On Tue, Jan 07, 2014 at 11:05:49AM -0800, Steve Langasek wrote: > [...] > Right - as noted in my other mail, one of the failure scenarios here is that > the user hibernates, closes up the laptop and stows it in the bag, not > realizing it's failed to hibernate.
With rotational storage media, it's also fairly dangerous to store it in a bag and walk around with it without waiting for it to finish hibernating, as the disk is being actively written to and is more likely to sustain damage from any jarring impacts (and yes, running after a bus counts, from personal experience). This is one of my main pet peeves with newer Windows' hibernation/hybrid-suspend -- it turns off the backlight and every visible LED that gives hints that the system is still writing stuff to disk, so you need to basically stick your ear to the laptop and listen until it's done before you stow it away. > > > There was also the design issue: > > > > - the difference between suspend and hibernate is opaque to the > > > average user; the user should not have to guess between them. > > > A lot of users understand and care about the difference. I would go > > so far as to say *most* of Ubuntu's users, which tend to be more savvy > > than the average Windows user, understands the difference. > > I don't think there's any evidence of this being true. I think there's a > very small percentage of Ubuntu power users who understand the difference > between suspend and hibernate - using those names - well enough to take > advantage of that difference; and then there's the much larger number of > ordinary users, who should be protected from the bugs. > > Ubuntu is meant to be suitable for use by the ordinary user. It certainly > shouldn't expose users to disruptive failures in prominent menu options that > are known to be unreliable. Sure, so make it opt-in through some obscure gsettings option that can be poked by an expert-mode tweak tool, e.g. (unity|gnome)-tweak-tool. There are enough users in-between who actually know the difference between suspend and hibernate. The current UX for re-enabling hibernation is horrible -- it's disabled in two different layers of policykit defaults, and isn't properly documented anywhere but some askubuntu.com question. Not to mention that the fix for saucy breaks with trusty because you now need to override org.freedesktop.login1.hibernate in addition to just org.freedesktop.upower.hibernate. Targetting ordinary users doesn't mean shitting on your intermediate users, which is exactly what's happening here. > > Even most Windows users understand the difference since they have been > > using both under Windows for years. > > I also don't believe that the existence of these options under Windows is > evidence that Windows users understand the difference. My mom doesn't, but my sister does. Both are accountants, and neither can program. There are users in both camps, and we should tailor to both. P.S. Some machines (e.g. Thinkpad E220S) have this "feature" in the BIOS that automatically wakes the machine up when the battery level falls below a certain percentage, presumably so that the machine can choose to enter hibernation instead. Under the default settings in Ubuntu on these machines, this means a suspend-resume loop until the battery runs out, which releases far more heat than a machine failing to hibernate while stowed in a bag. P.P.S. This "feature" cannot be disabled in the BIOS. P.P.P.S. This machine is Certified for Ubuntu: http://www.ubuntu.com/certification/hardware/201103-7427/ -- Kind regards, Loong Jin
signature.asc
Description: Digital signature
-- technical-board mailing list technical-board@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/technical-board
