Hi, Deirdre, Annette, Simon, and everyone else,
> > > The pay disparity between men and women may be due to the choices
> > > women make, rather than discrimination in the workforce.
> >
> > Similar studies were cited by Thomas Sowell in one of his books. He
> > cited some very interesting things, such as:
> >
> > 1) never-married women earned salaries virtually on par with those of
> > men;
This flies in the face of almost every statistic I read. For example, look
at Working Woman's annual salary survey. You'll find that, with a few
exceptions, women in the same position doing the same job still earn less
than men. The ideas you cite below are based on the idea that women choose
lower paying jobs. The numbers I cite are comparing men and women in the
*same* job. Women still are coming up short.
> > 2) married women earned approximately 25% of that of married men;
Again, to come up with a number like this you must compare all married women
(including those who stepped out of their careers to raise children and
don't work full time) rather than career women in positions identical or
comparable to their male counterparts.
> > 3) women were several times more likely to quit jobs;
I have heard this argument used repeatedly to justify lower salaries for
women. Once upon a time it was true. In today's high tech market, the
reverse seems to be true. Women seem to be more likely to show loyalty,
while men jump for the highest dollar. In either case, it is not a valid
reason to discriminate. OK, yes, women are more likely to quit to raise
children. Does that make it OK to penalize women who do not have children
and decide to remain in professional careers? IMHO, no.
> > 4) women were more likely to select jobs that allowed them easy entry
> > and exit from the job market; by economic law these would be
> > lower-paying jobs.
What the women's movement is still fighting for is equal pay for equal work,
not equal pay for unequal work. This argument is therefore specious.
> Funny, though, I used to work for a woman who was studying pay
> disparities in the legal profession, and one of the things she
> found that contributed to the disparity was that men tended to
> *threaten* to quit more often than women...
Yep. Men, traditionally, are also more agressive negotiators, more sure of
themselves, and less likely to undervalue themselves. I think this has to
do more with how boys are raised and taught vs. how girls are than anything
else.
>
> > It seems to me that, in the US at least, the liberals wouldn't want to
> > bring this up because it spoils their discrimination rhetoric, while the
> > conservatives wouldn't want to admit that family values were largely
> > responsible for the disparity.
OK, speaking as a flaming left-wing liberal: I wouldn't bring it up only
because it paints a totally distorted picture to further Thomas Sowell's
conservative cause. Sowell is really good at this, and of course, he writes
very well.
The comparison shouldn't be about the choices women make vis a vis men. The
comparison should be about women and men who make the same choices, have the
same skills and experiences, and yet end up with very different results.
Gender discrimination in our society is still very real. It's more subtle
than it used to be, but it is still very much there.
> >
> > Whether you agree with Sowell or not, the case is well-presented.
Everything Sowell writes is well presented :) That is certainly a talent he
has. He also has chosen an apples to oranges comparison.
>
> The fact remains that women are penalized for marrying and having
> children and men are not, or you would see men with children
> faring worse than men without children. The economic sacrifices
> that women make are not recognized in divorce or social security
> in the US. It may not be in the workplace that some of the
> issues should be addressed.
Absolutely! The fact also is that women who don't marry or have children
are also penalized.
>
> Of course, things will be different because we have different
> patterns of employment now -- hardly anyone is staying in one
> place for years and years. Career interruptions will become more
> common across the board.
>
> I think there are other disparities as well, having worked where
> men are paid more for the same work (but the work is just labeled
> differently).
I think this is all too common.
All the best,
Caity
--
Caitlyn Máire Martin
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.caitys-world.com
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