Turns out there *is* a document detailing enforcement policies and it *does* involve a range of possible responses to violations.
https://github.com/django/djangoproject.com/blob/master/templates/conduct/enforcement.html https://www.djangoproject.com/conduct/enforcement-manual/ On Mon, Sep 8, 2014 at 12:30 AM, Stephen Burrows < [email protected]> wrote: > Ben, > > Just to clarify, it sounds like what you're saying is the following: If > there were a member of the django community who (may this never be the > case) was harassing members of the django community, but limited their > harassment to non-django-specific forums, you would want it to not affect > their participation in django spaces. > > Is that correct? If so, is that a blanket statement or does it depend in > your mind what exactly they've done? For example, what if they had a single > hateful tweet? What if they had five? What if they orchestrated a > harassment campaign that drove someone from their home? > > Where would you draw the line? > > I would also like to point out that the code of conduct doesn't seem to > contain any statements about how it's enforced. Generally speaking, > policies like this operate with a certain number of warnings, followed by > escalation if that doesn't stick - except in extreme cases. It even says > explicitly *in* the policy: > > Don’t forget that it is human to err and blaming each other doesn’t get us >> anywhere, rather offer to help resolving issues and to help learn from >> mistakes. > > > I understand that you're concerned about the application of the policy, > but it seems like you're (perhaps unintentionally) exaggerating the scope > and purpose of the policy to support your point. > > --Stephen > > > On Mon, Sep 8, 2014 at 12:16 AM, Benjamin Scherrey <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> I thought I made my objections pretty clear in my original email but I'll >> attempt to be more pedantic about it now. The specific language in the PR >> 86 is: >> >> "In addition, violations of this code outside these spaces may affect a >> person's ability to participate within them." for both faq.html and >> index.html. >> >> I disagree with your assertion "that only makes explicit something that >> was already the case" because that's a) not how I read it and b) completely >> impossible to reasonably enforce or expect. I hope that what is occurring is >> simply a matter of "I don't think it means what you think it means" but >> what you're really saying here is that all people on this planet must >> comply with our "code of conduct" at all times in all places or risk being >> removed from our community - right after, mind you ironically, claiming to >> support an encourage the participation of all individuals. So what is this >> code of conduct that we're imposing on all of humanity for the salvation of >> the world? Fortunately there is, literally, a list: >> >> <ul> >> <li>Violent threats or language directed against another person.</li> >> <li>Sexist, racist, or otherwise discriminatory jokes and >> language.</li> >> <li>Posting sexually explicit or violent material.</li> >> <li>Posting (or threatening to post) other people's personally >> identifying information ("doxing").</li> >> <li>Personal insults, especially those using racist or sexist >> terms.</li> >> <li>Unwelcome sexual attention.</li> >> <li>Advocating for, or encouraging, any of the above behavior.</li> >> <li>Repeated harassment of others. In general, if someone asks you to >> stop, then stop.</li> >> </ul> >> >> So lets see... anyone who has done any of the following completely >> outside the context of the Django community or forums is now not welcome to >> participate: >> >> 1) Ever threatened to or actually spank their children. >> 2) Ever used violence or threat there-of to defend another person from >> same. >> 3) Ever posted a naked or somewhat explicit picture of themselves or >> others in a private message to another person or in a forum, such as a >> photo site like flickr. >> 4) Dox'd a person who is clearly engaging in criminal activity under a >> pretense of anonymity. >> 5) Ever repeated a joke with sexual or racial content. >> 6) Ever asked someone out or complemented another person on their looks >> who didn't want it. >> 7) Said it's ok for someone to do any of the above. >> 8) Said or did it twice. >> >> Seriously?!?! This *is* really what you're saying. (BTW - I've done all >> of the above at one time or another so ban me now.) >> >> Of course some of these (but not all - and it depends a lot about whom) >> may seem outrageous but they are true to the letter of the code of conduct. >> I agree these things probably don't belong in the context of a Django >> discussion or group but I do not believe you can enforce elimination this >> conduct outside of same. And - then there's just the ability to agree to >> disagree. One can very credibly argue that many religions or political >> philosophies are racist, sexist, etc. Are all practicing members of same >> now banned from participation in Django? This RP language says yes. >> >> Now that I have, again, been responsive to your dismissal of my >> objections, please do me the courtesy of re-reading my original (and this) >> email and attempt to be responsive to it's content. >> >> thank you, >> >> -- Ben Scherrey >> >> On Mon, Sep 8, 2014 at 3:04 AM, Daniele Procida <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> On Mon, Sep 8, 2014, Benjamin Scherrey <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> > Nothing you've written disagrees with what I said, nor do you >>> address >>> >the core concern I bring up about the "change of substance" which is >>> chock >>> >full of opportunities for the law of unintended consequences to come up >>> and >>> >bite us all. >>> >>> What in your opinion is (or was) the "change of substance" in < >>> https://github.com/django/djangoproject.com/pull/86>? >>> >>> I didn't see any but a very minor one, that only makes explicit >>> something that was already the case. >>> >>> >Re-reading the existing documents, I find that this language >>> >introduces an entirely different tone to the language of these policies >>> >and, again, implies some dangerous precedents beyond what the writers >>> may >>> >intend. >>> >>> Which language in pull request 86? >>> >>> Daniele >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Django developers" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-developers. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/20140907200417.1287303773%40mail.wservices.ch >>> . >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Chief Systems Architect Proteus Technologies <http://proteus-tech.com> >> Chief Fan Biggest Fan Productions <http://biggestfan.net> >> Personal blog where I am not your demographic >> <http://notyourdemographic.com>. >> >> This email intended solely for those who have received it. 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