https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=399375
--- Comment #15 from Tyson Tan <tyson...@mail.com> --- There are things I would like to clarify: 1) THIS IS NOT FOR KRITA I reported this bug, not because we are trying to push change for Krita's sake. I and David Revoy here are sharing the common sense of how Modifier keys operates on OS/DE in general. Our sincere intention here is to help you to improve the user experience for KDE Plasma. 2) THE COMMON SENSE We consider this to be a problem on kwin's side. Because what kwin has been doing is NOT COMMON SENSE. The COMMON SENSE and INDUSTRY STANDARD, as David Revoy mentioned: Ctrl/Shift/Alt should be reserved only for applications. This has been implemented since the dawn of of GUI and kwin is the one at odd here. kwin's taking away of the ALT key for window action goes against everything we have been using with a GUI. Only Plasma is doing it differently, and this is not what a sane people expect from a good desktop experience. 3) WHY SHOULDN'T KRITA CHANGE, BUT KWIN kwin's reservation of ALT for window actions is hitting every application outside of KDE, and not limited to applications outside of KDE. Those being hit are those adopted the INDUSTRIAL STANDARD and COMMON-SENSE. The more powerful they are, the harder they are hit. The applications we used for examples include Krita, GIMP, Inkscape, Blender. These are the NAMECARDS of the whole FOSS world. It delivers a clear message when they ONLY have problems under KDE Plasma, and the said problems CRIPPLES their CORE functionalities. If Krita should be the one to change, then EVERY application that adopt to this COMMON SENSE, this industry standard of modifier key arrangement should add rules specifically made for kwin. kwin is a special case in the grand scheme of things, not Krita, not GIMP/Inkscape/Blender/etc. And as a result, Krita shouldn't change, neither should GIMP, Inkscape nor Blener, etc. 4) THE SHORTTERM SOLUTION YOU PROPOSED I understand your proposal. I'm not a programmer so I don't know even what you mentioned is doable. But for now, let's assume it can be implemented. Then what? You have quieted one loudest scream that's closest to you. But what about everything else? Is this shortterm solution (implemented by Krita, although it is really a kwin issue) going to give you a false sense of security? What about those disgruntled users who can't reach you because they don't know what and where to report? While the status quo goes on, I wonder why people are so reluctant to adopt KDE Plasma as their daily DE. Missing ALT for whatever productivity applications they are using must be one of them. 5) WE CARE ABOUT KDE When a certain application has KDE Plasma specific compatibility issues like this, and by any luck it was reported to those projects as a bug, they will be for certain marked as UPSTREAM or NOT-OUR-BUG. Those information are rarely being relayed to you. We care because we are involved in KDE and we don't want to stand there watching it goes down a path that turns people away. 6) JUST DROP WINDOW ACTION SHORTCUTS BY DEFAULT Why do we even need to use ALT as a shortcut to move our window? Is it this important? Can't we just click on the titlebar and drag it around? It doesn't make any sense! My shortterm solution is to add a NONE option to window action and make it as default. 7) THE RESPONSIBLE SETTINGS ARE TOO HARD TO FIND The option to turn it off is hidden way too deep and hard to find, causing the learning curve to be insanely steep. If anything, at least change how the options are presented. Most people could not figure out how to change kwin's ALT to META, or in fact, figure out what is happening at all. So what do they do? They go back to the last other OS/DE they use and they will be more reluctant to try KDE Plasma for another time. I have been retrying KDE every year, only ending in retreat, only because I am involved in KDE community. Normal people would leave for good after their first or second disappointment. 8) IN THE END This discussion is for kwin and thus for KDE Plasma. This is not for Krita. We are not trying to make Krita works better under KDE Plasma. We are trying to help KDE Plasma works better for the majority of applications. I'm not saying you MUST do what I suggested here, but I do believe I and David Revoy have shared valuable information. We explained the context, history, and our perspective circling this problem. I hope you have read and digested our words carefully and thoroughly. I do hope in the coming years of maintaining kwin, our shared knowledge can help you make your decision wisely. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are watching all bug changes.
