bill/wilandra wrote:
Hmmm, a basic tenet of Prolog is that the rules do not have any side
effects. That is why Prolog can back track like it does. In a build process
there are many side effects in creating, modifying, and copying/moving
files. These side effects could become impossible to restore
To: Ant Users List
Subject: RE: Python implementation for Ant
> -Original Message-
> From: Steve Loughran [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 2:15 AM
> To: Ant Users List
> Subject: Re: Python implementation for Ant
>
> Now, I am not going to
> -Original Message-
> From: Steve Loughran [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 2:15 AM
> To: Ant Users List
> Subject: Re: Python implementation for Ant
>
> Now, I am not going to evangelise Prolog on everyone, but I
> found some
&g
Matt Benson wrote:
Here's a link to Terence Parr's "Humans should not
have to grok XML" article:
http://www-128.ibm.com/developerworks/xml/library/x-sbxml.html
In it he explains the distinction between XML as a
data representation format, the use for which it was
AFAIK intended, vs. as an expli
> -Original Message-
> From: Hans Schwaebli [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 12:56 PM
> To: Ant Users List
> Subject: RE: Python implementation for Ant
>
> Maybe you would start thinking about it if you would see a
> comparsion how
Maybe this can help a lot with tool support. But these tools must be offered
everywhere, in Eclipse, in IntelliJ Idea, in JDeveloper, in Borland, in
NetBeans and so on. Every vendor must implement such tool support. This is a
lot of work to be done on many places, basically the same work.
Eclip
still...
> I suppose one could have made the same argument against Makefiles and SH (or
> BASH)...
>
> Scot
>
> -Original Message-
>> From: Peter Reilly
>
>> Sent: Feb 8, 2007 1:47 PM
>> To: Ant Users List
>> Subject: Re: Python implementati
L PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Feb 8, 2007 4:37 PM
>To: Ant Users List
>Subject: Re: Python implementation for Ant
>
>I only have limited scripting language experience (Python, Perl, Ruby
>and Groovy) but normally a variable not being set would show up at
>runtime, rather than co
arguably one could look at XPath - the epressions
are in the attributes... Pretty slick honestly :)
Scot
-Original Message-
>From: Hans Schwaebli <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Feb 8, 2007 4:13 PM
>To: Ant Users List
>Subject: RE: Python implementation for Ant
>
>Interesti
sing XML as
the "markup" language
What is your aversion to XML with regards to it as a
scripting language? I personally like it...
-Original Message-----
From: "Anderson, Rob (Global Trade)"
Sent: Feb 8, 2007 12:58 PM
To: Ant Users List
Subject: RE: Python implem
)...
Scot
-Original Message-
>From: Peter Reilly
>Sent: Feb 8, 2007 1:47 PM
>To: Ant Users List
>Subject: Re: Python implementation for Ant
>
>On 2/8/07, Matt Benson wrote:
>> Here's a link to Terence Parr's "Humans should not
>> have to gro
old at that time (and still
am). I guess I am just biased now - must be getting old and set in my ways ;)
Scot
-Original Message-
>From: Matt Benson
>Sent: Feb 8, 2007 1:37 PM
>To: Ant Users List , "Scot P. Floess"
>Subject: RE: Python implementation for Ant
>
&
nal Message-
> >From: "Anderson, Rob (Global Trade)"
>
> >Sent: Feb 8, 2007 12:58 PM
> >To: Ant Users List
> >Subject: RE: Python implementation for Ant
> >
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: Hans Schwaebli
> [mailto:[EMAI
From: "Anderson, Rob (Global Trade)"
>Sent: Feb 8, 2007 12:58 PM
>To: Ant Users List
>Subject: RE: Python implementation for Ant
>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Hans Schwaebli [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 3:01 AM
&
Maybe you would start thinking about it if you would see a comparsion how build
scripts looks like with XML and how they would look like in Jython... And don't
forget the effect of habit on opinion. For example the QWERTY layout was
invented to slow down typing because the typewriters damaged if
t: Feb 8, 2007 1:47 PM
>To: Ant Users List
>Subject: Re: Python implementation for Ant
>
>On 2/8/07, Matt Benson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Here's a link to Terence Parr's "Humans should not
>> have to grok XML" article:
>>
>> http:/
L as
> the "markup" language
>
> What is your aversion to XML with regards to it as a
> scripting language? I personally like it...
>
> -Original Message-
> >From: "Anderson, Rob (Global Trade)"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Sent: Feb
pting language? I personally like it...
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> >From: "Anderson, Rob (Global Trade)"
>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >Sent: Feb 8, 2007 12:58 PM
>> >To: Ant Users List
>> >Subject: RE: Python implementat
pting language? I personally like it...
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> >From: "Anderson, Rob (Global Trade)"
>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >Sent: Feb 8, 2007 12:58 PM
>> >To: Ant Users List
>> >Subject: RE: Python implementat
It took is scripting but using XML as
> the "markup" language
>
> What is your aversion to XML with regards to it as a
> scripting language? I personally like it...
>
> -Original Message-
> >From: "Anderson, Rob (Global Trade)"
> <[EMAIL PROT
rson, Rob (Global Trade)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sent: Feb 8, 2007 12:58 PM
>To: Ant Users List
>Subject: RE: Python implementation for Ant
>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Hans Schwaebli [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007
> -Original Message-
> From: Hans Schwaebli [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 11:23 PM
> To: Ant Users List
> Subject: Re: Python implementation for Ant
>
> I reply to all of you here.
>
> For me it does not matter so muc
> -Original Message-
> From: Hans Schwaebli [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 3:01 AM
> To: Ant Users List
> Subject: Python implementation for Ant
>
> What do you think about the XML format used for writing Ant
> scripts? I don't like it.
>
> What abou
Just to add a third-party opinion from a neophyte Ant user experienced
in make and other build systems:
I appreciated the declarative, as opposed to procedural, nature of Ant.
The procedural nature of traditional build tools (scripts, make, etc.)
is the very reason they become so fragile with
I reply to all of you here.
For me it does not matter so much, if Ant's XML is replaced by Python,
Jython, Groovy or another scripting language. I think all would be better for
writing Ant scripts than the XML way.
In the beginning of Ant, XML seemed to be a good way. But as it evolve
On Wed, 07 Feb 2007 10:27:30 -0500, Hans Schwaebli
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Maybe Ant was not designed for easy programmatical use?
Maybe. What is your problem? Works for me... I use it programmatically,
though mostly through build files. But I like XML.
Robert Koberg <[EMAIL PROTECT
Matt Benson wrote:
NOW, having said all that, I am a DSL-phile and am
having all sorts of fun writing various
domain-specific languages for the last couple of
years. I have a low-priority intent to develop a
custom language for Ant and will attempt, when I am
ready to begin, to do so as an offi
Hans, I'm not sure why you've attacked Steve here.
I'm -pretty- sure he used the term "religious" simply
to convey to you the sometimes heated nature of this
discussion. Ultimately, as in the case of religion,
"Humans Should Not Have to Grok XML" (with credit to
Terence Parr) is a matter of opini
Maybe Ant was not designed for easy programmatical use?
Robert Koberg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
On Wed, 07 Feb 2007 09:49:16 -0500, Hans Schwaebli
wrote:
> Why not offer writing Ant scripts in Jython and XML? Let developers
> choose. But now they have no real choice for Ant scripts, only
Hans Schwaebli wrote:
Steve Loughran ...
If I dislike something it has nothing to do with religion. You can't avoid discussions by simply stating they are religious.
I am not anti-XML in general, but I don't think this format makes any sense for a scripting or programming language. Ev
On Wed, 07 Feb 2007 09:49:16 -0500, Hans Schwaebli
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Why not offer writing Ant scripts in Jython and XML? Let developers
choose. But now they have no real choice for Ant scripts, only XML
syntax.
What is stopping now from writing your Ant /scripts/ in Jython/Java
Steve Loughran ...
If I dislike something it has nothing to do with religion. You can't avoid
discussions by simply stating they are religious.
I am not anti-XML in general, but I don't think this format makes any sense
for a scripting or programming language. Even the first creator o
Hans Schwaebli wrote:
What do you think about the XML format used for writing Ant scripts? I don't
like it.
Interesting religious issue there. I know a lot of anti-XML people, and
tools like rake, capistrano and puppet all use ruby as their language
for describing building or deploying stuf
On Wed, 7 February, 2007 11:01 am, Hans Schwaebli wrote:
> What do you think about the XML format used for writing Ant scripts? I
> don't like it.
Tastes vary. :-)
> What about writing Ant scripts in a script language like Python or
> Jython instead of writing them in XML? I think it would be
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