Re: [AFMUG] CPI certified installer in TN

[Timothy Steele]

Yes it's a brand new WISP owner only

he was asking if I can get CPI Trained but I'm not even in the states right
now

from what I was reading on it sounds like the CPI needs to be on-site and
supervise the install



On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 4:37 AM Steve Jones 
wrote:

> This sounds like a WISP that needs to be educated on what they are doing.
> Somebody at that company really should do the certification, contracted CPI
> input just begs for a disaster years down the road. I cant see any CPI
> giving up their credentials to a non employer for SAS management. I know I
> wouldn't.
>
> On Sat, May 9, 2020, 8:37 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>> They do know that a CPI doesn’t necessarily do installation despite the
>> title, right?
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Timothy Steele
>> *Sent:* Friday, May 8, 2020 8:53 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] CPI certified installer in TN
>>
>>
>>
>> have a WISP asking me for a CPI Certified installer
>>
>>
>>
>> Does anyone know of a contractor in the TN area?
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>>
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Re: [AFMUG] CPI certified installer in TN

[Ken Hohhof]

The CPI certifies that the lat/lon, antenna height, azimuth, radio model and 
SN, and antenna model are correct as submitted to the SAS.  Also frequency, 
channel width and EIRP, but you request those and the SAS grants them.

 

For CPE installs, if you know the lat/lon, you know the azimuth.  In most cases 
someone at the office will provide the radio and antenna for the installer and 
will therefore be able to get that info.  The requirements for horizontal and 
vertical location accuracy are loose enough that in most cases you can easily 
meet them without being on site, for example from Google Earth.  If the 
physical installer is provided with a handheld GPS, and takes a cellphone photo 
of the install, it is reasonable for the CPI to verify and enter this 
information without having to be onsite.

 

It is actually easier for new installs.  We transitioned a lot of existing 3.65 
customers to CBRS.  I would say I had to go out and verify at most 10% of them 
because we didn’t have good records of exactly where on the property the CPE 
was installed.  A couple I used a laser rangefinder to determine AGL, but 
mostly because I was there and I had one, it is honestly overkill except maybe 
for tower sites where you don’t know the exact height.  If the CPE is on a 
customer’s TV tower, you can count 10 ft sections to get the height.

 

IMHO, the new WISP owner should pay the money and take the time for the online 
course and exam.  It’s not hard.  He will learn some stuff about CBRS, and will 
have his own CPI credentials for adding and modifying data in the SAS, you 
really don’t want to be reliant on an outside contractor for this.  In the 
grand scheme of getting CBRS working in your network, CPI credentials are a 
small piece.  Just do it.

 

He is using CBRS, right?  Otherwise, this is all moot.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Timothy Steele
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 2:04 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CPI certified installer in TN

 

Yes it's a brand new WISP owner only

 

he was asking if I can get CPI Trained but I'm not even in the states right now

 

from what I was reading on it sounds like the CPI needs to be on-site and 
supervise the install

 

 

 

On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 4:37 AM Steve Jones mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> > wrote:

This sounds like a WISP that needs to be educated on what they are doing. 
Somebody at that company really should do the certification, contracted CPI 
input just begs for a disaster years down the road. I cant see any CPI giving 
up their credentials to a non employer for SAS management. I know I wouldn't.

 

On Sat, May 9, 2020, 8:37 AM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

They do know that a CPI doesn’t necessarily do installation despite the title, 
right?

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Timothy Steele
Sent: Friday, May 8, 2020 8:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: [AFMUG] CPI certified installer in TN

 

have a WISP asking me for a CPI Certified installer 

 

Does anyone know of a contractor in the TN area?

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Re: [AFMUG] CPI certified installer in TN

[David Coudron]

Having transitioned existing customers over and now hooking up new ones, I 
agree with what is mentioned below.   If you are going to be doing CBRS just 
take the course and get the certification.  You can have a remote person do it 
but the CPI has responsibility for the data in the SAS and any CPI who takes it 
seriously will want to do some kind of review of the data.  I don’t think too 
many CPIs would hand over their certificate and password so that means on every 
install the WISP would have to reach out to the CPI to get the CPI to register 
the radio.  Even if the CPI only charges $25 to register each install it won’t 
be long before it would be cheaper to pay the money and get registered.  It 
only takes an afternoon.

Get Outlook for iOS

From: AF  on behalf of Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 7:26:34 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CPI certified installer in TN


The CPI certifies that the lat/lon, antenna height, azimuth, radio model and 
SN, and antenna model are correct as submitted to the SAS.  Also frequency, 
channel width and EIRP, but you request those and the SAS grants them.



For CPE installs, if you know the lat/lon, you know the azimuth.  In most cases 
someone at the office will provide the radio and antenna for the installer and 
will therefore be able to get that info.  The requirements for horizontal and 
vertical location accuracy are loose enough that in most cases you can easily 
meet them without being on site, for example from Google Earth.  If the 
physical installer is provided with a handheld GPS, and takes a cellphone photo 
of the install, it is reasonable for the CPI to verify and enter this 
information without having to be onsite.



It is actually easier for new installs.  We transitioned a lot of existing 3.65 
customers to CBRS.  I would say I had to go out and verify at most 10% of them 
because we didn’t have good records of exactly where on the property the CPE 
was installed.  A couple I used a laser rangefinder to determine AGL, but 
mostly because I was there and I had one, it is honestly overkill except maybe 
for tower sites where you don’t know the exact height.  If the CPE is on a 
customer’s TV tower, you can count 10 ft sections to get the height.



IMHO, the new WISP owner should pay the money and take the time for the online 
course and exam.  It’s not hard.  He will learn some stuff about CBRS, and will 
have his own CPI credentials for adding and modifying data in the SAS, you 
really don’t want to be reliant on an outside contractor for this.  In the 
grand scheme of getting CBRS working in your network, CPI credentials are a 
small piece.  Just do it.



He is using CBRS, right?  Otherwise, this is all moot.





From: AF  On Behalf Of Timothy Steele
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 2:04 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CPI certified installer in TN



Yes it's a brand new WISP owner only



he was asking if I can get CPI Trained but I'm not even in the states right now



from what I was reading on it sounds like the CPI needs to be on-site and 
supervise the install







On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 4:37 AM Steve Jones 
mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>> wrote:

This sounds like a WISP that needs to be educated on what they are doing. 
Somebody at that company really should do the certification, contracted CPI 
input just begs for a disaster years down the road. I cant see any CPI giving 
up their credentials to a non employer for SAS management. I know I wouldn't.



On Sat, May 9, 2020, 8:37 AM Ken Hohhof 
mailto:af...@kwisp.com>> wrote:

They do know that a CPI doesn’t necessarily do installation despite the title, 
right?



From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Timothy Steele
Sent: Friday, May 8, 2020 8:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: [AFMUG] CPI certified installer in TN



have a WISP asking me for a CPI Certified installer



Does anyone know of a contractor in the TN area?

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Re: [AFMUG] Ot: we are all people

[Robert]

Being able to disagree and still listen to each other is the lesson for 
me to take to heart today.   Sorry I get angry at people.    Very well 
said, Steve!


On 5/9/20 10:08 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
Afmug has devolved to some serious 2016 level negative discourse. We 
have never been an industry only group. Let's post (if your 
comfortable with personal info) what keeps us going. At the end of the 
day, what's in front of our eyes each day makes us do what we do. 
Here's my party. We are all people, even if we disagree.




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Re: [AFMUG] Ot: we are all people

[Ken Hohhof]

But getting angry at people is a trademark of getting old.  Does this mean I 
can’t yell at kids to get off my lawn anymore?  Plus, now I’m envious of 
Steve’s haircut.  Nice family AND a haircut, he’s got it all.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Robert
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 9:34 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Ot: we are all people

 

Being able to disagree and still listen to each other is the lesson for me to 
take to heart today.   Sorry I get angry at people.Very well said, Steve!

On 5/9/20 10:08 PM, Steve Jones wrote:

Afmug has devolved to some serious 2016 level negative discourse. We have never 
been an industry only group. Let's post (if your comfortable with personal 
info) what keeps us going. At the end of the day, what's in front of our eyes 
each day makes us do what we do. Here's my party. We are all people, even if we 
disagree.





 

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Re: [AFMUG] Ot: we are all people

[James Howard]

I think dinosaurs are still allowed to get angry Ken.  They just need to be 
respectful of the feelings of the kids when they yell at them to get off the 
lawn.  Depending on the species of dinosaur he might even want to consider 
sparing the kids feelings about being yelled at and just eat them instead…..

Seriously though, well said Steve.  Nice pictures too.

Tell your wife “happy mother’s day” for me.


From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 9:51 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Ot: we are all people

But getting angry at people is a trademark of getting old.  Does this mean I 
can’t yell at kids to get off my lawn anymore?  Plus, now I’m envious of 
Steve’s haircut.  Nice family AND a haircut, he’s got it all.


From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Robert
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 9:34 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Ot: we are all people

Being able to disagree and still listen to each other is the lesson for me to 
take to heart today.   Sorry I get angry at people.Very well said, Steve!
On 5/9/20 10:08 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
Afmug has devolved to some serious 2016 level negative discourse. We have never 
been an industry only group. Let's post (if your comfortable with personal 
info) what keeps us going. At the end of the day, what's in front of our eyes 
each day makes us do what we do. Here's my party. We are all people, even if we 
disagree.



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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Matt Hoppes]

Just gettting back to this thread now.

I would absolutely rush out and get it right now IF:

A) I knew for a fact that the antibodies would keep me immune to it 
going forward

B) I knew for a fact there were no long term issues (think Polio)

I'm  not convinced of either of those things, yet... and am waiting on 
folks more smart than myself.


On 5/9/20 10:50 AM, Steve Jones wrote:
That's why right now is the best time to get it. Matt and the talking 
heads keep saying that we all will eventually get this, and they 
wouldn't lie. So right now when the hospitals are empty and 60 percent 
of healthcare staff is laid off is the ideal time to get it. Get it in 
the fall when it resources (again, matt and the talking heads have 
guaranteed this) are taxed due to flu season, and survivability drops.
 From day one I've said infection centers would be the absolute best 
tool to fight this thing. The younger, healthier, medically screened 
people go and get infected, and start treatment immediately. Its 
effectively the same thing as vaccination with a few more steps.
Morons say "well we dont know that getting it will make you immune" 
which is fine and good, maybe it's not like 99 percent of other viruses. 
But guess what that means. It means that there will never be a vaccine 
since that's what vaccines to (make your body think you've had the 
disease). Matt and the talking heads cannot have it both ways, science 
doesnt allow it.


I'm in the same boat though, I want to maximize the time with my kids. I 
have this new fresh one that's still just a lump of dough, I'd like to 
get to know what he cooks into. But I wont do this teaching these little 
bastards to cower in the corner because the government says to, 
especially when the governments demands dont match the so called science 
they're basing it on. And the little dough ball isnt developing an 
immune system, he will be that pale gray sickly kid with a doctors note 
for PE soon if I dont get him exposed to some community germs. I'm about 
to go drag him across a truck stop floor


On Sat, May 9, 2020, 9:35 AM mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> 
wrote:


I have not had nearly enough time with my grandkids yet.
So, trying to optimize the chance of more time with grandkids.
*From:* Lewis Bergman
*Sent:* Saturday, May 9, 2020 8:18 AM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
Maybe. At this point, I couldn't care less. Get it, don't get it. I
don't care anymore.
On Sat, May 9, 2020, 9:07 AM  wrote:

I modified all the doors I could so you don’t have to use a hand
to open them.
Put an auto flush valve on the urinal.
We asked all the guys to try to do the 6 foot thing.
Logging temps with an IR thermometer each morning and posting
them on a white board is surprisingly reassuring in a way.
None of this is expensive or onerous or an overreaction and will
work for all kinds of communicable diseases.
I don’t want them to bring it back to me.  Everyone at my place
is much younger than my wife and myself.  Silly for those in a
particular age demographic to not be as careful as they can.  I
also wear my seat belt, don’t smoke and try to keep my blood
sugar and blood pressure low. To me this is just more of the same.
*From:* Lewis Bergman
*Sent:* Saturday, May 9, 2020 7:54 AM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
We changed nothing. No distancing, no work from home, no masks,
no gloves. The only thing we are sick of is all the talk of
covid. Workers comp covers this kind of thing and your ERA is
based on the total experience of like industries which
presumably would experience similar sickness rates.
Don't let the fear of liability stop you from doing anything
productive.
On Fri, May 8, 2020, 5:41 PM  wrote:

I never shut down.  I build critical infrastructure.
We distanced, made sure everyone was in their own vehicle.
Gave them all gloves and masks.  Make sure everyone’s
temperature is taken and logged each morning.
If someone gets sick, who gave it to them and who gave it to
that person.  If you want to attempt to assign liability it
would as difficult as doing slavery reparations in a fair
manner.
The can sue China.
*From:* Robert
*Sent:* Friday, May 8, 2020 4:20 PM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
Act of God?   How would you deal with someone getting the
flu or passing it on?

On 5/8/20 3:05 PM, Matt Hoppes wrote:

Any lawyer will tell you that waiver only goes so far.


On May 8, 2020, at 6:00 PM, Steve Jones
mailto

Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Matt Hoppes]

To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" do 
you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?


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[AFMUG] food banks

[Ken Hohhof]

I found the photos in this article disquieting.  Many of us are in the
business of selling a hot commodity and our businesses and personal income
are intact, at least for now.  Maybe consider writing a check to your local
food bank, or volunteering.

 

Interesting the first photo is from Utah, which is famous for taking care of
its own, not true everywhere.

 

https://www.vox.com/2020/5/9/21251895/food-banks-lines-pandemic

 

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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Ken Hohhof]

I heard on the radio a restaurant owner in downstate Illinois opened to a
full sit-down crowd, citing his rights as an American.  He apparently forgot
that restaurants are already subject to lots of rules, and the county health
department can pull his health permit.  Heck, they regulate how big your
sign can be, what hours you can be open, maximum occupancy, whether you can
serve liquor (or sprouts or foie gras), whether you can hand out plastic
straws.  The idea that a business is free to do whatever it wants, free of
government regulation, is kind of divorced from reality.

I don't necessarily agree with the way any level of government is handling
this, but not because of my rights and freedoms.

-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" do you
also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?

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Re: [AFMUG] food banks

[Chuck McCown]

The state government of Utah has mobilized many state agencies to move food and 
household supplies to those that need it.

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 10, 2020, at 1:12 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> 
> 
> I found the photos in this article disquieting.  Many of us are in the 
> business of selling a hot commodity and our businesses and personal income 
> are intact, at least for now.  Maybe consider writing a check to your local 
> food bank, or volunteering.
>  
> Interesting the first photo is from Utah, which is famous for taking care of 
> its own, not true everywhere.
>  
> https://www.vox.com/2020/5/9/21251895/food-banks-lines-pandemic
>  
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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Chuck McCown]

Did they shut him down?

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 10, 2020, at 1:27 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> 
> I heard on the radio a restaurant owner in downstate Illinois opened to a
> full sit-down crowd, citing his rights as an American.  He apparently forgot
> that restaurants are already subject to lots of rules, and the county health
> department can pull his health permit.  Heck, they regulate how big your
> sign can be, what hours you can be open, maximum occupancy, whether you can
> serve liquor (or sprouts or foie gras), whether you can hand out plastic
> straws.  The idea that a business is free to do whatever it wants, free of
> government regulation, is kind of divorced from reality.
> 
> I don't necessarily agree with the way any level of government is handling
> this, but not because of my rights and freedoms.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones
> 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
> 
> To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" do you
> also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?
> 
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> 
> 
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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Ken Hohhof]

The health dept called him and asked him to voluntarily stop seating customers. 
 I Googled for it and found this article, I think this was the guy.  It says he 
closed ... when he ran out of food.

I am not aware of any actual enforcement actions in Illinois other than Chicago 
police breaking up some parties, even then, they told people to disperse, I 
don't think they arrested people.  Compliance actually seems voluntary, you 
hear Andrew Cuomo say the same thing, if 19 million people decide not to wear 
masks, what is he going to do, arrest them all?

https://www.wcia.com/news/restaurant-owner-says-hell-sue-health-department-over-dine-in-refusal/

Read the article for yourself.  Sounds like he was looking for the attention, 
otherwise he could have just opened for business without all the publicity and 
threats of lawsuits.  People don't like being told what to do.


-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 2:40 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

Did they shut him down?

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 10, 2020, at 1:27 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> 
> I heard on the radio a restaurant owner in downstate Illinois opened 
> to a full sit-down crowd, citing his rights as an American.  He 
> apparently forgot that restaurants are already subject to lots of 
> rules, and the county health department can pull his health permit.  
> Heck, they regulate how big your sign can be, what hours you can be 
> open, maximum occupancy, whether you can serve liquor (or sprouts or 
> foie gras), whether you can hand out plastic straws.  The idea that a 
> business is free to do whatever it wants, free of government regulation, is 
> kind of divorced from reality.
> 
> I don't necessarily agree with the way any level of government is 
> handling this, but not because of my rights and freedoms.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones 
> 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
> 
> To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" 
> do you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?
> 
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> 
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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Bill Prince]

I would boycott any restaurant that served foie gras simply because I 
hate liver, and duck/goose live is just as disgusting.


bp


On 5/10/2020 12:26 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

I heard on the radio a restaurant owner in downstate Illinois opened to a
full sit-down crowd, citing his rights as an American.  He apparently forgot
that restaurants are already subject to lots of rules, and the county health
department can pull his health permit.  Heck, they regulate how big your
sign can be, what hours you can be open, maximum occupancy, whether you can
serve liquor (or sprouts or foie gras), whether you can hand out plastic
straws.  The idea that a business is free to do whatever it wants, free of
government regulation, is kind of divorced from reality.

I don't necessarily agree with the way any level of government is handling
this, but not because of my rights and freedoms.

-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" do you
also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?

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[AFMUG] Fwd: People in Salt Lake City shared "The state of Utah converts the Salt...

[Chuck McCown]

Sent from my iPhone

Begin forwarded message:

> From: Twitter 
> Date: May 10, 2020 at 2:57:51 PM MDT
> To: Chuck McCown 
> Subject: People in Salt Lake City shared "The state of Utah converts the 
> Salt...
> 
> 
>   
>  
>  
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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Chuck McCown]

I tried it in Monte Carlo.  Tasted like Underwood Deviled Ham mixed with 
margarine.  No liver taste at all.

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 10, 2020, at 2:37 PM, Bill Prince  wrote:
> 
> I would boycott any restaurant that served foie gras simply because I hate 
> liver, and duck/goose live is just as disgusting.
> 
> bp
> 
> 
>> On 5/10/2020 12:26 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>> I heard on the radio a restaurant owner in downstate Illinois opened to a
>> full sit-down crowd, citing his rights as an American.  He apparently forgot
>> that restaurants are already subject to lots of rules, and the county health
>> department can pull his health permit.  Heck, they regulate how big your
>> sign can be, what hours you can be open, maximum occupancy, whether you can
>> serve liquor (or sprouts or foie gras), whether you can hand out plastic
>> straws.  The idea that a business is free to do whatever it wants, free of
>> government regulation, is kind of divorced from reality.
>> 
>> I don't necessarily agree with the way any level of government is handling
>> this, but not because of my rights and freedoms.
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: AF  On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
>> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones
>> 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
>> 
>> To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" do you
>> also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?
>> 
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>> 
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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Ken Hohhof]

I hate liver but have been known to eat liver sausage.  Oscar Meyer.  On Ritz 
crackers.  With or without a slice of cheddar cheese.

Also excellent for getting dogs to take pills.

-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 4:19 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

I tried it in Monte Carlo.  Tasted like Underwood Deviled Ham mixed with 
margarine.  No liver taste at all.

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 10, 2020, at 2:37 PM, Bill Prince  wrote:
> 
> I would boycott any restaurant that served foie gras simply because I hate 
> liver, and duck/goose live is just as disgusting.
> 
> bp
> 
> 
>> On 5/10/2020 12:26 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>> I heard on the radio a restaurant owner in downstate Illinois opened 
>> to a full sit-down crowd, citing his rights as an American.  He 
>> apparently forgot that restaurants are already subject to lots of 
>> rules, and the county health department can pull his health permit.  
>> Heck, they regulate how big your sign can be, what hours you can be 
>> open, maximum occupancy, whether you can serve liquor (or sprouts or 
>> foie gras), whether you can hand out plastic straws.  The idea that a 
>> business is free to do whatever it wants, free of government regulation, is 
>> kind of divorced from reality.
>> 
>> I don't necessarily agree with the way any level of government is 
>> handling this, but not because of my rights and freedoms.
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: AF  On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
>> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones 
>> 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
>> 
>> To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" 
>> do you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?
>> 
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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Bill Prince]

The mask thing cuts two ways. You may not care (or think you don't care) 
whether you get it or not, but the main thing is whether you might give 
it to someone else. At least 20% of the people who get it (and spread 
it) show no symptoms whatever. We know a local woman who has been 
pinpointed as the one who gave it to 12 other people.



bp


On 5/10/2020 11:52 AM, Matt Hoppes wrote:
To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" 
do you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?




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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Erich Kaiser]

I am a big fan of calves liver spread.  Used to get some strange looks from
the other kids in grade school during lunch.   I have not had it for years
well because the wife will not buy it LOL.




On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> I hate liver but have been known to eat liver sausage.  Oscar Meyer.  On
> Ritz crackers.  With or without a slice of cheddar cheese.
>
> Also excellent for getting dogs to take pills.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 4:19 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
>
> I tried it in Monte Carlo.  Tasted like Underwood Deviled Ham mixed with
> margarine.  No liver taste at all.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On May 10, 2020, at 2:37 PM, Bill Prince  wrote:
> >
> > I would boycott any restaurant that served foie gras simply because I
> hate liver, and duck/goose live is just as disgusting.
> >
> > bp
> > 
> >
> >> On 5/10/2020 12:26 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
> >> I heard on the radio a restaurant owner in downstate Illinois opened
> >> to a full sit-down crowd, citing his rights as an American.  He
> >> apparently forgot that restaurants are already subject to lots of
> >> rules, and the county health department can pull his health permit.
> >> Heck, they regulate how big your sign can be, what hours you can be
> >> open, maximum occupancy, whether you can serve liquor (or sprouts or
> >> foie gras), whether you can hand out plastic straws.  The idea that a
> >> business is free to do whatever it wants, free of government
> regulation, is kind of divorced from reality.
> >>
> >> I don't necessarily agree with the way any level of government is
> >> handling this, but not because of my rights and freedoms.
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: AF  On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
> >> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
> >> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones
> >> 
> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
> >>
> >> To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public"
> >> do you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?
> >>
> >> --
> >> AF mailing list
> >> AF@af.afmug.com
> >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Erich Kaiser]

Looking it up online probably had goose liver and pork liver spread as well.


Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 815-570-3101





On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 5:32 PM Erich Kaiser 
wrote:

> I am a big fan of calves liver spread.  Used to get some strange looks
> from the other kids in grade school during lunch.   I have not had it for
> years well because the wife will not buy it LOL.
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>> I hate liver but have been known to eat liver sausage.  Oscar Meyer.  On
>> Ritz crackers.  With or without a slice of cheddar cheese.
>>
>> Also excellent for getting dogs to take pills.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
>> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 4:19 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
>>
>> I tried it in Monte Carlo.  Tasted like Underwood Deviled Ham mixed with
>> margarine.  No liver taste at all.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> > On May 10, 2020, at 2:37 PM, Bill Prince  wrote:
>> >
>> > I would boycott any restaurant that served foie gras simply because I
>> hate liver, and duck/goose live is just as disgusting.
>> >
>> > bp
>> > 
>> >
>> >> On 5/10/2020 12:26 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>> >> I heard on the radio a restaurant owner in downstate Illinois opened
>> >> to a full sit-down crowd, citing his rights as an American.  He
>> >> apparently forgot that restaurants are already subject to lots of
>> >> rules, and the county health department can pull his health permit.
>> >> Heck, they regulate how big your sign can be, what hours you can be
>> >> open, maximum occupancy, whether you can serve liquor (or sprouts or
>> >> foie gras), whether you can hand out plastic straws.  The idea that a
>> >> business is free to do whatever it wants, free of government
>> regulation, is kind of divorced from reality.
>> >>
>> >> I don't necessarily agree with the way any level of government is
>> >> handling this, but not because of my rights and freedoms.
>> >>
>> >> -Original Message-
>> >> From: AF  On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
>> >> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
>> >> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones
>> >> 
>> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
>> >>
>> >> To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public"
>> >> do you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> AF mailing list
>> >> AF@af.afmug.com
>> >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Steve Jones]

I love liver, liver and onions, liverwurst, chicken livers, I'd try foie
gras, both to try the taste and the comfort it gives me knowing an animal
rights creeps head is exploding

On Sun, May 10, 2020, 4:33 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> I hate liver but have been known to eat liver sausage.  Oscar Meyer.  On
> Ritz crackers.  With or without a slice of cheddar cheese.
>
> Also excellent for getting dogs to take pills.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 4:19 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
>
> I tried it in Monte Carlo.  Tasted like Underwood Deviled Ham mixed with
> margarine.  No liver taste at all.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On May 10, 2020, at 2:37 PM, Bill Prince  wrote:
> >
> > I would boycott any restaurant that served foie gras simply because I
> hate liver, and duck/goose live is just as disgusting.
> >
> > bp
> > 
> >
> >> On 5/10/2020 12:26 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
> >> I heard on the radio a restaurant owner in downstate Illinois opened
> >> to a full sit-down crowd, citing his rights as an American.  He
> >> apparently forgot that restaurants are already subject to lots of
> >> rules, and the county health department can pull his health permit.
> >> Heck, they regulate how big your sign can be, what hours you can be
> >> open, maximum occupancy, whether you can serve liquor (or sprouts or
> >> foie gras), whether you can hand out plastic straws.  The idea that a
> >> business is free to do whatever it wants, free of government
> regulation, is kind of divorced from reality.
> >>
> >> I don't necessarily agree with the way any level of government is
> >> handling this, but not because of my rights and freedoms.
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: AF  On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
> >> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
> >> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones
> >> 
> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
> >>
> >> To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public"
> >> do you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?
> >>
> >> --
> >> AF mailing list
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> >>
> >>
> >>
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Re: [AFMUG] food banks

[Steve Jones]

There's an article about these specific images. They're talen with a lens
in a direction that makes it look like more people are there.
This is a direct result of state governors not doing their job. Ours
finally admitted that unemployment is backlogged.
You cant get a check, you cant go to the store.

Food banks are overflowing with food right now. My mom's is to the point
she's bringing home tons of spoilage to can and dehydrate. She said they
cant get enough people in there to eat it. The feds are dumping food into
them like never before. Its crazy

On Sun, May 10, 2020, 2:30 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:

> The state government of Utah has mobilized many state agencies to move
> food and household supplies to those that need it.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On May 10, 2020, at 1:12 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> 
>
> I found the photos in this article disquieting.  Many of us are in the
> business of selling a hot commodity and our businesses and personal income
> are intact, at least for now.  Maybe consider writing a check to your local
> food bank, or volunteering.
>
>
>
> Interesting the first photo is from Utah, which is famous for taking care
> of its own, not true everywhere.
>
>
>
> https://www.vox.com/2020/5/9/21251895/food-banks-lines-pandemic
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT...yum yum

[Steve Jones]

I've accepted the fact that I'm back eating jalapenos. I'm gonna dive them
and keep them in a jar with a little vinegar
We made taco bowls, I wont post a pic, cause I'll probably be told they
arent tacos. Bet they were good. Daughter wanted guacamole, I ate some,
tastes like veggie urine

On Sun, May 10, 2020, 5:54 PM Jaime Solorza 
wrote:

> Jalapenos torreados, cebolla y carne asada
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Re: [AFMUG] OT...yum yum

[Jaime Solorza]

Don't put Jalapenos in vinegar!! These were cooked in soy sauce and a bit
of Worcestershire sauce.
Remove the veins and seeds if they are too hot for you.
Guacamole is ruined by most who make it...the stuff they sell with Tostidos
IS NOT guacamoleit's awful...

On Sun, May 10, 2020, 5:45 PM Steve Jones  wrote:

> I've accepted the fact that I'm back eating jalapenos. I'm gonna dive them
> and keep them in a jar with a little vinegar
> We made taco bowls, I wont post a pic, cause I'll probably be told they
> arent tacos. Bet they were good. Daughter wanted guacamole, I ate some,
> tastes like veggie urine
>
> On Sun, May 10, 2020, 5:54 PM Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
>> Jalapenos torreados, cebolla y carne asada
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Re: [AFMUG] OT...yum yum

[Bill Prince]

  
  
We do guac in the simplest way possible. Avocado, onion, tomato,
  cilantro if it's fresh, and some spices.


bp



On 5/10/2020 5:32 PM, Jaime Solorza
  wrote:


  
  Don't put Jalapenos in vinegar!! These were cooked
in soy sauce and a bit of Worcestershire sauce. 
Remove the veins and seeds if they are too hot
  for you.
Guacamole is ruined by most who make it...the
  stuff they sell with Tostidos IS NOT guacamoleit's
  awful...
  
  
  
On Sun, May 10, 2020, 5:45 PM
  Steve Jones 
  wrote:


  I've accepted the fact that I'm back eating
jalapenos. I'm gonna dive them and keep them in a jar with a
little vinegar 
We made taco bowls, I wont post a pic, cause
  I'll probably be told they arent tacos. Bet they were
  good. Daughter wanted guacamole, I ate some, tastes like
  veggie urine
  
  
  
On Sun, May 10, 2020, 5:54
  PM Jaime Solorza 
  wrote:


  Jalapenos torreados, cebolla y carne asada
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Re: [AFMUG] OT...yum yum

[Chuck McCown]

To that I add a bit of lemon or lime.  Preferably lime.  And a bit of salt.

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 10, 2020, at 6:40 PM, Bill Prince  wrote:
> 
> 
> We do guac in the simplest way possible. Avocado, onion, tomato, cilantro if 
> it's fresh, and some spices.
> 
> 
> 
> bp
> 
> 
> On 5/10/2020 5:32 PM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>> Don't put Jalapenos in vinegar!! These were cooked in soy sauce and a bit of 
>> Worcestershire sauce. 
>> Remove the veins and seeds if they are too hot for you.
>> Guacamole is ruined by most who make it...the stuff they sell with Tostidos 
>> IS NOT guacamoleit's awful...
>> 
>> On Sun, May 10, 2020, 5:45 PM Steve Jones  wrote:
>>> I've accepted the fact that I'm back eating jalapenos. I'm gonna dive them 
>>> and keep them in a jar with a little vinegar 
>>> We made taco bowls, I wont post a pic, cause I'll probably be told they 
>>> arent tacos. Bet they were good. Daughter wanted guacamole, I ate some, 
>>> tastes like veggie urine
>>> 
>>> On Sun, May 10, 2020, 5:54 PM Jaime Solorza  
>>> wrote:
 Jalapenos torreados, cebolla y carne asada
 -- 
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] OT...yum yum

[Jaime Solorza]

Avocados ,salt,  pepper, lil garlic,  Onion. Tomato, jalapeños ...pinch of
lime...not lemon

On Sun, May 10, 2020, 7:25 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:

> To that I add a bit of lemon or lime.  Preferably lime.  And a bit of salt.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On May 10, 2020, at 6:40 PM, Bill Prince  wrote:
>
> 
>
> We do guac in the simplest way possible. Avocado, onion, tomato, cilantro
> if it's fresh, and some spices.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
>
> On 5/10/2020 5:32 PM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>
> Don't put Jalapenos in vinegar!! These were cooked in soy sauce and a bit
> of Worcestershire sauce.
> Remove the veins and seeds if they are too hot for you.
> Guacamole is ruined by most who make it...the stuff they sell with
> Tostidos IS NOT guacamoleit's awful...
>
> On Sun, May 10, 2020, 5:45 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> I've accepted the fact that I'm back eating jalapenos. I'm gonna dive
>> them and keep them in a jar with a little vinegar
>> We made taco bowls, I wont post a pic, cause I'll probably be told they
>> arent tacos. Bet they were good. Daughter wanted guacamole, I ate some,
>> tastes like veggie urine
>>
>> On Sun, May 10, 2020, 5:54 PM Jaime Solorza 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Jalapenos torreados, cebolla y carne asada
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Re: [AFMUG] OT...yum yum

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Oh yeah. Lime & garlic. 

I would love jalapeno, but my sweetie does not. Heck, if I were
  the only one eating, I would throw in a habanero.


bp



On 5/10/2020 6:48 PM, Jaime Solorza
  wrote:


  
  Avocados ,salt,  pepper, lil garlic,  Onion.
Tomato, jalapeños ...pinch of lime...not lemon
  
  
On Sun, May 10, 2020, 7:25 PM
  Chuck McCown  wrote:


  To that I add a bit of lemon or lime. 
Preferably lime.  And a bit of salt.

Sent from my iPhone

  On May 10, 2020, at 6:40 PM, Bill
Prince 
wrote:

  


  
We do guac in the simplest way possible. Avocado,
  onion, tomato, cilantro if it's fresh, and some
  spices.


bp



On 5/10/2020 5:32 PM, Jaime Solorza wrote:


  Don't put Jalapenos in vinegar!! These
were cooked in soy sauce and a bit of Worcestershire
sauce. 
Remove the veins and seeds if they
  are too hot for you.
Guacamole is ruined by most who make
  it...the stuff they sell with Tostidos IS NOT
  guacamoleit's awful...
  
  
  
On Sun, May 10,
  2020, 5:45 PM Steve Jones 
  wrote:


  I've accepted the fact that I'm
back eating jalapenos. I'm gonna dive them and
keep them in a jar with a little vinegar 
We made taco bowls, I wont post
  a pic, cause I'll probably be told they arent
  tacos. Bet they were good. Daughter wanted
  guacamole, I ate some, tastes like veggie
  urine
  
  
  
On Sun, May
  10, 2020, 5:54 PM Jaime Solorza 
  wrote:


  Jalapenos torreados, cebolla y
carne asada
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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[James Howard]

There are 2 separate issues. Having the government tell everyone they must wear 
a mask is one thing.  A business requiring customers wear a mask to enter their 
store is another.  The second actually correlates to your example and is 
certainly the right of any business to put certain requirements on using their 
facility (within lawful limits of course).  If people don't want to abide by 
their requirements, they are free to go somewhere else or stay home if no one 
will let them in their place of business.

On the other hand, I assume that it will eventually come before the Supreme 
Court to decide if it is a violation of some "right" or other to be told that 
everyone is required to wear a mask in public.


From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" do
you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?

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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Chuck McCown]

Only for ugly people.

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 10, 2020, at 7:59 PM, James Howard  wrote:
> 
> 
> There are 2 separate issues. Having the government tell everyone they must 
> wear a mask is one thing.  A business requiring customers wear a mask to 
> enter their store is another.  The second actually correlates to your example 
> and is certainly the right of any business to put certain requirements on 
> using their facility (within lawful limits of course).  If people don’t want 
> to abide by their requirements, they are free to go somewhere else or stay 
> home if no one will let them in their place of business.
>  
> On the other hand, I assume that it will eventually come before the Supreme 
> Court to decide if it is a violation of some “right” or other to be told that 
> everyone is required to wear a mask in public.
>  
>  
> From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones 
> 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
>  
> To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" do 
> you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?
> 
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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Matt Hoppes]

And so it begins. 


https://www.foxbusiness.com/money/coronavirus-jbs-meat-plant-pennsylvania-death-lawsuit



> On May 10, 2020, at 10:43 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
> 
> Only for ugly people.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>>> On May 10, 2020, at 7:59 PM, James Howard  wrote:
>>> 
>> 
>> There are 2 separate issues. Having the government tell everyone they must 
>> wear a mask is one thing.  A business requiring customers wear a mask to 
>> enter their store is another.  The second actually correlates to your 
>> example and is certainly the right of any business to put certain 
>> requirements on using their facility (within lawful limits of course).  If 
>> people don’t want to abide by their requirements, they are free to go 
>> somewhere else or stay home if no one will let them in their place of 
>> business.
>>  
>> On the other hand, I assume that it will eventually come before the Supreme 
>> Court to decide if it is a violation of some “right” or other to be told 
>> that everyone is required to wear a mask in public.
>>  
>>  
>> From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
>> Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones 
>> 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
>>  
>> To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" do 
>> you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?
>> 
>> -- 
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>> From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Ken Hohhof]

A 70 year old was working at a slaughterhouse?

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 9:50 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

 

And so it begins. 

 

 

https://www.foxbusiness.com/money/coronavirus-jbs-meat-plant-pennsylvania-death-lawsuit

 

 





On May 10, 2020, at 10:43 PM, Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com> > wrote:

Only for ugly people.

Sent from my iPhone





On May 10, 2020, at 7:59 PM, James Howard mailto:ja...@litewire.net> > wrote:

 

There are 2 separate issues. Having the government tell everyone they must wear 
a mask is one thing.  A business requiring customers wear a mask to enter their 
store is another.  The second actually correlates to your example and is 
certainly the right of any business to put certain requirements on using their 
facility (within lawful limits of course).  If people don’t want to abide by 
their requirements, they are free to go somewhere else or stay home if no one 
will let them in their place of business.

 

On the other hand, I assume that it will eventually come before the Supreme 
Court to decide if it is a violation of some “right” or other to be told that 
everyone is required to wear a mask in public.

 

 

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> 
>; Steve Jones mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

 

To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" do 
you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?

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From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com  




You received this message because the domain afmug.com is on your allow list.

 

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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[James Howard]

Benjamin was Chief Steward of Local 1776, a chapter of the United Food and 
Commercial Workers Union.



From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 10:05 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

A 70 year old was working at a slaughterhouse?

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Matt Hoppes
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 9:50 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

And so it begins.


https://www.foxbusiness.com/money/coronavirus-jbs-meat-plant-pennsylvania-death-lawsuit



On May 10, 2020, at 10:43 PM, Chuck McCown 
mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote:
Only for ugly people.
Sent from my iPhone

On May 10, 2020, at 7:59 PM, James Howard 
mailto:ja...@litewire.net>> wrote:

There are 2 separate issues. Having the government tell everyone they must wear 
a mask is one thing.  A business requiring customers wear a mask to enter their 
store is another.  The second actually correlates to your example and is 
certainly the right of any business to put certain requirements on using their 
facility (within lawful limits of course).  If people don’t want to abide by 
their requirements, they are free to go somewhere else or stay home if no one 
will let them in their place of business.

On the other hand, I assume that it will eventually come before the Supreme 
Court to decide if it is a violation of some “right” or other to be told that 
everyone is required to wear a mask in public.


From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>; 
Steve Jones mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" do
you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?

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From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com





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You received this message because the domain afmug.com is on your allow list.



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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Ken Hohhof]

I guess we’ll go to live markets like in China, where you take it home and kill 
it yourself.  Or maybe “plant meat”.  Oh, wait, a greenhouse in upstate New 
York is a hotspot.

https://nypost.com/2020/05/06/new-york-greenhouse-emerges-as-coronavirus-hotspot/

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of James Howard
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 10:18 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

 

Benjamin was Chief Steward of Local 1776, a chapter of the United Food and 
Commercial Workers Union.

 

 

 

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 10:05 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

 

A 70 year old was working at a slaughterhouse?

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 9:50 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

 

And so it begins. 

 

 

https://www.foxbusiness.com/money/coronavirus-jbs-meat-plant-pennsylvania-death-lawsuit

 

 

 

On May 10, 2020, at 10:43 PM, Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com> > wrote:

Only for ugly people.

Sent from my iPhone

 

On May 10, 2020, at 7:59 PM, James Howard mailto:ja...@litewire.net> > wrote:

 

There are 2 separate issues. Having the government tell everyone they must wear 
a mask is one thing.  A business requiring customers wear a mask to enter their 
store is another.  The second actually correlates to your example and is 
certainly the right of any business to put certain requirements on using their 
facility (within lawful limits of course).  If people don’t want to abide by 
their requirements, they are free to go somewhere else or stay home if no one 
will let them in their place of business.

 

On the other hand, I assume that it will eventually come before the Supreme 
Court to decide if it is a violation of some “right” or other to be told that 
everyone is required to wear a mask in public.

 

 

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> 
>; Steve Jones mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

 

To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" do 
you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?

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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Robert]

The muslems must be loving this.  After all the uproar over keeping the 
womens faces covered...


On 5/10/20 7:43 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Only for ugly people.

Sent from my iPhone


On May 10, 2020, at 7:59 PM, James Howard  wrote:



There are 2 separate issues. Having the government tell everyone they 
must wear a mask is one thing.  A business requiring customers wear a 
mask to enter their store is another.  The second actually correlates 
to your example and is certainly the right of any business to put 
certain requirements on using their facility (within lawful limits of 
course).  If people don’t want to abide by their requirements, they 
are free to go somewhere else or stay home if no one will let them in 
their place of business.


On the other hand, I assume that it will eventually come before the 
Supreme Court to decide if it is a violation of some “right” or other 
to be told that everyone is required to wear a mask in public.


*From:*AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Matt Hoppes
*Sent:* Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones 


*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" do
you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?

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http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com



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From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com 



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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[Robert]

I was just watching a youtube about the "atomic man" who was doing 
nuclear fuel extractions at 64 for $16k/year.  Yeah our system rocks!


On 5/10/20 8:04 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:


A 70 year old was working at a slaughterhouse?

*From:*AF  *On Behalf Of *Matt Hoppes
*Sent:* Sunday, May 10, 2020 9:50 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

And so it begins.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/money/coronavirus-jbs-meat-plant-pennsylvania-death-lawsuit



On May 10, 2020, at 10:43 PM, Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote:

Only for ugly people.

Sent from my iPhone



On May 10, 2020, at 7:59 PM, James Howard mailto:ja...@litewire.net>> wrote:



There are 2 separate issues. Having the government tell
everyone they must wear a mask is one thing.  A business
requiring customers wear a mask to enter their store is
another.  The second actually correlates to your example and
is certainly the right of any business to put certain
requirements on using their facility (within lawful limits of
course).  If people don’t want to abide by their requirements,
they are free to go somewhere else or stay home if no one will
let them in their place of business.

On the other hand, I assume that it will eventually come
before the Supreme Court to decide if it is a violation of
some “right” or other to be told that everyone is required to
wear a mask in public.

*From:*AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Matt
Hoppes
*Sent:* Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>; Steve Jones
mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in
public" do
you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?

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Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability

[justsumname .]

That lawsuit is the kind of stuff that makes me say things  like:   "we are
too stupid to have a country".
I am dreading the court order which will come from that.
No one is responsible for themselves; everyone is responsible for everyone
else.

Many years ago I decided that the most politically correct way to live and
stay safe was to stay the hell away from 'everyone', especially the govt.
Fortunately, I have largely been able to do it that way.   But that kind of
issue has the potential to suck us all into the same black hole.



On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 10:50 PM Matt Hoppes <
mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net> wrote:

> And so it begins.
>
>
>
> https://www.foxbusiness.com/money/coronavirus-jbs-meat-plant-pennsylvania-death-lawsuit
>
>
>
> On May 10, 2020, at 10:43 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
>
> Only for ugly people.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On May 10, 2020, at 7:59 PM, James Howard  wrote:
>
> 
>
> There are 2 separate issues. Having the government tell everyone they must
> wear a mask is one thing.  A business requiring customers wear a mask to
> enter their store is another.  The second actually correlates to your
> example and is certainly the right of any business to put certain
> requirements on using their facility (within lawful limits of course).  If
> people don’t want to abide by their requirements, they are free to go
> somewhere else or stay home if no one will let them in their place of
> business.
>
>
>
> On the other hand, I assume that it will eventually come before the
> Supreme Court to decide if it is a violation of some “right” or other to be
> told that everyone is required to wear a mask in public.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Matt Hoppes
> *Sent:* Sunday, May 10, 2020 1:53 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group ; Steve Jones <
> thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] COVID liability
>
>
>
> To those saying "why should I have to wear a mask when in public" do
> you also complain about "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service"?
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
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> To: ja...@litewire.net
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