> On 21 May 2019, at 14:58, Philip Thrift <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, May 21, 2019 at 6:06:19 AM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 20 May 2019, at 10:32, Philip Thrift <[email protected] <javascript:>> >> wrote: >> >> >> But I claim that no zillion-processor Intel Core computer (that ultimately >> runs programs compiled to Intel machine code) can be conscious. I also claim >> God does not exist. > > Which God? > > >> >> It is this context that [ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_room >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_room> ] is correct. >> >> "The Chinese room argument holds that an executing program cannot [have] >> consciousness, regardless of how intelligently or human-like the program may >> make the computer behave.” > > The Chinese room argument is based on a misunderstanding of how a computer > work. It has been refuted correctly by Dennett and Hofstadter, since long. > > Bruno > > > > > I think in 2019 Dennett may have changed from his previous "consciousness > denier" belief, but I'm not sure. (Isn't Hofstadter a joke?)
Hofstadter is the only physicist I know who is 99,9% correct on Gödel’s theorems, even if some of its metaphors are a bit stretched and slightly inaccurate. Nothing to compare with Penrose, who is dead wrong in his use of Gödel against Mechanism. Hofstadter found the notion of “Henkin virus”, which inspired Solovay “himself” to dig on them. I say “Solovay “itself” as Solovay is the major contributor in the isolation of the G and G* mathematics, which I use all the time (indeed the mathematical theology of the machine exists entirely through the mathematics of G*). Hofstadter is a serious researcher, but his best book is “Gödel, Escher, Bach”, and its “metamagical themas”. I am less sure about his studies on metaphor, but I have not really studied them, also. > > > https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2018/03/13/the-consciousness-deniers/ > > This is how philosophers in the twentieth century came to endorse the Denial, > the silliest view ever held in the history of human thought. > > “When I squint just right,” Dennett writes in 2013, “it does sort of seem > that consciousness must be something in addition to all the things it does > for us and to us, some special private glow or here-I-am-ness that would be > absent in any robot… But I’ve learned not to credit the hunch. I think it is > a flat-out mistake, a failure of imagination.” His position was summarized in > an interview in The New York Times: “The elusive subjective conscious > experience—the redness of red, the painfulness of pain—that philosophers call > qualia? Sheer illusion.” If he’s right, no one has ever really suffered, in > spite of agonizing diseases, mental illness, murder, rape, famine, slavery, > bereavement, torture, and genocide. And no one has ever caused anyone else > pain. > > This is the Great Silliness. We must hope that it doesn’t spread outside the > academy, or convince some future information technologist or roboticist who > has great power over our lives. Yes, I agree. Eliminating consciousness is silly. Yet, Dennett is valid, given that he postulates, well, he even take for granted, the physical universe and he accepts Mechanism, and I have shown that this lead to consciousness elimination. I prefer to eliminate primitive matter, and keep consciousness and mechanist studies further, as the evidences favours mechanism, and are inexistent (up to now) for *primitive* matter. Bruno > > > @philipthfift > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/f3741ba7-9bf1-43d6-87ae-795214016101%40googlegroups.com > > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/f3741ba7-9bf1-43d6-87ae-795214016101%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/15B97461-A287-4C0D-90EE-71EE2FED1E07%40ulb.ac.be.
