say the Mac/
>> iPhone because it has never been used by the blind, and yes I know
>> about outspoken I'm just generalising. A lot like the sighted
>> dismissing us because they knew a blind person once who had no  
>> skills?
>> I'm probily taking it too far but find these little things to be
>> interesting.
>>
>> Also I can not wait until I can get an iPhone.
>> Jenny
>>
>>>
>
>
> >


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Developing for the accessible iPhone

[Alex]

Hi,
Lists,

I am trying to develop for the accessible iPhone, and am looking for  
methods to get around the whole problem with XCode. Though I have  
solutions of my own, I am wondering what kind of solutions you guys  
can come up with.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Regards,
alex,



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music on my iphone

[Brian Moore]

HI all.  Okay, I am copying this message to both lists because it  
involves my mac as well as the iphone.

The ipod feature of the iphone 3gs sounds better than any of my mp3  
players.  Stuff I  have purchased from the itunes store is easy to  
transfer to my phone.  However, I have a library of about 400 gb of  
both flac and mp3 files stored on an external hard drive which is  
connected to my network.  I would like to be able to transfer selected  
albums or songs to the phone.  My mac which is the only itunes I have  
is a 2007 model with a 120 gb hard drive.  Since importing my  
collection is not an option because it wouldn't fit on the mac hard  
drive, there seems to be no way to get files from network sources and  
copy them to my phone.

Not sure that the iphone will even play flac files so I suspect I will  
have to convert them to m4a or something.

Can I move my itunes library to a network drive and then import all my  
other music?  Seems silly to have another copy of all 400 gb of stuff  
but I realy would like to get some of the couple of hundred cds I have  
ripped onto my phone without doing it all again.

any tips would be appreciated.  Thanks.

Brian.


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Quick update on my recent mail questions :-)

[Jenny Kennedy (Howard)]

Hi there,
I just wanted to update everyone on my mail issues.
Thank you so much everyone who has had ideas in how to help.
Okay firstly, that defunct old mobile me account finally went away!   
It is just a small thing, but I am sooo happy it has went away.

Secondly I sorted out the signiture thing.  I am sorry but I had to  
have sighted help with it. I wasn't understanding how the screen was  
layed out and now have it sorted as you can see at the end of my mails.

And I now have George Carlin telling me "There's a letter in your  
mailbox." :-)
So thanks again. You all are so lovely


Best Wishes
Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
Olathe, Kansas USA

Join me on FaceBook:
Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search  
for it in groups or contact me for details.

Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan


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Re: Saving key assignments in num pad commander? Also. What/Where are portable preffrences in VO?

[Chris Blouch]

For portable preferences, I found the instructions here:

http://www.apple.com/accessibility/voiceover/

Pasted from the site:

Your preferences — to go
Once you’ve customized your own Mac, you can take all your VoiceOver 
settings with you on the road. To do so, connect a USB flash drive to 
your Mac and choose Create Portable Preferences from the File menu in 
VoiceOver Utility.

When you connect the flash drive to a Mac, VoiceOver automatically 
detects its presence and instantly reconfigures itself to match the 
Portable Preferences saved on the flash drive for such items as your 
Pronunciation Dictionary, Braille input key assignments, and NumPad 
Commander settings.

Log out, shut down, or turn off VoiceOver, and the settings return to 
their previous state. Great for students who share computers in labs and 
libraries, this feature also comes in handy when you’re visiting a 
friend or using a business associate's computer in the office or on the 
road.

CB

Jenny Kennedy (Howard) wrote:
> Good morning everyone,
>
> I've a few questions regarding VO utilities. Firstly the num pad  
> commander.
> I went to tweak a few key assignments in the NPC and noticed that  
> other key settings seem to of reset themselves.  It doesn't seem like  
> there is a "save" setting on the page and I am a bit perplexed by  
> this.  Although it just crossed my mind there might be usefulness in  
> the apple/file menu.  This also may be a answer to the next question  
> but I'm going to ask it anyway.
>
> What are "portable preferences" and how do you make/save them?
> I'm guessing it is a file you can put on a thumb drive that will load  
> your personal VO settings on any mac. but not quite sure.
>
>
>
> Best Wishes
> Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
> blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
> Olathe, Kansas USA
>
> Join me on FaceBook:
> Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
> And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search  
> for it in groups or contact me for details.
>
> Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan
>
>
> >
>   

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Re: Developing for the accessible iPhone

[James Dietz]

Hey,

This isn't a solution, but I am wondering what if any problems people
have been having wtih Xcode? I've just started using it for a project
and find it quite accessible.  (I've compiled some stuff with it -
status and everything read like a charm. Also manipulating projects
and whatnot works fine).  I'll probably run into it sooner or later,
whatever it is. Feel free to change the thread title (as I'm a
terrible person and didn't).

James

On 7/14/09, Alex  wrote:
>
> Hi,
> Lists,
>
> I am trying to develop for the accessible iPhone, and am looking for
> methods to get around the whole problem with XCode. Though I have
> solutions of my own, I am wondering what kind of solutions you guys
> can come up with.
>
> Any help is greatly appreciated.
>
> Regards,
> alex,
>
>
>
> >
>

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Re: Developing for the accessible iPhone

[Alex]

HI,
James,

IB is the foreseeeable problem.

Regards,
Alex,


On Jul 14, 2009, at 7:16 AM, James Dietz wrote:

>
> Hey,
>
> This isn't a solution, but I am wondering what if any problems people
> have been having wtih Xcode? I've just started using it for a project
> and find it quite accessible.  (I've compiled some stuff with it -
> status and everything read like a charm. Also manipulating projects
> and whatnot works fine).  I'll probably run into it sooner or later,
> whatever it is. Feel free to change the thread title (as I'm a
> terrible person and didn't).
>
> James
>
> On 7/14/09, Alex  wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>> Lists,
>>
>> I am trying to develop for the accessible iPhone, and am looking for
>> methods to get around the whole problem with XCode. Though I have
>> solutions of my own, I am wondering what kind of solutions you guys
>> can come up with.
>>
>> Any help is greatly appreciated.
>>
>> Regards,
>> alex,
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>
>
> >


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Re: music on my iphone

[Kevin Reeves]

Here's a couple ways to do this.

You can set a preference in iTunes to not copy files when songs are  
added. Then, you could either disconnect the drive from the network,  
hook it up to your mac, and add the songs to the library. Or, you  
could add across the network. I do believe that iTunes supports  
networked music drives. once the songs were added, you could then  
transfer them to the phone.

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Itunes won't play FLAC files?

[Mark Baxter]

What's a guy gotta do to get Itunes to play FLAC files?  I'm stunned  
that it's not doing so.


Mark BurningHawk

Skype and Twitter:  BurningHawk1969
MSN:  burninghawk1...@hotmail.com
My home page:
http://MarkBurningHawk.net/


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Mike Reiser]

What I was trying to say was that this coub one with mobilespeak.

M


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Re: Syncing Mac Address Book with Google Contacts question

[Kevin Fjelsted]

I found the following post that discusses this issue.
http://tinyurl.com/5fejtz

There is also the following reference which I have tried without
success from a Google Help user forum.
<<<

To enable Google sync client to operate as a full sync client, one has
to change the client type from "app" to "server". This will enable the
"Sync now" button even when Yahoo sync is not selected, and will make
sure Google sync is run every time a sync is run.

To change the Google sync client type, open a terminal window and type
(one line)
sudo defaults write /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/
GoogleContactSync.framework/Resources/ClientDescription Type 'server'

Then type the following one line command to restore the permissions on
the plist file:
sudo chmod 644 /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/
GoogleContactSync.framework/Resources/ClientDescription.plist

>>>
 Is there someone techy who can study the posts listed and clarify
whether both the items must be done?

-Kevin


 Alex Jurgensen wrote:
> HI,
>
> Missleading. I had the same issues and the instructions were
> misleading. Apple staff are posting me a work around and I will post
> it here if I figure it out.
>
> Regards,
> alex,
>
>
> On 12-Jul-09, at 7:20 PM, Kevin Fjelsted wrote:
>
> >
> > I am attempting to SYNC my mac with my Google COntacts address book.
> > THis solution is documented in the help file for the Mac address book
> > as well as the help file located on google. I have performed the
> > following steps per the doc.
> > 1) Opened the address book on the Mac, accessed preferences, checked
> > the box that states "sync with google", entered mhy Google account and
> > password when prompted.
> > Note the doc states that if the account and password are correct the
> > dialog prompting for them will close.
> > 2) Opened up ISync accessed preferences and checked the option "show
> > sync in status menu" per the doc.
> > 3) Under address book I am attempting to accesss the status menu per
> > the doc which states "access the sync now option under the status
> > menu. My questions are these. 1) What is the procedure under VO to
> > access the status menu? 2) I find a sync menu however the only option
> > is to enable Sync via Mobil Me.
> > Has anyone had experience with setting up this solution via VoiceOver?
> > -Kevin
> >
> > >
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Re: "New Mail" sound

[Kieren]

Yes Any format of sound that quicktime recognizes can be used.

If you would like to add your own sounds to the list of system wide
alert sounds etc.  You can create a folder named "Sounds" without the
quotes and note the capital first letter
In your user library folder or you can add then to the root library/
Sounds Folder if all users want to be able to access them.

Adding them in this way allows all apps that use alert sounds to find
your custom ones.

> Go to preferences under general is where you can change the current  
> sound.  It's a pop-up menu, at the bottom is add/remove sound, should  
> be able then to find whatever file you want and save it in there,  
> then go back and select it under "New mail sound."  Also you can have  
> different rules have sounds as well, for example I have certain  
> addresses that come across which are junk mail.  I set rules for them  
> to automatically deleet, and as an aditional option I have the rule  
> play the sound of a toilet flushing.  I then know it happened, but I  
> never have to put up with their mail.
>
> 73.
> On Jul 14, 2009, at 8:10 AM, Jenny Kennedy (Howard) wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Hi there,
> > I am wondering if there is a way to change that bonkey little
> > squeltchey sound that plays when new mail is received. If so what file
> > format must the sound file be in?
> > Thanks :-)
>
> > Best Wishes
> > Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
> > blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
> > Olathe, Kansas USA
>
> > Join me on FaceBook:
> > Personal Profile -www.facebook.com/blueskyes
> > And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search
> > for it in groups or contact me for details.
>
> > Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan
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Re: Syncing Mac Address Book with Google Contacts question

[Alex]

Hi,
Kevin,

This is te exact post that Apple Staff sent me.

Regards,
Alex,


On Jul 14, 2009, at 7:53 AM, Kevin Fjelsted wrote:

>
> I found the following post that discusses this issue.
> http://tinyurl.com/5fejtz
>
> There is also the following reference which I have tried without
> success from a Google Help user forum.
> <<<
>
> To enable Google sync client to operate as a full sync client, one has
> to change the client type from "app" to "server". This will enable the
> "Sync now" button even when Yahoo sync is not selected, and will make
> sure Google sync is run every time a sync is run.
>
> To change the Google sync client type, open a terminal window and type
> (one line)
> sudo defaults write /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/
> GoogleContactSync.framework/Resources/ClientDescription Type 'server'
>
> Then type the following one line command to restore the permissions on
> the plist file:
> sudo chmod 644 /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/
> GoogleContactSync.framework/Resources/ClientDescription.plist
>

> Is there someone techy who can study the posts listed and clarify
> whether both the items must be done?
>
> -Kevin
>
>
> Alex Jurgensen wrote:
>> HI,
>>
>> Missleading. I had the same issues and the instructions were
>> misleading. Apple staff are posting me a work around and I will post
>> it here if I figure it out.
>>
>> Regards,
>> alex,
>>
>>
>> On 12-Jul-09, at 7:20 PM, Kevin Fjelsted wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I am attempting to SYNC my mac with my Google COntacts address book.
>>> THis solution is documented in the help file for the Mac address  
>>> book
>>> as well as the help file located on google. I have performed the
>>> following steps per the doc.
>>> 1) Opened the address book on the Mac, accessed preferences, checked
>>> the box that states "sync with google", entered mhy Google account  
>>> and
>>> password when prompted.
>>> Note the doc states that if the account and password are correct the
>>> dialog prompting for them will close.
>>> 2) Opened up ISync accessed preferences and checked the option "show
>>> sync in status menu" per the doc.
>>> 3) Under address book I am attempting to accesss the status menu per
>>> the doc which states "access the sync now option under the status
>>> menu. My questions are these. 1) What is the procedure under VO to
>>> access the status menu? 2) I find a sync menu however the only  
>>> option
>>> is to enable Sync via Mobil Me.
>>> Has anyone had experience with setting up this solution via  
>>> VoiceOver?
>>> -Kevin
>>>

> >


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Re: "New Mail" sound

[Alex]

Hi,
Genny,

The system wide library folder for sounds is /Library/Sounds/ .

Regards,
Alex,


On Jul 14, 2009, at 7:57 AM, Kieren wrote:

>
> Yes Any format of sound that quicktime recognizes can be used.
>
> If you would like to add your own sounds to the list of system wide
> alert sounds etc.  You can create a folder named "Sounds" without the
> quotes and note the capital first letter
> In your user library folder or you can add then to the root library/
> Sounds Folder if all users want to be able to access them.
>
> Adding them in this way allows all apps that use alert sounds to find
> your custom ones.
>
>> Go to preferences under general is where you can change the current
>> sound.  It's a pop-up menu, at the bottom is add/remove sound, should
>> be able then to find whatever file you want and save it in there,
>> then go back and select it under "New mail sound."  Also you can have
>> different rules have sounds as well, for example I have certain
>> addresses that come across which are junk mail.  I set rules for them
>> to automatically deleet, and as an aditional option I have the rule
>> play the sound of a toilet flushing.  I then know it happened, but I
>> never have to put up with their mail.
>>
>> 73.
>> On Jul 14, 2009, at 8:10 AM, Jenny Kennedy (Howard) wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> Hi there,
>>> I am wondering if there is a way to change that bonkey little
>>> squeltchey sound that plays when new mail is received. If so what  
>>> file
>>> format must the sound file be in?
>>> Thanks :-)
>>
>>> Best Wishes
>>> Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
>>> blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
>>> Olathe, Kansas USA
>>
>>> Join me on FaceBook:
>>> Personal Profile -www.facebook.com/blueskyes
>>> And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search
>>> for it in groups or contact me for details.
>>
>>> Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan
> >


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Re: Itunes won't play FLAC files?

[Kieren]

A quick Google search yielded this quicktime plugin
http://www.xiph.org/quicktime/download.html

Apparently it allows any quicktime compatible player to open and
play .ogg and .FLAC files so itunes should work with them after
installing (possible restart required)

HTH

Kieren

On Jul 14, 10:39 pm, Mark Baxter  wrote:
> What's a guy gotta do to get Itunes to play FLAC files?  I'm stunned  
> that it's not doing so.
>
> Mark BurningHawk
>
> Skype and Twitter:  BurningHawk1969
> MSN:  burninghawk1...@hotmail.com
> My home page:http://MarkBurningHawk.net/
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Re: "New Mail" sound

[Mark Baxter]

Don't the sounds you add have to be AIFF format?  I don't have  
anything that write AIFF; I used to use *.wavs; will they work?


Mark BurningHawk

Skype and Twitter:  BurningHawk1969
MSN:  burninghawk1...@hotmail.com
My home page:
http://MarkBurningHawk.net/


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Re: Itunes won't play FLAC files?

[Mark Baxter]

Thanks much, Kieren.  Google truly is a deity of epic power and  
majesty. :)


Mark BurningHawk

Skype and Twitter:  BurningHawk1969
MSN:  burninghawk1...@hotmail.com
My home page:
http://MarkBurningHawk.net/


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Chris Blouch]

I think this highlights the elegance of Apple's solution. A screen 
bitmap can not only represent any kind of data anywhere but also make 
virtual controls. On desktop GUIs there was a mouse to map a virtual 
finger tip into the simulated world of buttons and controls. On the 
iPhone this layer is removed so we can actually touch and manipulate the 
controls directly (even if they are not physically perceptible). So to 
make any kind of overlay that tries to anticipate what kind of UI 
element will be in any particular spot is doomed to fail. On the other 
hand, the gesture system Apple created is generalized so it will work 
with whatever crazy UI developers come up with for their iPhone apps. A 
much more future proof solution.

CB

Larry Wanger wrote:
>
> I've been trying to get my head around an idea of creating a screen 
> cover with markings or even Braille on it for the keyboard. The 
> problem though for starters is that the keyboard changes and is 
> contextual. In some text fields, where you're entering email addresses 
> for example, the keyboard adds the period, @ sign and even a .com 
> button. In other cases those symbols are not present on the main 
> keyboard and you need to hit the more button to access these 
> functions. Therefore, I think creating an overlay would be challenging 
> but its something I've thought of.
>
>  
>
>  
>
>  
>
> 
>
> *From:* macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Ryan Mann
> *Sent:* Monday, July 13, 2009 1:45 PM
> *To:* macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> *Subject:* Re: Article Slamming the iPhone
>
>  
>
> With the Iphone, can bumps be put on the spots where the F and J keys 
> are supposed to be?  If not, I could see why it would take some people 
> a little too long to find the virtual home 
> row.  If somebody can't find the home row, it will probably be a struggle to 
> type each key.
>
>  
>
>  
>
>  
>
> On Jul 13, 2009, at 1:18 PM, Josh de Lioncourt wrote:
>
>
>
>  
>
> What I'd like to ask all these folks saying the 
> iPhone is so inefficient is: How efficient were you three weeks after the 
> first time you ever touched a QWERTY keyboard? It's a whole new model for 
> human interface interaction. After three weeks, I have no problems just 
> touching the battery status, or really much of anything else. Things are not 
> hard to find. They do not move around, and the flick method of navigation is 
> great when you are having trouble with a brand-new and unfamiliar screen.
>
>  
>
> Sitting with an iPhone for an hour and then declaring it slow, 
> inefficient, and difficult to navigate is just silly. :) The ever 
> growing number of VI iPhone users will tell you the same. Sure, it 
> takes time to be comfortable. Once you are, it's fantastic. :)
>
>
> Josh de Lioncourt
>
> ...my other mail provider is an owl...
>
>  
>
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/Lioncourt
>
> Music: http://stage19music.com
>
> Mac-cessibility: http://www.Lioncourt.com
>
> Blog: http://lioncourtsmusings.blogspot.com
>
> GoodReads: http://goodreads.com/Lioncourt
>
>  
>
>  
>
>  
>
>  
>
>
>
> >
>

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Re: "New Mail" sound

[Chris G]

You can have the system convert wave files.  I don't remember how I did
it but I have a converted wave file that's my email sound.



On Tue, 14 Jul 2009 06:16:37 -0700
Alex  wrote:

> 
> Hi,
> 
> It is in preferences of Mail.app. The file must be in *.aiff format.
> 
> regards,
> Alex,
> 
> 
> On Jul 14, 2009, at 6:10 AM, Jenny Kennedy (Howard) wrote:
> 
> >
> > Hi there,
> > I am wondering if there is a way to change that bonkey little
> > squeltchey sound that plays when new mail is received. If so what file
> > format must the sound file be in?
> > Thanks :-)
> >
> > Best Wishes
> > Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
> > blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
> > Olathe, Kansas USA
> >
> > Join me on FaceBook:
> > Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
> > And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search
> > for it in groups or contact me for details.
> >
> > Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan
> >
> >
> > >
> 
> 
> 

-- 
Chris G 


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Re: "New Mail" sound

[Thomas McMahan]

I think WAVS will work because when I downloaded my tons of sound  
effects several years ago, WAV was a common file type.  There are  
only a few in my  library which don't seem to work, and another hand  
full which just don't sound good, so I don't use them.
   Perhaps one day I'll get rid of them, or when I ever do a re- 
install will just dump the whole bunch, then next time be more  
selective about moving sounds into the computer.


On Jul 14, 2009, at 10:11 AM, Mark Baxter wrote:

>
> Don't the sounds you add have to be AIFF format?  I don't have
> anything that write AIFF; I used to use *.wavs; will they work?
>
>
> Mark BurningHawk
>
> Skype and Twitter:  BurningHawk1969
> MSN:  burninghawk1...@hotmail.com
> My home page:
> http://MarkBurningHawk.net/
>
>
> >


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Re: Itunes won't play FLAC files?

[Mark Baxter]

I installed the component in the applications folder, but no luck; am  
I doing something wrong?


Mark BurningHawk

Skype and Twitter:  BurningHawk1969
MSN:  burninghawk1...@hotmail.com
My home page:
http://MarkBurningHawk.net/


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Re: Itunes won't play FLAC files?

[Alex]

Hi,
Mark:

It must go in the Qucktime components folder in /Library/ .

Regards,
Alex,


On Jul 14, 2009, at 8:19 AM, Mark Baxter wrote:

>
> I installed the component in the applications folder, but no luck; am
> I doing something wrong?
>
>
> Mark BurningHawk
>
> Skype and Twitter:  BurningHawk1969
> MSN:  burninghawk1...@hotmail.com
> My home page:
> http://MarkBurningHawk.net/
>
>
> >


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Re: navigon lite

[Jason Custer]

AT&T.navigated gives voice guidenze and is accessable. Searching was a  
brease!

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 13, 2009, at 3:28 PM, "May and Wynter"   
wrote:

> I was able to route from where I am to where I wanted to go and got  
> directions for it.  Jus not like I would with trekker, it's not set  
> for that yet.  Maybe some day but know big deal for me.  I just need  
> to know how to get someplace so the map feature that's already on  
> the IPhone works for me.
>
> May and Wynter with a y
> - Original Message -
> From: Chris Blouch
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 1:36 PM
> Subject: Re: navigon lite
>
> Yup. Apparently the 'lite' version is little more than a demo in  
> that it doesn't let you route from where you are to some point. It  
> has a 'simulation' button which will go from someplace near by to  
> the point youpicked, but that's not really useful.
>
> CB
>
> May and Wynter wrote:
>>
>> Hey Rustle there is a version called navigon lite that works with  
>> the IPhone for North America.
>>
>> I tried it out for a little while to see what  if offered.  For  
>> our North American version there's no gps coverage yet. So if you  
>> wanted to use it for routes while you're actually walking and  
>> outside it won't work.  But if you wanted to plan a trip and get  
>> directions before you left it does that very well.  Hope tha made  
>> sense.
>>
>> May and Wynter with a y
>>
>>
>
>
> >

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RE: navigon lite

[Jed Barton]

question guys, does it give turn by turn directions?
What app would i use with the iphone?
 
Thanks,
Jed

  _  

From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jason Custer
Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 11:29 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: navigon lite


AT&T.navigated gives voice guidenze and is accessable. Searching was a
brease!

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 13, 2009, at 3:28 PM, "May and Wynter" 
wrote:



I was able to route from where I am to where I wanted to go and got
directions for it.  Jus not like I would with trekker, it's not set for that
yet.  Maybe some day but know big deal for me.  I just need to know how to
get someplace so the map feature that's already on the IPhone works for me.

May and Wynter with a y

- Original Message - 
From: Chris Blouch   
To:  
macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 1:36 PM
Subject: Re: navigon lite

Yup. Apparently the 'lite' version is little more than a demo in that it
doesn't let you route from where you are to some point. It has a
'simulation' button which will go from someplace near by to the point you
picked, but that's not really useful.

CB

May and Wynter wrote: 

Hey Rustle there is a version called navigon lite that works with the IPhone
for North America.
 
I tried it out for a little while to see what if offered.  For our North
American version there's no gps coverage yet. So if you wanted to use it for
routes while you're actually walking and outside it won't work.  But if you
wanted to plan a trip and get directions before you left it does that very
well.  Hope tha made sense.

May and Wynter with a y










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Re: VO and openoffice

[Chris Blouch]

Depending on your needs, many folks find the built-in wordprocessor 
called TextEdit is perfectly fine. It works well with VO and can open up 
and save as Microsoft Word files along with Open Document Format and 
some others.

CB

Roberto Burceni wrote:
> On 12/07/2009 18:56, Maxwell Ivey Jr. wrote:
>   
>> Hello;  Welcome in advance.  I know that once you get your mac book
>> you will love it.  Don't worry about your typing.  Your message came
>> through just fine.  I don't use open office, but I hear it works well
>> and is getting more accessible in each new version.  I wish that i had
>> bought a mac book pro for the larger hard drive options and more
>> memory, but I have yet to run across anything i can't do with my
>> regular mac book including managing my website and bologs such as my
>> skills are.  Welcome again and good luck, Max
>> On Jul 5, 2009, at 3:04 PM, Roberto Burceni wrote:
>>
>>
>> 
>>> Hi all, I.m an italian blind user who is using linux and used Windows
>>> screenreaders. Since last month I.m interested in the Mac Worls that
>>> seems to be fantastic.
>>> I haven't a Mac today, but I will buy it in the future. I would like
>>> to
>>> buy a Macbook Pro that seems to be the best choice.
>>> I would like to know how VO works with openoffice. Have you
>>> experienced
>>> in this way? Have you some guides to suggest me?
>>> Thanks all and sorry for my not very well English
>>> Bye from Italy
>>>
>>>  
>>>   

 
>>
>> 
> Thank you for answering. What do you use to write documents in mac?
> Bye
>
> >
>   

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Re: usb or fire wire sound cards with opticle inputs?

[Chris Blouch]

Can you be more specific in what you want to do? If it's just stereo 
audio in and out then you already have that built in. Most modern macs 
have dual purpose connectors which do both analog and digital optical 
from the same hole. Beyond that you might need outboard gear to do, say, 
8 channel concurrent recording with 192kbps data rates. For most folks 
the built-in stuff is just fine.

CB

hank smith wrote:
> hello does any know of any sound cards that will work with mac?
> Hank
>
> >

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Re: is this program iphone friendly? Fw: The Orbitcast Daily Update

[Chris Blouch]

AOL Radio seems to use 128kbps MP3 for broadband so maybe that's a lower 
bitrate and breaks up less than XM. It could also be that AOL's content 
distribution network has a node closer to you than XM so there would be 
less network hops and less latency.

http://www.digitalradiotech.co.uk/2008/07/aol_radio_relaunch.php

CB

Larry Wanger wrote:
> Yes, the app is VO friendly on the iPhone but speech tends to crack-up 
> at times. One hint is to hit the pause button in the upper left corner 
> of the app to stop the current station if you wish to change to 
> another one. From a pure performance perspective, I listened to this 
> on the train here in Phoenix the other day where in general we have 5 
> bars the entire way. The app seems to have some problems. Music 
> cracked and skipped a few times. I tried listening to AOL Radio on a 
> different day and did not experience this. The point being that AOL 
> Radio is free and you pay for XM. Sometimes free is better.
>
>
> On Jul 6, 2009, at 1:32 PM, hank smith wrote:
>
>>  
>> - Original Message -
>> *From:* Orbitcast 
>> *To:* hanksmi...@gmail.com 
>> *Sent:* Monday, July 06, 2009 12:09 PM
>> *Subject:* The Orbitcast Daily Update
>>
>>
>>   The Orbitcast Daily Update  
>>   
>> 
>>
>>  
>>
>> 
>>
>> Sirius XM iPhone App beats 1 million downloads 
>> 
>>
>> Posted: 06 Jul 2009 09:57 AM PDT
>>
>> Sirius XM iPhone App
>> Just 2 weeks after its debut, the Sirius XM iPhone App 
>>  has 
>> surpassed more than 1 million downloads. But what continues to amaze 
>> me is that the App has remained as the #1 top free music App 
>> 
>>  - 
>> having reached that status only 12 hours after its launch.
>>
>> All this, despite not featuring Howard Stern.
>> "Reaching more than 1 million downloads so quickly is a strong 
>> testament to our world-class programming and Sirius XM's instant 
>> brand recognition," said Sirius XM Radio Inc. President and Chief 
>> Content Officer Scott Greenstein. "Our goal is to give people access 
>> to the best audio entertainment wherever they go with what we think 
>> is the best music and audio entertainment application available on 
>> the App Store."
>>
>> You know what would be a masterful move? To wait until the momentum 
>> begins to wane, and then issue an App update which would include 
>> additional features 
>> 
>>  and 
>> the "contractual rights" issues 
>> 
>>  with 
>> Stern would get magically fixed.
>>
>> ...or maybe to execute the above "updates" in phases, to maintain 
>> that momentum over an extended period of time.
>>
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>>
>> 
>>   
>> 
>>   
>> 
>>
>> You are subscribed to email updates from Orbitcast 
>>  
>> To stop receiving these emails, you may unsubscribe now 
>> .
>>  
>>  Email delivery powered by Google
>> Google Inc., 20 West Kinzie, Chicago IL USA 60610
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> >

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Re: free recorders and low cost recorders for mac

[Chris Blouch]

You should probably poke through the mail archives as this comes up 
often. I like a free one called Audio Recorder which is fully VO 
accessible except for the initial license screen the first time you run it.

http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/17392

It records direct to your hard drive so recording length is only limited 
by your disk space. I've yet to have it crash so I've used it for 
recording live events so it has replaced the TASCAM CD recorder I used 
to haul in.

CB

hank smith wrote:
> hello is there any free ones or low cost ones I can also try out
> Hank
>
> >

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Re: importing to the address book

[Chris Blouch]

I haven't tried this but it sounds promising and works for more than 
just Eudora.

http://homepage.mac.com/aamann/Eudora_Mailbox_Cleaner.html

CB

Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
> If these are coming from a Microsoft box, I suggest you use Plaxo as  
> an itermediary. You can load them into Plaxo on their web page, and  
> then get the Plaxo agent for macintosh computers that will  
> automatically sync your on-line contacts in Plaxo with your address  
> book on your Macintosh.
>
> Write off list if you want more details.
>
> Jonathan Cohn
> jon.c.c...@gail.com
>
> On Jul 7, 2009, at 9:17 AM, Marcy Weinberg wrote:
>
>   
>> Hi, all,
>> I want to import numerous addresses into my address book.  They are in
>> a text file right now, and I tried to configure a new text file with
>> the proper configuration that I learned by importing my original
>> address book when I got my mac.  Anyway, no matter what I do, the
>> addresses will not import.  I save the file I create as a csv file,
>> but still no go.  Any advice or instructions on this would be
>> terrific!  Thanks a bunch in advance!Marcy
>> -- 
>> Wordy Mom
>> Think positive,
>> ...be positive,
>> ...your cup is always half full.
>>
>>
>> 
>
>
> >
>   

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Re: "New Mail" sound

[Jenny Kennedy (Howard)]

Hi there,

I got *.wav files to work. Right now I have just one sound but think  
I'll go look through the wonderful internet for more. *smile*

Best Wishes
Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
Olathe, Kansas USA

Join me on FaceBook:
Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search  
for it in groups or contact me for details.

Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan


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Obtaining sound effects files was Re: "New Mail" sound

[Jenny Kennedy (Howard)]

Hi there,
Thomas,
Did you get your sound effects files from random places from the web  
or did you go to one place for them?  There used to be a website I got  
sounds from, for wav files but I don't remember the URL.  It had a  
whole big bunch of all kinds of effects, snips from Movies and TV and  
everything.  Was just wondering where you collected all yours.

Best Wishes
Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
Olathe, Kansas USA

Join me on FaceBook:
Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search  
for it in groups or contact me for details.

Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan


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Re: Obtaining sound effects files was Re: "New Mail" sound

[Mark Baxter]

Try wavcentral.com
and a google search will bring up all sorts of storehouses for cartoon  
sounds, Start Trek / wars sound, you name it.  Everything' been  
sampled and bye-sized. :)


Mark BurningHawk

Skype and Twitter:  BurningHawk1969
MSN:  burninghawk1...@hotmail.com
My home page:
http://MarkBurningHawk.net/


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[John Panarese]

 I'm not sure what is mean here.  You can go to any application on  
the iPhone that you had running.  For example, if I check my fantasy  
baseball team's stats and I then check the weather or send a text  
message, I will find my same page open in Safari when I go back.  If I  
pause in writing a text message, that same message will be ready to  
finish when I go back to the Message app.  If  I start to read an  
article in Net News Wire and have to do something else, that article  
will still be there waiting for me.   There might not be a single key  
to press to get you back, but don't say you can't go back to running  
applications you had been using.


Take Care

John Panarese

On Jul 14, 2009, at 4:11 AM, william lomas wrote:

>
> no but I mean that one can keep an application open on a nokia phone
> hold down menu to get back to it with no problems but it seems on an i
> phone you can't keep say an SMS open whilst on the web or something to
> come back to later
> WIll
>
> On 14 Jul 2009, at 09:04, Thuy wrote:
>
>>
>> Not strictly true that you have to close down one app to use another.
>> It's like windows mobile, where you press the home key to launch a  
>> new
>> process. Then when you want to go back to the previous one, just
>> select it and you're back where you left off. Since screenreaders can
>> only give one focus at any given moment (and presumably we can only
>> interact with one thing at a time), this seems to make a lot of sense
>> to me, otherwise you would have multiple voices babbling away if you
>> really did want to be 'multi-tasking'?!
>>
>>
>>
>> On 14/07/2009, william lomas  wrote:
>>> I agree with this.
>>>
>>> 1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
>>> 2. the thought of having to keep closing application x to use
>>> application y will be frustrating for symbian users, since i can  
>>> have
>>> the web and an sms window open at same time
>>>
>>> 3. Using speech on a call on a symbian phone is in my view easier
>>> since if one dials numbers for an automated system, it is easier I
>>> think in my view, to type the number on a keypad, rather than having
>>> to mess around finding it on a dial pad etc
>>>
>>> On 13 Jul 2009, at 22:41, Damon Fibraio wrote:
>>>
 I’m not 100 percent sure.

 --
 Damon Fibraio
 screen names -- aol: dfibraio...msn dfibr...@comcast.net. skype:
 dfibraio
 Find me on facebook as Damon fibraio or twitter as dfibraio
 personal music site: http://www.keyboardguy.com.
 Band web sites: THD, http://www.thdband.com. Days Before Tomorrow,
 http://www.daysbeforetomorrow.com

 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 ] On Behalf Of patrickneazer
 Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 4:31 PM
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

 Hello Damon and all:

 I have no idea what to say in response to your question because I
 have both an Iphone and a symbian 60 phone and I am sold on the
 performance of the Iphone.

 So, let me ask a question of you and then possibly I would know
 better how to respond.

 What sorts of comparisons are you wanting to make. What for example
 would you want to see that would provide you with some sense that
 the Iphone truly would be worth the effort and enthusiasm others  
 are
 putting into it.

 I am not advocating that you drink the coolaide. I am asking  
 however
 what flavor of drink would you like to order.


 On Jul 13, 2009, at 3:22 PM, Damon Fibraio wrote:


 OK. I understand what you are saying. But is there anything about
 the I-phone beyond that? I mean, featurewise or functionality. I am
 replying to somebody who said they get more from the i-phone than
 they get from their windows mobile phone and I am curious to know
 why. What is different? I mean, I have been on the net with my
 blackjack 2. Why is the i-phone better and easier? What else does
 the i-phone do besides make calls and get on the net, for example?
 This goes beyond the fact that voice over is built in and it saves
 money. I got that part. I just hear that people are finding this
 more powerful than a windows smart phone and I am curious to know
 how.

 --
 Damon Fibraio
 screen names -- aol: dfibraio...msn dfibr...@comcast.net. skype:
 dfibraio
 Find me on facebook as Damon fibraio or twitter as dfibraio
 personal music site: http://www.keyboardguy.com.
 Band web sites: THD, http://www.thdband.com. Days Before Tomorrow,
 http://www.daysbeforetomorrow.com

 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 ] On Behalf Of Scott Howell
 Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 3:11 PM
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

 Well 

Re: Itunes won't play FLAC files?

[Mark Baxter]

I moved it there, but Quicktime says "this file isn't a movie," and  
Itunes remains stubbornly silent.


Mark BurningHawk

Skype and Twitter:  BurningHawk1969
MSN:  burninghawk1...@hotmail.com
My home page:
http://MarkBurningHawk.net/


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Josh de Lioncourt]

Just want to address these comments. See my responses inline.

On Jul 13, 2009, at 10:55 PM, william lomas wrote:
> 1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
> 2. the thought of having to keep closing application x to use  
> application y will be frustrating for symbian users, since i can  
> have the web and an sms window open at same time
>
These are one thought broken into two points, so I will address them  
as one. This is not a fair assessment, or even an accurate one. While  
the iPhone does not technically perform multi-tasking, it proides the  
same functionality. You can quickly switch between apps on the iPhone,  
and iPhone apps are designed to remember where they were when you left  
them. The upshot of this is, therefore, that you get the illusion of  
multi-tasking with all its benefits, without the performance hit. This  
argument is a flawed one, that is based on a misunderstanding of the  
iPhone and its operation.


> 3. Using speech on a call on a symbian phone is in my view easier  
> since if one dials numbers for an automated system, it is easier I  
> think in my view, to type the number on a keypad, rather than having  
> to mess around finding it on a dial pad etc

The buttons on the iPhone's keypad are large and do not move around. I  
do not search for them anymore. It's a different experience, and it  
takes a small amount of practice. However, it is no harder or easier,  
once you have learned to use it properly, than a physical keypad.

Josh de Lioncourt
…my other mail provider is an owl…

Twitter: http://twitter.com/Lioncourt
Music: http://stage19music.com
Mac-cessibility: http://www.Lioncourt.com
Blog: http://lioncourtsmusings.blogspot.com
GoodReads: http://goodreads.com/Lioncourt



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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Josh de Lioncourt]

Simon,

VoiceOver on the iPhone gives full access to the device. In fact, it  
gives far more access than any third-party mobile screen reader I've  
ever used. What give syou the impression that it does not?

Josh de Lioncourt
…my other mail provider is an owl…

Twitter: http://twitter.com/Lioncourt
Music: http://stage19music.com
Mac-cessibility: http://www.Lioncourt.com
Blog: http://lioncourtsmusings.blogspot.com
GoodReads: http://goodreads.com/Lioncourt


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Marie Howarth]

exactly. and my old simbien phone that ran talks, used to complain  
constantly about me having too many apps open when I only had the  
menu, short cut menu, which were open by default and another app,  
constantly had to reboot my phone. hurray for Iphone.

On Jul 14, 2009, at 6:57 PM, Josh de Lioncourt wrote:

> Just want to address these comments. See my responses inline.
>
> On Jul 13, 2009, at 10:55 PM, william lomas wrote:
>> 1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
>> 2. the thought of having to keep closing application x to use  
>> application y will be frustrating for symbian users, since i can  
>> have the web and an sms window open at same time
>>
> These are one thought broken into two points, so I will address them  
> as one. This is not a fair assessment, or even an accurate one.  
> While the iPhone does not technically perform multi-tasking, it  
> proides the same functionality. You can quickly switch between apps  
> on the iPhone, and iPhone apps are designed to remember where they  
> were when you left them. The upshot of this is, therefore, that you  
> get the illusion of multi-tasking with all its benefits, without the  
> performance hit. This argument is a flawed one, that is based on a  
> misunderstanding of the iPhone and its operation.
>
>
>> 3. Using speech on a call on a symbian phone is in my view easier  
>> since if one dials numbers for an automated system, it is easier I  
>> think in my view, to type the number on a keypad, rather than  
>> having to mess around finding it on a dial pad etc
>
> The buttons on the iPhone's keypad are large and do not move around.  
> I do not search for them anymore. It's a different experience, and  
> it takes a small amount of practice. However, it is no harder or  
> easier, once you have learned to use it properly, than a physical  
> keypad.
>
> Josh de Lioncourt
>   …my other mail provider is an owl…
>
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/Lioncourt
> Music: http://stage19music.com
> Mac-cessibility: http://www.Lioncourt.com
> Blog: http://lioncourtsmusings.blogspot.com
> GoodReads: http://goodreads.com/Lioncourt
>
>
>
> >


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Scott Bresnahan]

Hi,

I love the iPhone, but I have to disagree.  I 
think both points have some merit.  The iPhone is 
not for everyone..

1.  Multitasking is a short coming.  It's like 
the Finder compared to the Multi-Finder in the 
Mac Plus days.  Some technologies, ssh and irc 
come to mind, will not work well on the iPhone. 
We use a custom irc server to do real time IT 
troubleshooting across our applications, and I 
cannot keep my irc session alive while I use 
Safari.  This is not the case on other phone 
platforms and is a valid argument.  You can't say 
that remembering your preferences and place in an 
application is the same as background processing.

2.  Although you may have memorized the keypad, 
it's not reasonable to assume everyone will or 
can.   Which has a faster learning curve?  The 
touch screen layout or the standard keypad?  I 
say this only because part of the usefulness of a 
device lies not with the expert user, but with 
the casual user.   Personally, most of my numbers 
are direct dials, so I don't have the memory for 
the keypad due to lack of practice and everyday 
use, but when I do need it, I struggle and yes, a 
tactile keypad would be easier..  That said, I am 
surviving.



Finally, one more con on the iPhone is the 
battery.  I can imagine several use cases where a 
spare battery that's not an add on power pack 
would be required for some users.  The iPhone is 
designed for a certain work flow.  certain 
patterns it is not good for.  I understood these 
before I bought it, but don't dismiss them as the 
Almighty iPhone is God, cause it's not.

That said, I suggest the iPhone to everyone I 
see.  Although I warn my colleagues about the 
background and battery since I know that's an 
issue based on their work.

--Scott


address these comments. See my responses inline.

On Jul 13, 2009, at 10:55 PM, william lomas wrote:

1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
2. the thought of having to keep closing 
application x to use application y will be 
frustrating for symbian users, since i can have 
the web and an sms window open at same time

These are one thought broken into two points, so 
I will address them as one. This is not a fair 
assessment, or even an accurate one. While the iPhone does not technically 
perform multi-tasking, it proides the same functionality. You can quickly 
switch between apps on the iPhone, and iPhone apps are designed to remember 
where they were when you left them. 
The upshot of this is, therefore, that you get 
the illusion of multi-tasking with all its 
benefits, without the performance hit. This 
argument is a flawed one, that is based on a 
misunderstanding of the iPhone and its operation.


3. Using speech on a call on a symbian phone is 
in my view easier since if one dials numbers for 
an automated system, it is easier I think in my 
view, to type the number on a keypad, rather than 
having to mess around finding it on a dial pad etc


The buttons on the iPhone's keypad are large and 
do not move around. I do not search for them 
anymore. It's a different experience, and it 
takes a small amount of practice. However, it is 
no harder or easier, once you have learned to use 
it properly, than a physical keypad.

Josh de Lioncourt
Šmy other mail provider is an owlŠ


Twitter: http://twitter.com/Lioncourt
Music: http://stage19music.com
Mac-cessibility: http://www.Lioncourt.com
Blog: 
http://lioncourtsmusings.blogspot.com
GoodReads: http://goodreads.com/Lioncourt





-- 
--Scott

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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[James Dietz]

Hey,

As I'm eventually looking into getting an iPhone (by which I mean next
year when things may change once again) I'm glad to hear some of it's
shortcomings. (everything has shortcomings) Out of curiosity: how has
battery life been for voiceover users? I read that it you can get 8
hours of continuous music-listening and something like 7 for web
browsing. Are these figures lowered because the device is speaking
nigh-constantly? I've already read about the speaker "problem" - that
where the speaker activates as soon as you move the iPhone out of
ear-proximity.  Anything else people haven't been so pleased with? I'm
only trying to be negative because I've heard a lot about what the
iPhone does well, and when I tried it out for the few minutes last
weekend I did like it, but I'm interested in it's cons like I would be
with *any* device.

On 7/14/09, Scott Bresnahan  wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> I love the iPhone, but I have to disagree.  I
> think both points have some merit.  The iPhone is
> not for everyone..
>
> 1.  Multitasking is a short coming.  It's like
> the Finder compared to the Multi-Finder in the
> Mac Plus days.  Some technologies, ssh and irc
> come to mind, will not work well on the iPhone.
> We use a custom irc server to do real time IT
> troubleshooting across our applications, and I
> cannot keep my irc session alive while I use
> Safari.  This is not the case on other phone
> platforms and is a valid argument.  You can't say
> that remembering your preferences and place in an
> application is the same as background processing.
>
> 2.  Although you may have memorized the keypad,
> it's not reasonable to assume everyone will or
> can.   Which has a faster learning curve?  The
> touch screen layout or the standard keypad?  I
> say this only because part of the usefulness of a
> device lies not with the expert user, but with
> the casual user.   Personally, most of my numbers
> are direct dials, so I don't have the memory for
> the keypad due to lack of practice and everyday
> use, but when I do need it, I struggle and yes, a
> tactile keypad would be easier..  That said, I am
> surviving.
>
>
>
> Finally, one more con on the iPhone is the
> battery.  I can imagine several use cases where a
> spare battery that's not an add on power pack
> would be required for some users.  The iPhone is
> designed for a certain work flow.  certain
> patterns it is not good for.  I understood these
> before I bought it, but don't dismiss them as the
> Almighty iPhone is God, cause it's not.
>
> That said, I suggest the iPhone to everyone I
> see.  Although I warn my colleagues about the
> background and battery since I know that's an
> issue based on their work.
>
> --Scott
>
>
> address these comments. See my responses inline.
>
> On Jul 13, 2009, at 10:55 PM, william lomas wrote:
>
> 1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
> 2. the thought of having to keep closing
> application x to use application y will be
> frustrating for symbian users, since i can have
> the web and an sms window open at same time
>
> These are one thought broken into two points, so
> I will address them as one. This is not a fair
> assessment, or even an accurate one. While the iPhone does not technically
> perform multi-tasking, it proides the same functionality. You can quickly
> switch between apps on the iPhone, and iPhone apps are designed to remember
> where they were when you left them.
> The upshot of this is, therefore, that you get
> the illusion of multi-tasking with all its
> benefits, without the performance hit. This
> argument is a flawed one, that is based on a
> misunderstanding of the iPhone and its operation.
>
>
> 3. Using speech on a call on a symbian phone is
> in my view easier since if one dials numbers for
> an automated system, it is easier I think in my
> view, to type the number on a keypad, rather than
> having to mess around finding it on a dial pad etc
>
>
> The buttons on the iPhone's keypad are large and
> do not move around. I do not search for them
> anymore. It's a different experience, and it
> takes a small amount of practice. However, it is
> no harder or easier, once you have learned to use
> it properly, than a physical keypad.
>
> Josh de Lioncourt
>   Šmy other mail provider is an owlŠ
>
>
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/Lioncourt
> Music: http://stage19music.com
> Mac-cessibility: http://www.Lioncourt.com
> Blog:
> http://lioncourtsmusings.blogspot.com
> GoodReads: http://goodreads.com/Lioncourt
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> --Scott
>
> >
>

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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Marie Howarth]

I honestly think battery issues are across the board, so I personally  
would take VO out of the picture. some apps seem to use energy if  
they've been launched, I find this with those I use to connect to the  
web, I.E tweetaro, and some of the games. deactivating push when you  
don't need it helps and it would be nice to see the Iphone battery  
improve. But if I left my macbook running all day, I'd expect the  
battery to drain withing about four hours. lol.
the speech sometimes becomes garbled, but a quick five press of the  
sleep/wake button fixes it immediately.
I'm using mine effectively for day to day use, and now playing games  
on it which I could never do on the other phones I had.
I'm happy with it, and only reach for my old phone if someone  
contacted me on there, seen as that contract is not up yet. lol :)

On Jul 14, 2009, at 7:54 PM, James Dietz wrote:

>
> Hey,
>
> As I'm eventually looking into getting an iPhone (by which I mean next
> year when things may change once again) I'm glad to hear some of it's
> shortcomings. (everything has shortcomings) Out of curiosity: how has
> battery life been for voiceover users? I read that it you can get 8
> hours of continuous music-listening and something like 7 for web
> browsing. Are these figures lowered because the device is speaking
> nigh-constantly? I've already read about the speaker "problem" - that
> where the speaker activates as soon as you move the iPhone out of
> ear-proximity.  Anything else people haven't been so pleased with? I'm
> only trying to be negative because I've heard a lot about what the
> iPhone does well, and when I tried it out for the few minutes last
> weekend I did like it, but I'm interested in it's cons like I would be
> with *any* device.
>
> On 7/14/09, Scott Bresnahan  wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I love the iPhone, but I have to disagree.  I
>> think both points have some merit.  The iPhone is
>> not for everyone..
>>
>> 1.  Multitasking is a short coming.  It's like
>> the Finder compared to the Multi-Finder in the
>> Mac Plus days.  Some technologies, ssh and irc
>> come to mind, will not work well on the iPhone.
>> We use a custom irc server to do real time IT
>> troubleshooting across our applications, and I
>> cannot keep my irc session alive while I use
>> Safari.  This is not the case on other phone
>> platforms and is a valid argument.  You can't say
>> that remembering your preferences and place in an
>> application is the same as background processing.
>>
>> 2.  Although you may have memorized the keypad,
>> it's not reasonable to assume everyone will or
>> can.   Which has a faster learning curve?  The
>> touch screen layout or the standard keypad?  I
>> say this only because part of the usefulness of a
>> device lies not with the expert user, but with
>> the casual user.   Personally, most of my numbers
>> are direct dials, so I don't have the memory for
>> the keypad due to lack of practice and everyday
>> use, but when I do need it, I struggle and yes, a
>> tactile keypad would be easier..  That said, I am
>> surviving.
>>
>>
>>
>> Finally, one more con on the iPhone is the
>> battery.  I can imagine several use cases where a
>> spare battery that's not an add on power pack
>> would be required for some users.  The iPhone is
>> designed for a certain work flow.  certain
>> patterns it is not good for.  I understood these
>> before I bought it, but don't dismiss them as the
>> Almighty iPhone is God, cause it's not.
>>
>> That said, I suggest the iPhone to everyone I
>> see.  Although I warn my colleagues about the
>> background and battery since I know that's an
>> issue based on their work.
>>
>> --Scott
>>
>>
>> address these comments. See my responses inline.
>>
>> On Jul 13, 2009, at 10:55 PM, william lomas wrote:
>>
>> 1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
>> 2. the thought of having to keep closing
>> application x to use application y will be
>> frustrating for symbian users, since i can have
>> the web and an sms window open at same time
>>
>> These are one thought broken into two points, so
>> I will address them as one. This is not a fair
>> assessment, or even an accurate one. While the iPhone does not  
>> technically
>> perform multi-tasking, it proides the same functionality. You can  
>> quickly
>> switch between apps on the iPhone, and iPhone apps are designed to  
>> remember
>> where they were when you left them.
>> The upshot of this is, therefore, that you get
>> the illusion of multi-tasking with all its
>> benefits, without the performance hit. This
>> argument is a flawed one, that is based on a
>> misunderstanding of the iPhone and its operation.
>>
>>
>> 3. Using speech on a call on a symbian phone is
>> in my view easier since if one dials numbers for
>> an automated system, it is easier I think in my
>> view, to type the number on a keypad, rather than
>> having to mess around finding it on a dial pad etc
>>
>>
>> The buttons on the iPhone's keypa

Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Alex]

Hi,

You can have a intermediate server push IRC messages to you.

Regards,
Alex,


On Jul 14, 2009, at 11:38 AM, Scott Bresnahan wrote:

>
> Hi,
>
> I love the iPhone, but I have to disagree.  I
> think both points have some merit.  The iPhone is
> not for everyone..
>
> 1.  Multitasking is a short coming.  It's like
> the Finder compared to the Multi-Finder in the
> Mac Plus days.  Some technologies, ssh and irc
> come to mind, will not work well on the iPhone.
> We use a custom irc server to do real time IT
> troubleshooting across our applications, and I
> cannot keep my irc session alive while I use
> Safari.  This is not the case on other phone
> platforms and is a valid argument.  You can't say
> that remembering your preferences and place in an
> application is the same as background processing.
>
> 2.  Although you may have memorized the keypad,
> it's not reasonable to assume everyone will or
> can.   Which has a faster learning curve?  The
> touch screen layout or the standard keypad?  I
> say this only because part of the usefulness of a
> device lies not with the expert user, but with
> the casual user.   Personally, most of my numbers
> are direct dials, so I don't have the memory for
> the keypad due to lack of practice and everyday
> use, but when I do need it, I struggle and yes, a
> tactile keypad would be easier..  That said, I am
> surviving.
>
>
>
> Finally, one more con on the iPhone is the
> battery.  I can imagine several use cases where a
> spare battery that's not an add on power pack
> would be required for some users.  The iPhone is
> designed for a certain work flow.  certain
> patterns it is not good for.  I understood these
> before I bought it, but don't dismiss them as the
> Almighty iPhone is God, cause it's not.
>
> That said, I suggest the iPhone to everyone I
> see.  Although I warn my colleagues about the
> background and battery since I know that's an
> issue based on their work.
>
> --Scott
>
>
> address these comments. See my responses inline.
>
> On Jul 13, 2009, at 10:55 PM, william lomas wrote:
>
> 1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
> 2. the thought of having to keep closing
> application x to use application y will be
> frustrating for symbian users, since i can have
> the web and an sms window open at same time
>
> These are one thought broken into two points, so
> I will address them as one. This is not a fair
> assessment, or even an accurate one. While the iPhone does not  
> technically perform multi-tasking, it proides the same  
> functionality. You can quickly switch between apps on the iPhone,  
> and iPhone apps are designed to remember where they were when you  
> left them.
> The upshot of this is, therefore, that you get
> the illusion of multi-tasking with all its
> benefits, without the performance hit. This
> argument is a flawed one, that is based on a
> misunderstanding of the iPhone and its operation.
>
>
> 3. Using speech on a call on a symbian phone is
> in my view easier since if one dials numbers for
> an automated system, it is easier I think in my
> view, to type the number on a keypad, rather than
> having to mess around finding it on a dial pad etc
>
>
> The buttons on the iPhone's keypad are large and
> do not move around. I do not search for them
> anymore. It's a different experience, and it
> takes a small amount of practice. However, it is
> no harder or easier, once you have learned to use
> it properly, than a physical keypad.
>
> Josh de Lioncourt
>   Šmy other mail provider is an owlŠ
>
>
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/Lioncourt
> Music: http://stage19music.com
> Mac-cessibility: http://www.Lioncourt.com
> Blog:
> http:// 
> lioncourtsmusings.blogspot.com
> GoodReads: http://goodreads.com/ 
> Lioncourt
>
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> --Scott
>
> >


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Chris Blouch]

As far as #1 (multitasking) goes it's kind of splitting hairs to argue 
whether the phone has 'true' multitasking or not. For the sake of 
battery life and CPU load Apple made an architectural limitation of only 
one app running at any one time. For 99% of use cases this was fine 
because the speed to switch from app to app was fast enough that nobody 
would care much. Apps simply needed to store their state at shutdown and 
restore it on startup so the illusion of executing in the background 
would be maintained. This of course has issues for real-time 
communications like email or chat. For that Apple developed the push 
notification infrastructure where your iphone app could register for 
notifications of events. Then your servers pass to Apple's system when a 
particular user has an event they might want to know about such as an 
incoming message. This cuts a huge mess of polling systems out of the 
applications and saves a bunch of battery life. You might be in Safari 
but your baseball tracker app will still get notice of the play by play 
or whatever. The only place this breaks down is real time continuous 
connection communications like ssh or irc. You just can't fake it and 
when leaving your irc app you'll drop out of the room. So, yes, for the 
benefit of battery life for most users, not handling this edge case 
probably made sense. But the iPod stuff runs in the background so why is 
it special? Well, there is a custom chip that does the audio decoding 
from the sound files so that has little to no need to crank up the CPU 
and drain the battery. Just like there is a custom chip to monitor the 
communications going to the GSM tower. Maybe someday we'll have enough 
battery or low power CPU to run background apps at will just like on a 
desktop computer, but until then some compromises are in order.

CB

Scott Bresnahan wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I love the iPhone, but I have to disagree.  I 
> think both points have some merit.  The iPhone is 
> not for everyone..
>
> 1.  Multitasking is a short coming.  It's like 
> the Finder compared to the Multi-Finder in the 
> Mac Plus days.  Some technologies, ssh and irc 
> come to mind, will not work well on the iPhone. 
> We use a custom irc server to do real time IT 
> troubleshooting across our applications, and I 
> cannot keep my irc session alive while I use 
> Safari.  This is not the case on other phone 
> platforms and is a valid argument.  You can't say 
> that remembering your preferences and place in an 
> application is the same as background processing.
>
> 2.  Although you may have memorized the keypad, 
> it's not reasonable to assume everyone will or 
> can.   Which has a faster learning curve?  The 
> touch screen layout or the standard keypad?  I 
> say this only because part of the usefulness of a 
> device lies not with the expert user, but with 
> the casual user.   Personally, most of my numbers 
> are direct dials, so I don't have the memory for 
> the keypad due to lack of practice and everyday 
> use, but when I do need it, I struggle and yes, a 
> tactile keypad would be easier..  That said, I am 
> surviving.
>
>
>
> Finally, one more con on the iPhone is the 
> battery.  I can imagine several use cases where a 
> spare battery that's not an add on power pack 
> would be required for some users.  The iPhone is 
> designed for a certain work flow.  certain 
> patterns it is not good for.  I understood these 
> before I bought it, but don't dismiss them as the 
> Almighty iPhone is God, cause it's not.
>
> That said, I suggest the iPhone to everyone I 
> see.  Although I warn my colleagues about the 
> background and battery since I know that's an 
> issue based on their work.
>
> --Scott
>
>
> address these comments. See my responses inline.
>
> On Jul 13, 2009, at 10:55 PM, william lomas wrote:
>
> 1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
> 2. the thought of having to keep closing 
> application x to use application y will be 
> frustrating for symbian users, since i can have 
> the web and an sms window open at same time
>
> These are one thought broken into two points, so 
> I will address them as one. This is not a fair 
> assessment, or even an accurate one. While the iPhone does not technically 
> perform multi-tasking, it proides the same functionality. You can quickly 
> switch between apps on the iPhone, and iPhone apps are designed to remember 
> where they were when you left them. 
> The upshot of this is, therefore, that you get 
> the illusion of multi-tasking with all its 
> benefits, without the performance hit. This 
> argument is a flawed one, that is based on a 
> misunderstanding of the iPhone and its operation.
>
>
> 3. Using speech on a call on a symbian phone is 
> in my view easier since if one dials numbers for 
> an automated system, it is easier I think in my 
> view, to type the number on a keypad, rather than 
> having to mess around finding it on a dial pad etc
>
>
> The buttons on th

Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Scott Bresnahan]

Hi,

And that's called not irc, that's called a irc proxy hack.


--Scott





At 12:09 PM -0700 7/14/09, Alex wrote:
>Hi,
>
>You can have a intermediate server push IRC messages to you.
>
>Regards,
>Alex,
>
>
>On Jul 14, 2009, at 11:38 AM, Scott Bresnahan wrote:
>
>>
>>  Hi,
>>
>>  I love the iPhone, but I have to disagree.  I
>>  think both points have some merit.  The iPhone is
>>  not for everyone..
>>
>>  1.  Multitasking is a short coming.  It's like
>>  the Finder compared to the Multi-Finder in the
>>  Mac Plus days.  Some technologies, ssh and irc
>>  come to mind, will not work well on the iPhone.
>>  We use a custom irc server to do real time IT
>>  troubleshooting across our applications, and I
>>  cannot keep my irc session alive while I use
>>  Safari.  This is not the case on other phone
>>  platforms and is a valid argument.  You can't say
>>  that remembering your preferences and place in an
>>  application is the same as background processing.
>>
>>  2.  Although you may have memorized the keypad,
>>  it's not reasonable to assume everyone will or
>>  can.   Which has a faster learning curve?  The
>>  touch screen layout or the standard keypad?  I
>>  say this only because part of the usefulness of a
>>  device lies not with the expert user, but with
>>  the casual user.   Personally, most of my numbers
>>  are direct dials, so I don't have the memory for
>>  the keypad due to lack of practice and everyday
>>  use, but when I do need it, I struggle and yes, a
>>  tactile keypad would be easier..  That said, I am
>>  surviving.
>>
>>
>>
>>  Finally, one more con on the iPhone is the
>>  battery.  I can imagine several use cases where a
>>  spare battery that's not an add on power pack
>>  would be required for some users.  The iPhone is
>>  designed for a certain work flow.  certain
>>  patterns it is not good for.  I understood these
>>  before I bought it, but don't dismiss them as the
>>  Almighty iPhone is God, cause it's not.
>>
>>  That said, I suggest the iPhone to everyone I
>>  see.  Although I warn my colleagues about the
>>  background and battery since I know that's an
>>  issue based on their work.
>>
>>  --Scott
>>
>>
>>  address these comments. See my responses inline.
>>
>>  On Jul 13, 2009, at 10:55 PM, william lomas wrote:
>>
>>  1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
>>  2. the thought of having to keep closing
>>  application x to use application y will be
>>  frustrating for symbian users, since i can have
>>  the web and an sms window open at same time
>>
>>  These are one thought broken into two points, so
>>  I will address them as one. This is not a fair
>>  assessment, or even an accurate one. While the iPhone does not
>>  technically perform multi-tasking, it proides the same
>>  functionality. You can quickly switch between apps on the iPhone,
>>  and iPhone apps are designed to remember where they were when you
>>  left them.
>>  The upshot of this is, therefore, that you get
>>  the illusion of multi-tasking with all its
>>  benefits, without the performance hit. This
>>  argument is a flawed one, that is based on a
>>  misunderstanding of the iPhone and its operation.
>>
>>
>>  3. Using speech on a call on a symbian phone is
>>  in my view easier since if one dials numbers for
>>  an automated system, it is easier I think in my
>>  view, to type the number on a keypad, rather than
>>  having to mess around finding it on a dial pad etc
>>
>>
>>  The buttons on the iPhone's keypad are large and
>>  do not move around. I do not search for them
>>  anymore. It's a different experience, and it
>>  takes a small amount of practice. However, it is
>>  no harder or easier, once you have learned to use
>>  it properly, than a physical keypad.
>>
>>  Josh de Lioncourt
>>  Smy other mail provider is an owlS
>>
>>
>>  Twitter: http://twitter.com/Lioncourt
>>  Music: http://stage19music.com
>>  Mac-cessibility: http://www.Lioncourt.com
>>  Blog:
>>  http://
>>  lioncourtsmusings.blogspot.com
>>  GoodReads: http://goodreads.com/
>>  Lioncourt
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>  --
>>  --Scott
>>
>>  >
>
>
>
-- 
--Scott

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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Alex]

No. You can have it just act as a compatability layer.

Regards,
Alex,


On Jul 14, 2009, at 1:47 PM, Scott Bresnahan wrote:

>
> Hi,
>
> And that's called not irc, that's called a irc proxy hack.
>
>
> --Scott
>
>
>
>
>
> At 12:09 PM -0700 7/14/09, Alex wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> You can have a intermediate server push IRC messages to you.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Alex,
>>
>>
>> On Jul 14, 2009, at 11:38 AM, Scott Bresnahan wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> I love the iPhone, but I have to disagree.  I
>>> think both points have some merit.  The iPhone is
>>> not for everyone..
>>>
>>> 1.  Multitasking is a short coming.  It's like
>>> the Finder compared to the Multi-Finder in the
>>> Mac Plus days.  Some technologies, ssh and irc
>>> come to mind, will not work well on the iPhone.
>>> We use a custom irc server to do real time IT
>>> troubleshooting across our applications, and I
>>> cannot keep my irc session alive while I use
>>> Safari.  This is not the case on other phone
>>> platforms and is a valid argument.  You can't say
>>> that remembering your preferences and place in an
>>> application is the same as background processing.
>>>
>>> 2.  Although you may have memorized the keypad,
>>> it's not reasonable to assume everyone will or
>>> can.   Which has a faster learning curve?  The
>>> touch screen layout or the standard keypad?  I
>>> say this only because part of the usefulness of a
>>> device lies not with the expert user, but with
>>> the casual user.   Personally, most of my numbers
>>> are direct dials, so I don't have the memory for
>>> the keypad due to lack of practice and everyday
>>> use, but when I do need it, I struggle and yes, a
>>> tactile keypad would be easier..  That said, I am
>>> surviving.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Finally, one more con on the iPhone is the
>>> battery.  I can imagine several use cases where a
>>> spare battery that's not an add on power pack
>>> would be required for some users.  The iPhone is
>>> designed for a certain work flow.  certain
>>> patterns it is not good for.  I understood these
>>> before I bought it, but don't dismiss them as the
>>> Almighty iPhone is God, cause it's not.
>>>
>>> That said, I suggest the iPhone to everyone I
>>> see.  Although I warn my colleagues about the
>>> background and battery since I know that's an
>>> issue based on their work.
>>>
>>> --Scott
>>>
>>>
>>> address these comments. See my responses inline.
>>>
>>> On Jul 13, 2009, at 10:55 PM, william lomas wrote:
>>>
>>> 1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
>>> 2. the thought of having to keep closing
>>> application x to use application y will be
>>> frustrating for symbian users, since i can have
>>> the web and an sms window open at same time
>>>
>>> These are one thought broken into two points, so
>>> I will address them as one. This is not a fair
>>> assessment, or even an accurate one. While the iPhone does not
>>> technically perform multi-tasking, it proides the same
>>> functionality. You can quickly switch between apps on the iPhone,
>>> and iPhone apps are designed to remember where they were when you
>>> left them.
>>> The upshot of this is, therefore, that you get
>>> the illusion of multi-tasking with all its
>>> benefits, without the performance hit. This
>>> argument is a flawed one, that is based on a
>>> misunderstanding of the iPhone and its operation.
>>>
>>>
>>> 3. Using speech on a call on a symbian phone is
>>> in my view easier since if one dials numbers for
>>> an automated system, it is easier I think in my
>>> view, to type the number on a keypad, rather than
>>> having to mess around finding it on a dial pad etc
>>>
>>>
>>> The buttons on the iPhone's keypad are large and
>>> do not move around. I do not search for them
>>> anymore. It's a different experience, and it
>>> takes a small amount of practice. However, it is
>>> no harder or easier, once you have learned to use
>>> it properly, than a physical keypad.
>>>
>>> Josh de Lioncourt
>>> Smy other mail provider is an owlS
>>>
>>>
>>> Twitter: http://twitter.com/Lioncourt
>>> Music: http://stage19music.com
>>> Mac-cessibility: http://www.Lioncourt.com
>>> Blog:
>>> http://
>>> lioncourtsmusings.blogspot.com
>>> GoodReads: http://goodreads.com/
>>> Lioncourt
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> --Scott
>>>

>>
>>
>>
> --  
> --Scott
>
> >


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Mac Speech Dictate

[James & Nash]

Hi everyone,

I am curious to know what the current state of play is  for Mac Speech 
Dictate and Voice Over. Does anyone know?

Thanks

James 


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Scott Bresnahan]

Hi,

I don't think it's splitting hairs.  The iPhone simply does not 
support background processing for apps.  I agree with everything else 
you said, it was a conscious design decision, and as I stated a limit 
I was willing to accept.  But, it should be noted that there are 
compromises made on the platform that some users may find 
unacceptable.  My point is that's ok.  The phone doesn't solve 
everything, and iPHone users should not try to argue that it can. 
Again, I love my iPHone but it's not the tool for every job


--Scott


>As far as #1 (multitasking) goes it's kind of splitting hairs to argue
>whether the phone has 'true' multitasking or not. For the sake of
>battery life and CPU load Apple made an architectural limitation of only
>one app running at any one time. For 99% of use cases this was fine
>because the speed to switch from app to app was fast enough that nobody
>would care much. Apps simply needed to store their state at shutdown and
>restore it on startup so the illusion of executing in the background
>would be maintained. This of course has issues for real-time
>communications like email or chat. For that Apple developed the push
>notification infrastructure where your iphone app could register for
>notifications of events. Then your servers pass to Apple's system when a
>particular user has an event they might want to know about such as an
>incoming message. This cuts a huge mess of polling systems out of the
>applications and saves a bunch of battery life. You might be in Safari
>but your baseball tracker app will still get notice of the play by play
>or whatever. The only place this breaks down is real time continuous
>connection communications like ssh or irc. You just can't fake it and
>when leaving your irc app you'll drop out of the room. So, yes, for the
>benefit of battery life for most users, not handling this edge case
>probably made sense. But the iPod stuff runs in the background so why is
>it special? Well, there is a custom chip that does the audio decoding
>from the sound files so that has little to no need to crank up the CPU
>and drain the battery. Just like there is a custom chip to monitor the
>communications going to the GSM tower. Maybe someday we'll have enough
>battery or low power CPU to run background apps at will just like on a
>desktop computer, but until then some compromises are in order.
>
>CB
>
>Scott Bresnahan wrote:
>>  Hi,
>>
>>  I love the iPhone, but I have to disagree.  I
>>  think both points have some merit.  The iPhone is
>>  not for everyone..
>>
>>  1.  Multitasking is a short coming.  It's like
>>  the Finder compared to the Multi-Finder in the
>>  Mac Plus days.  Some technologies, ssh and irc
>>  come to mind, will not work well on the iPhone.
>>  We use a custom irc server to do real time IT
>>  troubleshooting across our applications, and I
>>  cannot keep my irc session alive while I use
>>  Safari.  This is not the case on other phone
>>  platforms and is a valid argument.  You can't say
>>  that remembering your preferences and place in an
>>  application is the same as background processing.
>>
>>  2.  Although you may have memorized the keypad,
>>  it's not reasonable to assume everyone will or
>>  can.   Which has a faster learning curve?  The
>>  touch screen layout or the standard keypad?  I
>>  say this only because part of the usefulness of a
>>  device lies not with the expert user, but with
>>  the casual user.   Personally, most of my numbers
>>  are direct dials, so I don't have the memory for
>>  the keypad due to lack of practice and everyday
>>  use, but when I do need it, I struggle and yes, a
>>  tactile keypad would be easier..  That said, I am
>>  surviving.
>>
>>
>>
>>  Finally, one more con on the iPhone is the
>>  battery.  I can imagine several use cases where a
>>  spare battery that's not an add on power pack
>>  would be required for some users.  The iPhone is
>>  designed for a certain work flow.  certain
>>  patterns it is not good for.  I understood these
>>  before I bought it, but don't dismiss them as the
>>  Almighty iPhone is God, cause it's not.
>>
>>  That said, I suggest the iPhone to everyone I
>>  see.  Although I warn my colleagues about the
>>  background and battery since I know that's an
>>  issue based on their work.
>>
>>  --Scott
>>
>>
>>  address these comments. See my responses inline.
>>
>>  On Jul 13, 2009, at 10:55 PM, william lomas wrote:
>>
>>  1. i can multi task on a symbian phone i can not on the iphone
>>  2. the thought of having to keep closing
>>  application x to use application y will be
>>  frustrating for symbian users, since i can have
>>  the web and an sms window open at same time
>>
>>  These are one thought broken into two points, so
>>  I will address them as one. This is not a fair
>>  assessment, or even an accurate one. While the iPhone does not 
>>technically perform multi-tasking, it proides the same 
>>functionality. You can quickly switch between apps on the

Leopard Disc

[James & Nash]

Hi everyone,

This might sound like a stupid question, but I have a copy of Leopard from 
when it first came out taht I bought from the store. Will this work on an 
MBP or does the MBP have a specific  configuration that is not covered by 
the disc?


Thanks

James 


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Re: Leopard Disc

[Dan]

Hello,
Yes, it will work.
On Jul 14, 2009, at 2:14 PM, James & Nash wrote:

>
> Hi everyone,
>
> This might sound like a stupid question, but I have a copy of  
> Leopard from
> when it first came out taht I bought from the store. Will this work  
> on an
> MBP or does the MBP have a specific  configuration that is not  
> covered by
> the disc?
>
>
> Thanks
>
> James
>
>
> >


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Re: Leopard Disc

[Alex]

Hi,

James:

The MBP ships with its own disk. The retail copy of Leopard does not  
work on Unibodies. Remember that the disk probably only has one  
lisence on it.

Regards,
Alex,


On Jul 14, 2009, at 2:14 PM, James & Nash wrote:

>
> Hi everyone,
>
> This might sound like a stupid question, but I have a copy of  
> Leopard from
> when it first came out taht I bought from the store. Will this work  
> on an
> MBP or does the MBP have a specific  configuration that is not  
> covered by
> the disc?
>
>
> Thanks
>
> James
>
>
> >


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Re: Leopard Disc

[James & Nash]

I see, thanks Alex. Can you still buy the retail copy or should I just wait 
until SL which I've heard is a complete OS as opposed to an upgrade?

Thanks

James
- Original Message - 
From: "Alex" 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 10:26 PM
Subject: Re: Leopard Disc


>
> Hi,
>
> James:
>
> The MBP ships with its own disk. The retail copy of Leopard does not
> work on Unibodies. Remember that the disk probably only has one
> lisence on it.
>
> Regards,
> Alex,
>
>
> On Jul 14, 2009, at 2:14 PM, James & Nash wrote:
>
>>
>> Hi everyone,
>>
>> This might sound like a stupid question, but I have a copy of
>> Leopard from
>> when it first came out taht I bought from the store. Will this work
>> on an
>> MBP or does the MBP have a specific  configuration that is not
>> covered by
>> the disc?
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> James
>>
>>
>> >
>
>
> > 


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Scott Howell]

Of course the iPhone was never marketed as a notebook either. I'm not  
sure how the windows smart phones handle the same processing since I  
really haven't bothered to use my current phone since it's a drag, but  
I suspect things could very well change in the not so distant future.  
I think what will eventually happen is once multi-core processors make  
it to the phone world, ram increases, and battery life is extended;  
we'll see true multi-tasking appear as we do on a notebook or desktop  
platform. I think the compromise makes perfect sense and the stuff  
your talking about wanting the phone to do, is admittedly beyond what  
most users will ever do. Not defending the iPhone and maybe as you see  
its shortcomings, but reality is that your more a power user than your  
average user. I think I would not mind having the ability to run ssh  
etc. myself, but I could easily live with the limitations as they are  
for now. Then again, I have to wait and see if the carrier I have cell  
service with will pickup the iPhone or what.

On Jul 14, 2009, at 5:03 PM, Scott Bresnahan wrote:

>
> Hi,
>
> I don't think it's splitting hairs.  The iPhone simply does not
> support background processing for apps.  I agree with everything else
> you said, it was a conscious design decision, and as I stated a limit
> I was willing to accept.  But, it should be noted that there are
> compromises made on the platform that some users may find
> unacceptable.  My point is that's ok.  The phone doesn't solve
> everything, and iPHone users should not try to argue that it can.
> Again, I love my iPHone but it's not the tool for every job
>
>
> --Scott
>
>
>> As far as #1 (multitasking) goes it's kind of splitting hairs to  
>> argue
>> whether the phone has 'true' multitasking or not. For the sake of
>> battery life and CPU load Apple made an architectural limitation of  
>> only
>> one app running at any one time. For 99% of use cases this was fine
>> because the speed to switch from app to app was fast enough that  
>> nobody
>> would care much. Apps simply needed to store their state at  
>> shutdown and
>> restore it on startup so the illusion of executing in the background
>> would be maintained. This of course has issues for real-time
>> communications like email or chat. For that Apple developed the push
>> notification infrastructure where your iphone app could register for
>> notifications of events. Then your servers pass to Apple's system  
>> when a
>> particular user has an event they might want to know about such as an
>> incoming message. This cuts a huge mess of polling systems out of the
>> applications and saves a bunch of battery life. You might be in  
>> Safari
>> but your baseball tracker app will still get notice of the play by  
>> play
>> or whatever. The only place this breaks down is real time continuous
>> connection communications like ssh or irc. You just can't fake it and
>> when leaving your irc app you'll drop out of the room. So, yes, for  
>> the
>> benefit of battery life for most users, not handling this edge case
>> probably made sense. But the iPod stuff runs in the background so  
>> why is
>> it special? Well, there is a custom chip that does the audio decoding
>> from the sound files so that has little to no need to crank up the  
>> CPU
>> and drain the battery. Just like there is a custom chip to monitor  
>> the
>> communications going to the GSM tower. Maybe someday we'll have  
>> enough
>> battery or low power CPU to run background apps at will just like  
>> on a
>> desktop computer, but until then some compromises are in order.
>>
>> CB
>>
>> Scott Bresnahan wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> I love the iPhone, but I have to disagree.  I
>>> think both points have some merit.  The iPhone is
>>> not for everyone..
>>>
>>> 1.  Multitasking is a short coming.  It's like
>>> the Finder compared to the Multi-Finder in the
>>> Mac Plus days.  Some technologies, ssh and irc
>>> come to mind, will not work well on the iPhone.
>>> We use a custom irc server to do real time IT
>>> troubleshooting across our applications, and I
>>> cannot keep my irc session alive while I use
>>> Safari.  This is not the case on other phone
>>> platforms and is a valid argument.  You can't say
>>> that remembering your preferences and place in an
>>> application is the same as background processing.
>>>
>>> 2.  Although you may have memorized the keypad,
>>> it's not reasonable to assume everyone will or
>>> can.   Which has a faster learning curve?  The
>>> touch screen layout or the standard keypad?  I
>>> say this only because part of the usefulness of a
>>> device lies not with the expert user, but with
>>> the casual user.   Personally, most of my numbers
>>> are direct dials, so I don't have the memory for
>>> the keypad due to lack of practice and everyday
>>> use, but when I do need it, I struggle and yes, a
>>> tactile keypad would be easier..  That said, I am
>>> surviving.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Finally, one m

Re: Leopard Disc

[Scott Howell]

James it will work just fine. You'll have no issues.
On Jul 14, 2009, at 5:14 PM, James & Nash wrote:

>
> Hi everyone,
>
> This might sound like a stupid question, but I have a copy of  
> Leopard from
> when it first came out taht I bought from the store. Will this work  
> on an
> MBP or does the MBP have a specific  configuration that is not  
> covered by
> the disc?
>
>
> Thanks
>
> James
>
>
> >


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Re: Leopard Disc

[Alex]

What are you trying to do. As I said, the retail will not work in a  
MBP because retail does not contain certain special drivers.

Regards,
alex,


On Jul 14, 2009, at 2:28 PM, James & Nash wrote:

>
> I see, thanks Alex. Can you still buy the retail copy or should I  
> just wait
> until SL which I've heard is a complete OS as opposed to an upgrade?
>
> Thanks
>
> James
> - Original Message -
> From: "Alex" 
> To: 
> Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 10:26 PM
> Subject: Re: Leopard Disc
>
>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> James:
>>
>> The MBP ships with its own disk. The retail copy of Leopard does not
>> work on Unibodies. Remember that the disk probably only has one
>> lisence on it.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Alex,
>>
>>
>> On Jul 14, 2009, at 2:14 PM, James & Nash wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Hi everyone,
>>>
>>> This might sound like a stupid question, but I have a copy of
>>> Leopard from
>>> when it first came out taht I bought from the store. Will this work
>>> on an
>>> MBP or does the MBP have a specific  configuration that is not
>>> covered by
>>> the disc?
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> James
>>>
>>>

>>
>>
>>>
>
>
> >


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Re: Leopard Disc

[James & Nash]

Thanks Scott,
- Original Message - 
From: "Scott Howell" 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 10:31 PM
Subject: Re: Leopard Disc


>
> James it will work just fine. You'll have no issues.
> On Jul 14, 2009, at 5:14 PM, James & Nash wrote:
>
>>
>> Hi everyone,
>>
>> This might sound like a stupid question, but I have a copy of
>> Leopard from
>> when it first came out taht I bought from the store. Will this work
>> on an
>> MBP or does the MBP have a specific  configuration that is not
>> covered by
>> the disc?
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> James
>>
>>
>> >
>
>
> > 


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Re: Leopard Disc

[James & Nash]

How od. It worked on my ld MacBook. I do not have a new Mac yet but I'm 
going to get the MBP I think. But if I buy the MacBook will the CD work? I 
was just curious as I have a copy of Leopard that I bought from the store 
and just wondered if it would work.

Thanks

James
- Original Message - 
From: "Alex" 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 10:39 PM
Subject: Re: Leopard Disc


>
> What are you trying to do. As I said, the retail will not work in a
> MBP because retail does not contain certain special drivers.
>
> Regards,
> alex,
>
>
> On Jul 14, 2009, at 2:28 PM, James & Nash wrote:
>
>>
>> I see, thanks Alex. Can you still buy the retail copy or should I
>> just wait
>> until SL which I've heard is a complete OS as opposed to an upgrade?
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> James
>> - Original Message -
>> From: "Alex" 
>> To: 
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 10:26 PM
>> Subject: Re: Leopard Disc
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> James:
>>>
>>> The MBP ships with its own disk. The retail copy of Leopard does not
>>> work on Unibodies. Remember that the disk probably only has one
>>> lisence on it.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Alex,
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jul 14, 2009, at 2:14 PM, James & Nash wrote:
>>>

 Hi everyone,

 This might sound like a stupid question, but I have a copy of
 Leopard from
 when it first came out taht I bought from the store. Will this work
 on an
 MBP or does the MBP have a specific  configuration that is not
 covered by
 the disc?


 Thanks

 James


>
>>>
>>>

>>
>>
>> >
>
>
> > 


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Re: Itunes won't play FLAC files?

[John Panarese]

 I am having the same problem.  I followed the instruction in the  
read.me documentation.  I have no idea what is going on.


Take Care

John Panarese

On Jul 14, 2009, at 1:19 PM, Mark Baxter wrote:

>
> I moved it there, but Quicktime says "this file isn't a movie," and
> Itunes remains stubbornly silent.
>
>
> Mark BurningHawk
>
> Skype and Twitter:  BurningHawk1969
> MSN:  burninghawk1...@hotmail.com
> My home page:
> http://MarkBurningHawk.net/
>
>
> >


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Audio tutorials for mac programs?

[Jenny Kennedy (Howard)]

Hi guys,
Does anyone know if there are tutorials out there, audio tutorials,  
for different mac programs? OSx, Mail, particularly interested in  
Mail, and safari?  combined with voice over?
Thanks


Best Wishes
Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
Olathe, Kansas USA

Join me on FaceBook:
Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search  
for it in groups or contact me for details.

Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan


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Re: Audio tutorials for mac programs?

[Alex Jurgensen]

Hi,

The entire manual is in Braille and audio.

Regards,
Alex,


On 14-Jul-09, at 3:37 PM, Jenny Kennedy (Howard) wrote:

>
> Hi guys,
> Does anyone know if there are tutorials out there, audio tutorials,
> for different mac programs? OSx, Mail, particularly interested in
> Mail, and safari?  combined with voice over?
> Thanks
>
>
> Best Wishes
> Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
> blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
> Olathe, Kansas USA
>
> Join me on FaceBook:
> Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
> And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search
> for it in groups or contact me for details.
>
> Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan
>
>
> >


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Re: Leopard Disc

[Alex Jurgensen]

That was not a unibody. That is why. The MBP will ship with Leopard.

Regards,
Alex,


On 14-Jul-09, at 2:44 PM, James & Nash wrote:

>
> How od. It worked on my ld MacBook. I do not have a new Mac yet but  
> I'm
> going to get the MBP I think. But if I buy the MacBook will the CD  
> work? I
> was just curious as I have a copy of Leopard that I bought from the  
> store
> and just wondered if it would work.
>
> Thanks
>
> James
> - Original Message -
> From: "Alex" 
> To: 
> Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 10:39 PM
> Subject: Re: Leopard Disc
>
>
>>
>> What are you trying to do. As I said, the retail will not work in a
>> MBP because retail does not contain certain special drivers.
>>
>> Regards,
>> alex,
>>
>>
>> On Jul 14, 2009, at 2:28 PM, James & Nash wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I see, thanks Alex. Can you still buy the retail copy or should I
>>> just wait
>>> until SL which I've heard is a complete OS as opposed to an upgrade?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> James
>>> - Original Message -
>>> From: "Alex" 
>>> To: 
>>> Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 10:26 PM
>>> Subject: Re: Leopard Disc
>>>
>>>

 Hi,

 James:

 The MBP ships with its own disk. The retail copy of Leopard does  
 not
 work on Unibodies. Remember that the disk probably only has one
 lisence on it.

 Regards,
 Alex,


 On Jul 14, 2009, at 2:14 PM, James & Nash wrote:

>
> Hi everyone,
>
> This might sound like a stupid question, but I have a copy of
> Leopard from
> when it first came out taht I bought from the store. Will this  
> work
> on an
> MBP or does the MBP have a specific  configuration that is not
> covered by
> the disc?
>
>
> Thanks
>
> James
>
>
>>


>
>>>
>>>

>>
>>
>>>
>
>
> >


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Josh de Lioncourt]

Hi Scott,

See my comments inline. :)

On Jul 14, 2009, at 11:38 AM, Scott Bresnahan wrote:
> I love the iPhone, but I have to disagree.  I
> think both points have some merit.  The iPhone is
> not for everyone..
>
Nor will you ever hear me sayt that any one device is for everyone. :)

> 1.  Multitasking is a short coming.  It's like
> the Finder compared to the Multi-Finder in the
> Mac Plus days.  Some technologies, ssh and irc
> come to mind, will not work well on the iPhone.
> We use a custom irc server to do real time IT
> troubleshooting across our applications, and I
> cannot keep my irc session alive while I use
> Safari.  This is not the case on other phone
> platforms and is a valid argument.  You can't say
> that remembering your preferences and place in an
> application is the same as background processing.

Apple has addressed this. This is not a problem with the iPHone, but  
rather with whatever app you are using for IRC. Push notifications,  
which developers can utilize to send notifications to the phone, can  
be used to solve your IRC issue. If your IRC client has not done this  
yet, it is not the iPhone's shortcoming, but rather the app's. While  
there are a very few situations when the combination of saving one's  
place and push notifications will not suffice, I can't readily think  
of one, and the vast, vast majority of problems can be rectified with  
these. Your IRC argument, in particular, is kind of like blaming the  
Mac because a third-party program for chatting doesn't play a sound  
when a new message comes in, for example.
>
> 2.  Although you may have memorized the keypad,
> it's not reasonable to assume everyone will or
> can.   Which has a faster learning curve?  The
> touch screen layout or the standard keypad?  I
> say this only because part of the usefulness of a
> device lies not with the expert user, but with
> the casual user.   Personally, most of my numbers
> are direct dials, so I don't have the memory for
> the keypad due to lack of practice and everyday
> use, but when I do need it, I struggle and yes, a
> tactile keypad would be easier..  That said, I am
> surviving.

I don't hardly use the keypad at all, but as it is identical to a  
tactile keypad in layout, I don't think it is as difficult as you seem  
to think. HOwever, as I said previously, I'll never say that any  
device is perfect for everyone. All users have different abilities and  
limitations, so on that point we're in agreement. But I think the  
keypad thing is not as big a deal as many have said.
>
> Finally, one more con on the iPhone is the
> battery.  I can imagine several use cases where a
> spare battery that's not an add on power pack
> would be required for some users.  The iPhone is
> designed for a certain work flow.  certain
> patterns it is not good for.  I understood these
> before I bought it, but don't dismiss them as the
> Almighty iPhone is God, cause it's not.

While I don't doubt there are some people who own extra cell phone  
batteries, in all my life, of allt he people I have ever known,  
through all the various cell phone models all those people have ever  
owned, I have never met a single, solitary soul who had an extra  
battery, unless there previous one had died and they needed to replace  
it...and even then, they usually opted for a new phone.

JMHO. :)


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[James Mannion]

However, if you are composing a message and you go back into messagaes
and in to that message, your keyboard will still be there and the text
in the edit field you had put in before you left it by hitting the
home button will still be there.  My understanding is that in most
situations it can not "run" multiple processes actively at one time,
but this is  a limitation that is not specific to voiceover by any
means.  I know you may know that, but to point it out for sure.  It
could be a disadvantage in some situations and I would guess if there
is enough demand the next revision will become more powerful and
incorporate this. I am also a symbian user and right now I have the
IPhone and a Symbian phone.  I have used Symbian for a good number of
years.  Symbian can run multiple tasks at one time to an extent, but
remember it is a device limited in resources and they too can get
bogged down pretty quickly doing much of that where multiple processes
are actively doing something.

Jim


On 7/14/09, Josh de Lioncourt  wrote:
>
> Hi Scott,
>
> See my comments inline. :)
>
> On Jul 14, 2009, at 11:38 AM, Scott Bresnahan wrote:
>> I love the iPhone, but I have to disagree.  I
>> think both points have some merit.  The iPhone is
>> not for everyone..
>>
> Nor will you ever hear me sayt that any one device is for everyone. :)
>
>> 1.  Multitasking is a short coming.  It's like
>> the Finder compared to the Multi-Finder in the
>> Mac Plus days.  Some technologies, ssh and irc
>> come to mind, will not work well on the iPhone.
>> We use a custom irc server to do real time IT
>> troubleshooting across our applications, and I
>> cannot keep my irc session alive while I use
>> Safari.  This is not the case on other phone
>> platforms and is a valid argument.  You can't say
>> that remembering your preferences and place in an
>> application is the same as background processing.
>
> Apple has addressed this. This is not a problem with the iPHone, but
> rather with whatever app you are using for IRC. Push notifications,
> which developers can utilize to send notifications to the phone, can
> be used to solve your IRC issue. If your IRC client has not done this
> yet, it is not the iPhone's shortcoming, but rather the app's. While
> there are a very few situations when the combination of saving one's
> place and push notifications will not suffice, I can't readily think
> of one, and the vast, vast majority of problems can be rectified with
> these. Your IRC argument, in particular, is kind of like blaming the
> Mac because a third-party program for chatting doesn't play a sound
> when a new message comes in, for example.
>>
>> 2.  Although you may have memorized the keypad,
>> it's not reasonable to assume everyone will or
>> can.   Which has a faster learning curve?  The
>> touch screen layout or the standard keypad?  I
>> say this only because part of the usefulness of a
>> device lies not with the expert user, but with
>> the casual user.   Personally, most of my numbers
>> are direct dials, so I don't have the memory for
>> the keypad due to lack of practice and everyday
>> use, but when I do need it, I struggle and yes, a
>> tactile keypad would be easier..  That said, I am
>> surviving.
>
> I don't hardly use the keypad at all, but as it is identical to a
> tactile keypad in layout, I don't think it is as difficult as you seem
> to think. HOwever, as I said previously, I'll never say that any
> device is perfect for everyone. All users have different abilities and
> limitations, so on that point we're in agreement. But I think the
> keypad thing is not as big a deal as many have said.
>>
>> Finally, one more con on the iPhone is the
>> battery.  I can imagine several use cases where a
>> spare battery that's not an add on power pack
>> would be required for some users.  The iPhone is
>> designed for a certain work flow.  certain
>> patterns it is not good for.  I understood these
>> before I bought it, but don't dismiss them as the
>> Almighty iPhone is God, cause it's not.
>
> While I don't doubt there are some people who own extra cell phone
> batteries, in all my life, of allt he people I have ever known,
> through all the various cell phone models all those people have ever
> owned, I have never met a single, solitary soul who had an extra
> battery, unless there previous one had died and they needed to replace
> it...and even then, they usually opted for a new phone.
>
> JMHO. :)
>
>
> >
>

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Re: VO and openoffice

[matthew T dyer]

Hi,  I am currently using open office here on my mac mini with no  
probklems,.  I do not use the database part often, but text writer is  
really fggood.  HTH.

Matthew


On Jul 5, 2009, at 4:04 PM, Roberto Burceni wrote:

>
> Hi all, I.m an italian blind user who is using linux and used Windows
> screenreaders. Since last month I.m interested in the Mac Worls that
> seems to be fantastic.
> I haven't a Mac today, but I will buy it in the future. I would like  
> to
> buy a Macbook Pro that seems to be the best choice.
> I would like to know how VO works with openoffice. Have you  
> experienced
> in this way? Have you some guides to suggest me?
> Thanks all and sorry for my not very well English
> Bye from Italy
>
> >


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Re: updarting on my mail problem

[matthew T dyer]

Hi,  I should have no problem as I am back on with my isp so I shoiuld  
have no problemds sending mail again.

Matthew


On Jul 12, 2009, at 1:01 PM, Maxwell Ivey Jr. wrote:

>
> Hello;  I don't know if this is your specific problem or not, but I
> have an account with people pc.  unless I'm signed into their network
> I have to put my whole email address in my mail program not just my
> screen name.  They claim its a security measure.  Once they told me
> about it, I've never had that problem sending mail again.  I also
> found out that with people pc you don't just enter smtp you have to
> enter smtpauth.  I'm sure you have probably already covered this with
> your isp, but just thought I'd ask.  Good luck in solving your mail
> problem, Max
> On Jul 4, 2009, at 2:13 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
>
>>
>> Hello,
>>
>> Because of the wide existance of SPAM and generally no security on
>> the original mail protocols used on the Internet, most ISP's block
>> access to their mail servers from outside their managed network. What
>> this means is if you are on Cox and attempt to send or receive e-mail
>> from RoadRunner  owned servers you will probably have problems.
>>
>> A way that might avoid this is to ask about SSL enabled  services, or
>> perhaps even just try turning on SSL  mode in the advanced mail
>> account configuration.
>>
>> Jon
>>
>> On Jul 4, 2009, at 2:01 PM, matthew T dyer wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Hello everyone in mac world.
>>>
>>> I just got of the phone with apple reggarding my mail sending  
>>> problem
>>> with roadrunner.  I think we are naring it down top a possible
>>> problem
>>> in which the block messages going out and possible incoming as well.
>>> If this iks the case,  anyone here using rloadrunner know what I
>>> should dpo to allow  me to be able to send message?  I am not using
>>> my own internet connection as i do not have it.hanks again  for
>>> everyone who has been a bifg help.
>>>
>>> Matthew
>>>
>>>
>>>

>>
>>
>>>
>
>
> >


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Re: Audio tutorials for mac programs?

[Jenny Kennedy (Howard)]

Hi Alex,

Awesome. I have the VoiceOver getting started thing read by the Alex  
voice.
Where are additional audio manuals for mail and whatnot? Or were you  
referencing the VO manual?


Best Wishes
Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
Olathe, Kansas USA

Join me on FaceBook:
Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search  
for it in groups or contact me for details.

Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Scott Bresnahan]

Hi, Josh,

Take a closer look at what is possible via push in the APIs and you 
may be surprised at how limiting it is.  Your argument about  Apple 
solving the problem by introducing push is more marketing hype than 
fact.  At the core, you can't keep sockets open in the background 
which many RFC standards like irc, ssh, telnet etc depend.  Apple's 
answer is well, rewrite the standard.  That's not an answer.  you 
cant' just rewrite every server platform out there to support Apple's 
whim of of a lame push notification method.  If you're starting from 
scratch today, writing a new client and server platform, then sure, 
you can work around it.  But there are a lot of pre existing 
technologies that won't work no matter how the app is coded simply 
because the problem is not with the client but the server piece the 
client is meant to communicate with.  But again, this isn't a problem 
for most people, but only for those who need to multitask, like 
keeping multiple sessions open at a time.

As for batteries, I agree that *most* people don't' have spare 
batteries.  However, just because you haven't met them doesn't mean 
they don't exist.  I had two spares back when I had an analog 
StarTac, and I know a small fraction of people who still have spare 
batteries for their phones today.  Granted, these folks tend to like 
Star Trek the original series vs tng, but I digress not to 
mention I think they try to use their phones as laptops, but who am I 
to argue their inefficiency.  :)
.

I can't believe I'm arguing the devils advocate on this. did I 
mention I love my iPhone?  But, it just doesn't do windows, so stop 
pretending it does.  lol


--Scott

>Hi Scott,
>
>See my comments inline. :)
>
>On Jul 14, 2009, at 11:38 AM, Scott Bresnahan wrote:
>>  I love the iPhone, but I have to disagree.  I
>>  think both points have some merit.  The iPhone is
>>  not for everyone..
>>
>Nor will you ever hear me sayt that any one device is for everyone. :)
>
>>  1.  Multitasking is a short coming.  It's like
>>  the Finder compared to the Multi-Finder in the
>>  Mac Plus days.  Some technologies, ssh and irc
>>  come to mind, will not work well on the iPhone.
>>  We use a custom irc server to do real time IT
>>  troubleshooting across our applications, and I
>>  cannot keep my irc session alive while I use
>>  Safari.  This is not the case on other phone
>>  platforms and is a valid argument.  You can't say
>>  that remembering your preferences and place in an
>>  application is the same as background processing.
>
>Apple has addressed this. This is not a problem with the iPHone, but
>rather with whatever app you are using for IRC. Push notifications,
>which developers can utilize to send notifications to the phone, can
>be used to solve your IRC issue. If your IRC client has not done this
>yet, it is not the iPhone's shortcoming, but rather the app's. While
>there are a very few situations when the combination of saving one's
>place and push notifications will not suffice, I can't readily think
>of one, and the vast, vast majority of problems can be rectified with
>these. Your IRC argument, in particular, is kind of like blaming the
>Mac because a third-party program for chatting doesn't play a sound
>when a new message comes in, for example.
>>
>>  2.  Although you may have memorized the keypad,
>>  it's not reasonable to assume everyone will or
>>  can.   Which has a faster learning curve?  The
>>  touch screen layout or the standard keypad?  I
>>  say this only because part of the usefulness of a
>>  device lies not with the expert user, but with
>>  the casual user.   Personally, most of my numbers
>>  are direct dials, so I don't have the memory for
>>  the keypad due to lack of practice and everyday
>>  use, but when I do need it, I struggle and yes, a
>>  tactile keypad would be easier..  That said, I am
>>  surviving.
>
>I don't hardly use the keypad at all, but as it is identical to a
>tactile keypad in layout, I don't think it is as difficult as you seem
>to think. HOwever, as I said previously, I'll never say that any
>device is perfect for everyone. All users have different abilities and
>limitations, so on that point we're in agreement. But I think the
>keypad thing is not as big a deal as many have said.
>>
>>  Finally, one more con on the iPhone is the
>>  battery.  I can imagine several use cases where a
>>  spare battery that's not an add on power pack
>>  would be required for some users.  The iPhone is
>>  designed for a certain work flow.  certain
>>  patterns it is not good for.  I understood these
>>  before I bought it, but don't dismiss them as the
>>  Almighty iPhone is God, cause it's not.
>
>While I don't doubt there are some people who own extra cell phone
>batteries, in all my life, of allt he people I have ever known,
>through all the various cell phone models all those people have ever
>owned, I have never met a single, solitary soul who had an extra
>battery, unless there prev

Re: Audio tutorials for mac programs?

[erik burggraaf]

Hi, I'd be interested in doing some if they aren't, but I'm pretty  
sure they are somewhere.

Best,

erik burggraaf
A+ sertified technician and user support consultant.
Phone: 888-255-5194
Email: e...@erik-burggraaf.com

On 14-Jul-09, at 6:37 PM, Jenny Kennedy (Howard) wrote:

>
> Hi guys,
> Does anyone know if there are tutorials out there, audio tutorials,
> for different mac programs? OSx, Mail, particularly interested in
> Mail, and safari?  combined with voice over?
> Thanks
>
>
> Best Wishes
> Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
> blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
> Olathe, Kansas USA
>
> Join me on FaceBook:
> Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
> And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search
> for it in groups or contact me for details.
>
> Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan
>
>
> >


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Re: Audio tutorials for mac programs?

[Jenny Kennedy (Howard)]

Hi Eric,

If there aren't any audio tutorials out there and you could do some  
that would be great! *smile*
I saw some of these "Take Control" of, and then there were random  
subjects but it didn't seem to have anything to do with VO


Best Wishes
Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
Olathe, Kansas USA

Join me on FaceBook:
Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
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NLS digital books and future versions of iTunes,iPod, iPhone?

[Jenny Kennedy (Howard)]

Hi guys,
Well it looks as if the NLS here in the U.S. is going to be rolling  
out their long awaited digital talkingbooks and players in a few  
months program wide.

For a while there have been beta testers that have used assorted  
aspects of the program's hardware and software.

The digital talking books are going to be put on flash memory and  
people who have the victor reader stream have been able to download  
digital files of the books to play on their players for a while.  You  
have to register for the service and receive a special file that you  
load onto the stream from what I understand and it pinpoints you as a  
registered NLS user and allows you to use the download-able files.

Well I am wondering if it would be possible for Apple to team up with  
NLS like they've done with Audible and allow iTunes, future iPods and  
or the iPhone to play the NLS DTBs?  I am thinking it would be the  
best thing in the world if I could put NLS books in iTunes and on my  
iPod.  This can be done but it is against the law and cumbersome and  
time consuming. LOL and it would be just better in my way of thinking  
if NLS DTBs would just go on the iPod all on their own without much  
fuss or muss.
Do you all think this could be done and is it something anyone else  
would like to see?
How would people e go about telling Apple to look into this or like I  
said is it even possible?

Best Wishes
Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
Olathe, Kansas USA

Join me on FaceBook:
Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search  
for it in groups or contact me for details.

Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan


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Re: updarting on my mail problem

[Gary]

I'm not sure if you still need this but I have Road Runner, and this  
is what I have  in my mailpreferences page.
Account information tab:
Account Type:  Road Runner Pop
Full Name:  I just put my first name here.
Incoming Mail Server:  Pop-server.satx.rr.com
Outgoing Mail Server:  smtp-server.satx.rr.com
(satx is the domainname for San Antonio Texas, where I live.   
Yours will be different if you don't live in S.A.)  Go to the Road  
Runner Help page to find your mail server domains.
Use only this server" should be unchecked.

Advanced TAb should have these settings:
Enable this account should be checked.
Port is 110
Use SSL should be unchecked.
Authentication should be set topassword.

Gary


On Jul 14, 2009, at 8:09 PM, matthew T dyer wrote:

>
> Hi,  I should have no problem as I am back on with my isp so I shoiuld
> have no problemds sending mail again.
>
> Matthew
>
>
> On Jul 12, 2009, at 1:01 PM, Maxwell Ivey Jr. wrote:
>
>>
>> Hello;  I don't know if this is your specific problem or not, but I
>> have an account with people pc.  unless I'm signed into their network
>> I have to put my whole email address in my mail program not just my
>> screen name.  They claim its a security measure.  Once they told me
>> about it, I've never had that problem sending mail again.  I also
>> found out that with people pc you don't just enter smtp you have to
>> enter smtpauth.  I'm sure you have probably already covered this with
>> your isp, but just thought I'd ask.  Good luck in solving your mail
>> problem, Max
>> On Jul 4, 2009, at 2:13 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> Because of the wide existance of SPAM and generally no security on
>>> the original mail protocols used on the Internet, most ISP's block
>>> access to their mail servers from outside their managed network.  
>>> What
>>> this means is if you are on Cox and attempt to send or receive e- 
>>> mail
>>> from RoadRunner  owned servers you will probably have problems.
>>>
>>> A way that might avoid this is to ask about SSL enabled  services,  
>>> or
>>> perhaps even just try turning on SSL  mode in the advanced mail
>>> account configuration.
>>>
>>> Jon
>>>
>>> On Jul 4, 2009, at 2:01 PM, matthew T dyer wrote:
>>>

 Hello everyone in mac world.

 I just got of the phone with apple reggarding my mail sending
 problem
 with roadrunner.  I think we are naring it down top a possible
 problem
 in which the block messages going out and possible incoming as  
 well.
 If this iks the case,  anyone here using rloadrunner know what I
 should dpo to allow  me to be able to send message?  I am not using
 my own internet connection as i do not have it.hanks again  for
 everyone who has been a bifg help.

 Matthew



>
>>>
>>>

>>
>>
>>>
>
>
> >


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Re: NLS digital books and future versions of iTunes,iPod, iPhone?

[Chris Polk]

that would be really cool to have only one device for all of the books/ 
music/phone/email, well you get the point.


On Jul 14, 2009, at 8:26 PM, Jenny Kennedy (Howard) wrote:

>
> Hi guys,
> Well it looks as if the NLS here in the U.S. is going to be rolling
> out their long awaited digital talkingbooks and players in a few
> months program wide.
>
> For a while there have been beta testers that have used assorted
> aspects of the program's hardware and software.
>
> The digital talking books are going to be put on flash memory and
> people who have the victor reader stream have been able to download
> digital files of the books to play on their players for a while.  You
> have to register for the service and receive a special file that you
> load onto the stream from what I understand and it pinpoints you as a
> registered NLS user and allows you to use the download-able files.
>
> Well I am wondering if it would be possible for Apple to team up with
> NLS like they've done with Audible and allow iTunes, future iPods and
> or the iPhone to play the NLS DTBs?  I am thinking it would be the
> best thing in the world if I could put NLS books in iTunes and on my
> iPod.  This can be done but it is against the law and cumbersome and
> time consuming. LOL and it would be just better in my way of thinking
> if NLS DTBs would just go on the iPod all on their own without much
> fuss or muss.
> Do you all think this could be done and is it something anyone else
> would like to see?
> How would people e go about telling Apple to look into this or like I
> said is it even possible?
>
> Best Wishes
> Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
> blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
> Olathe, Kansas USA
>
> Join me on FaceBook:
> Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
> And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search
> for it in groups or contact me for details.
>
> Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan
>
>
> >


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Re: NLS digital books and future versions of iTunes,iPod, iPhone?

[Greg Kearney]

A few points about the NLS system. First off it uses a very heavy  
encryption on the books as well as a some what unusual audio format.  
At this point in time the NLS has refused to permit the authorization  
of computer based playback of their books.

At the Association for the Blind of Western Australia we have been  
developing a digital talking book player software for the Mac as well  
as for the iPhone and iPod Touch. It will be interesting to see the  
reaction of the NLS when we approach them about authorizing the mass- 
market iPhone as a device.

That said we offer a library service, similar to the NLS one which is  
open to users worldwide and which offers DAISY books with no DRM.  
These titles include iPod playlist and can be used on an iPod or  
similar device as well as DAISY playback devices.

Our collection is divided into two sections. A public section which  
can be used by anyone world wide and a copyright controlled section  
restricted to our library members. We are investigating how to offer  
access to the copyrighted works to the disabled world wide and I will  
post information of that here.

You can take a look at our service at http://www.cucat.org/library/  
request fro production take about 48 hours to complete.

Gregory Kearney
Manager - Accessible Media
Association for the Blind of Western Australia
61 Kitchener Avenue, PO Box 101
Victoria Park 6979, WA Australia

Telephone: +61 (08) 9311 8202
Telephone: +1 (307) 224-4022 (North America)
Fax: +61 (08) 9361 8696
Toll free: 1800 658 388 (Australia only)
Email: gkear...@gmail.com

On Jul 15, 2009, at 11:26 AM, Jenny Kennedy (Howard) wrote:

>
> Hi guys,
> Well it looks as if the NLS here in the U.S. is going to be rolling
> out their long awaited digital talkingbooks and players in a few
> months program wide.
>
> For a while there have been beta testers that have used assorted
> aspects of the program's hardware and software.
>
> The digital talking books are going to be put on flash memory and
> people who have the victor reader stream have been able to download
> digital files of the books to play on their players for a while.  You
> have to register for the service and receive a special file that you
> load onto the stream from what I understand and it pinpoints you as a
> registered NLS user and allows you to use the download-able files.
>
> Well I am wondering if it would be possible for Apple to team up with
> NLS like they've done with Audible and allow iTunes, future iPods and
> or the iPhone to play the NLS DTBs?  I am thinking it would be the
> best thing in the world if I could put NLS books in iTunes and on my
> iPod.  This can be done but it is against the law and cumbersome and
> time consuming. LOL and it would be just better in my way of thinking
> if NLS DTBs would just go on the iPod all on their own without much
> fuss or muss.
> Do you all think this could be done and is it something anyone else
> would like to see?
> How would people e go about telling Apple to look into this or like I
> said is it even possible?
>
> Best Wishes
> Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
> blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
> Olathe, Kansas USA
>
> Join me on FaceBook:
> Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
> And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search
> for it in groups or contact me for details.
>
> Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan
>
>
> >


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Josh de Lioncourt]

Well, as others have pointed out, there is a very, very small number  
of uses for which the push notification is not appropriate. However,  
as I said before, they've solved the vast majority of issues this  
way.  I don't think we exactly disagree, but I think that the number  
of users who will actually be impacted by the limitations is extremely  
small, and that even for a lot of those who will be impacted, the pros  
will outweigh the cons. What I'm try towork through are the  
misconceptions, like Will Lomas put forth, that you can't move back  
and forth between multiple apps and essentially multi-task, and that  
point has been lost in an argument about technicalities that will  
effect less than a single percent of users. LOL. Your battery issue is  
likewise the same. It will impact a very, very tiny number of users.  
That doesn't mean the problem doesn't exist, but seeing it harped on  
about and latched onto by the nay sayers as an excuse to downplay the  
iPhone's advantages is frustrating.

I hope this makes sense. I have never said, and would never say, that  
any device is perfect for everyone. I think the iPhone is more than  
adequate, and is in fact ideal, for a huge numbe rof users, and that  
by arguing things like this multi-tasking situation, you're confusing  
folks like Will Lomas who would be just fine with an iPhone, but think  
they won't because of complaints about SSH and IRC.

Hope that makes more sense. :)

Josh de Lioncourt
…my other mail provider is an owl…

Twitter: http://twitter.com/Lioncourt
Music: http://stage19music.com
Mac-cessibility: http://www.Lioncourt.com
Blog: http://lioncourtsmusings.blogspot.com
GoodReads: http://goodreads.com/Lioncourt

On Jul 14, 2009, at 7:43 PM, Scott Bresnahan wrote:

>
> Hi, Josh,
>
> Take a closer look at what is possible via push in the APIs and you
> may be surprised at how limiting it is.  Your argument about  Apple
> solving the problem by introducing push is more marketing hype than
> fact.  At the core, you can't keep sockets open in the background
> which many RFC standards like irc, ssh, telnet etc depend.  Apple's
> answer is well, rewrite the standard.  That's not an answer.  you
> cant' just rewrite every server platform out there to support Apple's
> whim of of a lame push notification method.  If you're starting from
> scratch today, writing a new client and server platform, then sure,
> you can work around it.  But there are a lot of pre existing
> technologies that won't work no matter how the app is coded simply
> because the problem is not with the client but the server piece the
> client is meant to communicate with.  But again, this isn't a problem
> for most people, but only for those who need to multitask, like
> keeping multiple sessions open at a time.
>
> As for batteries, I agree that *most* people don't' have spare
> batteries.  However, just because you haven't met them doesn't mean
> they don't exist.  I had two spares back when I had an analog
> StarTac, and I know a small fraction of people who still have spare
> batteries for their phones today.  Granted, these folks tend to like
> Star Trek the original series vs tng, but I digress not to
> mention I think they try to use their phones as laptops, but who am I
> to argue their inefficiency.  :)
> .
>
> I can't believe I'm arguing the devils advocate on this. did I
> mention I love my iPhone?  But, it just doesn't do windows, so stop
> pretending it does.  lol
>
>
> --Scott


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Re: Audio tutorials for mac programs?

[Michael Babcock]

hi;
check out
screenlessswitchers.com
mike

On Jul 14, 2009, at 7:02 PM, Jenny Kennedy (Howard) wrote:

>
> Hi Eric,
>
> If there aren't any audio tutorials out there and you could do some
> that would be great! *smile*
> I saw some of these "Take Control" of, and then there were random
> subjects but it didn't seem to have anything to do with VO
>
>
> Best Wishes
> Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
> blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
> Olathe, Kansas USA
>
> Join me on FaceBook:
> Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
> And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search
> for it in groups or contact me for details.
>
> Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan
>
>
> >

Michael Babcock
GW Hosting, Your Dedicated Home On The Web
Phone: +1-888-272-3555, ext 54121
email: michael.babc...@gwhosting.net
administrative e-mail: ad...@gwhosting.net
url: http://gwhosting.net


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Re: NLS digital books and future versions of iTunes,iPod, iPhone?

[May and Wynter]

Hey, that would be a good idea. Then I could sell my victor stream along 
with my trekker.

May off to Edmonton Alberta on the 25th.
Am I ready to see some people there?
- Original Message - 
From: "Jenny Kennedy (Howard)" 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 8:26 PM
Subject: NLS digital books and future versions of iTunes,iPod, iPhone?


>
> Hi guys,
> Well it looks as if the NLS here in the U.S. is going to be rolling
> out their long awaited digital talkingbooks and players in a few
> months program wide.
>
> For a while there have been beta testers that have used assorted
> aspects of the program's hardware and software.
>
> The digital talking books are going to be put on flash memory and
> people who have the victor reader stream have been able to download
> digital files of the books to play on their players for a while.  You
> have to register for the service and receive a special file that you
> load onto the stream from what I understand and it pinpoints you as a
> registered NLS user and allows you to use the download-able files.
>
> Well I am wondering if it would be possible for Apple to team up with
> NLS like they've done with Audible and allow iTunes, future iPods and
> or the iPhone to play the NLS DTBs?  I am thinking it would be the
> best thing in the world if I could put NLS books in iTunes and on my
> iPod.  This can be done but it is against the law and cumbersome and
> time consuming. LOL and it would be just better in my way of thinking
> if NLS DTBs would just go on the iPod all on their own without much
> fuss or muss.
> Do you all think this could be done and is it something anyone else
> would like to see?
> How would people e go about telling Apple to look into this or like I
> said is it even possible?
>
> Best Wishes
> Jenny Kennedy (Howard)
> blueskyes9112...@gmail.com
> Olathe, Kansas USA
>
> Join me on FaceBook:
> Personal Profile - www.facebook.com/blueskyes
> And feel free to join "The Blind Parents of FaceBook" group.  Search
> for it in groups or contact me for details.
>
> Follow me via twitter using the username: ben_folds_fan
>
>
> > 


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Re: Article Slamming the iPhone

[Cara Quinn]

   Okay, I'm going to burst everyone's bubble here and say I'm one of  
those people who has had more than one phone battery for many phones  
I've had. And no, I am not a huge fan of Star Trek the original  
series! lol!  I like TNG, voyager and Enterprise! *smirk*

   Now do I need to separate you two or spray you both with water or  
something?…  lol!

   to at least try to stay on topic here in some semblance; I'd sure  
love to hear people's experiences with outboard batteries for the  
IPHone. I.E. the Mophi Juice Pack etc…

   So as not to hijack this thread, (I'm actually finding this quite  
interesting) I'd suggest if people want to contribute to the subject  
of batteries, that we start a new subjectline?…  Thanks so much!…

Have an awesome night and live long and prosper!…

Cara :)
---
Follow me on Twitter!

https://twitter.com/ModelCara

View my Online Portfolio at:
http://www.onemodelplace.com/CaraQuinn

On Jul 14, 2009, at 7:43 PM, Scott Bresnahan wrote:


Hi, Josh,

Take a closer look at what is possible via push in the APIs and you
may be surprised at how limiting it is.  Your argument about  Apple
solving the problem by introducing push is more marketing hype than
fact.  At the core, you can't keep sockets open in the background
which many RFC standards like irc, ssh, telnet etc depend.  Apple's
answer is well, rewrite the standard.  That's not an answer.  you
cant' just rewrite every server platform out there to support Apple's
whim of of a lame push notification method.  If you're starting from
scratch today, writing a new client and server platform, then sure,
you can work around it.  But there are a lot of pre existing
technologies that won't work no matter how the app is coded simply
because the problem is not with the client but the server piece the
client is meant to communicate with.  But again, this isn't a problem
for most people, but only for those who need to multitask, like
keeping multiple sessions open at a time.

As for batteries, I agree that *most* people don't' have spare
batteries.  However, just because you haven't met them doesn't mean
they don't exist.  I had two spares back when I had an analog
StarTac, and I know a small fraction of people who still have spare
batteries for their phones today.  Granted, these folks tend to like
Star Trek the original series vs tng, but I digress not to
mention I think they try to use their phones as laptops, but who am I
to argue their inefficiency.  :)
.

I can't believe I'm arguing the devils advocate on this. did I
mention I love my iPhone?  But, it just doesn't do windows, so stop
pretending it does.  lol


--Scott

> Hi Scott,
>
> See my comments inline. :)
>
> On Jul 14, 2009, at 11:38 AM, Scott Bresnahan wrote:
>> I love the iPhone, but I have to disagree.  I
>> think both points have some merit.  The iPhone is
>> not for everyone..
>>
> Nor will you ever hear me sayt that any one device is for everyone. :)
>
>> 1.  Multitasking is a short coming.  It's like
>> the Finder compared to the Multi-Finder in the
>> Mac Plus days.  Some technologies, ssh and irc
>> come to mind, will not work well on the iPhone.
>> We use a custom irc server to do real time IT
>> troubleshooting across our applications, and I
>> cannot keep my irc session alive while I use
>> Safari.  This is not the case on other phone
>> platforms and is a valid argument.  You can't say
>> that remembering your preferences and place in an
>> application is the same as background processing.
>
> Apple has addressed this. This is not a problem with the iPHone, but
> rather with whatever app you are using for IRC. Push notifications,
> which developers can utilize to send notifications to the phone, can
> be used to solve your IRC issue. If your IRC client has not done this
> yet, it is not the iPhone's shortcoming, but rather the app's. While
> there are a very few situations when the combination of saving one's
> place and push notifications will not suffice, I can't readily think
> of one, and the vast, vast majority of problems can be rectified with
> these. Your IRC argument, in particular, is kind of like blaming the
> Mac because a third-party program for chatting doesn't play a sound
> when a new message comes in, for example.
>>
>> 2.  Although you may have memorized the keypad,
>> it's not reasonable to assume everyone will or
>> can.   Which has a faster learning curve?  The
>> touch screen layout or the standard keypad?  I
>> say this only because part of the usefulness of a
>> device lies not with the expert user, but with
>> the casual user.   Personally, most of my numbers
>> are direct dials, so I don't have the memory for
>> the keypad due to lack of practice and everyday
>> use, but when I do need it, I struggle and yes, a
>> tactile keypad would be easier..  That said, I am
>> surviving.
>
> I don't hardly use the keypad at all, but as it is identical to a
> tactile keypad in layout, I don't think it is as difficult as you seem
> to thi