Just to add some more complexity to this model:
The majority of the mass of an old car is recyclable as scrap ferrous
metals, the most recycled material in America. So do we know how
much energy is saved by the recycling of steel and iron from your old
car vs. mining and smelting new steel from iron ore?
As long as we're splitting hairs.
David Bryant
On Feb 28, 2008, at 10:27 AM, Amartya Saha wrote:
Hi Jane,
Robert's point was about the resources taken to manufacture a new
car, hybrid or whatever.. all the metal, glass, plastics, chemicals
etc, mining those, energy costs to manufacture them, pollution
costs to the environment and so on, When one discards an old car
and goes for a hybrid, one has to add all the above costs to the
benefits of lower emissions per mile. Its not just C emissions
that accompany the manufacture of a car, there is a bunch of other
externalities if one were to track.
Of course, given the necessity of driving for most (In the US), one
can't run an old car forever, unless one is a mechanic,
understanding and taking care of every strut, wire and screw. Maybe
the breakeven in terms of environmental costs of continuing with
the old car vs. a hybrid may happen in 10 years, I do not know, and
its very difficult to put $ costs anyway to damage to habitat done
by resource extraction (mining,drilling etc) and pollution. Thats
the emerging field of natural resource economics ( thats been
emerging for at least trhe past 10 years as i'm aware of)..
cheers
amartya
Jane Shevtsov wrote:
Hi Bob,
Can you please cite some numbers to back up your claim? 30 MPG is
pretty
good (although old cars tend to be worse from the point of view of
toxic
emissions), but every examination I've seen of the question of
whether the
improved efficiency of a hybrid offsets the C emissions due to its
manufacture has concluded that the hybrid is better than keeping
the old
car. (I guess that might not be true if you do very little driving.)
Jane
On Wed, Feb 27, 2008 at 10:08 PM, Robert Fireovid
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
McDonough is like the Toyota ads that would seduce me into
trading in
my 1994, 30 mpg Prism for a brand new Prius. Considering the
quantities of non-renewable natural resources that are extracted,
transported and transformed into a new car (and the amount of Nature
that is destroyed in its wake), I would have to own the Prius for
over 50 years to "pay back" that resource debt and generate any net
improvement in my environmental footprint.
Young people love (and have taught me the power of) You-Tube. Have
them watch this short spot, "The Story of Stuff," to see what I
mean... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqZMTY4V7Ts
- Bob Fireovid
W. McDonough and M. Braungart's Cradle to Cradle: Remaking the
way we
make
things (2002) might be interesting for your summer reading
list. They
suggest a proactive approach to environmental issues that is
refreshing,
maybe even hopeful.
