keep up the good work kaissiom. i really hope we can create somekind of a database or something of that sorts so that ppl dont miss this. personally, i dont have voiceless BGMs at all. it will be wondeful to have professional musical analysis, BGMs, instrumentals, etc in a place where people any come anytime and attain it.
--- In [email protected], "kaissiom" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Voiceless BGMs - Explained! > > I'm not much of any expert on this topic, as I happened to accidentally > or unintentionally discover the process of ripping voiceless BGMs. > There may be members on this group who have expertise in this area who > may be able to shed some more light on this topic. Following article is > my limited understanding of this subject, please correct me if I am > wrong. > > First, some definitions: > * For the sake of discussion L refers to Left and R refers to Right > (speakers) > > Mono: Single channel (no difference in L or R speaker, both reproduce > one sound) > L speaker = R speaker = One sound from both. > [Note]: Rahman has been very disappointed that 'Kabhi Na Kabhi' was > recorded in stereo, but released in Mono. > > Stereo: Two or more channels (generally two channel, separate > recording/reproduction of sound, L and R) > L speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > + R speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > = 3 different sounds possible: L sound + Shared L/R sound + R sound > [Note]: Think of it as a Venn diagram: Both L and R speakers reproduce > same sound most of the time, but will also have variations of their own. > Quite evident in 'Daud' - Title track, the entire track has variations > in Left and Right channel. > > Stereo Surround: 5.1 or higher (5 channels plus 1 LFE; > Dolby-Digital,dts) > L Front speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > +R Front speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > +C Center speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > +L Rear speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > +R Rear speaker: recorded/reproduced separately > +LFE Low-Frequency Effects(sub-woofer) > = Surround Sound experience. > [Note]: Most, but not all, DVD-Videos have 5.1 surround sound. And also > the rare, but dying, DVD-Audio format falls in this category. > > There's no limitation on the number of channels, I find some English > movies with 7.1 surround sound , you can also buy a 10.1 sound systems, > if you can find source to utilize those channels. > > Almost all Media formats can reproduce mono and stereo, but not > surround: > Cassette tapes: Stereo and Mono > CD: Stereo and Mono > VCD: Stereo and Mono > DVD: Surround, Stereo and Mono > > How does this relate to voiceless BGMs? > Voiceless BGMs are only possible from surround sound, given that they > were recorded and reproduce as surround. So, that leaves us with > DVD-Audio, which I won't get into, and DVD-Video, by which we mean > regular DVD movies. > > How are BGMs recorded on DVDs? > I don't know exactly, but that's up to the composer and the sound > engineer. But in order to qualify as surround sound, they have to > record different sounds for different channels. For example they may > record actors' voices for the CENTER channel and the background score > for the two-REAR speakers and a combination of both voices and score on > the two-FRONT speakers (this is hypothetical, simple and > straightforward example): > L/R Front speakers: Combination/layers of both voices and background > score > CENTER speaker: Only voices > L/R Rear speakers: Only background score > > You can imagine watching a movie and an extra sound effect from back, or > someone yelling from behind you or a car whooshing by. And remember, > they can try many different combinations with 5 different channels. > > How to extract voiceless BGMs? > Simply put, you have to tap into the channels that only contain the > 'Background Score'. In the simple example given above, it would be the > 'L/R Rear Speaker/Channel'. > > How do kaissiom and AJ extract voiceless BGMs? > Well, I can't speak for AJ, but I know he uses some software. And as > far as I'm concerned, I can write a longer post than this one trying to > explain how I accidentally did it. My method is not all software- it's > combination of hardware and software. I was fixing my computer and my > home-theater system set-up, such that I can play the music from my > computer on my surround sound system. This required additional cables, > adapters, etc.. but I accidentally cut one wire and attached it in the > wrong place somewhere on the soundcard and amplifier. And when I played > a movie on my computer, all I could hear was voices, no BGM. When I > switched some wires.. I got BGM, no voices... hence, voiceless BGMs. I > still have to switch these wires... every time I have to extract > voiceless BGMs ;-) > > How can one extract voiceless BGMs? > -[Software]- Easiest way to do it: Find a DVD-ripping software that not > only rips audio from DVD, but rips audio as separate channels. Once you > have all the audio in different channels, keep the channel with BGM, > discard the rest. > -[Hardware]- Complicated way of doing it: Cut some wires from the > surround sound system and record it from the amplifier - this is how I > do it. It takes me about 5 to 6 hours to do a movie because I perform > additional editing using software to enhance the quality. I use > hardware(amplifier/soundcard) to extract the audio and then use > software(SoundForge) to enhance it. > > Are there any caveats? > As with everything... Yes. > -[Source] The movie has to be recorded in surround sound. Older movies > (Roja, Bombay, etc.), and surprisingly some newer movies are not > recorded in surround sound... therefore, NO VOICELESS BGMs are possible > - Ever. > -[Media] Even if the movie was recorded in surround sound. You have to > get hold of the DVD with 5.1 surround sound. VCD or a tape will not > work. Some Indian DVDs just have the '5.1 Dolby Digital' stamp for the > 'coolness' factor, and are not true surround sound. I have had this > experience with Zubeidaa. In other words, there are some fake surround > sound DVD out there, and they will not work - NO VOICELESS BGMs. > - [Application] Finally, the application used to extract the BGMs should > support surround sound. > > What is 'Sync sound'? > Some movies, mostly newer ones are recorded in sync sound. Lagaan, > Swades, RDB are all sync sound. Sync sound means actors' dialogues are > recorded live while shooting the movie, actors do not have to go in for > a 'lip sync' or 'dubbing' session after the movie. BMGs are added to > the original dialogues. Usually, when movies are recorded in sync > sound, we end up having crisp/clean surround sound... Voices are > separte, BGM is separate as quite evident in Lagaan/Swades BGMs. When > movie is not done in Sync sound, BGMs tend to be messy. Saathiya was > done in Sync sound, where as disappointgly, Guru was not. When dubbing > is done at the same time as BGMs are added, they tend to be layered > together and we don't get the crisp clean voiceless BGMs. Extracting > BGMs from Rajni movies is ever difficult, regardless of whether it's > done in sync or not. The extra 'Rajni Effects' or the 'swoosh-whoosh' > sound every time the superstar moves a finger... is added on top of the > BGMs. > > Having said that, recent media reports suggested that Hrithik and Ash > were in studios doing some voice recordings/dubbing... at around the > same time reports of 'Rahman finishing up the BGM for Jodha Akbar' were > cropping up. I really hope JA is done in Sync sound, otherwise the BGM > could be tainted. > > Sorry for the long/dry post. Vithur and others have expressed great > interest in this subject and I somehow come across as someone who is > hiding something. How can a blind person (me) lead someone on a path? > When I myself found the path accidentally and seem to be walking on it > unknowingly. > > But there! The unguarded 'secret' is out, the knowledge does not just > rest with me anymore. I feel like a great burden has been lifted off my > shoulders, although I have touched on and explained this topics in > various bits and pieces over time. > > Hopefully, I have cleared up some doubts here, and raised new ones.. As > always, please feel free to contact me if you have any questions or > corrections. > > I too believe that it will be a loss to Rahman fans, if we do not > collect all the available voiceless BGMs out there. Therefore it is > important to first establish how many such true surround sound DVDs > exist out there. Once we establish that, we can see which ones have > been extracted and which ones are pending. Then, we can go from there. > > > Regards, > Rahmaniac. >
