>
> You should be using area scoring only and if you are playing handicap
> games then either YOU or MOGO is not counting them the same. Or
> perhaps Mogo has a bug in the handicap code.
>
MoGo uses KGS handicap counting (add 1 point to white for each handicap
stone) if the GTP set_handicap_st
Hi Edward,
Edward de Grijs: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>Hi Hideki,
>
>The file is used by:
>cat file | mogo
I guess MoGo doesn't check end-of-file of stdin.
>Adding quit to the file lets mogo quit the game, but
>I want to let mogo wait for the obvious next command like
>play b
Then, you can mak
Hi is last black move A4 really illegal in cgos rules?
Just ensure before start change things. It seemed weird.
White D9 shouls change board situation and white kills two stones before A4
is getting then
one stone back fine? t. harri
W A4
9 WW..W.WWW
8 ...W.W.W.
7 WBW..
6 WBBWBBWWW
5 .WWWBB
You are almost certainly using incorrect scoring. Mogo is a Monte
Carlo program and doesn't care if it wins by 1 point or 50, so it will
have the behavior you are claiming.
However, it won't lose games that way. If it's passively filling in
it's own territory while you steal a won game from
On Wed, 2007-12-05 at 17:52 -0800, terry mcintyre wrote:
> I just finished a few 19x19 games with the freely downloadable version
> of Mogo, and noticed that Mogo loses a fair number of points in the
> endgame.
This is typical of MC engines...
If it's winning by 100.5 points, it'll lose 100 poin
I just finished a few 19x19 games with the freely downloadable version of Mogo,
and noticed that Mogo loses a fair number of points in the endgame.
I'll email an sgf file shortly, but the pattern is fairly easy to describe:
when territories have been fairly well enclosed, Mogo will just as often
On Wed, 5 Dec 2007, Joel Veness wrote:
I have been thinking about making a version of Goanna (~2250 on CGOS)
public, once it plays in a human friendly way.
Thanks,
Christoph
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The cgos 9x9 Game Archives have been updated will all the November 2007
games. Previously the last few days were missing because they were
extracted before the month had ended.
http://cgos.boardspace.net/index.html
- Don
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On Dec 5, 2007 3:17 PM, Lars <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Thank you for your explanations!
> You were right, it was a bug, and now it works really fine.
>
Are you (or Remi) willing to publish any of the following?
1. Source code for extracting ELO ratings for moves
2. Full list of gamma values, i
Thank you for your explanations!
You were right, it was a bug, and now it works really fine.
My results look more or less similar than yours now.
But I still don't understand where you get the standard deviation 302
from. But the mean 0 is clear now! ;)
@Jason:
Thank you although! I'm already
On Dec 5, 2007 1:35 PM, Don Dailey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Yes, I think there is a lot to this.Searching by depth is rather
> arbitrary.
>
> I think this basic idea is called "realization probabilities" and I
> thought of doing it with the Bradley Terry model.
>
> It also occurred to me
Nick Wedd wrote:
> In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, steve uurtamo
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes
>
> < snip >
>
>> to this end, if anyone wants to organize a 9x9 tournament on
>> kgs (i'm not sure how this is done) where computer players
>> are allowed (encouraged) to play, with cgos-like time contr
Yes, I think there is a lot to this.Searching by depth is rather
arbitrary.
I think this basic idea is called "realization probabilities" and I
thought of doing it with the Bradley Terry model.
It also occurred to me that if a move with low probability turns out to
be the best move at some
On Wed, 5 Dec 2007, Jacques Basaldúa wrote:
The correct answer should be: dan does not exist for board sizes other than
19. And it is impossible to define a consistent scale made of 30
levels for 9x9. Perhaps 9x9 has only 10 or 12 levels. Defining a step
in level as being a standard deviation ab
On Tue, 4 Dec 2007, Joshua Shriver wrote:
I've been working hard and hope to have an alpha program on CGOS by
Christmas. Know last time I asked this, one useful reply gave just 4-5
commands that were essential.
I have the full spec, and nothing look terribly hard, but I want to get the
minimal c
In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, steve uurtamo
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes
< snip >
to this end, if anyone wants to organize a 9x9 tournament on
kgs (i'm not sure how this is done) where computer players
are allowed (encouraged) to play, with cgos-like time controls,
I think that only a few pe
On Dec 5, 2007 11:33 AM, Erik van der Werf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Dec 5, 2007 5:01 PM, Álvaro Begué <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > On Dec 5, 2007 9:33 AM, Erik van der Werf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> > >
> > > Look for Realization Probability Search.
> >
> > Oh, thanks! I knew it was
On Dec 5, 2007 5:01 PM, Álvaro Begué <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Dec 5, 2007 9:33 AM, Erik van der Werf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > Look for Realization Probability Search.
>
> Oh, thanks! I knew it was too natural to be original. Well, I actually
> thought about it around 1998, so it mi
two followups, and i'm sorry for not referencing the
original notes directly:
i) i agree that 9x9 has fewer standard deviations of
skill. there's simply less to be good at (ladders are
tiny, life and death can only be so large, the difference
between influence and territory is skewed, etc.). thi
I'm in charge of organizing a computer Go event at this year's
Congress. Right now I'm trying to get one or more local companies to
donate machines and/or prize money.
I really doubt we can subsidize travel.
Stay tuned...
Peter Drake
http://www.lclark.edu/~drake/
On Dec 4, 2007, at 6:23
On Dec 5, 2007 9:33 AM, Erik van der Werf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Look for Realization Probability Search.
>
>
Oh, thanks! I knew it was too natural to be original. Well, I actually
thought about it around 1998, so it might have been new back then.
This is very close to what I was saying:
Hi Edward,
Edward de Grijs: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>Hi Hideki,
>
>The file is used by:
>cat file | mogo
I guess MoGo doesn't check end-of-file of stdin.
>Adding quit to the file lets mogo quit the game, but
>I want to let mogo wait for the obvious next command like
>play b
Then, you can mak
On Dec 5, 2007 9:39 AM, Dave Dyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> The problem with this is that below a few ply, the probabilities are
> all effectively zero. All you're really doing is enshrining the
> prior probabilities used to sort the first few levels.
Why would they be zero? floating-point
On Dec 5, 2007 4:44 AM, Lars <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 2. I had run the algorithm on 400 games (including handicap-games) from
> the same game-records source Remi used (Section 3.2), but i used an
> other month. I concidered only 3x3 shape-patterns and simple non-shape
> pattern including dist-
Hi all,
this discussion about ratings and playing strength of Go programs
on 19x19 and 9x9 with and without handicap stones etc.
is exactly the field I try to find an approach in my tournaments!
Most classic Go programs were designed only to be as strong
as possible in 19x19 and seamed to be muc
You can find my Ruby Mogo controller here: http://fantius.com/Mogo.rb
I created and used this for MechaGoZilla in the November KGS Computer
Go Tournament.
On Dec 5, 2007 8:53 AM, Edward de Grijs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Hideki,
>
> The file is used by:
> cat file | mogo
>
> Addi
The problem with this is that below a few ply, the probabilities are
all effectively zero. All you're really doing is enshrining the
prior probabilities used to sort the first few levels.
In cases where the good moves are the "obvious" ones, you've found them
anyway. In other cases, you prune
The problem with this is that below a few ply, the probabilities are
all effectively zero. All you're really doing is enshrining the
prior probabilities used to sort the first few levels.
In cases where the good moves are the "obvious" ones, you've found them
anyway. In other cases, you prune
On Dec 5, 2007 3:03 PM, Álvaro Begué <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> A long time ago I thought of how to organize what to prune The Right Way
> (tm). I initially thought about it in the context of computer chess, but I
> think it is even more relevant for computer go. Instead of doing global
> search
A long time ago I thought of how to organize what to prune The Right Way
(tm). I initially thought about it in the context of computer chess, but I
think it is even more relevant for computer go. Instead of doing global
search where you say "a node will be considered a leaf if it is n moves away
fr
Hi Hideki,
The file is used by:
cat file | mogo
Adding quit to the file lets mogo quit the game, but
I want to let mogo wait for the obvious next command like
play b
Normally I use the pipe with a self made server program
that send a new line through the pipe each time one of
the two pr
Petri Pitkanen wrote:
> 2007/12/4, Don Dailey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>
>> I'm not claiming this is a "good" way to proceed, I'm just trying to refute
>> the idea that it would play worse with depth - this is clearly not true. Of
>> course it's possible to refine this evaluation considerably -
Adding "quit" does not help?
Edward de Grijs: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>
>
>Hi to all,
>
>Can someone help me with this problem, for which I cannot
>find a solution:
>I am trying to run MoGo in an automatic way, using the
>cygwin toolkit.
>The problem in its simplest form is this:
>If I use MoGo o
Don Dailey wrote:
The assumption is that 1 Dan 19x19 = 1 Dan
9x9 and on average this will be true.
That is precisely my point. It is a very strong assumption because
19x19 has lots of things: joseki study, global board evaluation, etc.
that do not exist in 9x9. This assumption is only an a
2007/12/4, Don Dailey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> I'm not claiming this is a "good" way to proceed, I'm just trying to refute
> the idea that it would play worse with depth - this is clearly not true. Of
> course it's possible to refine this evaluation considerably - it's pretty
> lousy as I described
Lars wrote:
I have some questions concernig this paper of Remi:
http://remi.coulom.free.fr/Amsterdam2007/MMGoPatterns.pdf
1. Which sense make the prior (Section 3.3 in the paper and where is the
application?
I understand it the way that you put 2 more competitions to each pattern
in the minoriza
2007/12/4, Álvaro Begué <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>
>
> > Also there is not much published information evaluation functions in
> > Go. Obviously a go programming is a business and giving out such
> > information does not make sense. Best publicly available thingy is
> > GnuGo and it does not even have
Hi to all,
Can someone help me with this problem, for which I cannot
find a solution:
I am trying to run MoGo in an automatic way, using the
cygwin toolkit.
The problem in its simplest form is this:
If I use MoGo on the command line, typing the commands which
are send by stdin (i suppose) it
I have some questions concernig this paper of Remi:
http://remi.coulom.free.fr/Amsterdam2007/MMGoPatterns.pdf
1. Which sense make the prior (Section 3.3 in the paper and where is the
application?
I understand it the way that you put 2 more competitions to each pattern
in the minorization-maximizat
> What would get YOU to bring your program to the Congress? What would > you
> like to do once you are there?>> Cheers,> David
Hi,
due to my limited funding: compensate the travelling costs, or
make it possible for me to send the program, so it can run on
a local computer there, or
by remote
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