What you mention in terms of private and public communications. This is where a mailing list is good and the archive remains private and internal.
On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 2:40 PM, Israel <isr...@torios.org> wrote: > Hi all, > I just thought I'd throw in a few bits here. > I don't really care how you all want to do things in management, etc... > As long as, when it comes down to it, I can just do my own work with only > the customer's specific needs/design/etc.. as the constraints. > I think some private form of communication is essential for a business, as > well as public. > You all can set this up however is good an right. > > I would like for our communications not to be owned by a proprietary > company... I'd rather them be public than that (personal idealogical views). > But if you all need to use a proprietary company I will not leave, or get > upset at you. > We already use G+ which is owned by a company that is well known for data > mining (does anyone remember PRISM?). > > As for meetings... right now I have so very little time to devote to > meetings, and you always start one at times that are not good for me. > I have kids and cannot devote too much of my life to things away from > them, while I am with them. > Once this project is off the ground, I will be more involved. But as it > is, I do not need to be involved in the setup phase. > > I am just letting you all know that I intend to remain relatively quite, > but I am actually still around :) > > > > On 01/21/2015 11:25 PM, Jonathan Aquilina wrote: > > Weekends are best for me. early mornings and preferably on weekends to > meet and discuss. > > On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 2:20 AM, Emily Gonyer <emilyyr...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Tomorrow I'm mostly free aside from 10am-1pm (I'm -5GMT...), Friday >> we'll be visiting a museum, but I can check in on IRC/email; early >> Saturday I'm available but planning to go out in the evening - so up >> till ~4-4:30pm. Sunday I don't have any plans except to sleep in :p >> >> Emily >> >> On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 8:16 PM, Ali Linx (amjjawad) <amjja...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > >> > >> > On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 12:13 PM, Emily Gonyer <emilyyr...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> Ali, >> > >> > >> > Hi dear Emily, >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> I'm not going to pretend I have any idea as to why it was that Gustavo >> >> and/or Svetlana left, nor do I particularly care. >> > >> > >> > I highly respect your honesty. Thank you for speaking your mind >> directly. >> > >> >> >> >> I am still very >> >> interested in and excited about Kibo, and plan to continue to help >> >> however/whenever I can. >> > >> > >> > So kind and nice of you, many thanks :) >> > >> > >> >> >> >> I feel like we are going to be in need of >> >> another meeting with the remaining members present asap to discuss >> >> what we have, what we need, where we're going, etc. >> > >> > >> > I agree. I was about to ask for that but I wanted to prepare some >> positive >> > progress first :) >> > >> >> >> >> I'm fairly busy >> >> over the next few days but if I know ahead of time, I should be able >> >> to make time. >> > >> > >> > For me, my time is +11 GMT and you guys can contact me anytime. Whenever >> > you're free. However, what about the coming days? >> > >> > Fri? >> > Sat? >> > Sun? >> > >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> Emily >> > >> > >> > >> > Thank you! >> > >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 7:34 PM, Ali Linx (amjjawad) < >> amjja...@gmail.com> >> >> wrote: >> >> > @Phill: >> >> > I'm CC'ing you as per your request as discussed last night (your >> time). >> >> > >> >> > On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 2:15 AM, Jonathan Aquilina >> >> > <eagles051...@gmail.com> >> >> > wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> Hey Ali, >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > Hi Jonathan and everyone else, >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I want to put this out there as I have spoken to some people and >> they >> >> >> are >> >> >> getting a bit worn out with the lack of decisions being taken and >> only >> >> >> discussion. As the saying goes actions speak louder than words. >> That is >> >> >> in a >> >> >> way why I took the decision to speak to phil about the server. >> >> >> >> >> >> Again things are stuck in a loop of discussion and no action is >> >> >> happening. >> >> >> The people I spoke to are on the verge of leaving. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > The people you spoke to, with all due respect, are not being honest >> and >> >> > they're spreading more than one version of the story :) they tell you >> >> > something, they tell Phill different thing and they tell me something >> >> > else. >> >> > For you ALL to understand, I hate this childish behaviour. Grown up >> >> > people >> >> > should never do that. If you have a problem with someone or >> something, >> >> > bring >> >> > it to discussion and no need to come up with different version of the >> >> > story >> >> > and go public with it. >> >> > >> >> > Here is what happened: >> >> > Gustavo and Svetlana both joined Kibo as they were super interested. >> One >> >> > is >> >> > a business person (as he said) and the other is a community person >> (as >> >> > she >> >> > said). >> >> > >> >> > We were super fine and everything was okay. >> >> > >> >> > Over a disagreement and different opinion, they both left at the same >> >> > time. >> >> > >> >> > After 24 hours, Gustavo sent me a long email asking to be back to >> Kibo. >> >> > I >> >> > still have that email if someone does not believe me here - in case. >> >> > I accepted that and he wanted to bring back Svetlana and I too >> accepted >> >> > that. >> >> > >> >> > I had a condition. It was: "please don't leave again if we disagree. >> We >> >> > should not let such silly things get into our way. Every beginning is >> >> > hard >> >> > so let's move forward and work as a team." >> >> > >> >> > They accepted that. >> >> > >> >> > After that last meeting, Emily, myself and Gustavo was there - I have >> >> > the >> >> > link for the meeting as we did record that on YouTube. >> >> > >> >> > Gustavo after that meeting remained silent. I knew and did SEE what >> >> > would >> >> > happen next and it indeed happened and I was right. He asked me for a >> >> > chat >> >> > and he quit, yet again. This time, he said it is not about you Ali, >> it >> >> > is >> >> > about something else. >> >> > >> >> > He complained about several things that is not personal nor related >> to >> >> > me. >> >> > >> >> > While he was chatting with me, after he left, Svetlana did leave >> after >> >> > few >> >> > seconds. That could not be by chance. I know both were on IRC and >> they >> >> > both >> >> > agreed to leave. >> >> > >> >> > To me, she has zero ability to make up her mind. She is following >> only. >> >> > If >> >> > someone leaves, she leaves. If someone stays, she will stay. She >> can't >> >> > make >> >> > any decision and this is what I 'saw' based on her 'actions'. >> >> > >> >> > By the way, both of them joined ToriOS and they both left. NO GOOD >> >> > reason >> >> > for that except they both were picky and didn't really know what >> they're >> >> > doing. >> >> > >> >> > I have talked to Gustavo. I still have the chat log but I will not >> going >> >> > to >> >> > share it unless he agrees. >> >> > >> >> > I sent an email to thank them both: >> >> > >> >> > Dear Svetlana and Gustavo, >> >> > >> >> > I'd like to show my great appreciations and thank you so much for >> >> > everything >> >> > regarding Kibo, specially your quitting the project/team. This has >> >> > inspired >> >> > me big time and motivated me a lot. >> >> > >> >> > Yesterday, I have come across the attached quote. I saved the image >> on >> >> > my >> >> > HDD and kept it on my desktop. >> >> > >> >> > Today, I have indeed learned the real meaning of that quote and I >> have >> >> > indeed applied that in my life and WOW, it didn't only work but it >> did >> >> > create a huge positive power/energy and I'm so grateful for that :D >> >> > >> >> > This is in my mind and heart at the moment so I am letting you know >> >> > that. >> >> > >> >> > All the best and should you need 'anything', I'm more than glad to >> help >> >> > while I can. >> >> > >> >> > Take care! >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > And I made it extra clear that my door is always open. But ... >> >> > I ask you all to put yourself in my shoes. Will you accept someone >> who >> >> > left >> >> > 3 times from your house after you were super kind and nice to them? >> you >> >> > hosted them 3 times and they left? >> >> > >> >> > Gustavo admitted it he was picky and didn't understand Kibo. >> >> > >> >> > He got demotivated and didn't want to carry on when he read that >> >> > Jonathan is >> >> > not willing to quit his daily work over Kibo. >> >> > >> >> > I explained to him and to everyone that Kibo is a part-time job >> project >> >> > for >> >> > the moment. If we can make it and we can make a company out of it, we >> >> > can >> >> > work as full-time but only crazy people who might think Kibo is a >> >> > full-time >> >> > job. It is not. For me, perhaps it is because I'm jobless. But I >> would >> >> > NEVER >> >> > ever ask someone to quit his job. >> >> > >> >> > I'm not a kid, people. I've been around for sometime and I know who >> is >> >> > serious and who is not. Who is fooling around and who is not. Who is >> >> > helpful >> >> > and who is know. Who is understanding what we do and who is know. >> >> > >> >> > Gustavo showed a lot of positive stuff but at the same time, he >> >> > misunderstood lots of things. Thus, he left. >> >> > >> >> > As for Svetlana, as I said, she is always following someone and can't >> >> > make >> >> > her own decision herself. >> >> > She was like either: +1 or -1 only. >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I agree with us being too over exposed using launch pad. I proposed >> >> >> alternatives. >> >> >> >> >> >> 1) mailman for mailing list with private archives which is very >> >> >> beneficial. If the concern is that people's inboxes will get filled >> >> >> with >> >> >> lots of emails that isnt the case that is up to them when they >> >> >> subscribe. >> >> >> They can subscribe to digest and get an email with multiple postings >> >> >> instead >> >> >> of individual emails. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > What are we waiting for?! I tell you what :) >> >> > Because NONE of you replied my email about the roles, tasks, and all >> ... >> >> > go >> >> > back to your inbox and see ;) >> >> > >> >> > That is why I sent these emails. So X knows what to do and Y knows >> what >> >> > to >> >> > do. >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> 2) redmine this is a bug tracker as well as project management as >> well >> >> >> as >> >> >> version control integration and much more this is a great tool to >> have >> >> >> in >> >> >> place from now as we can use it to track bugs and issues on the >> website >> >> >> and >> >> >> more. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > I have never used it. If someone could take the time to explain that >> to >> >> > us, >> >> > then why not? I am not against using anything good. WHY people can't >> get >> >> > that straight? if someone has an opinion of a feedback, that does not >> >> > mean >> >> > he/she is against the idea. >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Ali you need to remember as well that things take time to build up a >> >> >> following and you have to spend money to make it and in this case I >> am >> >> >> helpign you with the amjjawad website as well as kibos for now as >> well >> >> >> as >> >> >> phil with the server. If you want this to succeed we need to move >> >> >> forward >> >> >> with actions and not rush things. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > I know that. Thanks for the reminder. Appreciate it. But, there is a >> >> > HUGE >> >> > misunderstanding here. >> >> > >> >> > We're confusing RUSHING with TAKING ACTIONS. >> >> > >> >> > And there are some other misunderstanding ... >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I would suggest as well talking with Gustavo and putting together a >> >> >> business plan so that way the business can be presented to investors >> >> >> and we >> >> >> get the cash we need to get established correctly. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > He has quit. >> >> > Again, put yourself in my shoes. Would you accept someone joined you >> 3 >> >> > times >> >> > and quit 3 times? >> >> > And he made it extra clear when I tried to change his mind that he >> is no >> >> > longer interested and can't help with Kibo. Why do I have to accept >> him >> >> > for >> >> > the 4th time so he leaves again for the 4th time? again, what would >> YOU >> >> > do >> >> > if you were in my place?! >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Here is a quote from Michael Baisden and I agree with him totally. >> >> >> >> >> >> “those who fail to plan, plan to fail!” >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > I am NOT blind so you don't really have to make it that large :) >> >> > But thanks anyway. >> >> > >> >> > "People don't plan to fail, they fail to plan." >> >> > >> >> > In my case, I do plan but NO ONE wishes to listen nor discuss >> anything >> >> > and >> >> > EVERYONE seems to push what he/she wants. NO, sorry, this is not >> what I >> >> > want. This is not what a team is about. A team means: all of us are >> >> > smarter >> >> > than anyone of us. Someone got upset just because we didn't take >> 'his' >> >> > input. Why? ask them :) >> >> > >> >> > I have been rejected billion of times. What I have done? before I >> quit, >> >> > I >> >> > did what people told me in my face that this will fail. >> >> > Example? >> >> > I suggested a community spin for Lubuntu for super old machines. I >> got >> >> > rejected by the majority of Lubuntu Community - no need to mention >> >> > names. >> >> > What I did? ToriOS and guess what? it is much lighter than Lubuntu :) >> >> > >> >> > I didn't quit right away when I got rejected nor someone disagreed >> with >> >> > me. >> >> > I quit when I found myself zero helpful for Lubuntu after 2 years of >> >> > being >> >> > the most active member of all and achieved what none achieved. >> >> > >> >> > If you are NOT sure what to do? don't do. Wait, think and then do. >> >> > >> >> > So, I would be very careful to accept both of them again in Kibo. >> They >> >> > were >> >> > never rejected. We were only discussing the ideas. Once their ideas >> >> > aren't >> >> > taken, they feel bad. Is this a school or what?! >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Sadly with things being super rushed that is whats going to happen. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > Define: "super rushed", please! >> >> > >> >> > Who went to Phill for a server? Me? that was you :) >> >> > Define: super rushed so we both be on the same page :D >> >> > >> >> > I'm afraid I'm lost. I don't know who is rushed and who is not :) >> >> > All what I know is we're in different pages at the moment ... but >> that >> >> > is >> >> > not the end of the world. At least for me. >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> Gustavo is a great and very helpful guy when it comes to this sort >> of >> >> >> stuff and I know he wants this to succeed as well as I. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > He left. His choice. It wasn't about ME. He left for something else. >> Can >> >> > we >> >> > all agree on that, please?! >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I am telling you this as a friend and not only to you to everyone on >> >> >> here. >> >> >> It may seem harsh but its the hard truth and reality. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > You should know by now .. in fact, all of you that I respect those >> who >> >> > come >> >> > and talk to me directly, not leaving after all what I have done for >> them >> >> > without one single word. I admire what Gustavo did. But someone else >> >> > left >> >> > without a single word. What kind of respect is that? >> >> > >> >> > I admire your honesty. You do care, Jonathan. Otherwise, you wouldn't >> >> > spend >> >> > time to write to me, right? so, I see that where it is coming from >> and I >> >> > have NO problem with that. Even though your bring it to public, I >> don't >> >> > mind. >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> >> Jonathan Aquilina >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > Sorry for the LONG email but I did this so we can END this right here >> >> > and >> >> > right now. NO talking about the past. Let's move forward. >> >> > >> >> > I already have Plan B, C, D, etc. >> >> > I'll NOT rush things. >> >> > >> >> > Here is my request for now: >> >> > I will NEVER ask anyone here to leave and I do HATE to see anyone >> >> > leaves. >> >> > You may all stay for now as volunteers. Once we have a clear solid >> >> > visible >> >> > roadmap, we can see about that. >> >> > >> >> > Do not leave unless you feel so. >> >> > I will not ask you to leave. Every word you contribute with is >> helpful. >> >> > I >> >> > have my own vision and I find everyone here is useful, even though >> >> > he/she is >> >> > not doing anything at this moment, his/her moment will come. >> >> > >> >> > If we wish to carry on, we should let the past go and turn the page. >> >> > Learn >> >> > from our mistakes for sure. >> >> > If you wish to be stuck in the past, the present will be lost and so >> the >> >> > future. >> >> > >> >> > Your call :) >> >> > >> >> > And this email for everyone, not for Jonathan nor someone, it is for >> >> > everyone to read. >> >> > >> >> > -- >> >> > Remember: "All of us are smarter than any one of us." >> >> > Best Regards, >> >> > Ali/amjjawad >> >> > http://torios.org - StartUbuntu - Ubuntu GNOME - http://amjjawad.net >> >> > >> >> > -- >> >> > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kibo-project >> >> > Post to : kibo-project@lists.launchpad.net >> >> > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kibo-project >> >> > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Whatever you can do, or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has genius, >> >> power and magic in it. - Goethe >> >> >> >> Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't >> >> matter and those who matter don't mind. - Dr.Seuss >> >> >> >> Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that >> >> counts can be counted. - Albert Einstein >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > Remember: "All of us are smarter than any one of us." >> > Best Regards, >> > Ali/amjjawad >> > http://torios.org - StartUbuntu - Ubuntu GNOME - http://amjjawad.net >> >> >> >> -- >> Whatever you can do, or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has genius, >> power and magic in it. - Goethe >> >> Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't >> matter and those who matter don't mind. - Dr.Seuss >> >> Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that >> counts can be counted. - Albert Einstein >> > > > > -- > Jonathan Aquilina > > > > > -- > Regards > > -Israel > ToriOS Team > > > -- > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kibo-project > Post to : kibo-project@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kibo-project > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > -- Jonathan Aquilina
-- Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kibo-project Post to : kibo-project@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kibo-project More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
