For what it is worth, I am with Dimitris on this: sub shell execution is so fundamental that it should be a standard part of the image. I always thought that that was the goal of the new OSSubProcess.
> On 28 Oct 2016, at 15:25, Dimitris Chloupis <kilon.al...@gmail.com> wrote: > > For those not experienced with other language let me offer here an > explanation why having something like OSProcess is vastly important. > > Coding even before the time of Smalltalk has been tied to the command line, > even in this day all languages come with the ability of the command line to > use them and them to use the command line. > > Since increasing the size of our community is paramount to the acceleration > of the growth and evolution of pharo , it is also paramount to smooth out the > learning curve of Smalltalk. In order to do that we must offer a familiar > environment to these coders , especially in the case where Pharo offers no > real alternative. > > Arguing that just because Smalltalk offers a different way of doing things ok > to ignore what others are been doing, is an excuse destined to collapse on > itself when Smalltalk for decades and still even Pharo fails to offer , not > only good alternatives but even bad ones , in case of command line. > > Which means that currently Pharo offers no real alternative for functionality > that is offered via the command line, that means: > 1) No library to deal with Git directly , Gitfiletree does this through the > command line > 2) No command line alternative for interaction with a vast array of software > like VLC, ImageMagick, video converters, audio converters , programming > languages etc etc > 3) Even when we take a look at pharo ecosystem the command like reigns > supreme, for example a trip to the pharo website success stories make its > clear that by far the most popular platform for commercial pharo apps is the > web . Guess what tool the web developers use the most ? Yeap the command > line. We make the life of those people that want to use pharo professionally > really really hard. > > Programming and coding is about covering a vast array of scenarios and maybe > in a small community of a few hundred like pharo maybe its ok to ignore the > command line but I can assure you in a community like Python that is more > than 2 million , it is not. > > We already got command line integration for pharo outside the image , lets > make the logical next step and offer also command line support from inside > the image as well. Let's not justify the stereotype that "Smalltalk is a > distant lone island, just because" or that is outdated. > > On Fri, Oct 28, 2016 at 3:25 PM Thierry Goubier <thierry.goub...@gmail.com> > wrote: > 2016-10-28 14:12 GMT+02:00 Guille Polito <guillermopol...@gmail.com>: > But the functionality is there, it's just that it is not loaded by default. > > Loading it by default implies wedding Pharo's life cycle with OS(Sub)Process' > one, and having to maintain the possibility of dependencies to OS(Sub)Process > spreading in the entire environment. > > Like many of the other projects loaded by default in a Pharo image. What is > wrong with OSSubprocess or OSProcess so that they can't be treated the same? > > > What is wrong in executing a simple Metacello command to load it? > > The fact the image doesn't come as a one download / ready to use for an > average user? > > Thierry > > > > -------- Original Message -------- >> I have a love and hate relationship with Pharo >> this one I will put in the hate category >> >> You expect people to use pharo when you do not offer functionality they come >> to expect from the language they already use and not even offer an >> altervative, say a library with similar command line functionality (See >> Scale). >> >> On Fri, Oct 28, 2016 at 2:59 PM Norbert Hartl <norb...@hartl.name> wrote: >> >> > Am 28.10.2016 um 13:17 schrieb Dimitris Chloupis <kilon.al...@gmail.com>: >> > >> > I just noticed that OSProcess misses from Pharo 6 image, it was supposed >> > to be replaced by OSSubProcess but this not in the image either ? What we >> > suppose to use to execute bash from inside pharo ? >> >> It was never in the image. You need to install it in order to use it. >> >> Norbert >> >> >
