Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-12 Thread James Holton
oordinates have been modelled carelessly that I would like to avoid! Obviously, I will discuss this openly in the publication, and only rely on features that are unambiguous for my conclusions, but it would be good to know peoples thoughts on what they would do or expect to see.

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-08 Thread Italo Carugo Oliviero
ve been modelled carelessly that I > would like to avoid! > > Obviously, I will discuss this openly in the publication, and only rely on > features that are unambiguous for my conclusions, but it would be good to > know peoples thoughts on what they would do or expect to see. > > Best > > Matthew. > > >

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-07 Thread Matthew Snee
d be good to know peoples thoughts on what they would do or expect to see. Best Matthew. From: Karplus, Andy Sent: 06 March 2025 01:02 To: Matthew Snee ; CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK Subject: Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB Hi Matthew. Your post reminds me of some

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-06 Thread John R Helliwell
From: Karplus, Andy Sent: 06 March 2025 01:02 To: Matthew Snee ; CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK Subject: Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB   Hi Matthew.   Your post reminds me of some work my student did earlier related to the question of what to consider as “too high a B-factor.” Back in 2003 a refe

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-05 Thread Karplus, Andy
AC.UK Subject: Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB [This email originated from outside of OSU. Use caution with links and attachments.] Thankyou for those links One of those papers seems to basically say that atoms that accumulate stratospheric B factors are "speculative", but Im working on an exa

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-05 Thread Pavel Afonine
> > > > -------------- > *From:* CCP4 bulletin board on behalf of Italo > Carugo Oliviero > *Sent:* 05 March 2025 16:21 > *To:* CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK > *Subject:* Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB > > > Just wanted to thank you for your remarkable contributi

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-05 Thread Matthew Snee
t the B factors are certainly not describing the relationship between the model and the data in a useful way! Best wishes Matthew. From: CCP4 bulletin board on behalf of Italo Carugo Oliviero Sent: 05 March 2025 16:21 To: CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK Subject:

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-05 Thread Italo Carugo Oliviero
Just wanted to thank you for your remarkable contributions to this discussion. These are a couple of articles that dive into the issue of unusually large B-factors: BMC Bioinformatics 2018 19 61 ( https://doi.org/10.1186/s12859-018-2083-8) & Zeit. Krist. 2018 234 73-77 ( https://doi.org/10.1515/zk

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-04 Thread Frank von Delft
Interesting... Has this got onto the radar (or critical path) of the PDB's mmCIF working group (or whatever it's called?) I'm assuming that's where this would go to next, if the downstream developers are ever going to take it seriously. Frank On 04/03/2025 12:21, Alexandre Ourjoumtsev wr

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-04 Thread Alexandre Ourjoumtsev
Dear all, Fully relevant to this discussion, you might noted that a couple of years ago, we (Vladimir Lunin and myself) argued [ https://journals.iucr.org/m/issues/2022/06/00/tf5001/ | https://journals.iucr.org/m/issues/2022/06/00/tf5001/ ] that, when describing an atomic model, each atom s

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-04 Thread Ezra Peisach
My personal observation is that people handle the unobserved electron density sections in three ways - assuming sufficient resolution (i.e. ignoring ripple effects of truncate Fourier transformations at ~2.9A) a) Leave it out.  Usually a surface loop. b) Refine B factors - hopefully at suffici

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-04 Thread Matthew Snee
08ec2c4efb208-dmarc-requ...@jiscmail.ac.uk> Sent: 04 March 2025 09:06 To: CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK Subject: Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB Dear Pavel and Oliverio, In our group we have had recent discussion about this issue, and I second Pavel's suggestion to introduce such a confidence measure. W

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-04 Thread Frank von Delft
I third this idea - it's about 4 decades overdue, but got pressing with the CryoEM revolution, and is now existential after AlphaFold. Our use case (large collections of near-identical ligand-bound structures) also really really needs this - a way to capture confidence that stems from far more

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-04 Thread Tim
Dear Pavel and Oliverio, In our group we have had recent discussion about this issue, and I second Pavel's suggestion to introduce such a confidence measure. When interpreting cryo-EM (but also X-ray crystallography) maps with models, we often face the problem that we have complete models (tha

Re: [ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-03 Thread Pavel Afonine
Greetings, It's hard to disagree with this! Resolution, occupancies, and B factors only indirectly suggest what's visible and what isn't — and they can be especially difficult to interpret correctly for non-specialists. Perhaps a local confidence measure — similar to pLDDT for predicted models — c

[ccp4bb] IDS in PDB

2025-03-03 Thread Italo Carugo Oliviero
A brief reflection on IDPs Increasingly, people with a computer science background are analyzing the data deposited in the Protein Data Bank. In the case of conformation disorder analyses, they consider residues that are explicitly stated to be disordered (the old REMAR 465 records). This is not