Well said Kit.----- Original Message ----- From: "Kit" <goldeneagl...@gmail.com>
To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2012 4:45 AM Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone)
Chris, of course, if given chance, many will like to test out for Nuance andgive feedback. Most important is that Nuance should get testers from all sorts of phone users. This TW and fb bug happened in N86, C5, C500.2, E5, E6,. What in the world is the testers using??? iPhone as a main phone and Nokia as 2nd phone? Also I believe Nuance release their last release to chase in time for theconference they had early March. Coming to a conference with nothing new toshow is a disaster! Well, let's see their next release whether it will issue this bug and when will the release come out. Many have been effected by this.---- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Chaltain" <chalt...@gmail.com>To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2012 4:29 AMSubject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone)The big difference between proof reading an important letter and putting Talks through it's paces, is in orders of magnitude. The test matrix for Talks, when you look at all of the hand sets it supports, all of the applications, web pages and so on that need to be tested is huge. The trick whenever you have a finite number of testers and so many permutations and combinations to test is to prioritize and look for representational tests. This is especially true when so much testing is manual. I'm not saying Nuance shouldn't have caught the issue you're talking about, but IMHO, you should be talking about helping Nuance prioritize their testing and not expecting them to test Talks with every application and every web page on every handset with every new build of Talks. On 19/03/12 12:37, Eleanor Burke wrote:I agree Fi and Talks is a business and not a charity concern. Furthermore, if one is writing an important letter for example, one will proof read it prior to sending. Now surely it would be possible for someone to run through Talks new release the day before, or even 2 people just to make sure all is well at least with what worked in the past. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fi Dunn" <f...@fidunn.plus.com> To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 4:54 PM Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone)tHAT's exactly what has happened with the social network thing. it has broke n something that worked before. As for gratitude, that only goes so far for so long, when you pay for the product in question. It's far cheaper than some PC screen readers, but seems expensive when compared with Talkback and Spiel for Android, which are free. I do realise, however, that they are not as mature as Talks, but we've always paid and paid for it repeatedly when new phones came along. Please don't think I'm rubbishing Talks, it's served me well for many years, and continues to do so on some of my phones. Fi Sent from my iPhone On 19 Mar 2012, at 13:32, "Dennis Long" <dennisl1...@gmail.com> wrote:What everyone is forgetting is it isn't always easy to track down bugs and it wouldn't be effective to put out a update just for facebook and twitter. If you don't like the new version then downgrade to the one before it and wait for the new version. I'm sure the dealers have passed on the feedback. Are you all forgetting that without talks we wouldn't have had accessibility for all these years lets be patient. If an update is rushed out then you would be complaining if it broke something that worked. Talks has always been about stability so relax people there are alternatives. ----- Original Message ----- From: <m...@chopra.us> To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 1:23 AM Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone)Exactly my point. I had put out an email a couple of weeks ago. Nuance is just not interested in Talks any more. -original message- Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone) From: "Kit" <goldeneagl...@gmail.com> Date: 19/03/2012 5:46 AM It's amazing the testers, either Alpha or Omega or Beta missed this bug on FB and Twitter. It's so commonly used by so many people in the world and also always ask on accessibility in Talks list. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eleanor Burke" <eleanorbu...@btinternet.com> To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 7:33 AM Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone) Fair points, but I mean the Testers must be reading our mails too and surelythey must be finding the same issues as ourselves so I am wondering whythey are not reporting back to the Developers. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fi Dunn" <f...@fidunn.plus.com> To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2012 11:21 PM Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone)Ah, well, I have done some beta testing, although never for talks, andyouhave to sign agreements about not disclosing various things, which candepend on the software in question. It always says you won't share features of upcoming versions you are testing, though, whichever company. Also, the hassle some of them on here would get from people trying to weedle information out of them would be horrific, if they disclosed that they were testers, I should imagine. Fi -----Original Message----- From: talks-boun...@talksusers.com [mailto:talks-boun...@talksusers.com] On Behalf Of Eleanor Burke Sent: 18 March 2012 23:10 To: Talks Mailing List Subject: Re: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone) Or if not developers, maybe even Testers, though I do not think the Testers openly say who they are either. Eleanor ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fi Dunn" <f...@fidunn.plus.com> To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2012 10:53 PM Subject: [Talks] Developers, are you there? (wasI just bought an iPhone)Exactly, this silence is really frustrating. Developers, are you there? Fi -----Original Message----- From: talks-boun...@talksusers.com [mailto:talks-boun...@talksusers.com] On Behalf Of Eleanor Burke Sent: 18 March 2012 22:15 To: Talks Mailing List Subject: Re: [Talks] I just bought an iPhone Well said Fi but I must just make another point about the e-mail and Talksand indeed I raised this within a few days of latest release of Talksbutit was met with a wall of silence. When we want to read an e-mail wehave all this additional information that we do not want, the number of frames the first frame being untitled and consisting of 2 colms, when the first frame finishes and when the second frame starts. Not only that, it is 50 50 if Talks even picks up the e-mail on first go, I am often treated to Browser Browser Browser and have to repeat the Talks and arrow down yet again. Eleanor ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fi Dunn" <f...@fidunn.plus.com> To: "Talks Mailing List" <talks@talksusers.com> Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2012 10:05 PM Subject: Re: [Talks] I just bought an iPhoneI agree totally, especially about E-mail and the FaceBook and Twitter jabbering while you're inputting text issue, which is really annoying!!! It's far easier for me to use my Android, iPhone or even ... um ... Mobilespeak on faceBook! Yes, it doesn't do some other stuff that the verylatest Talks does, but they haven't broken edit boxes on social networking sites up till now. Why should these be broken when they were fine before? I have only upgraded Talks, not my firmware or anything lately. I'm not sure if I should upgrade to the new versions of software available, either. Will facebook and Twitter edit boxes still be broken, even after that? Will my E-mail be even worse? We don't seem to get answers to such questions from developers the way they do on the Android list ... and most of the Android screen readers are free! So we've kept on and on paying for Talks and can't access E-mail very well, and the Ovi Store isn't even a joke! It's worse! As far as I know, there hasn't really been any explanation about why this doesn't work well, but the same applies with Mobile Speak there. Code factory did, at least make older phones read E-mail better, though. Having to arrow down to read the body of an E-mail really is primitive! I tend to do most of my mailing on my HTC or iPhone for that reason these days. I love the design of Nokia phones, and the Vocaliser voices used with talks, but, if you want to keep us on side, at least give us some reasons why this stuff doesn't work well in Symbian, when it does on other platforms, please! Thank you for reading this. These are thoughts I have had for a number of months now, not just something I thought of today. I've already pretty much decided my next new phone ... and I like new phones ... often ... will almost certainly not b a Nokia on Symbian, with its inaccessible Ovi Store, most apps and half-baked e-mail access. If people think I'm being harsh, I'm sorry. However, I say all this after using all three platforms, so I do know what I am comparing. Thanks. Fi -----Original Message----- From: talks-boun...@talksusers.com [mailto:talks-boun...@talksusers.com] On Behalf Of Eleanor Burke Sent: 18 March 2012 21:39 To: Talks Mailing List Subject: Re: [Talks] I just bought an iPhone Christopher I am very pleased to read what you write below re Talks and iPhone. I am aware of more and more blind people making the move over to iPhone and I am thinking seriously about it for my necxt phone, however, I have been a Talks user for 4 years now and my appeal here is to the Talksdevelopers not to let the iPhone and Android take over the market ofscreen readers for the blind. My Symbian S60 has met all my needs up to 2011 but Talks is not meeting my needs at present. What then are my problems? 1. E-mail accessability is not what it was. I cannot seem to find a way on my E6 to save a new e-mail address. 2. As pointed out by another list member, over a week ago, the Edit boxesin Twitter and Facebook have Talks continually saying edit box whileoneis writing. Yet this has only become an issue with Talks released inFebruary 2012. What surprises me is that such an issue is not known atrelease time. Surely the developers run through e-mail, internet andsocial network sites prior to release. 3. Despite all I said over months about the work around on E6 to start writing in a word document. My comments were not listened to.Finally Talks developers, I love Talks and do not want to stop usingthis excellent and reasonably priced software, but if my comments and those of other users fall on deaf ears, then we may be forced to go out and purchase an alternative mobile device than the symbian S60 one. -----Original message----- From: Christopher Chaltain Sent: 18/03/2012, 3:28 pm To: Talks Mailing List Subject: [Talks] I just bought an iPhone Well, after being a happy Symbian and Talks user for almost exactly 9 years, I finally decided to get a new smart phone, and this time I went with an iPhone. Not that why I did so is important to anyone, but I'll include some of my thoughts below, as well as how much I appreciate Talks and the Symbian platform. I started using Talks while it was still in beta back at the end of 2002. I got a Nokia 9290 communicator, and I think this, in conjunction with Talks, was the first fully accessible smart phone available to the blind. I've had 2 Symbian phones since then, the Nokia N75 and the AT&T Nokia E71X. Each phone had it's strengths and weaknesses, but in general, I've never been disappointed with Symbian or Talks. My decision to go with an iPhone was a tough one, although that was as much philosophical as anything else. I type on my E71X much less than I used to, so the thought of going with a touch only device became less of a concern for me. I was kind of waiting for the Droid 4 (which will have a keyboard), but I wasn't sure when or if AT&T would ever carry the Droid 4, and after reading multiple reviews of Android and Ice Cream Sandwich, it seemed like I'd be waiting quite a while for Android to catch up with the iPhone with respect to accessibility. The closed nature of the iPhone also concerned me when comparing it to an Android, or even a Symbian, phone, but I use the cloud more and more, and I eventually decided that I could leverage the cloud enough to minimize my need to use Windows or iTunes. I also started finding myself needing an IOS or Android device for workand wanting one for personal use, e.g. the apps I needed for work orwanted to use personally were only available on the IOS or Android platforms. Although there isn't anything wrong with my E71X, it is starting to show it's age, and once I decided Android would be playing catch up with the iPhone with respect to accessibility for quite some time to come, even given Ice Cream Sandwich. I decided there was no longer any reason to wait.I just want to say that I never slammed the iPhone, so I don't thinkI'mbeing hypocritical at all. I still feel the Symbian device and Talksare perfectly adequate solutions for the right situation, and I don't think anyone needs to feel like they're being left behind if they choose to continue to use a Symbian device for another handset or two. It's all about what you want and what gets the job done. I just want to conclude by letting the Talks developers and this list know how much I appreciated the technological advances made by the Talks developers. They were truly visionaries. I also want this list to know how much I appreciated the support I got from this list and it's members. I'm convinced that without Symbian, Talks and this list, I would not have been a satisfied blind smart phone user these past nine years. I'll hang out on this list for a bit, and I'm sure I'll see some of you on more generic lists, but eventually I'll have to unsubscribe from this list, unless of course, I can't stand the iPhone and come back to Talks!Wow, this all seems a bit melodramatic, but Talks and this list haveactually been a big part of my life for most of a decade, so I hope y'all will forgive my drama! Good luck everyone in that quest for the perfect smart phone for your own situation! -- Christopher (CJ) chalt...@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/_______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/_______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/_______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/_______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/_______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/_______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/-- Christopher (CJ) chalt...@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/ _______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ andTalknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/
_______________________________________________ Talks mailing list Talks@talksusers.com http://lists.talksusers.com/mailman/listinfo/talks Hosting of this list provided courtesy of: eHosting Limited: http://www.ehosting.com/ and Talknav Inc. http://www.talknav.net/
