process, which then should be applied by the various Apache top-level projects, because else
you might end up with "Baby-Apaches" (but I guess this might be not just because there are different opinions on the incubation process, but other stuff as well).
But I think Jeff has a point. For instance in the case of Lenya, discussions quickly moved to cocoon-dev, because we
proposed Lenya as a Cocoon subproject, and hence the Cocoon community cared about it.
Thanks
Michael
Paul Hammant wrote:
Jeff,
There is more than just Tapestry in incubator.
- Paul
--- Jeff Turner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Feh.
Incubation was a dumb idea from the start. It is busy failing in practice.
PMCs should manage the acceptance of new subprojects, not some disinterested Incubator PMC.
IMHO, scrap this failed experiment and let Tapestry migrate to Jakarta without being further jerked around.
I feel I'm stating the blindingly obvious. Is it just me?
--Jeff
On Mon, Mar 10, 2003 at 06:58:22PM -0500, Howard M. Lewis Ship wrote:
How, exactly, is Tapestry ever expected to exit the proposal stage?
Despite repeated attempts, Tapestry is NOT in BugZilla. We're still forced to use SourceForge for bug tracking.
Tapestry's mailing lists are not getting archived any more (not since 2/21).
Nobody seems to know ANY of the procedures for getting things done. Nothing is documented. Simple things like the correct way to distribute a release (including signing and mirroring) are just "known" by the right people ... and I don't even know who is in the know.
Andrew and Dion have been helpful, both before the move and after.
The only other accomplishment of the incubation process has been a code audit that resulted in a shuffling of the libraries checked into CVS and distributed with the framework.
Jakarta infrastructure is non-existent. Worse, the Jakarta culture
erroneously expects things to get done based on e-mails, rather than
something organized, like using BugZilla to track infrastructure requests.
The Incubator team has yet to provide a time table or a check list to indicate what the exit criteria are. In terms of Tapestry's commitments to the Incubator, it looks like we're more than there (based on http://incubator.apache.org/process.html). In terms of Incubator's commitments to Tapestry ... that is, to assist Tapestry in moving into Jakarta, fitting in, and accessing infrastructure; very little has been accomplished.
--
Howard M. Lewis Ship
Creator, Tapestry: Java Web Components
http://jakarta.apache.org/proposals/tapestry
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