> Joel, use whatever you like. That's what I do. I am not trying to make > you use a threadless fork, after all.
Well, I do use a threadless fork on one of my bikes ... I thought the debate here is whether Riv should start offering a threadless option. In my opinion, it would be more a change for change sake and not necessarily enhance what Rivendell is doing at present. >Lots of people have managed to work out the aesthetics somehow. In my opinion anyway, the only solution that works from an aesthetic point of view is to get a custom threadless stem made up that does not need spacers. Of course the lack of adjustability means you need to know what height you want in advance, which sort of takes out the threadless flexibility argument. > Also, there is nothing "ratty" about my guest bike. It's > actually a pretty nice ride, even if the frame is 12 years old. I did not mean to denigrate your GT. Sorry if it came out that way. But I am sure you will agree your Atlantis is the more attractive bike. > To say threadless stems are a solution in search of a problem is nonsense. I > don't care who said it. Whoever it was probably hates mountain bikes, > a common affliction among roadies. The quote is attributed to Richard Sachs. I do not know what his feelings are about mountain bikes. He makes cross bikes and sponsors a cross team, so he cannot be considered a pure roadie. More to the point, mountain bikes pre-date the shift to threadless stems. The move to threadless came when most bike manufacturing moved to the large Taiwan (couple in China now) factories. As the move coincided with the rise in mountain bike popularity, threadless became associated with mountain bikes. With a few exceptions - Riv notable amoung them - most road bikes today are threadless as well. Somewhat off topic, but when bike production moved to the big overseas factories you also saw the rise in the flat bar. Just as the threadless stems require you to buy top caps and spacers, to get the flat bars to work, most riders wind up buying extensions or other add ons to make the bars comfortable to use. Bullhorn and H-Bars are more elegant products for the mtb, but also more expensive to make. On Dec 24, 8:58 am, Atlantean <softlysoftlycatcheemon...@gmail.com> wrote: > Joel, use whatever you like. That's what I do. I am not trying to make > you use a threadless fork, after all. Lots of people have managed to > work out the aesthetics somehow. For me the most important issue is > flex, and it will not go away no matter how lovely Nitto quill stems > may be. Also, there is nothing "ratty" about my guest bike. It's > actually a pretty nice ride, even if the frame is 12 years old. > > Steve, I explained the limitations in my previous post. Possibly not > very clearly. The Atlantis has an extra tall steer tube, accommodated > by some spacers. I am glad I did not cut the fork, because I found > handlebar bliss on my Atlantis with an old Bridgestone Moustache bar > that takes V brake levers (rare item that should not be), and a > Periscopa stem. That extra tall steer tube helps keep the flex to a > tolerable level, at least on my "comfort bike." My point was that it > would have been very easy to try the lowest position afforded by a 17 > degree stem without cutting anything. This is very common. To say > threadless stems are a solution in search of a problem is nonsense. I > don't care who said it. Whoever it was probably hates mountain bikes, > a common affliction among roadies. > > On Dec 24, 7:24 am, JoelMatthews <joelmatth...@mac.com> wrote: > > > > > > That whole process can get pretty fiddly, but then so can unwrapping > > > bars and removing levers in order to try a different stem. With modern > > > mountain bike stems, and increasingly common road setups, it's easy to > > > swap between stems. > > > Fiddly and an aesthetic nightmare. Most (all? - not sure) headset > > makers do not make stems and vice versa. My custom Oswald with > > threadless fork has a Ti King headset. Before I had a custom stem > > made, it had a silver Thomson stem. King does not make Ti spacers. > > So I wound up using the Thomson spacers which did not match the > > headset. Not a complete aesthetic nightmare, but not optimal. It > > gets even worse if you use stems and headsets by other manufacturers > > who do not make spacers. You wind up with three different colors in > > one of the more prominent parts of the bike. > > > Not a problem if the bike is a ratty old GT. Looks are certainly an > > issue when you fork out the big bucks for a Rivendell, Velo-Orange or > > custom steel bike. As a result, most people who buy these bikes are > > very grateful Nitto continues to make threaded stems with modern > > alloys and to high tolerances possible with the new forging machinery. > > > > It's a very simple matter to swap stems on that bike, and it > > > gets done often. It has air springs on each end, so at the most we > > > swap out saddles, stems, pedals and adjust the air pressure and it's > > > good to go. This is a very common practice. > > > Seems to me you could accomplish the same just as well by adjusting a > > threaded stem up or down and simply rotating the angle of the bars to > > meet the riders' preferences. > > > If you are changing the bars as well as the stem, the open face of > > most threadless stems speeds the task somewhat. Unless the bike is > > fixed gear, however, it really is not so easy to swap bars. Brake > > levers are going to be in different positions on the bars, meaning at > > best you are going to have extra brake cable to deal with. If you are > > switching from Albatross to drops, you most likely will have to > > replace the brake cable as the existing cable will not be long enough, > > and, depending on the levers, may not use the same cable end. And > > that is assuming you are using non-aero levers that do not route the > > cable under the tape. > > > So again, it seems to me we are back to a tie in usefullness between > > the two. I concur that there are many beautiful custom threadless > > stems. As I have said multiple times here, the custom threadless > > Jonnycycles made for my Oswald is very lovely. When it comes to off > > the shelf, however, Nitto is a very special product at a price that is > > hard to beat. GP has had a tight relationship with Nitto since the > > Bridgestone era. Under the circumstances, I think his decision to > > stay with threadless makes a lot of sense. > > > On Dec 24, 12:06 am, Atlantean <softlysoftlycatcheemon...@gmail.com> > > wrote: > > > > I'm not a fan of the 7 shaped stem, and I really really don't like the > > > looks of track stems. A track stem and an Albatross bar? I don't think > > > so. > > > > The Atlantis comes with 15mm of spacers (I think) under the top nut. I > > > couild have shortened the steer tube up by that much and that might > > > have lowered the Albatross bar enough, but since the stem I was using > > > (an old Cinelli 13cm with a home brewed shim) was far from ideal, I > > > was not willing to make such a committment for an experiment. Bike > > > shop mechanics cut steer tubes of all description routinely, by the > > > way. Anyway, if that same frame had come with a threadless fork, it > > > would have been very easy to try the lowest postion available before > > > cutting the fork. People do this all the time with mountain bike > > > builds. Yes, it looks pretty funny with spacers on top of the stem, > > > but once the position is sorted out after a few rides, it's easy to > > > cut the steer tube to the proper length. There is nothing difficult > > > about shuffling spacers around, either. You can't get them backwards > > > or upside down. They come in many different lengths, too, so once the > > > proper dimension is determined, it is possible to use one spacer of > > > the proper length in most cases. That looks pretty tidy. > > > > That whole process can get pretty fiddly, but then so can unwrapping > > > bars and removing levers in order to try a different stem. With modern > > > mountain bike stems, and increasingly common road setups, it's easy to > > > swap between stems. Takes a couple of minutes. We have a guest bike, > > > an old GT dually, that several people ride over the course of a > > > season. It's a very simple matter to swap stems on that bike, and it > > > gets done often. It has air springs on each end, so at the most we > > > swap out saddles, stems, pedals and adjust the air pressure and it's > > > good to go. This is a very common practice. > > > > On Dec 23, 10:07 pm, John McMurry <johnmcmu...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > On Dec 23, 8:18 pm, Atlantean <softlysoftlycatcheemon...@gmail.com> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > I removed an Albatross bar from my Atlantis even though I liked it a > > > > > lot, simply because I could not get it low enough! > > > > > A stem like this stem ought to help that situation: > > > > >http://www.businesscycles.com/tstem-nitto.htm > > > > > > Imagine that! It > > > > > would have been easy with a threadless fork. > > > > > How would've it been easier to lower the bars with a threadless fork? > > > > > > Actually, I have > > > > > considered getting a custom fork for that bike, and painting it to > > > > > match the head tube. > > > > > That stem, while not exactly cheap, is a whole lot cheaper than a > > > > custom fork, if the purpose is to get the bars low. > > > > > Though, if that's the purpose, I bet there's a better bar for your > > > > ride. > > > > > John McMurry > > > > Burlington, VT- Hide quoted text - > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. 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