Hi Yuma, Thanks for listing some additional apps you found useful and, I assume, accessible. I definitely want to check out Abby Finereader and ICam.
Thanks again. Vic Yuma Decaux wrote: > Hi Vic, > > I wanted to participate in supporting your perspective over this discussion. > I fully agree and submit to the thought that the screen reader isn't the > culprit though is immediately seen on the line of fire. Educating both users > and developers in the system created for accessibility by apple is by far the > most important factor for tipping the voice over experience one way or the > other. > > I for one have been doing this since i first had my macbook almost 3 years > ago, and still do so on a fairly constant basis. When presented with a > request on accessibility, depending on the degree of acquaintance or > compatibility with apple's framework, developers responses are usually very > positive and some even find accidental advantages to their own developement > methods by using accessibility tools available with x-code. This assumes that > apples engineers are going the right path, as they are not layering a > framework with another one which use will only complicate developers, quite > the opposite; they incumb the tools with a unifying vision of advantages for > both sighted and non sighted users, and though this generally requires time > and energy, especially considering the competitive environment of tech and > software, they are pacing to dictate these procedures into every sector of > software developement save heavily graphical applications for which > accessibility will require an abstraction no-one has found yet. > > To list some additional applications which i use beyond those you have > mentioned, here is a small list: > > Alfred shortcut butler of sorts > Abbey fine reader express the best OCR i've had so far and easy to use > Amadeus pro sound clip and voice memo editing software > Chm reader plus reads all chm documents perfectly > DJ for my pseudo podcats and mixing pleasure as well as on the fly sampling > and live performances > Evernote for all aggregating all articles and news clips i deem important > for my projects current and future > Ibank for my finances, budgets and expense tracking combined with my iphone > Icam source using it to check on my cat every now and then and security > while we're away > Mars edit blogging tool so fast and effective won't change for a lifetime > Mportfolio very easy to use portfolio manager, they're about to add > applescript support > Netnewswire news aggregator which i have been using for years and accessible > all round > Snowtape internet radio application with a lot of options for recording and > scheduling > Soundcloud this is where i get all new sounds to check on itunes or other > Tapedeck the easiest recording app i've had since i first became a mac user > Text expander extremely useful for expanding text whether scripting or > editing or mailing > Textual completely accessible IRC client > Wikibot for fast wikipedia searches and reading without all the annoyances > of the web version > Yojimbo bookmark, note and password keeper. This one goes hand in hand with > evernote in my streamline > My point with this list of applications, though i have not listed others, is > that they came accessible straight out of the box. This seems different from > jaws accessibility which, it sounds to me, still requires downloading scripts > for each application. > > When i look at the support voice over has from both developers, users and > apple's accessibility division itself, and compare it with what jaws gets in > attention, i'm just not inclined to walk over to microsoft and get a license. > Simply put, i'm just happy with my current setup which allows me to stay > productive, and any shortcomings in the sound editing department is something > of a formality which we are going through since my point was that the switch > to total accessibility is a process, and apple having already successfully > switched CPU artchitecture from PPC to Intel with minimal disturbance, i > believe they can achieve the same in terms of making voice over ubiquitous, > easy to implement and more and more configurable yet easy to operate. > > > Ok, i need to jump back to my server :) > > Best regards > > Yuma > > > > On 24/12/2011, at 3:53 PM, M. Taylor wrote: > > > Hello Victor, > > > > Bravo on an excellent post. > > > > While I did not hear the podcast in question, your comments are well > > balanced, thoughtful, and down right compelling. > > > > Most Sincerely, > > > > Mark > > On Dec 23, 2011, at 5:25 PM, Victor Tsaran wrote: > > > >> Hello "VoiceOver On" guys and everyone else on the list, > >> First of all, I'll start by saying that I am not a Mac fan or anything-one > >> else's, for that matter. I am only a fan of myself, <just kidding>. > >> I just wanted to share a couple of my thoughts regarding the latest > >> "VoiceOver On" podcast because, unfortunately, Twitter's 140-character > >> limit is way too limiting for my taste and for the purpose of this > >> message. :) > >> > >> 1. I think you are correct in saying that many people forget to ask > >> themselves what they want to do with the computer. This often leads to > >> uninformed decisions and, subsequently, unjustified or unnecessary > >> purchases. We all in some ways affected by our friends's opinions, buzz > >> words and commercials. Regardless, we need to learn to ask those questions > >> so we do not regret our technology choices that will only slow us down and > >> make less productive. After all, a computer with an operating system on it > >> are just tools to help us live our lives like everyone else does . > >> > >> 2. Is VoiceOver a bad screen reader? Not at all, IMHO. Is it the best? Of > >> course, not. At times VO feels like a work-around altogether, while at > >> other time sit feels like the most innovative screen reader on the market. > >> It really has both. > >> > >> Pros: > >> - VoiceOver has a pretty good built-in help which most users probably > >> never read. > >> - VO is a pretty flexible screen reader, especially on Lion, EG through > >> the "Activities" feature. > >> - Good support for Mail, chat, Calendar, basic text editing with TextEdit, > >> Webkit-based browsers (Chrome, Safari, Lightning, iCab etc). > >> - A consistent support for applications that are designed wit > >> accessibility in mind, EG "YoruFukurou Twitter client" and many others. > >> > >> Cons: > >> - Too complicated system of shortcuts. However, Quicknav and Trackpad > >> navigation eliminates the need for many of of those shortcuts. > >> - Does not provide efficient environment with production applications like > >> Pages, Keynote and Numbers. > >> - Apple doesn't do a good job of promoting VoiceOver and/or interface with > >> the the end-user. > >> > >> If I had to pick one of the most innovative features of VoiceOver that > >> will have a profound impact on how blind people interact with technology > >> in the near future, it would be the "Trackpad Commander". I understand > >> this particular tool may not appeal to the generation of users who are > >> fairly firm in their computing habits but those young and adventurous > >> should be taught to give up their keyboards, especially for exploration > >> purposes. > >> > >> 3. So, what's the problem and why VoiceOver doesn't let me be productive? > >> This is where I feel the podcast participants lead us down the wrong path > >> of thinking. Instead of blaming everything on VoiceOver, we should instead > >> concentrate our efforts on applications themselves. > >> A good example would be the following: Pages and Keynote are not > >> accessible because of VoiceOver but primarily because their developers, > >> yes, Apple, did not expose the right accessibility interface to VoiceOver. > >> If you removed all the JAWS scripts from the JAWS application directory, > >> you would, to your surprise, quickly find out that most of the Windows > >> applications you thought were accessible actually are not. > >> > >> I know that NVDA developers expressed a similar concern on several > >> occasions, namely, that blind users tend to blame their screen reader > >> first before they blame the application itself. > >> And you know what? I completely understand why users do this. A regular > >> user does not have any insights into what makes their computing experience > >> accessible. Since they interface with the computer via a screen reader, if > >> something goes wrong, the screen reader is to blame. > >> So, we simply need more education. And this is where I wish the podcast > >> authors could spend more time and energy. > >> > >> In summary, it is correct to say that newcomers to technology should first > >> familiarize themselves wit choices available on the market and decide > >> which ones are the most suitable to their needs. > >> It is , however, totally wrong to blame everything on VoiceOver and blame > >> the lack of productivity tools on the screen reader at hand. > >> > >> Just FYI, here is what I use my Mac for and the kinds of apps that serve > >> me well. > >> - YoruFukurou client for Twitter. > >> - Textedit for wordprocessing. > >> - Chrome and Safari for web browsing. > >> - Mail and iCal for my corporate needs. > >> - Garage Band, VLC and iTunes for music. > >> - XCode and Dashcode for programming. > >> - Cyberduck for FTP uploads and downloads. > >> - Terminal for all the Unix-related stuff (geeky). > >> - VMWare 4 with Windows 7 if I ever need to jump into Windows for testing > >> or otherwise. > >> > >> How is this not a productive environment? Well, for me it is. > >> > >> Thanks, > >> Vic > >> > >> > >> -- > >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > >> "MacVisionaries" group. > >> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. > >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > >> For more options, visit this group at > >> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. > >> > > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "MacVisionaries" group. > > To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at > > http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. 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