It's no more profound than any other multi-order composition. It's part of the work we have to do for mechanistic modeling of higher order constructs. What galls me is that we can talk about it so much without discussing the mechanisms of construction.
The details of composing from genes, through physiological structures, through interoception, to very high order attributes like "reading ability" are interesting, regardless of any profundity. But some of us need to be reminded of how the details build the narrative. Like Magic Eye pictures, the Necker cube, or the lady/vase thing, what might seem banal without the larger frame can seem profound when the discourse is enlarged ... when it all snaps into place. On 9/10/21 10:25 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > Fine, the goal is some composition of functions and it is all interdependent. > > Sure. Of course. Why is this so profound to y’all? > > > > *From:* Friam <friam-boun...@redfish.com> *On Behalf Of > *thompnicks...@gmail.com > *Sent:* Friday, September 10, 2021 10:20 AM > *To:* 'The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group' <friam@redfish.com> > *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] gen'fur > > > > Which takes us back to thermostats, intentionality, intensional inexistence, > Sober’s epiphomenator, spandrels, and Lorenz’s law: The goal is never the > function. If you build a bird that measures competing male robins in terms > of “brown stick with red fluff” you eventually get an ethologist who gets > that bird to attack by providing only brown sticks with red fluff. > > > > See. It’s all connected. > > > > Nick > > > > Nick Thompson > > thompnicks...@gmail.com <mailto:thompnicks...@gmail.com> > > https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ > <https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/> > > > > *From:* Friam <friam-boun...@redfish.com <mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com>> > *On Behalf Of *Steve Smith > *Sent:* Friday, September 10, 2021 12:30 PM > *To:* friam@redfish.com <mailto:friam@redfish.com> > *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] gen'fur > > > > Sometimes all you need is a good aphorism > > https://sketchplanations.com/goodharts-law > <https://sketchplanations.com/goodharts-law> > > or maybe boost it up with a cartoon > > https://sketchplanations.com/ <https://sketchplanations.com/> > > I can't help but wonder if there's an analog of Goodhart's law lurking, > here. > > > > > > On September 9, 2021 2:31:39 PM PDT, Marcus Daniels > <mar...@snoutfarm.com> <mailto:mar...@snoutfarm.com> wrote: > > Or they are reprogramming their people to be smarter! > > (Actually, deCODE is owned by Amgen now.) > > > > Selection is already occurring, so it isn't as if this is some sci-fi > thing. > > > > > https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/12/the-last-children-of-down-syndrome/616928/ > > <https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/12/the-last-children-of-down-syndrome/616928/> > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Friam <friam-boun...@redfish.com> > <mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com> On Behalf Of David Eric Smith > > Sent: Thursday, September 9, 2021 2:12 PM > > To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group > <friam@redfish.com> <mailto:friam@redfish.com> > > Subject: Re: [FRIAM] gen'fur > > > > Aha! This is why Iceland has the highest per-capita fraction of > published authors in the world. I had assumed it was the weather…. > > > > On Sep 10, 2021, at 2:17 AM, Marcus Daniels > <mar...@snoutfarm.com> <mailto:mar...@snoutfarm.com> wrote: > > > > That can be screened as well with a large population-wide survey > such has been done in the UK or Iceland. > > Of course, it is unlikely that complex behaviors will be governed > by isolated mutations, so the task is to look for highly predictive motifs > (e.g. regular expressions). > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Friam <friam-boun...@redfish.com> > <mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com> On Behalf Of u?l? ?>$ > > Sent: Thursday, September 9, 2021 10:12 AM > > To: friam@redfish.com <mailto:friam@redfish.com> > > Subject: Re: [FRIAM] gen'fur > > > > Ha! Now you're trolling. The answer is: "because the sites that > generate reading ability (or whatever) *also* generate other 'abilities'", > with "abilities" in scare quotes because many abilities are considered bad > ... like the ability of a pimply faced white dude to shoot up a church or > blow up a federal building. > > > > In addition to polyphenism, there's robustness. If more than 1 > site generates the same functional ability (reading), then do we write them > all? ... just one of them? ... a probabilistically predictive handful of them? > > > > On 9/9/21 10:00 AM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > > So find the sites that correspond to reading ability, or > whatever, and WRITE them. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Friam <friam-boun...@redfish.com> > <mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com> On Behalf Of u?l? ?>$ > > Sent: Thursday, September 9, 2021 9:51 AM > > To: friam@redfish.com <mailto:friam@redfish.com> > > Subject: Re: [FRIAM] gen'fur > > > > I was alerted to this article this morning: > > > > Can Progressives Be Convinced That Genetics Matters? > > > https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2021/09/13/can-progressives-be-con > <https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2021/09/13/can-progressives-be-con> > > v > > inced-that-genetics-matters > > > > It should delight those amongst us who rant about the "woke". > 8^D But it dovetails nicely with the fraught concept of equality in the other > thread. > > > > Coincidentally, also on 9/6, the BIAPT announced their early > career prize winner Emily McTernan: > > > https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.associationfo > <https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fwww.associationfo> > > > rpoliticalthought.ac.uk%2fbiapt-2021-early-care&c=E,1,Je9MVNdO8lpJQOd > > > 6fZwUNe-4z5yuFq0upxNIzMBFjmLFh_h5a63ueVVpd8lkEdWeUx5Xx1RaoPg3T5Ph8YlG > > 0558qqHLZD8-DKeBPEC3YYM,&typo=1 > > er-prize-winner-dr-emily-mcternan/ > > > > "In her forthcoming monograph, Dr McTernan develops her work > on social equality further, to advance a pioneering conceptual account – and > robust normative defence – of the phenomenon of ‘taking offence’. Therein, > McTernan contends, we should understand taking offence, under appropriate > conditions, as a civic virtue rather than a vice, as an emotion that embodies > the resistance of social inequalities within a community." > > > > > > On 9/8/21 8:06 PM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > > From about a cancer rate of 10% (without mutation) to 50% > (with) but it depends on the BRCA variant. > > > > > https://www.cdc.gov/genomics/disease/breast_ovarian_cancer/breast_ca > <https://www.cdc.gov/genomics/disease/breast_ovarian_cancer/breast_ca> > > n > > c > > er.htm > > > <https://www.cdc.gov/genomics/disease/breast_ovarian_cancer/breast_c > <https://www.cdc.gov/genomics/disease/breast_ovarian_cancer/breast_cancer.htm> > > a > <https://www.cdc.gov/genomics/disease/breast_ovarian_cancer/breast_cancer.htm> > > n > <https://www.cdc.gov/genomics/disease/breast_ovarian_cancer/breast_cancer.htm> > > cer.htm> > <https://www.cdc.gov/genomics/disease/breast_ovarian_cancer/breast_cancer.htm> > > > > On Sep 8, 2021, at 4:07 PM, Frank Wimberly > <wimber...@gmail.com> <mailto:wimber...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > Is the Braca gene that little correlated with breast > cancer? > > > > --- > > Frank C. Wimberly > > 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, > > Santa Fe, NM 87505 > > > > 505 670-9918 > > Santa Fe, NM > > > > On Wed, Sep 8, 2021, 4:57 PM Marcus Daniels > <mar...@snoutfarm.com <mailto:mar...@snoutfarm.com> > <mailto:mar...@snoutfarm.com> <mailto:mar...@snoutfarm.com>> wrote: > > > > Yeah, it is hard to get excited about “unusual” > variance. Modern > > classification algorithms like gradient boosting make > it possible > > to predict phenotypes, and to me that is a lot more > interesting > > (and still possible to deconstruct).____ > > > > __ __ > > > > *From:* Friam <friam-boun...@redfish.com > <mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com> <mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com> > <mailto:friam-boun...@redfish.com>> *On Behalf Of *Eric Charles > > *Sent:* Wednesday, September 8, 2021 3:53 PM > > *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee > Group <friam@redfish.com <mailto:friam@redfish.com> > <mailto:friam@redfish.com> <mailto:friam@redfish.com>> > > *Subject:* [FRIAM] gen'fur____ > > > > __ __ > > > > Gen'fur this, gen'fur that... and also the > realities of biological complexity.... -- ☤>$ uǝlƃ - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . 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