Andy wrote: > But the program isn't stronger than pros, so how can it give better > information about proper komi? Pro's cannot give you statistical information on komi unless you simply collate several thousand pro games.
I don't think you need a particularly strong program, just good programs. If you notice that over thousands of games 6.5 is gives black a statistically significant edge, and 8.5 gives white a statistically significant edge, you know (at least for programs) that 8.5 is too high. Although it's possible that black has a won game at 8.5 komi, the evidence from computer play is just the opposite. You would have to assume that a computer is a better fighter when down, or conversely gets lazy when winning. Somehow that is difficult to believe. Also, you can try giving mogo a 6.5, and 8.5 komi and searching the second position (it seems to always play e5 on the first move.) At 6.5 komi, after black e5 white thinks it is slightly losing. At 8.5 komi white thinks it is slightly winning! At 7.5 komi it also thinks white is winning slightly. I tried Alford's value of 9.5 komi and white is even more happy, showing about 0.547 in the score. I don't believe what Alford says about 9.5 being the correct komi for 9x9. Where does that information come from? - Don > > On Feb 11, 2008 6:09 PM, Christoph Birk <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> wrote: > > On Mon, 11 Feb 2008, Don Dailey wrote: > > I don't bet, but if I did, I would bet that it's 7 or 8, and I'm > > fairly certain that with best play the game would end with 7 extra > > points for black. > > > > I think this was discussed at great length 2 or 3 years ago. > > I know ... I brought it up again because of Mogo's success. > A very (!) strong program should be able to tell us the proper > komi. > > Christoph > > _______________________________________________ > computer-go mailing list > computer-go@computer-go.org <mailto:computer-go@computer-go.org> > http://www.computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go/ > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > computer-go mailing list > computer-go@computer-go.org > http://www.computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go/ _______________________________________________ computer-go mailing list computer-go@computer-go.org http://www.computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go/
