You can VO+F2 twice go go to the window chooser menu, select "force quick applications," and arrow over to close.
On Jul 5, 2012, at 12:45 PM, Blinkin wrote: > Here is something I want fixed. > Every now and again when I use the Force Quit Application thing the > window will stay open after it closes the application. > I can't command tab to the screen and can't interact with it at all but > my wife will say it is covering my screen. > Pretty annoying. > On Jul 4, 2012, at 10:23 PM, Harry Hogue wrote: > >> jesús, this is a fascinating discussion. Personally, I use Fred on a daily >> basis for reading in English, and Paulina when reading in Spanish. Alex is >> okay, but I prefer a responsive Voice, and I find that I'm able to move >> about the Mac more quickly using Fred. I have tried Javier for Spanish, but >> find him less understandable. >> >> On Jul 4, 2012, at 6:49 AM, Jesus Garcia wrote: >> >>> Same here with regards to male voices rather than female, though I have no >>> major issues with Samantha. Can someone post how to download and install the >>> realspeak voices for the mac? >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Daniel McGee >>> Sent: Wednesday, July 04, 2012 08:26 >>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>> Subject: Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed or >>> squashed in Mountain Lion? >>> >>> Interesting, because I'm the opposite. I would rather use eloquence and I >>> would rather use male voices than female. I guess it all comes down to >>> personal taste in the end. >>> >>> Daniel >>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 14:47, Missy Hoppe wrote: >>> >>>> While I agree 100 percent that Eloquence is the only speech that is >>>> efficient enough to actually get things done with, I've never been >>>> particularly fond of it. Not sure that makes sense given that I've >>>> used Glen more or less exclusively for the past >>>> 12 years or so, but on the whole, I think Eloquence is seriously >>>> over-rated. True, it's the only thing I use on the PC side, but that's >>>> out of necessity, not because I find it pleasant or anything. I don't >>>> use the RealSpeak voices on the mac either, though. I even bought the >>>> acapella voices, but still find myself only using Alex as a general >>>> rule. So, while I can see both sides of the coin on the eloquence >>>> thing, it's nothing I'd get all excited about if Apple ever incorporated >>> it. In most cases, Alex is responsive enough for my needs on the mac. I'd >>> love to see a female equivelent of Alex, though. Alice, perhaps? It's just >>> that when it comes to those higher quality voices, I find the female ones >>> slightly easier to understand in most cases. >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Daniel McGee >>>> Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 9:39 AM >>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>>> Subject: Re: what Voiceover bugs people want or are hoping will be fixed >>> or squashed in Mountain Lion? >>>> >>>> eloquence 100% is for me. If I had this, then I wouldn't be using >>>> windows anymore there's something about the voice that I can listen to >>>> it and I don't get tired of it. I have a hearing impairment and find >>>> it is more clear understandable in words than these silly nuance >>>> voices. I don't want that to be offending to anyone who uses the nuance >>> real speak voices but for me, I just don't understand them clearly, to slow >>> no matter how much I speed them up I can't understand them when they are >>> really fast anyway and lastly too slow even when I can follow them. >>>> Ohand caps lock gets my vote too. >>>> If the day comes where Apple have eloquence added to the list of VO >>>> voices, will be the day where I differently upgrade my OS! >>>> >>>> How do others feel about eloquence being added? >>>> You got me started on this one! LOL >>>> >>>> Daniel >>>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 12:47, Chris Moore wrote: >>>> >>>>> I guess that makes sense. I suppose that is the charm of VO, it can be >>> used in so many different ways. >>>>> >>>>> If I am using my iMac, then I tend to use the numeric keypad., and if >>>>> I am using my iOS devices I use quick nav via a >>>> bluetooth keyboard, and when using my Macbook I use the track pad. >>>>> >>>>> Caps lock gets my vote too then if anyone at Apple is listening. >>>>> >>>>> HOw about built in OCR anyone? or would anyone like to see eloquence >>> added to the voice list too? >>>>> >>>>> Chris >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 12:18, Garth Humphreys wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I prefer not to have to take my fingers off the home keys. It is not >>>>>> so much with the arrow keys that I would want to use >>>> the caps lock key but with the other vo commands. I can't help think >>>> that the caps lock key is a complete waste of prime keyboard >>>> real-estate, if you know what I mean. It is much more efficient to my >>>> way of thinking to just move your little finger to the caps lock key as >>> compared to either removing your left or right hand from it's home keys to >>> press the current VO modifiers. >>>>>> >>>>>> Garth >>>>>> iblindtech.com >>>>>> >>>>>> On 03/07/2012, at 8:39 PM, Chris Moore wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Well with any luck Apple may head in this direction, as they appear >>>>>>> to have got the message with iOS 6 that zoom and >>>> voice over at the same time would be beneficial. If it was improved >>>> and there were better contrast colour schemes, I may consider using it >>>> myself. I sometimes fire up ZoomText on my work PC when using JAWS to >>> sometimes find that button within a web page that JAWS can't see or a dialog >>> window that JAWS refuses to read. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> So where would you see using the caps lock over using quick nav? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Chris >>>>>>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 10:31, Garth Humphreys wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> There are a few bugs when zoomed to high levels, i.e., more than >>>>>>>> 14X or so. If you have VO running and zoom set to >>>> follow the keyboard focus you will find that the command tab to switch >>>> between apps becomes unreliable and navigating the menu bar with the >>>> arrow keys is also unreliable. Also I don't like the way it tracks and >>>> works with reading text. I'd like better colour options and keyboard >>>> commands to adjust them, or at least for the invert brightness >>>> keyboard command not to conflict with a Voice Over command. You would >>>> think that Apple would be able to sort out keyboard command conflicts >>> between two of their own accessibility utilities. I am sure there are work >>> arounds for some of these but a work around isn't the same as fixing the >>> problem. For example the menu navigation issue I mentioned does not occur if >>> you use swipes on the trackpad with trackpad commander to navigate the menu. >>> It only happens with the arrow keys - strange but there you are. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> If I used it regularly I would probably come across more of the >>>>>>>> issues. It really doesn't seem to me that apple intended >>>> the two utilities to work together or at least that this was an edge >>>> case. It would seem to me that they expected people to use either option >>> exclusively and if so, they are probably right. Most people probably do use >>> one or the other. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I'd also love to see the safari busy issue buried deep. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The addition of the ability to set the caps lock key to act as the VO >>> modifier would also be great. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Garth >>>>>>>> iblindtech.com >>>>>>>> On 03/07/2012, at 6:48 PM, Chris Moore wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> What improvements would you like fixed in particular when it comes to >>> zoom? >>>>>>>>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 09:44, Garth Humphreys wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I'd love to see some improvements to the way VO works with Zoom >>>>>>>>>> and just some improvements to Zoom in general. I >>>> mostly don't use Zoom on my Mac but this only because it is so poor >>>> when compared to things like ZoomText in the windows world. It is >>>> probably great if you don't need to use Voice Over or if you only need a >>> little enlargement but it falls completely short for me. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Garth >>>>>>>>>> iblindtech.com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 03/07/2012, at 6:26 PM, Chris Moore wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Riccardo, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Actually that is what I was hinting at to be honest, as i feel >>>>>>>>>>> the method of selecting text within Safari is rather >>>> sloppy. You can also navigate by line within iOS, so hoped that >>>> feature would come across to OS X. Navigating by line is also useful >>>> when trying to read pages that have been styled into columns via CSS >>> instead of a table. This can be done in JAWS quite nicely. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Chris >>>>>>>>>>> On 3 Jul 2012, at 00:11, Ricardo Walker wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I doubt you will see the reading by line with the down arrow. >>>>>>>>>>>> That would radically change the way VO navigates the >>>> web, and I'm not sure it would be for the better. It would be selecting >>> text easier though. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Ricardo Walker >>>>>>>>>>>> rica...@appletothecore.info >>>>>>>>>>>> Twitter:@apple2thecore >>>>>>>>>>>> www.appletothecore.info >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 2, 2012, at 6:37 PM, Chris Moore >>> <apple.geek.ch...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hmmm I remember a while back putting a list of 15 >>>>>>>>>>>>> improvements. I can't remember them all now, so perhaps I >>>>>>>>>>>>> have >>>> just learnt to live without them. I did report them to Apple though as >>> bugs and feature enhancements. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> The VoiceOver busy is the biggest annoyance which is caused by >>> the pathetic slow buffering system voice over uses. >>>> So I would like to see that rewritten from the ground up. There are a >>>> few random performance bugs that happen now and then which require me to >>> switch voice over off then back on again. So overall performance could do >>> with being improved. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I would also like to know what web page I am looking at when >>>>>>>>>>>>> switching between tabs, being told that is an HTML >>>> page is not exactly helpful. I would also like to navigate line by >>>> line just by pressing the down arrow or up key. VO still needs a bit >>>> of work when reporting how many HMTL elements are on a web page, some >>> windows screen readers seem to find more tables and headings than VO, >>> especially in the buggy rotor. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I would like the ability to edit form fields in a PDF with >>>>>>>>>>>>> Preview, but I believe this is coming in the next >>>> Mountain Lion release (according to Apple's website). >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I would appreciate MIDI event editing in GarageBand, and a >>>>>>>>>>>>> huge update to iWork. There just is not enough >>>> accessible productive software on the Mac. There is more to using a Mac >>> than just Skype and Mail surely? >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Not sure if that bug still exists when using the real speak >>>>>>>>>>>>> voices where the pitch used to shift up and down >>>> randomly. I stopped using those voices as it became too annoying. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I would also like the ability to edit voice over's >>>>>>>>>>>>> dictionary. For example if you type third as in the number 3 >>>> followed by the letters r and d, you get 3rd (three road), surely this >>>> should be a third? So I think the ability to edit some of VO's >>>> assumptions would be nice, or maybe VO should grow up and become a tad >>> more intelligent. I would like more control over how VO reads out numbers >>> too. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Maybe developers should also be given the option to name what >>>>>>>>>>>>> VO calls an HTML area, as something else? For >>>> example when using adium the chat window is called an HTML area, am >>>> sure a chat window or conversation window would be more meaningful. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Last but not least, I find VO a bit slow when first entering the >>> iTunes store. The page takes a while to render. >>>> Well actually visually it does not, but VO seems to think it does. >>>> Actually come to mention it when VO says something is busy, a sighted >>> person can still move the mouse and perform the action they require, it is >>> just VO's buffer which is busy. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I spotted another bug today too. When ordering a smart case >>>>>>>>>>>>> for my iPad, VO was unable to read out the colour >>>> options. When trying to select a colour, VO simply said "space radio >>>> button" for each of the 6 colours. The work around seemed to be >>>> select a colour, go back to the top of the screen and read out the >>>> description to see if the default green had changed. Or look in the >>> basket and hope to god you have not selected pink. I eventually performed >>> this task via the Apple Store app on my iPhone which performed perfectly. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Chris >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2 Jul 2012, at 19:16, Daniel McGee wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi all, a while ago on this list I saw someone mention that >>>>>>>>>>>>>> they would like so and so bug to be fixed in Mountain >>>> Lion. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would just really like to start a discussion on if there >>>>>>>>>>>>>> are not many enhancements to Voiceover in the next OS, >>>> then what bugs would you like fixed and hope Apple has done there job with >>> it. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'll go 1st. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> For me its safari. two things for me. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1. Now and then when I go back a page with CMD left bracket >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Voiceover doesn't announce my list of headings or >>>> links that I have set in VO utility. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2. continuing this previous page thing, because I don't >>>>>>>>>>>>>> always know when the page is fully loaded when going back, >>>> I get the lovely "Voiceover Busy!" Not! >>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is using Lion V7.4 and Safari 5.1.7 >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> So what are yours? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I hope this will become an interesting topic because I'm >>>>>>>>>>>>>> interested to see what people can come up with and I'm >>>> sure there will be some good ones! >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> So everyone, the dance floor is yours! LOL >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Daniel >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>> Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>> Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>>>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> 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