I use Autosprink and I adjust the elevation of the water supply “ball” and 
connect the underground pipe to it. Same difference
  
  
  
Todd G Williams, PE  
Fire Protection Design/Consulting
  
Stonington, CT
  
860-535-2080 (tel:860-535-2080)  (ofc)
  
860-554-7054 (tel:860-554-7054)     (fax)
  
860-608-4559 (tel:860-608-4559)  (cell)
  
  
  
  

  
  
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> On Apr 11, 2025 at 11:46 AM,  <Taylor Schumacher 
> (mailto:[email protected])>  wrote:
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> I think it could be more simple than that. In AutoSprink, we still draw to 
> the “effective point” and then draw pipe vertically or horizontally to adjust 
> for that elevation from the test hydrant. In HydraCalc, we just input the 
> elevation from the test hydrant.
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> Thanks,
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> Taylor Schumacher
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>  Security Fire Sprinkler (http://www.j-berd.com/)   
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> 1 Industrial Blvd | Sauk Rapids, MN 56379
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> Office: 320.640.7050 | Cell: 605.212.2132
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> From:   Fpdcdesign  <[email protected]>
>   Sent:  Friday, April 11, 2025 10:30 AM
>   To:  Discussion list on issues relating to automatic fire sprinklers  
> <[email protected]>
>   Cc:  Steve Leyton  <[email protected]>
>   Subject:  [Sprinklerforum] Re: Effective point of a flow test.
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> Taylor, thanks. Essentially the drawing is what I have been using. Junction 
> of flowing and non-flowing water. The only difference is if there are 
> significant elevation changes, I will use the dead end reading technique for 
> a looped main, which allows
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>    Warning: Unusual link
>  This message contains an unusual link, which may lead to a malicious site. 
> Confirm the message is safe before clicking any links.
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> Taylor, thanks. Essentially the drawing is what I have been using. Junction 
> of flowing and non-flowing water. The only difference is if there are 
> significant elevation changes, I will use the dead end reading technique for 
> a looped main, which allows me to easily include elevation.   
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> Todd Williams   
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> Fire Protection Design/Consulting
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> Stonington, CT
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> 860-608-4559
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> > On Apr 11, 2025 at 10:03 AM,  <Taylor Schumacher 
> > (mailto:[email protected])>  wrote:
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> > Accounting for elevation is paramount and that will need to be adjusted 
> > for. onX has the best elevations.
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> > Aside from that I’ll give the same answer that I got years back from Steve 
> > which is, go look in a wonderful little book called “Sprinkler Hydraulics” 
> > by Harold Waas, Jr. There’s a chapter titled "Relating Hydraulic 
> > Calculations to the Water Supply” which answers this fully and describes 
> > the differences in circulating mains and dead end mains.
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> > Since this book is from 1983, I’ll save you scouring eBay like I did in 
> > 2017, I’ve attached the picture since it’s a Friday.
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> > Taylor Schumacher
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> >  Security Fire Sprinkler 
> > (https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fwww.j-berd.com%2f&c=E,1,Yt9BeQS9xZonekrTGThqLK6CF4-qzflGm2V_35QNvfjQSgRMIPicK_Rf6In-41AnwYXYPAiE8mq8AxRAtiQTesAbRcy4_xgqVoXU0XecK82xfme0oTg88aEvBD4q&typo=1)
> >
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> > 1 Industrial Blvd | Sauk Rapids, MN 56379
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> >   
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> > Office: 320.640.7050 | Cell: 605.212.2132
> >
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> > From:   cw bamford  <[email protected] (mailto:[email protected])>
> >   Sent:  Friday, April 11, 2025 8:30 AM
> >   To:  Discussion list on issues relating to automatic fire sprinklers  
> > <[email protected] 
> > (mailto:[email protected])>
> >   Subject:  [Sprinklerforum] Re: Effective point of a flow test.
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> > NFPA 291 from 2022 Fire Pump Handbook    4.4.6 I have used Google Earth Pro 
> >    It has Elevation    (not perfect    but close and you can get elevation 
> > Change between hydrant(s)) Hose Monster has a Good 8 page PDF on Hydrant 
> > Flow Testing Chuck Bamford On Fri, Apr 11, 2025
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> >    Warning: Unusual sender     <[email protected] 
> > (mailto:[email protected])>
> >  You don't usually receive emails from this address. Make sure you trust 
> > this sender before taking any actions.
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> > NFPA 291
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> > from 2022 Fire Pump Handbook   
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> > 4.4.6
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> > I have used Google Earth Pro   
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> > It has Elevation    (not perfect    but close and you can get elevation 
> > Change between hydrant(s))
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> > Hose Monster has a Good 8 page PDF on
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> > Hydrant Flow Testing
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> > Chuck Bamford
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> > On Fri, Apr 11, 2025 at 5:29 AM Fpdcdesign  <[email protected] 
> > (mailto:[email protected])>  wrote:
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> > > What is the effective point of a hydrant flow test? By that, I mean the 
> > > point you should design from. I was told from the beginning that it is at 
> > > the intersection of flowing and non-flowing water (i.e the connection 
> > > between the point of the flowing main with the branch to the hydrant 
> > > where the pressures are read.) Am I doing something wrong?
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> > > This comes from a test that a regional water company did and they will 
> > > only tell me what hydrant was flowed. It could make a difference because 
> > > of elevation.   
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> > > Todd G Williams, PE
> > >
> > >   
> > >   
> > >
> > > Fire Protection Design/Consulting
> > >
> > >   
> > >   
> > >   
> > >
> > > Stonington, CT
> > >
> > >   
> > >   
> > >   
> > >
> > > 860-535-2080 (tel:860-535-2080)  (ofc)
> > >
> > >   
> > >   
> > >   
> > >
> > > 860-554-7054 (tel:860-554-7054)     (fax)
> > >
> > >   
> > >   
> > >   
> > >
> > > 860-608-4559 (tel:860-608-4559)  (cell)
> > >
> > >   
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> > >   
> > >   
> > >
> > >
> > >  _________________________________________________________
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