Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

I believe Jimmy's confusion results primarily as follows: From NRPM 8.3: > 8.3. Transfers between Specified Recipients within the ARIN Region > > In addition to transfers under section 8.2, IPv4 numbers resources and ASNs > may be transferred according to the following conditions. > Conditions o

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On May 1, 2013, at 3:51 AM, Matthew Kaufman wrote: > Now, the actual language that is in the NRPM says "The recipient must > demonstrate the need for up to a 24-month supply* of IP address resources > under current ARIN policies and sign an RSA." ... if someone thinks that > "demonstrate the n

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 4/30/2013 10:36 PM, Jimmy Hess wrote: On 4/30/13, Owen DeLong wrote: With all due respect, this is a reference in section 8.3 to call out that the policies in section 4 regarding qualification of recipients are to be followed when determining eligibility for an 8.3 transfer. I don't read a

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 4/30/13, Owen DeLong wrote: > With all due respect, this is a reference in section 8.3 to call out that > the policies in section 4 regarding qualification of recipients are to be > followed when determining eligibility for an 8.3 transfer. I don't read a reference to section 4 there. don't

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

>> This says demonstrate the need for resources. > The "under current policies" bit is redundant, because the transfer policy > is referring to itself. Of course the current policies always apply; so > this is some strange infinitely recursive oddity. > Jimmy, With all due respect, this is a ref

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 30, 2013, at 10:56 PM, Jimmy Hess mailto:mysi...@gmail.com>> wrote: On Tuesday, April 30, 2013, John Curran wrote: On Apr 30, 2013, at 1:46 AM, Jimmy Hess > wrote: > On 4/29/13, John Curran > wrote: >> On Apr 29, 2013, at 2:46 PM, Lee Howard > >> wrote: >>> On 4/29/13 1:03 AM, "Jérôme Ni

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Tuesday, April 30, 2013, John Curran wrote: > On Apr 30, 2013, at 1:46 AM, Jimmy Hess > > wrote: > > > On 4/29/13, John Curran > wrote: > >> On Apr 29, 2013, at 2:46 PM, Lee Howard > > wrote: > >>> On 4/29/13 1:03 AM, "Jérôme Nicolle" > > wrote: > >> specified (based on being singly-homed or mu

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 30, 2013, at 1:46 AM, Jimmy Hess wrote: > On 4/29/13, John Curran wrote: >> On Apr 29, 2013, at 2:46 PM, Lee Howard wrote: >>> On 4/29/13 1:03 AM, "Jérôme Nicolle" wrote: >> specified (based on being singly-homed or multi-homed.) These same >> criteria now apply to receipt of an addres

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 4/29/13, John Curran wrote: > On Apr 29, 2013, at 2:46 PM, Lee Howard wrote: >> On 4/29/13 1:03 AM, "Jérôme Nicolle" wrote: > specified (based on being singly-homed or multi-homed.) These same > criteria now apply to receipt of an address block via transfer, so at > regional IPv4 free pool d

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

Other AC members and I are in the process of crafting a proposal to address this issue. Please stay tuned. I hope to have something ready to post to PPML in the next few weeks. Owen On Apr 29, 2013, at 12:19 PM, John Curran wrote: > On Apr 29, 2013, at 2:46 PM, Lee Howard wrote: > >> On 4/

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 29, 2013, at 2:46 PM, Lee Howard wrote: > On 4/29/13 1:03 AM, "Jérôme Nicolle" wrote: > >> It is necessary to keep an acceptable churn and still allocate small >> blocks to newcomers, merely to deploy CGNs. >> >> Not doing so would end up in courts for entry barrier enforced by a >> mon

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 4/29/13 1:03 AM, "Jérôme Nicolle" wrote: >Le 24/04/2013 07:46, Tore Anderson a écrit : >> Trying to reclaim and redistribute unused space would be a tremendous >> waste of effort. > >It is necessary to keep an acceptable churn and still allocate small >blocks to newcomers, merely to deploy C

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 4/29/13, Jérôme Nicolle wrote: > Therefore it is inevitable to reclaim unused address space as long as > there's a demand for IPv4, wich will still be strong as long as major > players refuse to do their jobs. The RIRs are very limited in what unused resources they could seek to reclaim; there

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

Le 24/04/2013 07:46, Tore Anderson a écrit : > Trying to reclaim and redistribute unused space would be a tremendous > waste of effort. It is necessary to keep an acceptable churn and still allocate small blocks to newcomers, merely to deploy CGNs. Not doing so would end up in courts for entry ba

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 26, 2013, at 10:49 PM, Randy Bush wrote: >>> amusing how much curran is interested in asserting his/arin's power and >>> rights and how little he speaks to the interest of the internet and the >>> isps. >> The power is in the hands of this community > > what bollocks Well, given that any

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

sorry, bug in .procmailrc. bye.

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 24, 2013, at 1:42 PM, Andrew Latham wrote: > FYI, What can ARIN, RIPE et al do to reclaim > http://www.spamhaus.org/drop/drop.txt networks? If you know that one of these blocks has been hijacked at ARIN, and can provide some supporting information, then please report it here:

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 26, 2013, at 10:49 PM, Randy Bush wrote: >>> amusing how much curran is interested in asserting his/arin's power and >>> rights and how little he speaks to the interest of the internet and the >>> isps. >> The power is in the hands of this community > > what bollocks Well, given that any

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

>> amusing how much curran is interested in asserting his/arin's power and >> rights and how little he speaks to the interest of the internet and the >> isps. > The power is in the hands of this community what bollocks

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 25, 2013, at 5:24 PM, Randy Bush wrote: > amusing how much curran is interested in asserting his/arin's power and > rights and how little he speaks to the interest of the internet and the > isps. The power is in the hands of this community; they get to set whatever policies are used for

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

I can be available feel free to call. On 4/26/13 10:46 AM, "Chris Adams" wrote: >Once upon a time, Owen DeLong said: >> As I understand it you can get some funky level of IPv6 on some of the >>older >> AWS products. I'm glad to hear that BING is now on IPv6. Guess they were >> getting scroogled

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 04/26/2013 05:37 AM, Tore Anderson wrote: * Owen DeLong Quite the contrary… I personally think that the abysmal rate of IPv6 adoption among some content providers (Are you listening, Amazon, Xbox, BING?) is just plain shameful. FWIW, www.bing.com resolves to IPv6 addresses from where I'm s

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

> Bing supports IPv6: http://www.worldipv6launch.org/ Noted. > The site www.xbox.com supports IPv6 (ditto), but the Xbox device does not. Noted. > My favorite place to see what content supports IPv6 is Eric Vyncke's site: > http://www.vyncke.org/ipv6status/detailed.php?country=us An excellent

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

Once upon a time, Owen DeLong said: > As I understand it you can get some funky level of IPv6 on some of the older > AWS products. I'm glad to hear that BING is now on IPv6. Guess they were > getting scroogled for that failure. ;-) I believe Bing is Akamaized (it is for me anyway), so whether you

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

As I understand it you can get some funky level of IPv6 on some of the older AWS products. I'm glad to hear that BING is now on IPv6. Guess they were getting scroogled for that failure. ;-) At least so far, this remains a problem: Owens-MacBook-Pro:blink-cocoa owendelong$ dig amazon.com ; <

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 4/26/13 7:31 AM, "Owen DeLong" wrote: > >On Apr 25, 2013, at 10:49 PM, Michael Thomas wrote: > >> On 04/25/2013 07:27 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: At some level, I wonder how much the feedback loop of "providers won't deploy ipv6 because everybody says they won't deploy ipv6" has c

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 25, 2013 10:29 PM, "joel jaeggli" wrote: > > On 4/25/13 10:16 PM, Matt Palmer wrote: >> >> On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 07:49:03PM -0700, Michael Thomas wrote: >>> >>> On 04/25/2013 07:27 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: AWS stands out as a complete laggard in this area. >>> >>> Heh... that's wh

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 26, 2013, at 10:23 AM, Chris Grundemann wrote: > > One interesting twist in all of this is that several of these new > "slow-start" players in the ARIN region seem to be servicing customers > outside of the region with equipment and services hosted here inside > the ARIN region (see slide

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Fri, Apr 26, 2013 at 3:12 AM, Geoff Huston wrote: > > On 26/04/2013, at 4:27 PM, joel jaeggli wrote: > >>> >>> I also find it a bit strange that the runout in APNIC and RIPE was very >>> different. APNIC address allocation rate accelerated at the end, whereas >>> RIPE exhaustion date kept cr

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Thu, 25 Apr 2013, joel jaeggli wrote: On 4/25/13 10:16 PM, Matt Palmer wrote: On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 07:49:03PM -0700, Michael Thomas wrote: Even if the only thing that supported IPv6 was ELB, and everything else was still IPv4 internally, that'd put a lot of traffic on IPv6 very quickly

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

* Owen DeLong > Quite the contrary… I personally think that the abysmal rate of IPv6 > adoption among some content providers (Are you listening, Amazon, > Xbox, BING?) is just plain shameful. FWIW, www.bing.com resolves to IPv6 addresses from where I'm sitting (Oslo), and the page seems to load o

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 25, 2013, at 10:49 PM, Michael Thomas wrote: > On 04/25/2013 07:27 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: >>> At some level, I wonder how much the feedback loop of "providers >>> won't deploy ipv6 because everybody says they won't deploy ipv6" >>> has caused this self-fulfilling prophecy :/ >> It's a def

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 26/04/2013, at 4:27 PM, joel jaeggli wrote: >> >> I also find it a bit strange that the runout in APNIC and RIPE was very >> different. APNIC address allocation rate accelerated at the end, whereas >> RIPE exhaustion date kept creeping forward in time instead of closer in >> time, giving

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 4/24/13 1:55 AM, Mikael Abrahamsson wrote: On Wed, 24 Apr 2013, Geoff Huston wrote: However, personally I find it a little hard to place a high probability on Tony's projected exhaustion date of August this year. I also have to qualify that by noting that while I think that a runout of the

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 4/25/13 10:16 PM, Matt Palmer wrote: On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 07:49:03PM -0700, Michael Thomas wrote: On 04/25/2013 07:27 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: AWS stands out as a complete laggard in this area. Heh... that's why I put all kinds of question marks and hedges :) That's disappointing about aws

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 07:49:03PM -0700, Michael Thomas wrote: > On 04/25/2013 07:27 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: > >AWS stands out as a complete laggard in this area. > > Heh... that's why I put all kinds of question marks and hedges :) > That's disappointing about aws. On the other hand, if aws light

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 04/25/2013 07:27 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: At some level, I wonder how much the feedback loop of "providers won't deploy ipv6 because everybody says they won't deploy ipv6" has caused this self-fulfilling prophecy :/ It's a definite issue. The bigger issue is the financial incentives are all in

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

> At some level, I wonder how much the feedback loop of "providers > won't deploy ipv6 because everybody says they won't deploy ipv6" > has caused this self-fulfilling prophecy :/ It's a definite issue. The bigger issue is the financial incentives are all in the wrong direction. Eyeball networks

RE: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

Frank -Original Message- From: David Conrad [mailto:d...@virtualized.org] Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2013 12:27 PM To: Andrew Latham Cc: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM On Apr 24, 2013, at 9:59 AM, Andrew Latham wrote: >>

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

> There was some good information shared at the recent INET Denver on > value vs. price and how to determine value of an IPv4 address, you can > watch the panel discussion on YouTube: http://youtu.be/v43CGqq70rM. amusing how much curran is interested in asserting his/arin's power and rights and ho

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 12:11 PM, Mikael Abrahamsson wrote: > There is a lot of speculation what IPv4 addresses are worth, I've been > hearing everything from a few USD to 20 EUR per address. There was some good information shared at the recent INET Denver on value vs. price and how to determine

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 04/25/2013 11:09 AM, Owen DeLong wrote: On Apr 25, 2013, at 11:24 AM, Michael Thomas wrote: So here is the question I have: when we run out, is there *anything* that will reasonably allow an ISP to *not* deploy carrier grade NAT? Assuming that it's death for the ISP to just say no to the lo

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 25, 2013, at 11:24 AM, Michael Thomas wrote: > So here is the question I have: when we run out, is there *anything* that > will reasonably allow an ISP to *not* deploy carrier grade NAT? Assuming > that it's death for the ISP to just say no to the long tail of legacy v4-only > sites? Thi

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Thu, 25 Apr 2013, Michael Thomas wrote: On 04/25/2013 10:10 AM, Brandon Ross wrote: On Thu, 25 Apr 2013, Michael Thomas wrote: So here is the question I have: when we run out, is there *anything* that will reasonably allow an ISP to *not* deploy carrier grade NAT? Do you count NAT64 or M

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 04/25/2013 10:10 AM, Brandon Ross wrote: On Thu, 25 Apr 2013, Michael Thomas wrote: So here is the question I have: when we run out, is there *anything* that will reasonably allow an ISP to *not* deploy carrier grade NAT? Do you count NAT64 or MAP as carrier grade NAT? I suppose that the

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Thu, 25 Apr 2013, Michael Thomas wrote: So here is the question I have: when we run out, is there *anything* that will reasonably allow an ISP to *not* deploy carrier grade NAT? Do you count NAT64 or MAP as carrier grade NAT? One thing that occurs to me though is that it's sort of in an I

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Thu, 25 Apr 2013, John Levine wrote: Once people realize that there's no more free v4 space to be had, or only little bits, that the market will develop and a lot of space will appear for sale. For example, there's an educational insitution near Boston that's sitting on a /8. If the price

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

In article <51794abf.5040...@mtcc.com> you write: >So here is the question I have: when we run out, is there *anything* that >will reasonably allow an ISP to *not* deploy carrier grade NAT? Assuming >that it's death for the ISP to just say no to the long tail of legacy v4-only >sites? Sure. Enoug

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

So here is the question I have: when we run out, is there *anything* that will reasonably allow an ISP to *not* deploy carrier grade NAT? Assuming that it's death for the ISP to just say no to the long tail of legacy v4-only sites? One thing that occurs to me though is that it's sort of in an ISP

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

Yes. We figured this out and we are starting a program (or a set of activities) to promote the deployment of IPv6 in what we call "End-users organizations" (basically enterprises, universities). We are seeing much lower adoption numbers than our ISP's categories. One basi

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 24, 2013, at 6:48 PM, "Justin M. Streiner" wrote: > On Wed, 24 Apr 2013, Fred Baker (fred) wrote: > >> http://www22.verizon.com/Support/Residential/Internet/HighSpeed/General+Support/Top+Questions/QuestionsOne/ATLAS8742.htm > > One minor typo in this one, that I've emailed Verizon's we

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

> Frankly, the ISPs likely to be tracking this list aren't the people holding > back there. To pick on one that is fairly public, Verizon Wireline is running > dual stack for at least its FIOS customers, and also deploying CGN, and being > pretty up front about the impacts of CGN. Verizon Wirele

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

> The really troubling thing that I don't get is why RR got a pile of little > blocks rather than a /12 up front. I don't know if that is an impact of > broken policy, internal deployment decisions about 'right size' allocations > rather than intentional deaggregation, or trying to 'fly under the r

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

* Justin M. Streiner (strei...@cluebyfour.org) wrote: > On Wed, 24 Apr 2013, Fred Baker (fred) wrote: > >http://www22.verizon.com/Support/Residential/Internet/HighSpeed/General+Support/Top+Questions/QuestionsOne/ATLAS8742.htm > > One minor typo in this one, that I've emailed Verizon's webmasters >

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 04/24/2013 05:34 PM, Fred Baker (fred) wrote: On Apr 24, 2013, at 4:50 PM, Michael Thomas wrote: On 04/24/2013 03:26 PM, Fred Baker (fred) wrote: Frankly, the ISPs likely to be tracking this list aren't the people holding back there. To pick on one that is fairly public, Verizon Wirelin

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 24, 2013, at 4:50 PM, Michael Thomas wrote: > On 04/24/2013 03:26 PM, Fred Baker (fred) wrote: >> >> Frankly, the ISPs likely to be tracking this list aren't the people holding >> back there. To pick on one that is fairly public, Verizon Wireline is >> running dual stack for at least

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 04/24/2013 03:26 PM, Fred Baker (fred) wrote: Frankly, the ISPs likely to be tracking this list aren't the people holding back there. To pick on one that is fairly public, Verizon Wireline is running dual stack for at least its FIOS customers, and also deploying CGN, and being pretty up fr

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Wed, 24 Apr 2013, Fred Baker (fred) wrote: http://www22.verizon.com/Support/Residential/Internet/HighSpeed/General+Support/Top+Questions/QuestionsOne/ATLAS8742.htm One minor typo in this one, that I've emailed Verizon's webmasters about in the past. A /56 does not give you 56 LANs... jm

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

I guess my question is what the difference is between the sharp-demand curve (Tony's latest, which perhaps mirrors APNIC's final few months of IPv4) and the straight-line curve. My read is that we're arguing about the difference between "late 2013" and "some time in 2014". I suspect that what mo

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

Le 24/04/2013 21:35, Lee Howard a écrit : > > On 4/24/13 2:45 PM, "ML" wrote: > >> On 4/23/2013 5:41 PM, Valdis Kletnieks wrote: >>> I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: >>> >>> http://tndh.net/~tony/ietf/ARIN-runout-projection.pdf >>> >>> tl;dr: ARIN predicted to run out of IP space

RE: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

Lee Howard wrote: > On 4/23/13 7:44 PM, "Geoff Huston" wrote: > > >On 24/04/2013, at 8:10 AM, Andrew Latham wrote: > > > >> On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 5:41 PM, Valdis Kletnieks > >> wrote: > >>> I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: > >>> > >>> http://tndh.net/~tony/ietf/ARIN-runout-pr

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

>I don't imagine they will be open to paying extortion prices for IPs >that other people never bothered to use. You know, sometimes life is just unfair. If they need the space, they'll have to figure out how to buy it.

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 4/24/13 2:45 PM, "ML" wrote: >On 4/23/2013 5:41 PM, Valdis Kletnieks wrote: >> I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: >> >> http://tndh.net/~tony/ietf/ARIN-runout-projection.pdf >> >> tl;dr: ARIN predicted to run out of IP space to allocate in August this >>year. >> >> Are you rea

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 24, 2013, at 2:45 PM, ML wrote: > On 4/23/2013 5:41 PM, Valdis Kletnieks wrote: >> I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: >> >> http://tndh.net/~tony/ietf/ARIN-runout-projection.pdf >> >> tl;dr: ARIN predicted to run out of IP space to allocate in August this year. >> >> Are

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 4/23/2013 5:41 PM, Valdis Kletnieks wrote: > I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: > > http://tndh.net/~tony/ietf/ARIN-runout-projection.pdf > > tl;dr: ARIN predicted to run out of IP space to allocate in August this year. > > Are you ready? > Where do the startup ISPs whom didn't

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

Black market is probably not the best phrase for the sources I have dug up today but here goes. Market Places http://addrex.net/ http://www.hilcostreambank.com/IPv4.asp http://www.kalorama.com/en/IPv4-IPv6-Advisory/IPv4-Acquisition-and-Divestiture/ News http://www.networkworld.com/news/2011/04141

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 1:42 PM, Andrew Latham wrote: > FYI, What can ARIN, RIPE et al do to reclaim > http://www.spamhaus.org/drop/drop.txt networks? > nothing since they don't control routability of the prefixes in question?

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

FYI, What can ARIN, RIPE et al do to reclaim http://www.spamhaus.org/drop/drop.txt networks? -- ~ Andrew "lathama" Latham lath...@gmail.com http://lathama.net ~

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

*Tore > That said - such speculation may well turn out to be correct, of course, > and being involved in the RIPE community I'm genuinely interested in the > topic. Therefore I was hoping you'd point me in the direction of "the > news of blackmarket sales of network allocations in Europe" you >

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

* Andrew Latham > If I can walk around a smallish town and point at 5 businesses like > this its a possible solution. I am not claiming a few /24s will do, I > am claiming that there are many (for larger values of many) companies > like this. There are certainly several thousands or even million

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 24, 2013, at 9:59 AM, Andrew Latham wrote: >> A demand curve would show that as prices increase, there is demand for fewer >> IPv4 addresses. And the other side of the coin: where there is demand and excess supply (e.g., allocated but unused addresses), the price increase would create an

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 12:55 PM, Lee Howard wrote: > > > On 4/24/13 10:18 AM, "Andrew Latham" wrote: > >>* Tore >> >>On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 1:46 AM, Tore Anderson wrote: >>> * Andrew Latham >>> I have sadly witnessed a growing number of businesses with /24s moving to colocation/aws n

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 4/24/13 10:18 AM, "Andrew Latham" wrote: >* Tore > >On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 1:46 AM, Tore Anderson wrote: >> * Andrew Latham >> >>> I have sadly witnessed a growing number of businesses with /24s >>> moving to colocation/aws networks and not giving up their unused >>> network space. I assum

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 4/23/13 7:44 PM, "Geoff Huston" wrote: >On 24/04/2013, at 8:10 AM, Andrew Latham wrote: > >> On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 5:41 PM, Valdis Kletnieks >> wrote: >>> I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: >>> >>> http://tndh.net/~tony/ietf/ARIN-runout-projection.pdf >>> >>> ARIN predic

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

this is still my favorite post on this subject: http://mailman.nanog.org/pipermail/nanog/2011-February/031737.html t On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 3:36 PM, staticsafe wrote: > On 4/23/2013 18:04, Leo Bicknell wrote: > > In a message written on Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 05:41:40PM -0400, > > Valdis Kletn

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 4/23/2013 18:04, Leo Bicknell wrote: > In a message written on Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 05:41:40PM -0400, > Valdis Kletnieks wrote: >> I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: >> >> http://tndh.net/~tony/ietf/ARIN-runout-projection.pdf >> >> tl;dr: ARIN predicted to run out of IP space to

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

* Tore On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 1:46 AM, Tore Anderson wrote: > * Andrew Latham > >> I have sadly witnessed a growing number of businesses with /24s >> moving to colocation/aws networks and not giving up their unused >> network space. I assume this will come into play soon. > > A couple of /24s be

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 8:07 AM, Tore Anderson wrote: > * Chris Grundemann > >> Nope, you are correct Geoff. There is a /10 reserved for transition >> technologies (e.g. outside addresses on a CGN) and there is a >> "critical infrastructure" reserve, but no general purpose reserve like >> in RIPE

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

* Chris Grundemann > Nope, you are correct Geoff. There is a /10 reserved for transition > technologies (e.g. outside addresses on a CGN) and there is a > "critical infrastructure" reserve, but no general purpose reserve like > in RIPE and APNIC. One interesting thing is that this is dedicated sp

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

* Mikael Abrahamsson > On Wed, 24 Apr 2013, Tore Anderson wrote: > >>> I have already read the news of blackmarket sales of network >>> allocations in Europe. >> >> Interesting. Do you have a link or some other kind of reference? > >

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 6:37 AM, Geoff Huston wrote: > But then again APNIC and RIPE NCC both had last /8 policies in place, which > has mitigated some of the impacts of address pool exhaustion. For smaller > actors there is still a source of addresses in these regions, albeit a very > limited

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 24/04/2013, at 6:55 PM, Mikael Abrahamsson wrote: > I also find it a bit strange that the runout in APNIC and RIPE was very > different. APNIC address allocation rate accelerated at the end, whereas RIPE > exhaustion date kept creeping forward in time instead of closer in time, > giving me

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 10:55:51AM +0200, Mikael Abrahamsson wrote: > I also find it a bit strange that the runout in APNIC and RIPE was very > different. APNIC address allocation rate accelerated at the end, whereas > RIPE exhaustion date kept creeping forward in time instead of closer in > tim

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 06:10:30PM -0400, Andrew Latham wrote: > > tl;dr: ARIN predicted to run out of IP space to allocate in August this > > year. > > > > Are you ready? > > I have sadly witnessed a growing number of businesses with /24s moving > to colocation/aws networks and not giving up th

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Wed, 24 Apr 2013, Geoff Huston wrote: However, personally I find it a little hard to place a high probability on Tony's projected exhaustion date of August this year. I also have to qualify that by noting that while I think that a runout of the remaining 40 M addresses within 4 months is im

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

Meanwhile, consumer-grade IPv6 still sucks, at "I have to turn off IPv6 to watch YouTube videos" levels of suck...

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On 24/04/2013, at 8:10 AM, Andrew Latham wrote: > On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 5:41 PM, Valdis Kletnieks > wrote: >> I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: >> >> http://tndh.net/~tony/ietf/ARIN-runout-projection.pdf >> >> ARIN predicted to run out of IP space to allocate in August this y

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

Black market sales, handing out /15s to Romanian spammers like candy .. Europe has had a lot of IP allocation fun On Wednesday, April 24, 2013, Andrew Latham wrote: > On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 5:41 PM, Valdis Kletnieks > > wrote: > > I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: > > > > http://

RE: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

M > To: Valdis Kletnieks > Cc: nanog@nanog.org > Subject: Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM > > On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 5:41 PM, Valdis Kletnieks > wrote: > > I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: > > > > htt

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Apr 23, 2013, at 5:41 PM, Valdis Kletnieks wrote: > Are you ready? I think what's very interesting for me is watching the consumer edge getting more IPv6 in north america. It's important for everyone to talk to their vendors (now is a good day to call/write them) about what their IPv6-Onl

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 04/23/2013 02:41 PM, Valdis Kletnieks wrote: | I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: | | http://tndh.net/~tony/ietf/ARIN-runout-projection.pdf | | tl;dr: ARIN predicted to run out of IP space to allocate in August this year. I haven'

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Wed, 24 Apr 2013, Tore Anderson wrote: I have already read the news of blackmarket sales of network allocations in Europe. Interesting. Do you have a link or some other kind of reference? is a "white market sales" place. Perh

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

* Andrew Latham > I have sadly witnessed a growing number of businesses with /24s > moving to colocation/aws networks and not giving up their unused > network space. I assume this will come into play soon. A couple of /24s being returned wouldn't make a significant difference when it comes to IPv

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Tue, 23 Apr 2013, Andrew Latham wrote: http://tndh.net/~tony/ietf/ARIN-runout-projection.pdf tl;dr: ARIN predicted to run out of IP space to allocate in August this year. http://www.potaroo.net/tools/ipv4/ says April 2014. That page worked well for the RIPE region. I assume this will co

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

Valdis Kletnieks writes: and I feel fine > I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: > > http://tndh.net/~tony/ietf/ARIN-runout-projection.pdf > > tl;dr: ARIN predicted to run out of IP space to allocate in August this > year. > > Are you ready? Personally? Yes! Customer side? No! Well

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 5:41 PM, Valdis Kletnieks wrote: > I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: > > http://tndh.net/~tony/ietf/ARIN-runout-projection.pdf > > tl;dr: ARIN predicted to run out of IP space to allocate in August this year. > > Are you ready? I have sadly witnessed a grow

Re: "It's the end of the world as we know it" -- REM

In a message written on Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 05:41:40PM -0400, Valdis Kletnieks wrote: > I didn't see any mention of this Tony Hain paper: > > http://tndh.net/~tony/ietf/ARIN-runout-projection.pdf > > tl;dr: ARIN predicted to run out of IP space to allocate in August this year. Here's a Geoff H