Hi Ari, I would beg to differ with respect to how well Jaws is reading the content of the column browser lists. I used to be able to arrow down and it would read perfectly, now I have to frequently use the screen refresh command (it was me who mentioned it) and even then it says "L1" after each genre or artist or album Jaws reads. I also think the guy who spoke to has probably very little information is to what underlying changes the iTunes team may have made and obviously he is clueless when it comes to Windows screenreaders, Jaws was doing a good job with Windows 95, 98 and 98SE when there was very basic Mac accessibility and since 2000 or 2001 when Windows XP came out and until Mac released this current form of Voiceover there was no accessibility of the Mac.
Anyhow, I am using Jaws 18 and on my laptop I have Windows 10 and the latest version of iTunes and there is no improvement as far as I can tell when compared to how this worked with Jaws 17. I also installed iTunes on one of my desktop computers at my work which is still on Windows 7. I am also using Jaws 18 and the issues are identical, the column browser needs to be refreshed a lot and neither apps nor tones are read by Jaws when I connect my iPhone. Since this worked perfectly with iTunes 11 it is clear that the Apple guy you spoke with really is clueless and he just said that it was because of Windows because he is probably told not to say it was because of Apple. There simply is no excuse for this and I'd love to have a chance to talk to Tim Cook, quote him on some of Apple's wonderful accessibility propaganda especially from their recent event and then ask him how he explains the incredible oversight and lack of accessibility with two products which have been around for many years, iTunes and iCloud.com. I also would like to hear him justify how they are sending out links to surveys which are completely inaccessible... really, a survey? How hard can it be to make it accessible, I get others all the time where the checkboxes or radio buttons and so on are perfectly accessible. Regards, Sieghard -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2016 8:52 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: Latest version of iTunes with windows 10 and jaws for windows I was just on the phone with Apple Accessibility yesterday to talk with them about the problems for screen reader users when trying to sync music to an iDevice with the sync selected artists, albums, and playlists method. The issue is that no screen reader I've tried (the latest version of NVDA, JAWS 17, and even Narrator) on my Windows 10 machine will read anything in these lists. I haven't yet tried (I think it was Marc's suggestion) of using the refresh screen feature of JAWS to try to get things reading with it. NVDA's text and object review commands don't make it possible to read anything, either. The reason I haven't yet tried JAWS 18 is that I only recently received my SMA update to version 18, and I haven't yet had a chance to install it. I'll report back with more news when I've installed JAWS 18 and tried the screen refresh command. By the way, I did all the tests of the screen readers mentioned above when the rep was on the phone with me. He said that the issue was with Microsoft. I specifically asked him if anything had changed in the latest versions of iTunes 12 in terms of the way they programed those lists (after all, the lists of the column browser work fine in the main music library) and he said that as far as he knew, nothing had changed except the way things were arranged in the program, not the underlying structure of the way things were made in the program,. I told him it'd be interesting to see if blind users of the latest iTunes and Windows 7 were haveing the same issues. A friend of mine is running Windows 8 or 8.1. I'll have to check if she's having the same issues I'm having. She's also running NVDA. I want to see if this is really a Microsoft issues with not presenting things well in Windows 10 to any screen readers' or if the issue is with iTunes. Lol the Apple Accessibility rep had the idea that all Windows screen readers were rather limited, and could only perform the "basics," as he put it. I couldn't let that slide, and set him straight on that. I must say, he was rather surprised. I wonder if that was just his Mac bias or Apple propaganda talking. Either way, he needed to know that not only were Windows screen readers very capable, but that I was a capable user of two of them, so that he knew I wasn't just spouting Windows screen readers are better than VoiceOver on Mac. Anyway, just thought I'd tell you all about the issues I'm having, and that I spoke to Apple about them, and that I'm going to do some testing. It'd be really useful if people running Windows 7 and the latest version of iTunes 12 could see if they're having the same issues I am' so I i can keep a useful dialogue going with Apple, and possibly start one with Microsoft. Sorry if any of this has been a bit nonsensicle; it's rather early here, and I'm not propperly awake yet. I just wanted to get this in before I forgot any of it. Thanks, Ari > On Nov 22, 2016, at 7:02 AM, Russ Kiehne <[email protected]> wrote: > > Perhaps someone could do a podcast on this program and post it on Applevis? > > -----Original Message----- From: Robert Doc Wright > Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 9:02 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: Latest version of iTunes with windows 10 and jaws for > windows > > yes, it works fine during the demo. I just haven't been able to afford > to purchase it yet with Murphy constantly rearing its head at my house. > ----- Original Message ----- From: "'Carol Pearson' via VIPhone" > <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Monday, November 21, 2016 10:41 AM > Subject: Re: Latest version of iTunes with windows 10 and jaws for > windows > > >> Anyone tried this and, if so, is it good and keeps the quality of the >> originals? >> >> >> Carol P - UK >> >> >> >>> On 21/11/2016 03:08, Robert Doc Wright wrote: >>> there is a program called "copytoy" it costs $14 and it will allow you to >>> copy music, contacts, pictures from your iDevice to your pc. >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "denise avant" >>> <[email protected]> >>> To: <[email protected]> >>> Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2016 8:10 PM >>> Subject: Re: Latest version of iTunes with windows 10 and jaws for >>> windows >>> >>> >>> >>> Hello everyone, >>> Thanks for the input. I thought there might be some workarounds for >>> some of the problems. It appears that accessibility with iTunes in windows >>> has gotten worse over the years. I was just trying to see what was possible >>> when using iTunes with windows 10 after all there is the need to sync data >>> from the iPhone and iPad to one's computer from time to time I can remember >>> when some of us upgraded to iOS 10. A lot of us simply connected our cables >>> to our computers to download I was just trying to find out whether I could >>> sync my contacts and other material such as photos and notes from my phone >>> when using iTunes in windows. I guess not. Thanks for all your help. >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>>> On Nov 19, 2016, at 8:49 PM, Sieghard Weitzel <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>> Unfortunately this is not strictly a Freedom Scientific problem, NVDA >>>> isn't doing a lot better with iTunes and while there are a few scripts out >>>> there which help a bit, there aren't any which make a huge difference. I >>>> have a feeling that Apple would have to make some pretty major changes so >>>> that companies like Freedom Scientific can get at the information and in >>>> turn do whatever is needed to make it as good as it can be. >>>> The same applies to the iCloud.com website, I highly doubt Apple is >>>> implementing web accessibility guidelines/standards here since the site is >>>> more or less unuseable for somebody who needs to rely on a screenreader. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> Sieghard >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On >>>> Behalf Of Todd Patkus >>>> Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2016 6:43 PM >>>> To: [email protected] >>>> Subject: RE: Latest version of iTunes with windows 10 and jaws for >>>> windows >>>> >>>> Denise, >>>> >>>> If you feel strong enough to have what you want be done, then, suggest you >>>> contact Freedom Scientific on this one. >>>> >>>> Todd >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On >>>> Behalf Of Larry Lumpkin >>>> Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2016 7:02 PM >>>> To: [email protected] >>>> Subject: RE: Latest version of iTunes with windows 10 and jaws for >>>> windows >>>> >>>> I don't think the interface is very good with jaws at all. >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On >>>> Behalf Of denise avant >>>> Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2016 6:56 PM >>>> To: [email protected] >>>> Subject: Latest version of iTunes with windows 10 and jaws for >>>> windows >>>> >>>> Hello everyone, >>>> I have a few questions about iTunes and windows I am wondering if >>>> it is possible to sync all of my contacts, appointments, notes, etc >>>> from my iPhone 6s plus to my new windows computer I have the >>>> latest version of itunes I am also wondering if I needed to change >>>> any of the settings in iTunes to navigate it with JAWS better? >>>> Thank you >>>> >>>> -- >>>> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone >>>> list. >>>> >>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or >>>> if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the >>>> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. >>>> >>>> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara >>>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at [email protected] >>>> >>>> The archives for this list can be searched at: >>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >>>> --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "VIPhone" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>>> email to [email protected]. >>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/viphone. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone >>>> list. >>>> >>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or >>>> if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the >>>> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. >>>> >>>> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara >>>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at [email protected] >>>> >>>> The archives for this list can be searched at: >>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >>>> --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "VIPhone" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>>> email to [email protected]. >>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/viphone. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone >>>> list. >>>> >>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or >>>> if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the >>>> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. >>>> >>>> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara >>>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at [email protected] >>>> >>>> The archives for this list can be searched at: >>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >>>> --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "VIPhone" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>>> email to [email protected]. >>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/viphone. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone >>>> list. >>>> >>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or >>>> if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the >>>> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. >>>> >>>> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara >>>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at [email protected] >>>> >>>> The archives for this list can be searched at: >>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >>>> --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "VIPhone" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>>> email to [email protected]. >>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/viphone. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> >> -- >> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list. >> >> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if >> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or >> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. >> >> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara >> Quinn - you can reach Cara at [email protected] >> >> The archives for this list can be searched at: >> http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >> --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups "VIPhone" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/viphone. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if > you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or > moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara > Quinn - you can reach Cara at [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/viphone. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if > you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or > moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara > Quinn - you can reach Cara at [email protected] > > The archives for this list can be searched at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "VIPhone" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/viphone. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list. If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at [email protected] The archives for this list can be searched at: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "VIPhone" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/viphone. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list. If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at [email protected] The archives for this list can be searched at: http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "VIPhone" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/viphone. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
