Did you see the movie Men In Black? I think it’s like the aliens on the streets of New York City. They’re right there in front of us, but we choose not to notice.
My first job after college at the big GTE Automatic Electric plant in Northlake, IL (as a test equipment design engineer) in 1972, we had a flamboyantly gay guy known as Gay Gilbert, and an old engineer named George who would invite young guys over to his house and suddenly be wearing just his boxer shorts. It was a huge place so there were no doubt many more, but like the NYC aliens, they were invisible. Who would have guessed at the time that Raymond Burr (reportedly one of the nicest people who ever lived) was gay. But yeah, maybe energy drinks. Or chemtrails, or vaccines. I will admit to having my doubts about Bruce Jenner. I feel like he was surrounded by all these women getting rich from their TV shows and product lines, and decided to join them. But I’m probably influenced by the fact that he makes an unattractive woman. While I admit that I think Chelsea Manning pulls it off. Do you remember the Kinks song from the 70’s “Lola”? L-O-L-A Lola. A guy at my coop job was mortified because he took a girl home from a bar and she was not a girl. That was probably 1970. From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> On Behalf Of Chuck Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2024 7:34 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Cc: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Analogy I blame energy drinks and internet porn. We didn’t have these problems when we were limited to a purloined playboy. Sent from my iPhone On Dec 10, 2024, at 6:31 PM, Ken Hohhof <khoh...@kwom.com <mailto:khoh...@kwom.com> > wrote: I’ve never understood why devoutly religious people have the biggest problem with gender dysphoric people. Surely God made them that way, and God does not make mistakes. That’s not me saying that, I have a loosey goosey relationship with organized religion. But that’s how I imagine deeply religious people thinking. Like maybe Sheldon’s mom? If you’ve ever known a transgender person, the people who say it’s just men who decide to become women so they can go in the womens bathroom and assault women, that seems simplistic and mean spirited. Or whenever I hear the term “lifestyle”, I know it’s talking points time. Like people who choose the gay lifestyle. Why do we never near about choosing the asshole lifestyle? I’m not sure we can blame God for that one, it does seem like a lifestyle choice. Not targeting any of these comments at you, BTW. From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf Of ch...@go-mtc.com <mailto:ch...@go-mtc.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2024 6:57 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com <mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Analogy I apologize for starting this thread. I was just wanting to put a bit of polish on my purposely provocative analogy. I still think it a fun thought having teachers help kids come out and admit they are alcoholics. I can see this being an SNL skit. Maybe they will pay me lotsa money for writing this skit for them.... (see, you do not have to be trans to be delusional). Ken, I prefer the term “cross dresser”... My kids also had friends that felt they were some how born wrong. But with them the kids just became butch lesbians and are seemingly happy. We run into them now and then. From: Jason McKemie Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2024 5:33 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Analogy On Tue, Dec 10, 2024 at 5:44 PM <ch...@go-mtc.com <mailto:ch...@go-mtc.com> > wrote: Lessee.... I was trying to be ridiculous, but I feel a bit of an impulse to provide some serious counterpoint here, this is bound to be a bad idea: “Unfortunately they've repositioned themselves to be in favor of government control with: book bans, white washing history, controlling women's Healthcare, trying to ban same sex marriage, forcing religion (specifically Christianity) into public schools, threatening to imprison the media and people who speak out against them. “ Book Bans. Yes, grade school kids do not need books describing gay anal rape etc. Kids need to be allowed to grow up protected from the gritty truths of the world. Book bans are necessary to prevent greater harm. Book bans cover more than these sensationalist topics, reasonable people can agree not all books should be in a school library. White washing history. History is there for the reading, more content and transparency than ever before. What has been labeled “white washing” is in reality an attempt to bring balance to the narrative in public schools. If you keep teaching “whitey is bad” then how do you ever expect people to be allowed to change? The pendulum swings. Critical race theory and some similar things are a bit out of control IMO. This definitely depends on the school you attend, they never taught this stuff at my school (I'm pretty sure they still don't teach it there). Controlling women’s healthcare. Call it what it really is, Abortion. And for the majority of the world Abortion == Murder of an innocent child. This will never change. So don’t “whitewash” it by calling murder “health care”. Almost all sides understand there are medically necessary abortions and most are not arguing about those. This is a red herring. Moreover Trump said it is a states rights thing, he is right. Read the constitution, anything not explicitly delineated or enumerated in the constitution is delegated to the control of the states. Don’t like what your state is doing, work to change it there. The argument that it is a child carries a ton of religious baggage. I would agree that it should be a state decision - many in the Republican party do not agree. There are also many other reproductive issues that fall into grey areas when abortion is outlawed. Religion into schools: Our whole legal system, actually the legal system of the entire western world is derived from Exodus chapter 20. The 10 commandments. Putting the original codified law, the list governing behavior is not an injection of Christianity into the world of your precious little liberals kiddies. It is a display of the origins of western civilization. And the fact that supposedly believe in the “Rule of Law” What better exhibit than to display the origin of that. I think you can teach kids the facts about religion without indoctrination, again I think this varies based on school district. Who is imprisoning media personalities? You mean like Biden having the FBI force Facebook and Twitter to silence and block their critics? From: Jason McKemie Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2024 4:19 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Analogy Very well stated. I hope both political parties can get closer to center in the next few years (this is the only way our democracy can function properly), but I'm not holding my breath. The current situation with the Republican party is only going to make things worse on both sides of the aisle. On Tue, Dec 10, 2024 at 4:26 PM Darin Steffl <darin.ste...@mnwifi.com <mailto:darin.ste...@mnwifi.com> > wrote: I think you're drinking the conspiracy kool-aid with this claim. I'm 33 and when I was in school, they needed permission to provide me something small like Tylenol. I have family members who are teachers and kids in our family from elementary to highschool. I'm also in Minnesota which has been blue for a long time. There is absolutely zero truth to kids being secretly helped to transition with meds or operations. The claim is absurd. The claim that people support secret transition operations is also absurd. I'm socially liberal and fiscally conservative and this is not anything I would support. I doubt you'll find any sane adult that supports this. That means the democratic party absolutely does not support this either. What I and most of the party does support is talking with kids who feel their gender doesn't match the way they were born. This means therapy, counseling, consultations with a doctor to talk through everything. Parents should be involved in the conversations if the child wants to do anything more than talk. Things like medications and such should not be provided without parental and doctor involvement. Again, there is ZERO evidence of schools providing any sort of medical treatment, prescriptions, or operations in secret to kids. Any such claim to the contrary is absurd. They don't have enough money for class supplies as it is. What I do support is the school keeping the gender identity and sexuality private from parents IF the child feels the parents will be abusive to them if they come out. There's plenty of examples of strict or religious parents who would abuse or kick out a child if they came out as trans or LGBT. The privacy protection is something I'm onboard with. Anything more than counseling should not be allowed until parents are involved and a doctor agrees with any plans. Ideally, no physical operations will happen until they're 18 under any circumstances. This is my opinion as a slightly left of center voter. Republicans should be in full support of these views as the self proclaimed "freedom party". Unfortunately they've repositioned themselves to be in favor of government control with: book bans, white washing history, controlling women's Healthcare, trying to ban same sex marriage, forcing religion (specifically Christianity) into public schools, threatening to imprison the media and people who speak out against them. Republicans are not about freedom anymore since Trump became popular. I hope once he's done with his second term that the party can return to normal. On Tue, Dec 10, 2024, 5:55 PM Ken Hohhof <khoh...@kwom.com <mailto:khoh...@kwom.com> > wrote: K-12 schools I am familiar with won't give out a Tylenol without parents permission, I'm not sure if they can apply a bandaid. So I'm skeptical about the meds part. ---- Original Message ---- From: ch...@go-mtc.com <mailto:ch...@go-mtc.com> Sent: 12/10/2024 1:28:27 PM To: af@af.afmug.com <mailto:af@af.afmug.com> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Analogy OK, how can I strengthen the analogy? I kinda want it to have a bit of a gotcha effect. I am purposely trying to be a bit vague as to practitioner and meds. From: Bill Prince Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2024 12:07 PM To: af@af.afmug.com <mailto:af@af.afmug.com> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Analogy That's why context is so important. "Practitioner" is pretty subjective, as is "meds". What if the meds were LSD, methamphetamine, psilocybin, morphine? What if the practitioner were RFK Jr? Analogy is weak. bp <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com> On 12/10/2024 9:17 AM, ch...@go-mtc.com <mailto:ch...@go-mtc.com> wrote: Does this idea work: Say the school observes/detects a certain trait in your kid. The kid seemingly agrees with the people at the school. They think that if they can get the kid treatment, the kid will be much happier and relaxed. So they pursue some counseling for the kid and help the kid obtain some treatment meds from a practitioner. All without the knowledge of the parents. Seemingly the kid is happier and more well adjusted. They become gregarious and outgoing and find it easier to find friends. Nobody seems to tell the kid or be worried about the long term physical and mental effects. Some folks in this nation think this is totally OK. All for the kid right. Now, a few details I left out: The teacher thinks the kid might be an alcoholic. There is some science that hints that alcholism is genetic. The school thinks that it might be helpful for the kid to explore the world of alcohol. They give the kid some books on mixology etc. So they set up a kid bar with a bar tender to give them their meds during the day. 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