Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

- Data: Sun, 25 Oct 2020 15:58:52 + De: Stefan Schreiber Assunto: Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET Para: Surround Sound discussion group “remember we have had long conversations about VBAP already in private years ago .” I don’t remember all the details (will talk to

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

selective about >> which >> >> channels you use and the perspective of the listener. Funnily enough the >> >> stereo recordings I have downmixed from quad and octaphonic recordings >> >> sound strangely spacious. I hope this makes my point of vi

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

be. For me this kind of thing is > >> >> crucially important as I do walkaround installations that cannot > have a > >> >> "sweet spot".So upmixing presents a problem for this type of 3D > >> audio > >> >> recordings - and perhaps less so for ambisonics. N

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

ut >>> of the stereo front. >>> >>> Octomic to 20 speakers: Should actually (and does) work, via simple >>> panning. >>> >>> It is important to see that every position is panned to 2 speakers in >>> 2D,

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

the public > response > >> is not good simple as that. > >> Delightful as this conversation is I have to get back to work and will > be > >> offline for a bit - I bid you good day sir. > >> > >> On Sun, 25 Oct 2020 at 01:34, Stefan Schreiber &

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

y reasonable (and proven) results. Object and speaker panning is not very different, by the way. (You can see the speakers also as objects. ) Best, Stefan - Mensagem de Augustine Leudar ----- Data: Fri, 23 Oct 2020 23:21:50 +0100 De: Au

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

ry” VBAP, obtaining some very reasonable (and proven) results. Object and speaker panning is not very different, by the way. (You can see the speakers also as objects. ) Best, Stefan - Mensagem de Augustine Leudar - Data: Fri, 23 Oct 2020 23:21:50 +0100 De: Augustine Le

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

rules, which are proven in millions of >> recordings. So I would say your statement is just wrong. >> >> You don’t spread “8 speakers over 20 speakers” in some statistical >> ways, if that is what you meant. >> So I just have suggested to “try” VBAP, obtaining some very r

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

hat you meant. > So I just have suggested to “try” VBAP, obtaining some very reasonable > (and proven) results. > > Object and speaker panning is not very different, by the way. > (You can see the speakers also as objects. ) > > > Best, > > Stefan > > >

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

- Data: Fri, 23 Oct 2020 23:21:50 +0100 De: Augustine Leudar Assunto: Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET Para: Surround Sound discussion group I refer to mapping, for example, a stereo file to 4 speakers, an octophonic to 20 speakers etc - one channel over several speakers sounds

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

? Don’t think > so...;-) > > Best, > > Stefan > > > > > > > - Mensagem de Augustine Leudar - > Data: Fri, 23 Oct 2020 12:33:34 +0100 > De: Augustine Leudar > Assunto: Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET > Para: Surround Sound disc

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

to: Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET Para: Surround Sound discussion group you can also get reasonably nice downmixes to quad and stereo by combining channels as well . However, the problem with Scheops type systemsI see is upmixing rather than downmixing. YOur basically spreadinge signa

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

you can also get reasonably nice downmixes to quad and stereo by combining channels as well . However, the problem with Scheops type systemsI see is upmixing rather than downmixing. YOur basically spreadinge signal over several speakers when you do that which blurs localisation horrible- and this

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Jack Reynolds wrote > The only problem with using ambisonics mics is the high frequency limit > above which they stop working properly. A second order ambi mic reduces > this problem, but above about 7Khz the not quite coincident capsules > becomes a problem. This isn't correct. Here's OctoMic's

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

< nothing below implies that an Ambisonics microphone is the best solution for all sound capture cases! > On 10/21/20 6:37 AM, Augustine Leudar wrote: Hi Steve, An interesting proposal. You'll excuse perhaps my misunderstanding here, but my understanding was that ambisonics A format consists of

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

> > You could of course object that those should never be combined, just each > one sent to its own speaker. But that would mean that such a one to one > mapping is the only possible way to use such signals if you want to > preserve > sound quality. No downmixing or anything similar (e.g. binaural)

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

I upmix to third order and then use the Blue Ripple Spotlight plugin to isolate on half of the sound field from each mic and then combine the two into a single third order ambix signal to decode binaurally. It’s sound really nice. I’ll post a session with some files of a dawn chorus recording wh

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

On Thu, Oct 22, 2020 at 04:42:28PM +0100, Jack Reynolds wrote: > I have had great results with a pair of spaced first order ambisonic mics > for binaural decoding. > Taking the left hemisphere of one of the mics, and right hemisphere of the > other How do you obtain only one hemisphere from a

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

I have had great results with a pair of spaced first order ambisonic mics for binaural decoding. Taking the left hemisphere of one of the mics, and right hemisphere of the other, then combining the two. The decorellation does add something nice and spacious to the sound. Sent from my iPhone

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

On Thu, Oct 22, 2020 at 01:38:49PM +0100, Steven Boardman wrote: > I had an Ambeo and got rid of it for this reason. The A/B processing provided by Sennheiser sucks. It gets a lot better with a proper A/B processor computed from actual measurements. Ciao, -- FA _

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

On Thu, Oct 22, 2020 at 12:36:38PM +0100, jack reynolds wrote: > The only problem with using ambisonics mics is the high frequency limit > above which they stop working properly. A second order ambi mic reduces > this problem, but above about 7Khz the not quite coincident capsules > becomes a prob

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

> On 22 Oct 2020, at 13:19, michael strohmann wrote: > > regarding sound quality: i had my hand only at an sennheiser ambeo. did an > A/B comparison with Schoeps DMS setup. while the drums i recorded sounded > like drums via the Schoeps, they sounded like cardboard boxes via the ambeo. > or are o

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

regarding sound quality: i had my hand only at an sennheiser ambeo. did an A/B comparison with Schoeps DMS setup. while the drums i recorded sounded like drums via the Schoeps, they sounded like cardboard boxes via the ambeo. or are other ambisonic mics comparable to e.g. a ccm4 or mkh8020 ? spati

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

This is an especially annoying problem when you consider hi frequencies are what we localise best On Thu, 22 Oct 2020 at 12:37, jack reynolds wrote: > The only problem with using ambisonics mics is the high frequency limit > above which they stop working properly. A second order ambi mic reduces

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

"Sorry, this doesn't make any sense... A decoder doesn't give 'spherical coordinates', it outputs signals. What makes you think that ORTF captures 'a small 8th of a sphere' ??" Ummm - because it has 8 super cardioid microphones pointing in eight different directions each of which corresponds to on

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Hi Jack If the spaced array was only using cardioids, then maybe their patterns would be more stable at higher frequencies, but not for near coincident spurs of mid/side (and the like). As they are even further apart than an ambisonic mic, and they aren’t calibrated together. Steve > On 22 O

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

The only problem with using ambisonics mics is the high frequency limit above which they stop working properly. A second order ambi mic reduces this problem, but above about 7Khz the not quite coincident capsules becomes a problem. J On Thu, 22 Oct 2020 at 11:36, Steven Boardman wrote: > > > Wh

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

> What makes you think that ORTF captures > 'a small 8th of a sphere' ?? I don’t.. Maybe I wasn’t clear. What I meant was replacing each ORTF capsule (or M/S pair) with an ambisonic mic, and decoding for the direction it should point. All spaced array setups can use ambisonic mics, as they can

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

On Wed, Oct 21, 2020 at 02:37:39PM +0100, Augustine Leudar wrote: > So if you > had say, 8 ambisonics mics pointed in 8 different directions ,in order to > record that small 8th of a sphere (or in this case cube) in the direction > they are pointed in (which is what the ORTF does) - how would th

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Augustine Leudar wrote: > Im assuming the answer to this will be in the decoding ? You can see the decoding process here: https://www.core-sound.com/OctoMic/4.php#SpacedArrays Len Moskowitz (mosko...@core-sound.com) Core Sound LLC www.core-sound.com Home of OctoMic and TetraMic __

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

From the 788T manual > El 21 oct 2020, a las 2:13, John Leonard Main escribió: > > As with the 788, all eight can be ganged together. > > Regards, > > John > >> On 20 Oct 2020, at 20:20, peterson tooke wrote: >> >> However I am not sure how many channels can be ganged together on their >

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Im assuming the answer to this will be in the decoding ? On Wed, 21 Oct 2020 at 14:37, Augustine Leudar wrote: > Hi Steve, > An interesting proposal. You'll excuse perhaps my misunderstanding here, > but my understanding was that ambisonics A format consists of a omni plus > x,y,z to give 4 sign

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Hi Steve, An interesting proposal. You'll excuse perhaps my misunderstanding here, but my understanding was that ambisonics A format consists of a omni plus x,y,z to give 4 signals that are then converted to b format . I built my own ambisonics mic and decoder once a long time ago so perhaps things

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Hi Gus For even better polar pattern control, you could use ambisonic mics in an ORTF. Schoeps won’t have better polar patterns than a well calibrated ambisonic mic. So in theory the ORTF array would produce a better spatial image. If you have enough channels and your budget is good, why not use

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

gt; > From: Augustine Leudar > > To: Surround Sound discussion group > > Subject: Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET > > Message-ID: > >gmail.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > > > Ha - theres no way I could

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

d (or octamic?) if you’re going to be hanging around > > the rainforest? > > > > best, Justin. > > > >> On 20 Oct 2020, at 18:00, sursound-requ...@music.vt.edu wrote: > >> > >> Message: 7 > >> Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2020 21:12:45 +0100 > >>

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

e: Mon, 19 Oct 2020 21:12:45 +0100 >> From: Augustine Leudar >> To: Surround Sound discussion group >> Subject: Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET >> Message-ID: >> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> Ha - theres

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Ha - theres no way I could afford it for myself its for a grant application > Im doing. My use for it would be in the Amazon making wildlife recordings >

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

The one I want on my 788T is 4 (for sound field) plus 2 plus 2, for two stereo mics Closest I can get is 4 + 2 + 1 +1 which is vaguely annoying. I asked Sounddevices for this at NAB (and via support) a number of times, and got a shrug. Jon > On 20 Oct 2020, at 13:53, John Leonard Main wrote

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

As with the 788, all eight can be ganged together. Regards, John > On 20 Oct 2020, at 20:20, peterson tooke wrote: > > However I am not sure how many channels can be ganged together on their > MixPre10ii. ___ Sursound mailing list Sursound@music.v

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Thanks Peter. Yes i lived ten years in the Amazon making 3D audio recordings - humidity is indeed a problem. I've been looking at the Sonosax unit - looks amazing but I didnt realise it needed an addon. I'm probably not going to go for the ORTF right now as there's other things I want to use the bu

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Late to your question but of course a lot depends on how much can you afford to spend… but as your Schoeps array is mighty pricey, that may not be an issue. Also As others have mentioned - at the lower end price-wise ( but not quality wise) one option is the USA made Sound Devices MixPre 10ii.

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Steve, The SD 788 can indeed link all eight channels, and a lot of other variations as well, except for one which I sometimes need - two sets of M/S linking. Still, can’t have everything. Cheers, John > On 19 Oct 2020, at 20:56, Steven Boardman wrote: > > Can the 788 gang all preamps? Didn'

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Ha - theres no way I could afford it for myself its for a grant application Im doing. My use for it would be in the Amazon making wildlife recordings for various purposes. I have also been interested in the Zyla 3rd order microphone don't know if anyone's tried that ? Its certainly cheaper but its

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Can the 788 gang all preamps? Didn't think it could.. Plus one for the zoom f8/n. Gangable, standard XLRs, good quality, affordable, small and versatile. You can even sync and word clock a load together, for loads of inputs! I have 3, and sync them all for 24 channels no problem. But as John said.

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Even worse for connections, though: 4 XLRs and 4 TA3s - I had a six-way version made up for my 788 when I had a DPA 5001which was rather nice, but not cheap. Those multi-pin Lemo connectors are expensive. But if you’re going for the Schoeps set up, what’s a couple of thousand bucks or so extr

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Sound Devices 788T Suso > El 19 oct 2020, a las 17:34, Augustine Leudar > escribió: > > Hi there, > can someone recommend a recorder that would work well with the ORTF-3D > OUTDOOR SET > > > > -- > Artist website: www.augustineleudar.com > Business website: www.magikdoor.net >

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Thanks John - is there an alternative ? On Mon, 19 Oct 2020 at 17:44, John Leonard Main wrote: > You’ll need a breakout: the 10T uses 8 (low-cost, sadly) XLR/TRS combi > sockets. > > Regards, > > John > > > On 19 Oct 2020, at 17:28, Augustine Leudar > wrote: > > > > Thanks, > > I notice the Sc

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

You’ll need a breakout: the 10T uses 8 (low-cost, sadly) XLR/TRS combi sockets. Regards, John > On 19 Oct 2020, at 17:28, Augustine Leudar wrote: > > Thanks, > I notice the Schoeps uses this cable : > > https://schoeps.de/en/products/accessories/cables/k-surround-m.html > > Does the sound de

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Thanks, I notice the Schoeps uses this cable : https://schoeps.de/en/products/accessories/cables/k-surround-m.html Does the sound devices take that or is it a breakout cable scenario for the Sound Devices On Mon, 19 Oct 2020 at 16:56, jack reynolds wrote: > Sound devices Mix Pre 10ii will wor

Re: [Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Sound devices Mix Pre 10ii will work well. Linked gains and very nice preamps. That's what I would use at least. Jack On Mon, 19 Oct 2020 at 16:34, Augustine Leudar wrote: > Hi there, > can someone recommend a recorder that would work well with the ORTF-3D > OUTDOOR SET > > > > -- > Artist w

[Sursound] Recorder for ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET

Hi there, can someone recommend a recorder that would work well with the ORTF-3D OUTDOOR SET -- Artist website: www.augustineleudar.com Business website: www.magikdoor.net -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: