I'm not sure what value of Recipients is really referring to - but I think this is kind of the question that needs to be asked. Should the administrator of a sending server (the IP address) be responsible for removing addresses from a mailing list? Probably. But in order for the administrator of the sending server to know about this, reports are going to have to come to the administrator of the sending server based on it's IP address.
I'm an administrator of a mail server (many mail servers). I (personally) don't really send out emails through these servers. We sell a service to customers that allows them to use the server to send out emails. It's those customers that are sending out mailing lists and/or questionable marketing messages, etc. When those customers send messages to Yahoo or any other email service ... they really don't care if the individual recipient at Yahoo or whoever flags that message as spam. Is this wrong? Absolutely! But this is the disconnect from reality that I think a lot of Mailops seem to discount. We've reached a point in society where individuals can't read and can't be expected to take the 90 seconds it takes to read and understand something, they want to be spoon fed information. ... If an individual in the general public gets a feedback loop report about a message being spam... they're not going to read it... they're not going to take the time to understand it... they're just going to keep sending out to their list just ignoring that report Now, eventually, Yahoo or whatever mail service, will say that the mail server that I'm an administrator to has sent them too much spam and they start to block/blacklist/throttle mail from the server. I'm left out in the cold because 1) I'm not the one sending out the mailing list messages 2) I have no way of getting feedback loop messages from Yahoo or whatever mail service for this sending IP 3) there's a severe lack of ways to get in touch with a human person at Yahoo or whatever mail service to discuss the situation. Some people seem to assume that 1 IP address = 1 domain sending out mail = 1 person responsible for managing that. And that is just simply not true. 1 IP address may have 1000s of domains sending out emails, which may refer to 1000s of different individuals. The common denominator is the sending IP address and that's why abuse reports, feedback loops, and all discussion about the quality/quantity of mail coming from that IP address needs to refer to the individual that is managing the SMTP service at that IP address. If a service is going to block/blacklist/throttle messages by the sending IP, then what good does it do to base feedback loops and spam reports on a domain basis? A sending IP could have 1000 domains sending from it and only 1 of those domains is sending spam or sending to a list that is being flagged as spam, but the recipient server isn't going to block based on domain, it's going to block based on IP. On Thu, Jan 13, 2022 at 4:23 PM Grant Taylor via mailop <mailop@mailop.org> wrote: > On 1/13/22 1:00 PM, Scott Mutter via mailop wrote: > > The person sending out the mails or mailing list often doesn't care if > > their recipients are flagging messages as spam or if their messages are > > being treated as spam or unsolicited. > > Does this imply that the person sending out the mails to the mailing > list cares more about the message going to $RECIPIENTS and less about > the actual value of $RECIPIENTS? Sort of implying that the SMTP server > operators have some leeway to remove / unsubscribe a few specific > recipients from the larger $RECIPIENTS list in the spirit of protecting > the larger overall system operation and flow? > > > > -- > Grant. . . . > unix || die > > _______________________________________________ > mailop mailing list > mailop@mailop.org > https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop >
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