Yes, all things being equal. They weren’t equal. The problem with wider channels is same signal, double the noise, unless the EIRP limit is dBm/MHz not dBm. 900 MHz has a hard EIRP limit +36 dBm, at both AP and CPE.
Still in most bands practical experience says wider channel always increases capacity despite hurting SNR. 900 MHz seemed to be an exception. Probably because there is so much interference, you can see distant interferers due to low FSL, narrow antenna patterns and low sidelobes are difficult at low frequencies, plus high power paging immediately adjacent to the 900 MHz ISM band. Whatever the reason, we reverted to 10 MHz channels in 900. Bottom line though is there are were radios that could use 20 MHz of the 26 MHz. From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Friday, October 4, 2024 11:42 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Tarana G2 Double the channel size would double the throughput. On Fri, Oct 4, 2024 at 12:37 PM Ken Hohhof <khoh...@kwom.com <mailto:khoh...@kwom.com> > wrote: 900 MHz version of 450i can use 20 MHz channels, that’s not the entire band but pretty close, wasn’t it 26 MHz (902-928)? My experience though was going from a 10 MHz channel to 20 MHz didn’t typically gain much in actual throughput. That product is EOL now. We abandoned 900 MHz because of smartgrid interference, although I think we still have 2 legacy subs on 1 AP. From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf Of ch...@go-mtc.com <mailto:ch...@go-mtc.com> Sent: Friday, October 4, 2024 11:10 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com <mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Tarana G2 I was always asking Motorola to make a version of 900 that used the entire band. In some rural applications it would have worked just find and could have gotten full speed out of it. Was never to be. I wonder if they could have applied the Orthogon method to 900. From: Jeff Broadwick - Lists Sent: Friday, October 4, 2024 8:34 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Tarana G2 BTW, we’ve seen people replace 900 MHz with 3GHz Tarana and the results have been terrific. Regards, Jeff Jeff Broadwick CTIconnect 312-205-2519 Office 574-220-7826 Cell jbroadw...@cticonnect.com <mailto:jbroadw...@cticonnect.com> On Oct 4, 2024, at 10:19 AM, Jeff Broadwick - Lists <jeffl...@att.net <mailto:jeffl...@att.net> > wrote: It won’t hit everything, but within 10 miles or so, 3GHz goes through a ton of foliage and 5 and 6 will generally go through a line of trees. Nothing goes through dirt, but Tarana embraces multipath so it’s quite possible that you can get a solid connection off of a carom shot (mainly off of buildings)…people are doing that all over the place. The interference mitigation isn’t magic, but it’s freaking close. We’ve been selling it for 3 years, so I’ve seen quite a few scenarios. Regards, Jeff Jeff Broadwick CTIconnect 312-205-2519 Office 574-220-7826 Cell jbroadw...@cticonnect.com <mailto:jbroadw...@cticonnect.com> On Oct 4, 2024, at 9:43 AM, dmmoff...@gmail.com <mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com> wrote: Jeff, I know someone who tested Tarana and he seems convinced that it’s the NLOS holy grail that we always wanted. Like what every Wimax and LTE vendor promised us and couldn’t deliver. We have a long history in the industry which should make us all skeptical of NLOS claims so I’m curious if it’s really as great as all that. Any comment, Jeff? When we were doing 5ghz canopy, we bracketed our city with a dozen towers to give ourselves lots of options and we still had to end up saying “no” to half our installs. This is urban/suburban so we’re usually talking about one rooftop or one row of trees in the way. At most 100ft of foliage to penetrate before you’re in clear skies. 5ghz Canopy would work, but it tended to be unreliable in those conditions and we just found it wasn’t worth the trouble and the damage to our credibility if we installed it. Our Alvarion VL using neighbors always talked up how well their thing worked NLOS, but their actual outcomes and my own testing of the product told me that it only “works” NLOS within certain definitions of “works”, i.e.: you’d have to willing to accept high error rates and low MCS as “working”. Anything else built around a WiFi chipset I’d lump in with Alvarion. 900mhz of course worked within the limits of its bandwidth and high interference, and I’d say more or less the same about 2.4ghz. Wimax was an incremental improvement because you could get some predictable and reliable outcomes NLOS, but your NLOS customers are still lowering efficiency of the system due to retransmits and lower MCS, and I never saw a Wimax product that wasn’t a total PITA on the management side. I bitched endlessly about the Motorola CAP320, but after seeing what some other vendors had I think CAP320 might have been the cream of the crop as far as operability. LTE was another incremental step up, but at best maybe half as good as it was hyped up to be. If Tarana makes every install a success then we should give them all of our money and be happy to do it, but it absolutely better work. -Adam From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf Of Jeff Broadwick - Lists Sent: Friday, October 04, 2024 8:40 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com <mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Tarana G2 I can get you any pricing you need. My understanding is that the G2 will be dual band, 3 and 6GHz. It will be able to use 4x 40MHz channels and still provide all the interference mitigation of the G1 with 2x 40MHz channels. I’m sure there is more, but that is what I know now. Regards, Jeff Jeff Broadwick CTIconnect 312-205-2519 Office 574-220-7826 Cell jbroadw...@cticonnect.com <mailto:jbroadw...@cticonnect.com> On Oct 3, 2024, at 6:43 PM, Dev <d...@logicalwebhost.com <mailto:d...@logicalwebhost.com> > wrote: I wish Tarana’s price was the actual price, instead of sometimes a ton, sometimes a half a ton, sometimes don’t know. That way, I could calculate how many decades it would be until each customer would be profitable (outside of subsidized builds). On Oct 3, 2024, at 3:04 PM, Jason McKemie <j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com <mailto:j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> > wrote: The G1 is expensive enough, are people actually deploying these on a large scale? The AP is pricey, but not necessarily a deal-breaker - those subscriber units though... On Thu, Oct 3, 2024 at 1:21 PM Ken Hohhof <khoh...@kwom.com <mailto:khoh...@kwom.com> > wrote: Osborne Effect refers to one of the most infamous marketing fails of all time. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect Has Tarana done this by announcing the G2 while all they have shipping is the G1? Or is the G2 so much more expensive that it’s just for window shopping anyway? I figure if these are being bought with BEAD money, frugality may be out the window. -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com _____ -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com <mailto:AF@af.afmug.com> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
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