hi, gr8 writeup dude ...would like to add something !!!! about the software....(the hardware thing u said was greek and latin 4 me...and gr8 u had the guts to cut the wires of your system :0) when i did the voiceless bgms for some(Alaipayuthey,Tenali,Rhythm(was just 2 good!!!),Padiyaapa ,Minsara Kanavu) the basic funda as u said was to find a dvd ripper to convert it to a audio format ...more specifically i converted the dvd vobs to ac3 files (which can store all the channels of the movie and the software i used is now in the dumps..)....and then use an ac3 to mp3 converter(i used a software called headac3h...i think!!!) by choosing which channels i wanted to downmix(either surround or front channels)....the downmixing was a trial and error thing... and i used the resources from this site to get me going... http://www.doom9.org/
its been sometime since this site was updated but nevertheless it has good stuff about this thing... hope i helped !!! :) thnaks and regards, prashanth --- In [email protected], just me! <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > GREAT STUFF! thanks alot but those who use software can u guys pls tell us wat softwares u use? > > Thulasi Ram <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: knowledge showcased! brilliant!! > > appreaciate ur effort to share this to us Wasim! > > > On Feb 19, 2008 7:49 PM, kaissiom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Voiceless BGMs - Explained! > > I'm not much of any expert on this topic, as I happened to accidentally or unintentionally discover the process of ripping voiceless BGMs. There may be members on this group who have expertise in this area who may be able to shed some more light on this topic. Following article is my limited understanding of this subject, please correct me if I am wrong. > > First, some definitions: > * For the sake of discussion L refers to Left and R refers to Right (speakers) > > Mono: Single channel (no difference in L or R speaker, both reproduce one sound) > L speaker = R speaker = One sound from both. > [Note]: Rahman has been very disappointed that 'Kabhi Na Kabhi' was recorded in stereo, but released in Mono. > > Stereo: Two or more channels (generally two channel, separate recording/reproduction of sound, L and R) > L speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > + R speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > = 3 different sounds possible: L sound + Shared L/R sound + R sound > [Note]: Think of it as a Venn diagram: Both L and R speakers reproduce same sound most of the time, but will also have variations of their own. Quite evident in 'Daud' - Title track, the entire track has variations in Left and Right channel. > > Stereo Surround: 5.1 or higher (5 channels plus 1 LFE; Dolby-Digital,dts) > L Front speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > +R Front speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > +C Center speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > +L Rear speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > +R Rear speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > +LFE Low-Frequency Effects(sub-woofer) > = Surround Sound experience. > [Note]: Most, but not all, DVD-Videos have 5.1 surround sound. And also the rare, but dying, DVD-Audio format falls in this category. > > There's no limitation on the number of channels, I find some English movies with 7.1 surround sound , you can also buy a 10.1 sound systems, if you can find source to utilize those channels. > > Almost all Media formats can reproduce mono and stereo, but not surround: > Cassette tapes: Stereo and Mono > CD: Stereo and Mono > VCD: Stereo and Mono > DVD: Surround, Stereo and Mono > > How does this relate to voiceless BGMs? > Voiceless BGMs are only possible from surround sound, given that they were recorded and reproduce as surround. So, that leaves us with DVD-Audio, which I won't get into, and DVD-Video, by which we mean regular DVD movies. > > How are BGMs recorded on DVDs? > I don't know exactly, but that's up to the composer and the sound engineer. But in order to qualify as surround sound, they have to record different sounds for different channels. For example they may record actors' voices for the CENTER channel and the background score for the two-REAR speakers and a combination of both voices and score on the two-FRONT speakers (this is hypothetical, simple and straightforward example): > L/R Front speakers: Combination/layers of both voices and background score > CENTER speaker: Only voices > L/R Rear speakers: Only background score > > You can imagine watching a movie and an extra sound effect from back, or someone yelling from behind you or a car whooshing by. And remember, they can try many different combinations with 5 different channels. > > How to extract voiceless BGMs? > Simply put, you have to tap into the channels that only contain the 'Background Score'. In the simple example given above, it would be the 'L/R Rear Speaker/Channel'. > > How do kaissiom and AJ extract voiceless BGMs? > Well, I can't speak for AJ, but I know he uses some software. And as far as I'm concerned, I can write a longer post than this one trying to explain how I accidentally did it. My method is not all software- it's combination of hardware and software. I was fixing my computer and my home-theater system set-up, such that I can play the music from my computer on my surround sound system. This required additional cables, adapters, etc.. but I accidentally cut one wire and attached it in the wrong place somewhere on the soundcard and amplifier. And when I played a movie on my computer, all I could hear was voices, no BGM. When I switched some wires.. I got BGM, no voices... hence, voiceless BGMs. I still have to switch these wires... every time I have to extract voiceless BGMs ;-) > > How can one extract voiceless BGMs? > -[Software]- Easiest way to do it: Find a DVD-ripping software that not only rips audio from DVD, but rips audio as separate channels. Once you have all the audio in different channels, keep the channel with BGM, discard the rest. > -[Hardware]- Complicated way of doing it: Cut some wires from the surround sound system and record it from the amplifier - this is how I do it. It takes me about 5 to 6 hours to do a movie because I perform additional editing using software to enhance the quality. I use hardware(amplifier/soundcard) to extract the audio and then use software(SoundForge) to enhance it. > > Are there any caveats? > As with everything... Yes. > -[Source] The movie has to be recorded in surround sound. Older movies (Roja, Bombay, etc.), and surprisingly some newer movies are not recorded in surround sound... therefore, NO VOICELESS BGMs are possible - Ever. > -[Media] Even if the movie was recorded in surround sound. You have to get hold of the DVD with 5.1 surround sound. VCD or a tape will not work. Some Indian DVDs just have the '5.1 Dolby Digital' stamp for the 'coolness' factor, and are not true surround sound. I have had this experience with Zubeidaa. In other words, there are some fake surround sound DVD out there, and they will not work - NO VOICELESS BGMs. > - [Application] Finally, the application used to extract the BGMs should support surround sound. > > What is 'Sync sound'? > Some movies, mostly newer ones are recorded in sync sound. Lagaan, Swades, RDB are all sync sound. Sync sound means actors' dialogues are recorded live while shooting the movie, actors do not have to go in for a 'lip sync' or 'dubbing' session after the movie. BMGs are added to the original dialogues. Usually, when movies are recorded in sync sound, we end up having crisp/clean surround sound... Voices are separte, BGM is separate as quite evident in Lagaan/Swades BGMs. When movie is not done in Sync sound, BGMs tend to be messy. Saathiya was done in Sync sound, where as disappointgly, Guru was not. When dubbing is done at the same time as BGMs are added, they tend to be layered together and we don't get the crisp clean voiceless BGMs. Extracting BGMs from Rajni movies is ever difficult, regardless of whether it's done in sync or not. The extra 'Rajni Effects' or the 'swoosh-whoosh' sound every time the superstar moves a finger... is added on top of the BGMs. > > Having said that, recent media reports suggested that Hrithik and Ash were in studios doing some voice recordings/dubbing... at around the same time reports of 'Rahman finishing up the BGM for Jodha Akbar' were cropping up. I really hope JA is done in Sync sound, otherwise the BGM could be tainted. > > Sorry for the long/dry post. Vithur and others have expressed great interest in this subject and I somehow come across as someone who is hiding something. How can a blind person (me) lead someone on a path? When I myself found the path accidentally and seem to be walking on it unknowingly. > > But there! The unguarded 'secret' is out, the knowledge does not just rest with me anymore. I feel like a great burden has been lifted off my shoulders, although I have touched on and explained this topics in various bits and pieces over time. > > Hopefully, I have cleared up some doubts here, and raised new ones.. As always, please feel free to contact me if you have any questions or corrections. > > I too believe that it will be a loss to Rahman fans, if we do not collect all the available voiceless BGMs out there. Therefore it is important to first establish how many such true surround sound DVDs exist out there. Once we establish that, we can see which ones have been extracted and which ones are pending. Then, we can go from there. > > > Regards, > Rahmaniac. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! 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