Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-11-05 Thread Adam Roach
[speaking as an individual] On 10/6/18 00:30, Adam Roach wrote: I strongly support enumerating the concerns raised in the HRPC review as part of this document. Since this came up during today's REGEXT meeting, I wanted to clarify something. I made the above quoted statement assuming that no

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Niels ten Oever
On 10/05/2018 04:18 PM, Eliot Lear wrote: <> > He gave *an* example. There were several examples mentioned earlier, all of which turned out not be planning to implement 3rd party verification. > You implied then that it was the only use case. No other has been mentioned to date. So am curious

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Gould, James
Peter, I agree that the sentence "The data verified by the VSP MUST be stored by the VSP along with the generated verification code to address any compliance issues." should be changed. The proposal that I posted (https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/regext/UWdcY2q-9JkSlASV0UJcUGPJJyQ) to th

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Adam Roach
[as an individual] On 10/5/18 8:17 AM, Thomas Corte wrote: Generally, technical standards are IMHO not the appropriate place for fighting political or societal issues. At the IETF 98 plenary in Chicago, David Clark said something on the topic of human rights that's really resonated with me e

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Andrew Sullivan
On Fri, Oct 05, 2018 at 04:16:04PM +0200, Niels ten Oever wrote: > The difference between NAT and 3rd party verification is that there was > a significant demand for the former, and not for the latter. It seems to me that the WG is a place where a bunch of people who work on registries and registr

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Peter Koch
On Fri, Oct 05, 2018 at 09:59:43AM -0400, Andrew Sullivan wrote: > and I'm all in favour of that. What you are arguing, however, is in > line with the way the IETF ended up doing the BEHAVE WG: we wouldn't this case is probably more related to the discussion around RFC 2804. > I think it would

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Eliot Lear
On 05.10.18 14:08, Niels ten Oever wrote: > We might disagree here. If there is one place in which this extension > might be useful, I am not sure whether standardization is appropriate > because there is only one (potential) implementation. Again, not required (albeit desirable).  RFC 2026 st

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Eliot Lear
On 05.10.18 14:05, Niels ten Oever wrote: > On 10/05/2018 01:55 PM, Eliot Lear wrote: >> I take no position on the HR issues of this draft.  However: >> >> >>> If there is only one instance in which this MAY be useful, perhaps there >>> is no need for standardization of this extension? >>> >> Not

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Niels ten Oever
On 10/05/2018 03:59 PM, Andrew Sullivan wrote: > On Fri, Oct 05, 2018 at 03:24:08PM +0200, Niels ten Oever wrote: >> We cannot simply wish political implications of our work away. > > Right, but I don't believe the HRPC work has suggested that things > that have HR implications should _not be done

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Andrew Sullivan
On Fri, Oct 05, 2018 at 03:24:08PM +0200, Niels ten Oever wrote: > We cannot simply wish political implications of our work away. Right, but I don't believe the HRPC work has suggested that things that have HR implications should _not be done_. They should be noted, and I'm all in favour of that.

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Niels ten Oever
On 10/05/2018 03:17 PM, Thomas Corte wrote: > Hello, > > On 10/5/18 15:01, Niels ten Oever wrote: > >> If this would be a standard in response to a demand, that would be fine. >> But I am rather afraid this is a standard that will create policy and >> practice. Namely the practice of 3rd party id

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Thomas Corte
Hello, On 10/5/18 15:01, Niels ten Oever wrote: > If this would be a standard in response to a demand, that would be fine. > But I am rather afraid this is a standard that will create policy and > practice. Namely the practice of 3rd party identity verification > providers. Since there is legisla

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Niels ten Oever
On 10/05/2018 02:48 PM, Andrew Sullivan wrote: > On Fri, Oct 05, 2018 at 02:08:38PM +0200, Niels ten Oever wrote: > >> We might disagree here. If there is one place in which this extension >> might be useful, I am not sure whether standardization is appropriate >> because there is only one (pot

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Andrew Sullivan
On Fri, Oct 05, 2018 at 02:08:38PM +0200, Niels ten Oever wrote: > We might disagree here. If there is one place in which this extension > might be useful, I am not sure whether standardization is appropriate > because there is only one (potential) implementation. That leads me to > the question:

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Niels ten Oever
On 10/05/2018 01:55 PM, Eliot Lear wrote: > I take no position on the HR issues of this draft.  However: > > >> If there is only one instance in which this MAY be useful, perhaps there >> is no need for standardization of this extension? >> > > Not the way we do business.  We ask this question o

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-05 Thread Eliot Lear
I take no position on the HR issues of this draft.  However: > If there is only one instance in which this MAY be useful, perhaps there > is no need for standardization of this extension? > Not the way we do business.  We ask this question on the front end of the process, not the back end.  That

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-04 Thread bzs
Re: tagging discussion I don't see content tagging as only negative. I could imagine such a facility being used positively such as tagging some content as "child friendly". Which is why my interest in the topic is more in mechanism than policy. One would still have to trust the source of the t

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-03 Thread Vittorio Bertola
> Il 3 ottobre 2018 alle 18.01 Erwin Lansing ha scritto: > > > > On 3 Oct 2018, at 17.39, Ulrich Wisser < ulr...@wisser.se> wrote: > > > > > > Denmark has plans to only allow registrations with a Danish electronic id. > > > I’m sorry to barge in and distract from the real discussion here, >

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-03 Thread Erwin Lansing
> On 3 Oct 2018, at 17.39, Ulrich Wisser wrote: > > Denmark has plans to only allow registrations with a Danish electronic id. I’m sorry to barge in and distract from the real discussion here, but I cannot let such a blatant inaccuracy stand. There are no such plans, neither have there ever b

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-03 Thread Ulrich Wisser
Hi, I completely agree with Gurshabad assessment. But as others already pointed out, it is an intended consequence of the extension. In the context of domain registration, privacy cannot be expected. So my question is rather, does this extension make the situation worse? As you were asking for ex

Re: [regext] [hrpc] Human Rights Review of draft-ietf-regext-verificationcode

2018-10-03 Thread Vittorio Bertola
> Il 3 ottobre 2018 alle 15.42 Niels ten Oever < > li...@digitaldissidents.org mailto:li...@digitaldissidents.org > ha scritto: > > > On Wed, Oct 03, 2018 at 01:14:10PM +, Gould, James wrote: > > > > > > > > > > The draft is intended for interoperabili