Ruby On Rails was started by one developer , so no it's not users that bring contributors it's contributors that bring users. Smalltalk started by a small team. Almost all programming languages started with no users and mostly a sole developer. This is because a user will not use software that is not even alpha, on the other hand a contributor will be a user and a contributor regardless of the state of software provided he has the desire to do so.
Spreading the word and helping people understand Pharo no longer makes you a user, it promotes you to contributor Same applies to Richard ;) On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 03:19, Vitor Medina Cruz <vitormc...@gmail.com> wrote: > Yes it is an amazing thing what you all do, I admire that. But isn't > contributors previous users? > > What I like about the Richard intent, from what I understand, is to make > Smalltalk, and Pharo, more visible, more used, and that is the only way I > know to bring more contributors. From what I know, Ruby got a lot of more > contributors after Rails, which brought a lot of users to the platform. > > I really would like to contribute some day, in the mean time I will try to > support initiatives like the one proposed by Richard, and spread the word > as much as I can. > > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 9:45 PM, Dimitris Chloupis <kilon.al...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > Do you know how many unique views had PBE last 5 months ? 1000 > Do you know how many contributions PBE had last 5 months ? Zero. Not 100 . > Not even 10. Not even 1... zero > > PBE would be still in Pharo version 1.4 if it was not for me , Stef and > Damien. > > This is not a Pharo problem, all open source software has the same issue. > > We need more people helping, I ported the first 1/3rd of the book from 1.4 > to Pharo 4 just by myself and the other two joined after I was burned out > from the pain. I was disgusted working on PBE . I literally hated Pharo. > Fortunately nothing that a bit of a small break could not fix. > > I was and still I am the most loud critic about the state of > documentation. In the end however what makes open source projects exist is > not users. Users are insignificant. Sorry to say that but is true. It's > contributors that are the life of the project. > > People like Stef made Pharo and even Squeak possible. People like Stef > keep Smalltalk alive. Personally I don't give a damn what users want , I > rather attract only contributors and zero just users. That's enough to keep > Pharo evolving for centuries. > > Stef says that "Pharo is yours" , apparently this easier said than done. I > respect your opinion, I agree with your opinion because I said what you say > years ago. In the end however if you and other users are not willing to > help we will remain at zero commits at least as far as PBE is concerned . > > It's pretty much the same for the other areas of Pharo. > On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 01:26, Vitor Medina Cruz <vitormc...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > *Dimitris:* > > I agree with much of what you said, but I think it is still possible to > make step 0 and follow the Pharo path with more easy. :) > > Also, > https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/UpdatedPharoByExample/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/book-result/PharoTour/PharoTour.html > is nice too, I didn't know of it. It is the new version of PBE ongoing? I > am going to take a look at it. > > Ben: > > Thanks for the links, two of them I didn't know of. I hadn't time to read > them yet, but I think what I am looking for is something like > https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b5327ca0740 > > "The things we see as important might be a paradigm step too far for > newcomers." > > > I think the problem for Step 0 it is exactly that. I myself have already > tried to show the paradigm shift along with all that must be learn to use > Pharo, and it didn't went well. It is too much to tackle at once. There is > the language, the environment, the IDE, the paradigm shift, too much... > > Nicolai: > > The first example from the book provides the first experience you have on > Pharo, and it uses stuff that is not on the default image (it happened to > me a long time ago and with a friend more recently). It is frustrating and > leave the person trying to learn suspicious. I see that the current site > for the book has a link to the image that should be used while reading the > book, but it is not very visible and I think the book don't mention > it. From the Getting Started chapter I count five pages until some code is > executed (Time now). The problem here is that people usually don't > understand, yet, the power of the environment, and are eager to see code > and execute it, and they often get confused with so many different things > to learn even before the first "Hello World". I can say the first time I > got PBE I gave up because of this, and I only come back later because I > persist to learn Smalltalk, and I know some other people who tried to read > it too and give up for exactly the same reason. > > I found the book an excellent reference and source to solidify the > understanding of Pharo, but I don't like it as a tutorial. > > > *-------* > > Look at the Go language site: https://golang.org/, the first thing it > puts in your face is a way to execute code and a link to a Tour. I don't > even have to think much before I have executed the Hello World, my hand > just moved the mouse to the Run button, and even before I noticed I was > doing the tour. > > In my opinion, a good Step 0 would be something like Profstef ( > http://amber-lang.net/learn.html) as a Tour, going slowly through the > language aspects, messages types, comparing to other OO languages, showing > that operator are just messages, then that control flow statements are also > just messages, creating classes etc, always letting the user execute code > as she goes on. > > After that, the Tour could tell its user to continue it using the image > and showing the download link. When the user execute Pharo.exe and loads > the default image the first thing that appears is the Profstef asking if it > is the first time he is there and if he is continuing the tour from the web > (if it is someone used to Pharo, he just closes the windows and starts to > use his new fresh image). It could explains steadily the workspace, the > transcript, the nautilus and how to make a very simple web application with > tests. After that it could explain the image, that objects are stored > (serialized) into it and the image itself consists of the running program > while the Pharo.exe is the VM. In the end It could point to a tutorial like > https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b5327ca0740, > the PBE and to the many others resources available. > > The order of things could change and maybe I had missed something, but > that is what I can think now. Perhaps this approach is too slow, I don't > know, but the fast one isn't working for me :( It don't need to be a tour > also, but something in these lines, like the medium post above but with > more parts, each describing a little more of Pharo. The idea, in general, > is to easy the entrance barriers that Pharo has by it's quite different, > yet powerful, programming model and environment. When I talk to people I > know that have tried Pharo, that is the biggest problem. > > That is just my two cents. :) > > And thanks for all the new links :) > > Regards, > Vitor > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 8:05 PM, stepharo <steph...@free.fr> wrote: > > > > Le 25/10/16 à 15:05, Dimitris Chloupis a écrit : > > PBE is for Pharo version 5, I will give it another look to start porting > it to Pharo version 6. Will add a git tag and make release for 5. > > > Thanks. > Yes it would be an immense help. > > Stef > > > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 10:19 AM p...@highoctane.be <p...@highoctane.be> > wrote: > > There was this book (and some others of the same ink) that was provided > with my first computer: > > > http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Hardware/Getting%20Started%20With%20Extended%20Color%20Basic%20(Tandy).pdf > <http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Hardware/Getting%20Started%20With%20Extended%20Color%20Basic%20%28Tandy%29.pdf> > > I actually had the french version. > http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Hardware/Color%20Computer%203%20Exended%20Basic%20(Tandy)%20(French).pdf > <http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Hardware/Color%20Computer%203%20Exended%20Basic%20%28Tandy%29%20%28French%29.pdf> > > This thing is still sitting near my desk today (I guess it keeps me > connected to my curious young self or something like that). > > I keep on thinking that it would be great to have a Pharo-based version of > it. > > And something like this one for bytecode sets... > > > http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Programming/EDTASM+%20With%20ZBUG%20(Tandy).pdf > <http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Programming/EDTASM+%20With%20ZBUG%20%28Tandy%29.pdf> > > Phil > > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 7:22 AM, Matteo via Pharo-users < > pharo-users@lists.pharo.org> wrote: > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Matteo <matte...@yahoo.it> > To: Any question about pharo is welcome <pharo-users@lists.pharo.org> > > Cc: > Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2016 07:08:21 +0200 > Subject: Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate Smalltalk Tutorial > +1 for PBE > It has been my first smalltalk/Pharo tutorial. > I'm still using it, as a quick reference. > > On October 25, 2016 6:25:08 AM GMT+02:00, monty <mon...@programmer.net> > wrote: > > +1 for PBE. > > > > Sent: Monday, October 24, 2016 at 1:56 AM > From: "Nicolai Hess" <nicolaih...@gmail.com> > To: "Any question about pharo is welcome" <pharo-users@lists.pharo.org> > Subject: Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate Smalltalk Tutorial > > Am 23.10.2016 3:16 nachm. schrieb "Vitor Medina Cruz" > <vitormc...@gmail.com[mailto:vitormc...@gmail.com]>: > > > I think the MOOC is too much for a tutorial. What I miss today is a good > written (no videos! Please!) tutorial that teaches just a little of the > language and give a few guidelines on how to do simple stuff with the > environment, such as a "Hello World!", creating a class, tests and run stuff. > > I thought "pharo by example" provides exactly that. > What is missing here, from your perspective? > I learned a lot from it and it helped me to get started to learn smalltalk, > not only the syntax, but also, doing something the smalltalk way. > > > On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 12:15 PM, horrido > <horrido.hobb...@gmail.com[mailto:horrido.hobb...@gmail.com]> wrote: > > > Excellent suggestion! I shall look into it. Thanks. > > > > > -- > View this message in context: > http://forum.world.st/The-Ultimate-Smalltalk-Tutorial-tp4918859p4918930.html[http://forum.world.st/The-Ultimate-Smalltalk-Tutorial-tp4918859p4918930.html] > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > > > -- > Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. > > > > >
